1,000's of Muslims Act As Human Shields For Christians

[Psychoblues]

I feel like this is just fantastically good news and exemplifies exactly what many of us of the more sane in this regard have been saying for years.

Thousands Of Egyptian Muslims Show Up As "Human Shields" To Protect Coptic Christians From Terrorism

On New Year’s Day, a devastating terrorist bombing at a Coptic church in Egypt killed 21 people and injured 79 others. Although the identity of the culprits was not known, it was assumed that they were Muslim extremists, intent on targeting those they saw as heretics. Religious tensions immediately rose in the country, and angry Copts stormed streets, battled with police, and even vandalized a nearby mosque. The riots and heightened tensions between the Muslim and Coptic communities was likely what the terrorists wanted — to divide the Egyptian community and create sectarian strife between different religious groups.

Yet by Coptic Christmas Eve, which took place Thursday night in Egypt, things had changed completely. As Egyptian Copts attended mass at churches across the country, “thousands” of Muslims, including “the two sons of President Hosni Mubarak,” joined them, acting as “human shields” to protect from terrorist attacks by extremists. The Muslims organized under the slogan “We either live together, or we die together,” inspired by Mohamed El-Sawy, an Egyptian artist:

Egypt’s majority Muslim population stuck to its word Thursday night. What had been a promise of solidarity to the weary Coptic community, was honoured, when thousands of Muslims showed up at Coptic Christmas eve mass services in churches around the country and at candle light vigils held outside. From the well-known to the unknown, Muslims had offered their bodies as “human shields” for last night’s mass, making a pledge to collectively fight the threat of Islamic militants and towards an Egypt free from sectarian strife.

“We either live together, or we die together,” was the sloganeering genius of Mohamed El-Sawy, a Muslim arts tycoon whose cultural centre distributed flyers at churches in Cairo Thursday night, and who has been credited with first floating the “human shield” idea. Among those shields were movie stars Adel Imam and Yousra, popular preacher Amr Khaled, the two sons of President Hosni Mubarak, and thousands of citizens who have said they consider the attack one on Egypt as a whole. “This is not about us and them,” said Dalia Mustafa, a student who attended mass at Virgin Mary Church on Maraashly. “We are one. This was an attack on Egypt as a whole, and I am standing with the Copts because the only way things will change in this country is if we come together.”

Al Jazeera English covered the attacks and reported from the site of one of the solidarity events where Muslims and Christians stood side by side, protesting discrimination against Copts and calling for an end to violence.


It is a frequent complaint among opinion makers in the United States that the global Muslim community does not condemn and prevent terrorism. New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman has even said that Islam needs a civil war similar to the one the United States fought in order to deal with its extremists. But the truth is that moderate and progressive Muslims all over the world are battling extremism. Here in the United States, one-third of al-Qaeda related terror plots have been broken up thanks to intelligence provided by Muslim Americans. It is up to the press to report these positive stories and not exaggerate the sway that extremists hold over the global Muslim community.

More: http://thinkprogress.org/2011/01/08/thousands-muslims-human-shields

Psychoblues

[Trigg]

This is great news, thanks for posting.

Muslims, in the end, are the ones who are going to have to be responsible for rooting out the terrorists/extremists in their religion.

[Psychoblues]

This is great news, thanks for posting.

Muslims, in the end, are the ones who are going to have to be responsible for rooting out the terrorists/extremists in their religion.

And as Christians, we have our own demons in white robes and otherwise.

Psychoblues

[SassyLady]

Very commendable ... let's home this support continues.

[abso]

It is a frequent complaint among opinion makers in the United States that the global Muslim community does not condemn and prevent terrorism. New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman has even said that Islam needs a civil war similar to the one the United States fought in order to deal with its extremists. But the truth is that moderate and progressive Muslims all over the world are battling extremism. Here in the United States, one-third of al-Qaeda related terror plots have been broken up thanks to intelligence provided by Muslim Americans. It is up to the press to report these positive stories and not exaggerate the sway that extremists hold over the global Muslim community.

More: http://thinkprogress.org/2011/01/08/thousands-muslims-human-shields

Psychoblues

thanks for your post...

[Kathianne]

thanks for your post...

But Abso, while it's great news for those of us reading in the West, I thought the reality was there was only a few nutters that wanted to cause problems?

[abso]

But Abso, while it's great news for those of us reading in the West, I thought the reality was there was only a few nutters that wanted to cause problems?

who said otherwise ?

[Psychoblues]

Oh, my. Is doo doo necessary in just any event? God bless the Muslims and Christians that peacefully practice their religions. War is abomination.

Psychoblues

[revelarts]

that's awesome,
may that type of thing increase.
:clap:

[Kathianne]

the extremist Muslims are committed to killing the Coptics and any other religions. You all go, "Yee Haw!" because some disagree. Good luck with that.

PB you are playing into the hands of those that are blinded by wishful thinking. If it were here, you'd be at the forefront.

[Psychoblues]

the extremist Muslims are committed to killing the Coptics and any other religions. You all go, "Yee Haw!" because some disagree. Good luck with that.

PB you are playing into the hands of those that are blinded by wishful thinking. If it were here, you'd be at the forefront.

Kath, you do understand that the peaceful Muslims would be over run in about 5 minutes if what you intimate was true. Is it your purpose to fearmonger?

You have me confused, Kath. Are you not for peace, do you think war is not abomination, is terrorism amongst religions the answer? I'm confused, Kath.

Psychoblues

[logroller]

Idealism to realism -- this makes me so happy!

[abso]

the extremist Muslims are committed to killing the Coptics and any other religions. You all go, "Yee Haw!" because some disagree. Good luck with that.

PB you are playing into the hands of those that are blinded by wishful thinking. If it were here, you'd be at the forefront.

so if about 80 million egyptians disagree, and couple of hundreds of extremists agree, you say (some disagree) and consider the majority to be extremists ??? :rolleyes:

[jimnyc]

One decent gesture doesn't change the fact that Egypt continually persecutes Christians, and this includes the government. It would be the same if they protected a few women today, as tomorrow the rampant abuse of women in Egypt would still be the same.

[abso]

One decent gesture doesn't change the fact that Egypt continually persecutes Christians, and this includes the government. It would be the same if they protected a few women today, as tomorrow the rampant abuse of women in Egypt would still be the same.

continually presecute christians ?

can you tell me in points, how does egypt persecute christians, and what made that a fact ?

please tell me your opinion without posting any videos made by christians who want to look like victims.

Btw, even thousands of good gestures isnt enough for you to see the right facts.

[jimnyc]

continually presecute christians ?

can you tell me in points, how does egypt persecute christians, and what made that a fact ?

please tell me your opinion without posting any videos made by christians who want to look like victims.

Btw, even thousands of good gestures isnt enough for you to see the right facts.

How about we had a whole thread on this when you ran away stating you hadn't the time to respond?

But since you apparently have time now, start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians#Egypt
http://www.persecution.org/category/countries/africa/egypt

Deny those FACTS. I find it fucking pathetic that you didn't know about the rampant abuse of women in your country. Now you act like you don't know about the persecution of Christians. You're either a fucking liar or a denier.

[jimnyc]

Btw, even thousands of good gestures isnt enough for you to see the right facts.

I post the FACTS, it is YOU that continually denies them. This is why YOU REFUSE to debate me about YOUR country, because you know I'll slap you fucking silly about your own shithole of a country.

[abso]

How about we had a whole thread on this when you ran away stating you hadn't the time to respond?

But since you apparently have time now, start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians#Egypt
http://www.persecution.org/category/countries/africa/egypt

Deny those FACTS. I find it fucking pathetic that you didn't know about the rampant abuse of women in your country. Now you act like you don't know about the persecution of Christians. You're either a fucking liar or a denier.

nope, still dont have time, my first exam is tomorrow, and its the most difficult exam, i was just taking a break, and wanted to check the forum as i do everyday, but i rarely respond this days as you notice.

since i dont have time to argue about all things mentioned in the article, i will just respond to some points:

Education:



Many colleges dictate quotas for Coptic students, often around 1 or 2% despite the group making up 15% of the country's population.


Not true at all, there is not quotas at all for any type of students.

the quota is only for studenst who is not undertaking the egyptian education (General Secondary Certificate), students who study according to the british system (IG), or american diploma in private schools, such students have different system for calculating their degree, and equating it with the general secondary certificate, they have a Quota of 5% in every college in egypt, while they only make about 1-2% of the students, which make them enter better colleges with less degrees, but since such education is expensive, its not available for everyone to take that easy choice.



There is also a separate tax-funded education system called Al Azhar, catering to students from elementary to college level, which accepts no Christian Coptic students, teachers or administrators.


AL-Azhar is mainly a religious institute, and Islamic religion is being teached in it in all its colleges, even engineering and medicine and pharmacy and such practical colleges, because it was at first merely a religious institue which teaches religion and prepare people to be preachers, then the practical education were introduced to it, but still religion is being teached along with any studies taken in Al-Azhar univeristy, thats why its only for muslims.

and about Al-Azhar schools, they also teach religion as a main subject, and it have a great effect on their final degree, thats why they are a seperate system for schools, and they have different system for calculating their final degrees required for universities admission, as done with IG and American diploma students.




Hundreds of Christian Coptic girls have been kidnapped and forcibly converted to Islam, as well as being victims of rape and forced marriage to Muslim men.


not true, none is forced to convert in egypt, the only problem is that if a muslim converts to christianity, his family may kill him or force him back to Islam, and if a christian converts to Islam the same happens, his family kills him or force him back to christianity, its problem with the families, and it happened before that a christian girl loved a muslim man, then she converted to Islam and married him, her brother killed her along with her new born baby and injured her muslim husband.



most of what mentioned in the article are incidents done by extremists and some were done by just criminals who had nothing to do with religion like the incident that happend in eve of Januray 7, 2010, that had nothing to do with religion.

the terrorism have nothing to do with christians being persecuted in egypt, persecution means that the government itself treats them any different than muslims or denies them any rights, persecution is some legal actions against christians, but its not persecution when some extremists hates christians any kill them, that is not persecution, that is terrorism.

[jimnyc]

There are verifiable links in the articles I pointed you to which backup their words. Of course, as usual, you deny anything that puts muslims in a bad light, and as usual you give no links to dispute what is in the wiki page.

You're a denier and sympathizer.

Let me see how you deny the following from that page:


While the Egyptian government does not have a policy to persecute Christians, it discriminates against them and hampers their freedom of worship. Its agencies sporadically persecute Muslim converts to Christianity.[137] The government enforces Hamayouni Decree restrictions on building or repairing churches. These same restrictions, however, do not apply to mosques.[137]

The government has effectively restricted Christians from senior government, diplomatic, military, and educational positions, and there has been increasing discrimination in the private sector.[137][138] The government subsidizes media which attack Christianity and restricts Christians access to the state-controlled media.[137]

In Egypt the government does not officially recognize conversions from Islam to Christianity; because certain interfaith marriages are not allowed either, this prevents marriages between converts to Christianity and those born in Christian communities, and also results in the children of Christian converts being classified as Muslims and given a Muslim education.[137] The government also applies religiously discriminatory laws and practices concerning clergy salaries.[137]

Foreign missionaries are allowed in the country only if they restrict their activities to social improvements and refrain from proselytizing. The Coptic Pope Shenouda III was internally exiled in 1981 by President Anwar Sadat, who then chose five Coptic bishops and asked them to choose a new pope. They refused, and in 1985 President Hosni Mubarak restored Pope Shenouda III, who had been accused of fomenting interconfessional strife. Particularly in Upper Egypt, the rise in extremist Islamist groups such as the Gama'at Islamiya during the 1980s was accompanied by attacks on Copts and on Coptic churches; these have since declined with the decline of those organizations, but still continue. The police have been accused of siding with the attackers in some of these cases.[139]

[Nukeman]

A question I would like answered would be WHY did the Egyptian security forces leave 1 hour before the bombing?? Why did they not stay untill the service was over like they routinely do??

Also if this was done by extremist why were the Muslims chanting Allah akbar after the deadly bombing. Are you telling me that all the Muslims that attend the mosque across the street are extremist or are they just "misguided" you know revelling in the death, dismemberment, and desicration of the Coptic Christians!!!??

They (Muslims) were stepping on the strewn body parts of the Christians channting Allah akbar. All I can say is how cowerdly can you be that you feel the need to add insult to injury...???!!! F***ing pigs!!!! FILTH!!!!


Eyewitnesses also claim that state security forces guarding the church left the scene nearly one hour before the blast. “Normally they would have waited until the mass was over,” said Hany el-Gezeiry, head of Copts4Egypt. It’s unclear why any security forces would have left the scene as worshipers continued their service, especially after al-Qaida had previously threatened attacks on the Copts.



According to church officials and eyewitnesses, there are many more victims that are still unidentified and whose body parts were strewn all over the street outside the church. The body parts were covered with newspapers until they were brought inside the church after some Muslims started stepping on them and chanting Jihadi chants (video showing dead bodies and limbs covered with newspapers in the street).

[jimnyc]

The news reports lie, abso's uncle was there! And saying allah akbar to the christians was the muslims way of being respectful towards them, at least according to abso once again.

You can't believe everything you read and see in videos! They never walked on any body parts, abso says so!

And there is no persecution of christians, those entries on wikipedia about what the Egyptian government does is all lies. abso knows best.

And there isn't rampant abuse of women in egypt. The endless amount of documentation from the women themselves is all lies, probably coming from the jews who wish to shed the filthy muslims in a bad light! LOL

[pete311]

can you tell me in points, how does egypt persecute christians, and what made that a fact ?


I remember when swine flu went around, the egyptian gov killed all the coptics pigs even though everyone knew pigs weren't the cause of the disease.


I'll slap you fucking silly about your own shithole of a country.

Out of line. Egypt's people and places can be very special. I've visited twice for about a month each.

[Psychoblues]

continually presecute christians ?

can you tell me in points, how does egypt persecute christians, and what made that a fact ?

please tell me your opinion without posting any videos made by christians who want to look like victims.

Btw, even thousands of good gestures isnt enough for you to see the right facts.

abso, I have lived in the middle east among practically 100% Muslims. Muslims are not the demons these islamophobes would have everybody else believe. Typically the population couldn't care one whit as to my religious inclinations except to the point that if I asked questions of the Islamic religions and given answers they considered that as having enlightened me and then they expected me to adhere or be considered a heretic. I was very careful not to engage in religious conversations over there.

Muslims have just as hard if not a harder time here trying to assimilate. You've certainly been exposed to tremendous and terribly unjustified islamophobia right here on this board. Do not despair, abso. They reveal their own weakness with their hate, fear, vileness, misunderstanding, etc. Even though you do well it is obvious to me that English is not your first language and you make a good number of mistakes in your writing. Some of these jerks cannot argue with your point so they exploit your mistakes and unjustly criticize. Most times you are not even aware of what they are doing to you so that is definitely not your fault. But, it does demonstrate the lack of character on the part of those that surely know better. They cannot hide and they are not cute.

Psychoblues