View Full Version : Mark Steyn: Obama's pastor disaster
stephanie
03-17-2008, 04:11 AM
I just don't understand Democrats...they think they can get away with anything........and it should not be a deal...like the Howard Dean Scream..........Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaaa aaa:laugh2:
MARK STEYN
Syndicated columnist
Comments 42| Recommend 77
The Rev. Jeremiah Wright thinks that, given their treatment by white America, black Americans have no reason to sing "God Bless America." "The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America," he told his congregation. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human."
I'm not a believer in guilt by association, or the campaign vaudeville of rival politicians insisting this or that candidate dissociate himself from remarks by some fellow he had a 30-second grip'n'greet with a decade ago. But Jeremiah Wright is not exactly peripheral to Barack Obama's life. He married the Obamas and baptized their children. Those of us who made the mistake of buying the senator's latest book, "The Audacity Of Hope," and assumed the title was an ingeniously parodic distillation of the great sonorous banality of an entire genre of blandly uplifting political writing discovered circa page 127 that in fact the phrase comes from one of the Rev. Wright's sermons. Jeremiah Wright has been Barack Obama's pastor for 20 years – in other words, pretty much the senator's entire adult life. Did Obama consider "God Damn America" as a title for his book but it didn't focus-group so well?
read the rest..
http://www.ocregister.com/opinion/america-obama-wright-1998925-rev-bless
If so many people have a problem with his pastor and the link with obama- then DONT VOTE FOR OBAMA.
If you dont like him- then dont vote for him- SIMPLE!
Leave the poor guy alone, and go and vote for war monger McCain.
Classact
03-17-2008, 06:15 AM
If so many people have a problem with his pastor and the link with obama- then DONT VOTE FOR OBAMA.
If you dont like him- then dont vote for him- SIMPLE!
Leave the poor guy alone, and go and vote for war monger McCain.He's not a poor guy! And, that isn't the point, the point is he is lower than a lawyer when it comes to the definition of lies... A lawyer is speaking he is lying... Obama's life base, including his family is base on a lie and hate... nothing coming out of his mouth can be trusted.
War is necessary sometimes and if Obama should be elected by some mistake he will show you what I mean.
Your overexaggerating. Any how- dont vote for him.
The pastor oversaw his marriage, baptises his kids- that still does not mean that obama accepts and endorses every sermon that wright gave.
You need to think about that concept, and maybe people will realize that.
Classact
03-17-2008, 07:10 AM
Your overexaggerating. Any how- dont vote for him.
The pastor oversaw his marriage, baptises his kids- that still does not mean that obama accepts and endorses every sermon that wright gave.
You need to think about that concept, and maybe people will realize that.Are you saying a public person is not responsible for his associations? He has friends that tried to attack the American government... he has a friend being tried for fraud... he has a pastor that is a racists...
If another public person, McCain or Hillary were found to have equal relationships would they not be fair game? To me an equal would be for one of them to be a member of the KKK or a White Supremacy group for equal time... where am I going wrong here?
Nukeman
03-17-2008, 07:22 AM
Your overexaggerating. Any how- dont vote for him.
The pastor oversaw his marriage, baptises his kids- that still does not mean that obama accepts and endorses every sermon that wright gave.
You need to think about that concept, and maybe people will realize that.Ummm did you miss the 20 year relationship they have??? Did you miss the fact that Rev. Wright was a ADVISOR on Obama's campaign, or that Obama list him as a mentor?? There is a lot going on here for somene to be running for the highest office in the US and have an advisor that is so anti-American is crazy. This man is a huge racist! If Hillary was to employ David Duke as an advisor would she be justified in saying she "never" "heard" him say anything like that, even though its common knowledge how he thinks!!!!
You can not sit there and say Obama didn't know what his pastor thought or how he acted. These two had a very close relationship that has spanned 2 decades.....
Classact
03-17-2008, 07:35 AM
Obama wants to have Martin Luther King respect but attends a racist church with his family that spews Black Panther rhetoric.
Check out the Black Panthers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Panther_Party and see if his minister fits in closer than he does with Rev. King?????????????????
If so many people have a problem with his pastor and the link with obama- then DONT VOTE FOR OBAMA.
If you dont like him- then dont vote for him- SIMPLE!
Leave the poor guy alone, and go and vote for war monger McCain.
why then are you complaining about mccain's pastor? bush, etc....
People, politicians lie!. Its a dirty and corrupt world. Nobody who has the top jobs in the US admin-that is of huge integrity.
For example- the world was sold a lie by bush and co regarding WMD'S and the imminent theat posed by Iraq. We were all lied to.
So, stop over reacting here regarding obama.
People, politicians lie!. Its a dirty and corrupt world. Nobody who has the top jobs in the US admin-that is of huge integrity.
For example- the world was sold a lie by bush and co regarding WMD'S and the imminent theat posed by Iraq. We were all lied to.
So, stop over reacting here regarding obama.
why are you over reacting to mccain and bush?
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 10:56 AM
This crap will get no traction no matter how many times you repete the story.
Everyone has sat on a pew and heard their pastor/rabi or whatever say something they did not agree with.
You just keep reminding people hes not a muslim so thanks.
This crap will get no traction no matter how many times you repete the story.
Everyone has sat on a pew and heard their pastor/rabi or whatever say something they did not agree with.
You just keep reminding people hes not a muslim so thanks.
whatever, if this was a white pastor you would be frothing at the mouth
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 11:21 AM
I do recall one of the Big R pastors saying 911 was our punishment for not killing gays or some kinda crazy ass shit though.
God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve.
-- Rev Jerry Falwell, blaming civil libertarians, feminists, homosexuals, and abortion rights supporters for the terrorist attacks of Tuesday, September 11, 2001, to which Rev Pat Robertson agreed, quoted from John F Harris, "God Gave US 'What We Deserve,' Falwell Says," The Washington Post (September 14, 2001)
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 11:42 AM
I do recall one of the Big R pastors saying 911 was our punishment for not killing gays or some kinda crazy ass shit though.
God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve.
-- Rev Jerry Falwell, blaming civil libertarians, feminists, homosexuals, and abortion rights supporters for the terrorist attacks of Tuesday, September 11, 2001, to which Rev Pat Robertson agreed, quoted from John F Harris, "God Gave US 'What We Deserve,' Falwell Says," The Washington Post (September 14, 2001)
hahahaha...yah..that is exactly what he said. very nice
and what happened? he got reamed for it. not.."oh..it's no big deal"
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 11:44 AM
Did it stop the Rs from buddying up to him and taking his money?
MtnBiker
03-17-2008, 11:48 AM
I do recall one of the Big R pastors saying 911 was our punishment for not killing gays or some kinda crazy ass shit though.
God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve.
-- Rev Jerry Falwell, blaming civil libertarians, feminists, homosexuals, and abortion rights supporters for the terrorist attacks of Tuesday, September 11, 2001, to which Rev Pat Robertson agreed, quoted from John F Harris, "God Gave US 'What We Deserve,' Falwell Says," The Washington Post (September 14, 2001)
There are most likely numerous example of both liberal and conservative pastors making such statements, it really does not have any context to the situation of Obama and his Pastor of 20 years.
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 11:58 AM
There are most likely numerous example of both liberal and conservative pastors making such statements, it really does not have any context to the situation of Obama and his Pastor of 20 years.
it has all of the context in the world Mtn. or have the lies just made you blind?
Abbey Marie
03-17-2008, 12:07 PM
If so many people have a problem with his pastor and the link with obama- then DONT VOTE FOR OBAMA.
If you dont like him- then dont vote for him- SIMPLE!
Leave the poor guy alone, and go and vote for war monger McCain.
Why should we not examine the history and close relationships of a man who would be the leader of our country? Why should we keep this information under wraps? It is way too important to say "just don't vote for him". Everyone needs to know the truth, so they too can vote accordingly. Are you against freedom of the press? Does your country give your pols a pass? I think not.
And, I am really curious now, why are you so emotionally involved in our country's politics, from way across the pond?
Abbey Marie
03-17-2008, 12:11 PM
There are most likely numerous example of both liberal and conservative pastors making such statements, it really does not have any context to the situation of Obama and his Pastor of 20 years.
The issue is not that some pastors say anti-American and/or racist things. There are jerks in every walk of lfe. The issue is that this candidate for President sat at his feet for 20 years, and calls him his "mentor". As much as I liked Duncan Hunter, if I heard that he was going to a church with a hate-spewing pastor for 20 years, or even 1 year, I would have run from him.
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 12:22 PM
You can run if you like. You wouls have never voted for Obama in any situation.
The people who are yet to make up their minds now know he is a christian and always has been a christian. They also know he disagrees with his pastor on these issues.
Net gain is for Obama. Thanks for helping.
Abbey Marie
03-17-2008, 12:26 PM
You can run if you like. You wouls have never voted for Obama in any situation.
The people who are yet to make up their minds now know he is a christian and always has been a christian. They also know he disagrees with his pastor on these issues.
Net gain is for Obama. Thanks for helping.
You are starting to sound funny in your desperation, TM. There is no way this is good, or even neutral, for Obama. It's a campaign derailment.
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 12:34 PM
You can run if you like. You wouls have never voted for Obama in any situation.
The people who are yet to make up their minds now know he is a christian and always has been a christian. They also know he disagrees with his pastor on these issues.
Net gain is for Obama. Thanks for helping.
who in this thread (other than you) keeps going on about the muslim/christian debate? it really isn't even hit on that much by other than a few nutty ppl (cept Gafer).
i was considering Obama. i agreed with some of his points. may not agreed by the methods, but ya gotta cross that bridge when you get there. then when i heard him doing the classic double speak, that is what turned me off of him. just like with Kerry. so he can say taht he disagrees with his pastor all taht he wants. unless he shows it, then words me nothing. you know...the classic "you can talk the talk, but can you walk the walk"?
Classact
03-17-2008, 12:41 PM
Pastor Wright was chosen by Obama and Obama knew of his complete record when he dis-invited the pastor very early on in his campaign... Rolling Stones magazine broke the story months ago but was just presented to the national media in the last week... Well guess what the American people think about Rev. Wright... 8% agree with him http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/people2/just_8_have_favorable_opinion_of_pastor_jeremiah_w right
Oprah Winfrey attended the same church and had the good judgment to depart it in 1990 shortly after attending... http://islamanazi.com/2008/01/14/oprah-barack-in-the-same-racist-islamic-church/
How is it that Obama had such poor judgment? Rev. Wright is locally know to be Obama's "father figure". Obama was with the 8% of America until just last week when he was busted!:lame2:
Abbey Marie
03-17-2008, 12:45 PM
"You must spread some reputation around before..."
Excellent post, ClassAct.
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 01:10 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/29/john-hagees-mccain-endor_n_89189.html
Well McCain still likes this guy Hagee who said some pretty awful things.
Classact
03-17-2008, 01:18 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/29/john-hagees-mccain-endor_n_89189.html
Well McCain still likes this guy Hagee who said some pretty awful things.Well not quite...
"Well, obviously I repudiate any comments that are anti-Semitic or anti-Catholic, racist, any other," McCain said. "And I condemn them and I condemn those words that Pastor Hagee apparently — that Pastor Hagee wrote. I will say that he said that his words were taken out of context, he defends his position. I hope that maybe you'd give him a chance to respond." http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/mccain_hagee_assured_us_his_wo.php
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 01:25 PM
taken out of context....blatantly saying it.
supporter....mentor of 20 yrs
yep! those are exactly the same. score another for TM :clap:
Immanuel
03-17-2008, 01:27 PM
This crap will get no traction no matter how many times you repete the story.
Everyone has sat on a pew and heard their pastor/rabi or whatever say something they did not agree with.
You just keep reminding people hes not a muslim so thanks.
Wrong! This story will get a ton of traction and it might just end the campaign for Obama.
As for sitting in the pew and listening to a pastor say something I don't agree with; yes, that has happened, but I can tell you that if my pastor stood up and began spewing hate filled crap like that, I as an elder of my church would immediately call for his dismissal.
Did it stop the Rs from buddying up to him and taking his money?
As a matter of fact, it did. Those very words cost Jerry Falwell his prominence as a Christian leader. Today, Jerry Falwell is little more than a shadow of what he was at one time and I'm not speaking of his weight.
You can run if you like. You wouls have never voted for Obama in any situation.
The people who are yet to make up their minds now know he is a christian and always has been a christian. They also know he disagrees with his pastor on these issues.
Net gain is for Obama. Thanks for helping.
Tell me, PLEASE, that you have not listened to those tapes that are being played. No true Christain would spew that kind of hatred. I'm sorry to have to say that to MFM, but that man is not displaying Christian love at all. The fact that he has more than 10 people in his church is down right scary.
Immie
theHawk
03-17-2008, 01:50 PM
If so many people have a problem with his pastor and the link with obama- then DONT VOTE FOR OBAMA.
If you dont like him- then dont vote for him- SIMPLE!
Leave the poor guy alone, and go and vote for war monger McCain.
We're not going to vote for this sack of shit. And we'll also expose to as many people as possible his shady past and his severe lapse of judgement when it comes to his ideology choices. He chose to suscribe to this pastor's ideology. And if Obama is going to run his campaign based on his superior judgement, we as voters have every right to scrutinize that judgement.
To suggest that we should all just shut up and vote for who we want really demonstrates that libtards like yourself hate freedom of speech. This is a political message board and if you can't handle people scrutinizing your candidate, then don't let the door hit you on your ass.
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 01:55 PM
None of you would have voted for him anyway.
Your side has shown its ability to make judgements for America and the results are hitting us smack in the face right now.
This is a non issue. You can ride this all the way to political obscurity.
Obama did not say these things and he repudiated them.
This is all you have to "attack " him with and its a losing game.
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 02:07 PM
None of you would have voted for him anyway.
Your side has shown its ability to make judgements for America and the results are hitting us smack in the face right now.
This is a non issue. You can ride this all the way to political obscurity.
Obama did not say these things and he repudiated them.
This is all you have to "attack " him with and its a losing game.
do you not read anything that was posted? or can you not read? i would just like to be clear on this.
and you keep telling yourself that it is a non-issue and losing game. doesn't make it right...but...you tell yourself that no matter what ok? wrap that blanket around you and go off on an adventure in dreamland. they atleast all believe and agree with you there.
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 02:17 PM
It will get no traction with anyone other than the people who would never vote for him anyway.
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 02:19 PM
It will get no traction with anyone other than the people who would never vote for him anyway.
what about the undecides? you know...the ones that haven't put their heads in the sands as the chant " Change! Change!"
Immanuel
03-17-2008, 02:30 PM
It will get no traction with anyone other than the people who would never vote for him anyway.
I pray you are wrong.
I pray that Christians who may have voted for him because he seems to be different than the run of the mill politician will listen to those tapes.
I pray that even if they don't hold Obama responsible for those tapes (and they should not), they will at least speak out against the hatred those tapes contain. That is NOT Christian by any stretch of the imagination.
I pray that people in his church will hear the controversy the tapes have stirred up and repudiate what he said as well.
Immie
Monkeybone
03-17-2008, 02:41 PM
don't hold Obama responsible for those tapes
i know that i am not holding him responsible for what was said. he can't control it, just like he can't control what anybody says (like his proud wife). to me it just brings up questions about what he is really like and his thoughts. it would be hard to listen and take advice from someone for 20 yrs if you didn't think along the same lines.
Immanuel
03-17-2008, 02:57 PM
i know that i am not holding him responsible for what was said. he can't control it, just like he can't control what anybody says (like his proud wife). to me it just brings up questions about what he is really like and his thoughts. it would be hard to listen and take advice from someone for 20 yrs if you didn't think along the same lines.
I completely agree.
I was not and am not going to vote for Obama, but only because I have decided I cannot support either one of the two parties any longer. They are the establishment of power in this country. We need a real change... and a peaceful one not just a change of one party over another.
I disagree with what I have heard of Obama's social views. I have not really sat down and searched each candidate's views at this point. That will come when the candidates are chosen. But as a person, Obama seems to be heads and shoulders above the other two candidates... except for this one issue.
As a Christian, I can not tolerate the hatred spoken in my savior's name that came out of the lips of Jeremiah Wright. It is unacceptable... then to see people that I would assume are Christian standing and saying "hallelujah" at his sermon... well, I darn near swallowed my tongue when I saw that!
The fact that Obama has chosen him as a pastor and a mentor brings into question Obama's judgment as far as I am concerned. A mentor? Are you telling me Obama chose this man as a mentor and didn't know what he believed? I find that hard to believe.
Immie
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 03:02 PM
Like I said anyone who takes this issue seriously would never vote for Obama anyway.
Like I said anyone who takes this issue seriously would never vote for Obama anyway.
:lol:
obama took it seriously....he fired him from his staff and it is SO serious, the guy quit as pastor
:laugh2:
:dance:
truthmatters
03-17-2008, 03:07 PM
Yes he did but to you that means nothing.
He did not say these things his pastor did.
When he was asked what he thought of the remarks he replyed.
You would have never voteed for him anyway.
for you its just an opportunity to bash him.
CockySOB
03-17-2008, 06:35 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/29/john-hagees-mccain-endor_n_89189.html
Well McCain still likes this guy Hagee who said some pretty awful things.
Is McCain a member of Hagee's congregation? Has McCain developed a long-term friend/mentor relationship with Hagee? No? Oops, seems you can't quite make the analogy you wanted, not that I'm at all surprised.
TM, you're really showing a pathetic desperation here.
CockySOB
03-17-2008, 06:36 PM
Like I said anyone who takes this issue seriously would never vote for Obama anyway.
You might be surprised just how many of the Democrats will swing to Hillary over this. I won't be.
We're not going to vote for this sack of shit. And we'll also expose to as many people as possible his shady past and his severe lapse of judgement when it comes to his ideology choices. He chose to suscribe to this pastor's ideology. And if Obama is going to run his campaign based on his superior judgement, we as voters have every right to scrutinize that judgement.
To suggest that we should all just shut up and vote for who we want really demonstrates that libtards like yourself hate freedom of speech. This is a political message board and if you can't handle people scrutinizing your candidate, then don't let the door hit you on your ass.
Mr conservative, you clearly seem a bit emotionak, obama is the front runner, are you feeling a few jitters? Please dont act like you give a shit about obama and this pastor fiasco- you are targeting him because you know he is the frontrunner and- that he has a muslim middle name.
Yes he did but to you that means nothing.
He did not say these things his pastor did.
When he was asked what he thought of the remarks he replyed.
You would have never voteed for him anyway.
for you its just an opportunity to bash him.
no, you said, "anyone who takes this seriously would not vote for him"
i proved you wrong by pointing out that his church takes it so serious they removed the pastor, obamala takes it so serious he fired the guy from his campaign.
so how can you still justify your statement? this isn't about me, it is about your statement and how you are dead wrong, this is obviously very important to many people..... continue to keep your head in the sand, saves precious resources.....
Abbey Marie
03-17-2008, 06:59 PM
...
As a matter of fact, it did. Those very words cost Jerry Falwell his prominence as a Christian leader. Today, Jerry Falwell is little more than a shadow of what he was at one time and I'm not speaking of his weight.
...
Immie
Reverend Falwell passed away. I think it was in 2007.
Edited to add: I looked it up- it was May, 2007
Immanuel
03-18-2008, 07:07 AM
Yes he did but to you that means nothing.
He did not say these things his pastor did.
When he was asked what he thought of the remarks he replyed.
You would have never voteed for him anyway.
for you its just an opportunity to bash him.
I have no intention to bash him nor have I done so. As I said, of the three candidates, I like him much better than either one of the other two in the running. I do not hold him responsible for Jeremiah Wright's faults, but I do question how he could have chosen this man as a mentor in the first place.
That would be like me chosing David Duke as a mentor and then 20 years later saying I had no idea that he was a racist. Please... give me a break.
Immie
Immanuel
03-18-2008, 07:10 AM
Reverend Falwell passed away. I think it was in 2007.
Edited to add: I looked it up- it was May, 2007
You're right. I had forgotten. See he IS nothing but a shadow of his former self! :D
RIP Rev. Falwell.
Immie
Classact
03-18-2008, 07:51 AM
The general election with Obama on the Democratic ticket would be disastrous for the nation because of the blind following given him would result in a super majority in congress and him in the White House.
On the other hand, Obama is ahead of Hillary in delegates but has some rough times ahead due to his minister's hatred... States like PA, WV and NC will have little use for someone represented by such a black white hater in the shadows...
Today Obama will give a speech on race... my guess it will satisfy ALL liberals and blacks but will leave the topic of his minister in the headlines to be debated even more... this will force him in front of people like Chris Wallace who will have some VERY hard questions to answer.
If you watched Forest Gump, and everyone has... there was a scene in the DC mall where in a bus there was a young Black Panther that was about to beat up Forest... (This is Rev. Wright)... or at least what he represents... The big question is why is Obama and Wright even come in to conversation since there is no reason for someone with opposite views to be seen together other than in a debate... Obama should be standing up to people like Wright and to people like those who support hate from the right...
The key here is what Hillary said yesterday... WORDS MATTER... and she will point the above facts out as clearly as I have above to the Supper Dupper Delegates who will have to choose her... Why is this important? It will destroy the Democratic Party by breaking away the Afro-American blind support for the party... hardly no one will show up for the general election from either side... With Hill and McC on the ticket will result in balance regardless who is elected because congress will remain split.
jimnyc
03-18-2008, 09:42 AM
This crap will get no traction no matter how many times you repete the story.
I wonder why you think it's a non-issue, and it won't get traction. If it wasn't so, why would Obama himself be going out of his way to distance himself from the comments? I read about this issue with him and his pastor on no less than 5 major media outlets today.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080318/ap_on_el_pr/obama_race
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/18/obama.speech/index.html
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23687688/
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/17/under-pressure-obama-prepares-for-race-and-unity-speech/
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/18/us/politics/18wright.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin
Amazing how something that is so inconsequential is getting talked about by every major media outlet in the nation. So much for it not getting any traction.
TM - wrong again for the 3500th time! LOL
hjmick
03-18-2008, 10:11 AM
The idea that some people believe Obama's pastor and his views are non-issues is surprising to me. Obama has proclaimed this man his "spiritual leader." He serves as an advisor to Obama's campaign. One would think he is the man Obama does an would turn to when in need of advice both morally and spiritually. The very notion that it should be considered a non-topic is diversionary at best. At worst it is ignorant. His rhetoric, like it or not is divisive, racially charged, and ethnocentric. Were he a white minister advising a white candidate the outcry would doom the candidate in question. Much like his approach to to the Farrakhan endorsement, his approach to this issue has been designed to preserve the votes he would otherwise run the risk of losing if he were to take a harder line with the good Reverend Wright. He is the epitome of the perfect politician, he will and does say anything and everything to get the votes, every vote, any vote. Wright is and should be a topic of discussion. The spiritual advisor to any candidate is part of the discussion. So are his or her points of view.
Immanuel
03-18-2008, 10:19 AM
The idea that some people believe Obama's pastor and his views are non-issues is surprising to me. Obama has proclaimed this man his "spiritual leader." He serves as an advisor to Obama's campaign. One would think he is the man Obama does an would turn to when in need of advice both morally and spiritually. The very notion that it should be considered a non-topic is diversionary at best. At worst it is ignorant. His rhetoric, like it or not is divisive, racially charged, and ethnocentric. Were he a white minister advising a white candidate the outcry would doom the candidate in question. Much like his approach to to the Farrakhan endorsement, his approach to this issue has been designed to preserve the votes he would otherwise run the risk of losing if he were to take a harder line with the good Reverend Wright. He is the epitome of the perfect politician, he will and does say anything and everything to get the votes, every vote, any vote. Wright is and should be a topic of discussion. The spiritual advisor to any candidate is part of the discussion. So are his or her points of view.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving some to hjmick again.
Sorry, have to wait for another time.
Immie
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.