PDA

View Full Version : A question for our gun users



Abbey
08-20-2012, 11:21 AM
Can a gun accidentally fire if the safety is on? Does the answer change depending on what caliber gun?

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
08-20-2012, 11:41 AM
Can a gun accidentally fire if the safety is on? Does the answer change depending on what caliber gun?

With older models perhaps but with the newer guns its almost impossible unless the safey has been damaged. Caliber has nothing to do with it. Some guns have back up safeties in that one must cock the hammer before it will fire even with the safety off. As always most the older models were less safety conscious when designed and manufactured. The thinking then was that most gun owners know proper safety procedures with guns and are experienced with their proper use, at least here in USA that was pretty much true. Treat every gun like its loaded as an extra precaution .Never put your finger inside the trigger guard unless you are aiming at a target with intent to shoot or are using the gun to hold off an intruder /attacker. Never leave loaded guns were others can get to them unless its a trusted family member even then I dont reccommend it unles that person is extremely skilled in gun safety and use of such weapons! I have mine close by with chamber empty , clip out next to it when at home at night as my son is far too young to put in the clip or rack in a shell. When he gets a few years older I'll have to come up with a different method. A gun that takes too long to get to is MOST OFTEN as useless as "tats" on a boar hog IMHO. -Tyr

logroller
08-20-2012, 12:21 PM
Disclaimer: If you have any concerns, whatsoever, contact a gunsmith before attempting to operate any firearm. Is this a generic concern, or have you something specific?

Answer: no, it should not and matters not the caliber.
Can it? Sure. Depending on the weapon, firing groups (pin, sear, hammer, trigger etc) have a variety of parts which, if worn, damaged or improperly modified, can lead to unintended discharges.
There is an inviolable rule to firearm safety, never point a weapon at something you are not willing to kill or destroy. That alone renders grave accidents to an ah shit moment.

logroller
08-20-2012, 12:27 PM
With older models perhaps but with the newer guns its almost impossible unless the safey has been damaged. Caliber has nothing to do with it. Some guns have back up safeties in that one must cock the hammer before it will fire even with the safety off. As always most the older models were less safety conscious when designed and manufactured. The thinking then was that most gun owners know proper safety procedures with guns and are experienced with their proper use, at least here in USA that was pretty much true. Treat every gun like its loaded as an extra precaution .Never put your finger inside the trigger guard unless you are aiming at a target with intent to shoot or are using the gun to hold off an intruder /attacker. Never leave loaded guns were others can get to them unless its a trusted family member even then I dont reccommend it unles that person is extremely skilled in gun safety and use of such weapons! I have mine close by with chamber empty , clip out next to it when at home at night as my son is far too young to put in the clip or rack in a shell. When he gets a few years older I'll have to come up with a different method. A gun that takes too long to get to is MOST OFTEN as useless as "tats" on a boar hog IMHO. -Tyr
I agree with this, except it's a magazine, not a clip. (unless you have a revolver, Garand or linked-belt fed weapon) the key is the spring; if it has a spring inside, it's a mag!

Abbey
08-20-2012, 04:42 PM
Disclaimer: If you have any concerns, whatsoever, contact a gunsmith before attempting to operate any firearm. Is this a generic concern, or have you something specific?

Answer: no, it should not and matters not the caliber.
Can it? Sure. Depending on the weapon, firing groups (pin, sear, hammer, trigger etc) have a variety of parts which, if worn, damaged or improperly modified, can lead to unintended discharges.
There is an inviolable rule to firearm safety, never point a weapon at something you are not willing to kill or destroy. That alone renders grave accidents to an ah shit moment.

It's a claim made by someone I know who accidentally discharged a gun while it was holstered, in a house while people were visiting with little children. He said the safety was on. I wasn't there, and don't know if the gun was old or new. I didn't believe him, and was wondering about it.

tailfins
08-20-2012, 04:48 PM
It's a claim made by someone I know who accidentally discharged a gun while it was holstered in a house while people were visiting with little children. He said the safety was on. I wasn't there, and don't know if the gun was old or new. I didn't believe him, and was wondering about it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NDKe2PVphg

Mr. P
08-20-2012, 05:58 PM
It's a claim made by someone I know who accidentally discharged a gun while it was holstered in a house while people were visiting with little children. He said the safety was on. I wasn't there, and don't know if the gun was old or new. I didn't believe him, and was wondering about it.

Neither do I.

aboutime
08-20-2012, 07:14 PM
Neither do I.


No way. Anyone who believed that story is probably guilty of buying the mortgage for the Brooklyn Bridge too!

logroller
08-20-2012, 09:56 PM
It's a claim made by someone I know who accidentally discharged a gun while it was holstered in a house while people were visiting with little children. He said the safety was on. I wasn't there, and don't know if the gun was old or new. I didn't believe him, and was wondering about it.
For the most part, all holsters cover the trigger, so I'm not quite sure how it went off (regardless of being on safe). My guess is he was (mis)handling the weapon, and if in fact his weapon was capable of discharging while on safe, he has an extremely unsafe weapon-- to which he should have been aware. I couldnt fathom having a loaded weapon in my possession in which I was anything less than 100% confident. My life could depend upon it after all. Plus, given the circumstance of his having a loaded (unsafe) weapon around children and handling it, I have to question his awareness on a broad swath of firearm related issues. From the sound of your story, thank God no one was injured.

Abbey
08-21-2012, 02:22 PM
Yup, he's a Darwin Award candidate at this point, as he accidentally shot himself with it. No major injuries, though.

Thanks everyone for your opinions. I believe that you all know what you are talking about, and as I've said, I didn't believe him. :thumb:

Voted4Reagan
08-21-2012, 04:35 PM
RIMFIRE AMMUNITION is more prone to an accidental discharge ....

Center Fire Ammo is far less likely..

CSM
08-22-2012, 08:00 AM
I dunno. Something funny here as guns don't just go off by themselves. Safety or no safety, if the gun is secured in the holster and no one is messing with it, I don't see how it just "cooked off" a round. I have several older single action revolvers that are not equipped with a safety; none of them EVER fired a round all by themselves. I have many other firearms that have safeties and none of those EVER fired a round "accidently" whether the safety was on or off.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
08-22-2012, 08:31 AM
I dunno. Something funny here as guns don't just go off by themselves. Safety or no safety, if the gun is secured in the holster and no one is messing with it, I don't see how it just "cooked off" a round. I have several older single action revolvers that are not equipped with a safety; none of them EVER fired a round all by themselves. I have many other firearms that have safeties and none of those EVER fired a round "accidently" whether the safety was on or off.

I am 58 years old and have owned and often fired well over 300 guns in my life. I've been shooting guns since I was six years old and never have I known of a gun just firing off a round by itself. I've been buying ,selling and trading guns for over 40 years and NEVER known that to occur. Short and simple answer is the guy is lying like hell.-:laugh:-Tyr

Nukeman
08-22-2012, 08:51 AM
Ya know just to throw this in, WHY did he have a round in the chamber and why was it cocked, that is the ONLY way a round can go off!?!?!?!?!? Unless he was expecting some serious shit to go down why was this pistol "ready" to fire in the first place????

Have no problem with a clip in but you don't need to chamber a round until you are ready to use it!!! if it was a revolver you have to have the hammer cocked otherwise ITS NOT GOING TO DISCHARGE!!!!

So once again WHY DID HE HAVE THE GUN READY TO SHOOT AT A PRIVATE PARTY WITH KIDS????? F-ing moron!!!!!!

Abbey
08-22-2012, 01:40 PM
I can GUARANTEE you there was no threat whatsoever. This is a nice vacation home, no neighbors for a ways. The others in the house didn't report any problems. It's as low a crime area as you can imagine. No bears or wolves, etc., threatening anyone either. I also found out that he was "showing" his always-worn-on-his-belt hunting knife to a 6 year old girl in the house.
:lame2:

logroller
08-22-2012, 01:59 PM
I met a guy once who claimed he was an amateur gunsmith... cut from the same cloth as the guy in the OP.

jimnyc
08-22-2012, 02:35 PM
Abbey, forgive me for asking what may have been answered... How well do you know this person? Did you verify the wounds? I ask, because it sounds like a good argument from a liberal anti-gun nutter looking for "ammo" to push for more gun regulation or similar.

Abbey
08-22-2012, 02:40 PM
Abbey, forgive me for asking what may have been answered... How well do you know this person? Did you verify the wounds? I ask, because it sounds like a good argument from a liberal anti-gun nutter looking for "ammo" to push for more gun regulation or similar.

No problem, I know it sounds weird. I know him, and I have family members who were there, and took him to the hospital. It's real.

Dilloduck
08-22-2012, 05:42 PM
Mechanical failures. Wear, faulty assembly, damage or faulty design of the firearm can cause it not to function as intended. For instance, a safety may have been worn down to a point where it is no longer functioning. Broken or worn parts in the trigger, sear or hammer/striker may have given the firearm a "hair trigger" (a very sensitive trigger). A dented or bent body of the firearm may cause jams or premature discharge of ammunition. Sensitivity to impact may cause a firearm to discharge if dropped or struck against another object.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_safety

I would never trust a safety.

Or your "friend" for that matter

Abbey
08-22-2012, 05:56 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_safety

I would never trust a safety.

Or your "friend" for that matter

Why "friend" in quotes? Do you think it is me?

Dilloduck
08-22-2012, 06:13 PM
Why "friend" in quotes? Do you think it is me?

LMAO--no no no====

I was just thinking that this person may not be a big buddy of yours after this incident.

Abbey
08-22-2012, 07:43 PM
LMAO--no no no====

I was just thinking that this person may not be a big buddy of yours after this incident.

Ha! I've always been leery of him. Unfortunately, he is a my nephew's best friend, and the family still shows no signs of reining him in.

While we're on the subject, what do you all think of people shooting squirrels out of the window of their home? With neighbors on both sides. He does this, too.

cadet
08-22-2012, 08:12 PM
Ha! I've always been leery of him. Unfortunately, he is a my nephew's best friend, and the family still shows no signs of reining him in.

While we're on the subject, what do you all think of people shooting squirrels out of the window of their home? With neighbors on both sides. He does this, too.

Tell him to kill those stupid squirrels, maybe they'll learn to stay away from the bird feeder.
Oh, and squirrel taco's are awesome. Made some up here :rolleyes:, just happens to be enough meat for one!

logroller
08-23-2012, 01:34 AM
I dunno. Something funny here as guns don't just go off by themselves. Safety or no safety, if the gun is secured in the holster and no one is messing with it, I don't see how it just "cooked off" a round. I have several older single action revolvers that are not equipped with a safety; none of them EVER fired a round all by themselves. I have many other firearms that have safeties and none of those EVER fired a round "accidently" whether the safety was on or off.
Those revolvers don't have a half-cock; that is old!


. I also found out that he was "showing" his always-worn-on-his-belt hunting knife to a 6 year old girl in the house.
:lame2: what would Freud say about that????


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_safety

I would never trust a safety.

Or your "friend" for that matter
I have a good friend who's a competive shooter, and his guns are modified extensively, includin the trigger pull-- but its not as though thats his carry weapon-- that's like commuting in a drag car.


Ha! I've always been leery of him. Unfortunately, he is a my nephew's best friend, and the family still shows no signs of reining him in.

While we're on the subject, what do you all think of people shooting squirrels out of the window of their home? With neighbors on both sides. He does this, too.

Ive shot a lot, not as much as some, but enough to have been muzzle swept a time or two and had to have a heart to heart conversation on the basics of firearm safety. That muzzle sweep thing, that violates rule 2-- never cover your muzzle with anything youre not willing to destroy. I'll not bore you with four basics, but respect for firearms and the safety of those around you is of paramount concern. Discharging a weapon in proximity to any house/residence is a big no-no in all but the most dire of circumstances. Ok; maybe I'll bore you:coffee:
that last one, firing around houses with trees, bushes, rocks and what not--that likely violates rule 4 -- know your target and beyond. It likely violates county ordinances as well.
The first rule is treat every firearm as if it's loaded. That's the cardinal rule; and one abbey's friend clearly violated when, by trusting in the safety device, neglected to respect the fact it's a loaded weapon. This is why you always check a weapon before handling it; both before giving it somebody and upon receiving it. Which brings me to rule 3 -- keep your finger of the trigger until ready to fire (I'm guessing abbeys friend violated this rule too). This is a learned behavior, and if you watch trained marksmen, from the draw and throughout the sighting process the trigger (and guard) will be unattended. Quite frankly, it takes multiple rule violations to result in an accidental injury. This guy was just careless, the gun did exactly what it is intended to do, and it sounds like he's been dealt a healthy dose of reality, but somebody needs to sit him down and have a talk about responsible gun ownership...for the children.:salute:

SassyLady
08-23-2012, 01:57 AM
Abbey, I always handle my gun as if the safety cannot be trusted. So, it's like a backup plan.

logroller
08-23-2012, 02:25 AM
Abbey, I always handle my gun as if the safety cannot be trusted. So, it's like a backup plan.
Exactly. To do otherwise would be the equivalent of wearing a seatbelt and thinking you can ignore the basic rules of the road.

CSM
08-24-2012, 08:20 AM
Those revolvers don't have a half-cock; that is old!



I am an old guy with old guns (which happen to be in Excellent condition ... unlike their owner). I don't consider "half -cock" as a safety anyway.