What Do You All Wish To Talk About?

[Kathianne]

Lots of possibilities here. Seems I miss hitting them. From what I can garner most would like to hit the local stuff? For the most part I'm inclined towards national and global, but I'll see what I can do.

[MtnBiker]

Let's talk about beer!

:beer:

St Pauli Girl, hmmmmm

[hjmick]

Let's talk about beer!

:beer:

St Pauli Girl, hmmmmm

Beer brewing was practiced in Egypt and Mesopotamia at least 5,000 years ago, and beer was an important part of the Egyptian culture. In fact, the hieroglyphic symbol for food was a pitcher of beer and a cake of bread. Some ancient Egyptians even used the phrase "bread and beer" as a greeting.

Egyptian records show the regulation of beer shops in 1300 B.C. - the world's first liquor licenses. In the Egyptian wing of the Louvre in Paris, you can see actual conical clay vessels once used to hold beer, and tiny replicas of them once entombed with a noble to provide refreshment in the afterlife.

Osiris, being the the Egyptian god of agriculture, was also revered as the god of beer. Diodorus, a Greek historian of the time of Julius and Augustus Caesar, wrote, "Wherever a country did not permit the culture of the vine, there Osiris taught the people how to brew the beverage which is made of barley, and which is not greatly inferior to wine in odor and potency."

Our modern word "booze" comes from the Nubian "boosa," one of many beer styles developed by the Egyptians. Their repertoire included a sweet beer lagered with dates, and special brews for various religious and medicinal uses.

The ancient Babylonians also considered beer an important part of their economic and social life. They used beer in their religious ceremonies and, like the Egyptians, designated gods to watch over their brewing. The Sumerians drank beer through straws (to avoid the grain hulls left in the cup), and often depicted these straws and unique beer jars on urns and official seals. The Code of Hammurabi prescribed stiff penalties for offenses at beer taverns. And the Hymn to Ninkasi, inscribed on a nineteenth-century B.C. tablet, contains a recipe for Sumerian beer.

In his 1868 book, "The Beer of the Bible," James Death, anthropologist and head brewer of the Cairo Brewery in Alexandria, postulated that the manna from heaven that God fed the Israelites in the desert was wusa, an Arab bread-based, porridge-like beer.

The Egyptians passed their knowledge on to the Greeks. Reaction to beer in wine-loving Greece was mixed. Despite Plato's assertion that "He was a wise man who invented beer," some Greek physicians thought beer caused leprosy, or at least too-frequent urination.

The Greeks, in turn, taught the Romans to brew. The Romans called their brew "cerevisia," from Ceres, the goddess of agriculture, and vis, Latin for "strength." This is the root of the modern Spanish word for beer, cerveza.

When the Romans began their conquest of the British Isles in 55 BC, the Britons were already making ale from barley. The Romans refined the British brewing methods and, unbeknownst to them, started a long love affair between the British and their bitter.

Women's Work

Spontaneously fermented beers (using wild yeast that floats into the brew on its own) occur all over the world, from Africa to the Andes. When Columbus arrived in the "New World" in the 1490s, he found Indians making beer from corn and black birch sap. Other cultures use the grains native to their region, from millet, maize and cassava in Africa to rice and sorghum in Asia.

In almost all of these cultures, brewing was and is women's work.

From Ninkasi, the Babylonian "lady who fills the mouth," to the native Amazon legends about a woman tricked into making the first beer to 18th-century alewives, women have taken on beer brewing along with other food production. Saint Brigid was alledged to have changed bath water into beer for a colony of thirsty lepers (take that, you Greeks).

Cultural anthropologist Alan Eames even postulates that "women have maintained power and status in macho, male-dominated, hunter-gatherer societies by developing their skills as brewsters." Could be.

"In archeological sites in Egypt and the Sudan, in 5000-year-old Sumerian cuneiform manuscripts, among contemporary tribal people and rural farmers from Peru to Norway, you find the exact same thing: women making beer," says Eames. "Same way, same basket, same pot, same rituals. Tibetan beers are very similar to Amazonian manioc beers. The nomads of the Yellow River area of Mongolia have these little portable breweries that go on horseback, and the women take them wherever they go. It's kind of a collective unconscious."

In Medieval Europe, women were brewsters in public taverns, although unless widowed they could only hold a tavern license under a husband's name. Since beer was a key dietary component, bad beer and short measures were punished with flogging and worse -- a church in Ludlow, England features a stone carving of an ale wife being cast into hell, false-bottomed pitcher in hand.

Of course, once brewing moved outside the home and became a commercial enterprise, it moved to the male domain. Home and small commercial brewing as women's work continued through the 17th century, but slowly died out as mass production took over. It was big news when Elise Miller John took over the reigns at Miller Brewing for eight years beginning in 1938 - the first woman ever to run a major brewing company.

The Viking Age

Eames calls the Vikings "the most beer-drunken people that ever lived." Like the Egyptians and Sumerians before them, the Vikings revered beer and brewing as holy pursuits. In fact, our modern word "ale" comes from the Norse "aul."

Norse legend says that Odin, disguised as an eagle, spilled the secret of beer from the sky. The Norse sea god, Aegir, brewed ale for the gods in a giant kettle provided by Thor. Aegir's role as the gods' ale brewer probably comes from the association between the ocean's foam and ale's foamy head. Aegir was famous for his hospitality; the cups in his hall magically refilled themselves.

In Valhalla, essentially a giant ale house where the Viking dead feasted, ale streamed boundlessly from the udders of a mythic goat named Heidrun. In the Kalevala, the ancient Finnish account of the creation of the world, the creation of ale is given twice the narrative space devoted to the creation of the world.

The mortal Vikings brewed ale on board their ships, spreading their ale throughout Europe as they raided and colonized during the 8th through 10th centuries. Viking brewers commonly used juniper berries as a preservative and bittering agent in place of hops. (Other cultures developed similar substitutes, such as the heather and pine ales produced in the Scottish isles.)

Today you can sample a number of beers brewed in the Viking tradition or at least inspired by the Norsemen, from Legends Ltd.'s Skullsplitter Orkney Ale (named for Thorfinn Hausakluif, the Seventh Viking Earl of Orkney) to Norvig Viking Ale, made in England with yeast and recipes that date from Viking times. (Norvig was brewed in the mid-90s by the always-interesting Legends Ltd., but I don't think they make it any more.)

Ale was more than a means to divine intoxication for the Vikings and Anglo-Saxons. In a world without refrigeration or good sanitary technique, brewed beverages were both a bankable source of nourishment (high in carbohydrates and containing some protein) and a safe substitute for drinking water of dubious quality.

Even today, some events are so closely associated with beer that their Scandinavian names incorporate the Norse word for beer: gravöl (a wake, or "funeral ale"), barnöl (a christening, or "child-ale") and taklagsöl (a barn-raising, or "roofing-ale").

It should come as no surprise, then, that one of the first phrases I learned in Swedish, after some of the hymns and kitchen terms supplied by my grandmother, was the ever-useful "Jag tycker om öl!" (I like beer!).

(By the way, if you need your very own Viking drinking horn, check in with the folks at The Jelling Dragon.)

Monking Around

During the Dark Ages and Middle Ages, many of the key advancements in brewing science and styles came out of monasteries. Some credit the 12th century mystic, St. Hildegard of Bilgen, with introducing the use of hop flowers in brewing. Others say the Bohemians and others were already cultivating and using hops as early as the 800s A.D. In fact, Bohemian hops were so prized that King Wenceslas (yes, that King Wenceslas) ordered the death penalty for anyone caught exporting the cuttings, from which new plants could be grown. Regardless of the source, hops helped preserve the beer and paved the way for wider distribution.

It was during the first half of the Middle Ages (500-1000 AD) that brewing begin to shift from a household chore to centralized production in monasteries and convents, which provided hospitality for traveling pilgrims.

During Medieval times beer was used for tithing, trading and payment of taxes.

Beer & Britain

In the reign of Henry VIII, ladies at court were allowed a daily ration of a gallon of ale. Queen Elizabeth I was known to drink "large quantities of particularly strong brew." In fact, it was said to be "so strong as there is no man able to drink it." Household accounts show she liked bread and ale for breakfast.

The first people to really take an interest in the history of beer were a bunch of eccentric English country gentlemen, who in the 1880s published collections of beer songs, stories and legends they had collected. Most notable among these are "The Curiosities of Ale and Beer" by Bickerdyke (actually a collaborative effort by Charles Cook, J.G. Finell and a third man) and Marchand's "In Praise of Ale."

Across the Atlantic

Pilgrims, founding fathers and later immigrants helped shape the beer scene in the US.

Sometimes, beer helped shape history as well. When the Pilgrims pulled the Mayflower into Plymouth Harbour on December 16, 1620, one of their main reasons for stopping was that they had run out of beer. "We could not now take time for further searche or consideration: our victuals being much spente, especially our beere," the captain recorded in the the ship's log.

Even before the Pilgrims arrived, Sir Walter Raleigh's colony in Virginia brewed the first European beer in the New World in 1587, but the colonists still sent requests to England for better beer.

During the colonial period, the tavern was the focal point of the community, as it was in England. Even the Puritans, with their strict religious beliefs, realized that the early American settlers were going to drink and promoted beer over "demon rum" and whiskey.

Resourceful New Englanders brewed beer flavored with spruce, birch and sassafras in place of hops, with pumpkin, apple parings, molasses, maple syrup, beet tops and other additives.

The Dutch in New Amsterdam (now New York - wasn't that a They Might Be Giants song?) opened their own breweries as early as 1632. New Amsterdam's Red Lion Brewery produced the first brand-named colonial beer.

Universities in Europe and American from the 1300s through the 1700s had in-house breweries to nourish the student body. Harvard had its own brewhouse in 1674 and five beer halls, each burned down by rioting divinity students. Students received beer three meals a day -- nice to see some things haven't changed.

Perhaps inspired by Frederick the Great's musing that "Many battles have been fought and won by soldiers nourished on beer," soldiers in the Revolutionary army received rations of a quart of beer a day.

Like many gentlemen of their time, many of the original presidents and leaders of the United States were avid brewers and beer drinkers. Benjamin Franklin, well-known for enjoying the high life, said, "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." George Washington's personal recipe for porter is handwritten in a notebook available at the New York Public Library. William Penn operated a commercial brewery in the 1680s. And James Madison even wanted to establish a National Brewery and appoint a Secretary of Beer to the Cabinet.

The Industrial Revolution

Brewing became a big business in the latter part of the nineteenth century, as German immigrants (Anheuser-Busch, Miller, Coors, Stroh, Schlitz and Pabst among them) introduced lager to the US. After 1890, beer surpassed distilled spirits as the principal source of beverage alcohol in the American market. In 1880, there were about 2,300 breweries in the US, most of them small-volume operations serving limited geographical areas.

Dr. Alexander Nowell's discovery in 1602 that ale could be stored longer in cork-sealed glass bottles paved the way for mass production. But it was 19th century technological advances, namely the railroads and mechanical refrigeration, that changed the American brewing landscape forever. With the ability to ship their product for longer distances, large regional breweries began to emerge. In 1880, Anheuser-Busch launched its first fleet of refrigerated freight cars and a network of icehouses, making Budweiser the first national brand.

In 1876 Louis Pasteur figured out how yeast works in the fermentation process, and also developed pasteurization to stabilize beers (22 years before the process was applied to milk), further enabling mass distribution.

In the 1890s, Pabst became the first brewer to sell over one million barrels in a year.

By the turn of the century, the number of breweries had shrunk dramatically and the business was evolving towards domination by giant brewers and mass-marketed brands. In 1914 there were 1,400 commercial brewers in the US.

Prohibition, from 1920-1933, drove all but the most powerful and adaptable brewers out of business. Anheuser-Busch, for example, built truck bodies and refrigerated cabinets; manufactured barley malt syrup and ice cream; and entered the baker's yeast business. There was even a de-alcoholized version of Budweiser. In all, the company produced more than 26 new products between 1920-1927 in its attempt to stay in business.

Prohibition ended on April 7, 1933; the number of operating breweries quickly grew from zero to 756 by 1934. However, in 1935 only 160 breweries remained in the US. By 1984, just 44 brewers in the United States operated a total of 83 breweries.

The last big innovation of the industrial era for American brewers was the introduction of the beer can in 1935, the progeny of American Can Co. and Kreuger Brewing.

California Dreamin'

After the bigger-is-better, Tomorrowland atmosphere of the atomic 1950s, the 1960s and 70s brought about a revived interest in all things natural and hand-made, from macrame to vegetarian cooking. The interest in craft brewing was a natural extension of this sentiment. In 1965, washing machine heir Fritz Maytag bought San Francisco's historic but ailing Anchor Brewing Company. Founded in 1896, Anchor had struggled to keep up with the growth and power of mass-market brands. Maytag's success at Anchor inspired a new generation of small-volume brewers and hand-crafted beers.

In the late 1970s and early 80s, several companies began microbrewing in Northern California, including New Albion (Sonoma, 1976) and Sierra Nevada (Chico, 1981). Meanwhile, the venerable Red Hook Brewery was getting started in Seattle in 1982. While these companies brewed hand-crafted beer in small quantities, they did not offer brewpubs as we know them today. In 1981, there were only 41 operating breweries in the US, including industry giants like Anheuser-Busch and Coors.

In 1983, armed with a dream and about $100,000, a small band of craft brewers purchased the assets of the now-defunct New Albion Brewing Company and founded the Mendocino Brewing Company. Mendo's Hopland brewpub, opened in December 1983, was the first brewpub in California since Prohibition and the second in the U.S. The brewery sold out its first bottling of 1.5 liter magnums.

As of 1997, there were 780 brewpubs and a total of 1239 microbreweries in the U.S.

Source (http://www.brewreview.com/brewreview/marginalia/history.asp)

[Kathianne]

Well that seems to cover beer. Now about ale?

[KitchenKitten99]

Let's talk about beer!

:beer:

St Pauli Girl, hmmmmm

:slap:
It's Guinness or you're just drinking beer-flavored soda...
Amateurs... :::sigh::::

[Mr. P]

Well that seems to cover beer. Now about ale?

Tis horse pee.

[MtnBiker]

:slap:
It's Guinness or you're just drinking beer-flavored soda...
Amateurs... :::sigh::::

That's awesome!

Guinness is ok, but I would rather have a Samuel Smith Oatmeal Stout, nothing like having a beer that you have to squeeze out of the bottle. :D

[Kathianne]

tis horse pee.

lol!

[KitchenKitten99]

That's awesome!

Guinness is ok, but I would rather have a Samuel Smith Oatmeal Stout, nothing like having a beer that you have to squeeze out of the bottle. :D

LOL! :cheers2:

[gabosaurus]

Discussions about different kinds of beer usually lose me. Doesn't it all come from the same horse? :p

I have been gradually tuning out national and international issues over last several months or so. I am more interested in whether I will still have a job next fall.
Also, I want to hear more about families and kids. Since that is about 90 percent of what I talk about anyway. I have fallen into the "new mom" vacuum.

[MtnBiker]

Discussions about different kinds of beer usually lose me. Doesn't it all come from the same horse? :p

I have been gradually tuning out national and international issues over last several months or so. I am more interested in whether I will still have a job next fall.
Also, I want to hear more about families and kids. Since that is about 90 percent of what I talk about anyway. I have fallen into the "new mom" vacuum.

Alright, kid friendly vacations, where and how? I saw a show on the Travel Channel about a Disney cruise ship, looked like great fun for the family.

When my little guy is a little older, I'm sure we will be going camping to include fishing, mountain biking, roasting marshmallows in the fire and making smores. Great fun!

[Trigg]

Alright, kid friendly vacations, where and how? I saw a show on the Travel Channel about a Disney cruise ship, looked like great fun for the family.

When my little guy is a little older, I'm sure we will be going camping to include fishing, mountain biking, roasting marshmallows in the fire and making smores. Great fun!

I couldn't do a cruise with kids, I'd be paranoid the whole time about them going overboard.

Camping is our #1 pastime. The kids LOVE getting out and spending time in the tents. They don't have to make their beds, we do all the cooking and they don't have any dishes to do. All they're expected to do is run around and stay out of trouble, oh and keep an eye on their littlest brother.

[Kathianne]

Alright, kid friendly vacations, where and how? I saw a show on the Travel Channel about a Disney cruise ship, looked like great fun for the family.

When my little guy is a little older, I'm sure we will be going camping to include fishing, mountain biking, roasting marshmallows in the fire and making smores. Great fun!

Like Trigg, I was too nervous about small kids on big ship. ;) However, best vacation we took with kids was at Disney and like a cruise we did it, "all inclusive." Meals, hotels, waterparks, special character meals all included. We even got some souvenirs thrown in. It probably cost more than if we'd paid for everything as we went, but not having to worry about where and when to eat or checking balances took lots of stress off.

My youngest was under 3, so we didn't have to pay for him. We flew down and took the Disney bus to the resort, (Grand Floridian), never needed a car again. The kids were young, so we were up early, breakfast at 6-6:30, Magic Kingdom by 7:30-8. Around noon would catch ride back to hotel, have lunch there or in the park, then get the kids down for nap. Have a drink and sit on balcony. Around 3:30, head for one of the waterparks. Dinner around 6:30, fireworks, bed. One night we even had a babysitter come into room and did Downtown Disney.

I think the fact that it was paid for upfront, helped relax us. Then the 7 days didn't pressure us to 'push through' schedules and such, so important for little kids. It didn't feel like a 'kids' vacation or adult vacation, it really was family vacation.

[gabosaurus]

We don't have any family vacations planned this summer, because my husband doesn't have any vacation time.
I am taking my daughter to England in a couple of weeks to see my best friend Lauren's new baby.
This Saturday is my daughter's 8th birthday. Her first as a member of our family. My mom is making a cake.

I would never do a cruise. They sound like money-grabbing tourist traps to me. Cruises are a captive audience.

[avatar4321]

I want to talk about sleep. I cant for the life of me get enough. I slept all last night, got home from work early today, was asleep all afternoon. And i just want to go back to sleep till tomorrow. Im just so drained lately.

[chloe]

Family issues, welfare reform, best places to live in the us taxwise, job wise fun wise. I'd like to hear more biographies of the members here, I read the interview section and enjoyed it. Dr Laura says single parents shouldn't date or remarry, does everyone agree? Also is postmodernphrophet a Prophet like Thomas Spencer Monson?

[avatar4321]

Family issues, welfare reform, best places to live in the us taxwise, job wise fun wise. I'd like to hear more biographies of the members here, I read the interview section and enjoyed it. Dr Laura says single parents shouldn't date or remarry, does everyone agree? Also is postmodernphrophet a Prophet like Thomas Spencer Monson?

Why shouldn't single parents date or remarry?

[chloe]

Why shouldn't single parents date or remarry?

Dr Laura said it messes the kids up, because if the kids get attached and it doesnt work out or if the ex spouse gets jealous and causes turmoil the kids suffer. She said single parents gave up that right when they brought children into the world and then divorced.

[Trigg]

Family issues, welfare reform, best places to live in the us taxwise, job wise fun wise. I'd like to hear more biographies of the members here, I read the interview section and enjoyed it. Dr Laura says single parents shouldn't date or remarry, does everyone agree? Also is postmodernphrophet a Prophet like Thomas Spencer Monson?

Dr Laura is kind of a loon.

Single parents should be carefull though. My brother in law's kids are a little messed up because of the divorce and dating though. But that has more to do with his introducing them to EVERYONE he dates.

I think single parents need to be selective and only introduce their kids if the relationship is serious. Why introduce every Tom, Dick and Harry who walks though???????

[Trigg]

I want to talk about sleep. I cant for the life of me get enough. I slept all last night, got home from work early today, was asleep all afternoon. And i just want to go back to sleep till tomorrow. Im just so drained lately.

Maybe your pregnant :laugh2:






Seriously though check your thyroid.

[chloe]

Dr Laura is kind of a loon.

Single parents should be carefull though. My brother in law's kids are a little messed up because of the divorce and dating though. But that has more to do with his introducing them to EVERYONE he dates.

I think single parents need to be selective and only introduce their kids if the relationship is serious. Why introduce every Tom, Dick and Harry who walks though???????

Yeah I know women friends who get these live-in boyfriends and live together a year and there kids get attached and then they break up and the kids are sad about it and then they get a new boyfriend a few months later and move him in. I don't agree with that. I always worry about pedaphiles too, I read an article that said some pedaphiles look for single mothers to trick them so they can molest there children. I think its better to wait until your kids are grown up.

[Trigg]

Yeah I know women friends who get these live-in boyfriends and live together a year and there kids get attached and then they break up and the kids are sad about it and then they get a new boyfriend a few months later and move him in. I don't agree with that. I always worry about pedaphiles too, I read an article that said some pedaphiles look for single mothers to trick them so they can molest there children. I think its better to wait until your kids are grown up.

Personally I don't think, especially women, single people with kids should be moving anyone in.

Either get married or don't, but don't play house when there are kids involved. Kids are vulnerable, why put them in that kind of situation.

[Mr. P]

Yeah I know women friends who get these live-in boyfriends and live together a year and there kids get attached and then they break up and the kids are sad about it and then they get a new boyfriend a few months later and move him in. I don't agree with that. I always worry about pedaphiles too, I read an article that said some pedaphiles look for single mothers to trick them so they can molest there children. I think its better to wait until your kids are grown up.


Personally I don't think, especially women, single people with kids should be moving anyone in.

Either get married or don't, but don't play house when there are kids involved. Kids are vulnerable, why put them in that kind of situation.

During the 1 yr I flew an EMS helicopter I flew 4 kids that had "unfortunate" accidents which always turned out to be beatings by the boy friend or live-in.

I think one lived.

[chloe]

Personally I don't think, especially women, single people with kids should be moving anyone in.

Either get married or don't, but don't play house when there are kids involved. Kids are vulnerable, why put them in that kind of situation.

agreed !

[KitchenKitten99]

Personally I don't think, especially women, single people with kids should be moving anyone in.

Either get married or don't, but don't play house when there are kids involved. Kids are vulnerable, why put them in that kind of situation.
Serious question:
What is the necessity of getting married again after divorcing once or more before that, if you will not be having any(more) children? If the person you are with feels that they don't want to get married again, and you feel the same way, but you wish to be together on that level (you don't need a piece of paper telling society that you are committed), then why push marriage? Do you think it is easier on everyone involved if the marriage doesn't work out and kids (if any are involved) go through the divorce process again or if the couple isn't married and they find their relationship isn't working and they are able to split up without the lawyers and paperwork?

No using religious beliefs... just facts and tangible arguments.

There are many out there that feel committed to their partner and don't need the official paper stating they are legally tied to them.

The kids involved would probably have a much easier time if the parents communicate and explain things to them and make sure that they don't have any concerns and hear the kids out on anything that may be bothering them.

[emmett]

Yeah I know women friends who get these live-in boyfriends and live together a year and there kids get attached and then they break up and the kids are sad about it and then they get a new boyfriend a few months later and move him in. I don't agree with that. I always worry about pedaphiles too, I read an article that said some pedaphiles look for single mothers to trick them so they can molest there children. I think its better to wait until your kids are grown up.


Wise words.

[emmett]

Serious question:
What is the necessity of getting married again after divorcing once or more before that, if you will not be having any(more) children? If the person you are with feels that they don't want to get married again, and you feel the same way, but you wish to be together on that level (you don't need a piece of paper telling society that you are committed), then why push marriage? Do you think it is easier on everyone involved if the marriage doesn't work out and kids (if any are involved) go through the divorce process again or if the couple isn't married and they find their relationship isn't working and they are able to split up without the lawyers and paperwork?

No using religious beliefs... just facts and tangible arguments.

There are many out there that feel committed to their partner and don't need the official paper stating they are legally tied to them.

The kids involved would probably have a much easier time if the parents communicate and explain things to them and make sure that they don't have any concerns and hear the kids out on anything that may be bothering them.

Good point about living together but what about the children getting attached.

[gabosaurus]

Children of re-marriages are rarely as happy and/or content as kids with their original parents. Because they know that stepparents do not value them as much.
It is pretty sad that children have to suffer for their parents' mistakes.

As much as I despise Dr. Laura, I have to agree with her on this one.

[Trigg]

Serious question:
What is the necessity of getting married again after divorcing once or more before that, if you will not be having any(more) children? If the person you are with feels that they don't want to get married again, and you feel the same way, but you wish to be together on that level (you don't need a piece of paper telling society that you are committed), then why push marriage? Do you think it is easier on everyone involved if the marriage doesn't work out and kids (if any are involved) go through the divorce process again or if the couple isn't married and they find their relationship isn't working and they are able to split up without the lawyers and paperwork?

No using religious beliefs... just facts and tangible arguments.

There are many out there that feel committed to their partner and don't need the official paper stating they are legally tied to them.

The kids involved would probably have a much easier time if the parents communicate and explain things to them and make sure that they don't have any concerns and hear the kids out on anything that may be bothering them.


If neither person wants to get married, then why move in together, especially when children are involved??

The couple can have their alone time and they can get together as a group.

Personally I'm not pushing marriage. I support not moving in together at all. What's wrong with waiting until the kids have grown up and moved out??????

I'm not saying single people shouldn't date, but why the rush to move in together these days????????

It's to hard on the kids if mom/dad is always bringing someone new over to meet them. I know my neices have had a hard time with this.

[Kathianne]

If neither person wants to get married, then why move in together, especially when children are involved??

The couple can have their alone time and they can get together as a group.

Personally I'm not pushing marriage. I support not moving in together at all. What's wrong with waiting until the kids have grown up and moved out??????

I'm not saying single people shouldn't date, but why the rush to move in together these days????????

It's to hard on the kids if mom/dad is always bringing someone new over to meet them. I know my neices have had a hard time with this.

That's pretty much what I did. Waited till the kids actually were out of high school. Just didn't seem worth it. Sure I dated here and there, but I was not willing to commit, as I already had commitments. Now they are pushing me to go out and it's fun, relaxing, and no guilt.

[gabosaurus]

My daughter is now eight years old!!
One year down, a lifetime to go. :D

[chloe]

My daughter is now eight years old!!
One year down, a lifetime to go. :D

enjoy the years they go fast !

[chloe]

It would be nice to have an Art & Poetry thread