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View Full Version : Debt, deficits, and American morals



chloe
08-14-2011, 05:21 PM
John Adams once wrote: "Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." Alexis de tocquville wrote in Democracy in America that if one is to be dogmatic, he should be so in religion rather than politics, because compromise is essential in a democracy. And the great theologian C.S.Lewis said sick society would focus on politics as a sick man focuses on his digestion.
After a momentous two weeks in which the United States has tottered near default, brokered a weak compromise, seen the stock market seesaw wildly, and had a credit rating agency downgrade US debt for the first time in seven decades, things certainly look unhealthy. It's easy to point fingers: Take your pick. Most Americans trust Washington as much as Wall Street, which ranks just above used car dealers. But before we blame others, consider what those three great moral thinkers are saying.
Would they suggest in today's turmoil that we look to our own moral character – take the log from our own eyes, as Christ Jesus put it – before demonizing others?
I have a degree in political science, have spent three decades on Wall have spent three decades on Wall Street, and have written five books on the morality of political economy. So I am fascinated by the connections among the private, public, and independent sectors of our economy. Despite the cynicism toward Washington, I believe our true problem reflects the flawed thinking that has created the impasse between those who believe that government is the answer and those who have faith that "capitalism will save us," as Steve Forbes has written. Strange as it may seem, the heart of this economics debate is moral, even religious, particularly among cultural elites.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/new-economy

Do you think that is true? Is an economic downfall a result of immoral business practices?

SassyLady
08-14-2011, 05:25 PM
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/new-economy

Do you think that is true? Is an economic downfall a result of immoral business practices?

Immoral business practices involving lobbyists, over zealous progressive regulations, class warfare, you name it ... it's not just one thing.

Kathianne
08-14-2011, 08:51 PM
Both politicians and Wall St. financial companies, (especially banks, insurance companies, mortgage companies and venture capitalists), taking all for a ride. In particular Fannie and Freddie executives, lobbyists, congress that was supposed to regulate. Take a few hours to read, "Reckless Endangerment," for a glimpse of what happened.

Will we recover? I honestly don't know, but for many the idea of owning a home is no longer a dream, but a nightmare. It didn't have to happen.

fj1200
08-14-2011, 09:04 PM
Do you think that is true? Is an economic downfall a result of immoral business practices?

No. The pursuit of profit is not immoral. At best it's moral and at worst it's amoral. What becomes immoral is when government will act as cover to favor one group over another or establish rules that are contrary to a free market. When transparency in business practice is favored then there is healthy competition which acts as its own check on immorality.

Prince Lemon
08-14-2011, 09:48 PM
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/new-economy

Do you think that is true? Is an economic downfall a result of immoral business practices?
I believe America gets a total market collapse and USD default for all her decay.

TheShadowKNows
08-14-2011, 10:22 PM
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/new-economy

Do you think that is true? Is an economic downfall a result of immoral business practices?

Your post is representing what has become a complicated, and confused issue. So what I am about to offer, will at first appear to be "sophmoric" at the least, and no doubt laughable to some at the worst.
With that having been said, my contention in response to the above can, for the most part, be traced back to the outrageous growth of Government in the past 20+ years. While the plethora of "Carpetbaggers" remain a threat on an ongoing basis to any Government. Their ability to influence and execute policy to suit their own personal agendas, finds a safe haven through the litany of bureaucratic mazes that have been instituted by the powers that be.
As if the confusion created by a system of "paper pushers" isn't intimidating enough, we have more than a few multi-term congressmen who have become so ingrained within the system that they must be "satisfied" ( use your imagination ) before any legislation is finalized. Regardless of it's benefits to the American taxpayers. While admittedly "solving" problems would render Washington elites USELESS, they have gone the extra mile and now have turned shody legislation into a fine art.
You need look no further for an example of such than that disgrace of a free Republic called "Obamacare". Admittedly requiring the hiring of 17,000 I.R.S. agents to oversee the populous' mandatory adherence to it's participation, along with initiating 150 new bureaucracies to pass more paper around. Along with grossly inadequate benefits and outrageously expensive costs. Not to mention the inherent "tenacles" designed within, that will eventually lead to Goverment's control in every area of our lives. IE; Food, Housing, Vehicles, Recreation, Schools, ETC. ETC. ETC..
While now their latest crowning glory of confused misrepresentation, the "Debt Ceiling Increase". Designed to let both parties off the hook while accomplishing nothing to explicitly curb the run away spending that has caused our economic crisis. Proving once more that "establishment" politicans of both parties only have their jobs in mind, and the Taxpayer once more comes in a distant third. Behind the "Power Brokers" who are the real "Movers n' Shakers" of all things Monetary ( does the name George Soros ring a familiar note ).
The short answer is that all Governments have the potential to be corrupt, as Power corrupts. While that is exactly why our forefathers "insisted" that the citizenry MUST oversee the people that they elect.
Now all that you have to do, is find them through the plethora of "Mazes" that they have created.
ROTS of RUK

fj1200
08-14-2011, 10:39 PM
I believe America gets a total market collapse and USD default for all her decay.

Will that be before or after the rapture?