American Embassy and Consulate invaded

[avatar4321]

Im surprised there isnt a thread on the violence of the past 24 hrs.

The American Embassy in Egypt was invaded by rioters. They burned the American flag. There was discussion of possibly hostages, but I dont think there were any taken. Atleast not the last time I checked.

An American Consulate in Libya was attacked by gunfire. At least one was killed. The building was set on fire.

All because someone made an unflattering film about Mohammad.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/video-shows-islamists-in-cairo-tearing-apart-american-flag-on-911-anniversary/

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/american-shot-to-death-in-us-consulate-attack-libyan-security-official-says/

The Embassy had apologized to the rioters. It looks like the White House was smart enough to repudiate it. Probably after they got some backlash about it.

These are acts of war. I seriously dont want to go to war. We need to get our house in order. But these are clearly acts of war, and i dont think this is the last of it.

[Gaffer]

I'm surprised there isn't a bunch of threads on this and opinions flying all over the place.

The ambassador to lybia was killed and 3 others were killed as well. All because of a movie posted on the internet. Raging barbarians are at it again. They have found an excuse to go into a murderous rage. The Cairo embassy was attacked as well. This is an act of war and if we had a real president there would be serious action taken.

Damn, talk about carter 2, this is unreal.

[glockmail]

These people respond to weakness by attacking you. The Obama has weakened the US in so many ways, not the least of which is financial. About half of Americans understand that, and the rest are Democrats.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

These people respond to weakness by attacking you. The Obama has weakened the US in so many ways, not the least of which is financial. About half of Americans understand that, and the rest are Democrats.

The rest are "useful idiots" but hey you said democrats so I just repeated you.;)

[Voted4Reagan]

Another attack by the RELIGION OF PEACE in the name of ALLAH...

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/international/american_ambassador_others_killed_uvtJF2mvUd6CzlMs rh169K

The person killed was a United States Ambassador!! WHY ARE WE APOLOGIZING?? WTF IS WRONG WITH OBAMA?

Yup.... Obama is certainly the second coming of President Peanut.... Thank god Carters Second Term ends in less then 2 months.

Pathetic.

Jafar.... So much for your PEACEFUL MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD!!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Another attack by the RELIGION OF PEACE in the name of ALLAH...

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/international/american_ambassador_others_killed_uvtJF2mvUd6CzlMs rh169K

The person killed was a United States Ambassador!! WHY ARE WE APOLOGIZING?? WTF IS WRONG WITH OBAMA?

Yup.... Obama is certainly the second coming of President Peanut.... Thank god Carters Second Term ends in less then 2 months.

Pathetic.

Jafar.... So much for your PEACEFUL MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD!!

Jafar can not say this did not happen. So my guess is that he will righteously declare the guilty party to not be "real muslims"!! Perhaps they were just ordinary "criminals" out for a stroll . And certainly not MB types. -Tyr

[Voted4Reagan]

I think of the Second line of the Greatest Military anthem ever written.....

TO THE SHORES OF TRIPOLI!!


http://youtu.be/N1Fr5ILu-Hg

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I think of the Second line of the Greatest Military anthem ever written.....

TO THE SHORES OF TRIPOLI!!


http://youtu.be/N1Fr5ILu-Hg

To every embassy in danger from muslim scum there should be detached a 50 man squad of Marines armed with automatic weapons , at least 2,000 rounds of ammo each, and
told to do Chesty Puller proud--Tyr

[tailfins]

Another attack by the RELIGION OF PEACE in the name of ALLAH...

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/international/american_ambassador_others_killed_uvtJF2mvUd6CzlMs rh169K

The person killed was a United States Ambassador!! WHY ARE WE APOLOGIZING?? WTF IS WRONG WITH OBAMA?

Yup.... Obama is certainly the second coming of President Peanut.... Thank god Carters Second Term ends in less then 2 months.

Pathetic.

Jafar.... So much for your PEACEFUL MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD!!

Maybe being corporatized has led me not to belittle a religion, but I will say this: The American way of life must be restored and I don't care how Uncle Sam does it. Whatever it takes.

[krisy]

I know this. I just watched Romneys press conference and was very impressed.He was unapologetic,as he should be.This country should NOT be apologizing for anything!!!!

Now Obama is speaking and has allready insinuated that this country condems picking on anyones religon(in reference to the u tube movie)?!!! I cannot believe this!!!! Hard to find the words.

[tailfins]

I know this. I just watched Romneys press conference and was very impressed.He was unapologetic,as he should be.This country should NOT be apologizing for anything!!!!

Now Obama is speaking and has allready insinuated that this country condems picking on anyones religon(in reference to the u tube movie)?!!! I cannot believe this!!!! Hard to find the words.

I don't care what links the perpetrators. If they are bound together by a poker club, neutralize that poker club. I want the job done. Enough of these attacks on our people. If the perpetrators are bound by a mosque, neutralize that mosque. I don't care. Whatever it takes.

[glockmail]

I've said before that our presence in the ME should be a large air base in Iraq far away from the urban areas and protected by a ten-mile deep kill zone. We'd fly all our supplies in and don't need to interact with the folks there at all. It's main purpose would be to protect our few allies in the region by providing air support.

Now I'm thinking that we no longer need embassies in these countries that are hostile to us. The historical reason for embassies is to foster trade with the host country, and we have no need to trade with them except for oil, and we can do that with OPEC at the UAE. Remove the staff at these locations. We technically own the land parcels so we'll retain ownership and rent them, or have local groups use them as orphanages or schools.

[Dilloduck]

I don't care what links the perpetrators. If they are bound together by a poker club, neutralize that poker club. I want the job done. Enough of these attacks on our people. If the perpetrators are bound by a mosque, neutralize that mosque. I don't care. Whatever it takes.

They are bound by the fact that they are all Africans. Are you suggesting we kill all Africans ?

[Thunderknuckles]

They are bound by the fact that they are all Africans. Are you suggesting we kill all Africans ?
No, they are bound by Islam.
It should be clear to all that radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the democratic value of free speech.

[Dilloduck]

No, they are bound by Islam.
It should be clear to all that radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the democratic value of free speech.

Then charge the ones who have committed a crime just like we do every other American. It ain't rocket science. Do you plan on pinning red cresents on all of them too ?

[Dilloduck]

No, they are bound by Islam.
It should be clear to all that radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the democratic value of free speech.

They are bound by their criminal minds.

[Thunderknuckles]

[CENTER]

They are bound by their criminal minds.
No, they are not. These are common people inflamed by an insult to their religion who are retaliating and killing innocents in the name of their God.
The act was criminal but the impetus behind it was not the same as that of a common criminal. They are religious zealots. Completely different.

The only thing I will agree with you on is that they need to be brought to justice like criminals.

[Dilloduck]

No, they are not. These are common people inflamed by an insult to their religion who are retaliating and killing innocents in the name of their God.
The act was criminal but the impetus behind it was not the same as that of a common criminal. They are religious zealots. Completely different.

The only thing I will agree with you on is that they need to be brought to justice like criminals.

Every muslim in the world or just the ones who commited these crimes ?

[Thunderknuckles]

Every muslim in the world or just the ones who commited these crimes ?
Violent, and deadly, retaliation against an insult to Islam is part of Islamic culture. Is every Muslim in the world at this moment a criminal?
No, but they have a much higher propensity for becoming violent due to the demands of Islamic culture.

As I said before, radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the values of free speech. It simply cannot tolerate an insult to the prophet Muhammad or Allah with a turn of the cheek. Death must be the indemnity.

[Dilloduck]

Violent, and deadly, retaliation against an insult to Islam is part of Islamic culture. Is every Muslim in the world at this moment a criminal?
No, but they have a much higher propensity for becoming violent due to the demands of Islamic culture.

As I said before, radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the values of free speech. It simply cannot tolerate an insult to the prophet Muhammad or Allah with a turn of the cheek. Death must be the indemnity.

It obviously isn't part of American Islamic culture. There were no riots or murders here.

[Thunderknuckles]

It obviously isn't part of American Islamic culture. There were no riots or murders here.
Oh, I believe it is. Don't think for a moment that American Muslims aren't pissed about the insult to Mohammad. As I've said before, there isn't much they can do about it here without a major blow-back to Muslims in general.

You and I simply have a very different view of Islam.

[Dilloduck]

Oh, I believe it is. Don't think for a moment that American Muslims aren't pissed about the insult to Mohammad. As I've said before, there isn't much they can do about it here without a major blow-back to Muslims in general.

You and I simply have a very different view of Islam.

They have every right to be pissed. Everyone in America has a right to be pissed. The Islamic culture in America however did NOT KILL OR RIOT. Are you saying they want to but are too afraid ? Can you substantiate that with facts of any kind or is this more of the same Islamic hatred expoused by the person who created this movie in the first place ?

You are correct. I have very different view of Islam than you do.

[tailfins]

[CENTER]

They are bound by their criminal minds.


So let's drop prosecution if someone forgot to read them their Miranda rights? Correct? Responding to this as a criminal justice issue isn't working and the countries where this happened are not arresting the perpetrators.

[Thunderknuckles]

They have every right to be pissed. Everyone in America has a right to be pissed. The Islamic culture in America however did NOT KILL OR RIOT. Are you saying they want to but are too afraid ? Can you substantiate that with facts of any kind or is this more of the same Islamic hatred expoused by the person who created this movie in the first place ?

You are correct. I have very different view of Islam than you do.
I have not hate for Islam. However, one should be wary of any culture that demands your death in retaliation for what they believe to be an insult.
That's the last I will say about it.

[Dilloduck]

So let's drop prosecution if someone forgot to read them their Miranda rights? Correct? Responding to this as a criminal justice issue isn't working and the countries where this happened are not arresting the perpetrators.

It just happened and you don't know if they will arrest them or not. How about we set aside insane bigotry for a bit and give the legal system a few seconds to do it's business ?

[tailfins]

It just happened and you don't know if they will arrest them or not. How about we set aside insane bigotry for a bit and give the legal system a few seconds to do it's business ?


So in your book, demanding results is bigotry. I see. Let me guess: you think companies exist to further social responsibility.

[Dilloduck]

So in your book, demanding results is bigotry. I see. Let me guess: you think companies exist to further social responsibility.

Wrong----How in the hell did you manage to twist my post into something that bizarre ?

[tailfins]

Wrong----How in the hell did you manage to twist my post into something that bizarre ?


It's called pattern matching. You seem to dislike the demand for success in putting an end to these attacks without abridging the American way of life.

[Dilloduck]

It's called pattern matching. You seem to dislike the demand for success in putting an end to these attacks without abridging the American way of life.

I dislike condemning all muslims as insane and fanatic murderers when the evidence plainly shows the ones committing the acts are a criminal minority. Attempting to put and end to these attacks by attacking an entire religion and it's adherents is bound to backfire and cause more criminal acts than we can even imagine. Arrest and convict the guilty. Stop the criminal gangs, enforce the law but condemning millions of people for nothing more than association? No thanks. Hitler tried that .

[Little-Acorn]

(oops, duplicate post)

[Little-Acorn]

BTW, technically they did not commit "crimes", which are civil matters. They committed acts of war by forcibly invading sovereign U.S. territory (the U.S. consulates and embassies in Egypt and Libya), and committed war crimes by killing the ambassador to Egypt and civilian personnel.

We may give that a miss, depending on how quickly the Libyan and Egyptian governments collar, prosecute, and punish the ones who did these things, and let it go as simple civil "crimes".

But if those governments don't get their acts together REAL quick, we must retain the option of regarding them as the acts of war and war crimes they are, and using whatever means we find necessary (including military means followed by U.S. military tribunals) to redress them.

[Dilloduck]

BTW, technically they did not commit "crimes", which are civil matters. They committed acts of war by forcibly invading sovereign U.S. territory (the U.S. consulates and embassies in Egypt and Libya), and committed war crimes by killing the ambassador to Egypt and civilian personnel.

We may give that a miss, depending on how quickly the Libyan and Egyptian governments collar, prosecute, and punish the ones who did these things, and let it go as simple civil "crimes".

But if those governments don't get their acts together REAL quick, we must retain the option of regarding them as the acts of war and war crimes they are, and using whatever means we find necessary (including military means followed by U.S. military tribunals) to redress them.

Our I'm sure we can blow the hell out of them whenever we wish. I just hope that the US is a bit more careful about who we support in the future when we decide to overthrow a government. Syria comes to mind.

[tailfins]

Our I'm sure we can blow the hell out of them whenever we wish. I just hope that the US is a bit more careful about who we support in the future when we decide to overthrow a government. Syria comes to mind.

A correct response should be swayed neither by the prejudiced nor the apologist. A correct result is driven by correct information.

[avatar4321]

I'm surprised there isn't a bunch of threads on this and opinions flying all over the place.

The ambassador to lybia was killed and 3 others were killed as well. All because of a movie posted on the internet. Raging barbarians are at it again. They have found an excuse to go into a murderous rage. The Cairo embassy was attacked as well. This is an act of war and if we had a real president there would be serious action taken.

Damn, talk about carter 2, this is unreal.

This is beyond Carter. Carter wasnt this bad.

[Kathianne]

BTW, technically they did not commit "crimes", which are civil matters. They committed acts of war by forcibly invading sovereign U.S. territory (the U.S. consulates and embassies in Egypt and Libya), and committed war crimes by killing the ambassador to Egypt and civilian personnel. It was the ambassador to Libya, not Egypt. Not sure what you mean here regarding criminal and civil, but a handy reference:

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Civil_Law_vs_Criminal_Law


We may give that a miss, depending on how quickly the Libyan and Egyptian governments collar, prosecute, and punish the ones who did these things, and let it go as simple civil "crimes".

But if those governments don't get their acts together REAL quick, we must retain the option of regarding them as the acts of war and war crimes they are, and using whatever means we find necessary (including military means followed by U.S. military tribunals) to redress them.

Why?

[Kathianne]

This is beyond Carter. Carter wasnt this bad.

He was really bad, that Obama is worse? Scary.

[avatar4321]

Maybe being corporatized has led me not to belittle a religion, but I will say this: The American way of life must be restored and I don't care how Uncle Sam does it. Whatever it takes.

Uncle Sam cant do it. We have to do it. We have to do it in our lives. We have to do it in our families. We have to do it in our Churches. We have to do it in our local communities.

Government cant do it.

[Kat]

It obviously isn't part of American Islamic culture. There were no riots or murders here.

No, but there sure was dancing in the streets, and passing out candy after 9/11....right HERE on our soil.

[avatar4321]

He was really bad, that Obama is worse? Scary.

From everything I've seen, yes. I could be wrong. Does anyone think that?

[Dilloduck]

But not this weekend. If you wanna bring up the past we can go all the way back to the Spanish Inquistition if you like.

[Kathianne]

No, but there sure was dancing in the streets, and passing out candy after 9/11....right HERE on our soil.

Sssshhh you're messing with the narrative.

[Kat]

Sssshhh you're messing with the narrative.



:laugh:

[Dilloduck]

good catch, Kathianne.

[tailfins]

But not this weekend. If you wanna bring up the past we can go all the way back to the Spanish Inquistition if you like.

And how does the Spanish Inquisition relate to the English speaking world's treatment of Muslims?

[Dilloduck]

And how does the Spanish Inquisition relate to the English speaking world's treatment of Muslims?

English speaking ? LOL The Spanish Inquisition was the Christian persecution of muslims, jews etc. They didn't give a shit what language they spoke.
It was some members of the Christian religion committing the same acts of violence as some members of Islam are doing today.

[tailfins]

English speaking ? LOL The Spanish Inquisition was the Christian persecution of muslims, jews etc. They didn't give a shit what language they spoke.
It was some members of the Christian religion committing the same acts of violence as some members of Islam are doing today.

What are you going to say next? That John Calvin was culpable in the Spanish Inquisition. Catholics are not Christians.

[Kathianne]

What are you going to say next? That John Calvin was culpable in the Spanish Inquisition. Catholics are not Christians.

Most ignorant post of the day.

[logroller]

Most ignorant post of the day.
:laugh:
Maybe he just meant Catholics are radicalized Christians...Ironic to say the least. (but ya, ignorant)

[tailfins]

:laugh:
Maybe he just meant Catholics are radicalized Christians...Ironic to say the least. (but ya, ignorant)

I managed to out-do Gabby, Dorothy, and others with four little words! Talk about impact. I just decided to repeat something I have heard preached from the pulpit from time to time. What is posted here about Islam has the same tone what I hear about Catholicism. Where I come from Catholicism is just as errant as Islam. I don't generally talk about it. However, it's interesting to see Islam so fiercely attacked have such a different reaction to attacks on Catholicism. I have heard both attacked so much that it becomes background noise. I don't care; I don't believe in either one.

[jafar00]

Then charge the ones who have committed a crime just like we do every other American. It ain't rocket science. Do you plan on pinning red cresents on all of them too ?

I would wear mine with pride.


They have every right to be pissed. Everyone in America has a right to be pissed. The Islamic culture in America however did NOT KILL OR RIOT. Are you saying they want to but are too afraid ? Can you substantiate that with facts of any kind or is this more of the same Islamic hatred expoused by the person who created this movie in the first place ?

You are correct. I have very different view of Islam than you do.

Well said. Over the years I have heard Imams urging those who want to protest to do it in the Mosque in prayer and supplication to God because protesting to a mortal human is akin to using intermediaries which is a Christian concept.

However there is less patient group among us. The Wahhabi/Salafi group (which is a creation of British Intelligence but that's another story) tend to rise up in a more violent way.

With all the insults, persecution, invasions etc... that Muslims have had to endure over recent years, I guess this movie just pushed some over the edge. The maker (who strangely doesn't seem to exist) should be prosecuted for inciting violence. He knew damn well what the reaction would be.


BTW, technically they did not commit "crimes", which are civil matters. They committed acts of war by forcibly invading sovereign U.S. territory (the U.S. consulates and embassies in Egypt and Libya), and committed war crimes by killing the ambassador to Egypt and civilian personnel.

We may give that a miss, depending on how quickly the Libyan and Egyptian governments collar, prosecute, and punish the ones who did these things, and let it go as simple civil "crimes".

But if those governments don't get their acts together REAL quick, we must retain the option of regarding them as the acts of war and war crimes they are, and using whatever means we find necessary (including military means followed by U.S. military tribunals) to redress them.

Isn't scaling the walls of your embassy and ripping up/burning your flag also freedom of speech? You should be defending their right to do that. :p

[Kathianne]

:laugh:
Maybe he just meant Catholics are radicalized Christians...Ironic to say the least. (but ya, ignorant)

Hmmm, though that wouldn't make sense in the PC world. Unlike the bible thumpers, Catholicism tends to emphasize the logical, with recognition that besides the gospels, the bible is lesson based, not literal. On the point of liberalism though, the Catholic teachings are extreme 'social justice' based.

[Voted4Reagan]

Isn't scaling the walls of your embassy and ripping up/burning your flag also freedom of speech? You should be defending their right to do that. :p

No...In international law invading the grounds of another countries Embassy is considered the same as if you landed troops on a beach or flew planes over their cities... it's a violation of Sovereign Territory.

and Foreign Nationals are not protected under our Constitution.... Just as we are not under yours.

Egypt and Libya INVADED the United States yesterday.... So much for the PEACEFUL MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD...

Anwar Sadat would be crying at what you now cheer today... you insult him and all the good he did to promote peace.

So will you decry these acts Jafar? Or will you stand there and cheer them like the Palestinians did after 9-11-2001?

[Kathianne]

No...In international law invading the grounds of another countries Embassy is considered the same as if you landed troops on a beach or flew planes over their cities... it's a violation of Sovereign Territory.

and Foreign Nationals are not protected under our Constitution.... Just as we are not under yours.

Egypt and Libya INVADED the United States yesterday.... So much for the PEACEFUL MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD...

Anwar Sadat would be crying at what you now cheer today... you insult him and all the good he did to promote peace.

So will you decry these acts Jafar? Or will you stand there and cheer them like the Palestinians did after 9-11-2001?

Just an aside, but if a ME embassy in DC, NY, Chicago, LA were being overrun, trust me that the police would be backing up the defenders of the country. None of that in evidence for our folks, yesterday.

[Voted4Reagan]

Just an aside, but if a ME embassy in DC, NY, Chicago, LA were being overrun, trust me that the police would be backing up the defenders of the country. None of that in evidence for our folks, yesterday.

I agree.... Here in NYC i can assure you the NYPD would repel the invaders...

[Kathianne]

I agree.... Here in NYC i can assure you the NYPD would repel the invaders...

Chicago too, waiting for the West Coast, but they are probably chillin'

[Dilloduck]

Americans sure are clueless about foreign relations if they think that Libya, particularly due to recent events, would have security anywhere near what America has.

[Kathianne]

Americans sure are clueless about foreign relations if they think that Libya, particularly due to recent events, would have security anywhere near what America has.

Tell that to State or Obama, with them having to call in Marines, that are 2 of those dead.

[Voted4Reagan]

Chicago too, waiting for the West Coast, but they are probably chillin' Wiccan and I must come out there to Chi-Town one day... I have long wanted to partake of the local fare... especially the Deep Dish Pizza.

Been to the Left Coast.... they can keep it....lol

[Dilloduck]

Tell that to State or Obama, with them having to call in Marines, that are 2 of those dead.

Libya----too insecure to even be able to help provide security for embassies. Do you really think they were in any shape to help ?

[Voted4Reagan]

Americans sure are clueless about foreign relations if they think that Libya, particularly due to recent events, would have security anywhere near what America has.

wow... you really are the ultimate apologist....

No wonder nobody takes you seriously.....

You may as well change your name to DILDO-DUCK because all you are doing is trolling and fucking with people...

but we knew that already...

[Dilloduck]

wow... you really are the ultimate apologist....

No wonder nobody takes you seriously.....

You may as well change your name to DILDO-DUCK because all you are doing is trolling and fucking with people...

but we knew that already...

please---did you think Libya was like New York ?

I see you've taken the plunge into name calling---that's too bad.

[Voted4Reagan]

please---did you think Libya was like New York ?

I see you've taken the plunge into name calling---that's too bad.

I only resort to the name calling when it is used against a troll... you sir are a troll.

and Libya certainly should have made every effort to fight those that invaded our embassy... after all...Obama sent the planes that set these people on their current course... They abandoned those that helped them the most...

Keep Trolling..... it's easy to pick your nonsense apart....

[Dilloduck]

I only resort to the name calling when it is used against a troll... you sir are a troll.

and Libya certainly should have made every effort to fight those that invaded our embassy... after all...Obama sent the planes that set these people on their current course... They abandoned those that helped them the most...

Keep Trolling..... it's easy to pick your nonsense apart....

LOL sneaky------label me a troll to validate your name calling. How do you know that Libya DIDN"T do everything they could ? It's not exactly a stable regime and just have had thousands killed in a civil war.

[logroller]

Chicago too, waiting for the West Coast, but they are probably chillin'
We're gonna regulate them into leaving or killing themselves.

[Kathianne]

We're gonna regulate them into leaving or killing themselves.

Neither will happen, that's the shame of it.

[krisy]

Some lawmakers are wanting to stop aid to these countries. That is one of many things that need to happen!!! Make it happen and give it to the boys comin home from Afghanistan!!!

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/09/12/lawmakers-call-for-libya-egypt-aid-to-be-stripped-over-attacks-on-us-posts/

[gabosaurus]

We're gonna regulate them into leaving or killing themselves.

I see you don't like the new members, either. :rolleyes:

[jafar00]

Counter protests have popped up.

http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/5050e6306bb3f7cf76000023/amazing-photo-on-streets-of-benghazi-shows-libyans-apologizing-to-americans-over-embassy-attack.jpg
http://p.twimg.com/A2nx283CIAIgCKe.jpg

If it helps. There is a lot of discussion among Muslims both online and offline about how the killings in Benghazi were wrong and contrary to Islam. We all condemn what happened there and will never accept cold blooded murder in our names.

[avatar4321]

English speaking ? LOL The Spanish Inquisition was the Christian persecution of muslims, jews etc. They didn't give a shit what language they spoke.
It was some members of the Christian religion committing the same acts of violence as some members of Islam are doing today.

The Inquisition isnt as bad as the Protestants painted it. They were mainly glorified Church courts, which were much more humane than the state courts of the day. It was the states that caused most of the problems.

Even so. It was Catholics, not all Christians.

[avatar4321]

Tell that to State or Obama, with them having to call in Marines, that are 2 of those dead.

Do you think the 50 marines will make a big difference? I dont want this to turn into Carters Iranian raid.

Warships heading to Libya dont exactly make my legs tingle either.

[avatar4321]

Counter protests have popped up.



http://p.twimg.com/A2nx283CIAIgCKe.jpg

If it helps. There is a lot of discussion among Muslims both online and offline about how the killings in Benghazi were wrong and contrary to Islam. We all condemn what happened there and will never accept cold blooded murder in our names.

This makes me smile

[logroller]

Neither will happen, that's the shame of it.
Hmmm...more regulations!?!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

LOL sneaky------label me a troll to validate your name calling. How do you know that Libya DIDN"T do everything they could ? It's not exactly a stable regime and just have had thousands killed in a civil war.

Libyan security forces moved them to a safer location away from the embassy then those same libyan security forces told the protesting mob where they were! -Tyr

[logroller]

The Inquisition isnt as bad as the Protestants painted it. They were mainly glorified Church courts, which were much more humane than the state courts of the day. It was the states that caused most of the problems.

Even so. It was Catholics, not all Christians.

It wasnt all Catholics either. But glorified church courts being favored over corrupt state courts sounds eerily familiar.

[Thunderknuckles]

http://p.twimg.com/A2nx283CIAIgCKe.jpg


Look very closely at that picture. See the creases in the paper but yet the writing is straight? Just look at the word "Benghazi". Fuck that, look at the "B" alone. Shitty photoshop job.
Sorry Jafar, but that is a bullshit propaganda picture. Label me surprised.

[jafar00]

Look very closely at that picture. See the creases in the paper but yet the writing is straight? Just look at the word "Benghazi". Fuck that, look at the "B" alone. Shitty photoshop job.
Sorry Jafar, but that is a bullshit propaganda picture. Label me surprised.

By all means, produce an "original". That, or purchase a good pair of reading glasses.

[logroller]

Look very closely at that picture. See the creases in the paper but yet the writing is straight? Just look at the word "Benghazi". Fuck that, look at the "B" alone. Shitty photoshop job.
Sorry Jafar, but that is a bullshit propaganda picture. Label me surprised.
Looked real to me...but then again, I thought Obama's birth cert looked real too.:dunno:

[Voted4Reagan]

LOL sneaky------label me a troll to validate your name calling. How do you know that Libya DIDN"T do everything they could ? It's not exactly a stable regime and just have had thousands killed in a civil war.

I will label you a troll as several of the Moderators have already said as much...

I am trying to figure out if you are an Anti-Semite or Simply a punk OWS Type that just likes to agitate ...

Certainly you have an anti-Jewish Bent so I am leaning towards the Anti-Semite label with a healthy dose of TROLL combined...

[Gaffer]

I will label you a troll as several of the Moderators have already said as much...

I am trying to figure out if you are an Anti-Semite or Simply a punk OWS Type that just likes to agitate ...

Certainly you have an anti-Jewish Bent so I am leaning towards the Anti-Semite label with a healthy dose of TROLL combined...

You pegged it and didn't take you long at all.

[Dilloduck]

Labelling someone a troll, anti semite, liberal etc. is a pretty handy way of discounting someone with an opinion other than yours. I follow board rules,restrain myself to thread topics and avoid name calling. No moderator has warned me about trolling. Is this a debate board or a place where everyone agrees to agree ?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Labelling someone a troll, anti semite, liberal etc. is a pretty handy way of discounting someone with an opinion other than yours. I follow board rules,restrain myself to thread topics and avoid name calling. No moderator has warned me about trolling. Is this a debate board or a place where everyone agrees to agree ?

I've been called worse and treated worse here before. Man up pedro. Nobody suggested banning you that I could see. Perhaps if you posted more than the often one liners that usually are questions rather than replies stating your reasons your contribution here would be viewed differently. Just sayin'.. -Tyr

[Dilloduck]

I've been called worse and treated worse here before. Man up pedro. Nobody suggested banning you that I could see. Perhaps if you posted more than the often one liners that usually are questions rather than replies stating your reasons your contribution here would be viewed differently. Just sayin'.. -Tyr

Just a simple response to an allegation. If anyone wishes to persue it further fine. If not fine.
If people can't look at my contributions without bias there is nothing I can do about it. I've seen several comments from people who don't read posts because they are too long.

[tailfins]

Labelling someone a troll, anti semite, liberal etc. is a pretty handy way of discounting someone with an opinion other than yours. I follow board rules,restrain myself to thread topics and avoid name calling. No moderator has warned me about trolling. Is this a debate board or a place where everyone agrees to agree ?

When you're taking a break from a busy day to post, those are real time savers. I wouldn't say it's a place where everyone agrees to agree. It's more like all's fair in love and war. I will let you decide which.

[Dilloduck]

When you're taking a break from a busy day to post, those are real time savers. I wouldn't say it's a place where everyone agrees to agree. It's more like all's fair in love and war. I will let you decide which.

I'll let Jimmy call the shots.

[tailfins]

I'll let Jimmy call the shots.

Jimmy's a butthole .... and a troll.

[Dilloduck]

Jimmy's a butthole .... and a troll.

The boss usually is.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

No, they are bound by Islam.
It should be clear to all that radicalized Islam cannot peacefully co-exist with the democratic value of free speech.

A fact that so many deny is true because they fear it and others because they (being muslim)want to embrace and/or support it. Jihad being a part of Islam its not viewed as bad acts to wage a terrorist war against infidels.
Murder is sanctioned by Islam.-Tyr

[tailfins]

The boss usually is.


Soooo.... have you decided whether the name calling is love or is it war?

[Dilloduck]

A fact that so many deny is true because they fear it and others because they (being muslim)want to embrace and/or support it. Jihad being a part of Islam its not viewed as bad acts to wage a terrorist war against infidels.
Murder is sanctioned by Islam.-Tyr

Murder is not sanctioned in America. Muslims live in America and they seem to understand that if they murder here, they will be prosecuted under our laws. Is there some legal challenge to our laws that I'm unaware of ?

[tailfins]

Do you make loaded statements on purpose?


Murder is not sanctioned in America. Muslims live in America and they seem to understand that if they murder here, they will be prosecuted under our laws. Is there some legal challenge to our laws that I'm unaware of ?

1. Murder is sanctioned in America under Margaret Sanger's vision to thin the "underclass" population through abortion
2. There is a legal challenge to our laws. It called liberal judges that legislate from the bench.

[Dilloduck]

Do you make loaded statements on purpose?



1. Murder is sanctioned in America under Margaret Sanger's vision to thin the "underclass" population through abortion
2. There is a legal challenge to our laws. It called liberal judges that legislate from the bench.

No I was referring to Sharia law not the abortion issue. How does Sharia law feel about abortion ?

I agree that there are too many cases of legislating from the bench. Is there a case relating to Sharia sanctioned murder ?

[gabosaurus]

More evidence that the Embassy attacks were planned and not a spontaneous event.

<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/PjJ_eMFfL6k" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

[Trigg]

More evidence that the Embassy attacks were planned and not a spontaneous event.

<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/PjJ_eMFfL6k" frameBorder="0" width="560" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

Just wondering if our illustrius leader had any knowledge of impending violence?????????????

Perhaps skipping so many meetings wasn't such a great idea afterall.

[Kathianne]

Just wondering if our illustrius leader had any knowledge of impending violence?????????????

Perhaps skipping so many meetings wasn't such a great idea afterall.

They knew about Egypt, it had been evacuated. I think the Libya attack took them by surprise.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

They knew about Egypt, it had been evacuated. I think the Libya attack took them by surprise.

They are finding proof that the murder of the diplomat and his guards was a well organised planned hit in retaliation for the osama killing. More info to come later. Two of those were ex-Navy Seals that were murdered. Can you imagine giving them guns but not allowing ammo to be used? Just heard that today on radio, havent check its veracity yet! In Egypt they were not chanting abot the film , they were chanting as they went over the wall, we are all osamas obama! It was about ladens kiling and quite likely stired from te dem conventionwhere it was presented as obama's great achievement , killing Osama and saving GM!! Spiking the ball to build up obama got those people murdered . --Tyr

[Kathianne]

They are finding proof that the murder of the diplomat and his guards was a well organised planned hit in retaliation for the osama killing. More info to come later. Two of those were ex-Navy Seals that were murdered. Can you imagine giving them guns but not allowing ammo to be used? Just heard that today on radio, havent check its veracity yet! In Egypt they were not chanting abot the film , they were chanting as they went over the wall, we are all osamas obama! It was about ladens kiling and quite likely stired from te dem conventionwhere it was presented as obama's great achievement , killing Osama and saving GM!! Spiking the ball to build up obama got those people murdered . --Tyr

The Marines in Egypt didn't have live ammo, order of the ambassador. Libya? Not hearing that, just that they were overwhelmed in planned attack. I'm sure more will come later, but there is enough out now to prevent repeating false info.

[SassyLady]

I dislike condemning all muslims as insane and fanatic murderers when the evidence plainly shows the ones committing the acts are a criminal minority. Attempting to put and end to these attacks by attacking an entire religion and it's adherents is bound to backfire and cause more criminal acts than we can even imagine. Arrest and convict the guilty. Stop the criminal gangs, enforce the law but condemning millions of people for nothing more than association? No thanks. Hitler tried that .

Why do you call them criminals and not terrorists?

[jafar00]

More evidence that the Embassy attacks were planned and not a spontaneous event.

I've said a few times that the copts are trouble makers. The film is just more proof of that.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I've said a few times that the copts are trouble makers. The film is just more proof of that.

O' is that right? So it's the Copts that are to blame for everything over there in the ME?
And not the fact that place has been royally ffed up for well over a thousand years now!
Should we not even consider that the Islamists have never had: a Renaissance, a sustained period of Enlightenment, a Magna Carta, a Reformation or a Bill of Rights. That their fanatical rulers still live in the age of the Crusades and Ali Babi. That their Intolerance is on an epic scale: Sunni vs Shia vs Christian vs Alawite vs Jew vs Infidel. That they murder those that disagree and any that even look like they may ever disagree.. That they blow up ancient religious sites which have no relevance to their troubles today. That they are consumed by a crazed religious ideology that will take another century or two to find any kind of true enlightenment. That their Jihadi warriors must be killed or locked away for life.

[logroller]

I will label you a troll as several of the Moderators have already said as much...

I am trying to figure out if you are an Anti-Semite or Simply a punk OWS Type that just likes to agitate ...

Certainly you have an anti-Jewish Bent so I am leaning towards the Anti-Semite label with a healthy dose of TROLL combined...
Putting things a box...you should come over a play with my 3 yr old son.

I've said a few times that the copts are trouble makers. The film is just more proof of that.
As compared to the burned out Coptic churches and american embassies, such a video is child's play. I'm beginning to suspect you may be less than reasonable. Do you believe a person can reach enlightenment via a non-Islamic path?

[Trigg]

I've said a few times that the copts are trouble makers. The film is just more proof of that.

Seriously??????

Anyone who would riot and KILL people over a movie has their head screwed on the wrong way.

[Abbey Marie]

I would wear mine with pride.
...
Well said. Over the years I have heard Imams urging those who want to protest to do it in the Mosque in prayer and supplication to God because protesting to a mortal human is akin to using intermediaries which is a Christian concept.
...


Catholic, specifically. Other denominations do not believe in intermediaries either.

[Abbey Marie]

I dislike condemning all muslims as insane and fanatic murderers when the evidence plainly shows the ones committing the acts are a criminal minority. Attempting to put and end to these attacks by attacking an entire religion and it's adherents is bound to backfire and cause more criminal acts than we can even imagine. Arrest and convict the guilty. Stop the criminal gangs, enforce the law but condemning millions of people for nothing more than association? No thanks. Hitler tried that .


Dillo, how many thousands of people rioting and killing in how many countries, will it take for you to see these acts as committed by an extremely large group of people, rather than "a minority"? I think scale matters more than percentages in life and death situations.

It is not we who label them Islamists to criticize and blame the religion. They do that themselves by killing in the name of Allah.

[tailfins]

Dillo, how many thousands of people rioting and killing in how many countries, will it take for you to see these acts as committed by a extremely large group of people, rather than "a minority"? I think scale matters more than percentages in life and death situations.

It is not we who label them Islamists to criticize and blame the religion. They do that themselves by killing in the name of Allah.

If only one percent of 1.5 billion Islamists are violent similar to Al Qaida that makes 15 million. That's ten times the number of US active duty military personnel.

[Abbey Marie]

If only one percent of 1.5 billion Islamists are violent similar to Al Qaida that makes 15 million. That's ten times the number of US active duty military personnel.

Bingo.

[Dilloduck]

Dillo, how many thousands of people rioting and killing in how many countries, will it take for you to see these acts as committed by a extremely large group of people, rather than "a minority"? I think scale matters more than percentages in life and death situations.

It is not we who label them Islamists to criticize and blame the religion. They do that themselves by killing in the name of Allah.

I'm not sure. I certainly don't trust the media to give me any accurate numbers but I guess I didn't make myself clear. It is the minority of Muslims doing this rioting and as of now zero percent of them are in America. Technically we're not even sure these are all Muslims. Certainly the ones who riot and kill don't do the religion any favors. Christianity has it's share of loons too that people use to discredit it everytime they get the opportunity.

[red states rule]

These people respond to weakness by attacking you. The Obama has weakened the US in so many ways, not the least of which is financial. About half of Americans understand that, and the rest are Democrats.

At this point Obama is probably asking himself what Jimmy Carter would do?

He should since Obama has adopted Carter's economic polices

[red states rule]

Then charge the ones who have committed a crime just like we do every other American. It ain't rocket science. Do you plan on pinning red cresents on all of them too ?

With all due respect Dillo there is only one way to deal with these bastards. In the movie "The Untouchables" there was a scene where Ness wanted to know "how to get Capone"

he was told

If he pulls a knife - you pull a gun

If he sends one of your men to the hospital - you send two of his to the morgue

These terrorists are no different then Capone. All they understand is force, violence, and strength
That is the way we should be reacting to the murder of US citizens

[red states rule]

More evidence that the Embassy attacks were planned and not a spontaneous event.

<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/PjJ_eMFfL6k" frameBorder="0" width="560" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

You should email this to Jay Carney, he said today the video was to blame

I am surprised you have not blamed Pres Bush yet for the attack Gabby

[Dilloduck]

With all due respect Dillo there is only one way to deal with these bastards. In the movie "The Untouchables" there was a scene where Ness wanted to know "how to get Capone"

he was told

If he pulls a knife - you pull a gun

If he sends one of your men to the hospital - you send two of his to the morgue

These terrorists are no different then Capone. All they understand is force, violence, and strength
That is the way we should be reacting to the murder of US citizens

With all due respect RSR, Elliot Ness didn't say "Wipe out all the Italians"

[red states rule]

With all due respect RSR, Elliot Ness didn't say "Wipe out all the Italians"

Where did I say wipe out all the Muslims

We know where the terrorists are so lets let the US miltary do what they do best

Meanwhle, the libs are blaming America for the attacks

http://www.mrctv.org/videos/msnbc-contributor-dyson-all-hate-aint-equal-horrible-americans-have-fomented-hostility-toward-muslims

[Dilloduck]

Where did I say wipe out all the Muslims

We know where the terrorists are so lets let the US miltary do what they do best

Meanwhle, the libs are blaming America for the attacks

http://www.mrctv.org/videos/msnbc-contributor-dyson-all-hate-aint-equal-horrible-americans-have-fomented-hostility-toward-muslims

You want to send troops into Egypt and Libya?

Politicians always blame the other guy for everything. That's nothing new.

[red states rule]

You want to send troops into Egypt and Libya?

Politicians always blame the other guy for everything. That's nothing new.

No but have alot of Drones, and we can ARM with LIVE ammo

We can cut off all money to them

That is just a start

Oh and the kerk blaming America was not a pokitcan, He was an idoit liberal who is held in high esteem at MSNBC

[Dilloduck]

No but have alot of Drones, and we can ARM with LIVE ammo

We can cut off all money to them

That is just a start

That shouldn't have any repercussions.

[red states rule]

That shouldn't have any repercussions.

To logical folks, but just wait for the outrage from the left, the Middle East, and spinless peace niks over cutting of the money train and sending a large number of terrorists to Allah

[Dilloduck]

To logical folks, but just wait for the outrage from the left, the Middle East, and spinless peace niks over cutting of the money train and sending a large number of terrorists to Allah

We've been walking a tightrope over there for quite some time. Between trying to keep that oil flowing and the Jews and Muslims from Killing each other we've just about screwed the pooch. We're broke and they all hate us.

[red states rule]

We've been walking a tightrope over there for quite some time. Between trying to keep that oil flowing and the Jews and Muslims from Killing each other we've just about screwed the pooch. We're broke and they all hate us.

and as far as oil, we need to fire up every rig we have (Obama still has aban on driling in the Gulf) and tap every oil reserve we have

We have MORE oil then the ME has so why the hell do need to keep giving them any of our money

We are not broke yet - that is why far left libs will vote for Obama so he can have another 4 years to try and finish us off

[Dilloduck]

and as far as oil, we need to fire up every rig we have (Obama still has aban on driling in the Gulf) and tap every oil reserve we have

We have MORE oil then the ME has so why the hell do need to keep giving them any of our money

We are not broke yet - that is why far left libs will vote for Obama so he can have another 4 years to try and finish us off

We give em money so war doesn't break out. It's not working well these days.

[red states rule]

We give em money so war doesn't break out. It's not working well these days.

When has paying people to like us or change their bad behaviour ever worked?

[Dilloduck]

When has paying people to like us or change their bad behaviour ever worked?

Worked for awhile with Mubarak and Sadat.

[red states rule]

Worked for awhile with Mubarak and Sadat.

How many people did Mubarak murder and Sadat was murdered

Again, I never beleived you could pay bad people to become decent people

[Dilloduck]

How many people did Mubarak murder and Sadat was murdered

Again, I never beleived you could pay bad people to become decent people

It's been the American way for decades. Buy and arm a dictator to handle things for us.

[red states rule]

It's been the American way for decades. Buy and arm a dictator to handle things for us.

I cannot ink of a beter time to stpo and the over taxed US taxpayers would agree

Meanwhile, the Washington Compost thinks it is extreme to expet extreem Muslims to stop being extreme




[I]f you haven’t noticed a pattern, let me illustrate this sadistic re-run. First, anti-Islam propagandists create and promote anti-Islam propaganda under the guise of free speech—knowing it will incite extremists to violence. Second, extremists react to the propaganda, resulting in the deaths of innocent civilians including U.N. aid workers, American citizens, and what we often callously refer to as “collateral damage,”—i.e. innocent women and children. Third, anti-Islam propagandists sit safely in their abodes, thousands of miles away and innocently shrug, “Too bad. This offensive speech is my right.” Finally, Muslims worldwide are put on trial to again condemn the violence—failure to do so is perceived as implicit approval. Yet, Islam remains maligned and, most importantly, innocent people continue to suffer.

Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/ken-shepherd/2012/09/14/washpost-faith-contributor-its-extreme-expect-extremist-muslims-forsak#ixzz26TyBD0dk

[Dilloduck]

Problem-----you nor I nor the American taxpayer has any power to do that. We're not even supposed to know that it happens.

[red states rule]

Problem-----you nor I nor the American taxpayer has any power to do that. We're not even supposed to know that it happens.

Dillo, look no further than the Tea Party, the 2010 midterm and the WI recall

People DO have the power if they stay pissed off enough not to let BOTH sides continue with the "business as usual" attitude

[Dilloduck]

I cannot ink of a beter time to stpo and the over taxed US taxpayers would agree

Meanwhile, the Washington Compost thinks it is extreme to expet extreem Muslims to stop being extreme

We can't even expect secular or religious Americans to all be saints.

[Dilloduck]

Dillo, look no further than the Tea Party, the 2010 midterm and the WI recall

People DO have the power if they stay pissed off enough not to let BOTH sides continue with the "business as usual" attitude

We have two choices for president-----they both suck. We don't have the power cuz we don't control the money. It's that simple.

[red states rule]

We have two choices for president-----they both suck. We don't have the power cuz we don't control the money. It's that simple.


Obama did not have any opposition and Mitt outclassed what opponents he had. With the selection of Ryan, Mitt is a little better

But if you want 4 more years of "hope and change" then the choice is clear for you

[Abbey Marie]

I'm not sure. I certainly don't trust the media to give me any accurate numbers but I guess I didn't make myself clear. It is the minority of Muslims doing this rioting and as of now zero percent of them are in America. Technically we're not even sure these are all Muslims. Certainly the ones who riot and kill don't do the religion any favors. Christianity has it's share of loons too that people use to discredit it everytime they get the opportunity.

You were clear.

Here's what I see:
1. The fact that it is happening outside America (for now, anyway) does not negate the facts of what is happening. And what is happening is big, and is in the name of Islam.
2. It is beyond tiresome to see some of you bring up Christianity again and again whenever "murderous Islamists" stories are posted. At some point you need to address the issues at hand, instead of resorting to some sort of relative morality. Especially one based on things that happened centuries ago.

[Dilloduck]

You were clear.

Here's what I see:
1. The fact that it is happening outside America (for now, anyway) does not negate the facts of what is happening. And what is happening is big, and is in the name of Islam.
2. It is beyond tiresome to see some of you bring up Christianity again and again whenever "murderous Islamists" stories are posted. At some point you need to address the issues at hand, instead of resorting to some sort of relative morality. Especially one based on things that happened centuries ago.

I never denied anything was happening. Yes---violence is happening IN THE NAME of Islam which isn't the same as Islam is violent. Want a recent example? Westboro baptist Church. Naturally you are aware of what THEY are doing in the name of Christianity.
It's a perfect and current example of what can happen when some asshole highjacks a religion.

[Dilloduck]

Obama did not have any opposition and Mitt outclassed what opponents he had. With the selection of Ryan, Mitt is a little better

But if you want 4 more years of "hope and change" then the choice is clear for you

A chimpanzee could be president and we would have the same results. You do understand that polticians lie like hell to get the job right ?

[logroller]

With all due respect Dillo there is only one way to deal with these bastards. In the movie "The Untouchables" there was a scene where Ness wanted to know "how to get Capone"

he was told

If he pulls a knife - you pull a gun

If he sends one of your men to the hospital - you send two of his to the morgue

These terrorists are no different then Capone. All they understand is force, violence, and strength
That is the way we should be reacting to the murder of US citizens
ideoloical constructs dont always pan out in practice. Even a liberal like me gets that. So let's analyze the
How many American deaths have occurred at the hand of terrorists -10,000? But let's just double that for the sake of argument. Now compare that conservative estimate of the number of Muslims killed combatting the world on terror?
In Iraq alone, better than 100,000 we're killed. Mission accomplished, Iraq is free of terrorists... Right?
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/2012/09/09/iraq-terror-attacks-leave-44-dead-91466-31799156/

[glockmail]

ideoloical constructs dont always pan out in practice. Even a liberal like me gets that. So let's analyze the
How many American deaths have occurred at the hand of terrorists -10,000? But let's just double that for the sake of argument. Now compare that conservative estimate of the number of Muslims killed combatting the world on terror?
In Iraq alone, better than 100,000 we're killed. Mission accomplished, Iraq is free of terrorists... Right?
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/2012/09/09/iraq-terror-attacks-leave-44-dead-91466-31799156/

We don't care if Iran is free of terrorists as long as they are contained. Like bees in a bottle, they will eventually tire out.

[red states rule]

A chimpanzee could be president and we would have the same results. You do understand that polticians lie like hell to get the job right ?

So what wil you do on Election Day? Pout and stay home? That is what many on the right did in 2008 and we got Obama.

Now after 4 years the nation faces record poverty, $6 trilion more in debt, $4/gal gas, high unemployment, and 2 credit downgrades

Just think what Obama could do with 4 more years!!!!!

[Dilloduck]

So what wil you do on Election Day? Pout and stay home? That is what many on the right did in 2008 and we got Obama.

Now after 4 years the nation faces record poverty, $6 trilion more in debt, $4/gal gas, high unemployment, and 2 credit downgrades

Just think what Obama could do with 4 more years!!!!!

Our financial disaster was a collaboration of both parties failing. We BOTH parties gathered together prior to Obama's inauguration I knew we were screwed. What's Romney going to do any differently ?

[red states rule]

Our financial disaster was a collaboration of both parties failing. We BOTH parties gathered together prior to Obama's inauguration I knew we were screwed. What's Romney going to do any differently ?

If you are asking what Mitt and Paul would do DIFFERENTLY from Obozo with a straight face then you are either

A) not paying attention

B) PO'd your candidate (if you ahd one) did not win the nomination

C) Uninformed and not wanting to learn


As I am confident C does not apply to you; it must be a toss up between A and B

[Dilloduck]

If you are asking what Mitt and Paul would do DIFFERENTLY from Obozo with a straight face then you are either

A) not paying attention

B) PO'd your candidate (if you ahd one) did not win the nomination

C) Uninformed and not wanting to learn


As I am confident C does not apply to you; it must be a toss up between A and B

No answer ? Not willing to educate me ?

[red states rule]

No answer ? Not willing to educate me ?


OK.....

Repeal Obamacare, reduce the rate of growth of spending, offer reforms of the social programs that are bankrupting us, tas reform where deductions are closed but rates are lowered, and treating the private sector as a partner and not an enemy

I would prefer to have a BALANCED budget TODAY since sooner or later the bad medicine will have to be taken - but the Ryan budget is a step in the right direction

Tell me Dillo was Ron Paul your guy? You sound like one of his supporters

[Dilloduck]

OK.....

Repeal Obamacare, reduce the rate of growth of spending, offer reforms of the social programs that are bankrupting us, tas reform where deductions are closed but rates are lowered, and treating the private sector as a partner and not an enemy

I would prefer to have a BALANCED budget TODAY since sooner or later the bad medicine will have to be taken - but the Ryan budget is a step in the right direction

Tell me Dillo was Ron Paul your guy? You sound like one of his supporters

Na---I lost faith in all politicians. My experience with them has been that they lie and continue to lie to get into jobs that are more ceremonial than functional. The banksters are the ones with the real power. Who does the economy listen too. Obama or Bernanke ?

[red states rule]

Na---I lost faith in all politicians. My experience with them has been that they lie and continue to lie to get into jobs that are more ceremonial than functional. The banksters are the ones with the real power. Who does the economy listen too. Obama or Bernanke ?

So what will YOU do on election day? Stay home or vote?

As far as the "banksters" please remember it was Clinton who started us down the road to the current mess we are in. Not the banks

[Dilloduck]

So what will YOU do on election day? Stay home or vote?

As far as the "banksters" please remember it was Clinton who started us down the road to the current mess we are in. Not the banks

Bullshit-----the fed started us down this road.
I'll see what things are like on election day before I vote for a presidential candidate. There are some local items on the ballot that interest me

[red states rule]

Bullshit-----the fed started us down this road.
I'll see what things are like on election day before I vote for a presidential candidate. There are some local items on the ballot that interest me

Sorry, but here is where it all started

Please note the date





Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending
By STEVEN A. HOLMES
Published: September 30, 1999

In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.

The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.

In addition, banks, thrift institutions and mortgage companies have been pressing Fannie Mae to help them make more loans to so-called subprime borrowers. These borrowers whose incomes, credit ratings and savings are not good enough to qualify for conventional loans, can only get loans from finance companies that charge much higher interest rates -- anywhere from three to four percentage points higher than conventional loans.

http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/business/fannie-mae-eases-credit-to-aid-mortgage-lending.html

[Dilloduck]

Ya ya----and a deomocrat will say otherwise. It's tiresome and unproductive.

[red states rule]

Ya ya----and a deomocrat will say otherwise. It's tiresome and unproductive.

Dillo, I work in the mortgage industry. I know what happened. Bill clinton and the Dems believed home ownershipo was a RIGHT and not something poeople had to work and save for

Now we are getting off topic here

If a mod could break these posts off I would enjoy debating this issue wioth you Dillo.

It was the Dems who started this mess and when Pres Bush wanted to reform Fannies and Freddie the Dems balked and of course, played the race card as they opposed any attemot to rein in the bad loans

Remember Barney frank saying there was no problem with Fannie and Freddie?

[Dilloduck]

Dillo, I work in the mortgage industry. I know what happened. Bill clinton and the Dems believed home ownershipo was a RIGHT and not something poeople had to work and save for

Now we are getting off topic here

If a mod could break these posts off I would enjoy debating this issue wioth you Dillo.

It was the Dems who started this mess and when Pres Bush wanted to reform Fannies and Freddie the Dems balked and of course, played the race card as they opposed any attemot to rein in the bad loans

Remember Barney frank saying there was no problem with Fannie and Freddie?

Our economic problems are much larger than that. Central Banks rob us blind.

[red states rule]

Our economic problems are much larger than that. Central Banks rob us blind.

How do banks "rob" us?

For some reason banks have been made the bad guys over something the government FORCED them to do

What about the fact the housing meltdown was the result of Dems wanting to "help" minorities and the poor own homes?

[Dilloduck]

How do banks "rob" us?

For some reason banks have been made the bad guys over something the government FORCED them to do

What about the fact the housing meltdown was the result of Dems wanting to "help" minorities and the poor own homes?

Financial industry ----is that better ?
They issue credit and make monopoly money. The pay you about 3% interest on you savings and charge someone else 23% on a loan. It's bullshit. They have everyone by the balls.

[red states rule]

Financial industry ----is that better ?
They issue credit and make monopoly money. The pay you about 3% interest on you savings and charge someone else 23% on a loan. It's bullshit. They have everyone by the balls.


BAnsks extend unsecured credit on those credit cards Dillo and have to make a profit so they can pay therir employees and extend credit on secured loans

I do not recall anyone from the banks holdig a gun to someones head and making them take a credit card or buy a house

Try living your life without credit and without the banks. I see this attitude everyday as more and more people think they are entitled to freebies and balme others for the debt they took on

[Dilloduck]

BAnsks extend unsecured credit on those credit cards Dillo and have to make a profit so they can pay therir employees and extend credit on secured loans

I do not recall anyone from the banks holdig a gun to someones head and making them take a credit card or buy a house

Try living your life without credit and without the banks. I see this attitude everyday as more and more people think they are entitled to freebies and balme others for the debt they took on

I have zero debts and pay cash for what I need.

[red states rule]

I have zero debts and pay cash for what I need.

Congrats and I am in the same boat. Thanks to all the OT I am getting at work I have paid off everyone and everything

So you never had a car loan. a credit card, or any other debt?

It that is true then your credit score should be zero

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

That which we call radical Islam is actually fully justified within Islam. We term Islam's Jihadi actions as radical when Jihad is a well established part of Islam !
If we are ever to defeat the radical Islamic movement we must first survive long enough to do so.
The huge problem is that it will take a great many years of blood and treasure to force these folks to give up their agenda to impose Sharia law on the entire world.
My understanding is that it takes about 2 or 3 generations to turn around mindsets witthe possibility that religous mindsets may take even longer! That is a long road, we must not only stay alive that long but also be powerful enough during that long peroid of time to do the job successfully. We are only just starting and yet we face huge opposition from those within this nation for even daring to fight back! Such "useful idiots" could possibly seal our destruction if not stopped themselves ! I vigorously oppose them and their insanity too. --Tyr

[Dilloduck]

That which we call radical Islam is actually fully justified within Islam. We term Islam's Jihadi actions as radical when Jihad is a well established part of Islam !
If we are ever to defeat the radical Islamic movement we must first survive long enough to do so.
The huge problem is that it will take a great many years of blood and treasure to force these folks to give up their agenda to impose Sharia law on the entire world.
My understanding is that it takes about 2 or 3 generations to turn around mindsets witthe possibility that religous mindsets may take even longer! That is a long road, we must not only stay alive that long but also be powerful enough during that long peroid of time to do the job successfully. We are only just starting and yet we face huge opposition from those within this nation for even daring to fight back! Such "useful idiots" could possibly seal our destruction if not stopped themselves ! I vigorously oppose them and their insanity too. --Tyr

I'm going to stay alive for 3 or 4 generations ( and work out a lot) just for you.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I'm going to stay alive for 3 or 4 generations ( and work out a lot) just for you.

HAHA, obviously the "we" was referencing our nation, its population and their descendants.
But your brilliant comment has been so noted.
Judging from your views cited here you arent living now, instead just existing to watch others live...:laugh:
Ever heard that, "A man must stand for something or he will fall for anything" !?? Just checking..
Standing for straddling a fence so often (inaction)must be awfully uncomfortable, eh?? -Tyr

[Dilloduck]

HAHA, obviously the "we" was referencing our nation, its population and their descendants.
But your brilliant comment has been so noted.
Judging from your views cited here you arent living now, instead just existing to watch others live...:laugh:
Ever heard that, "A man must stand for something or he will fall for anything" !?? Just checking..
Standing for straddling a fence so often (inaction)must be awfully uncomfortable, eh?? -Tyr

We haven't been invaded here so people are out and about just like normal. You would be amazed at the calm, almost carefree attitude around here. Went to the range and shot off a few rounds --great time to be an American.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

We haven't been invaded here so people are out and about just like normal. You would be amazed at the calm, almost carefree attitude around here. Went to the range and shot off a few rounds --great time to be an American.

Yes indeed , as were people out and about just like normal on 9/11. Did you forget so quickly?-Tyr

[glockmail]

...

It that is true then your credit score should be zero :lol: