Is Israel Really America's Friend? [Archive] - Debate Policy

View Full Version : Is Israel Really America's Friend?

abso

09-05-2010, 10:56 AM

we can look at whether Israel has really been a loyal ally to the U.S., or whether the U.S.-Israeli relationship is costing America.

Where does our national self-interest really lie? The two countries are not identical and our interests will sometimes diverge. When Israel acts contrary to our interests, should we just let them?

Below are articles that allege that Israel is acting contrary to American policies and interests by:

1- Spying on America
2- Selling American military secrets to America's enemies
3- Pirating America's technology
4- Illegally stockpiling weapons of mass destruction
5- Attacking an American naval vessel in international waters
6- Standing by and let Americans be killed

This is not "Muslim propaganda". All reports are taken from American or Israeli news sources and journalists.

--------------------------------------------------------------

1- Israel's Espionage Against the U.S.

A New Pollard Affair? (http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2002/2910too_big_bury.html), by Jeffrey Steinberg
Allies and Espionage (http://real-info.1accesshost.com/janes1.html), by Jane's Intelligence Digest
An Enigma: Vast Israeli Spy Network Dismantled in the U.S. (http://www.antiwar.com/rep/lemonde1.html), by Sylvain Cypel
Art Students or Intelligece Agents? (http://www.insightmag.com/main.cfm/include/detail/storyid/207226.html), by Paul Rodriguez
Art, Espionage and Cover Ups (http://www.comlinks.com/mag/120spies.htm), by Alan Simpson
Damage Caused by 'Friendly' Spies (http://www.mideastfacts.com/green_spies.html), by Stephen Green
Despite Coverup, Israel Caught Spying in Washington Again (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/062000/0006006.html), by Richard H. Curtiss
FBI Probes Espionage at Clinton White House (http://www.insightmag.com/main.cfm?include=detail&storyid=160595), by J. Michael Waller and Paul M. Rodriguez
Is Israel Spying on the U.S.? (http://www.mideastfacts.com/fox_4part_onisrl_911.html), by Carl Cameron, Fox News
Israel's 40-Year History of Espionage Against the United States (http://www.mideastfacts.com/green_spies.html), by Stephen Green
Israeli Outlaws in America (http://www.counterpunch.org/nimmo08252003.html), by Kurt Nimmo
Israeli Spy-Ring Uncovered in U.S. (http://www.ahram.org.eg/weekly/2002/576/in00.htm), by Iason Athanasiadis
Mossad using forged New Zealand passports (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=3580546&thesection=news&thesubsection=general&thesecondsubsection=&reportid=1162641), by New Zealand Herald
NZ deports Israeli spies (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3699252.stm), by the BBC
Nine Israelis face deportation: Spy agency suspects they may be foreign agents (http://cryptome.org/ca-il-spies.htm), by John Steinbachs and Andrew Seymour
Report of Israeli Eavesdropping on White House Telephones Gets Varying Media Treatment (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/072000/0007043.html), by Richard H. Curtiss
Revelation that Shamir Bartered U.S. Secrets Is Part of a Lifetime Pattern (http://www.mideastfacts.com/hadar_shamir_hersh.html), by Leon T. Hadar
Spies, Or Students? (http://news.haaretz.co.il/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=162902&contrassID=2&subContrassID=5&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y&itemNo=162902), by Nathan Guttman
Spy Rumors Fly on Gusts of Truth: Americans Probing Reports of Israeli Espionage (http://www.forward.com/issues/2002/02.03.15/news2.html), by Marc Perelman
Spying on America (http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/1/16/110443.shtml), by Charles R. Smith
Suspicious Activities Involving Israeli Art Students at DEA Facilities (http://cryptome.org/dea-il-spy.htm), by the Drug Enforcement Administration
The Israeli "Art Student" Mystery (http://real-info.1accesshost.com/artstudents.html), by Christopher Ketcham
The Israeli Art Student Papers (http://www.antiwar.com/orig/dea1.html), by Justin Raimondo
The Spies Who Came in from the Art Sale (http://www.atlanta.creativeloafing.com/2002-03-20/fishwrapper.html), by John Sugg
U.S. Arrests 200 Young Israelis in Spying Investigation (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/03/07/wspy07.xml&sSheet=/news/2002/03/07/ixworld.html), by Ben Fenton
U.S. Busts Huge Israeli Spy Ring, Says French Paper (http://www.nationalpost.com/news/world/story.html?f=/stories/20020306/250416.html), by Reuters newswire
U.S. Deports Israelis Amid Warnings of Espionage Activities (http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAQS1FAGYC.html), by Ted Bridis
U.S. Intelligence Failures and Israeli Spy Ring (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/2294487.stm), by Bob Broomby, BBC News
U.S. Police and Intelligence Hit by Israeli Spy Network (http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/12/18/224826.shtml), by Charles R. Smith
Urban Myth, My A** (http://atlanta.creativeloafing.com/2002-03-27/fishwrapper.html), by John Sugg
Was Israel Involved in Los Alamos Espionage? (http://www.newsmax.com/showinsidecover.shtml?a=2002/1/28/205623), by Carl Limbacher

Here are some links specifically about the Jonathan Pollard spy case:
Another Look into the Murky Depths of the Pollard Affair (http://www.mideastfacts.com/pollard_story.html), by Amir Oren
In the Pollard Case, Israel Dishonors Its Mother and Father (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/123085/851230001.html), by Andrew I. Killgore
Israel Finally Admits Pollard was Its Agent (http://www.mideastfacts.com/isrl_acpt_pollard.html), by David Makovsky
Israel Should Admit Its Responsibility to Jonathan Pollard (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0598/9805045.html), by Victor Ostrovsky
Israeli Make-Believe: Jonathan Jay Pollard Did Not Damage the United States (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/1098/9810021.html), by Andrew I. Killgore
Jonathan Pollard Was No Jewish Patriot (http://www.foreigncorrespondent.com/archive/pollard.html), by Eric Margolis
Pollard Should Not Go Free (http://www.mideastfacts.com/zionpollard.html), by Joseph E. diGenova
Pollard and Beyond (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/071486/860714002.html), by Richard H. Curtiss
Pollard in Perspective (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/071486/860714012.html), by Michael Saba
Pollard is Only the Tip of the Iceberg (http://www.mideastfacts.com/zionsobpollard.html), by Joseph Sobran
Report: Pollard stole 10-volume intelligence 'Bible' (http://www.mideastfacts.com/new_yorker_pollard.html), by Batsheva Tsur

And here are some links about the FBI probe into Israeli spies in the Pentagon at the current time (2004):
2d probe at the Pentagon examines actions on Iraq (http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/08/31/2d_probe_at_the_pentagon_examines_actions_on_iraq/), by Bryan Bender
A Spy for Israel? (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001080.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
A Web Of Intrigue (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101040913-692835,00.html), by Brian Bennett, Elaine Shannon, and Adam Zagorin
A grand unifying theory (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001086.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
A mole called Mega (http://www.janes.com/security/international_security/news/fr/fr040929_1_n.shtml), by Jane's Intelligence Review
AIPAC At Center of Two Year FBI Probe (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001084.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
AIPAC Probe Intensifies (http://www.jewishtimes.com/News/4374.stm), by Ron Kampeas and Matthew E. Berger
AIPAC Spy Case Update (http://www.juancole.com/2004_09_01_juancole_archive.html#10943284956610436 4), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
AIPAC Spy Case involves Intelligence on Iranian WMD (http://www.juancole.com/2004_09_01_juancole_archive.html#10945081086324981 5), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
AIPAC Spy Nest Exposed (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=6890), by Justin Raimondo
AIPAC Spying Case Heats up (http://www.juancole.com/2004/12/aipac-spying-case-heats-up-richard.html), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
AIPACgate: New Info from the New Indictment (http://dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/8/5/12137/52469), by LITBMueller (blog entry)
Analyst Who Is Target of Probe Went to Israel (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A42625-2004Aug28?language=printer), by Thomas E. Ricks and Robin Wright
Analyst at center of spy flap called naive, ardently pro-Israel (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/470856.html), by Nathan Guttman
And Now a Mole? (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5853706/site/newsweek/), by Michael Isikoff and Mark Hosenball
And Now a Mole? (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5853706/site/newsweek/), by Michael Isikoff and Mark Hosenball
Congress Must Investigate Spy Scandal (http://www.antiwar.com/orig/conyers.php?articleid=3488), by Rep. John Conyers
Defense Analyst Guilty in Israeli Espionage Case (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/05/AR2005100501608_pf.html), by Jerry Markon
F.B.I. Is Said to Brief Pentagon Bosses on Spy Case; Charges Are Possible (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/31/politics/campaign/31inquire.html?ex=1094923271&ei=1&en=b4e77a3947e930d6), by David Johnston and Eric Schmitt (registration required)
F.B.I. Said to Reach Official Suspected of Passing Secrets (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/29/politics/29spy.html?ex=1094742995&ei=1&en=688e4dbb7dc1d485), by James Risen (registration required)
FBI Furious at Leak (http://www.juancole.com/2004_08_01_juancole_archive.html#10938784348284908 6), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
FBI Has Probed Pentagon Analyst for a Year (http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040828/D84OFJA81.html), by Curt Anderson
FBI Informed White House of AIPAC Probe Two Years Ago (http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=6138716), by Adam Entous
FBI Interviews Senior Defense Officials in Probe of Analyst (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A47521-2004Aug30?language=printer), by Bradley Graham and Dan Eggen
FBI Probe Targets Pentagon Official (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A40004-2004Aug27?language=printer), by Bradley Graham and Thomas E. Ricks
FBI Probes Pentagon Spy Case (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml), by CBS News
FBI Questions Israeli Lobbyists in Spying Probe (http://fairuse.1accesshost.com/news2/latimes274.htm), by Richard B. Schmitt and Tyler Marshall
FBI espionage probe goes beyond Israeli allegations, sources say (http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/9524480.htm), by Warren P. Strobel
FBI investigates suspected Pentagon security breaches (http://news.ft.com/cms/s/344aa23c-0103-11d9-9d96-00000e2511c8.html), by Guy Dinmore
FBI investigating Pentagon official for alleged spying (http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2004-08-27-spy-pentagon_x.htm?csp=24&RM_Exclude=Juno), by Associated Press
FBI looks at Pentagon worker in Israel spy probe (http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/08/27/fbi.spy/index.html), by CNN
FBI painting ugly picture (http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/Columnists/Toronto/Eric_Margolis/2004/09/05/616439.html), by Eric Margolis (column)
FBI probe into leaked secrets embroils Israeli lobbying group (http://www.sundayherald.com/44533), by Ros Davidson
FBI probe into leaked secrets takes aim at AIPAC (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/556679.html), by Nathan Guttman
FBI probe of AIPAC said to go beyond alleged mole (http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/472644.html), by Haaretz Service
FBI probe of Pentagon extends to Iran stance (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2002024726_leaks03.html), by Warren P. Strobel
FBI probes 'spy suspect deep inside' the Pentagon (http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1293126,00.html), by Paul Harris
FBI probes DOD office (http://www.majority.com/news/upi-spy.htm), by Richard Sale
FBI seizes computer from AIPAC offices (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1093921795845), by Janine Zacharia
FBI steps up AIPAC probe (http://www.wpherald.com/North_America/storyview.php?StoryID=20041209-034208-9336r), by Richard Sale
FBI steps up AIPAC probe (http://www.washtimes.com/upi-breaking/20041208-045115-7516r.htm), by Richard Sale
Four AIPAC officials asked to testify in FBI investigation (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/509447.html), by Nathan Guttman
Franklin Met with Naor Gilon (http://www.juancole.com/2004_08_01_juancole_archive.html#10939321552545108 3), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
Franklin, Flipped (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001074.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
Friends in High Places (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=3497), by Justin Raimondo (blog entry)
Israel Has Long Spied on U.S., Say Officials (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2026&ncid=2026&e=8&u=/latimests/20040903/ts_latimes/israelhaslongspiedonussayofficials), by Bob Drogin and Greg Miller
Israel at Center of Spying Probe (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2026&ncid=2026&e=1&u=/latimests/20040828/ts_latimes/israelatcenterofspyingprobe), by Richard B. Schmitt and Mark Mazzetti
Israeli 'mole' investigation grows (http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0831/dailyUpdate.html), by Tom Regan
Israeli Spy in Pentagon Linked to AIPAC (http://www.juancole.com/2004_08_01_juancole_archive.html#10936817212187877 1), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
Israeli interests strong in office cited in spy case (http://www.iht.com/articles/537003.html), by Eric Schmitt
Israeli military attache met with alleged Pentagon mole (http://www.spacewar.com/2004/040906093726.5jl0pnfa.html), by Agence France Press
Israeli sources: Alleged spy had regular work ties with us (http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=470334&contrassID=1&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y), by Aluf Benn
Larry Franklin Affair, contd (http://justworldnews.org/archives/000858.html), by Helena Cobban (blog entry)
Leak Inquiry Includes Iran Experts in Administration (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A60497-2004Sep3?language=printer), by Robin Wright and Dan Eggen
Leak Probe More Than 2 Years Old (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A54494-2004Sep1.html?nav=rss_nation), by Susan Schmidt and Robin Wright
Making a mountain into a molehill (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/objects/pages/PrintArticleEn.jhtml?itemNo=470871), by Akiva Eldar
Mole Hunt (http://www.prospect.org/web/page.ww?section=root&name=ViewWeb&articleId=8467), by Jason Vest and Laura Rozen
More Investigations of Feith's Office (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001075.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
More on the FBI Investigation (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001092.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
New Spy Investigation Suppressed at Crucial Juncture (http://www.wrmea.com/archives/November_2004/0411026.html), by Richard H. Curtiss
New spy scandal comes as major blow to Israel, AIPAC (http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=10&categ_id=2&article_id=7909), by Hussein Ibish
Newsweek: Franklin Confesses, AIPAC Under Separate FBI Investigation (http://www.juancole.com/2004_08_01_juancole_archive.html#10938399424173329 0), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
Officials Say Publicity Derailed Secrets Inquiry (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/30/politics/30spy.html?ex=1094841390&ei=1&en=43cce4a544f1e489), by David Johnston and Eric Schmitt (registration required)
Pentagon Analyst Accused of Creating Web of Deception (http://fairuse.1accesshost.com/news3/latimes100.htm), by Richard B. Schmitt
Pentagon Office in Spying Case Was Focus of Iran Debate (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/02/politics/02pentagon.html?ex=1251864000&en=cbf5dc53bba3e43d&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland), by Eric Schmitt
Pentagon Official Suspected of Giving U.S. Secrets to Israel (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/28/politics/28spy.html?ex=1094661360&ei=1&en=0c0b68aef09d6b39), by James Risen (registration required)
Pentagon analyst 'passed secrets' (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4514153.stm), by the BBC
Pentagon analyst faces new charge (http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/05/24/pentagon.secrets/index.html), by Kevin Bohn
Pentagon man jailed over spying (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4633120.stm), by BBC
Pentagon/Israel Spying Case Expands: Fomenting a War on Iran (http://www.juancole.com/2004_08_01_juancole_archive.html#10937678551678636 0), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
Secretive Pentagon office target of FBI probe, sources say (http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/news/politics/9560493.htm), by James Gordon Meek
Source: Bush administration briefed about spy probe early (http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2004-09-03-whitehouse-spyprobe_x.htm), by Associated Press
Spies in the Pentagon? (http://www.lewrockwell.com/kwiatkowski/kwiatkowski91.html), by Karen Kwiatkowski (column)
Spy Probe Scans Neocons (http://www.lewrockwell.com/ips/lobe122.html), by Jim Lobe
Spy Scandal's Roots are Deep (http://www.juancole.com/2004_09_01_juancole_archive.html#10940238285032992 8), by Juan Cole (blog entry)
Subpoenas issued for officials of pro-Israel lobby group (http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/10315035.htm), by Warren P. Strobel and Shannon McCaffrey
The Axis of Treason (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=3469), by Justin Raimondo (blog entry)
The FBI investigation (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001067.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
The Israeli spying accusation: big questions! (http://justworldnews.org/archives/000857.html), by Helena Cobban (blog entry)
Think Again: 'Misplaced Feith' (http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=181113), by Eric Alterman and Paul McLeary
Two More Charged in Pentagon Leak (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/04/AR2005080401129.html), by Dan Eggen
U.S. accuses Israeli officials of spying (http://washingtontimes.com/world/20041215-101444-5836r.htm), by Joshua Mitnick
US examines 'Israeli spy' claim (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3607060.stm), by BBC
Updates on AIPAC spy case (http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001514.html), by Laura Rozen (blog entry)
What More Could They Possibly Want? (http://www.counterpunch.org/whitney08302004.html), by Mike Whitney (column)
White House remains silent on probe into alleged 'mole' (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/470409.html), by Nathan Guttman
Wider FBI Probe Of Pentagon Leaks Includes Chalabi (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A57595-2004Sep2?language=printer), by Robin Wright and Thomas E. Ricks

2- Israel's Transfer of American Military Technology to Hostile States.

CIA Asserts Israel Sold Arms Programs To Chinese Military (http://www.nti.org/db/missile/1993/m9303784.htm), by Michael R. Gordon
Defense Relations Between Israel and India Have Grown So Strong That Some Say Israel is Replacing Russia As India's Main Arms Supplier (http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=110713&contrassID=2&subContrassID=5&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y), by Amnon Barzilai
Israel Denies China Planes Have U.S. Technology, But Do They? (http://www.mideastfacts.com/radar_2_china.html), by Amnon Barzilai
Israel Selling U.S. Weapons to China (http://www.nti.org/db/missile/1998/m9808627.htm), by Duncan L. Clarke
Israel Transferring Laser Technology (http://www.mideastfacts.com/laser_2_china.html), by IsraelWire
Israel's Role in China's New Warplane (http://atimes.com/atimes/China/DL04Ad01.html), by David Isenberg
Israel's Unauthorized Retransfer of U.S. Technology Exposed (http://www.mideastfacts.com/9509008.html), by Shawn L. Twing
Israel's unbridled trade in arms (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/518037.html), by Yossi Melman
Israeli Defense Contract Illustrates How U.S. Aid Harms American Industries (http://www.mideastfacts.com/9610072.html), by Shawn L. Twing
Israeli Not Allowed Out in Nuclear Detonator Case (http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=4136729), by Robert Boczkiewicz
Look Who's Arming Beijing (http://www.mideastfacts.com/bucan_isrl.html), by Patrick Buchanan
Pentagon, GAO Report Israeli Espionage And Illegal Technology Retransfer (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0496/9604014.htm), by Shawn L. Twing
Report: Israel Won't Stop Selling Arms To India (http://www.mideastfacts.com/us_isrl_ndia.html), by Arieh O'Sullivan
Report: U.S. Slams Israel for Selling Arrow Know-how to India (http://www.mideastfacts.com/arrow_india.html), by Douglas Davis
Strange Bedfellows: China And Israel (http://www.foreigncorrespondent.com/archive/strange.html), by Eric S. Margolis
U.S. Anger at Israeli Arms Sales (http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_699000/699829.stm), by the BBC
U.S. Arms Sales to Israel End Up In China, Iraq (http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0509-07.htm), by Jonathan Reingold
U.S. Defense Sec'y Rebukes Israelis Bluntly on Sale of Radar Systems to China (http://www.nti.org/db/missile/2000/m0010913.htm), by William A Orme Jr.
U.S. Had to Wage Long Battle Against Israel's Technology Transfers to China (http://www.mideastfacts.com/9706070.html), by Donald Neff
U.S. Informs Israel of Missile Violation (http://www.nti.org/db/missile/1998/m9810696.htm), by IsraelWire
U.S. Military Technology Sold by Israel To China Upsets Asian Power Balance (http://www.mideastfacts.com/9601012.html), by Tim Kennedy
U.S. Upset By Israeli Arms Sales To India (http://www.mideastfacts.com/isrl_arms_2india.html), by Arieh O'Sullivan
US 'anger' at Israel weapons sale (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4101961.stm), by the BBC
US-Israel ties in crisis over arms sales to China (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/2C3521D1-8E5B-4F18-AA8B-B38B91D8BE76.htm), by Agence-France Press
What the Cox Report Does and Does Not Say About Israeli Technology Transfer to China (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0799/9907049.html), by Shawn L. Twing

3- Israel's Piracy of American Software and CDs

Israel Among the Leaders in Pirated Computer Software (http://www.mideastfacts.com/sftwr_isrl_worst.html), by IsraelWire
Israel Faces US Sanctions Over Software (http://www.mideastfacts.com/software_piracy.html), by Judy Dempsey
Israel to be Fined $150 Million for Software Piracy (http://www.mideastfacts.com/sftwr_prcy_fine.html), by Avi Blizovsky
US Industry Says Israel Major Source of CD Piracy (http://www.mideastfacts.com/cd_piracy.html), by IsraelWire

4- Israel's Weapons of Mass Destruction

Crash of Cargo Plane in Holland Revealed Existence of Israeli Chemical and Biological Weapons Plant (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/1298/9812019.html), by Victor Ostrovsky
Does Israel Have Smart Germs? (http://www.foreigncorrespondent.com/archive/genes.html), by Eric Margolis
Does Israel Have the Neutron Bomb? (http://www.nti.org/db/nuclear/1994/n9411479.htm), by the Center for Non-Proliferation Studies
Fears of New Arms Race As Israel Tests Cruise Missiles (http://www.nti.org/db/missile/2000/m0011200.htm), by Uzi Mahnaimi and Peter Conradi
Hide and Seek: Israel's Nuclear Game (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/1297/9712035.html), by Dr. Edna Homa Hunt
Israel Has Offensive Chemical, Biological Warfare Capabilities, Swedish Report Says (http://www.nti.org/d_newswire/issues/2006/1/6/E0C19A0B-C558-41A1-A5E9-917B69B2DBEA.html), by David Ruppe
Israel Reveals Secrets of How It Gained Bomb (http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2001/12/23/wnuke23.xml&sSheet=/news/2001/12/23/ixworld.html), by Inigo Gilmore
Israel's Covert Nuclear Program (http://www.foreigncorrespondent.com/archive/nuclear.html), by Eric Margolis
Israel's Nuclear Friends (http://www.nti.org/db/nuclear/1994/n9411478.htm), by the Center for Non-Proliferation Studies
Israel's Nuclear Weapons (http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/israel/nuke/farr.htm), by Warner D. Farr, LTC, U.S. Army
Israel's Weapons of Mass Destruction: A Summary (http://www.nti.org/db/nuclear/1993/n9314558.htm), by the Center for Non-Proliferation Studies
Israeli Nuclear Stockpile Undercuts U.S. Credibility at NPT Conference (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0695/9506012.htm), by Frank Collins
Israeli Weapons of Mass Destruction: A Threat to Peace (http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/STE203A.html), by John Steinbach
Mordechai Vanunu and Israel's Nukes (http://www.counterpunch.org/gaffney01312003.html), by Mark Gaffney
President Johnson Suppressed Reports that Israel Smuggled Nuclear Technologies from U.S. (http://www.mideastfacts.com/zionsoblbjliberty.html), by Joseph Sobran

Special focus on the ongoing case of nuclear technology smuggled to Israel from the U.S.:
Background: What is a Krytron? (http://www.ee.ualberta.ca/~schmaus/elect/pas5.html), by the University of Alberta's Dept of Electrical Engineering
Israel-Hollywood Nuclear Connection (http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/606092.asp), by Robert Windrem
Nuclear Trigger Dealer Arrested (http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/0,,3-2001253839,00.html), by Sam Kiley and Michael Evans
U.S. Man Admits Nuke-Linked Sale to Israel (http://www.upi.com/view.cfm?StoryID=28122001-080648-7543r), by Hil Anderson
U.S. Nuclear Technology Smuggled to Israel (http://www.film.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/Guardian/0,4029,530204,00.html), by Julian Borger
See also: The Great Krytron Caper (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/071585/850715006.html), by Najwa Sa'd

5- Israel's Attack on the U.S.S. Liberty

'Liberty' Survivors Can Never Forget (http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0603-32.htm), by David Rossie
America's Most Shameful Secret (http://www.foreigncorrespondent.com/archive/uss_liberty.html), by Eric Margolis
Attack on the Liberty: Lifting the 'Fog of War' (http://www.wrmea.com/archives/June_2004/0406026.html), by David C. Walsh
Book Says Israel Intended 1967 Attack on U.S. Ship (http://www.mideastfacts.com/risen_nyt_liberty.html), by James Risen
Cover Up of the Attack on the Liberty (http://www.counterpunch.org/weir10242003.html), by Sarah Weir
Dead in the Water (http://www.antiwar.com/ewens/ussliberty.html), by Mike Ewens
Even as U.S.S. Liberty's Heroic Captain Receives New Honor, Coverup of Israeli Attack on His Ship Continues (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0398/9803026.html), by Paul Findley
Friendless Fire? (http://www.usni.org/proceedings/Articles03/PROwalsh06.htm), by U.S. Naval Institute
Israel Attacks the United States (http://www.mideastfacts.com/1967-liberty.html), by David Paul
Israel's 1967 attack on U.S. ship deliberate, book says (http://www.mideastfacts.com/risen_nyt_liberty.html), by David Ensor
Israel: America's Deadliest Ally (http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/deadliest-ally.html), by Jeff Elkins
Israeli Attack on U.S. Navy Ship Led to Cover-Up (http://www.wrmea.com/archives/March_2004/0403009.html), by Admiral Thomas Moorer
National Security Agency Documents on Attack on USS Liberty Prove What? (http://www.wrmea.com/archives/sept03/0309025.html), by James M. Ennes
Navy Captain, Other Officials Call for Investigation of Israel's Attack on USS Liberty (http://www.wrmea.com/archives/july_aug2003/0307042.html), by Delinda C. Hanley
Our Friends, the Israelis (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j102703.html), by Justin Raimondo
The Assault on the U.S.S. Liberty Still Covered Up After 26 Years (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0693/9306019.htm), by James M. Ennes Jr.
The Israeli Attack on the U.S.S. Liberty, June 8, 1967, And the 32-Year Cover-up That Has Followed (http://www.mideastfacts.com/akins_liberty.html), by James E. Akins
The Liberty Cover-Up (http://www.mideastfacts.com/liberty_reese.html), by Charley Reese
The U.S.S. Liberty: A Demon That Won't Go Away (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/061686/860616005.html), by James M. Ennes, Jr.
The U.S.S. Liberty: Still Covered Up After 35 Years (http://www.yellowtimes.org/article.php?sid=399), by James Ennes
U.S.S. Liberty and Qana Massacre Compared (http://www.mideastfacts.com/liberty_qana_cmpr.html), by Mark Genrich
U.S.S. Liberty: Periscope Photography May Finally Reveal Truth (http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0697/9706019.htm), by James M. Ennes, Jr.
U.S.S. Liberty: Questions Persist (http://www.mideastfacts.com/liberty_moorer.html), by Thomas H. Moorer
U.S.S. Liberty: The Cover-Up (http://www.mideastfacts.com/bamford_liberty_extrct.html), by James Bamford
When Israel Attacked the U.S.S. Liberty (http://www.counterpunch.org/stclair1126.html), by Jeffrey St. Clair
When Israel Attacked the USS Liberty (http://www.counterpunch.org/stclair1126.html), by Jeffrey St. Clair

6- Special Focus: Did Israel Know About the WTC Attacks in Advance - And Fail to Warn Us?

Articles have appeared in major foreign news sources and scattered American ones about Israeli intelligence agents who appear to have been monitoring the 9/11 terrorists for up to several years, but Israel did not pass this information on to the U.S. government so that there was no American surveillance of the hijackers. What was this about? The articles in this section are largely by a single columnist, Justin Raimondo; he provides links to further resources that you should read and judge for yourself. There is an overall lack of serious investigation into 9/11 and into the intelligence failures that allowed it to happen. This is only part of the story, but it should raise some questions about whether America's interests are the same as Israel's interests.

Israel Spying on U.S.? (http://www.mideastfacts.com/fox_4part_onisrl_911.html) - A Fox News report by Carl Cameron with Brit Hume. Cameron looks into evidence of Israeli espionage against the U.S. (see links above) and indications that the alleged spies may have known in advance about the WTC attacks.
Israel and 9/11 (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j112801.html) - An article by American commentator Justin Raimondo. Raimondo discusses other trouble Israel is causing the U.S. then comes to the question of whether or not Israeli spies could have known in advance about the WTC attacks. Note that Raimondo wrote this before the Fox News report was released.
Et Tu, Israel? (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j121401.html) - Another article by Justin Raimondo. Raimondo now reacts to the Fox News report and hopes that this will finally cause the U.S. to re-evaluate its special relationship with Israel.
9/11 - What Was Israel's Role? (http://www.mediamonitors.net/justin18.html) - A third article by Justin Raimondo. Raimondo examines further implications of possible Israeli involvement.
The 9/11 Enigma (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j121901.html) - Justin Raimondo continues to look at the question of Israeli involvement in 9/11, drawing together several other threads in the investigation, ones pointing to a very ominous conclusion.
The Secret War (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j122101.html) - Justin Raimondo looks further at the depth of the Israeli involvement and what context it gives the 9/11 attacks.
9/11: The Truth Comes Out (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j030802.html) - Justin Raimondo returns to the story in the wake of the news that Israeli spies have been deported.
The 'Urban Myth' Gambit: Apologists 'Spin' Israel's Spy Operation in the U.S. (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j031302.html) - Justin Raimondo examines responses to the Israeli spy ring story and analyzes the evidence.
Israel Versus America: The Secret War is Now Out in the Open (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j031502.html) - Justin Raimondo continues to explore the implications of this story.
The Truth, At Last: Leaked Gov't Report Exposes Israeli Spy Ring (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j032202.html) - Justin Raimondo asks some tough questions about the true extent of Israel's involvement in 9/11.
The Story of the Century (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j051002.html) - Justin Raimondo looks at the coverage of this story and again at its implications.
Spinning a Spy Scandal (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j051502.html) - Justin Raimondo examines attempts by pro-Israel commentators to minimize the story, and whether they are right to.
America Awakes (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j052002.html) - Justin Raimondo examines the recent stories that the Bush Administration knew in advance, and continues to ask why Israeli foreknowledge is not being looked into further.
Investigate 9/11 (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j052202.html) - Justin Raimondo calls for a real investigation into what was going on leading up to 9/11 including the Israeli espionage angle.
Unsolved Mysteries of 9/11 (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j053102.html) - Justin Raimondo looks at various strange news stories surrounding 9/11 and who knew what when, including the several stories relating to Mossad agents that have never been fully explained.
Treason is the Reason (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j062102.html) - Justin Raimondo alleges that Israeli intelligence was working within the FBI to sabotage its investigations of terrorist cases, including 9/11. As he says, this goes beyond foreknowledge of 9/11 to active facilitation of it, a theme he will return to later.
9/11 Revised Edition (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j070802.html) - Justin Raimondo looks at the penetration of the FBI by Israeli intelligence and what role this may have played in 9/11.
I Have in My Hands a List (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j072602.html) - Although Justin Raimondo's article is largely about what he sees as the malevolence of the Israeli government, it continues to follow up on the Israeli spies story and evidence that the Israeli spy ring is directly connected to the 9/11 attacks.
9/11: What Did Israel Know? (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j100402.html) - Justin Raimondo returns to the Israeli spies story yet again as the story appears in the BBC.
Debunking the Myth of 9/11 (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j111802.html) - Justin Raimondo doubts that the inquiry into 9/11 will come anywhere near the real truth, then he sets out his own theory about what happened.
By Way of Deception (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j120902.html) - Justin Raimondo analyzes reports that the Mossad attempted to set up a phony "al-Qa'ida cell" in Palestine and speculates on what other phony al-Qa'ida cells it may have set up. See "further speculations" at the bottom of this page for more information
9/11 - Who Knew? (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j121802.html) - Justin Raimondo calls for an investigation into whether the Mossad was doing more than just spying on the 9/11 hijackers.
Five Israelis were seen filming as jet liners ploughed into the Twin Towers on September 11, 2001 (http://ww1.sundayherald.com/37707) - Neil Mackay of the Sunday Herald proves that it's not just Justin Raimondo following this story.
Kean on the Truth (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j121903.html) - Could 9/11 have been prevented? A new report by the 9/11 commission says yes. Justin Raimondo comments on this and continues to push the Israeli angle.
Ghosts of 9/11 (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=3539) - On the third anniversary of 9/11, Justin Raimondo reviews the state of play on this story and makes some additional remarks about the Israeli spy case at the Pentagon.
Israel's Fifth Column in Washington: The AIPAC spy scandal points to a massive undercover operation (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=4178) - Justin Raimondo wonders if the ongoing scandal involving Israeli spies at the Pentagon is connected with other Israeli espionage operations.
Israel and 9/11: New Report Connects the Dots (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=7127) - Justin Raimondo reports on the Philadelphia Times-Herald's report (http://www.timesherald.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15114089&BRD=1672&PAG=461&dept_id=33380&rfi=6) on a memo (http://www.antiwar.com/rep2/MemorandumtotheCommissionandSelectCommitteesbold.p df) (PDF) analyzing the DEA report (http://cryptome.org/dea-il-spy.htm) on the Israeli art students who may have been tracking the hjackers before 9/11. The memo is by lawyer Gerald Shea and was sent to the 9/11 Commission.
High-Fivers and Art Student Spies (http://www.counterpunch.org/ketcham03072007.html) - In a Counterpunch special investigation, Christopher Ketcham takes another look at the story.

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 11:11 AM

Abso, really. Ok, we get it, you think Israel sucks and want all of us to agree. We get it.

abso

09-05-2010, 11:17 AM

Abso, really. Ok, we get it, you think Israel sucks and want all of us to agree. We get it.

no, you dont get it, and i am not saying israel sucks, i am just saying its not your friend, israel have harmed the american interests more than the arabs will ever do.

and before defending israel and liking it, read some articles, i think thats a large collection which i posted, and all written by americans and israelis, not arabs.

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 11:23 AM

no, you dont get it, and i am not saying israel sucks, i am just saying its not your friend, israel have harmed the american interests more than the arabs will ever do.

and before defending israel and liking it, read some articles, i think thats a large collection which i posted, and all written by americans and israelis, not arabs.

Israel is much more our friend than Palestinians or most Muslims. Note, that does not compute to 'most Muslims are terrorists.' That would be an incorrect leap.

abso

09-05-2010, 11:52 AM

Israel is much more our friend than Palestinians or most Muslims. Note, that does not compute to 'most Muslims are terrorists.' That would be an incorrect leap.

how is israel much more friend than the palestinians ?

palestinians just have problems with israel not USA, so why are you talking about them like if those problems are yours ???, if USA just stops interfering in every conflict in this world, it would have been alot better for the american people.

can you tell me, as an american citizen, what have you gained from Iraq war, or Afghanistan, or Golf War, or Vietnam, i dont see and benifit for the american people, it was just useless wars, none has ever attacked the USA soil, but when USA cant find any enemies of its own, it just go and fighter the enemies of others, palestine maybe an enemy, but not yours, its the enemy of israel, and israel is not the state number 51.

you say that the arabs are your enemy because 9/11, so, before 9/11, why was the arabs your enemy, why were you and your government supporting israel.

before 9/11, have the arabs ever attacked USA in any way ?

billions of dollar are spent for israel's sake, and for the security of israel, not the security of america, as i said before, Iran, Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan, all those countries, have never had any problem with USA, just israel, but its USA is the one who have problems with them now.

if USA just forgot about all those conflicts and spent this money on developing its civilization even more and more, that will be the best for its citizens.

anyway, can you tell me how is israel your friend ?

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 12:00 PM

how is israel much more friend than the palestinians ?

palestinians just have problems with israel not USA, so why are you talking about them like if those problems are yours ???, if USA just stops interfering in every conflict in this world, it would have been alot better for the american people.

can you tell me, as an american citizen, what have you gained from Iraq war, or Afghanistan, or Golf War, or Vietnam, i dont see and benifit for the american people, it was just useless wars, none has ever attacked the USA soil, but when USA cant find any enemies of its own, it just go and fighter the enemies of others, palestine maybe an enemy, but not yours, its the enemy of israel, and israel is not the state number 51.

you say that the arabs are your enemy because 9/11, so, before 9/11, why was the arabs your enemy, why were you and your government supporting israel.

before 9/11, have the arabs ever attacked USA in any way ?

billions of dollar are spent for israel's sake, and for the security of israel, not the security of america, as i said before, Iran, Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan, all those countries, have never had any problem with USA, just israel, but its USA is the one who have problems with them now.

if USA just forgot about all those conflicts and spent this money on developing its civilization even more and more, that will be the best for its citizens.

anyway, can you tell me how is israel your friend ?

Where did I write 'Arabs?'

abso

09-05-2010, 12:14 PM

Where did I write 'Arabs?'

okay, then you said muslims, how can be the muslims your enemies ?

and how can israel be your friend ?

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 12:23 PM

okay, then you said muslims, how can be the muslims your enemies ?

and how can israel be your friend ?

Israel is our only ally in ME that views the world as we do. Pro-democracy, pro-human rights, pro-capitalism, pro-peace.

The only reason there is not Palestine has been the decisions made by the Palestinians and their allies.

The real picture is not Israel v Palestinians, it's Palestinians v themselves.

BoogyMan

09-05-2010, 12:43 PM

Wow, you just stole a whole web page full of content and pasted it here as your own work.

Very interesting. (http://www.muhajabah.com/israel.htm)

abso

09-05-2010, 12:50 PM

Wow, you just stole a whole web page full of content and pasted it here as your own work.

Very interesting. (http://www.muhajabah.com/israel.htm)

i never said its my own work, ever since i joined this forum, i have been posting the articles written by americans and israelians, i have said that many times, so when did i say that this collection is my own work !!!

this articles is not my own, and not even the collector work, he just collected a big collection of articles, written by americans, and i copied those links here, is that wrong !!!

abso

09-05-2010, 12:54 PM

Israel is our only ally in ME that views the world as we do. Pro-democracy, pro-human rights, pro-capitalism, pro-peace.

The only reason there is not Palestine has been the decisions made by the Palestinians and their allies.

The real picture is not Israel v Palestinians, it's Palestinians v themselves.

pro-human rights ???
pro-peace ???

where is the human rights in using white phosphorus in gaza war ?

where is the peace in occupying the lands of others and refusing to get out ?

how is israel your ally while it refuses the repeated requests from USA to stop building in the settlements and east jerusalem ????

nearly all the human rights organizations on earth condemn israel, and you say that israel is pro-human rights !!!, is this a joke ???

why you think that palestine is the one who doesnt want peace, have israel agreed to give back the occupied lands for peace ???, when israel agrees to get out of the land, then you can say that they want peace, but how can you say that while they refuse to stop building settlements and refuse to stop moving their civilians into the occupied lands in a clear violation to the geneva convention and international law !!!

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 01:02 PM

pro-human rights ???
pro-peace ???

where is the human rights in using white phosphorus in gaza war ?

where is the peace in occupying the lands of others and refusing to get out ?

how is israel your ally while it refuses the repeated requests from USA to stop building in the settlements and east jerusalem ????

nearly all the human rights organizations on earth condemn israel, and you say that israel is pro-human rights !!!, is this a joke ???

why you think that palestine is the one who doesnt want peace, have israel agreed to give back the occupied lands for peace ???, when israel agrees to get out of the land, then you can say that they want peace, but how can you say that while they refuse to stop building settlements and refuse to stop moving their civilians into the occupied lands in a clear violation to the geneva convention and international law !!!

You are a tool. If Israel 'gave in' to all the demands, it would just lead to more attacks. Why? It's ultimate destruction is the goal, to say not is just fooling yourself.

Israel hasn't attacked anyone in ME, unless attacked first.

abso

09-05-2010, 01:16 PM

You are a tool. If Israel 'gave in' to all the demands, it would just lead to more attacks. Why? It's ultimate destruction is the goal, to say not is just fooling yourself.

Israel hasn't attacked anyone in ME, unless attacked first.

was israel attacked in 1967 ???

many of you thinks that it was attacked first or that there was an intention of first attack so israel started it to protect itself.

but as Abraham Lincoln said:
"Allow the president to invade a neighboring nation, whenever he shall deem it necessary to repel an invasion, and you allow him to do so whenever he may choose to say he deems it necessary for such a purpose - and you allow him to make war at pleasure."

and anyway, the current situation is not the same, who can destroy israel, none else than egypt has enough power to stand against israel in a complete war, and egypt signed a peace treaty, and we dont want to go to war, we have no interest in war with israel, we got all our land back.

so who will destroy israel if it given back all the occupied lands, the palestinians cant destroy it, and if israel give the land back, there will be UN troops to protect the borders between countries, so stop using this destruction excuse.

its just that israel doesnt want to give east jerusalem back, they already announced the annexation of east jerusalem, and they refuse to give it back, while none in the world recognize this annexation, so the problem now is israel.

stop saying that palestinians wants to destroy israel, that does not matter, when we give them their land back, only then we can blame them if they attack israel.

but how can you blame them now when they attack and israelian solider who is standing on their land, thats called an occupation, and thats called a legal resistance.

i am not talking about attacking civilians, that not something i support, i condemn those actions, but i will never condemn them when they attack the israelian army, because that a legal resistance to an illegal occupation.

thats why Geneva Convention forbid the occupation from moving a part of its civilian population into the occupied lands, because they will be caught in fire with the resistance, but israel is ignoring the international law, and moving more and more of its civilians into the occupied lands, despite of the requests from USA to stop doing that, they just dont listen to anyone and dont respect anyone or anything, not the international law, not the Geneva Convention, not the law of war, not the USA itself, you are just nothing more than a tool to israel, a tool to achieve their goals and use the VETO right for their interests not yours.

american always justify the palestinian children death as a casuality of war against Hamas, and says that Hamas is responsible because they fight israel, then why dont you say that israelian civilians deaths is also a casuality of war, because israel is fighting palestine and doesnt want to give them their land back, israel is moving their civilians in a land considered by the internatiol law as an occupied land, so why dont you think that its israel fault for moving them into a war zone, where the palestinian resistance is attacking.

why dont israel just give back east jerusalem and west bank, then they can condemn palestine as much as they want if they attacked after that ???

you cant condemn the resistance, without condemning the occupation forces, its not their right to be there, so stop justifying it by saying that hamas wants to destroy israel, because they wont be able to do so with or without their land, just give them the land, then destroy them if they attacked after that.

Kathianne

09-05-2010, 01:26 PM

Not all Muslims are terrorists, but most terrorists today are Muslim.

Israel gets US support, very unlikely to change.

Now why would Israel be so unbending about making 'peace' with those whose own constitution of ruling party calls for its destruction?

Wherever young Muslims have the numbers, trouble certainly follows:

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2010/09/027153.php

THE HATE THAT OPENLY SPEAKS ITS NAME

September 4, 2010 Posted by John at 9:10 AM
One of the most chilling phenomena of our time is the resurgence of anti-Semitism in Europe. The dirty work, the threats and violence that are causing Jews to leave Europe, is carried out more or less exclusively by young Muslim immigrants. But implicit sanction for anti-Semitism comes straight from the top, as top European political, business and social leaders make little effort to hide their contempt for Jews.

The most recent case is that of Karel De Gucht, the European trade commissioner. On Thursday he gave an interview to a Belgian radio station, in the course of which he volunteered his opinions on the Jews:

On Thursday, with the Middle East peace process in the news, Mr. De Gucht picked yet another fight. Jews, he told Belgian radio, have a "belief" that they are "always right." He described his frustration at debating the Middle East because "it is not easy even with a moderate Jew to have a conversation."

He continued: "Don't underestimate the power of the Jewish lobby in the capital. That is best organized lobby in the states. And they have an influence on politicians, Republicans and Democrats."

The unreasonableness of Israeli Jews, as best I can understand it, consists of not wanting to be bombed or shot. When De Gucht's observations were criticized, he followed up with the usual pro forma apology:

"I gave an interview yesterday to the Flemish radio. I was also asked about the Middle East peace talks. I gave my personal point of view. I regret that the comments that I made have been interpreted in a sense that I did not intend. I did not mean in any possible way to cause offense or stigmatize the Jewish Community. I want to make clear that anti-Semitism has no place in today's world and is fundamentally against our European values."

I suppose Jews can be excused for questioning whether history supports the claim that anti-Semitism is "fundamentally against...European values." For whatever reason, we don't seem to see the same resurgence in the U.S. that is happening in Europe. I would say with considerably more confidence that anti-Semitism is fundamentally against American values.

http://blogs.wsj.com/brussels/2010/09/03/eu-commissioner-in-trouble-for-remarks-on-jews/

Gaffer

09-05-2010, 02:35 PM

was israel attacked in 1967 ???

many of you thinks that it was attacked first or that there was an intention of first attack so israel started it to protect itself.

but as Abraham Lincoln said:
"Allow the president to invade a neighboring nation, whenever he shall deem it necessary to repel an invasion, and you allow him to do so whenever he may choose to say he deems it necessary for such a purpose - and you allow him to make war at pleasure."

and anyway, the current situation is not the same, who can destroy israel, none else than egypt has enough power to stand against israel in a complete war, and egypt signed a peace treaty, and we dont want to go to war, we have no interest in war with israel, we got all our land back.

so who will destroy israel if it given back all the occupied lands, the palestinians cant destroy it, and if israel give the land back, there will be UN troops to protect the borders between countries, so stop using this destruction excuse.

its just that israel doesnt want to give east jerusalem back, they already announced the annexation of east jerusalem, and they refuse to give it back, while none in the world recognize this annexation, so the problem now is israel.

stop saying that palestinians wants to destroy israel, that does not matter, when we give them their land back, only then we can blame them if they attack israel.

but how can you blame them now when they attack and israelian solider who is standing on their land, thats called an occupation, and thats called a legal resistance.

i am not talking about attacking civilians, that not something i support, i condemn those actions, but i will never condemn them when they attack the israelian army, because that a legal resistance to an illegal occupation.

thats why Geneva Convention forbid the occupation from moving a part of its civilian population into the occupied lands, because they will be caught in fire with the resistance, but israel is ignoring the international law, and moving more and more of its civilians into the occupied lands, despite of the requests from USA to stop doing that, they just dont listen to anyone and dont respect anyone or anything, not the international law, not the Geneva Convention, not the law of war, not the USA itself, you are just nothing more than a tool to israel, a tool to achieve their goals and use the VETO right for their interests not yours.

american always justify the palestinian children death as a casuality of war against Hamas, and says that Hamas is responsible because they fight israel, then why dont you say that israelian civilians deaths is also a casuality of war, because israel is fighting palestine and doesnt want to give them their land back, israel is moving their civilians in a land considered by the internatiol law as an occupied land, so why dont you think that its israel fault for moving them into a war zone, where the palestinian resistance is attacking.

why dont israel just give back east jerusalem and west bank, then they can condemn palestine as much as they want if they attacked after that ???

you cant condemn the resistance, without condemning the occupation forces, its not their right to be there, so stop justifying it by saying that hamas wants to destroy israel, because they wont be able to do so with or without their land, just give them the land, then destroy them if they attacked after that.

The 67 war started because 6 arab armies were massed along Israel's border. They had a choice. Stand by and let the arab armies over run them or strike first and through them into disarray. They chose to strike first. The first target was the biggest threat. The Egyptian air force. without air cover the Egyptian army was at the mercy of the Israeli's. They took lots more territory than they kept. Egypt got the entire Sinai back after the war. Israel kept lands that they could use to keep the invading armies out. It wasn't enough as in 73 the arabs attacked again. Israel added more territory. Seeing they couldn't defeat Israel militarily the arabs shifted gears and began using terror attacks. They also began the promotion of pals as victims.

It all centers around islam and the determination that anything that once belonged to islam should be brought back under islam.

As for when was the US attacked by muslims before 9/11? We can start with 1979 in iran, the Mairne barracks bombing, hijackings, embassy bombings, USS Cole, there's a long list of attacks against the US by muslims. Most people here just didn't know there was a war on.

As for un peace keepers on the borders of Israel, that is a joke. The un troops would help the arabs set up the rockets and aim them. They might transfer some of those rapists from the congo in to help with security. They could even hand carry all the un resolutions condemning Israel for existing.

NightTrain

09-05-2010, 08:24 PM

was israel attacked in 1967 ???

They were about to be, and no rational person would deny it.

many of you thinks that it was attacked first or that there was an intention of first attack so israel started it to protect itself.

Do yourself a favor and research what happened yourself, by non-arab sources. The attack was coming, and very quickly. Only a fool would have ignored the impending invasion on multiple fronts.

and anyway, the current situation is not the same, who can destroy israel, none else than egypt has enough power to stand against israel in a complete war, and egypt signed a peace treaty, and we dont want to go to war, we have no interest in war with israel, we got all our land back.

Egypt doesn't have the capability to take on Israel, they've tried a few times and got their asses whipped from one end of the desert to the other.

Even more impressively, Israel beat the snot out of Egypt while simultaneously fighting two other countries.

so who will destroy israel if it given back all the occupied lands, the palestinians cant destroy it, and if israel give the land back, there will be UN troops to protect the borders between countries, so stop using this destruction excuse.

Every time Israel has pulled back and given back land, it has been viewed as a weakness by the Arabs and only encouraged more attacks on Israel.

No UN country is interested in acting as a meat shield between the palestinians and Israel. All that would do is give the muslim terrorists extra targets for bombs, rockets and kids with their shiny new bomb belts.

its just that israel doesnt want to give east jerusalem back, they already announced the annexation of east jerusalem, and they refuse to give it back, while none in the world recognize this annexation, so the problem now is israel.

No, the problem is the mindless peasants that refuse to wake up and blindly accept propaganda (you are included) and half-truths as to what has happened to get where things are now. Your religious fanatic leaders that whip the masses into a frenzy to distract the ignorant and misled peasants from the real problems with their governments and barbaric religious customs are precisely the reason why the attacks continue.

You obviously think that Israel should give back everything that they have gained in ill-conceived attempts by Egypt, Syria and Lebanon to "wipe Israel from the face of the earth". This is a foolish notion.

Pacifism will only invite more bloodshed. You Arabs have proven this time after time. Every time Israel pulled back, they were rewarded with renewed attacks from the very land they "gave back."

Since Egypt, Syria, Lebanon have learned that they are unable to take out Israel in legitimate combat, they have resorted to funding and supplying the displaced Arabs (palestinians) who found themselves on the other side of the border after multiple wars and encouraged terrorist activities.

I would suggest that you drop your weak attempts at portraying yourself as objective and simply proclaim your hatred for Israel and all it stands for. You are not impartial and clearly have an axe to grind with Israel. Probably because you have been lied to by your local Imam or Cleric or Al-Jezeera or whoever you get your disinformation from.

Stop with your false claims that you support peace - you are not fooling anyone but yourself.

BoogyMan

09-05-2010, 08:29 PM

It is proper to site your source, anything else is plagiarism. I does matter where you pilfer your information from as it goes to either building or erasing credibility.

i never said its my own work, ever since i joined this forum, i have been posting the articles written by americans and israelians, i have said that many times, so when did i say that this collection is my own work !!!

this articles is not my own, and not even the collector work, he just collected a big collection of articles, written by americans, and i copied those links here, is that wrong !!!

KarlMarx

09-05-2010, 09:15 PM

SassyLady

09-08-2010, 01:25 AM

They were about to be, and no rational person would deny it.

Do yourself a favor and research what happened yourself, by non-arab sources. The attack was coming, and very quickly. Only a fool would have ignored the impending invasion on multiple fronts.

Egypt doesn't have the capability to take on Israel, they've tried a few times and got their asses whipped from one end of the desert to the other.

Even more impressively, Israel beat the snot out of Egypt while simultaneously fighting two other countries.

Every time Israel has pulled back and given back land, it has been viewed as a weakness by the Arabs and only encouraged more attacks on Israel.

No UN country is interested in acting as a meat shield between the palestinians and Israel. All that would do is give the muslim terrorists extra targets for bombs, rockets and kids with their shiny new bomb belts.

No, the problem is the mindless peasants that refuse to wake up and blindly accept propaganda (you are included) and half-truths as to what has happened to get where things are now. Your religious fanatic leaders that whip the masses into a frenzy to distract the ignorant and misled peasants from the real problems with their governments and barbaric religious customs are precisely the reason why the attacks continue.

You obviously think that Israel should give back everything that they have gained in ill-conceived attempts by Egypt, Syria and Lebanon to "wipe Israel from the face of the earth". This is a foolish notion.

Pacifism will only invite more bloodshed. You Arabs have proven this time after time. Every time Israel pulled back, they were rewarded with renewed attacks from the very land they "gave back."

Since Egypt, Syria, Lebanon have learned that they are unable to take out Israel in legitimate combat, they have resorted to funding and supplying the displaced Arabs (palestinians) who found themselves on the other side of the border after multiple wars and encouraged terrorist activities.

I would suggest that you drop your weak attempts at portraying yourself as objective and simply proclaim your hatred for Israel and all it stands for. You are not impartial and clearly have an axe to grind with Israel. Probably because you have been lied to by your local Imam or Cleric or Al-Jezeera or whoever you get your disinformation from.

Stop with your false claims that you support peace - you are not fooling anyone but yourself.

Wow ... NT.... thanks for the summary and the WWW smackdown. Glad you are on our side!!!

revelarts

09-08-2010, 07:52 AM

jimnyc

09-08-2010, 09:54 AM

Abso

I'm not going to pretend to be a board moderator or speak on behalf of the board owners...

but

if you post anything from another source, you're supposed to post one or two paragraphs, then a link to the rest of the article....

that way the board doesn't run into problems with United States Copyright laws....

THANK YOU!

I was going to give him a little leeway then drop the hammer, as I get accused of bias if I ask someone persistently to post their sources. But in Abso's case, I think sometimes he just doesn't want us to know where he dug up his tripe.

Little-Acorn

09-08-2010, 10:21 AM

no, you dont get it, and i am not saying israel sucks, i am just saying its not your friend,

Does abso EVER post her without telling lies???

What, exactly, is the point of reading his stuff? Aside from letting him spread his bilge?

It's not as if there was any chance of changing his mind on this stuff. Sort of like trying to persuade a pig to stop grunting and squealing. What's the point?

SassyLady

09-08-2010, 10:15 PM

Does abso EVER post her without telling lies???

What, exactly, is the point of reading his stuff? Aside from letting him spread his bilge?

It's not as if there was any chance of changing his mind on this stuff. Sort of like trying to persuade a pig to stop grunting and squealing. What's the point?

Sharpening our debating skills? Checking our belief systems? Getting a taste of what it's like on the other side? I find it refreshing and scary at the same time ... like bungee jumping ... where you scream OMG!!! one minute and the next minute hysterical laughter because you survived!

revelarts

09-11-2010, 08:35 AM

Abso,

Cricket.... Cricket .... Cricket....

abso

09-16-2010, 02:03 PM

They were about to be, and no rational person would deny it.

Do yourself a favor and research what happened yourself, by non-arab sources. The attack was coming, and very quickly. Only a fool would have ignored the impending invasion on multiple fronts.

Egypt doesn't have the capability to take on Israel, they've tried a few times and got their asses whipped from one end of the desert to the other.

Even more impressively, Israel beat the snot out of Egypt while simultaneously fighting two other countries.

Every time Israel has pulled back and given back land, it has been viewed as a weakness by the Arabs and only encouraged more attacks on Israel.

No UN country is interested in acting as a meat shield between the palestinians and Israel. All that would do is give the muslim terrorists extra targets for bombs, rockets and kids with their shiny new bomb belts.

No, the problem is the mindless peasants that refuse to wake up and blindly accept propaganda (you are included) and half-truths as to what has happened to get where things are now. Your religious fanatic leaders that whip the masses into a frenzy to distract the ignorant and misled peasants from the real problems with their governments and barbaric religious customs are precisely the reason why the attacks continue.

You obviously think that Israel should give back everything that they have gained in ill-conceived attempts by Egypt, Syria and Lebanon to "wipe Israel from the face of the earth". This is a foolish notion.

Pacifism will only invite more bloodshed. You Arabs have proven this time after time. Every time Israel pulled back, they were rewarded with renewed attacks from the very land they "gave back."

Since Egypt, Syria, Lebanon have learned that they are unable to take out Israel in legitimate combat, they have resorted to funding and supplying the displaced Arabs (palestinians) who found themselves on the other side of the border after multiple wars and encouraged terrorist activities.

I would suggest that you drop your weak attempts at portraying yourself as objective and simply proclaim your hatred for Israel and all it stands for. You are not impartial and clearly have an axe to grind with Israel. Probably because you have been lied to by your local Imam or Cleric or Al-Jezeera or whoever you get your disinformation from.

Stop with your false claims that you support peace - you are not fooling anyone but yourself.

i never watch Al-Jezeera, they actually hate and attack egypt nearly everyday in their shows.

i rarely go to the mosque, i am not too religious as many of you think, i just pray at home.

i have never talked to any Imam in my life before.

All my info and posts comes from american writers, so stop crying and whining about my sources, and go to talk with the writers, i just post their work.

abso

09-16-2010, 02:04 PM

It is proper to site your source, anything else is plagiarism. I does matter where you pilfer your information from as it goes to either building or erasing credibility.

the while article is full with sources, its all articles with links to them, what source do you need !!!

abso

09-16-2010, 02:05 PM

Abso

I'm not going to pretend to be a board moderator or speak on behalf of the board owners...

but

if you post anything from another source, you're supposed to post one or two paragraphs, then a link to the rest of the article....

that way the board doesn't run into problems with United States Copyright laws....

the articles is not copyrighted, its just a collection of american articles, made by someone, and the links is considered sources.

abso

09-16-2010, 02:14 PM

Abso, you've made some very good points. in the begining.
if you remember ,in another thread, I mentioned that I perceive Israel in a lot of ways as a freeloading and unscrupulous family member.
the Spying and heavy handed political influence is mainly what gets me.

the liberty is very bad too. and seems to have been a joint US gov't and Israel gov't false flag project. the 911 stuff I think I can find more arabs on the planes than Israels, and more U.S. gov't people who dropped the ball. (maybe carried the ball) and more than a few middle eastern terrorist sympathizers who, while not involved personally, where probably dancing to to see the great satan take a hit.(I think most Muslims were shocked and saddened by 911 like the rest of the world and most Israels and Jews were though)

Israel is not a perfect Ally but as KathiAnne points out they do share some democratic values. And Share the basic of faith as well.

But Abso you seem very ready to paint the Israelis with a dark brush. since your very interested with the middle east could you give us a picture of how the middle eastern kings and dictators and millitarys are our friends and ways that they are not. I love to see a similar list of offenses of a few middle eastern countries.

But you've also made lot about the Israel boarder. Please gives us an Honest answer here. If the boarders went back to .. wherever you think they should go. Do you really believe that Israel could live in peace from that point on? That the other countries would completely be satisfied at that point? And not continue to castigate Israels existence?
Please give me an honest yes, no or maybe to these question?

I will never be sure if the palestinians will attack after they get their land back or not, but all i can say, is that egypt will never be a part of any conflict against israel as long as they dont attack egypt, we got all our land back, and we have nothing to fight israel for.

what i can say about that is: if israel gave the land back then it got attacked, only at that point none can blame it, but i cant just keep the lands of others assuming that they will attack me if i gave them back without even trying.

and even if israel is attacked after giving the land back, who will attack it ????, it will be just the weak palestinian resistance, no real army will be involved at all, so there will be no trouble at all in bombing them again, am i right ????

And you still haven't answered my Palestinian question from the other thread?
ALL the middle eastern Countries cry about the injustices done to the their brothers, the Palestinians, but they won't let their brothers settle in their countries and they often keep them corralled in squalid refuge camps as well? Why? why the loud Out crys about Israel but no actions to help their brothers live with them.

as i said before, egypt has more than 22 million under the poverty line, so can you tell me, how can we sustain more 7 millions!!!, we dont have any money to feed them or to take care of them.

and about the other arabian countries, they dont have to let anyone in, palestinians have their own lands, and they dont have to give them up, will you just leave america if its occupied by russia, or will you fight for your own country !!!

don't try the Mexican boarder answer again that won't fly. we don't claim Mexicans as brother, even though they are neighbors. (and in God's eye's as well our brothers.) And we aren't constantly wailing about the Mexican gov'ts treatment of Mexicans to the rest of the world. And we don't don't keep Mexicans in camps .. not yet anyway.

thats my answer to your questions, pardon me if i am late in answering to any of the replies, because i will be too busy with my studies.

abso

09-16-2010, 02:18 PM

NightTrain

10-02-2010, 01:12 PM

Have anyone even read any article from the links or you all just attacking me without even caring if am telling the truth or not !!!!!!!!!!

read anything, then come and debate about it, stop replying to any of my posts if you are not welling to discuss the article, you are just discussing my personality, my religion, my likings, none is trying to read or to discuss anything about the post, except revelarts who seems to be moderate in his discussions.

Of course I care if you're telling the truth, that's why I took the time to point out where you were completely wrong and my guess as to why.

Just because you found inaccurate articles authored by American writers does not mean that the article itself is truthful or correct. We have idiots in this country too, you know.

To prove this point, I can create an article describing how Mohammed River Danced around sheep and camels in a pink dress for 40 days and 40 nights while singing The Dreidel Song.

abso

10-04-2010, 10:41 AM

Of course I care if you're telling the truth, that's why I took the time to point out where you were completely wrong and my guess as to why.

Just because you found inaccurate articles authored by American writers does not mean that the article itself is truthful or correct. We have idiots in this country too, you know.

To prove this point, I can create an article describing how Mohammed River Danced around sheep and camels in a pink dress for 40 days and 40 nights while singing The Dreidel Song.

Lets just leave dead people out of our discussions, i never said anything about jesus so stop saying anything about Muhammed, dont insult other's believes if you expect them to respect yours, lets just respect the religions and leave them out of our proplems.

so you saying that anyone who write anything against israel is just a fool and there is no truth about it ???, isnt that biased ?

if you want to say that they are not telling the truth, then find me some facts in one article, and tell me this fact is not correct, but lets refrain from talking about the writers and their personalities.

do you deny the Israel's Espionage Against the U.S ?

read and then tell me your opinion, the reports are from:
http://www.antiwar.com
http://www.washington-report.org
http://www.telegraph.co.uk
http://news.bbc.co.uk
http://www.mideastfacts.com
http://www.time.com
http://www.jewishtimes.com
http://www.washingtonpost.com
http://www.haaretz.com
http://www.msnbc.msn.com
http://www.nytimes.com
http://www.reuters.com
http://www.cbsnews.com
http://www.usatoday.com
http://www.cnn.com
http://www.haaretzdaily.com
http://www.sundayherald.com
http://www.sundayherald.com

and alot more sources, so you think all those are fools ???

if you want to call someone a fool, then bring an evidence, tell me a fact or an article that is not accurate, and even so, if one article is inaccurate, there is more than 100 article infront of you, try to read instead of your biased support of israel.

NightTrain

10-04-2010, 02:39 PM

so you saying that anyone who write anything against israel is just a fool and there is no truth about it ???

Of course not.

isnt that biased ?

No.

if you want to say that they are not telling the truth, then find me some facts in one article, and tell me this fact is not correct, but lets refrain from talking about the writers and their personalities.

What you have problems with is finding credible articles and you really have destroyed any personal credibility you may have had (call it the benefit of a doubt) when you first came here as a new poster with your statements and skewed backup.

You keep finding these people who clearly are against Israel and everything it stands for - like a modern form of government, freedom of religion, equal rights, etc., and while you continually spout off with lip service that you are for peace with the Jews and personally have nothing against Israel, your incessant posts portraying Israel as evil tell me everything I need to know about you.

You, Abso, hate Israel. I can understand this because they beat the holy hell out of Egypt in a matter of days and that probably is humiliating. Those Jews really opened up a can of whoop-ass on you Arabs on your "wipe Israel from the face of the earth" adventure.

You hate America because we make sure they have the technology and weaponry to give you another ass beating if you try some of the stupid stunts again that you've tried in the past. I can understand this as well. Those American-made F-15s are still unbeaten in combat and those Israeli pilots really know how to make them dance.

We also block idiots like the French who have tried to impose UN sanctions on Israel for defending itself from mindless muslim fanatics hellbent to kill as many Israeli civilians as possible. I understand your hatred toward the USA for protecting them on this level, too.

I also understand that you, as a muslim, have a hatred for a free nation filled with women that have just as many rights as men do, and the fact that it's a very real possibility that a woman was flying that F-22 Raptor that just blew you further back into the stone age the next time we need to kick more ass has to sting a bit. She won't be wearing a burka, either.

do you deny the Israel's Espionage Against the U.S ?

Oh, I'm sure they have engaged in espionage, and I'm sure we've done the same.

So what?

Kathianne

10-04-2010, 02:56 PM

Of course not.

No.

What you have problems with is finding credible articles and you really have destroyed any personal credibility you may have had (call it the benefit of a doubt) when you first came here as a new poster with your statements and skewed backup.

You keep finding these people who clearly are against Israel and everything it stands for - like a modern form of government, freedom of religion, equal rights, etc., and while you continually spout off with lip service that you are for peace with the Jews and personally have nothing against Israel, your incessant posts portraying Israel as evil tell me everything I need to know about you.

You, Abso, hate Israel. I can understand this because they beat the holy hell out of Egypt in a matter of days and that probably is humiliating. Those Jews really opened up a can of whoop-ass on you Arabs on your "wipe Israel from the face of the earth" adventure.

You hate America because we make sure they have the technology and weaponry to give you another ass beating if you try some of the stupid stunts again that you've tried in the past. I can understand this as well. Those American-made F-15s are still unbeaten in combat and those Israeli pilots really know how to make them dance.

We also block idiots like the French who have tried to impose UN sanctions on Israel for defending itself from mindless muslim fanatics hellbent to kill as many Israeli civilians as possible. I understand your hatred toward the USA for protecting them on this level, too.

I also understand that you, as a muslim, have a hatred for a free nation filled with women that have just as many rights as men do, and the fact that it's a very real possibility that a woman was flying that F-22 Raptor that just blew you further back into the stone age the next time we need to kick more ass has to sting a bit. She won't be wearing a burka, either.

Oh, I'm sure they have engaged in espionage, and I'm sure we've done the same.

So what?
It hurt, really, that I couldn't rep you for this.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to NightTrain again.