No reviews of Palin's new book yet?

[Palin Rider]

Do the Tea partiers really find her that embarrassing? :laugh:

[SassyLady]

I'm still reading Decision Points. Give me time.

Why don't you read it and give us your review....and not just parrot the liberal talking points.

[Noir]

yyyeah, i heard she was staring in a reality TV show or somthing, weirds times a coming =/

[red states rule]

Do the Tea partiers really find her that embarrassing? :laugh:

The liberal media is giving its review with their usual distain and bias





NBC correspondent Norah O'Donnell hyped Sarah Palin's criticism of her liberal opponents on Tuesday's Today show, stating that the former governor "rips the heart out of some of her opponents" in her new book. O'Donnell stated that Palin, "in very personal terms, also questions the President's [Obama's] patriotism, concluding he has 'a stark lack of faith in the American people.'"

The correspondent covered "America By Heart," the Republican's second book, for the second straight day. Anchor Matt Lauer introduced her report, which began 40 minutes into the 7 pm Eastern hour, by immediately noting Palin's attacks on Mr. Obama: "Sarah Palin's much-anticipated new book hits stores today. NBC News received an advanced copy last night, and the former Alaska governor is not holding back when it comes to President Obama." O'Donnell picked up where he left off: "Well, you know, her new book is called 'America By Heart.' It's full of what she calls 'reflections on faith, family and flag.' But with all the attacks on President Obama and others, some say it could be a handbook for her for a 2012 campaign."

After noting Palin's recent visibility due to her daughter Bristol's run on Dancing With the Stars and her TLC series, the NBC correspondent turned her attention on the Tea Party favorite's attacks on liberals: "Palin, it seems, is everywhere, plugging her book and settling some old scores."



Read more: http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/matthew-balan/2010/11/23/nbcs-odonnell-palin-rips-heart-out-her-opponents-new-book#ixzz169K30fY4

[krisy]

I will probably read it after I read Decision Points,which I should get this week.

The question seems a little grade schoolish. I wouldn't be embarrased about reading her book. I like her and am not ashamed.:2up:

[SassyLady]

yyyeah, i heard she was staring in a reality TV show or somthing, weirds times a coming =/

Not a reality show...she has editorial control.

I find it fascinating that she's being attacked for hosting a TV show about Alaska for the Discovery Channel and thinking about running for office. Huckabee has a weekly television show and is thinking about running for office ... and I haven't heard anyone say that it will probably not look good on his resume.

Once again, the Palin derangement syndrome is in full swing.

[Palin Rider]

Why don't you read it and give us your review....and not just parrot the liberal talking points.
I read as much of it as I need to. It reminds me of a middle school kid's assignment in which she started to do an essay about herself, and ended up doing an essay about Obama.

(No idea whether that's a "liberal talking point," since I make no effort to follow those...)

[red states rule]

I read as much of it as I need to. It reminds me of a middle school kid's assignment in which she started to do an essay about herself, and ended up doing an essay about Obama.

(No idea whether that's a "liberal talking point," since I make no effort to follow those...)

You remind me of people who don't listen to Rush or watch Fox News, but they claim to know the contents of those shows

[SassyLady]

I read as much of it as I need to. It reminds me of a middle school kid's assignment in which she started to do an essay about herself, and ended up doing an essay about Obama.

(No idea whether that's a "liberal talking point," since I make no effort to follow those...)

You've already read it ... did you get an advance copy? Thought it just became available today.

[NightTrain]

I read as much of it as I need to.


You mean you read someone's review at MoveOn?

[red states rule]

You mean you read someone's review at MoveOn?

It is sad to see people like PR consumed with fear and jealousy over Sarah Palin

[SassyLady]

You mean you read someone's review at MoveOn?

No ... I think he's telling the truth...he read as much as he "needed" to. He will come back and state that he had no need to read any of it....and is just parroting the liberal talking points ...."middle school essay about Obama".

Because I'm sure he didn't run out to the bookstore and buy a copy first thing this morning ..... because he's such a fan.

[red states rule]

No ... I think he's telling the truth...he read as much as he "needed" to. He will come back and state that he had no need to read any of it....and is just parroting the liberal talking points ...."middle school essay about Obama".

Because I'm sure he didn't run out to the bookstore and buy a copy first thing this morning ..... because he's such a fan.

and no matter how many copies of the book are sold libs like PR will dismiss them

Poor sales will show how bad the book is

Great sales will show the sheep mentality of the public

As you posted on another thread - damned if you and damned if you don't

[Kathianne]

Once again I'll state she is not a candidate for me. With that said, RSR and Mrs KP are correct in the bias and the spin of both the MSM and the leftists. It's clear that this woman, regardless of what one thinks of her, is held to an impossible standard.

[red states rule]

Once again I'll state she is not a candidate for me. With that said, RSR and Mrs KP are correct in the bias and the spin of both the MSM and the leftists. It's clear that this woman, regardless of what one thinks of her, is held to an impossible standard.

She has alot of questions to answer before she could get my support.

Libs are out to get her no matter what. Chris Matthews is on the record saying the MSM will destroy her if she gets the nomination

Looks like they are not waiting for that to happen, and have started their self assigned search and destroy mission

[SassyLady]

I like her because she's an outsider, speaks her mind, and is not pandering to the polls.

[red states rule]

I like her because she's an outsider, speaks her mind, and is not pandering to the polls.

Much like the candidates she backed (and won BTW)

[SassyLady]

Much like the candidates she backed (and won BTW)

I like her explanation for what a true feminist is ...



VAN SUSTEREN: You have a brand-new book out, so -- and let me -- let me get straight to your book. I'm going to read some passages to you, but let me start with this one: "It surprises some people to hear that I consider myself a feminist."
I think that's probably going to light some people on fire to think of you thinking of yourself as a feminist. So tell me what you mean.

SARAH PALIN, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR/FORMER ALASKA GOVERNOR: This is a great book. And I think the takeaway from the book for a lot of people will be that passage and that chapter when I talk about, Hey, I am a feminist. I'm a common sense, conservative, constitutional feminist, that I believe that women are capable and should be empowered to know that they can pursue career, pursue good education and raise a family. They can do it all at the same time, believe it or not. And those who have kind of hijacked the term feminism and believe that unless you are a left-wing liberal, you cannot call yourself a feminist, well, I take them on in this chapter.

VAN SUSTEREN: You say "take them on." Let me read a little bit more to you. You say, "I believe that some in the radical feminist movement of the 1960s and '70s became too heavily invested in the idea of women as powerless. They were preoccupied with themselves and their frustration to the degree that they made victims of themselves."
A lot of women are -- I mean, that -- that's hitting the women right between the eyes.

PALIN: Well, I think that some of these women in these women groups, they do a great disservice to women when they try make, especially young women, feel that they are victims and that society and men just will hold them back and hold them down. Maybe, Greta, a lot of this has to do with my upbringing in Alaska, where we are very independent here, and gender really isn't an issue. The women are expected to do the same work as the men, in the oil fields and out there hunting and fishing, making their living, carving it out of the wilderness and on the water. Because of my upbringing in a very outdoorsy, competitive family, I have been brought up to believe that women are equal to men.
So those women, especially who kind of have -- I think their thinking is passe, and it's naive to think that women are victims. No. It depends on how you're going to react to the circumstances around you in society, whether you are going to succumb to this idea that we are victims and that, Oh, gosh, we're never going to have fair treatment. No. We have to work harder, I think, to prove ourselves. But more power to us for doing that.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, let me read another passage to you, this time quoting Tina Brown, who, of course, may reflect some of the Upper East Side of New York thinking. You write about her, "Commenting on the victories of common sense, conservative women in primaries earlier this year, liberal editor Tina Brown complained it's almost feels as if all these women winning are kind of a blow to feminism."
(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: ... definition.

PALIN: Yes, she must. I think that's one of the stupidest ever sentences that I have heard come out of any feminist woman's mouth. I think that Tina makes absolutely no sense. And I will take her on with a comment like that. She's trying to say that Nikki Haley, Susana Martinez, Carly Fiorina, Kristi Noem -- these women who either prevailed or will prevail next time in their elections, that they are strong, powerful, smart. They happen to be adorable, too, when it comes to their embracing of all that life has to offer, including raising children.
She's going to claim that they are not good for our country? They represent what I believe the majority of women want to see represented in government. And that is individual rights and equality and freedom and free markets so that we can grow and thrive and prevail and invest according to our own priorities, not some politician back in D.C. telling us what to do with our money or our businesses or our families.
That's what these women represent. And they can be in positions to empower other women, especially young women, to go forth and to conquer.

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/on-the-record/transcript/sarah-palin-speaks-039heart039-why-she-won039t-039sit-down-and-shutup039

[Noir]

I like her because she's an outsider, speaks her mind, and is not pandering to the polls.

I disagree about the poll pandering, by her very nature she panders, but so she should, she'd be void of any political reality if she didn't.

[Palin Rider]

You've already read it ... did you get an advance copy? Thought it just became available today.

I have online access to just about every advance edition of anything the major publishing houses print. (Sorry, I can't help you do the same. You just have to be friends with the right people.)

[fj1200]

I disagree about the poll pandering, by her very nature she panders, but so she should, she'd be void of any political reality if she didn't.

How do you figure that?

[Noir]

How do you figure that?

She's a politician.

[fj1200]

She's a politician.

:rolleyes: Weak.

[gabosaurus]

If you like Palin, you are going to like the book before you even read it.
Same with Palin's weekly infomercial. Which I know serves some purpose, since filming it is likely the only time she spends with her family these days.

[Kathianne]

If you like Palin, you are going to like the book before you even read it.
Same with Palin's weekly infomercial. Which I know serves some purpose, since filming it is likely the only time she spends with her family these days.

Seriously, how do you "know" that?

[Noir]

:rolleyes: Weak.

Or...true?

Anyone who wants to go into politics wants to be voted for, and so will pander by nature.

[fj1200]

Or...true?

Anyone who wants to go into politics wants to be voted for, and so will pander by nature.

You haven't backed up your position. A leader shouldn't be pandering for votes, identify the way forward and lead.

[BoogyMan]

If you like Palin, you are going to like the book before you even read it.
Same with Palin's weekly infomercial. Which I know serves some purpose, since filming it is likely the only time she spends with her family these days.

It really is funny when a liberal who claims there is no hatred of Palin posts something like this!! :lol:

[SassyLady]

I disagree about the poll pandering, by her very nature she panders, but so she should, she'd be void of any political reality if she didn't.

So, when has she changed her mind about a principle she stands on because of what a poll has revealed?

See...that would be pandering to the polls.

[Noir]

So, when has she changed her mind about a principle she stands on because of what a poll has revealed?

See...that would be pandering to the polls.

The bridge to nowhere


ANCHORAGE, Alaska (Reuters) - It garnered big applause in her first speech as Republican John McCain's vice presidential pick, but Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's assertion that she rejected Congressional funds for the so-called "bridge to nowhere" has upset many Alaskans.

During her first speech after being named as McCain's surprise pick as a running mate, Palin said she had told Congress "'thanks but no thanks' on that bridge to nowhere."

In the city Ketchikan, the planned site of the so-called "Bridge to Nowhere," political leaders of both parties said the claim was false and a betrayal of their community, because she had supported the bridge and the earmark for it secured by Alaska's Congressional delegation during her run for governor.

As if to underline the point


"People are learning that she pandered to us by saying, I'm for this' ... and then when she found it was politically advantageous for her nationally, abruptly she starts using the very term that she said was insulting," Weinstein said.

"You don't tell a group of Alaskans you support something and then go to someplace else and say you oppose it," said Phillips

http://us.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSN3125537020080901?ca=rdt

Pandering is pandering, be it to polls or just the Joe Blogs on the street.

[SassyLady]

The bridge to nowhere



As if to underline the point



http://us.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSN3125537020080901?ca=rdt

Pandering is pandering, be it to polls or just the Joe Blogs on the street.

So, are you saying she changed her mind about the bridge to nowhere because of a poll that was taken?

[Trigg]

Palin is an interresting person and I'm sure she tries to be genuine.

I'm also pretty sure the dems would love to see her run in 2012, cause that's the only way bambam is going to win a second term.

Palin has her fan's, but the GOP will need independents firmly on their side to win in 2012 and the independents don't like Palin.

[SassyLady]

I'm not sure the Dems will get Obama through the primaries....nor am I sure that Palin will make it through the primaries. I don't think Independents like either choice at the moment.

And, if Obama doesn't make it through ... it's because the progressive faction wants someone even more left than Obama...and I really don't think that individual will win the hearts of the Independents either.

It'll be interesting to see what floats to the top in all parties.

[Kathianne]

I'm not sure the Dems will get Obama through the primaries....nor am I sure that Palin will make it through the primaries. I don't think Independents like either choice at the moment.

And, if Obama doesn't make it through ... it's because the progressive faction wants someone even more left than Obama...and I really don't think that individual will win the hearts of the Independents either.

It'll be interesting to see what floats to the top in all parties.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to mrskurtsprincess again. I'd really like to kill that!

I agree about the candidates, though I don't think it's just the indies. I think substantial numbers of both ideologies do not like these 2. For Obama it's the far left. For Palin, it's the moderates that trend libertarian.

[NightTrain]

Seriously, how do you "know" that?


Because she got TWO degrees from Cal, of course! :slap:

[Kathianne]

Because she got TWO degrees from Cal, of course! :slap:

Dammit! I was drinking.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to NightTrain again.

[SassyLady]

I'd really like to kill that!

I agree about the candidates, though I don't think it's just the indies. I think substantial numbers of both ideologies do not like these 2. For Obama it's the far left. For Palin, it's the moderates that trend libertarian.

Well, I'm an Indy and I can already tell you that I will not vote for Obama or anything left of him. And, I won't vote for a career politician.

[Noir]

So, are you saying she changed her mind about the bridge to nowhere because of a poll that was taken?

No, which was why I said at the end of the pos that pandering is pandering.
If you're only concerned with poll related pandering fair enough, but I think that's needlessly narrow.

[SassyLady]

No, which was why I said at the end of the pos that pandering is pandering.
If you're only concerned with poll related pandering fair enough, but I think that's needlessly narrow.

Which is why I posted it as one of the things I like about her ... she doesn't pander to "polls"....unlike Obama ... who is more concerned about the polls than his principles.

[DragonStryk72]

You got me, PR, I didn't read her biography, or Bush's, didn't read Obama's, Biden's, Clinton's, either. Here's a thought: Maybe biographies are generally boring. Two notable exceptions on this were the biography of Ben Franklin I read while working at Borders, and the bio on Hank Aaron. But then, they actually did interesting stuff I'm not already clearly aware of. just like I roll my eyes when I see a bio for Britney Spears, Justin Bieber, or Miley Cyrus.

[Noir]

Which is why I posted it as one of the things I like about her ... she doesn't pander to "polls"....unlike Obama ... who is more concerned about the polls than his principles.

So you only care if someone is more concerned about people changing their opinions because of polls, but not at all when someone changes their opinion because of their audience?

As far as i see someone will lose either way; Ignore the polls and the opinions of a nation and you are arrogant, out of touch with the public and driven by ideology. If you do listen to the polls and public opinion then you pander, aren't concerned about your principles and flipflop on issues.

But, to continue along your line of thought, National Heathcare is an Obama Principle, are you saying you'd want him to do everything possible to push his principle through no matter how unpopular national polls would show the policy to be, just so he can be a man of principle?

[SassyLady]

So you only care if someone is more concerned about people changing their opinions because of polls, but not at all when someone changes their opinion because of their audience?

This is what I care about: I don't like anyone changing who they are, or their principles, just to win a popularity contest. Run on your principles ... if they match the majority of voters, you will probably win.


As far as i see someone will lose either way; Ignore the polls and the opinions of a nation and you are arrogant, out of touch with the public and driven by ideology. If you do listen to the polls and public opinion then you pander, aren't concerned about your principles and flipflop on issues.

It's possible.



But, to continue along your line of thought, National Heathcare is an Obama Principle, are you saying you'd want him to do everything possible to push his principle through no matter how unpopular national polls would show the policy to be, just so he can be a man of principle?

Never said he wasn't a man of principle, or driven by ideology....just that I don't agree with some of his principles or ideology.

[Noir]

This is what I care about: I don't like anyone changing who they are, or their principles, just to win a popularity contest. Run on your principles ... if they match the majority of voters, you will probably win.

Well Palin loses this one. I don't know which principle is Plains *real one* but she made statements that she was both for and against the bridge to nowhere.

But, as i said when i first posted, its in her nature, because its in all politicians nature (IF they want to get elected)


It's possible.

Well more than possible, its true, but its just one of the many Paradoxes of politics.


Never said he wasn't a man of principle, or driven by ideology....just that I don't agree with some of his principles or ideology.

You didn't answer the question, would you rather he pushed through policy that the American people did not want rather than *pander* to the majority of the people?

[SassyLady]

You didn't answer the question, would you rather he pushed through policy that the American people did not want rather than *pander* to the majority of the people?

Noir....I would rather Obama resign ... his principles are not good for America. Obama panders to his cronies, deluding himself into thinking it is the public majority.

[Palin Rider]

....I would rather Obama resign...
Never figured you for a Biden fan! :laugh:

[Noir]

Noir....I would rather Obama resign ... his principles are not good for America. Obama panders to his cronies, deluding himself into thinking it is the public majority.

Mkay, clearly don't want to answer the question presented, fair enough, i won't press it further.

[SassyLady]

Never figured you for a Biden fan! :laugh:


Good point ... let's have a recall election instead.

[SassyLady]

Mkay, clearly don't want to answer the question presented, fair enough, i won't press it further.

Question:



But, to continue along your line of thought, National Heathcare is an Obama Principle, are you saying you'd want him to do everything possible to push his principle through no matter how unpopular national polls would show the policy to be, just so he can be a man of principle?



Answer:

Yes ... I'm glad he pushed ... it has galvanized America to stand up for their principles. I'd rather he stick to his principles so we know what type of man he is...someone who panders to the polls is hard to support because you never know which way they will go next.

[Noir]

Question:
Answer:

Yes ... I'm glad he pushed ... it has galvanized America to stand up for their principles. I'd rather he stick to his principles so we know what type of man he is...someone who panders to the polls is hard to support because you never know which way they will go next.

Mkay, well here we have a fundamental disagreement on what politicians are meant to do. IMO they are there to represent the people, and that if a policy should be deemed extremely unpopular (like say Healthcare in America) then even if its not what that politician believes in ultimately its the people that make the decision, and it is not a bad thing to listen to the people. When you advocate ignoring them on a matter of personal principle.

Though, quiet oddly, you don't seem to care about Palin pandering, just because you don't think it was a poll that made her pander, but just good old political opportunism

[SassyLady]

Mkay, well here we have a fundamental disagreement on what politicians are meant to do. IMO they are there to represent the people, and that if a policy should be deemed extremely unpopular (like say Healthcare in America) then even if its not what that politician believes in ultimately its the people that make the decision, and it is not a bad thing to listen to the people. When you advocate ignoring them on a matter of personal principle.

Though, quiet oddly, you don't seem to care about Palin pandering, just because you don't think it was a poll that made her pander, but just good old political opportunism

Well, I guess for me it boils down to the fact that I don't trust polls Noir. Now, if every single individual in America were asked what they thought about a particular policy, and were allowed to ask questions about the question before they answered, then I might trust the results. However, I've taken enough surveys to know that the questions are loaded to get the result that the survey taker is looking for. When I'm asked to take a survey I always ask who is paying for it....that is the first determining factor as to whether I'll take the survey. And, there are times when I'm part way through the survey when I decide that I'm not going to finish it because of the obvious bias of the questions.

So, yes, I would rather support someone who is principled, and I know what those principles are, rather than support someone who makes their decisions based upon every poll that comes across their radar.

An example of listening to people would be setting up a website or phone line where people can call in and tell their representative what they think about a policy...a place where they can ask the questions that they are concerned about....that is listening and representing. Not putting together a poll.

Here's an example of how to do that... Jim is asking for feedback about the thanks and rep system. If he put up a poll that just asked:

Keep the rep system? Yes or No

.............and the first ten people said NO and he removed it because of the poll numbers .... and then the next ten people who came in (perhaps they were at family's for Thanksgiving and didn't get their vote in) said YES and then Jim put it back.....oh, and then the next 20 people said NO.....

can you see my point about polls?

Jim didn't put up a poll. He asked for feedback, and he's listening to everyone and then I'm sure he'll make a decision based upon what he thinks is best for the board and in line with his principles. And anyone who doesn't voice an opinion shouldn't come in later and complain about the outcome.

As for Palin ... do you really think that she doesn't believe in what she's saying? That she is just saying these things to pander? See, this is where I disagree with you ... I think she believes what she is saying because that is who she is. Which is why so many people hate her ... she isn't pandering to try and get everyone's vote.

[fj1200]

Mkay, well here we have a fundamental disagreement on what politicians are meant to do. IMO they are there to represent the people, and that if a policy should be deemed extremely unpopular (like say Healthcare in America) then even if its not what that politician believes in ultimately its the people that make the decision, and it is not a bad thing to listen to the people. When you advocate ignoring them on a matter of personal principle.

Though, quiet oddly, you don't seem to care about Palin pandering, just because you don't think it was a poll that made her pander, but just good old political opportunism

If they were just to "represent the people" then they will be blown by the popular winds and are of no value other than sticking their finger into the air to see which way to vote. Politicians, in the US at least, start with a set of beliefs/values/whatever in which they convince people to vote for them, from that basis they represent the people.

I would prefer a candidate run on a set of beliefs that are distinct from another candidates and their set of beliefs so that a clear choice can be made. If people vote for lefties/righties and get lefty/righty government then so be it. It is when candidates votes are inconsistent with their stated beliefs that I, and all voters hopefully, get frustrated. I think there are not enough challengers in primaries in this country; incumbents were getting fat and happy which is why I think the Tea Party is such a positive development. A group of people decided that their elected officials were not voting the way that their constituents desired.

As far as Palin and the bridge, I don't remember all the details but there is a difference between a governor of a state and running for VPOTUS; especially veep, they have to support the top of the ticket. You may have a point about the bridge but your implication was that all Palin was doing these past two years was pandering to the polls, I don't think that has any basis, I think she's been in front of the wave rather than riding it. Full disclosure, my opinion as I rarely listen to her for more than a soundbite.

[Missileman]

If they were just to "represent the people" then they will be blown by the popular winds and are of no value other than sticking their finger into the air to see which way to vote. Politicians, in the US at least, start with a set of beliefs/values/whatever in which they convince people to vote for them, from that basis they represent the people.

I would prefer a candidate run on a set of beliefs that are distinct from another candidates and their set of beliefs so that a clear choice can be made. If people vote for lefties/righties and get lefty/righty government then so be it. It is when candidates votes are inconsistent with their stated beliefs that I, and all voters hopefully, get frustrated. I think there are not enough challengers in primaries in this country; incumbents were getting fat and happy which is why I think the Tea Party is such a positive development. A group of people decided that their elected officials were not voting the way that their constituents desired.

As far as Palin and the bridge, I don't remember all the details but there is a difference between a governor of a state and running for VPOTUS; especially veep, they have to support the top of the ticket. You may have a point about the bridge but your implication was that all Palin was doing these past two years was pandering to the polls, I don't think that has any basis, I think she's been in front of the wave rather than riding it. Full disclosure, my opinion as I rarely listen to her for more than a soundbite.

In the case of Obama, what he said he would do if elected and what he has done since getting elected are damned near 180 degrees opposite. It's unfortunate when someone so blatantly misrepresents themselves that we have to suffer them for their entire term...they should be subject to a recall.

[red states rule]

Palin is an interresting person and I'm sure she tries to be genuine.

I'm also pretty sure the dems would love to see her run in 2012, cause that's the only way bambam is going to win a second term.

Palin has her fan's, but the GOP will need independents firmly on their side to win in 2012 and the independents don't like Palin.

I believe the same was said about Ronald Reagan in 1978

[red states rule]

The liberal hate fest on Ms Palin continues. Once again the tolerant left goes after her kids

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[SassyLady]

Disgusting representation of the liberal left .... and they will say that Bristol is fair game because she's an adult and not off limits anymore.

[red states rule]

Disgusting representation of the liberal left .... and they will say that Bristol is fair game because she's an adult and not off limits anymore.

To the left MSK all is fair in love, war, and in the defense of Obama

[SassyLady]

Time to reload.

[red states rule]

Time to reload.

Time to relaod as the liberals form their circular firing squad

http://www.solidprinciples.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Circular-Firing-Squad-Health-Care.jpg

[SassyLady]

One of the shooters should be the Lamestream Media.