Paul Ryan is a Liar

[Joe Steel]

Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday. It was a bold-face lie. Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation. Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Paul Ryan is a liar.

[Missileman]

Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday. It was a bold-face lie. Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation. Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Paul Ryan is a liar.

Let's call it what it really is. The inheritance tax is plain theft. The government has no "legal" claim to it.

[OldMercsRule]

Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday.

Hmmmmmm......... n' here I thought Fareed Zakaria on his GPS on the Commie News Netwerk this mornin' was reveeeeeeeelin'. (Can't read his mind as to whether he was lyin' or actually believed the elitist horse pooooooooop that rolled out of his pie hole, (as Liberals who think they can read minds; like this author).

Zakaria's premise was false in that he claimed that Lord John Maynard Keynes philosophy was both Gubment spending and tax cuts. Wrong.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Maynard_Keynes

He further went on to take to upside down Progressive/Liberal postion that $900 Billion in "tax cuts" over two years was the same as the $900 Billion in porkulus fer the Chicago thug, fruit fly Obamaprompter.
Wrong.

Both figures are within range of each other, and Obamaprompter isn't spendin' his Chicago thug "walk around money" until he tries ta buy votes fer 2012, so the present value of money argument on China borrowing is somewhat neutral.

The huge difference is forced crony capitalism vs private sector allocation of resources.

Was the so called "smart", (cause he is soooo Liberal), Zakaria lyin'? I dunno, as I can't read his mind.

Was his premise totally false, (n' representative of the elitist Liberal dim wit Democrat "main stream media" look down their nose kool aid)?

YUP!!!!!!


It was a bold-face lie.

MIND READER ^^^^^^^^ snark..... snark.... burp.... :laugh2:


Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation.

That's the ABSOLUTE TRUTH: Einstein. I suggest ya study econ 101 or maybe go back ta KINDERGARDEN..... :laugh2::laugh2:


Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Did you get a degree when ya became a clown who thinks he can read minds? Or do ya even think???? :laugh2::laugh2:


Paul Ryan is a liar.

Nope. Not at all.

[Joe Steel]

Hmmmmmm......... n' here I thought Fareed Zakaria on his GPS on the Commie News Netwerk this mornin' was reveeeeeeeelin'. (Can't read his mind as to whether he was lyin' or actually believed the elitist horse pooooooooop that rolled out of his pie hole, (as Liberals who think they can read minds; like this author).

Zakaria's premise was false in that he claimed that Lord John Maynard Keynes philosophy was both Gubment spending and tax cuts. Wrong.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Maynard_Keynes

He further went on to take to upside down Progressive/Liberal postion that $900 Billion in "tax cuts" over two years was the same as the $900 Billion in porkulus fer the Chicago thug, fruit fly Obamaprompter.
Wrong.

Both figures are within range of each other, and Obamaprompter isn't spendin' his Chicago thug "walk around money" until he tries ta buy votes fer 2012, so the present value of money argument on China borrowing is somewhat neutral.

The huge difference is forced crony capitalism vs private sector allocation of resources.

Was the so called "smart", (cause he is soooo Liberal), Zakaria lyin'? I dunno, as I can't read his mind.

Was his premise totally false, (n' representative of the elitist Liberal dim wit Democrat "main stream media" look down their nose kool aid)?

YUP!!!!!!



MIND READER ^^^^^^^^ snark..... snark.... burp.... :laugh2:



That's the ABSOLUTE TRUTH: Einstein. I suggest ya study econ 101 or maybe go back ta KINDERGARDEN..... :laugh2::laugh2:



Did you get a degree when ya became a clown who thinks he can read minds? Or do ya even think???? :laugh2::laugh2:



Nope. Not at all.

Try again, dumbass.

Ryan was wrong and so are you.

[SassyLady]

Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday. It was a bold-face lie. Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation. Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Paul Ryan is a liar.

I will only believe you if you can tell what type of tax it is then. I've earned two million dollars and have it in savings. I've paid tax on it when I earned it. If my daughter inherits it, why is it taxed again .... and at a much higher rate than what I paid.

So, tell me why this isn't double taxation and why it isn't theft?


P.S. I really don't have two million ... just using for illustrative purposes only!

[NightTrain]

It is nice to see Wisconsin finally back with electing conservatives, that's where the bulk of my family lives.

The vast majority of my family work their asses off and hold conservative values.

There is a branch of my family in WI that doesn't work, or work as little as possible and manipulate the system to gain every handout and free ride that they can possibly get. Naturally, this branch of my clan vote liberal each and every time.

Same sense of humor, same religious values, same sense of family, everything except work ethic. The lazy ones are liberals, the hard working ones are conservatives.

But even the liberal family members don't like the inheritance tax - not because it's money that's being taxed twice, but because that's less money they'll be handed from the hard working ones when they kick the bucket.

[Kathianne]

I will only believe you if you can tell what type of tax it is then. I've earned two million dollars and have it in savings. I've paid tax on it when I earned it. If my daughter inherits it, why is it taxed again .... and at a much higher rate than what I paid.

So, tell me why this isn't double taxation and why it isn't theft?

It is. Here's much more:

www.taxfoundation.org/files/tw-fall2010.pdf

http://i54.tinypic.com/293ziow.png

http://i51.tinypic.com/jq5lvk.png

[SassyLady]

The Estate Tax is one of the primary reasons family farms/ranches are going under. They are usually land rich and cash poor. However, when the parents die and the children inherit ... they have to sell off some of the land to pay the inheritance tax.

If the tax cuts are not extended then on 1/1/2011 the rate goes up to 55% and anything over a million will be taxed at that rate.

So, taking my theoretical $2M ..... my estate would be taxed 55% on everything over $1M.....so the IRS will take $550,000. If this isn't stealing, what is it?

I would love Joe Steel to explain to me why it isn't stealing, why it isn't just a tax on someone having the misfortune to die.

[Kathianne]

The Estate Tax is one of the primary reasons family farms/ranches are going under. They are usually land rich and cash poor. However, when the parents die and the children inherit ... they have to sell off some of the land to pay the inheritance tax.

If the tax cuts are not extended then on 1/1/2011 the rate goes up to 55% and anything over a million will be taxed at that rate.

So, taking my theoretical $2M ..... my estate would be taxed 55% on everything over $1M.....so the IRS will take $550,000. If this isn't stealing, what is it?

I would love Joe Steel to explain to me why it isn't stealing, why it isn't just a tax on someone having the misfortune to die.

I totally agree. My parents would have been leaving a similar sized estate if not for choices about health care. We'd all discussed their choices available and what we thought was best. The money was gone by the time my dad died nearly 3 years after my mom. No regrets. However, if they'd gone at the same time, earlier? Would be hard hit under what some now are arguing for, again.

Gift and death taxes go sort of hand-in-hand regarding excessive rates. I can see an argument for both of these in amounts exceeding a million dollars, at say a 3% rate-as it's unearned income, (the concentration of wealth argument), but 55%? No way.

[Joe Steel]

I will only believe you if you can tell what type of tax it is then. I've earned two million dollars and have it in savings. I've paid tax on it when I earned it. If my daughter inherits it, why is it taxed again .... and at a much higher rate than what I paid.

So, tell me why this isn't double taxation and why it isn't theft?

P.S. I really don't have two million ... just using for illustrative purposes only!

What if you used the money you earned to buy real property which tripled in value. When did you pay income tax on the increase in value?

[NightTrain]

What if you used the money you earned to buy real property which tripled in value. When did you pay income tax on the increase in value?

You pay it when it's assessed again. Of course.

You'd know that if you bought a house instead of camping out in your Mom's basement like your pal Palin Rider.

[Kathianne]

You pay it when it's assessed again. Of course.

You'd know that if you bought a house instead of camping out in your Mom's basement like your pal Palin Rider.

and in IL you'd also pay to buy in additional taxes, before any increase in value, via 'stamps' on the deed. Another form of double taxation.

[fj1200]

Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday. It was a bold-face lie. Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation. Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Paul Ryan is a liar.

You're taxed when you die (death) and your taxed on money that was previously taxed (double taxation). Sounds like he got it right.


What if you used the money you earned to buy real property which tripled in value. When did you pay income tax on the increase in value?

What difference does it matter what her investment does post death?

I started a thread on eliminating the estate tax, take a read and tell me what you think. The lib response was underwhelming to be sure.

[SassyLady]

What if you used the money you earned to buy real property which tripled in value. When did you pay income tax on the increase in value?

Whether the property tripled in value has nothing to do with what is right or wrong. Forcing people to sell their inheritance to pay taxes is wrong.

[Joe Steel]

The Estate Tax is one of the primary reasons family farms/ranches are going under. They are usually land rich and cash poor. However, when the parents die and the children inherit ... they have to sell off some of the land to pay the inheritance tax.

If the tax cuts are not extended then on 1/1/2011 the rate goes up to 55% and anything over a million will be taxed at that rate.

So, taking my theoretical $2M ..... my estate would be taxed 55% on everything over $1M.....so the IRS will take $550,000. If this isn't stealing, what is it?

I would love Joe Steel to explain to me why it isn't stealing, why it isn't just a tax on someone having the misfortune to die.

Of course it's not stealing. Congress has a constitutional power of taxation and it's almost unlimited. They can lawfully tax almost anything they want to tax.

[darin]

Joe? All you've done is say "Nuh-UH!!" when people explain stuff to you. You don't WANT to understand.

[Noir]

I've never understood inheritance tax, especialy given that a person can gift someone anything without having to pay tax, but one they die its suddenly tax-able =/

also, Joe, going by that logic you get a basis of morality from the Goverment, i.e. they voted for it in congress ergo its not stealing, take that to its logical conclusion and then say congress passed a law saying 'all men and women over 60 years old my be shot dead by the authorites, in order to deal with the pension crisis and population problem' that would *not* be murder, after all congress passed it, right? =/

[fj1200]

I've never understood inheritance tax, especialy given that a person can gift someone anything without having to pay tax, but one they die its suddenly tax-able =/

There is a gift tax here in the US, 11k per year per person and also a gift tax exclusion if you gift blah, blah, blah... Congress came up with it so you know it's stupid and counterproductive.


also, Joe, going by that logic...

Yeah, I don't think logic has anything to do with his thinking, more of an intense hatred.

[SassyLady]

Of course it's not stealing. Congress has a constitutional power of taxation and it's almost unlimited. They can lawfully tax almost anything they want to tax.

And the "people" have the right to get rid of Congress .... which they are, and will, if this type of "stealing" continues.

[darin]

And the "people" have the right to get rid of Congress .... which they are, and will, if this type of "stealing" continues.

I disagree - I believe the american population is quickly becoming too dumb to take a stand against financial tyranny from the govt.

[SassyLady]

I disagree - I believe the american population is quickly becoming too dumb to take a stand against financial tyranny from the govt.

Well, if the government keeps everyone dependent upon them through entitlements, they won't have an estate to worry about ... so perhaps you are right, dmp, the majority won't care because they have nothing to lose and everything to gain.......more taxes = more entitlements.

[Pagan]

I disagree - I believe the american population is quickly becoming too dumb to take a stand against financial tyranny from the govt.

You nailed it, debt is slavery and those who control the debt are the slave masters.

[jon_forward]

Typical Robin Hood Syndrome, Take Money by whatever means deemed Legal from the perceived Filthy Rich, ie, small business owner that has worked 80 hrs a week for 40 yrs often without pay to build the company for his children, and give it to the government to parcel out to the poor folks that cant and wont get a job because they are OWED a living by those of use that do. Give me a break... some people dont deserve to live in this great country... MOVE THE HELL OUT

[Palin Rider]

You pay it when it's assessed again. Of course.

You'd know that if you bought a house instead of camping out in your Mom's basement like your pal Palin Rider.

Alaska. Where you can never be too drunk or too fat.

P.S. I killed all my relatives, dumbass.

[Palin Rider]

I disagree - I believe the american population is quickly becoming too dumb to take a stand against financial tyranny from the govt.

Or from the insurance and banking industries.

[BoogyMan]

Inheritance tax IS a tax on death and it is a sickening and unconscionable demand by th US government to fork over obscene sums of money that has already been taxed.


Seldom is an example of deceit so clear as was Representative Paul Ryan's (R-WI) this morning on Fox News Sunday. It was a bold-face lie. Ryan called the inheritance tax a tax on death and double taxation. Ryan has a degree in political science and economics. He has to know what he said isn't true.

Paul Ryan is a liar.

[NightTrain]

Alaska. Where you can never be too drunk or too fat.

:laugh2:

What does that have to do with tax assessments?



P.S. I killed all my relatives, dumbass.

Nifty! It's too bad they didn't return the favor at the time.

[fj1200]

:crickets:

:420:

[Palin Rider]

:laugh2:

What does that have to do with tax assessments?

Nothing. I was just thinking about the potato fight photo.

[PostmodernProphet]

What if you used the money you earned to buy real property which tripled in value. When did you pay income tax on the increase in value?

so you're saying the estate tax isn't an estate tax, it's a capital gains tax?.....

[PostmodernProphet]

I've never understood inheritance tax, especialy given that a person can gift someone anything without having to pay tax, but one they die its suddenly tax-able =/

also, Joe, going by that logic you get a basis of morality from the Goverment, i.e. they voted for it in congress ergo its not stealing, take that to its logical conclusion and then say congress passed a law saying 'all men and women over 60 years old my be shot dead by the authorites, in order to deal with the pension crisis and population problem' that would *not* be murder, after all congress passed it, right? =/
but that IS what we have.....if the legislature passed such a law then it would not be murder.....after all, that's what we have with abortion, isn't it?........

[NightTrain]

Nothing. I was just thinking about the potato fight photo.

Oh, you're going to have to do better than that to step on my feelers, kiddo.

[Palin Rider]

Oh, you're going to have to do better than that to step on my feelers, kiddo.

At least you're honest about being an insect. :laugh:

[Noir]

but that IS what we have.....if the legislature passed such a law then it would not be murder.....after all, that's what we have with abortion, isn't it?........

In some sense. Personally I don't let outside bodies dictate my morality, which is why I believe killing animals is murder etc, no matter what the 'social norm' or current law is on the issue.

[Palin Rider]

Joe? All you've done is say "Nuh-UH!!" when people explain stuff to you. You don't WANT to understand.

First, that was my line. :)

Second, most of the self-styled conservatives here do exactly the same thing.

[SassyLady]

First, that was my line. :)

Second, most of the self-styled conservatives here do exactly the same thing.

How often do you see the "self-styled" conservatives on this board open a thread and then run from the debate?

[Noir]

Second, most of the self-styled conservatives here do exactly the same thing.

Even if this were accepted as true, does that make it alright? Sounds pretty weak to me when the 'well your 'side' are just as bad as our 'side'' arguments start flowing =/

[fj1200]

Second, most of the self-styled conservatives here do exactly the same thing.

Especially funny in a thread where a "self-styled" liberal ran from his own thread in a full sprint.

[Palin Rider]

How often do you see the "self-styled" conservatives on this board open a thread and then run from the debate?

Several times a day. :coffee:

[Palin Rider]

Even if this were accepted as true, does that make it alright? Sounds pretty weak to me when the 'well your 'side' are just as bad as our 'side'' arguments start flowing =/

Perhaps, but I'd rather acknowledge hypocrisy on anyone's part than ignore it.

[fj1200]

Perhaps, but I'd rather acknowledge hypocrisy on anyone's part than ignore it.

Here's an idea, you could defend the OP's posit (if you agree) rather than ignoring your own hypocrisy.

[Palin Rider]

Here's an idea, you could defend the OP's posit (if you agree) rather than ignoring your own hypocrisy.

Funny, I thought threads were supposed to "evolve" wherever the responders took them.

Here's an idea, you could move out of yer glass house. Hailstorm season is coming up.

[avatar4321]

Of course it's not stealing. Congress has a constitutional power of taxation and it's almost unlimited. They can lawfully tax almost anything they want to tax.

Robbery is the use of force to take the property of others.

We have Robbers in our government. Legalizing is doesnt change the fact that it's Robbery.

[fj1200]

Funny, I thought threads were supposed to "evolve" wherever the responders took them.

Here's an idea, you could move out of yer glass house. Hailstorm season is coming up.

And you're proud of the direction you've taken it? I guess when you don't have an argument we're subjected to your sniping comments and your definition of "evolution."

Thanks for playing.

[Palin Rider]

And you're proud of the direction you've taken it? I guess when you don't have an argument we're subjected to your sniping comments and your definition of "evolution."

This takes the "pot-meet-kettle" award for 2010. :thumb:

[fj1200]

This takes the "pot-meet-kettle" award for 2010. :thumb:

Taking a break from your High School civics paper?

Psychology of money and taxation (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?29112-Psychology-of-money-and-taxation)

It could use a bit of work.

[Palin Rider]

Taking a break from your High School civics paper?

Psychology of money and taxation (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?29112-Psychology-of-money-and-taxation)

It could use a bit of work.

That's only because everyone (including you) shrank away from the discussion in defeat so early.

[fj1200]

That's only because everyone (including you) shrank away from the discussion in defeat so early.

:laugh: Who shrank away? :laugh:


Dear FJ,

I'm going to place you on ignore.

[Palin Rider]

:laugh: Who shrank away? :laugh:

You were wrong then, and you're wrong now.

(Subtitle: I'm using the conservative tactic of repetition creating truth.)

[Kathianne]

You were wrong then, and you're wrong now.

(Subtitle: I'm using the conservative tactic of repetition creating truth.)

call it whatever you will, it is your MO.

[fj1200]

call it whatever you will, it is your MO.

Truth.

[avatar4321]

You nailed it, debt is slavery and those who control the debt are the slave masters.

I heard a good quote one time:

"Those who understand debt, collect it. Those who don't understand it, pay it"

Wish I could for the life of me remember who said it.

[avatar4321]

Typical Robin Hood Syndrome, Take Money by whatever means deemed Legal from the perceived Filthy Rich, ie, small business owner that has worked 80 hrs a week for 40 yrs often without pay to build the company for his children, and give it to the government to parcel out to the poor folks that cant and wont get a job because they are OWED a living by those of use that do. Give me a break... some people dont deserve to live in this great country... MOVE THE HELL OUT

Sounds more like the sherrif to me. Robin Hood stole from the government to give back to the people.

[Palin Rider]

I heard a good quote one time:

"Those who understand debt, collect it. Those who don't understand it, pay it"

Wish I could for the life of me remember who said it.

Some entrepreneurs pay debt to invest in resources that will more than make it up in profit, though.

[revelarts]

Of course it's not stealing. Congress has a constitutional power of taxation and it's almost unlimited. They can lawfully tax almost anything they want to tax.
As other have point out this is wrong on a lot of levels.
here's 1 take on U.S. income tax.

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[NightTrain]

As other have point out this is wrong on a lot of levels.
here's 1 take on U.S. income tax.

<object width="640" height="390"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zWN9d-8wwGk&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&version=3"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zWN9d-8wwGk&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="390"></embed></object>

That chick looks like she's about to bite someone on the leg.