Suspension of Nurse Who Offered to Pray for Patient's Recovery Sparks Uproar

[-Cp]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article5675452.ece

The nurse who was suspended without pay for offering to pray for a patient's recovery has been reinstated and will return to work in the next few days.

Caroline Petrie, an evangelical Christian from Weston-super-Mare, was subjected to disciplinary action by North Somerset Primary Care Trust even though the patient was not offended and made no complaint.

Mrs Petrie, who was supported by the Christian Legal Centre, was summoned last week to a disciplinary hearing on the charge that she had failed to demonstrate a "personal and professional commitment to equality and diversity".

North Somerset Primary Care Trust said yesterday that it recognised Mrs Petrie, a mother of two, had been acting in the "best interests of her patients" and that nurses did not have to "set aside their faith" in the workplace and could "continue to offer high-quality care for patients while remaining committed to their beliefs".

It also conceded that for some people prayer was an "integral part of health care and the healing process".

Sir Patrick Cormack, the Tory MP for South Staffordshire and a committed Anglican, told Parliament that the case illustrated the “utter absurdities” of political correctness.

Andrea Williams, director of the Christian Legal Centre, said: "This is a great victory for Mrs Petrie, and for common sense. Today’s decision highlights the importance of being able to take personal faith into the workplace rather than being forced to leave it at the door for fear of being silenced by equality and diversity policies."

The turnaround by the trust comes amid a tightening up by Government on how far public sector workers can go in communicating their faith.

According to a document published by the Department of Health last month, any attempt by a doctor or nurse to proselytise during the course of their work is to be considered harassment or intimidation and will be subject to disciplinary procedures.

Religion or Belief: A Practical Guide for the NHS states that preaching or attempting to convert people in a workplace environment "can cause many problems, as non-religious people and those from other religions or beliefs could feel harassed and intimidated by this behaviour".

Hazel Blears, the Communities Secretary, said yesterday that the Government was working on changing the rules on the funding of faith-based charity work.

Speaking at the Evangelical Alliance Life Beyond Debt conference in central London, she said faith based charities have a "vital role to play" in the economic downturn. The Government is working on a "charter of excellence" that faith charities will be asked to sign.

"For every action that Government takes, there are local charities taking thousands of their own," she said. "When times are hard they come into their own. Some of those outstanding people working in those organisations are motivated by their faith. Some of the organisations themselves have a religious ethos."

Referring to Salford Central Church in her own constituency in particular, which recently became part of the Oasis Group, she said: "I’ve often found that churches, synagogues and mosques are the places where communities first get organised, the most forceful advocates for their neighbourhoods, and the most steadfast in rocky times when other organisations might falter.

"In my own constituency I think in particular of Salford Central Church. Recently it became part of the Oasis group. It is redoubling its work with the community - with everything from a drop-in centre to a cafe to sports teams for the young. Giving local people a place to go, sound advice about money and health, positive things to do with their spare time."

She also mentioned the Salvation Army, Churches Against Poverty and Church Action on Poverty.

She admitted that religious groups have not always received their fair share of public money because some local authorities through ignorance or mistrust have "fought shy" of working with them. She said that the new charter, which should be ready by the end of the year, would help address this. "The charter would mean faith groups who are paid public money to provide services promising to provide those services to everyone, regardless of their background. And promising not to use public money to proselytise.

"It’s not about trying to stop the people manning the soup kitchens or making the home visits talking about their faith if people ask, or being open about what motivates them. It is about making sure that services funded by public money are unconditional - clearly and unequivocally so - with no strings attached."

[PostmodernProphet]

this is nothing unusual....if you know a Christian nurse who works for a public hospital she can tell you that they are prohibited from praying for patients......

[Psychoblues]

That is a lie, pimp, and you know it. Any public employee whether a nurse or otherwise is certainly permitted to pray for whatever reason they want.



this is nothing unusual....if you know a Christian nurse who works for a public hospital she can tell you that they are prohibited from praying for patients......

Paul and others but especially Paul said that prayer should be private and I agree with that observation and consideration. There is more to this story than is being reported here.

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

That is a lie, pimp, and you know it. Any public employee whether a nurse or otherwise is certainly permitted to pray for whatever reason they want.


don't ever call me a liar you ignorant twit.......

and don't pretend I was talking about something they do in the privacy of their own homes, I'm talking about what they do openly at work......

[Psychoblues]

But, you lied, pimp, and you're a homophobe to boot!!!!!!!!!!!!!



don't ever call me a liar you fucking twit.......

and don't pretend I was talking about something they do in the privacy of their own homes, I'm talking about what they do openly at work......

What else do you intend to expose about yourself in these threads, pimp?!?!?!???!???!?!?!?

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

But, you lied, pimp, and you're a homophobe to boot!!!!!!!!!!!!!


ah, but everyone who has read the posts knows that I haven't lied and that you ARE an ignorant twit....guess that tells us all that nothing has been exposed....it was all known before hand.....

[Psychoblues]

Au contraire, pimp.


ah, but everyone who has read the posts knows that I haven't lied and that you ARE an ignorant twit....guess that tells us all that nothing has been exposed....it was all known before hand.....

You said that public nurses were forbidden from prayer or the equivalent of that. You lied. You're also afraid of the queers and you have made that quite evident on multiple occasions.

What does that make you?!?!???!!?!?!??! A liar and a homophobe in my honest estimation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What else you got, cowgirl?!?!??!?!?!?!??!?!?!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

What does that make you?

smarter than a two bit worthless drunk, who only posts to this board when he's too shit faced to be embarrassed about what he types.....

you remind me of training puppies.....you come home and find he made a mess on the carpet, but you realize that he's too ignorant to connect the punishment with the mess he made hours ago....the only thing you can do is rub his face in it......

[PostmodernProphet]

You lied. You're also afraid of the queers

I'm not afraid of you, I simply find you disgusting.....I suspect though, that I would find you disgusting even if you were straight.....

[Psychoblues]

'Zat all you got, cowgirl?!?!??!?!?!????!?!???



smarter than a two bit worthless drunk, who only posts to this board when he's too shit faced to be embarrassed about what he types.....

you remind me of training puppies.....you come home and find he made a mess on the carpet, but you realize that he's too ignorant to connect the punishment with the mess he made hours ago....the only thing you can do is rub his face in it......

How long did you think about it?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!? A half hour or so?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!? Get real, my friend. You don't have to be afraid of anything real.

Are you on meds or are you seeing a doctor about your condition?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

I'd offer you a drink but, hell, I'm now afraid to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[Psychoblues]

I'll repeat your byline as if it were real in any sense.




I'm not afraid of you, I simply find you disgusting.....I suspect though, that I would find you disgusting even if you were straight.....


Never interrupt an existentialist when he's thinking.

:lol::laugh2::lol:

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I'd offer you a drink but, hell, I'm now afraid to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


get over yourself....offering to share your intoxication is insufficient cover for your inadequacies.....

[Psychoblues]

In other words you're already pissing on yourself and you can't handle anymore?!?!?!??!???!?!?!?!?!



get over yourself....offering to share your intoxication is insufficient cover for your inadequacies.....

Thanks for the expose', pimp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What's that you have to say about the nurse and prayer?!?!?!??!??!?!?!??!?!??!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[Abbey Marie]

That is a lie, pimp, and you know it. Any public employee whether a nurse or otherwise is certainly permitted to pray for whatever reason they want.




Paul and others but especially Paul said that prayer should be private and I agree with that observation and consideration. There is more to this story than is being reported here.

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

Psycho, if you are going to come in a thread and throw it off the rails by calling someone a liar, you should at least prove it.

Let's see a link that proves that pmp is a liar.

[Kathianne]

Psycho, if you are going to come in a thread and throw it off the rails by calling someone a liar, you should at least prove it.

Let's see a link that proves that pmp is a liar.

I'd have to agree here. Liar has been thrown around way too much imo. Borrowing from a wise person I know, it's being used in the wrong context. Probably because that whacked poster used to flip out about it so often.

[Abbey Marie]

I'd have to agree here. Liar has been thrown around way too much imo. Borrowing from a wise person I know, it's being used in the wrong context. Probably because that whacked poster used to flip out about it so often.

Indeed.

[PostmodernProphet]

federal VA hospital guidelines....


11. Can we have prayer groups on the wards for patients whom would like to participate?

Prayer groups conducted for patients are the responsibility of the medical center chaplains. They may also be coordinated by faith group representatives under the supervision of the chaplain staff when a chaplain of that faith is not generally available. Staff should not be leading prayer or Bible study groups for the patients under their care. Occasionally, patients have chosen to get together informally for prayer and bible study. Chaplain section has provided study guides and Bibles (or other religious materials as in the case of Muslim or Jewish patients). There is no objection to the practice of patient-led prayer groups so long as participation is voluntary the patient(s) involved are not soliciting members for their faith group or church. An employee runs the risk of being accused of soliciting for their particular faith group or church should they engage in running these sorts of groups. Soliciting of any sort, religious or otherwise, is prohibited by Federal regulation.

http://www.westpalmbeach.va.gov/services/Chaplain_Frequently_Asked_Questions.asp#etiq10

and yet....


Patients admitted to hospital with heart problems suffer fewer complications if someone prays for them, according to scientists in the US.

The study, carried out at Duke University Medical Center in North Carolina, found that patients who received alternative therapy following angioplasty were 25% to 30% less likely to suffer complications.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/1627662.stm

and


Does prayer benefit cancer patients? A new study says it does.

Breast cancer patients who pray in online support groups can get mental health benefits, according to the study.

"We know that many cancer patients pray in online support groups to help them cope with their illness. This is the first study we are aware of that examines the psychological effects of this behavior," said Bret Shaw, an associate scientist in UW-Madison's College of Engineering and lead author of the study.

http://www.kmbc.com/health/10670704/detail.html

[My Winter Storm]

If the nurse works in a public hospital, they should not be allowed to pray for patients - by that I mean, they should not be allowed to suggest they pray for someone, however, I have no problem with them praying for a patient outside of hospital grounds, or if the patient makes the request.

[darin]

Why, storm? Why should praying nurses be prohibited from praying for folk, or offering to pray for them? Does the offer cause harm?

[Mr. P]

If the nurse works in a public hospital, they should not be allowed to pray for patients - by that I mean, they should not be allowed to suggest they pray for someone, however, I have no problem with them praying for a patient outside of hospital grounds, or if the patient makes the request.

Do you have a problem with them asking if they can make you (as a patient) comfortable?

[Missileman]

Psycho, if you are going to come in a thread and throw it off the rails by calling someone a liar, you should at least prove it.

Let's see a link that proves that pmp is a liar.

This statement:


this is nothing unusual....if you know a Christian nurse who works for a public hospital she can tell you that they are prohibited from praying for patients......

is without any doubt a lie. It's another prime example of the thumper's mentality. If they can't perform a gaudy, loud, bible-thumping "come to Jesus" revival and rub everyone's noses in it, THEY'RE being persecuted. It's a load of manure.

[PostmodernProphet]

is without any doubt a lie. It's another prime example of the thumper's mentality. If they can't perform a gaudy, loud, bible-thumping "come to Jesus" revival and rub everyone's noses in it, THEY'RE being persecuted. It's a load of manure.

listen up, you worthless slice of shit.....I have already provided a link to the federal rules for VA hospitals which expressly prohibits nurses from praying with patients.....in addition, my church runs a free health clinic two blocks from my house manned by volunteer nurses and doctors who WANTED a place where they are free to pray with their patients.....don't call me a liar when I tell you something you obviously don't have an iota of information about.....

[Missileman]

listen up, you worthless slice of shit.....I have already provided a link to the federal rules for VA hospitals which expressly prohibits nurses from praying with patients.....in addition, my church runs a free health clinic two blocks from my house manned by volunteer nurses and doctors who WANTED a place where they are free to pray with their patients.....don't call me a liar when I tell you something you obviously don't have an iota of information about.....

And you listen you ignorant asshole...you posted that they are prohibited from praying FOR their patients. You didn't put any qualifiers on it, and since the nurses are perfectly able to offer a prayer for their patients on their own time whether at home, on break, at church, etc, your statement isn't true...AKA a lie.

[PostmodernProphet]

And you listen you ignorant asshole...you posted that they are prohibited from praying FOR their patients. You didn't put any qualifiers on it, and since the nurses are perfectly able to offer a prayer for their patients on their own time whether at home, on break, at church, etc, your statement isn't true...AKA a lie.

fucking semantics player......we were talking about a nurse suspended for offering to pray WITH a patient....if your too fucking dense to keep track of a topic for a single page don't call me a liar for your inadequacies.....I swear the atheists I have met have one thing in common, when they gave up their faith in God they also seem to have lost the use of the brains God gave them......

what I stated was true, the lie is in your twisted accusation.....now shut the fuck up before I lose my temper and tell you what I REALLY think of you.....

[Missileman]

fucking semantics player......we were talking about a nurse suspended for offering to pray WITH a patient....if your too fucking dense to keep track of a topic for a single page don't call me a liar for your inadequacies.....I swear the atheists I have met have one thing in common, when they gave up their faith in God they also seem to have lost the use of the brains God gave them......

what I stated was true, the lie is in your twisted accusation.....now shut the fuck up before I lose my temper and tell you what I REALLY think of you.....

It's called English dipshit! If you're going to attempt to use it, you'd be well served to learn it first. You can raise all the objections you'd like, your statement was clearly untrue.

[PostmodernProphet]

it is only "untrue" for those intent on ignoring the issue and pretending we were discussing something else.....obviously you were so excited about calling me a liar you were willing to ignore that fact.....so fuck yourself for trying to make me look like something I'm not to gain points....

[Abbey Marie]

And you listen you ignorant asshole...you posted that they are prohibited from praying FOR their patients. You didn't put any qualifiers on it, and since the nurses are perfectly able to offer a prayer for their patients on their own time whether at home, on break, at church, etc, your statement isn't true...AKA a lie.

I think this is a stretch. It was clear what PMP was talking about, because
the thread and article are about praying with a patient, not for a patient privately or off-site. If that were the case, there would be no issue whatsoever.

So, we are back to the point that if pmp is to be called a liar, let's see some proof. That (post #2?) is the exact point where the thread was derailed, and the discussion turned ugly and useless, imo.

[Kathianne]

I think this is a stretch. It was clear what PMP was talking about, because
the thread and article are about praying with a patient, not for a patient privately or off-site. If that were the case, there would be no issue whatsoever.

So, we are back to the point that if pmp is to be called a liar, let's see some proof. That (post #2?) is the exact point where the thread was derailed, and the discussion turned ugly and useless, imo.

Agreed on both the purposeful twisting and turning ugly.

OT: It would be great if we could respond more respectfully even when differing in positions. Assume the person has a point to posting what they do and respond with your own take-whether you agree or not. That doesn't mean the other person, 'Doesn't know all XXXX are like XXXX.' Or call someone a liar off the bat. Or an idiot. Seriously folks, it would be nice if this would stop.

[Abbey Marie]

Agreed on both the purposeful twisting and turning ugly.

OT: It would be great if we could respond more respectfully even when differing in positions. Assume the person has a point to posting what they do and respond with your own take-whether you agree or not. That doesn't mean the other person, 'Doesn't know all XXXX are like XXXX.' Or call someone a liar off the bat. Or an idiot. Seriously folks, it would be nice if this would stop.

:beer:

[Missileman]

listen up, you worthless slice of shit.....I have already provided a link to the federal rules for VA hospitals which expressly prohibits nurses from praying with patients.....in addition, my church runs a free health clinic two blocks from my house manned by volunteer nurses and doctors who WANTED a place where they are free to pray with their patients.....don't call me a liar when I tell you something you obviously don't have an iota of information about.....

BTW, the rules you posted DO NOT forbid a nurse from praying for or with a patient. They are forbidden to engage in solicitation.

[PostmodernProphet]

BTW, the rules you posted DO NOT forbid a nurse from praying for or with a patient. They are forbidden to engage in solicitation.

you are still a fucking idiot...

[Missileman]

you are still a fucking idiot...

And you're still a fucking liar with a second grade reading ability!

[PostmodernProphet]

And you're still a fucking liar with a second grade reading ability!

trot out your proof, brainless one.....

[Missileman]

trot out your proof, brainless one.....

Post the part of the VA reg that "expressly forbids" nurses to pray as you allege.

[PostmodernProphet]

post number 17, dumbfuck.......

[Missileman]

post number 17, dumbfuck.......

There isn't anything in post 17 that forbids a nurse from praying for or with a patient...hell, there isn't even anything in what you quoted that forbids a nurse from leading a prayer group...though leading a group is discouraged. I'm gonna have to set you back a grade...you couldn't even hang with the second graders in reading comprehension.

So, let's try again. Post the part of post #17 that "expressly forbids" a nurse from praying as you alleged.

[PostmodernProphet]

An employee runs the risk of being accused of soliciting for their particular faith group or church should they engage in running these sorts of groups. Soliciting of any sort, religious or otherwise, is prohibited by Federal regulation.

once a dumbfuck, always a dumbfuck.....

[Missileman]

once a dumbfuck, always a dumbfuck.....

Read the context dipshit! You even quoted it and STILL can't fucking understand it. Solicitation is prohibited, not prayer. RUNNING a prayer group might be misconstrued as soliciting for their particular faith group or church which is why RUNNING a prayer group is discouraged for the staff.

You are now demoted to kindergarten...care to try for nursery school?

[Kathianne]

Read the context dipshit! You even quoted it and STILL can't fucking understand it. Solicitation is prohibited, not prayer. RUNNING a prayer group might be misconstrued as soliciting for their particular faith group or church which is why RUNNING a prayer group is discouraged for the staff.

You are now demoted to kindergarten...care to try for nursery school?

I think this is a first for me, moving a thread dominated at least towards end by Missleman and Post Modern, to the cage.

[PostmodernProphet]

You are now demoted to kindergarten...care to try for nursery school?

sure, DumbFuck.....just keep pretending your dealing with the topic of the thread with this bullshit.....your lack of honesty will earn you a response that will further demote me in your view.....which bothers me not the least......

[Missileman]

I think this is a first for me, moving a thread dominated at least towards end by Missleman and Post Modern, to the cage.

Moving it won't change the fact that PMP has the reading comprehension of a turnip!

But hey! You're a teacher. You read:


Prayer groups conducted for patients are the responsibility of the medical center chaplains. They may also be coordinated by faith group representatives under the supervision of the chaplain staff when a chaplain of that faith is not generally available. Staff should not be leading prayer or Bible study groups for the patients under their care. Occasionally, patients have chosen to get together informally for prayer and bible study. Chaplain section has provided study guides and Bibles (or other religious materials as in the case of Muslim or Jewish patients). There is no objection to the practice of patient-led prayer groups so long as participation is voluntary the patient(s) involved are not soliciting members for their faith group or church. An employee runs the risk of being accused of soliciting for their particular faith group or church should they engage in running these sorts of groups. Soliciting of any sort, religious or otherwise, is prohibited by Federal regulation.

and tell us if you see anything in it that expressly forbids a nurse from praying for or with a patient.

[Kathianne]

Moving it won't change the fact that PMP has the reading comprehension of a turnip!

But hey! You're a teacher. You read:



and tell us if you see anything in it that expressly forbids a nurse from praying for or with a patient.

to missleman:

You asked me to comment. My comment is both of you are not listening to each other or want to. You both have valid points, but are whistling past each other.

[dan]

What a Christ-like thread!:laugh2:

I think their thinking might be this: the job of a nurse is a very, very busy one. If they're given permission to pray with their patients, especially if the nurse is a very devout Christian/Jew/Muslim/whatever, they might find themselves focusing on that or more likely to go to that rather than actually administering the medical care these people might need.

Not saying that's what they EXPECT to happen, but organizations write these rules to cover their own asses in extreme circumstances. Let's say a nurse is given the go-ahead to pray for a Christian patient. Meanwhile, the particularly ornery Jewish patient in the next room is waiting for his/her medicine, finds out that his/her nurse was in the next room praying over a Christian patient and decides to file a lawsuit. Now the hospital has a discrimination suit on its hands. The rules are there to avoid situations like this. Just off the top of my head, I could think of at least 4 other situations where the hospital could be held liable as a result.

[Abbey Marie]

What a Christ-like thread!:laugh2:

I think their thinking might be this: the job of a nurse is a very, very busy one. If they're given permission to pray with their patients, especially if the nurse is a very devout Christian/Jew/Muslim/whatever, they might find themselves focusing on that or more likely to go to that rather than actually administering the medical care these people might need.

Not saying that's what they EXPECT to happen, but organizations write these rules to cover their own asses in extreme circumstances. Let's say a nurse is given the go-ahead to pray for a Christian patient. Meanwhile, the particularly ornery Jewish patient in the next room is waiting for his/her medicine, finds out that his/her nurse was in the next room praying over a Christian patient and decides to file a lawsuit. Now the hospital has a discrimination suit on its hands. The rules are there to avoid situations like this. Just off the top of my head, I could think of at least 4 other situations where the hospital could be held liable as a result.

You could apply this logic to a nurse taking a couple of minutes to just talk to a patient to cheer him up. Same amount of time taken away from the actual work.
Yet, not only is that allowed; it is probably encouraged. It's more likely to make a patient feel better cared-for. Like prayer. I think we need to look elsewhere for the reason prayer might be prohibited.

[Missileman]

You could apply this logic to a nurse taking a couple of minutes to just talk to a patient to cheer him up. Same amount of time taken away from the actual work.
Yet, not only is that allowed; it is probably encouraged. It's more likely to make a patient feel better cared-for. Like prayer. I think we need to look elsewhere for the reason prayer might be prohibited.

*sigh* Prayer isn't prohibited!

[dan]

You could apply this logic to a nurse taking a couple of minutes to just talk to a patient to cheer him up. Same amount of time taken away from the actual work.


Admittedly, but if a nurse is reprimanded for regularly taking time away from her work to try to cheer up patients, it's not really newsworthy. I'd be willing to bet that happens more often than we'd like to think. On the other hand, if the nurse is praying with the patients, it becomes a freedom of religion issue, much thornier for all involved.

[Kathianne]

*sigh* Prayer isn't prohibited!

Dang! Who would have thought? I will say something related to MM's pov, no one working with seriously ill, should initiate the idea of prayer, though obviously they are free to pray for anyone. However, if the patient requests prayers, and the nurse/tech/doc feels comfortable, it does good.

[Missileman]

Dang! Who would have thought? I will say something related to MM's pov,

Explain what you think my POV is. I don't believe I've said anything on the subject of prayers in hospitals other than they aren't prohibited.

[Kathianne]

Explain what you think my POV is. I don't believe I've said anything on the subject of prayers in hospitals other than they aren't prohibited.

I thought I did, the part you didn't include:


...no one working with seriously ill, should initiate the idea of prayer, though obviously they are free to pray for anyone. However, if the patient requests prayers, and the nurse/tech/doc feels comfortable, it does good.
if I was wrong, I apologize. I was trying to be fair.

[Psychoblues]

I maintain that pimp continues to be a liar, a homophobe and a poor excuse to attempt preaching or praying for anyone or anything.

But, she's not the only liar on this board!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[My Winter Storm]

Why, storm? Why should praying nurses be prohibited from praying for folk, or offering to pray for them? Does the offer cause harm?

They shouldn't be prevented from praying for patients, but they should not ask the patient. It's very easy to offend someone. If the patient askes for prayers, then that's fine, and the nurse is welcome to say a prayer to herself as she does her rounds, or at home. I just don't think she needed to let her patient know her intentions.

[My Winter Storm]

Do you have a problem with them asking if they can make you (as a patient) comfortable?

Of course not, it is their job to make one comfortable, it is not their job to pray for patients, or offer prayer, which is why this woman should have kept her intentions to herself.

[Psychoblues]

Thanks for reading the article, MWS. So many others here never considered that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Of course not, it is their job to make one comfortable, it is not their job to pray for patients, or offer prayer, which is why this woman should have kept her intentions to herself.

Could I offer you a julep?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I maintain that pimp continues to be a liar, a homophobe and a poor excuse to attempt preaching or praying for anyone or anything.

But, she's not the only liar on this board!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

?????.......why do you call me "she", you fucking idiot?.......apparently you are unobservant four ways at once....

[Psychoblues]

Simple, darlin', because you are a liar and a homophobe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



?????.......why do you call me "she", you fucking idiot?.......apparently you are unobservant four ways at once....

Do you ever read back through your own posts?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?

I'd offer you a drink but I also think you're incapable of handling it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

a poor excuse to attempt preaching or praying for anyone or anything.

I'm gonna pray that you never be in a position to influence young children or ever hold a job where people might be killed when you screw up.........

[Psychoblues]

I've certainly been there and done all that, sweetie.



I'm gonna pray that you never be in a position to influence young children or ever hold a job where people might be killed when you screw up.........

Care to address the nurse and prayer issues, I mean in an honest way?!?!?!?!?!?!??!??!?!?!?

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

Care to address the nurse and prayer issues, I mean in an honest way?

?????....well here is the way boards work.....people make comments and people respond to them......so far, you haven't mentioned the topic, you've only mentioned me......I would debate even you if you dealt with the topic.....as it is, I have only responded to what was raised......

[Noir]

Gawd Psychobabe, do you not notice that everybody else is debating the issue at hand and that you are dragging it through the dirt? If you're gonna debate the issue then fair enough, but if not then leave your childish posts out of this thread and let the adults debate.

I don't think she should have been suspended, if there was a problem in what she was doing then she should have been asked to stop, and then if she continued she could be suspended or fired, but unless we are only seeing part of the story this seems a rather rash decision.

[Psychoblues]

I've dealt with the topic and stand ready to deal with it further, liar homophobe.



?????....well here is the way boards work.....people make comments and people respond to them......so far, you haven't mentioned the topic, you've only mentioned me......I would debate even you if you dealt with the topic.....as it is, I have only responded to what was raised......

Others have as well but you seem to be in the attack mode. Carry on, cowgirl. The topic is now in the cage so no holds barred, correct?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!

Attention, barkeeps!!!!!!!!!! No alcohol for the pimp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

I thought I did, the part you didn't include:


if I was wrong, I apologize. I was trying to be fair.

In the VA hospitals, there's a chaplain staff. It's their job to coordinate and recruit for the prayer groups. I imagine that non-Chaplain staff is welcome to attend the groups, time permitting. If a nurse recognizes a patient from a group they attended, it wouldn't be inappropriate for the nurse to bring up the topic. Outside that, I think the nurses should restrict themselves to "I've got you in my prayers" or the like and concentrate on the mundane needs of the patient.

[darin]

They shouldn't be prevented from praying for patients, but they should not ask the patient. It's very easy to offend someone. If the patient askes for prayers, then that's fine, and the nurse is welcome to say a prayer to herself as she does her rounds, or at home. I just don't think she needed to let her patient know her intentions.

Would a reasonable person be offended if another offered to pray for them? Do folks have a right to be saved from any single thing which might - in the least amount - offend them?

[Psychoblues]

Just read the article and the thread, dimples.



Would a reasonable person be offended if another offered to pray for them? Do folks have a right to be saved from any single thing which might - in the least amount - offend them?


You just might glean something from the wisdom contained within!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I've dealt with the topic and stand ready to deal with it further, liar homophobe.


Psychoblues

I'm curious, Psycho?.....why are you tolerated?.......

[Psychoblues]

I've thought much the same about you, pimp.



I'm curious, Psycho?.....why are you tolerated?.......

Could you get me a beer, bitch?!?!?!??!?!??!????!?!?

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

Could you get me a beer, bitch?!?!?!??!?!??!????!?!?



if I did I wouldn't open it....it would be too much fun watching you be stymied by the words "Twist Off" on the cap for an hour or two......

[Psychoblues]

I'm a lot more of a pull the tab kind of guy, silly goose, but I can still pop a cap with my teeth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



if I did I wouldn't open it....it would be too much fun watching you be stymied by the words "Twist Off" on the cap for an hour or two......

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I'm a lot more of a pull the tab kind of guy, silly goose, but I can still pop a cap with my teeth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



picture of Psych found on internet....

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/3050283/2/istockphoto_3050283-broken-teeth.jpg

[Psychoblues]

I thought you were one of those existentialist types, pimp?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?



picture of Psych found on internet....

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/3050283/2/istockphoto_3050283-broken-teeth.jpg

Are you lying or just kidding?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I thought you were one of those existentialist types, pimp?

????...if I were, why would I make fun of them?.......

[Psychoblues]

OK, pimp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




????...if I were, why would I make fun of them?.......

I'll consider your lies exactly as you mean them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Make fun of that, cowgirl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I'll consider your lies exactly as you mean them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Make fun of that, cowgirl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


????....it doesn't make enough sense to even mock.....

[Psychoblues]

Soooooooo, intellectual philosophies aside, you are not even the Prophet that you claim to be?!?!?!?!?!?!????!??!?!?!?!?!?



????....it doesn't make enough sense to even mock.....

Sad, pimp, really damned sad.

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I'm not a prophet in the sense that I can predict what you are going to say next, or impute intelligence into your otherwise unintelligible posts.....I am a prophet in the sense of warning people that if they are stupid enough to pay attention to what you say, they are doomed to a future of psychotic ramblings......

[Psychoblues]

And yet you use in your headline "confusion as a tool..........".


I'm not a prophet in the sense that I can predict what you are going to say next, or impute intelligence into your otherwise unintelligible posts.....I am a prophet in the sense of warning people that if they are stupid enough to pay attention to what you say, they are doomed to a future of psychotic ramblings......

Rather shallow and a faux claim by you, correct?!?!?????????!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

And yet you use in your headline "confusion as a tool..........".



/shrugs.....your confusion, my tool....I could open a hardware store.....

[Psychoblues]

Confusion is generally a lack of education, cowgirl, and I know how to remedy that anomaly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



/shrugs.....your confusion, my tool....I could open a hardware store.....

Go ahead and open up your lil' hardware store!!!!!!!!!!!! I'll give you 2 weeks in business and that's only if you have the capital to survive that long without a customer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dork!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

Go ahead and open up your lil' hardware store!!!!!!!!!!!! I'll give you 2 weeks in business and that's only if you have the capital to survive that long without a customer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


you do have a point......nobody in the world would want to acquire your confusion......

[Psychoblues]

Confusion is your tool, idiot.



you do have a point......nobody in the world would want to acquire your confusion......

I prefer a more chaotic intelligence.

:beer::cheers2::beer:

Psychoblues

[PostmodernProphet]

I prefer a more chaotic intelligence.

lords, do we have an award for understatement of the year?.......searching for intelligence in your posts CERTAINLY reveals chaos....

[actsnoblemartin]

this is wrong on so many levels

[My Winter Storm]

Would a reasonable person be offended if another offered to pray for them? Do folks have a right to be saved from any single thing which might - in the least amount - offend them?

Look. If someone went to a church, then it would be fine to ask that person if they needed some prayers, and you could even pray with them. Churches can offer prayer provided you are inside church walls. Working at a hospital, your job is to care for patients and make them comfortable. It is not your job to ask people if they want your prayers. It is not in your job description. If the patient requests that you pray with them then IMO that is fine, but you, as an employee, cannot ask the patient as it is not your job to do this.

[DragonStryk72]

Look. If someone went to a church, then it would be fine to ask that person if they needed some prayers, and you could even pray with them. Churches can offer prayer provided you are inside church walls. Working at a hospital, your job is to care for patients and make them comfortable. It is not your job to ask people if they want your prayers. It is not in your job description. If the patient requests that you pray with them then IMO that is fine, but you, as an employee, cannot ask the patient as it is not your job to do this.

Now, hold on here, what happened to 1st Amendment rights? Accordingly to that, she has every right to pray for whomever she wants, and ask them if they'd like her to pray for, as long as she does not harass them about it.

Let's also look at the point that the patient that she prayed for, as per the article, did not find it offensive in any way. The hospital decided to make it offensive, but then, I don't seem them stepping in and stopping any of the various other religions aside from Christianity from praying in the hospital. This, to me, is not within the hospital's rights, to determine which prayers are good and which are bad, since, as you put it, "It's not in their job description".