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Sitarro
01-30-2009, 04:53 AM
This is an editorial by Rush that appeared in the Wall Street Journal, the proposal makes a lot of sense, is fair and will never be taken seriously by the Demwitocrats because they are too afraid that they would be proven full of shit once and for all by a mere talk show host....... Obama is a pussy.:cool: Rush would kick his ass in any debate at any time or place on any subject including that fag sport of hoops.



http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123318906638926749.html


OPINIONJANUARY 29, 2009
My Bipartisan Stimulus
Let's cut taxes, as I want, and spend more, as Obama would like.


By RUSH LIMBAUGH

There's a serious debate in this country as to how best to end the recession. The average recession will last five to 11 months; the average recovery will last six years. Recessions will end on their own if they're left alone. What can make the recession worse is the wrong kind of government intervention.

I believe the wrong kind is precisely what President Barack Obama has proposed. I don't believe his is a "stimulus plan" at all -- I don't think it stimulates anything but the Democratic Party. This "porkulus" bill is designed to repair the Democratic Party's power losses from the 1990s forward, and to cement the party's majority power for decades.

Keynesian economists believe government spending on "shovel-ready" infrastructure projects -- schools, roads, bridges -- is the best way to stimulate our staggering economy. Supply-side economists make an equally persuasive case that tax cuts are the surest and quickest way to create permanent jobs and cause an economy to rebound. That happened under JFK, Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush. We know that when tax rates are cut in a recession, it brings an economy back.

Recent polling indicates that the American people are in favor of both approaches.

Notwithstanding the media blitz in support of the Obama stimulus plan, most Americans, according to a new Rasmussen poll, are skeptical. Rasmussen finds that 59% fear that Congress and the president will increase government spending too much. Only 17% worry they will cut taxes too much. Since the American people are not certain that the Obama stimulus plan is the way to go, it seems to me there's an opportunity for genuine compromise. At the same time, we can garner evidence on how to deal with future recessions, so every occurrence will no longer become a matter of partisan debate.

Congress is currently haggling over how to spend $900 billion generated by American taxpayers in the private sector. (It's important to remember that it's the people's money, not Washington's.) In a Jan. 23 meeting between President Obama and Republican leaders, Rep. Eric Cantor (R., Va.) proposed a moderate tax cut plan. President Obama responded, "I won. I'm going to trump you on that."

Yes, elections have consequences. But where's the bipartisanship, Mr. Obama? This does not have to be a divisive issue. My proposal is a genuine compromise.

Fifty-three percent of American voters voted for Barack Obama; 46% voted for John McCain, and 1% voted for wackos. Give that 1% to President Obama. Let's say the vote was 54% to 46%. As a way to bring the country together and at the same time determine the most effective way to deal with recessions, under the Obama-Limbaugh Stimulus Plan of 2009: 54% of the $900 billion -- $486 billion -- will be spent on infrastructure and pork as defined by Mr. Obama and the Democrats; 46% -- $414 billion -- will be directed toward tax cuts, as determined by me.

Then we compare. We see which stimulus actually works. This is bipartisanship! It would satisfy the American people's wishes, as polls currently note; and it would also serve as a measurable test as to which approach best stimulates job growth.

I say, cut the U.S. corporate tax rate -- at 35%, among the highest of all industrialized nations -- in half. Suspend the capital gains tax for a year to incentivize new investment, after which it would be reimposed at 10%. Then get out of the way! Once Wall Street starts ticking up 500 points a day, the rest of the private sector will follow. There's no reason to tell the American people their future is bleak. There's no reason, as the administration is doing, to depress their hopes. There's no reason to insist that recovery can't happen quickly, because it can.

bullypulpit
01-30-2009, 05:27 AM
Moody's Investment Services did an analysis of return on investment provided by various fiscal stimulus policies:

<center><a href="http://s456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/?action=view&current=bangforthebuck.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/bangforthebuck.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a></center> Source: <a href=http://www.economy.com/mark-zandi/default.asp?src=economy_homepage>Moody's</a>

Now, as you can plainly see, the permanent tax cuts espoused by the previous administration and the current crop of Freidmanites that are the congressional Republicans, are actually money losing propositions. And Moody's is all about money.

The argument that cutting taxes is a better alternative than increasing government spending because taxpayers are a better judge of how to spend their money than bureaucrats is a canard. Following that logic, we should shut down the air traffic control system. Hell, the system is paid for by fees on airline tickets, so it's much better to let the flying public keep its money that to hand it over to a bunch of swivel-chair jockeys...Right? There'll be alot of mid-air collisions, but hey, shit happens. Ya buys the ticket, ya takes the ride.

The new found fiscal conservatism of the House Republicans is nothing more than political puffery. Obama gave them what they wanted, and they still voted, one and all, against the stimulus package. The hand was extended, and instead of accepting it, they slapped it away. If that's how they want to play, well fine...let 'em die on that hill. The votes are there to pass anything the Obama administration wants to do...without the Republicans.

red states rule
01-30-2009, 07:24 AM
Moody's Investment Services did an analysis of return on investment provided by various fiscal stimulus policies:

<center><a href="http://s456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/?action=view&current=bangforthebuck.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/bangforthebuck.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a></center> Source: <a href=http://www.economy.com/mark-zandi/default.asp?src=economy_homepage>Moody's</a>

Now, as you can plainly see, the permanent tax cuts espoused by the previous administration and the current crop of Freidmanites that are the congressional Republicans, are actually money losing propositions. And Moody's is all about money.

The argument that cutting taxes is a better alternative than increasing government spending because taxpayers are a better judge of how to spend their money than bureaucrats is a canard. Following that logic, we should shut down the air traffic control system. Hell, the system is paid for by fees on airline tickets, so it's much better to let the flying public keep its money that to hand it over to a bunch of swivel-chair jockeys...Right? There'll be alot of mid-air collisions, but hey, shit happens. Ya buys the ticket, ya takes the ride.

The new found fiscal conservatism of the House Republicans is nothing more than political puffery. Obama gave them what they wanted, and they still voted, one and all, against the stimulus package. The hand was extended, and instead of accepting it, they slapped it away. If that's how they want to play, well fine...let 'em die on that hill. The votes are there to pass anything the Obama administration wants to do...without the Republicans.

So libs idea is to spend $900 billion worth of pork and like magic - the economy will be perfect

$140 million for honey bee insurance - a real job creator

$50 million for the Smithsonian Institution - that will put alot of people back to work

Check for illegals - well Dems have to coddle their base

$5 billion for ACORN - Obama is thinking about 2012 already

bullypulpit
01-30-2009, 07:25 AM
:coffee:

red states rule
01-30-2009, 07:34 AM
:coffee:

What wrong BP? Having a problem spinning the mega pork bill Dems want pushed thru

This break another Obama promise. Go 2 minutes into the speech and listen

<div><iframe height="339" width="425" src="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22425001/vp/28525332#28525332" frameborder="0" scrolling="no"></iframe><style type="text/css">.msnbcLinks {font-size:11px; font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: #999; margin-top: 5px; background: transparent; text-align: center; width: 425px;} .msnbcLinks a {text-decoration:none !important; border-bottom: 1px dotted #999 !important; font-weight:normal !important; height: 13px;} .msnbcLinks a:link, .msnbcLinks a:visited {color: #5799db !important;} .msnbcLinks a:hover, .msnbcLinks a:active {color:#CC0000 !important;} </style><p class="msnbcLinks">Visit msnbc.com for <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com">Breaking News</a>, <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032507">World News</a>, and <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032072">News about the Economy</a></p></div>

bullypulpit
01-30-2009, 08:03 AM
What wrong BP? Having a problem spinning the mega pork bill Dems want pushed thru

This break another Obama promise. Go 2 minutes into the speech and listen

<div><iframe height="339" width="425" src="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22425001/vp/28525332#28525332" frameborder="0" scrolling="no"></iframe><style type="text/css">.msnbcLinks {font-size:11px; font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: #999; margin-top: 5px; background: transparent; text-align: center; width: 425px;} .msnbcLinks a {text-decoration:none !important; border-bottom: 1px dotted #999 !important; font-weight:normal !important; height: 13px;} .msnbcLinks a:link, .msnbcLinks a:visited {color: #5799db !important;} .msnbcLinks a:hover, .msnbcLinks a:active {color:#CC0000 !important;} </style><p class="msnbcLinks">Visit msnbc.com for <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com">Breaking News</a>, <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032507">World News</a>, and <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032072">News about the Economy</a></p></div>

Care to refute the facts as I presented them? Of course you don't.

red states rule
01-30-2009, 08:35 AM
Care to refute the facts as I presented them? Of course you don't.

What facts?

History has shown tax cuts increase revenues. The Bush tax cuts increased revenues to the government to record levels

It is the insane pork spending (like the mega pork bill) that has caused deficits

Money taken by government out of the private sector is more money that could be spent to expand business, hire workers, and take risk

I do like how liberal like you BP do not even try to explain how this pork will "create" jobs

Pres Obam has promised 4 million new jobs. Well take mean the US taxpayer will pay about $290,000 per job

PostmodernProphet
01-30-2009, 10:16 AM
dang....I had a long post and lost it somehow in a reset......basic summary BP is that I read your Moody link and it doesn't show anywhere the formula they used to calculate that government spending is better than private spending (tax breaks).....and your author used the same formula to "show" that the TARP bail out would be creating new jobs by now.......

red states rule
01-30-2009, 10:20 AM
dang....I had a long post and lost it somehow in a reset......basic summary BP is that I read your Moody link and it doesn't show anywhere the formula they used to calculate that government spending is better than private spending (tax breaks).....and your author used the same formula to "show" that the TARP bail out would be creating new jobs by now.......

He must have used the Bernie Madoff formula

PostmodernProphet
01-30-2009, 10:27 AM
look at it this way.....is it better to create a job building a bridge (which job will go away as soon as the bridge is built)....or to create a job making product X which job will be there as long as someone wants to buy product X.........

thus, should we invest in jobs building bridges or in jobs making product Xs........

Sitarro
01-30-2009, 12:31 PM
Moody's Investment Services did an analysis of return on investment provided by various fiscal stimulus policies:

<center><a href="http://s456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/?action=view&current=bangforthebuck.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/bangforthebuck.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a></center> Source: <a href=http://www.economy.com/mark-zandi/default.asp?src=economy_homepage>Moody's</a>

Now, as you can plainly see, the permanent tax cuts espoused by the previous administration and the current crop of Freidmanites that are the congressional Republicans, are actually money losing propositions. And Moody's is all about money.

The argument that cutting taxes is a better alternative than increasing government spending because taxpayers are a better judge of how to spend their money than bureaucrats is a canard. Following that logic, we should shut down the air traffic control system. Hell, the system is paid for by fees on airline tickets, so it's much better to let the flying public keep its money that to hand it over to a bunch of swivel-chair jockeys...Right? There'll be alot of mid-air collisions, but hey, shit happens. Ya buys the ticket, ya takes the ride.

The new found fiscal conservatism of the House Republicans is nothing more than political puffery. Obama gave them what they wanted, and they still voted, one and all, against the stimulus package. The hand was extended, and instead of accepting it, they slapped it away. If that's how they want to play, well fine...let 'em die on that hill. The votes are there to pass anything the Obama administration wants to do...without the Republicans.

Gee Bullshit, why don't you credit this asinine quote (in bold type) to who just wrote it in his pathetic column.......... Paulie Klugman?

5stringJeff
01-30-2009, 12:35 PM
Moody's Investment Services did an analysis of return on investment provided by various fiscal stimulus policies:

<center><a href="http://s456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/?action=view&current=bangforthebuck.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/qq286/dzadzey/bangforthebuck.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a></center> Source: <a href=http://www.economy.com/mark-zandi/default.asp?src=economy_homepage>Moody's</a>

Now, as you can plainly see, the permanent tax cuts espoused by the previous administration and the current crop of Freidmanites that are the congressional Republicans, are actually money losing propositions. And Moody's is all about money.

The argument that cutting taxes is a better alternative than increasing government spending because taxpayers are a better judge of how to spend their money than bureaucrats is a canard. Following that logic, we should shut down the air traffic control system. Hell, the system is paid for by fees on airline tickets, so it's much better to let the flying public keep its money that to hand it over to a bunch of swivel-chair jockeys...Right? There'll be alot of mid-air collisions, but hey, shit happens. Ya buys the ticket, ya takes the ride.

The new found fiscal conservatism of the House Republicans is nothing more than political puffery. Obama gave them what they wanted, and they still voted, one and all, against the stimulus package. The hand was extended, and instead of accepting it, they slapped it away. If that's how they want to play, well fine...let 'em die on that hill. The votes are there to pass anything the Obama administration wants to do...without the Republicans.

This whole table is based on the flawed premise of the Keynesian multiplier, which essentially presupposes that government spending is "free."

red states rule
01-30-2009, 12:37 PM
Tax cuts do not lower revenue

Here is an article that covered the myth that the Bush tax cuts decreased revenues

snip

Fact: Tax revenues are above the historical average, even after the tax cuts.

Tax revenues in 2006 were 18.4 percent of gross domestic product (GDP), which is actually above the 20-year, 40-year, and 60-year historical aver*ages.[1] The inflation-adjusted 20 percent tax revenue increase between 2004 and 2006 represents the largest two-year revenue surge since 1965–1967.[2] Claims that Americans are undertaxed by historical standards are patently false.

Some critics of President George W. Bush's tax policies concede that tax revenues exceed the his*torical average yet assert that revenues are histori*cally low for economies in the fourth year of an expansion. Setting aside that some of these tax pol*icies are partly responsible for that economic expan*sion, the numbers simply do not support this claim. Comparing tax revenues in the fourth fiscal year after the end of each of the past three recessions shows nearly equal tax revenues of:

18.4 percent of GDP in 1987,
18.5 percent of GDP in 1995, and
18.4 percent of GDP in 2006.[3]

http://www.heritage.org/research/taxes/bg2001.cfm

The ClayTaurus
01-30-2009, 02:08 PM
The problem with Rush's do both and compare is there is no way you can separate those two variables and study them independent of each other. It's a flawed premise that could never be successfully carried out. It also rules out the possibility that doing both could be worse than either plan individually.