Bush recession now official

[gabosaurus]

Not that we didn't know it already. But it is so Bush to leave an economic mess for the next president to clean up.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-econ2-2008dec02,0,2587872.story

[stephanie]

yeah like one man can make or break an ecomony..

how dumb..:coffee:

[red states rule]

Not that we didn't know it already. But it is so Bush to leave an economic mess for the next president to clean up.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-econ2-2008dec02,0,2587872.story

Sorry to bust your bubble Gabby - but it is not official.

From your link

By one benchmark, a recession occurs whenever the gross domestic product, the total output of goods and services, declines for two consecutive quarters. The GDP turned negative in the July-September quarter of this year, and many economists believe it is falling in the current quarter at an even sharper rate.

[stephanie]

yeah like one man can make or break an ecomony..

how dumb..

not to fret though..........the little Marxist will come and save us..
:coffee:

[Yurt]

so you admit clinton screwed up and handed bush a stock bubble which harmed the economy....

remind me again of which president soon to be elect sued citibank and others to force them to loan to people in inner cities/minorities who did not have the proper credit, remind me again what president altered the housing act in 96'....remind me again which president in 2001 and onward warned you libs about the impending housing crisis, remind me again which AZ senator to recently run for high office tried to warn you guys back in 2005 and remind me again which side of the aisle were the congressmen on that yelled at republicans in 2003 to stop fear mongering about the housing crisis....

remind me again of which illinois senator said that fm and fm were just fine in 2007

[gabosaurus]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

[red states rule]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

and the Dems who said there was no problem with them when Pres Bush wanted to reform them

[Yurt]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

bush and soon to be obama

your point?

i answered you, now kindly answer me. :)


so you admit clinton screwed up and handed bush a stock bubble which harmed the economy....

remind me again of which president soon to be elect sued citibank and others to force them to loan to people in inner cities/minorities who did not have the proper credit, remind me again what president altered the housing act in 96'....remind me again which president in 2001 and onward warned you libs about the impending housing crisis, remind me again which AZ senator to recently run for high office tried to warn you guys back in 2005 and remind me again which side of the aisle were the congressmen on that yelled at republicans in 2003 to stop fear mongering about the housing crisis....

remind me again of which illinois senator said that fm and fm were just fine in 2007

[Kathianne]

I have to agree with RSR, this is one article using one type of definition which is to help Obama escape the inevitable plummeting of our financial sectors as it became clear that he would likely win. This is and will be Obama's recession or lord help us, depression.

While normally one can't assign fault to one person, in this case Obama has made clear that all change is through him.

[Yurt]

and the Dems who said there was no problem with them when Pres Bush wanted to reform them

i believe obama said there was no problem as recently as late 2007...

[red states rule]

i believe obama said there was no problem as recently as late 2007...

Obama did say that, along with most top ranking Dems

http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2008/09/mccain_obama_di.html

[avatar4321]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

Barack Obama.

[5stringJeff]

Barack Obama.

And George Bush. Not that Obama will be any better in this regard, but Bush did start the whole corporate bailout thing.

[red states rule]

And George Bush. Not that Obama will be any better in this regard, but Bush did start the whole corporate bailout thing.

Jeff, Pres Bush and McCain tried to fix the problem before it exploded. - but Dems blocked the efforts

I oppose the bailouts, but if Dems would have not been out to block everything Pres Bush tired to do, we may not be in the situation we are now in

[5stringJeff]

Jeff, Pres Bush and McCain tried to fix the problem before it exploded. - but Dems blocked the efforts

I oppose the bailouts, but if Dems would have not been out to block everything Pres Bush tired to do, we may not be in the situation we are now in

LOL!!! Bush's Treasury Secretary is the program's creator and biggest proponent! He's more Hamiltonian than Hamilton!!! And McCain voted for the bailouts!!

Bush has never proposed any serious solutions to the present crisis, like complete privatization of Fannie and Freddie or permanent tax cuts.

[red states rule]

LOL!!! Bush's Treasury Secretary is the program's creator and biggest proponent! He's more Hamiltonian than Hamilton!!! And McCain voted for the bailouts!!

Bush has never proposed any serious solutions to the present crisis, like complete privatization of Fannie and Freddie or permanent tax cuts.

As I said, you need to pay attention more


snip

Bush Called For Reform of Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac 17 Times in 2008 Alone... Dems Ignored Warnings

For many years the President and his Administration have not only warned of the systemic consequences of financial turmoil at a housing government-sponsored enterprise (GSE) but also put forward thoughtful plans to reduce the risk that either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac would encounter such difficulties. President Bush publicly called for GSE reform 17 times in 2008 alone before Congress acted.

Unfortunately, these warnings went unheeded, as the President's repeated attempts to reform the supervision of these entities were thwarted by the legislative maneuvering of those who emphatically denied there were problems.

The White House released this list of attempts by President Bush to reform Freddie Mae and Freddie Mac since he took office in 2001.
Unfortunately, Congress did not act on the president's warnings:


** 2001

April: The Administration's FY02 budget declares that the size of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac is "a potential problem," because "financial trouble of a large GSE could cause strong repercussions in financial markets, affecting Federally insured entities and economic activity."

** 2002

May: The President calls for the disclosure and corporate governance principles contained in his 10-point plan for corporate responsibility to apply to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. (OMB Prompt Letter to OFHEO, 5/29/02)

** 2003

January: Freddie Mac announces it has to restate financial results for the previous three years.

February: The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight (OFHEO) releases a report explaining that "although investors perceive an implicit Federal guarantee of [GSE] obligations," "the government has provided no explicit legal backing for them." As a consequence, unexpected problems at a GSE could immediately spread into financial sectors beyond the housing market. ("Systemic Risk: Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and the Role of OFHEO," OFHEO Report, 2/4/03)

September: Fannie Mae discloses SEC investigation and acknowledges OFHEO's review found earnings manipulations.

September: Treasury Secretary John Snow testifies before the House Financial Services Committee to recommend that Congress enact "legislation to create a new Federal agency to regulate and supervise the financial activities of our housing-related government sponsored enterprises" and set prudent and appropriate minimum capital adequacy requirements.

October: Fannie Mae discloses $1.2 billion accounting error.

November: Council of the Economic Advisers (CEA) Chairman Greg Mankiw explains that any "legislation to reform GSE regulation should empower the new regulator with sufficient strength and credibility to reduce systemic risk." To reduce the potential for systemic instability, the regulator would have "broad authority to set both risk-based and minimum capital standards" and "receivership powers necessary to wind down the affairs of a troubled GSE." (N. Gregory Mankiw, Remarks At The Conference Of State Bank Supervisors State Banking Summit And Leadership, 11/6/03)

http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/09/bush-called-for-reform-of-fannie-mae.html

[Yurt]

And George Bush. Not that Obama will be any better in this regard, but Bush did start the whole corporate bailout thing.

really? what about chrysler in 79'?

[red states rule]

Jeff, here is an article from 2003 the NY Times ran

New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae

By STEPHEN LABATON
Published: September 11, 2003
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress, to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.

The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt -- is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates.

''There is a general recognition that the supervisory system for housing-related government-sponsored enterprises neither has the tools, nor the stature, to deal effectively with the current size, complexity and importance of these enterprises,'' Treasury Secretary John W. Snow told the House Financial Services Committee in an appearance with Housing Secretary Mel Martinez, who also backed the plan.

Mr. Snow said that Congress should eliminate the power of the president to appoint directors to the companies, a sign that the administration is less concerned about the perks of patronage than it is about the potential political problems associated with any new difficulties arising at the companies.

The administration's proposal, which was endorsed in large part today by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, would not repeal the significant government subsidies granted to the two companies. And it does not alter the implicit guarantee that Washington will bail the companies out if they run into financial difficulty; that perception enables them to issue debt at significantly lower rates than their competitors. Nor would it remove the companies' exemptions from taxes and antifraud provisions of federal securities laws.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E06E3D6123BF932A2575AC0A9659C8B 63&sec=&spon=&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink

[avatar4321]

And George Bush. Not that Obama will be any better in this regard, but Bush did start the whole corporate bailout thing.

I know. Im just pointing out her hypocrisy.

[5stringJeff]

As I said, you need to pay attention more


snip

Bush Called For Reform of Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac 17 Times in 2008 Alone... Dems Ignored Warnings


"Reforming" Fannie and Freddie would not have worked, and will never work. That is simply kicking the can down the road. The two firms should be completely privatized, with absolutely no government funding or oversight.

[5stringJeff]

really? what about chrysler in 79'?

Good one - forgot about that! :thumb:

So does that put Bush into the same company as Carter?

[red states rule]

"Reforming" Fannie and Freddie would not have worked, and will never work. That is simply kicking the can down the road. The two firms should be completely privatized, with absolutely no government funding or oversight.

Nice dodge from your comment how Pres Bush did NOTHING to try and fix things

They tried to head off the problem, and Dems blocked the attempts while saying there was no problem. Now those who turned a blind eye are in charge of fixing things

[5stringJeff]

Nice dodge from your comment how Pres Bush did NOTHING to try and fix things

They tried to head off the problem, and Dems blocked the attempts while saying there was no problem. Now those who turned a blind eye are in charge of fixing things

It's not a dodge. "Reforming" Fannie and Freddie is impossible. The two institutions are designed to suck money out of the Treasury ad infinitum. the only fix is to completely privatize them - which Bush has never proposed.

[red states rule]

It's not a dodge. "Reforming" Fannie and Freddie is impossible. The two institutions are designed to suck money out of the Treasury ad infinitum. the only fix is to completely privatize them - which Bush has never proposed.

What Pres Bush and John McCain wanted to do was a step in right direction - but we will never know if it would have helped

Dems like Barney Frank said there was no problem, and the reform efforts were coming from racist Republicans

[manu1959]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

obama......and if i recall carter and clinton signed into law the legislation that forced banks to pass out liar loans.....

[Yurt]

Good one - forgot about that! :thumb:

So does that put Bush into the same company as Carter?

imo, with regards to this, yup

we made it through the stock bubble collapse by getting our tax dollars back. this bubble was caused by the government and now the governmnt is stealing our money to fix their problem.

btw, has anyone figured out where exactly this money is coming from?

[manu1959]

imo, with regards to this, yup

we made it through the stock bubble collapse by getting our tax dollars back. this bubble was caused by the government and now the governmnt is stealing our money to fix their problem.

btw, has anyone figured out where exactly this money is coming from?

the us mint.......kidding...go on dennis kucinch's website.....he explains it....

the banks loan the us govt money at interest who in turn loan it back interest free.....

[Yurt]

the us mint.......kidding...go on dennis kucinch's website.....he explains it....

the banks loan the us govt money at interest who in turn loan it back interest free.....

i remember our convo on that, but i still wondered what banks exactly and i think you said the ones who are doing well, i am not sure which ones? also, is it interest free? i thought the feds wanted a stake in the mtgs, then they didn't, then they wanted a stake in the bank itself.

[Kathianne]

I have to agree with RSR, this is one article using one type of definition which is to help Obama escape the inevitable plummeting of our financial sectors as it became clear that he would likely win. This is and will be Obama's recession or lord help us, depression.

While normally one can't assign fault to one person, in this case Obama has made clear that all change is through him.

no dissents. It's the Obama recession.

[Des]

This whole bailout thing should wake us all up to the fact that the government is owned by private corporations and we need to wake up, stop allowing the t.v. and consumerism to run our lives, and stop blaming everything on the people in the government WE are responsible for putting there.

[bullypulpit]

Not that we didn't know it already. But it is so Bush to leave an economic mess for the next president to clean up.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-econ2-2008dec02,0,2587872.story

Just another of the flaming bags of dogshit the Bush administration is leaving on the front porch of the next administration. Guess the drug addled gas-bag that is Rush Limbaugh can't bitch about the "Obama recession".

Never mind that Bush and Co caved to pressure from the same banks he now wants to save by failing to implement tougher rules on no money down and interest only mortgages in 2006. (<a href=http://www.cnbc.com/id/27998044>Bush Officials Delayed Crackdown on Risky Mortgages</a>)

Laissez-faire capitalism presupposes a rational society, where the consequences of one's actions are carefully weighed to assure any negative consequences to both the actors and bystanders are minimized or eliminated. We do not have such a society, and well thought out government regulation is the only way to stem the worst excesses of capitalism.

[jimnyc]

Remind of which president wants to bail out private corporations who fucked themselves up.

Remind me of WHO in congress voted for the bailout. Regardless of Bush's wishes, it couldn't have happened without the votes.

[namvet]

Not that we didn't know it already. But it is so Bush to leave an economic mess for the next president to clean up.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-econ2-2008dec02,0,2587872.story



"its Osama's fault"

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb180/gardenmo/Obamarama.gif

[5stringJeff]

no dissents. It's the Obama recession.

I dissent. How could a recession that started in December - well before Obama even won a primary and Hillary was the heir-apparent in the Democrat Party - be labeled "the Obama recession?" I'm certainly not convinced that Obama is going to fix anything - he'll probably make it worse - but it's not 'his' recession. And if it is labeled the Obama recession, then the economic downturn in 2000 deserves to be labeled "the Bush downturn," since, after all, he was running for President when it happened.