Unions Now Will Negotiate

[Yurt]

remember a week or two ago, the UAW said no negotiations and i said that their attitude could bankrupt the companies and then they will have nothing and that their stance was unnacceptable. well, now that unions "look" bad, they are willing to negotiate:


UAW to renegotiate labor terms, suspend jobs bank

DETROIT – The United Auto Workers said Wednesday it is willing to change its contracts with U.S. automakers and accept delayed payments of billions of dollars to a union-run health care trust to do its part to help the struggling companies secure $34 billion in government loans.

United Auto Workers President Ron Gettelfinger said the union will suspend the jobs bank, in which laid-off workers are paid up to 95 percent of their salaries while not working, but he did not give specifics or a timetable of when the program will end.

"We're going to sit down and work out the mechanics," Gettelfinger said at a news conference after meeting with local union officials. "We're a little unclear on some of the issues."

Members of Congress criticized the automakers last month for paying workers who are not on the job. About 3,500 auto workers across the three companies are currently in jobs bank programs.
...

He also said the union will run a television ad in Maine, Kentucky, Indiana and Minnesota to put the faces of union workers on the controversy over the loans, and explain how the auto industry differs from the banking industry. The ads presumably are designed to pressure Congressional opponents of the loans.

"There's a perception problem," Gettelfinger said, stressing that the automakers' woes have painted a negative view of the union. "Yes, we have lost some clout."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081203/ap_on_bi_ge/autos_uaw

[avatar4321]

they realize if the company declares bankrupcy, they have nothing.

[moderate democrat]

they realize if the company declares bankrupcy, they have nothing.


I have to agree. unions are smart enough to realize that killing the goose that lays the golden egg is a losing strategy.

[red states rule]

I have to agree. unions are smart enough to realize that killing the goose that lays the golden egg is a losing strategy.

Well it took them long enough to get a firm grasp on the obvious. The best thing that could happen to the Big Three is to kick the unions to the curb

[moderate democrat]

Well it took them long enough to get a firm grasp on the obvious. The best thing that could happen to the Big Three is to kick the unions to the curb

I am not sure that an adversarial stance is in anyone's best interest in these troubled times.

[red states rule]

I am not sure that an adversarial stance is in anyone's best interest in these troubled times.

Unions are the reason the Big Three are in trouble. The auto companies pay more for the employees health care then they pay for the steel to make the cars

Unions are no longer needed, and need to be done away with

Of course the Democrat party and the mafia will be the ones who will suffer the most if the unions are disbanded

[moderate democrat]

Unions are the reason the Big Three are in trouble. The auto companies pay more for the employees health care then they pay for the steel to make the cars

Unions are no longer needed, and need to be done away with

Of course the Democrat party and the mafia will be the ones who will suffer the most if the unions are disbanded

your desiring to kick them to the curb seems like you are the one who is adversarial in times that do not call for it.

[red states rule]

your desiring to kick them to the curb seems like you are the one who is adversarial in times that do not call for it.

If you have a cancer you cut it out of your body, and not try to reason with it

[moderate democrat]

If you have a cancer you cut it out of your body, and not try to reason with it

I would suggest that calling the workforce of the largest manufacturing sector in America "a cancer" is hardly the way to find common ground and move forward to develop solutions that are good for America.

[red states rule]

I would suggest that calling the workforce of the largest manufacturing sector in America "a cancer" is hardly the way to find common ground and move forward to develop solutions that are good for America.

Unions are only about 9% of the US workforce. Unions have done for the auto industry what liberalsim has done for the entire state of MI

[moderate democrat]

Unions are only about 9% of the US workforce. Unions have done for the auto industry what liberalsim has done for the entire state of MI

if unions really are irrelevant to the auto industry, what is the problem here?

if the auto industry really is irrelevant to the nation's economy, what is the problem here?

[red states rule]

if unions really are irrelevant to the auto industry, what is the problem here?

if the auto industry really is irrelevant to the nation's economy, what is the problem here?

As I said, unions are the main reason the auto companies are in trouble

[moderate democrat]

As I said, unions are the main reason the auto companies are in trouble

I would think that their inability to produce energy efficient products would be a main reason as well.

[red states rule]

if unions really are irrelevant to the auto industry, what is the problem here?

if the auto industry really is irrelevant to the nation's economy, what is the problem here?


I would think that their inability to produce energy efficient products would be a main reason as well.

You mean like the lefts beloved electric car? :laugh2:

I guess you would love Pelosi and Reid to decide what type or car Detroit should produce, in what quantity, and how much they would cost

[Yurt]

Unions are the reason the Big Three are in trouble. The auto companies pay more for the employees health care then they pay for the steel to make the cars

Unions are no longer needed, and need to be done away with

Of course the Democrat party and the mafia will be the ones who will suffer the most if the unions are disbanded

unions are part of, not the reason they are in trouble. dude, i have always owned toyota and will never buy an american car. if you want to blame that on the unions, then you had better talk to management that manages the unions, unless you are telling me that unions controll the assembly line <-- that is key, the assembly line. check it out, there is a diff btwn japan and america on that.


if unions really are irrelevant to the auto industry, what is the problem here?

if the auto industry really is irrelevant to the nation's economy, what is the problem here?

the problem is that unions are there by LAW and by FORCE. i had a job that i could only get if i was union. do you really not understand this?



You mean like the lefts beloved electric car? :laugh2:

I guess you would love Pelosi and Reid to decide what type or car Detroit should produce, in what quantity, and how much they would cost

i LIKE the electric car. what is your problem it? "who killed the electric car" watch it sometime.

[red states rule]

Yurt, I know first hand how unions operate. In the union I once worked in, it was nearly impossible to fire a bad worker - and auto companies are locked into insane contracts

As far as the electric car, it died because you had to charge it up after a few hours of use, and from what I have read, few people wanted to own one

[Yurt]

Yurt, I know first hand how unions operate. In the union I once worked in, it was nearly impossible to fire a bad worker - and auto companies are locked into insane contracts

As far as the electric car, it died because you had to charge it up after a few hours of use, and from what I have read, few people wanted to own one

you said unions are THE reason the companies are in trouble.

the unions are not "the" reason. that was my point.

no, it did not die because of that. try a google search, there were actually a good amount of famous, whatever that is, folks in LA trying to save the electric car, GM said go pound sand we want our electric vehicles back. no matter the price, they wanted them back. in fact, one of the cars in now in a museum....go figure....

seriously check it out

[red states rule]

you said unions are THE reason the companies are in trouble.

the unions are not "the" reason. that was my point.

no, it did not die because of that. try a google search, there were actually a good amount of famous, whatever that is, folks in LA trying to save the electric car, GM said go pound sand we want our electric vehicles back. no matter the price, they wanted them back. in fact, one of the cars in now in a museum....go figure....

seriously check it out

I will check it out Yurt. From what I have read, the electric cars are a joke

But you can trace the problems Detroit has back to the unions. High operation costs, shitty cars put out, and the "I do not care atitude"

[moderate democrat]

shitty cars start with the design.... not the assembly line

[red states rule]

shitty cars start with the design.... not the assembly line

The quality of the cars were crap, and they were put together by union workers

[moderate democrat]

The quality of the cars were crap, and they were put together by union workers

the quality of the cars were crap, and they were designed by non-union workers

[red states rule]

the quality of the cars were crap, and they were designed by non-union workers

The quality concern of the production line workers was nonexistent MFM. They did not care how well they were put together, they just slinged them out

That is why the Big Three tanked in the 70's and have been playing catch up ever since

[moderate democrat]

The quality concern of the production line workers was nonexistent MFM. They did not care how well they were put together, they just slinged them out

That is why the Big Three tanked in the 70's and have been playing catch up ever since

mfm? my point is that the cars developed by detroit were not the right products for the market. and the market chose foreign competitors who were better attuned to what the market demanded. detroit was always a day late and a dollar short.

[red states rule]

mfm? my point is that the cars developed by detroit were not the right products for the market. and the market chose foreign competitors who were better attuned to what the market demanded. detroit was always a day late and a dollar short.

You are Virgil. Japan makes the same cars here in America and are doing fine

[moderate democrat]

You are Virgil. Japan makes the same cars here in America and are doing fine


I have no idea who virgil is... and japan makes better designed cars here in America which is why they are doing better than the big three.

[red states rule]

I have no idea who virgil is... and japan makes better designed cars here in America which is why they are doing better than the big three.

Look in the mirror and you will see him

Japan does not have the insane labor costs and contracts to deal with

[moderate democrat]

Look in the mirror and you will see him

Japan does not have the insane labor costs and contracts to deal with
poorly designed cars are poorly designed at any price.

[red states rule]

poorly designed cars are poorly designed at any price.

No it is about Japan paying about $30/hr less in labor costs

[moderate democrat]

No it is about Japan paying about $30/hr less in labor costs

their labor costs do not change our poor design, do they?

[Mr. P]

their labor costs do not change our poor design, do they?

Yes they do..high labor cost means less $$$ for R&D etc..so the unions really are mostly at fault here.

[Yurt]

I will check it out Yurt. From what I have read, the electric cars are a joke

But you can trace the problems Detroit has back to the unions. High operation costs, shitty cars put out, and the "I do not care atitude"

so all of those problems are due solely to the unions?

[bullypulpit]

Ah...yes...It's all the fault of the unions. Wall Street and it's white-collar work-force can walk away with hundreds of billions of dollars in tax-payer money with no strings attached but Motown and its blue-collar workforce takes it in the shorts. Bullshit.

The auto industry is the heavy manufacturing base of our economy...endangered by the outsourcing of jobs and incompetent management, its collapse would lead to the collapse of major portions of the rest of our manufacturing industry. You know the folks who actually MAKE the things we use every day, in stark contrast to those in the financial services industry which produce nothing.

The unions are to be broken, not that they've been working all that well for the last thirty years or so. Before you castigate the unions, however...it is due to them that we have forty hour work-weeks, vacation, health-care benefits, occupational safety standards and much more.

[red states rule]

Ah...yes...It's all the fault of the unions. Wall Street and it's white-collar work-force can walk away with hundreds of billions of dollars in tax-payer money with no strings attached but Motown and its blue-collar workforce takes it in the shorts. Bullshit.

The auto industry is the heavy manufacturing base of our economy...endangered by the outsourcing of jobs and incompetent management, its collapse would lead to the collapse of major portions of the rest of our manufacturing industry. You know the folks who actually MAKE the things we use every day, in stark contrast to those in the financial services industry which produce nothing.

The unions are to be broken, not that they've been working all that well for the last thirty years or so. Before you castigate the unions, however...it is due to them that we have forty hour work-weeks, vacation, health-care benefits, occupational safety standards and much more.

Barney Frank summed up the left view on this BP. He sneered how the Dems would "punish" management and anyone who made over $250,000/yr

Not a word about the unions, the higher labor costs, and how the auto industry is paying more for health benefits then they do for the steel they buy to make the cars

I also see how unions have become wholly owned subsidiaries of the Democrat party and the Mafia

[Yurt]

I would suggest that calling the workforce of the largest manufacturing sector in America "a cancer" is hardly the way to find common ground and move forward to develop solutions that are good for America.


shitty cars start with the design.... not the assembly line

:lol:

sounds like, walks like....

[red states rule]

:lol:

sounds like, walks like....

Even Insp. Jacques Clouseau would have figured it out by now :laugh2:

[Binky]

The quality of the cars were crap, and they were put together by union workers


Then don't buy them....it's that simple. And because of people's greed, they wanted larger and larger vehicles produced. The auto companies wouldn't have spent the time and money in producing huge suvs if the public hadn't asked for them.

They were put together by people who were doing as they were told to do by management. Just like working at a fast food restaurant, the burgers are made the way management wants them made. Doesn't take a genius to figure it out.

It's all about choice.......you can choose or not choose to purchase them.

[Binky]

Ah...yes...It's all the fault of the unions. Wall Street and it's white-collar work-force can walk away with hundreds of billions of dollars in tax-payer money with no strings attached but Motown and its blue-collar workforce takes it in the shorts. Bullshit.

The auto industry is the heavy manufacturing base of our economy...endangered by the outsourcing of jobs and incompetent management, its collapse would lead to the collapse of major portions of the rest of our manufacturing industry. You know the folks who actually MAKE the things we use every day, in stark contrast to those in the financial services industry which produce nothing.

The unions are to be broken, not that they've been working all that well for the last thirty years or so. Before you castigate the unions, however...it is due to them that we have forty hour work-weeks, vacation, health-care benefits, occupational safety standards and much more.



AND.........the reason that management can't abuse or harrass their workers. The reason for the unions is to protect the workers. People were once treated as pieces of shit by abusive foremans etc. until they voted in the unions.

[DragonStryk72]

your desiring to kick them to the curb seems like you are the one who is adversarial in times that do not call for it.

Actually, I agree with RSR (god, it just always haunts me when I say that) on unions. They have become outdated, with most the actual reasons for unions having been to get rid of sweat shops, and make safe working environments for their employees.

Nowadays, we have those things, and have had them for quite a while, but the unions have kept increasing in both demands as well as in power. They just aren't a necessity like they were, and it is actually far past time that we stood them down.

[DragonStryk72]

I will check it out Yurt. From what I have read, the electric cars are a joke

But you can trace the problems Detroit has back to the unions. High operation costs, shitty cars put out, and the "I do not care atitude"

Actually, electric cars can get as much as 250 miles per charge these days, which is roughly equivalent to the miles you can put on most decent cars these days. While, yes, the initial price tag was a bit higher, you have to way that against the vehicle maintenance being vastly lower, with no gas needs, no oil changes, far fewer moving parts that would need replacing, no brake pads that wear down, none of it. With all of that removed, the electric car is far far cheaper than any gas powered vehicle on the road. Yes, if you got the Yugo of the electric cars, then you're getting crapped on, but then, if you got the Yugo of Yugos, you;re getting crapped on just as much.

[hjmick]

The problem as I see it, if you can only pull 250 miles on a charge, you're stuck stopping to charge up for the next 250. When my tank needs filling after 250 miles, I fill up and drive 250 more. Driving to Texas from California gets a bit more complicated when your car needs to be plugged in for hours in order to complete the next leg of your journey.

I see no way electric cars will ever replace internal combustion. Hybrids are, however, a different story.

[DragonStryk72]

The problem as I see it, if you can only pull 250 miles on a charge, you're stuck stopping to charge up for the next 250. When my tank needs filling after 250 miles, I fill up and drive 250 more. Driving to Texas from California gets a bit more complicated when your car needs to be plugged in for hours in order to complete the next leg of your journey.

I see no way electric cars will ever replace internal combustion. Hybrids are, however, a different story.

Actually, for long hauls, you should be making regular breaks anyhow, and as well, most people who have an electric car also get a hybrid for the longer runs.

[red states rule]

Then don't buy them....it's that simple. And because of people's greed, they wanted larger and larger vehicles produced. The auto companies wouldn't have spent the time and money in producing huge suvs if the public hadn't asked for them.

They were put together by people who were doing as they were told to do by management. Just like working at a fast food restaurant, the burgers are made the way management wants them made. Doesn't take a genius to figure it out.

It's all about choice.......you can choose or not choose to purchase them.

How is it greed when people buy the type of car they want? Why do some people think they have the right to tell people what type of car they must drive?

It is so funny to listen to the enviro wackos on TV dictate how we need to drive tiny cars, while they are driven around in chauffeur driven limos

[namvet]

my brother in law works for GM here locally. he's attending these meetings now. his dad is seriously ill down in TX. but he decided his god damned money was more important.

[red states rule]

my brother in law works for GM here locally. he's attending these meetings now. his dad is seriously ill down in TX. but he decided his god damned money was more important.

Either that, or he is afraid of answering to the union thugs if he does not attend the meeting

[namvet]

Either that, or he is afraid of answering to the union thugs if he does not attend the meeting

like all auto workers he's a dem. and their counting on the Marxist to bail their ass's out. my other brother in law is retired. and he's sweating losing his beneifts. they'll unify for $$$ but that's all.

[red states rule]

like all auto workers he's a dem. and their counting on the Marxist to bail their ass's out. my other brother in law is retired. and he's sweating losing his beneifts. they'll unify for $$$ but that's all.

The union bosses are waiting for their money

http://images.starpulse.com/Photos/Previews/Godfather-movie-09.jpg

[namvet]

The union bosses are waiting for their money

http://images.starpulse.com/Photos/Previews/Godfather-movie-09.jpg

im gonna make you an offer you can't refuse..............:laugh2:

[red states rule]

im gonna make you an offer you can't refuse..............:laugh2:

http://www.nakedauthors.com/uploaded_images/Clemenza,-Richard-S-Castellano-738076.jpg

Negotiate This!

[Trigg]

Ah...yes...It's all the fault of the unions. Wall Street and it's white-collar work-force can walk away with hundreds of billions of dollars in tax-payer money with no strings attached but Motown and its blue-collar workforce takes it in the shorts. Bullshit.

The auto industry is the heavy manufacturing base of our economy...endangered by the outsourcing of jobs and incompetent management, its collapse would lead to the collapse of major portions of the rest of our manufacturing industry. You know the folks who actually MAKE the things we use every day, in stark contrast to those in the financial services industry which produce nothing.

The unions are to be broken, not that they've been working all that well for the last thirty years or so. Before you castigate the unions, however...it is due to them that we have forty hour work-weeks, vacation, health-care benefits, occupational safety standards and much more.


There used to be a place for unions. Now they're a relic. Many, Many people in my family and my husband's work in unions or are retired from union jobs, and they aren't supporting this bailout. I spoke to a man today at the hospital, a life long union man and he said, let them fail.

Chapter 11 would allow the company to restructure themselves and get rid of some of the ridiculous union demands, ineffective management and CEO's who've driven the big 3 into the gutter.

Before you start crying about class warfare, read some old posts. Almost no one on this board was for the wall street bailout, least of all me.

The gov. should not be bailing out private businesses.

[namvet]

http://www.nakedauthors.com/uploaded_images/Clemenza,-Richard-S-Castellano-738076.jpg

Negotiate This!


its nothing personal just business

M2YBZxfW990

[red states rule]

http://www.moviestore.com/library/photos/169/169677.jpg

"$25 billion is a start, now how about a serious offer?"

[namvet]

http://www.moviestore.com/library/photos/169/169677.jpg

"$25 billion is a start, now how about a serious offer?"

its no secret the mob and unions slept together for years. going back to Hoffa. maybe before. Union $$$ helped build Vegas. so the mob could run it.

[red states rule]

its no secret the mob and unions slept together for years. going back to Hoffa. maybe before. Union $$$ helped build Vegas. so the mob could run it.

and the mobs have their claws deep in the unions today. Dems not only want to bail out the pension funds of the UAW - but to line the pockets of the mob and union bosses as well