Females Not Flocking To Marine Infantry

[Kathianne]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/25/few-female-marines-step-forward-for-infantry/

Hmm, so much for no differences between the sexes. I'm thinking that of the 80 women that 'qualified,' 78 of them recognized their limitations:


Few female Marines step forward for infantry



Female Marine officers are unlikely to join the infantry anytime soon, in part because of a lack of volunteers for the Marine Corps (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/united-states-marine-corps/)‘ Infantry Officer Course (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/course/), which was opened to women in September.

Only two of about 80 eligible female Marines have volunteered for the course — a grueling, three-month advanced regimen conducted at Quantico, Va., that was opened to women to research their performance.

Of the two female volunteers, one washed out on the first day, along with 26 of the107 men, and the other dropped out two weeks later for medical reasons, a Marine Corps (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/united-states-marine-corps/) spokesman said.

The research effort was launched after the Pentagon (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/pentagon/) opened to women more than 14,000 jobs that could place them closer to front lines and combat.

...

[Kathianne]

Not exactly related, but tangentially:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/underdogs-the-making-of-the-modern-marine-corps-by-aaron-b-oconnell/2012/11/23/3035da94-16fe-11e2-9855-71f2b202721b_story.html


“Underdogs: The Making of the Modern Marine Corps” by Aaron B. O’Connell...

[gabosaurus]

I don't see why females are drawn to any branch of the military. As a whole, the military is very sexist. There is a lot of discrimination and harassment of women. It has become a "good old boys club." Sort of like Porky's.

[Kathianne]

I don't see why females are drawn to any branch of the military. As a whole, the military is very sexist. There is a lot of discrimination and harassment of women. It has become a "good old boys club." Sort of like Porky's.

Gabby, it's not just females you don't understand being drawn to the military, I'm guessing.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/16/us/16women.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


<nyt_kicker>Women at Arms</nyt_kicker>
<nyt_headline version="1.0" type=" "> G.I. Jane Breaks the Combat Barrier </nyt_headline><nyt_byline version="1.0" type=" "> By LIZETTE ALVAREZ

(http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/a/lizette_alvarez/index.html?inline=nyt-per)

</nyt_byline> As the convoy rumbled up the road in Iraq, Specialist Veronica Alfaro was struck by the beauty of fireflies dancing in the night. Then she heard the unmistakable pinging of tracer rounds and, in a Baghdad moment, realized the insects were illuminated bullets.


She jumped from behind the wheel of her gun truck, grabbed her medical bag and sprinted 50 yards to a stalled civilian truck. On the way, bullets kicked up dust near her feet. She pulled the badly wounded driver to the ground and got to work.


Despite her best efforts, the driver died, but her heroism that January night last year earned Specialist Alfaro a Bronze Star for valor. She had already received a combat action badge for fending off insurgents as a machine gunner.


“I did everything there,” Ms. Alfaro, 25, said of her time in Iraq. “I gunned. I drove. I ran as a truck commander. And underneath it all, I was a medic.”


Before 2001, America’s military women had rarely seen ground combat. Their jobs kept them mostly away from enemy lines, as military policy dictates.


But the Afghanistan (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/afghanistan/index.html?inline=nyt-geo) and Iraq wars, often fought in marketplaces and alleyways, have changed that. In both countries, women have repeatedly proved their mettle in combat. The number of high-ranking women and women who command all-male units has climbed considerably along with their status in the military.


“Iraq has advanced the cause of full integration for women in the Army (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/a/us_army/index.html?inline=nyt-org) by leaps and bounds,” said Peter R. Mansoor, a retired Army colonel who served as executive officer to Gen. David H. Petraeus (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/p/david_h_petraeus/index.html?inline=nyt-per) while he was the top American commander in Iraq. “They have earned the confidence and respect of male colleagues.”


Their success, widely known in the military, remains largely hidden from public view. In part, this is because their most challenging work is often the result of a quiet circumvention of military policy.

...

[gabosaurus]

There are always special cases. Like I have said before, women can do anything they put their minds to doing.
At the same time, there is a lot of sexism in the military. Too many men refuse to view women as their equals.

At one of our high schools, where ROTC leaders are chosen by merit, performance and leadership skills, the two top positions are held by girls. This has not gone down well with many of the guys, since Latino males view women as inferiors. But I am guessing the two girls will make kick butt Marines when they enlist next summer.

[Kathianne]

There are always special cases. Like I have said before, women can do anything they put their minds to doing.
At the same time, there is a lot of sexism in the military. Too many men refuse to view women as their equals.

At one of our high schools, where ROTC leaders are chosen by merit, performance and leadership skills, the two top positions are held by girls. This has not gone down well with many of the guys, since Latino males view women as inferiors. But I am guessing the two girls will make kick butt Marines when they enlist next summer.

So you are now saying that it's the Latino males, not the military? Are you saying male Latinos in the military are the cause of sexism, based on YOUR school's ROTC program?

[Robert A Whit]

I don't see why females are drawn to any branch of the military. As a whole, the military is very sexist. There is a lot of discrimination and harassment of women. It has become a "good old boys club." Sort of like Porky's.

Why do women want to kill other humans?

[Kathianne]

Why do women want to kill other humans?

Do men wish to kill others humans?

[Robert A Whit]

Do men wish to kill others humans?


Yes, men do want to kill other humans. Many in the infantry are eager to fight wars.

But the women bear the children. I hoped women were the more gentle sex.

[Kathianne]

Yes, men do want to kill other humans. Many in the infantry are eager to fight wars.

But the women bear the children. I hoped women were the more gentle sex.

So you are saying that wars are just about men being given an excuse for bloodlust? No principles, not patriotism?

[Robert A Whit]

So you are saying that wars are just about men being given an excuse for bloodlust? No principles, not patriotism?

If you are serious, let me explain more since I was in the Army infantry.

I was serious that I did not want to be drafted. I wanted no part of the military.

I got drafted.

The Army selected me to be a leader of a platoon.

While would gladly have paid to get out of the Army, I was stuck for 2 years.

When one is in the Army and I presume the Marines, one is told all day long what to do.

We got orders so many times per day that we were conditioned.

I can't recall any of the guys I served with claiming they wanted to kill humans. But once war breaks out, funny things happen.

Too many of the young men claim they want to go fight. You fight using weapons. This means if you want to fight, humans get killed.

I tend to doubt many women want to get their guts blown out to be in a fight.

[Kathianne]

If you are serious, let me explain more since I was in the Army infantry.

I was serious that I did not want to be drafted. I wanted no part of the military.

I got drafted.

The Army selected me to be a leader of a platoon.

While would gladly have paid to get out of the Army, I was stuck for 2 years.

When one is in the Army and I presume the Marines, one is told all day long what to do.

We got orders so many times per day that we were conditioned.

I can't recall any of the guys I served with claiming they wanted to kill humans. But once war breaks out, funny things happen.

Too many of the young men claim they want to go fight. You fight using weapons. This means if you want to fight, humans get killed.

I tend to doubt many women want to get their guts blown out to be in a fight.

But men do?

[Robert A Whit]

Kathianne, what is your point?

You posted a thread that stated the 2 women in the Marines that wanted to be officers washed out.

And you pointed out that women do not want to be in the infantry.

As to your question about wanting guts blown out, it was intended to make a point that men indeed when war is going on, do want to be part of the fight.

i am sorry that I don't want women to do the fighting. I keep recalling my mother and aunts and sisters not seeing them wanting to be in any war.

[Kathianne]

Kathianne, what is your point?

You posted a thread that stated the 2 women in the Marines that wanted to be officers washed out.

And you pointed out that women do not want to be in the infantry.

As to your question about wanting guts blown out, it was intended to make a point that men indeed when war is going on, do want to be part of the fight.

i am sorry that I don't want women to do the fighting. I keep recalling my mother and aunts and sisters not seeing them wanting to be in any war.

And your point Robert? That men enjoy war or that war is repugnant? Truly not clear.

My point was that was is repugnant, sometimes necessary. Women can participate in that effort, but at the frontlines? Not so likely. Especially in infantry. Especially in Marine infantry. Has nothing to do with a wish to fight or take it to the enemy. Indeed, women are as patriotic as men.

[cadet]

I don't see why females are drawn to any branch of the military. As a whole, the military is very sexist. There is a lot of discrimination and harassment of women. It has become a "good old boys club." Sort of like Porky's.

EXCUSE ME! Do you know how many briefings I've had to go to about sexual harassment? I could get sued and kicked out for asking a fellow officer out. All depending on what she see's as sexual harassment. My limits are as long as you don't grab my ass i don't care, But some of them, you can't even look in the eyes without doing some sort of assult.

The military is NUKIN FUTS when it comes to sexual assault.

[gabosaurus]

EXCUSE ME! Do you know how many briefings I've had to go to about sexual harassment? I could get sued and kicked out for asking a fellow officer out. All depending on what she see's as sexual harassment. My limits are as long as you don't grab my ass i don't care, But some of them, you can't even look in the eyes without doing some sort of assult.

The military is NUKIN FUTS when it comes to sexual assault.

Cadet, not every guy is as polite and proper as you are. In groups where there are a lot of men and not many women, the women are going to be subject to improper advances and comments.
Read this forum and you will notices all the references to boobs and body types. Men will always be men.
You would be surprised how many men believe it is acceptable to grope women, make comments about their looks or suggest what a wonderful sexual coupling they could make. Look at the comment in another thread where the poster states "If a woman lives with me and I give her money, she should be happy to have sex with me."

It is awesome that you have such proper values. :salute:

[Kathianne]

Cadet, not every guy is as polite and proper as you are. In groups where there are a lot of men and not many women, the women are going to be subject to improper advances and comments.
Read this forum and you will notices all the references to boobs and body types. Men will always be men.
You would be surprised how many men believe it is acceptable to grope women, make comments about their looks or suggest what a wonderful sexual coupling they could make. Look at the comment in another thread where the poster states "If a woman lives with me and I give her money, she should be happy to have sex with me."

It is awesome that you have such proper values. :salute:

Gabby, I understand your bringing up boobies. Quite the gotcha. Now answer this, how many of those are or were former military? You are the one saying that the military males are Neanderthals. I've yet to see that.

[gabosaurus]

Not ALL. Not even close to all. In fact, a very small minority.
But look at all the scandals. Plus, the military schools are rife with scandals involving such. As are basic training camps.

I have never met a member of the military who was not a perfect gentleman with outstanding character.
Then again, I've never met a Muslim who was a terrorist.

I do agree that extreme caution is needed when swinging the broad brush around.

[Kathianne]

Not ALL. Not even close to all. In fact, a very small minority.
But look at all the scandals. Plus, the military schools are rife with scandals involving such. As are basic training camps.

I have never met a member of the military who was not a perfect gentleman with outstanding character.
Then again, I've never met a Muslim who was a terrorist.

I do agree that extreme caution is needed when swinging the broad brush around.

Name them.

Name 'all the scandals', I'll help: tailhook. Now your turn.

Making equivalency between our military members and terrorist may not be the best move in furthering discussion.

If you were concerned about the 'broad brush', why did you bring it out?

[Little-Acorn]

Why do women want to kill other humans?

So as not to get killed by other humans.

Or enslaved, or robbed, or any of the other things enemies tend to do.

In other words, same reason why men want to kill other humans.

You didn't know this?

.

[Kathianne]

So as not to get killed by other humans.

Or enslaved, or robbed, or any of the other things enemies tend to do.

You didn't know this?

.

Agree, 100%. However, no matter their dedication to the cause, most women would be a liability in infantry. 80 women qualified for Marine infantry, 2 tried, one crashed 1 day, the other for medical reasons. Why the other 78 didn't? No explanation given, but my guess were they were as bright as fit.

They recognized that female realities and issues could cause problems for their sisters and brothers at arms. They weren't going to be part of the problem.

[aboutime]

Not ALL. Not even close to all. In fact, a very small minority.
But look at all the scandals. Plus, the military schools are rife with scandals involving such. As are basic training camps.

I have never met a member of the military who was not a perfect gentleman with outstanding character.
Then again, I've never met a Muslim who was a terrorist.

I do agree that extreme caution is needed when swinging the broad brush around.


Gabby. Here is how you use YOUR Broad Brush.....4078

[cadet]

Cadet, not every guy is as polite and proper as you are. In groups where there are a lot of men and not many women, the women are going to be subject to improper advances and comments.
Read this forum and you will notices all the references to boobs and body types. Men will always be men.
You would be surprised how many men believe it is acceptable to grope women, make comments about their looks or suggest what a wonderful sexual coupling they could make. Look at the comment in another thread where the poster states "If a woman lives with me and I give her money, she should be happy to have sex with me."

It is awesome that you have such proper values. :salute:

Darlin... I'm at an engineering school. And ain't no boys here going up to the girls saying naughty things. (Competition is too rough for that kind of stuff, gotta stand out to win em)

And thank you. :beer:

[aboutime]

Darlin... I'm at an engineering school. And ain't no boys here going up to the girls saying naughty things. (Competition is too rough for that kind of stuff, gotta stand out to win em)

And thank you. :beer:

cadet. It's obvious. Gabby lives in somewhat of a dream, fictional world where everything is according to the wishes, dreams, and nightmares of Gabby. Because Gabby says so...is all Gabby needs to convince herself...only she is right, and the smartest, dull knife in the drawer.

[cadet]

cadet. It's obvious. Gabby lives in somewhat of a dream, fictional world where everything is according to the wishes, dreams, and nightmares of Gabby. Because Gabby says so...is all Gabby needs to convince herself...only she is right, and the smartest, dull knife in the drawer.

Ok, now, I think you need to cut back on the name calling and making fun of.
More or less, I'm pretty sure gabby just enjoys messing with everyone. Alot of her discussions she shoves different views for you guys to discuss. I think she just enjoys screwing with your head in particular.

[aboutime]

Ok, now, I think you need to cut back on the name calling and making fun of.
More or less, I'm pretty sure gabby just enjoys messing with everyone. Alot of her discussions she shoves different views for you guys to discuss. I think she just enjoys screwing with your head in particular.


Oh. I see. It's okay for Gabby to screw with My, Your, Other people's heads. But when I, or anyone else does the same thing. It's time to CUT BACK?

Guess you never imagined how I, or anyone else might enjoy screwing with Gabby's head....ya know? Kinda like...Tit for Tat?

If it's permissible for Gabby. Why is it not permissible for anyone else.

I enjoy coming here to do just that. Weeding out the ones who think they can mess with us, and give them a little of their own BACK.

[cadet]

Oh. I see. It's okay for Gabby to screw with My, Your, Other people's heads. But when I, or anyone else does the same thing. It's time to CUT BACK?

Guess you never imagined how I, or anyone else might enjoy screwing with Gabby's head....ya know? Kinda like...Tit for Tat?

If it's permissible for Gabby. Why is it not permissible for anyone else.

I enjoy coming here to do just that. Weeding out the ones who think they can mess with us, and give them a little of their own BACK.

See, you're not talking back, or just messing. Almost every one of your posts has something derogatory in it. Plus, every time i see a new thread the first post from you is some sort of insult.
Tone it down some. Have some debates and not pissing matches. Usually the bigger person doesn't flat out insult, and has actual stuff to debate. In fact, usually it's the moron that starts insulting.
Not pointing any fingers.... but think on it.

[aboutime]

See, you're not talking back, or just messing. Almost every one of your posts has something derogatory in it. Plus, every time i see a new thread the first post from you is some sort of insult.
Tone it down some. Have some debates and not pissing matches. Usually the bigger person doesn't flat out insult, and has actual stuff to debate. In fact, usually it's the moron that starts insulting.
Not pointing any fingers.... but think on it.


Yeah. Right!

Thanks. I'll take it under advisement, if, and when you present the same NON-instructions to the others here.

Until then. Thanks.

And, please, if you have the time. Post a quote you referred to above.