Five Conservative Values

[Joe Steel]

Is Glenn Beck drinking again? He says Conservatives have "values."

We Surround Them-The Unveiling (http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/21018/?ck=1)

I guess that's true to some extent. Everyone has "values." He got them wrong, though. Seriously wrong.

Five Conservative Values

Deceit
Greed
Hatred
Ignorance
Violence


Everything Conservatives do and everything they say can be understood best in terms of the Five Conservative Values.

[PostmodernProphet]

and Joe displays the prime liberal motivation......dishonesty.....

[avatar4321]

I get it:

You are decietful by encouraging people to be honest.

You are greedy by encouraging people to be charitable.

You are hateful by encouraging people to love

You are ignorant by encouraging people to seek the truth

You are violent by encouraging people to seek peace.

I really do get it. You live in Bizarro world.

[Joe Steel]

I get it:

You are decietful by encouraging people to be honest.

You are deceitful by letting hate media define you "values."


You are greedy by encouraging people to be charitable.

You are greedy by promoting tax cuts for the rich.


You are hateful by encouraging people to love

You are hateful for trying to blame the economic crisis on home loans to minorities.


You are ignorant by encouraging people to seek the truth

You are ignorant by believing Fox News really is "fair an balanced."


You are violent by encouraging people to seek peace.

You are violent by worshiping guns and starting wars.

[Little-Acorn]

Another thread where a liberal tells a few lies about conservatives and them bashes them for it?

Little joesteal is becoming a real one-trick pony, isn't he......

[Yurt]

Is Glenn Beck drinking again? He says Conservatives have "values."

We Surround Them-The Unveiling (http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/21018/?ck=1)

I guess that's true to some extent. Everyone has "values." He got them wrong, though. Seriously wrong.

Five Conservative Values

Deceit
Greed
Hatred
Ignorance
Violence


Everything Conservatives do and everything they say can be understood best in terms of the Five Conservative Values.

why is it you feel that lying will convince people that conservatism is bad or wrong? perhaps it is because you know the truth will sway more people to conservatism. what a pathetic attempt to attribute false values to conservatives...what is actually stated in the link and what is true, not your unfounded meadowmuffins:

12 Values
•Honesty
•Reverence
•Hope
•Thrift
•Humility
•Charity
•Sincerity
•Moderation
•Hard Work
•Courage
•Personal Responsibility
•Gratitude


The Nine Principles

1. America is good.

2. I believe in God and He is the Center of my Life.

3. I must always try to be a more honest person than I was yesterday.

4. The family is sacred. My spouse and I are the ultimate authority, not the government.

5. If you break the law you pay the penalty. Justice is blind and no one is above it.

6. I have a right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, but there is no guarantee of equal results.

7. I work hard for what I have and I will share it with who I want to. Government cannot force me to be charitable.

8. It is not un-American for me to disagree with authority or to share my personal opinion.

9. The government works for me. I do not answer to them, they answer to me.

[Classact]

CNN must be pulling their hair out trying to compete with their former employee Glenn Beck... I understand his ratings are very high

Between the talking heads on CNBC financial network and Glenn, Hanity and Rush Obama must be at a loss who to pick on first... I heard his spokesman pick on CNBC Cramer today... what a classact, the spokesperson for the president picking on the press individually...

[avatar4321]

So what does everyone think of Glenn's 9/12 plan?

[sgtdmski]

Is Glenn Beck drinking again? He says Conservatives have "values."

We Surround Them-The Unveiling (http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/21018/?ck=1)

I guess that's true to some extent. Everyone has "values." He got them wrong, though. Seriously wrong.

Five Conservative Values

Deceit
Greed
Hatred
Ignorance
Violence


Everything Conservatives do and everything they say can be understood best in terms of the Five Conservative Values.

Yes let us take a look:

Deceit:


"Too often bills are rushed through Congress and to the president before the public has the opportunity to review them," Obama's campaign Web site states . "As president, Obama will not sign any nonemergency bill without giving the American public an opportunity to review and comment on the White House Web site for five days."

Greed:

How's not paying taxes???

How many different nominees (http://www.usnews.com/blogs/mary-kate-cary/2009/2/3/tax-problems-for-daschle-geithner-and-other-obama-nominees-show-need-for-reform.html?s_cid=etRR-0307)

More (http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/03/daschle/)

more (http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2009-02-05-solis-husband-taxes_N.htm)

more (http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2009/03/yet-another-obama-nominees-tax-problems.html)

Hatred:

Conservatives judge a person based upon the individual, for the Democrats you must be a member of a group: Blacks, Hispanics, Gays, Union members, conservatives were not the ones that called Collin Powell a house negro (http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2009/03/yet-another-obama-nominees-tax-problems.html), nor were we the ones that called Condeleeza Rice an Aunt Jemina (http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/nation/20041118-2131-radiohost-remark.html), now that honor belongs to the democrats. Talk about hatred!!!


Ignorance:

Where to begin on this one? Here's a good start (http://www.michnews.com/artman/publish/article_21288.shtml).

And they start off young!! (http://lauraelizabethmorales.net/2007/08/24/my-cnn-transcript/)

or this (http://thevoice.name/?p=13874)

Not to mention how the Obama adminstration loves to answer questions about abortion or stems cells with that all but favorite answer:


It's above my pay grade.Violence:

Yes democrats even have the market cornered on this one, tell me who was it the let a rapist out on work furlough as Governor?? Democrat Dukakis that's who.

WWI - Woodrow Wilson
WWII - FDR
Vietnam - Kennedy & Johnson

Nor should we forget about the party of abortions now, then and forever.

So shall we talk more about the values????

Come on, I got a lot more ammo.

dmk

[bullypulpit]

why is it you feel that lying will convince people that conservatism is bad or wrong? perhaps it is because you know the truth will sway more people to conservatism. what a pathetic attempt to attribute false values to conservatives...what is actually stated in the link and what is true, not your unfounded meadowmuffins:

12 Values
•Honesty
•Reverence
•Hope
•Thrift
•Humility
•Charity
•Sincerity
•Moderation
•Hard Work
•Courage
•Personal Responsibility
•Gratitude

OK.


The Nine Principles

1. America is good.

No argument there


2. I believe in God and He is the Center of my Life.

Which god? America is not a theocracy.


3. I must always try to be a more honest person than I was yesterday.

OK


4. The family is sacred. My spouse and I are the ultimate authority, not the government.

With every family a law unto itself, we have anarchy.


5. If you break the law you pay the penalty. Justice is blind and no one is above it.

So Bush and the rest of his administration should be tried for war crimes?


6. I have a right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, but there is no guarantee of equal results.

OK


7. I work hard for what I have and I will share it with who I want to. Government cannot force me to be charitable.

Taxation is the price of civilization.


8. It is not un-American for me to disagree with authority or to share my personal opinion.

OK


9. The government works for me. I do not answer to them, they answer to me.

Society cannot exist with total disregard for the individuals that compromise it any more than individuals can live in utter disregard for the society in which they live.

[PostmodernProphet]

With every family a law unto itself, we have anarchy.



only if that family thinks its a law unto YOURself.....

[Joe Steel]

Yes let us take a look:

So shall we talk more about the values????

Come on, I got a lot more ammo.

dmk

Sorry.

I left off one "value:" stupidity.

Illustrated by the idea that finely parsing a general statement to find a few questionable exceptions is substantive analysis.

[Kathianne]

Sorry.

I left off one "value:" stupidity.

Illustrated by the idea that finely parsing a general statement to find a few questionable exceptions is substantive analysis.

Meaning he annihilated your premise. Rather than whining, answer.

[BoogyMan]

Sorry.

I left off one "value:" stupidity.

Illustrated by the idea that finely parsing a general statement to find a few questionable exceptions is substantive analysis.

That didn't take long. The standard liberal answer to any conservative is that the conservative side of the argument is simply evidence of stupidity. Joe, yet again you lose the argument that you yourself started because in light of the refutation of the sensational and false arguments you provide you toss out that favorite liberal standby of calling names.

I have seen people spanked in an argument time and time again, but to watch the guy who picked the scab spank himself is just priceless. :lol:

[sgtdmski]

Sorry.

I left off one "value:" stupidity.

Illustrated by the idea that finely parsing a general statement to find a few questionable exceptions is substantive analysis.

You provide no general statements only your own opinion. You assumed and you what they say way you assume you make an a** of you.

So you got stupidity covered as well I see.

But if you really want to talk about stupid, lets talk about that majority in Congress who has just passed itself an automatic raise once again, one that this time will remain permanent. Not only did the raise their own salaries again, but they also tripled their AMR, the money in which they get to pay for mailings, car rentals and airline flights. Suddenly the AMR went from $30,000 a year to $90,000 a year. Hmmm I thought we were suppose to be sacrificing, oh thats right, that does not apply to the Democrats in charge who know better how to spend our money they we do.

Any more values you wish to discuss??????

I am ready are you, thus far it seems you are not really up to the task.

Perhaps we should include compentency as a value. Oh sorry you would fail that too.

dmk

[sgtdmski]

OK.



No argument there



Which god? America is not a theocracy.



OK



With every family a law unto itself, we have anarchy.



So Bush and the rest of his administration should be tried for war crimes?



OK



Taxation is the price of civilization.



OK



Society cannot exist with total disregard for the individuals that compromise it any more than individuals can live in utter disregard for the society in which they live.

So what happened to courage, personal responsibility and gratitude??

I guess liberals have none.

They prefer to do what everyone else wants, have government solve all problems and feel they are obligated to get without never having to thank anyone, I can see why you skipped them.

dmk

[bullypulpit]

So what happened to courage, personal responsibility and gratitude??

I guess liberals have none.

They prefer to do what everyone else wants, have government solve all problems and feel they are obligated to get without never having to thank anyone, I can see why you skipped them.

dmk

It was yurt's list. Blame him ya weenie. As for the attributes you mentioned...My work demands them of me so piss off.

[Joe Steel]

Meaning he annihilated your premise. Rather than whining, answer.

No. Meaning his premise was stupid.

It was like saying a guy with a dollar in his pocket is just like Bill Gates because they both have money.

[Joe Steel]

That didn't take long. The standard liberal answer to any conservative is that the conservative side of the argument is simply evidence of stupidity. Joe, yet again you lose the argument that you yourself started because in light of the refutation of the sensational and false arguments you provide you toss out that favorite liberal standby of calling names.

I have seen people spanked in an argument time and time again, but to watch the guy who picked the scab spank himself is just priceless. :lol:

No. I won the argument because his premise really was stupid.

Stupidity exists. Worshiping it and considering it fundamental to conservative ideology doesn't change it's nature. It still stupidity.

[Yurt]

It was yurt's list. Blame him ya weenie. As for the attributes you mentioned...My work demands them of me so piss off.

it is not my list...try reading more carefully...the list is what actually was in the link in the OP, not JS's meadowmuffins list

[avatar4321]

No. I won the argument because his premise really was stupid.

Stupidity exists. Worshiping it and considering it fundamental to conservative ideology doesn't change it's nature. It still stupidity.

Who the heck is worshiping anyone?

You still cant argue against any of the principles. All you are doing is making yourself look stupid.

[sgtdmski]

Sorry.

I left off one "value:" stupidity.

Illustrated by the idea that finely parsing a general statement to find a few questionable exceptions is substantive analysis.

Whoa, at least I proved substantive analysis, what was your post? Nothing more of the same silly rhetoric that has been spewed for the last 8 years. A whole bunch of opinion, without any fact to support it. When fact was shown, the fact totally blew you main premise. You talked of violence, well in the 5 Wars fought in the 20th century, 4 of them had been started by liberals.

Again proving that other than making statements without any support you have offered nothing more than you opinion, and you know what they say about opinion.

dmk

[Missileman]

well in the 5 Wars fought in the 20th century, 4 of them had been started by liberals.

I have no problem with any of the other arguments you've offered in this thread, but the above statement isn't even close to being accurate.

[Little-Acorn]

I have no problem with any of the other arguments you've offered in this thread, but the above statement isn't even close to being accurate.

It certainly isn't. It implies that Osama Bin Laden and assorted Islamic terrorists, are conservative. Couldn't be farther from the truth. Good catch, missileman.

[Abbey Marie]

No one from the party that guarantees the right to partial birth abortion, has a leg to stand on when discussing values.

Give it up, Joey.

[Missileman]

It certainly isn't. It implies that Osama Bin Laden and assorted Islamic terrorists, are conservative. Couldn't be farther from the truth. Good catch, missileman.

That isn't the reason his statement is inaccurate. Wilson didn't start WWI and FDR didn't start WWII are the primary reason.

And Islamic fundamentalists are the quintessential conservatives.

[Little-Acorn]

That isn't the reason his statement is inaccurate. Wilson didn't start WWI and FDR didn't start WWII are the primary reason.
Americans didn't start any of the wars we got involved in in the 20th century. His statement is inaccurate for that reason. Perhaps he meant that liberals were in the Presidency when we got involved in 4 of the 5. But you'll have to ask him, I guess.


And Islamic fundamentalists are the quintessential conservatives.
I LOVE your sense of humor here.

Islamic fundamentalists believe in govt having little to do with people's lives, believe govt should have little control over people, believe they should be free to choose their own religion and govt should keep out of it... LOL! :clap: That's GREAT!!!

[Missileman]

Islamic fundamentalists believe in govt having little to do with people's lives, believe govt should have little control over people, believe they should be free to choose their own religion and govt should keep out of it... LOL! :clap: That's GREAT!!!

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/conservative


1. disposed to preserve existing conditions, institutions, etc., or to restore traditional ones, and to limit change.

That describes Islamic fundamentalism perfectly.

[Little-Acorn]

Yeah! If it says it on the internet, then it must be true! :lol:

I love it! Today's conservatives are trying to keep things the same, preserve the massive spending and exploding government we've had for the last 20 years... yup!

Aw, stop it, yer killin' me, man.......

[Missileman]

Yeah! If it says it on the internet, then it must be true! :lol:

Which part of the definition is it that you have a problem with? Maybe you'd care to break out a couple definitions of liberal and argue how Islamic fundamentalists are progressives?

[avatar4321]

Which part of the definition is it that you have a problem with? Maybe you'd care to break out a couple definitions of liberal and argue how Islamic fundamentalists are progressives?

Probably with the part that tries to equate your usage of the word with the modern conservative movement.

[Binky]

why is it you feel that lying will convince people that conservatism is bad or wrong? perhaps it is because you know the truth will sway more people to conservatism. what a pathetic attempt to attribute false values to conservatives...what is actually stated in the link and what is true, not your unfounded meadowmuffins:

12 Values
•Honesty
•Reverence
•Hope
•Thrift
•Humility
•Charity
•Sincerity
•Moderation
•Hard Work
•Courage
•Personal Responsibility
•Gratitude


The Nine Principles

1. America is good.

2. I believe in God and He is the Center of my Life.

3. I must always try to be a more honest person than I was yesterday.

4. The family is sacred. My spouse and I are the ultimate authority, not the government.

5. If you break the law you pay the penalty. Justice is blind and no one is above it.

6. I have a right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, but there is no guarantee of equal results.

7. I work hard for what I have and I will share it with who I want to. Government cannot force me to be charitable.

8. It is not un-American for me to disagree with authority or to share my personal opinion.

9. The government works for me. I do not answer to them, they answer to me.


Well now, don't these all seem so much nicer than the other five? These are not hatefilled.

What is so horrible about being a conservative for crying out loud? A liberal is way out in left field and tends to do things that are harmful in mind and body to that of others and oneself. It seems to me that liberals have been overrunning this country and now it looks as tho' it's Saddam and Gamorrah where anything goes anymore. What the hell is next for our kids to learn about? Beastiallity?

[Missileman]

Probably with the part that tries to equate your usage of the word with the modern conservative movement.

Right! Like I ever said that Islamic fundies were card carrying Republicans. :cool:

[sgtdmski]

I have no problem with any of the other arguments you've offered in this thread, but the above statement isn't even close to being accurate.

Really?

WWI started by Wilson.
WWII started by Roosevelt
Korea started by Truman
Vietnam started by Kennedy/Johnson
Gulf War started by Bush

So tell me how am I not accurate? Perhaps it is your knowledge of history that is not accurate.

dmk

[sgtdmski]

That isn't the reason his statement is inaccurate. Wilson didn't start WWI and FDR didn't start WWII are the primary reason.

And Islamic fundamentalists are the quintessential conservatives.

For the United States they did. That was the brunt of your argument regarding Conservatives and violence. Wilson got the US involved in WWI and Roosevelt got the US involved in WWII. BTW, there are conspiracy theorists who believe that Roosevelt allowed Pearl harbor to be bombed so that he could involve the US in the war. Not to mention the conspiracy theorists who believe that Germany warned Wilson that the U2s would sink the Lusitania, and that American should not be allowed to sail on it.

So again, it would seem that the liberals in the 20th Century were the most blood-thirsty seeking violence.

dmk

[sgtdmski]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/conservative



That describes Islamic fundamentalism perfectly.

We can sit here and study definitions all night long. The definitions of conservative and liberal have nothing to do with the ideology of the political philosophies associated with those labels in the United States. If we were talking about Great Britian that may be a different story.

The conservative political philosophy believes in and stresses individual freedom, free markets, limited government, low taxes, private property rights, equality under the law, equality of opportunity and not outcome, and the belief in natural rights which means a belief in a Creator.

The liberal political philosopy endorse regulation for business, a limited social welfare state, supports broad racial, ethnic, sexual and religious tolerance, causing them to believe in group rights over those of the individual, prefers not only equality of opportunity but equality of outcome as well, and believes that government has the ultimate authority when it comes to private property and that government need outweighs individual property.

You do a disservice to yourself when you knowing lie to prove your point. Any political science 101 class will tell you that the words as defined by the dictionary have nothing to do with political philosophies. I could pick apart all kinds of definitions for liberals.

Open-minded. Yes, liberals are open minded when it comes to new ideas, however, when it comes to debate, they are very closeminded. You either agree with their argument or you are called a name. Disagree of gay marriage you are a homophobe. Disagree about massive goverment spending and higher taxes you are spewing hate speech on the air waves, like Glen Beck or Rush Limbaugh. I believe that right there was something even you said, helping to prove the point.

Progressive, yes, liberals love to try new ideas, however, when it comes to allowing individuals to invest their SS monies in private accounts, we cannot touch SS. Not very open to progress there, really seems like you are sticking to the tried and true system that is inherently unfair, racist, and failing.

Shall I go on??

Yes you value rights, but god forbid someone be gay, black, hispanic and be a Republican or conservative, then they are selling out or Uncle Toms. To liberals everyone has to fit into a nice little group. Blacks, gays, Hispanics, etc., the group rights must be valued over that of the individuals.

As a conservative in this country I have allowed for far too long the left to use my name. I am the classic liberal, like Friedman, Hayek and Reagan. We allowed Roosevelt to steal the name liberal during the 1930's for his socialist agenda. We allowed it to happen and never fought against it. Well perhaps it is time we take our name back. It is time for us to take back our heros of Mises, Locke and Smith.

dmk

[bullypulpit]

We can sit here and study definitions all night long. The definitions of conservative and liberal have nothing to do with the ideology of the political philosophies associated with those labels in the United States. If we were talking about Great Britian that may be a different story.

The conservative political philosophy believes in and stresses individual freedom, free markets, limited government, low taxes, private property rights, equality under the law, equality of opportunity and not outcome, and the belief in natural rights which means a belief in a Creator.

The liberal political philosopy endorse regulation for business, a limited social welfare state, supports broad racial, ethnic, sexual and religious tolerance, causing them to believe in group rights over those of the individual, prefers not only equality of opportunity but equality of outcome as well, and believes that government has the ultimate authority when it comes to private property and that government need outweighs individual property.

You do a disservice to yourself when you knowing lie to prove your point. Any political science 101 class will tell you that the words as defined by the dictionary have nothing to do with political philosophies. I could pick apart all kinds of definitions for liberals.

Open-minded. Yes, liberals are open minded when it comes to new ideas, however, when it comes to debate, they are very closeminded. You either agree with their argument or you are called a name. Disagree of gay marriage you are a homophobe. Disagree about massive goverment spending and higher taxes you are spewing hate speech on the air waves, like Glen Beck or Rush Limbaugh. I believe that right there was something even you said, helping to prove the point.

Progressive, yes, liberals love to try new ideas, however, when it comes to allowing individuals to invest their SS monies in private accounts, we cannot touch SS. Not very open to progress there, really seems like you are sticking to the tried and true system that is inherently unfair, racist, and failing.

Shall I go on??

Yes you value rights, but god forbid someone be gay, black, hispanic and be a Republican or conservative, then they are selling out or Uncle Toms. To liberals everyone has to fit into a nice little group. Blacks, gays, Hispanics, etc., the group rights must be valued over that of the individuals.

As a conservative in this country I have allowed for far too long the left to use my name. I am the classic liberal, like Friedman, Hayek and Reagan. We allowed Roosevelt to steal the name liberal during the 1930's for his socialist agenda. We allowed it to happen and never fought against it. Well perhaps it is time we take our name back. It is time for us to take back our heros of Mises, Locke and Smith.

dmk

Well argued, but off the mark. Your definitions of "conservative" and "liberal" represent extremes, and as history shows us, the best government is that which governs from the middle, not the extremes. No sane, healthy society can exist with total disregard for the individuals that compromise that society any more than individuals can exist with complete disregard for the society in which they live.

[sgtdmski]

Well argued, but off the mark. Your definitions of "conservative" and "liberal" represent extremes, and as history shows us, the best government is that which governs from the middle, not the extremes. No sane, healthy society can exist with total disregard for the individuals that compromise that society any more than individuals can exist with complete disregard for the society in which they live.

No my argument is right on the mark. The definitions given to conservative and liberal apply to political parties in Great Britain, but have little do whith political parties in the United States.

I am sick and tired of people throwing the definition of Conservative in my face. It has little to do with the beliefs of my political party, as does the word liberal has to do with the politics of the left.

In Great Britain, the Conservatives in the United States would be called liberals, as was Burke, Adams and Hayek.

There is always room in the Center, and you are right that there are extremes in both parties. However, neither party ignores the society in which we live, we just have different philosophies on how we should go further in the future.

Liberals believe that the government should provide all things for everyone, Conservatives believe that government should keep their hands off and let people succeed or fail on their own, being their only as a last resort to help those that truly need help.

The government that governs the best governs the least.

dmk

dmk

[Little-Acorn]

Time to do some debunking of the obvious.

Really?

WWI started by Wilson.
In fact it was started by Germany, Hungary, and France. the US under Wilson swore up and down we'd never get in, then got in three years later.


WWII started by Roosevelt
Actually it was started by Japan and Germany. The US under FDR swore up and down we'd never get in, then got in after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. Germany then quickly declared war on the US.


Korea started by Truman
Actually started by North Korea, with help from China. The US got in fairly quickly under Truman.


Vietnam started by Kennedy/Johnson
Actually started by North Vietnam and France. This one's vague, but Americans had nothing to do with it. The US started sending in "advisors" under Kennedy, and things escalated from there, mostly under Kennedy and Johnson. Nixon increased the bombing hugely, nearly wiped out the NV armed forces, then got us out, promising massive logistical support. The Democrat Congress then cut off that support, and South Vietnam fell as a result. Millions of civilians subsequently died at the hands of the North Vietnamese leftist govt and its allies.


Gulf War started by Bush
Actually started by Iraq invading Kuwait. U.S. under George H.W. Bush 41 and many other countries jumped in afterward to help Kuwait, and Iraq promised to get out, stay out, and follow certain rules in order to keep the Allies from blowing them completely off the map. Iraq subsequently violated every one of those agreements, and after years of negotiations Bill Clinton decided on a policy of Regime Change, but didn't do much. Violations and negotiations continued, and GWB 43 and other countries eventually re-invaded and completed Clinton's regime change. Gulf War 1 and 2 were two parts of the same conflict.

[Missileman]

Really?

WWI started by Wilson.
WWII started by Roosevelt
Korea started by Truman
Vietnam started by Kennedy/Johnson
Gulf War started by Bush

So tell me how am I not accurate? Perhaps it is your knowledge of history that is not accurate.

dmk

There is a difference between being President when the U.S. enters a war and starting a war.

[Missileman]

You do a disservice to yourself when you knowing lie to prove your point. Any political science 101 class will tell you that the words as defined by the dictionary have nothing to do with political philosophies. I could pick apart all kinds of definitions for liberals.
dmk

Excuse me? Care to point to my lie or are you just another poster who likes to make up shit?

[actsnoblemartin]

brilliant, from what i know so far


So what does everyone think of Glenn's 9/12 plan?

[sgtdmski]

Time to do some debunking of the obvious.

In fact it was started by Germany, Hungary, and France. the US under Wilson swore up and down we'd never get in, then got in three years later.


Actually it was started by Japan and Germany. The US under FDR swore up and down we'd never get in, then got in after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. Germany then quickly declared war on the US.


Actually started by North Korea, with help from China. The US got in fairly quickly under Truman.


Actually started by North Vietnam and France. This one's vague, but Americans had nothing to do with it. The US started sending in "advisors" under Kennedy, and things escalated from there, mostly under Kennedy and Johnson. Nixon increased the bombing hugely, nearly wiped out the NV armed forces, then got us out, promising massive logistical support. The Democrat Congress then cut off that support, and South Vietnam fell as a result. Millions of civilians subsequently died at the hands of the North Vietnamese leftist govt and its allies.


Actually started by Iraq invading Kuwait. U.S. under George H.W. Bush 41 and many other countries jumped in afterward to help Kuwait, and Iraq promised to get out, stay out, and follow certain rules in order to keep the Allies from blowing them completely off the map. Iraq subsequently violated every one of those agreements, and after years of negotiations Bill Clinton decided on a policy of Regime Change, but didn't do much. Violations and negotiations continued, and GWB 43 and other countries eventually re-invaded and completed Clinton's regime change. Gulf War 1 and 2 were two parts of the same conflict.

So how exactly are republicans violent then. You have now even justified the war in Iraq, so where does the idea of violence come from.

Come on, where's the rationale for the statement. I will accept your statements on who started the wars, that is fine then. So if a sitting President gets America involved in war and it was not started by this country, then they are not responsible for the violence. No problem, so I guess you lied about republicans being violent, Right!!

dmk

[sgtdmski]

There is a difference between being President when the U.S. enters a war and starting a war.


Fine but a statement was made about Republicans being violent, one can only conclude that this comes from war. As such, I pointed to the fact that for the United States 4 of the 5 wars were started by Democrats who were President. As far as I am concerned, when I say started I mean beginning American involvement. Of the five 20th century conflicts, four of them were under Democratic Presidents. Really causes one to consider that statement about violence does it not?

More American soldiers have died, while a Democrat has been President that when a Republican has been President.

dmk

[sgtdmski]

Excuse me? Care to point to my lie or are you just another poster who likes to make up shit?

I point to your definition of conservative as taken from the dictionary reference. Either you have never studied political science, or you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to conservative and liberal in the United States.

I didn't make up shit. I have sat through political science classes and any professor worth his degree will tell you that the dictionary definitions of liberal and conservative have nothing to do with parties or political philosophies. You act on this board like you know something, I guess that was my mistake in believing that you actually did. Obviously you don't know what your are talking about you when you pass your judgements and thus you are providing nothing more than your unenlightened opinion.

dmk

[Missileman]

I point to your definition of conservative as taken from the dictionary reference.

That's hardly a lie, asshole!

I didn't make up the definition of conservative that I referenced, and whether you like it or not, it describes perfectly the mindset of Islamic fundamentalists. Why else do you suppose the ignorant bastards still live in, and try to remain living in the 7th century?


Either you have never studied political science, or you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to conservative and liberal in the United States.

Where did I compare Islamic fundies to anyone in the U.S.? I was responding to a post where someone attempted to compare them to U.S. liberals.


I didn't make up shit. I have sat through political science classes and any professor worth his degree will tell you that the dictionary definitions of liberal and conservative have nothing to do with parties or political philosophies. You act on this board like you know something, I guess that was my mistake in believing that you actually did. Obviously you don't know what your are talking about you when you pass your judgements and thus you are providing nothing more than your unenlightened opinion.

dmk

Congratulations on sitting through political science classes...but maybe you should have invested in some English. Anyone remotely literate can clearly see I made no comparison of Islamic fundies to any political affiliation. If I were going to though, I would have to say they more closely resemble the religious far right than anything center or left.

[theHawk]

Is Glenn Beck drinking again? He says Conservatives have "values."

We Surround Them-The Unveiling (http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/21018/?ck=1)

I guess that's true to some extent. Everyone has "values." He got them wrong, though. Seriously wrong.

Five Conservative Values

Deceit
Greed
Hatred
Ignorance
Violence


Everything Conservatives do and everything they say can be understood best in terms of the Five Conservative Values.

You seem to be describing liberals.

Deceit is pretty much at the core of liberalism. This is why most liberal politicians never actually state their core values during elections: Pro-abortion, high taxes, more goverment control/power, and a weaker military.

Greed: Pretty much all politicians Dem or Repub all need money and lots of it to run campaigns. If Dems like paying taxes so much why do so many of them not pay their taxes?

Hatred: Libs fear conservatives, they fear anyone shedding light on liberals' inherent Deceit about their core values. Libs always love to stir up racial hatred. We see plainly in these days of 'economic turmoil' libs like class warfare. Class envy and a sense of entitlement is another core value of liberalism.

Ignorance: Goes hand in hand with liberals' deceit to hide their own intensions. Key liberal value - keep the masses poor and ignorant so they keep voting more power to those who promise more handouts.

Violence: Certainly violence is necessary in some cases. Usually for conservatives violence is justified to right a wrong, to stand up for some kind of injustice. This is why we give police men guns, and why we give our military tanks and bombs. For liberals however, violence is used to silence their opposition. Libs can't have dissenters, can't have anyone exposing their lies, so force is necessary for them. See the Fairness Doctrine.

[BoogyMan]

No. I won the argument because his premise really was stupid.

Stupidity exists. Worshiping it and considering it fundamental to conservative ideology doesn't change it's nature. It still stupidity.

Joe, some people just seem to celebrate stupid as is evidenced by the sheer bait content of your OP. When you actually want to talk about issues and have developed the capavity for debate, get back with me.

America doesn't need 4 more years of liberal hate, anyone with a full and functional set of frontal lobes would have clocked this fact by now.