GREAT speech by President Obama tonight from Newtown, CT

[Little-Acorn]

He's still giving the speech now, as I type this. But I am greatly moved by what he said.

There was the usual fluff, the slow-motion enunciation, the downcast eyes, the chewing of the lower lip. I was eerily reminded of an odd blend of Al Gore and Bill Clinton.

But that aside, the SUBSTANCE of the speech is what made me pay attention. The President asked if he (and we) in good conscience could wait any longer before "doing something about this", referrring of course to the horrible shootings at the elementary school in Newtown, and he also mentioned other shootings in Aurora, and Columbine High School.

Bravo, Mr. President. I fully agree, and support what you said. We cannot wait any longer, and Government *must* do what it can to reduce or stop such horrors from happening any longer.

We have seen the things that have been tried so far. Gun-free zones - a complete failure. Nearly every such shooting has taken place in exactly such "gun-free zone". In fact, there is reason to believe the shooters planned it that way, knowing their victims had been disarmed in advance, and were unlikely to shoot back. Assault-weapons bans - another failure. We had one in place for upwards of ten years. How many of these mass shootings took place while it was in effect? Cities and states have also had restrictions on such "assault weapns", however vaguely defined or undefined. And these are exactly the places where, time and again, these shootings took place. They have likewise been a complete failure.

And in this latest horrific mass murder, what was the only thing that prevented it from being EVEN WORSE? Many news outlets have pointed out the answer. This insane whacko had some ten or fifteen minutes in that room with those terrified, screaming children - time enough to walk up to each one, the medical examinerts have said, and shoot them at point-blank range, more than once, and ensure they were DEAD. Have you noticed how few "wounded" there were? This guy was able to shoot virtually EVERY victim, and KEEP shooting them, until they were DEAD.

And, some authorities have said, he might well have gone on to shoot others, except for one thing that finally occurred: Men with guns showed up to stop him. When he saw they had arrived (however belatedly), only then did he stop firing at the small innocent children. And he turned his gun on himself. And the slaughter finally ended. Due entirely to the arrival of men with guns.

But before that happened, he had a relatively long time, during which NO ONE AROUND HIM HAD A GUN. And he knew it. And he used that time, to leisurely kill 27 people.

Mr. President, THANK YOU for finally taking the gloves off. As you said, it is clear that we can no longer continue to let what has gone on far too long, to continue. It is time for government to act. Thank you for bringing up this hard, harsh reality. Because ignoring it, and letting things go on as they have for so many years, only lets these horrors continue. Nothing could be clearer, especially now, with the bodies of those twenty small children and seven adults barely cool.

It is time to engender safer surroundings for our children - the kind of surroundings so callously denied them by for 10-15 horror-filled minutes that morning a few days ago, when a crazed lunatic had time to mercilessly gun down AN ENTIRE CLASSROOM full of our most precious and innocent, knowing no one could stop him. Thos useless "gun free zones" that gave the lunatic the assurance he wanted, must end. The worthless "assault weapons bans" that did nothing to prevent other such horror-filled times, must be swept aside.

Thank you, Mr. President, for declaring that now, finally we must do something that WORKS. These insane, murderous wretches must be denied the assurance that law-abiding people will be disarmed and left helpless before them. Obviously these insane freaks are not afraid to die themselves - this latest one calmly took his own life, and clearly planned to do it from the very beginning, and many of the other insane freaks have done. And just as clearly, this insane freak wanted to rack up a huge enough body count, commit such a horrible crime, that he would be assured of weeks of gory headlines, moths of bloodcurdling reports and analyses and hand-wringing on a nationwide scale, far more than he could hope to get by "merely" shooting one or two people. Ne needed the time and opportunity to shoot a LOT of people before taking his own life... and we gave it to him.

No more.

Mr. President, as you said so eloquently tonight, we can't let this go on. We must do the only thing that PREVENTS such insane murderers from getting the lurid headlines and infamous legacy they so desire. We must let any responsible persons at these most precious repositories of our most precious children, arm themselves if they so desire, and make themselves ready to deny people like this mass murderer the fame he seeks, before or after his own death.

The benefits are multiple, and the risks... well, how can the risks be any worse than the ones you so eloquently described tonight? Insens murderers like the Newtown shooter must be aware that, if/when they start on their horrible rampages, they will NOT have 10-15 minute to rack up their headline-making body counts before responsible people with guns show up. Instead, they have only seconds... not nearly enough time to methodically walk up to child after child and deliver multiple, carefully spaced shots into their terrified, pleading faces.

These insane murderers know that people with guns are right there, inside the same locked gates they themselves forced their way through. And the murderer must know that a bullt that will end his rampage is only seconds away... and might come from any of the people outside (or even inside) the classroom he is in. Most people at the school will still not be armed, of course. But a few will be... and he will have no idea which ones they are, nor what direction the bullet might come from. Only that it will come... and QUICKLY, not after 10 or 15 minutes.

Mr. President, thank you for your decision to not let the status quo remain. Thank you for finally deciding to change course, and do what will finally WORK. Thank youu most of all, for deciding to set up a situation where these insane murderers know, BEFORE THEY EVEN START, that their dreams of luring, workld-gripping headlines will never materialize. These insane murderers are obviously unafraid of dying. But finally we will be able to deny them what they DO want: Horrible, infamous fame, even in death.

These murderers are undeniably insane... but they still have enough cognizance left to plan how to get through locked gates, plan to accumulate and bring enough weapons and ammunition to do what they set out to do, etc. And they clearly have enough sanity, however fleeting, to know what they want, and to make elaborate plans to get it... and to react when they find it is not possible any more. And there is a reasonable chance that, even as insane as they obvuiously are, they might decide that since they will be unable to kill the dozens of people they want to... perhaps they should no longer bother to try. And maybe they should simply turn the gun on themselves in the few second we have left them, instead of taking away our most precious.

Thank you, Mr. President for finally deciding to change course. Thank you for deciding we have had enough of "responses" that have not worked. Thank you for declaring to the nation, in the moment of our greatest grief and outrage, that we will change course and do soemthig that reduces or PREVENTS these rare, insane whackos from doing these things to us.

I await your efforts to campaign against, sweep aside, and repeal the useless, unworkable schemes of the past, which have failed so regularly while our precious children keep dying in these horrible massacres they did nothing to prevent. Thank you for working to get rid of laws that disarm the only people who can save us from these monsterswho would murder us. Thank you for finally providing what the authors of the 2nd amendment knew all along: that ordinary, law-abiding Ameican citizens are the last - and indeed the only - real defense against the insane monsters in our midst. Thank you for repealing things like "may issue" restrictions that keep our only real defenders from helping us. Thank you for pledging to sweep away paranoid gun bans in cities like New York, San Francisco, Washington DC, and your own native Chicago that disarm only the innocent victims while the insane murderers go right on arming themselves and killing us and our children.

Even after you sweep aside these restrictions on our defending ourselves, you know and we know that most of us will still not bother arming ourselves in our everyday comings and goings. But a few of us will... and the occasional insane monsters lurking among us, will never know which ones we are. And this very knowledge may be enough to stop some of them from doing their horrible deeds. For the few that are still insane enough to try anyway, these new provisions will ensure that the insane ones will be kept busy enough - and soon, wounded or incapacitated quickly enough - to reduce the body count from dozens to far smaller numbers. Still horrible, but not as horrible as what happened where you are presently giving your speech: The elementary school in Newtown, CT where 20 precious children lie dead along with 7 adults who tried to save them. But could not, in part due to the very laws that we must now acknowledge did far more harm than good.

Thank you, Mr. President. I admire your courage in this change in course. And I fully support your efforts to get rid of the laws that have allowed so many massacres to continue... but hopefully will not longer be allowed to do so.

[Gaffer]

I didn't listen to the speech, can't stand to hear him talk. I will have to look for the speech now and see what he said, because, frankly, I don't believe him.

[Kathianne]

I didn't listen to the speech, can't stand to hear him talk. I will have to look for the speech now and see what he said, because, frankly, I don't believe him.

I share your boat and your disbelief. I thanked LA for his mighty effort, that was one long sucker of a post.

I don't agree with what I saw as a swipe at mitigating the first amendment, though I could be wrong on that.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I didn't listen to the speech, can't stand to hear him talk. I will have to look for the speech now and see what he said, because, frankly, I don't believe him.

He is a GD lying Son of a Bitch.. NO OTHER WAY TO PUT IT.
Didnt wait long to start his next crusade did he?? We had these mass killings before ,one back in the early 90's, how have we survived 20 years since then without obama and this sudden new and urgent doing "something" ABOUT IT?
2ND AMENDMENT STAYS IN PLACE OR ELSE HE PLUNGES THIS NATION INTO A RADICAL DIVIDE FAR WORSE THAN EXISTS NOW. TOLD ALL YOU PEOPLE THIS TRAITOR IS ALL FOR DIVIDE AN CONQUER!!
He is a globalist puppet!
How about that mass killing on 9/11 , did we get a call to outlaw airplanes!!!?? How about that Oklahoma city bombing, did we get a call to outlaw fertilizer and rental trucks? FFKK THAT TRAITOR!! -Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Calls against gun rights over this are complete bullshit. A man could have went in there killed the two women in that office with a hammer, then went into that room and did the same thing with that same hammer. Defenseless is the problem. Obama is a damn lying bastard, a traitor as well. -Tyr

[gabosaurus]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

[aboutime]

All anyone reading this has to know, or remember is. If Obama talked about anything, and his lips were moving, making sounds, or any movement above the neck took place. YOU can be certain. HE WAS LYING.

That is what LIARS do, and they do it Well. He is nothing but a LIAR.

Any opportunity...as his buddy Rahm reminded him...to make the best of a CRISIS, and not waste it. Is all Obama wants to do. Period.

[Kathianne]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

We'll see.

[aboutime]

He's still giving the speech now, as I type this. But I am greatly moved by what he said.

There was the usual fluff, the slow-motion enunciation, the downcast eyes, the chewing of the lower lip. I was eerily reminded of an odd blend of Al Gore and Bill Clinton.

But that aside, the SUBSTANCE of the speech is what made me pay attention. The President asked if he (and we) in good conscience could wait any longer before "doing something about this", referrring of course to the horrible shootings at the elementary school in Newtown, and he also mentioned other shootings in Aurora, and Columbine High School.

Bravo, Mr. President. I fully agree, and support what you said. We cannot wait any longer, and Government *must* do what it can to reduce or stop such horrors from happening any longer.

We have seen the things that have been tried so far. Gun-free zones - a complete failure. Nearly every such shooting has taken place in exactly such "gun-free zone". In fact, there is reason to believe the shooters planned it that way, knowing their victims had been disarmed in advance, and were unlikely to shoot back. Assault-weapons bans - another failure. We had one in place for upwards of ten years. How many of these mass shootings took place while it was in effect? Cities and states have also had restrictions on such "assault weapns", however vaguely defined or undefined. And these are exactly the places where, time and again, these shootings took place. They have likewise been a complete failure.

And in this latest horrific mass murder, what was the only thing that prevented it from being EVEN WORSE? Many news outlets have pointed out the answer. This insane whacko had some ten or fifteen minutes in that room with those terrified, screaming children - time enough to walk up to each one, the medical examinerts have said, and shoot them at point-blank range, more than once, and ensure they were DEAD. Have you noticed how few "wounded" there were? This guy was able to shoot virtually EVERY victim, and KEEP shooting them, until they were DEAD.

And, some authorities have said, he might well have gone on to shoot others, except for one thing that finally occurred: Men with guns showed up to stop him. When he saw they had arrived (however belatedly), only then did he stop firing at the small innocent children. And he turned his gun on himself. And the slaughter finally ended. Due entirely to the arrival of men with guns.

But before that happened, he had a relatively long time, during which NO ONE AROUND HIM HAD A GUN. And he knew it. And he used that time, to leisurely kill 27 people.

Mr. President, THANK YOU for finally taking the gloves off. As you said, it is clear that we can no longer continue to let what has gone on far too long, to continue. It is time for government to act. Thank you for bringing up this hard, harsh reality. Because ignoring it, and letting things go on as they have for so many years, only lets these horrors continue. Nothing could be clearer, especially now, with the bodies of those twenty small children and seven adults barely cool.

It is time to engender safer surroundings for our children - the kind of surroundings so callously denied them by for 10-15 horror-filled minutes that morning a few days ago, when a crazed lunatic had time to mercilessly gun down AN ENTIRE CLASSROOM full of our most precious and innocent, knowing no one could stop him. Thos useless "gun free zones" that gave the lunatic the assurance he wanted, must end. The worthless "assault weapons bans" that did nothing to prevent other such horror-filled times, must be swept aside.

Thank you, Mr. President, for declaring that now, finally we must do something that WORKS. These insane, murderous wretches must be denied the assurance that law-abiding people will be disarmed and left helpless before them. Obviously these insane freaks are not afraid to die themselves - this latest one calmly took his own life, and clearly planned to do it from the very beginning, and many of the other insane freaks have done. And just as clearly, this insane freak wanted to rack up a huge enough body count, commit such a horrible crime, that he would be assured of weeks of gory headlines, moths of bloodcurdling reports and analyses and hand-wringing on a nationwide scale, far more than he could hope to get by "merely" shooting one or two people. Ne needed the time and opportunity to shoot a LOT of people before taking his own life... and we gave it to him.

No more.

Mr. President, as you said so eloquently tonight, we can't let this go on. We must do the only thing that PREVENTS such insane murderers from getting the lurid headlines and infamous legacy they so desire. We must let any responsible persons at these most precious repositories of our most precious children, arm themselves if they so desire, and make themselves ready to deny people like this mass murderer the fame he seeks, before or after his own death.

The benefits are multiple, and the risks... well, how can the risks be any worse than the ones you so eloquently described tonight? Insens murderers like the Newtown shooter must be aware that, if/when they start on their horrible rampages, they will NOT have 10-15 minute to rack up their headline-making body counts before responsible people with guns show up. Instead, they have only seconds... not nearly enough time to methodically walk up to child after child and deliver multiple, carefully spaced shots into their terrified, pleading faces.

These insane murderers know that people with guns are right there, inside the same locked gates they themselves forced their way through. And the murderer must know that a bullt that will end his rampage is only seconds away... and might come from any of the people outside (or even inside) the classroom he is in. Most people at the school will still not be armed, of course. But a few will be... and he will have no idea which ones they are, nor what direction the bullet might come from. Only that it will come... and QUICKLY, not after 10 or 15 minutes.

Mr. President, thank you for your decision to not let the status quo remain. Thank you for finally deciding to change course, and do what will finally WORK. Thank youu most of all, for deciding to set up a situation where these insane murderers know, BEFORE THEY EVEN START, that their dreams of luring, workld-gripping headlines will never materialize. These insane murderers are obviously unafraid of dying. But finally we will be able to deny them what they DO want: Horrible, infamous fame, even in death.

These murderers are undeniably insane... but they still have enough cognizance left to plan how to get through locked gates, plan to accumulate and bring enough weapons and ammunition to do what they set out to do, etc. And they clearly have enough sanity, however fleeting, to know what they want, and to make elaborate plans to get it... and to react when they find it is not possible any more. And there is a reasonable chance that, even as insane as they obvuiously are, they might decide that since they will be unable to kill the dozens of people they want to... perhaps they should no longer bother to try. And maybe they should simply turn the gun on themselves in the few second we have left them, instead of taking away our most precious.

Thank you, Mr. President for finally deciding to change course. Thank you for deciding we have had enough of "responses" that have not worked. Thank you for declaring to the nation, in the moment of our greatest grief and outrage, that we will change course and do soemthig that reduces or PREVENTS these rare, insane whackos from doing these things to us.

I await your efforts to campaign against, sweep aside, and repeal the useless, unworkable schemes of the past, which have failed so regularly while our precious children keep dying in these horrible massacres they did nothing to prevent. Thank you for working to get rid of laws that disarm the only people who can save us from these monsterswho would murder us. Thank you for finally providing what the authors of the 2nd amendment knew all along: that ordinary, law-abiding Ameican citizens are the last - and indeed the only - real defense against the insane monsters in our midst. Thank you for repealing things like "may issue" restrictions that keep our only real defenders from helping us. Thank you for pledging to sweep away paranoid gun bans in cities like New York, San Francisco, Washington DC, and your own native Chicago that disarm only the innocent victims while the insane murderers go right on arming themselves and killing us and our children.

Even after you sweep aside these restrictions on our defending ourselves, you know and we know that most of us will still not bother arming ourselves in our everyday comings and goings. But a few of us will... and the occasional insane monsters lurking among us, will never know which ones we are. And this very knowledge may be enough to stop some of them from doing their horrible deeds. For the few that are still insane enough to try anyway, these new provisions will ensure that the insane ones will be kept busy enough - and soon, wounded or incapacitated quickly enough - to reduce the body count from dozens to far smaller numbers. Still horrible, but not as horrible as what happened where you are presently giving your speech: The elementary school in Newtown, CT where 20 precious children lie dead along with 7 adults who tried to save them. But could not, in part due to the very laws that we must now acknowledge did far more harm than good.

Thank you, Mr. President. I admire your courage in this change in course. And I fully support your efforts to get rid of the laws that have allowed so many massacres to continue... but hopefully will not longer be allowed to do so.



Little-Acorn. I would love to find agreement with you. But sadly. I dislike, distrust, and do not believe anything Obama says.
He is an Opportunist, looking to use this terrible event in our history to butter his own bread in any way he can.

Perhaps we should remind ourselves of the INACTION, and near TOTAL, Intentional disregard....to this day, of the massive shootings that took place in FORT HOOD. Now, decidedly called a WORKPLACE crime by this same LYING, Pretend, President.

Obama only does things that will feather his nest, and work toward the destruction of this nation....One Step at a time.

Anyone who fails to see that, or denies it is taking place is just as ignorant as Obama.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

REALLY, PEOPLE ALREADY POSSESS THOSE WEAPONS. SO FORCED CONFISCATION BECOMES LAW. GOING DIRECTLY AGAINST THE 2ND AMENDMENT. HOW MANY PEOPLE KNOWING ITS ILLEGAL AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL WILL GIVE 'EM THE BULLETS INSTEAD, AT SOUND BREAKING SPEED ?
YOU ARE A REAL FOOOOOOOL AND A WANT TO BE NAZI.. There is not a damn thing American about your thinking ..-TYR

[Little-Acorn]

Really, people already possess those weapons. So forced confiscation becomes law. Going directly against the 2nd amendment. How many people knowing it's illegal and unconstitutional will give 'em the bullets instead, at sound breaking speed? You are a real foooooool and want to be a Nazi. There is not a damn thing American about your thinking ..-Tyr


(Fixed the stuck Caps-lock key for you.)

Want to hear a real knee-slapper?

In the only case ever to come before the Supreme Court that directly addressed the constitutionality of a Federal gun law - US v. Miller, about the 1934 National Firearms Act - the Supremes ruled that the only guns that WERE protected by the 2nd amendment, were guns that were similar or identical to those in use by the military at the time! Nowadays, that would mean, exactly, Assault Rifles! Especially the ones with a full-auto option, that could fire like machine guns! The Supreme Court has already ruled that the right of the people to own and carry them, cannot be infringed!

So if little gabby's wet dream were to somehow come true, Obama would not only be violating the 2nd amendment, he would also be going against the only Supreme Court case ever brought on that legislation!

Talk about bucking a stacked deck....!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[aboutime]

REALLY, PEOPLE ALREADY POSSESS THOSE WEAPONS. SO FORCED CONFISCATION BECOMES LAW. GOING DIRECTLY AGAINST THE 2ND AMENDMENT. HOW MANY PEOPLE KNOWING ITS ILLEGAL AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL WILL GIVE 'EM THE BULLETS INSTEAD, AT SOUND BREAKING SPEED ?
YOU ARE A REAL FOOOOOOOL AND A WANT TO BE NAZI.. There is not a damn thing American about your thinking ..-TYR

Tyr. Most of us know. What Obama basically promised in that typical, liberal speech was just another BACK-DOOR, or SIDE-DOOR attempt at deconstructing the 2nd Amendment.

Everything that is aimed at changing the Constitution, by those who disobey, or ignore it is done in SMALL steps, as we are now seeing.
Obama and his Democrat cronies who are HELL BENT on eroding the 2nd amendment know how to use CRISIS, and TERROR to pad their own needs, and illegal intentions.

One step at a time. Almost as if what happened in CT was somewhat of a LIBERAL BLESSING IN DISGUISE. It has given them a new SOAPBOX to preach to the IGNORANT, ILLITERATE, and UNDER-EDUCATED Americans who foolishly voted for Obama in November.
As long as Obama and the Democrats can depend on IGNORANCE by the large segment of Americans who put him in office again. They will be able to convince the dumb to do anything...in the name of FALSE Security...until THEY HAVE NONE.

[Missileman]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

A bolt-action 30-06 was a military weapon...the lever-action 30-30 saw military action. The Colt 45 M1911 pistol was a military weapon. A gunman with a double-barrel 12ga shotgun and a back full of shells would have amassed the same body count in that confined classroom. It DIDN'T have to be committed with a pistol-grip rifle.

[Dilloduck]

It was the first of his speeches that I actually listened to. I thought it was quite spiritually Christian in nature and I was glad he mentioned the names of the dead. Beyond that he said that we have to change the way we do things. Seems like a no brainer. I hope he was offering free mental health services because it's the only change that has a chance of making a difference. Gun conrol legislation is a waste of time and will do nothing to stop murders.

[DragonStryk72]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

Oh great, so only the real rat bastards will have them. That's just great, gabs. I'm certain none of them will walk into a school, and murder a mass of children.

[avatar4321]

This attack is a symptom of a problem the government cant fix. And they've even contributed to it.

We have become so dependent on government fixing our problems that we have stopped being responsible for ourselves and our families. And it's time to stop doing that.

[logroller]

Obama delivers great speeches...and abissmal responses.

[Larrymc]

He's still giving the speech now, as I type this. But I am greatly moved by what he said.

There was the usual fluff, the slow-motion enunciation, the downcast eyes, the chewing of the lower lip. I was eerily reminded of an odd blend of Al Gore and Bill Clinton.

But that aside, the SUBSTANCE of the speech is what made me pay attention. The President asked if he (and we) in good conscience could wait any longer before "doing something about this", referrring of course to the horrible shootings at the elementary school in Newtown, and he also mentioned other shootings in Aurora, and Columbine High School.

Bravo, Mr. President. I fully agree, and support what you said. We cannot wait any longer, and Government *must* do what it can to reduce or stop such horrors from happening any longer.

We have seen the things that have been tried so far. Gun-free zones - a complete failure. Nearly every such shooting has taken place in exactly such "gun-free zone". In fact, there is reason to believe the shooters planned it that way, knowing their victims had been disarmed in advance, and were unlikely to shoot back. Assault-weapons bans - another failure. We had one in place for upwards of ten years. How many of these mass shootings took place while it was in effect? Cities and states have also had restrictions on such "assault weapns", however vaguely defined or undefined. And these are exactly the places where, time and again, these shootings took place. They have likewise been a complete failure.

And in this latest horrific mass murder, what was the only thing that prevented it from being EVEN WORSE? Many news outlets have pointed out the answer. This insane whacko had some ten or fifteen minutes in that room with those terrified, screaming children - time enough to walk up to each one, the medical examinerts have said, and shoot them at point-blank range, more than once, and ensure they were DEAD. Have you noticed how few "wounded" there were? This guy was able to shoot virtually EVERY victim, and KEEP shooting them, until they were DEAD.

And, some authorities have said, he might well have gone on to shoot others, except for one thing that finally occurred: Men with guns showed up to stop him. When he saw they had arrived (however belatedly), only then did he stop firing at the small innocent children. And he turned his gun on himself. And the slaughter finally ended. Due entirely to the arrival of men with guns.

But before that happened, he had a relatively long time, during which NO ONE AROUND HIM HAD A GUN. And he knew it. And he used that time, to leisurely kill 27 people.

Mr. President, THANK YOU for finally taking the gloves off. As you said, it is clear that we can no longer continue to let what has gone on far too long, to continue. It is time for government to act. Thank you for bringing up this hard, harsh reality. Because ignoring it, and letting things go on as they have for so many years, only lets these horrors continue. Nothing could be clearer, especially now, with the bodies of those twenty small children and seven adults barely cool.

It is time to engender safer surroundings for our children - the kind of surroundings so callously denied them by for 10-15 horror-filled minutes that morning a few days ago, when a crazed lunatic had time to mercilessly gun down AN ENTIRE CLASSROOM full of our most precious and innocent, knowing no one could stop him. Thos useless "gun free zones" that gave the lunatic the assurance he wanted, must end. The worthless "assault weapons bans" that did nothing to prevent other such horror-filled times, must be swept aside.

Thank you, Mr. President, for declaring that now, finally we must do something that WORKS. These insane, murderous wretches must be denied the assurance that law-abiding people will be disarmed and left helpless before them. Obviously these insane freaks are not afraid to die themselves - this latest one calmly took his own life, and clearly planned to do it from the very beginning, and many of the other insane freaks have done. And just as clearly, this insane freak wanted to rack up a huge enough body count, commit such a horrible crime, that he would be assured of weeks of gory headlines, moths of bloodcurdling reports and analyses and hand-wringing on a nationwide scale, far more than he could hope to get by "merely" shooting one or two people. Ne needed the time and opportunity to shoot a LOT of people before taking his own life... and we gave it to him.

No more.

Mr. President, as you said so eloquently tonight, we can't let this go on. We must do the only thing that PREVENTS such insane murderers from getting the lurid headlines and infamous legacy they so desire. We must let any responsible persons at these most precious repositories of our most precious children, arm themselves if they so desire, and make themselves ready to deny people like this mass murderer the fame he seeks, before or after his own death.

The benefits are multiple, and the risks... well, how can the risks be any worse than the ones you so eloquently described tonight? Insens murderers like the Newtown shooter must be aware that, if/when they start on their horrible rampages, they will NOT have 10-15 minute to rack up their headline-making body counts before responsible people with guns show up. Instead, they have only seconds... not nearly enough time to methodically walk up to child after child and deliver multiple, carefully spaced shots into their terrified, pleading faces.

These insane murderers know that people with guns are right there, inside the same locked gates they themselves forced their way through. And the murderer must know that a bullt that will end his rampage is only seconds away... and might come from any of the people outside (or even inside) the classroom he is in. Most people at the school will still not be armed, of course. But a few will be... and he will have no idea which ones they are, nor what direction the bullet might come from. Only that it will come... and QUICKLY, not after 10 or 15 minutes.

Mr. President, thank you for your decision to not let the status quo remain. Thank you for finally deciding to change course, and do what will finally WORK. Thank youu most of all, for deciding to set up a situation where these insane murderers know, BEFORE THEY EVEN START, that their dreams of luring, workld-gripping headlines will never materialize. These insane murderers are obviously unafraid of dying. But finally we will be able to deny them what they DO want: Horrible, infamous fame, even in death.

These murderers are undeniably insane... but they still have enough cognizance left to plan how to get through locked gates, plan to accumulate and bring enough weapons and ammunition to do what they set out to do, etc. And they clearly have enough sanity, however fleeting, to know what they want, and to make elaborate plans to get it... and to react when they find it is not possible any more. And there is a reasonable chance that, even as insane as they obvuiously are, they might decide that since they will be unable to kill the dozens of people they want to... perhaps they should no longer bother to try. And maybe they should simply turn the gun on themselves in the few second we have left them, instead of taking away our most precious.

Thank you, Mr. President for finally deciding to change course. Thank you for deciding we have had enough of "responses" that have not worked. Thank you for declaring to the nation, in the moment of our greatest grief and outrage, that we will change course and do soemthig that reduces or PREVENTS these rare, insane whackos from doing these things to us.

I await your efforts to campaign against, sweep aside, and repeal the useless, unworkable schemes of the past, which have failed so regularly while our precious children keep dying in these horrible massacres they did nothing to prevent. Thank you for working to get rid of laws that disarm the only people who can save us from these monsterswho would murder us. Thank you for finally providing what the authors of the 2nd amendment knew all along: that ordinary, law-abiding Ameican citizens are the last - and indeed the only - real defense against the insane monsters in our midst. Thank you for repealing things like "may issue" restrictions that keep our only real defenders from helping us. Thank you for pledging to sweep away paranoid gun bans in cities like New York, San Francisco, Washington DC, and your own native Chicago that disarm only the innocent victims while the insane murderers go right on arming themselves and killing us and our children.

Even after you sweep aside these restrictions on our defending ourselves, you know and we know that most of us will still not bother arming ourselves in our everyday comings and goings. But a few of us will... and the occasional insane monsters lurking among us, will never know which ones we are. And this very knowledge may be enough to stop some of them from doing their horrible deeds. For the few that are still insane enough to try anyway, these new provisions will ensure that the insane ones will be kept busy enough - and soon, wounded or incapacitated quickly enough - to reduce the body count from dozens to far smaller numbers. Still horrible, but not as horrible as what happened where you are presently giving your speech: The elementary school in Newtown, CT where 20 precious children lie dead along with 7 adults who tried to save them. But could not, in part due to the very laws that we must now acknowledge did far more harm than good.

Thank you, Mr. President. I admire your courage in this change in course. And I fully support your efforts to get rid of the laws that have allowed so many massacres to continue... but hopefully will not longer be allowed to do so.i have a hard time listen to him, especially when he talks about God and Scripture, but i guess the man who couldn't included God in his convention, found a use for him, when people or hurting and they're really is nothing you can say, God and the Bible becomes a tool,

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Obama delivers great speeches...and abissmal responses.

I have never seen or heard a great speech by him. One must consider not just the carefully crafted words read from a teleprompter by this "supposed great orator" but also the character of the man , his true convictions and his true actions. Reading lies well and pretending great and compassionate concern does not impress me. Others with far less insight apparently it does.
By the way I think that it is an "abysmal " display of comprehension to praise a man when he is a lying bastard faking great compassion IMHO. But hey, that's just me.. --Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

This attack is a symptom of a problem the government cant fix. And they've even contributed to it.

We have become so dependent on government fixing our problems that we have stopped being responsible for ourselves and our families. And it's time to stop doing that.

:clap:

[mundame]

We have become so dependent on government fixing our problems that we have stopped being responsible for ourselves and our families. And it's time to stop doing that.

For instance, speaking of being responsible for our families:


Why did the father of that family abandon it to have a midlife crisis and marry a floozy? Because that's what apparently happened. If the father had stayed in the family, I bet this rampage wouldn't have happened.

The older brother Ryan, too: he hadn't been in contact with Adam for two years. We know that one thing that happened to Adam was complete abandonment by all male relatives. Maybe if they had been around and provided better male role models, or ANY male role models, this would not have happened.

To be fair, some shooters do come from intact families: both Columbine killers had a father in the home, for instance. The DC Sniper kid was begging for a father figure --- unfortunately, the one he found wanted him to shoot lots of people at gas stations.

I don't know. What do people think about broken families and young rampage shooters?

[Robert A Whit]

I didn't listen to the speech, can't stand to hear him talk. I will have to look for the speech now and see what he said, because, frankly, I don't believe him.

For some oddball reason, Obama believes he owns every bad event that happens in this country.

We elect mayors to run cities. We don't elect the president to waltz in and act as if the town is run by him.

We elect governors for the same purpose. But have a tragedy and in waltzes Obama trying to get more photo ops.

What is wrong with Obama hogging this?

How many of you have had his caravan impact your life? When he gets into any area, the secret service erects a wall around presidents. I don't mean one ten feet away, but even the distance bullets travel.

You can literally need to show ID just to get into your own home when he is around.

Clinton used to visit one of his pals in SunnyVale, CA and my son in law's parents lived on that court. Clinton shows up and suddenly it is an armed camp not only on that court, but the area was a fortress.

A private neighborhood.

Anyway, I was watching the SF 49ers play the Patriots on TV and suddenly NBC says they are going to TV Obama and his speech.

Damn that man. The game was more important to me than watching him pig out the TV time.

He never changed a thing. And others in the local government had to give up their time so he could pig the show for himself and make himself the center of attention.

Narcissist. I can't for the life of me recall any president who was such a narcissist as is Obama.

He probably got done and told his team, well, that should get me more points.

I think Little Acorn hit the ball out of the park.

[mundame]

I know what you mean, Bob, I didn't like it, either. We just switched to a music channel until they went back to the game.

It does seem narcissistic; good point. It's not all about him!

[Robert A Whit]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

None were used by this killer. None used in CO. Matter of fact, she is farting in the wind to think her bill will fix a thing.

The last time she did this, it did not save lives. (Sen. Feinstein)

Imaging cops had no guns. I magine that dude shot up a police station.

Think Feinstein would yammer that we need to ban assault weapons? No, she would say,let's arm the cops.

Arm the teachers. Killers don't want to face a gun fight. They want victims only. We armed the pilots. Heard of any airplane being hiJacked since 911 in this country?

[Abbey Marie]

For instance, speaking of being responsible for our families:


Why did the father of that family abandon it to have a midlife crisis and marry a floozy? Because that's what apparently happened. If the father had stayed in the family, I bet this rampage wouldn't have happened.

The older brother Ryan, too: he hadn't been in contact with Adam for two years. We know that one thing that happened to Adam was complete abandonment by all male relatives. Maybe if they had been around and provided better male role models, or ANY male role models, this would not have happened.

To be fair, some shooters do come from intact families: both Columbine killers had a father in the home, for instance. The DC Sniper kid was begging for a father figure --- unfortunately, the one he found wanted him to shoot lots of people at gas stations.

I don't know. What do people think about broken families and young rampage shooters?

It was one of the first points I made, so you know what I think.

I'm sure there was some perfect storm of mental issues, life experiences and current events that set this man off. But the fact that his father and his brother apparently abandoned him is likely a big part of that.

[Drummond]

What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

... which, if this is entirely true, falls far short of the stringent controls the UK experiences right NOW.

So, would such a ban fix any likelihood of future gun outrages ?

Well ... a 'yes' answer would completely defy the truth, as illustrated by this following link ...

http://www.murderuk.com/mass_Derrick_Bird.html

Having some of the most stringent gun laws on the planet STILL didn't stop the killings described from happening. So let's not kid ourselves.

Obama wants to disempower people, because in arranging that, he helps build on the dependency culture Socialists want. But this is ALL that can be 'achieved' .. no good outcome can come of his control freakery. NONE.

[aboutime]

... which, if this is entirely true, falls far short of the stringent controls the UK experiences right NOW.

So, would such a ban fix any likelihood of future gun outrages ?

Well ... a 'yes' answer would completely defy the truth, as illustrated by this following link ...

http://www.murderuk.com/mass_Derrick_Bird.html

Having some of the most stringent gun laws on the planet STILL didn't stop the killings described from happening. So let's not kid ourselves.

Obama wants to disempower people, because in arranging that, he helps build on the dependency culture Socialists want. But this is ALL that can be 'achieved' .. no good outcome can come of his control freakery. NONE.



Drummond. Something very few of us here in the USA are aware of, or care to mention when this topic is at the height of attention because of the terrible shootings last Friday is.... The U.S. Constitution DOES NOT GRANT The President any Power to Change, or Amend the Constitution.

All of this SCREAMING, WHINING, and POLITICAL RHETORIC....so soon after the shootings is NOTHING more than more Hyperbole our Politicians use, and depend on to Excite as many UNINFORMED, UNEDUCATED voters as they can.

Everyone should just look back to the shootings of the Arizona Congresswoman....and refresh themselves on the now REPEATED, GROUNDHOG DAY....whining, and screaming that took place after that occured.

Same actors. Different stage. RERUNS of same.

[Drummond]

Drummond. Something very few of us here in the USA are aware of, or care to mention when this topic is at the height of attention because of the terrible shootings last Friday is.... The U.S. Constitution DOES NOT GRANT The President any Power to Change, or Amend the Constitution.

All of this SCREAMING, WHINING, and POLITICAL RHETORIC....so soon after the shootings is NOTHING more than more Hyperbole our Politicians use, and depend on to Excite as many UNINFORMED, UNEDUCATED voters as they can.

Everyone should just look back to the shootings of the Arizona Congresswoman....and refresh themselves on the now REPEATED, GROUNDHOG DAY....whining, and screaming that took place after that occured.

Same actors. Different stage. RERUNS of same.

Thanks for this.

Still, if nothing can be done, then what's the point of debating the issue ?

Aboutime ... I'm probably the last person on here who can usefully comment on the US Constitution - I'm just not qualified to try. But I still have to wonder if its provisions can be bent to fit some sort of control. Maybe restricting the range of permitted weaponry. Maybe restricting the availability of ammunition.

If this is possible .. then, again, we'd STILL see a skewing of the power-balance to criminals, since there's bound to be a black market in more powerful weapons ... and besides, who'd resist hoarding in the run-up to such restrictions ?

And with a shifted power balance, you'd have the basis for a limited form of dependency culture.

And don't underestimate Obama. What happens if he manages to carry public opinion to such a pitch that he has Americans resenting the Constitution ?

I think Tyr's attitude to this is right. Obama's a Socialist destroyer. If he CAN find a way of damaging something that's a bedrock of American values, he'll do it.

It's what Socialist trash do, given half a chance. Considering what the UK has seen over the decades, I should know !!

[Robert A Whit]

This killer in CT coldly stood over each kid and kept shooting them. And he took aim on their heads.

I know of no way to modify a gun so it would not kill in such conditions. This clown was schooled in how to aim and shoot to kill. By his mom.

We can agonize over this. I tend to think that we will do this for a few more days and suddenly something else captures our attention and we yammer about that new event. My hope is it will not be some other shooting.

We keep telling them over and over.

Guns don't shoot themselfs.

Making a law up that craps on my rights is not how to fix a problem that is not about guns.

Somebody said, correctly so, that since he used a car to get to the school, maybe this ought to trigger new laws about the automobile.
:rolleyes:
What the hell.

He wore shoes too. So we must craft new shoe laws. And he had pants and a shirt on. Wooops, more new laws.
:rolleyes:
No it is not the gun.

This man intended to murder. We have plenty of laws about murder. We even have tons of laws due to guns.
You can't stop a bank robber with a law. You won't end the case of a man killing a woman with laws.

Face it, this country culture is violent. We must seek root causes.

I realize that it takes a few to spoil the stew. And most of us are not violent. But we see even our own government engaging in violence.

When we have a violent government, is it likely the citizens won't also be violent?

[mundame]

Gabosaurus: What you are going to get is a proposed ban on military style assault weapons and ammunition. It will become a felony to buy, sell or possess one.

Bob: None were used by this killer. None used in CO.


Yeah, it was the Bushmaster, an assault rifle, that did all the shooting before Lanza killed himself. It was in the Wall Street Journal this morning, and I trust their fact-checking. He shot the window in with the Bushmaster and killed the principal and psychologist in the hall, then used the same rifle for the many shots killing each child and teacher.

Now here's a big point: he also had on him the Glock and the Sig Sauer and hundreds of rounds of ammo for each of them. Apparently he planned to shoot the Bushmaster dry and then continue with the two handguns killing as many as he could -- there were 600 students in the school.

But as soon as he heard the police pounding down the hall, he shot himself, as they all do: this is a constant, it's what nearly every rampage shooter does.

This is why it's crucial to go in AS SOON AS they hear shots fired! (And they did, brave men! they went straight in as soon as they got there.)

Because that didn't happen at Columbine. That catastrophe of a response kept every police officer, even volunteer EMT people begging to go in, outside while Eric and Dylan leisurely killed until they got tired of it, and then after the gunfire stopped, the police and SWAT teams STILL did not go in for literally hours, while people inside bled out and died. They were afraid of a large team of terrorists, and to be fair, there were small bombs going off frequently that the boys had set, though the big ones never went off.

Okay, live and learn, the police don't wait anymore.

[mundame]

Somebody said, correctly so, that since he used a car to get to the school, maybe this ought to trigger new laws about the automobile.
:rolleyes:
What the hell.

Well, wait, there's no need to deal with the auto unless he used the auto to kill people, right? I mean, if he'd run a lot of people down, that would be a problem.


He wore shoes too. So we must craft new shoe laws. And he had pants and a shirt on. Wooops, more new laws.
:rolleyes:
No it is not the gun.


I think the accessory has to actually be ....armed, right? It has to be used to harm people, like this guy's Bushmaster was. The shoes and clothes aren't a problem themselves unless actually used to hurt people, right? Like the Sneaker Bomber, remember him? And people DID make laws against shoes and we've been taking our shoes off in airports ever since.

And that Nigerian Captain Underpants who had a panty bomb in the airplane flying into Detroit Christmas Day, remember? And we've had laws against underpants ever since, too --- in the sense that TSA gropers are always poking around in there and looking at people's genitals with their Xray machines.

[aboutime]

Thanks for this.

Still, if nothing can be done, then what's the point of debating the issue ?

Aboutime ... I'm probably the last person on here who can usefully comment on the US Constitution - I'm just not qualified to try. But I still have to wonder if its provisions can be bent to fit some sort of control. Maybe restricting the range of permitted weaponry. Maybe restricting the availability of ammunition.

If this is possible .. then, again, we'd STILL see a skewing of the power-balance to criminals, since there's bound to be a black market in more powerful weapons ... and besides, who'd resist hoarding in the run-up to such restrictions ?

And with a shifted power balance, you'd have the basis for a limited form of dependency culture.

And don't underestimate Obama. What happens if he manages to carry public opinion to such a pitch that he has Americans resenting the Constitution ?

I think Tyr's attitude to this is right. Obama's a Socialist destroyer. If he CAN find a way of damaging something that's a bedrock of American values, he'll do it.

It's what Socialist trash do, given half a chance. Considering what the UK has seen over the decades, I should know !!


Thank you Drummond. You managed to hit the nail, right on the head. As for not underestimating Obama. I put nothing past him. And, as you said. HE already IS managing to carry public opinion. The election on November 6 proved that there are more Uninformed, Dependent, Selfish, Uneducated Americans who want other people's stuff...more than they want, or understand the freedoms they are willing to GIVE AWAY...to be temporarily CONTENT to allow the Govt. to do their thinking for them.

It is on it's way down. And the only way to stop it ISN'T GONNA BE GOOD, or NICE.

[Robert A Whit]

Well, wait, there's no need to deal with the auto unless he used the auto to kill people, right? I mean, if he'd run a lot of people down, that would be a problem.




I think the accessory has to actually be ....armed, right? It has to be used to harm people, like this guy's Bushmaster was. The shoes and clothes aren't a problem themselves unless actually used to hurt people, right? Like the Sneaker Bomber, remember him? And people DID make laws against shoes and we've been taking our shoes off in airports ever since.

And that Nigerian Captain Underpants who had a panty bomb in the airplane flying into Detroit Christmas Day, remember? And we've had laws against underpants ever since, too --- in the sense that TSA gropers are always poking around in there and looking at people's genitals with their Xray machines.


On another thread I think, you called the Bushmaster an assault weapon because of what you read in the WSJ. I looked that article up and though the claim was made that he shot the victims using the Bushmaster, that is not an assault weapon.

A true assault weapon is a rather light weight gun that fires automatically so long as the trigger is held in the shooting position.

The Bush master fires one time per trigger pull. It's semi automatic.

Pne moer thing. The caliber is very small. This particular killere knew to kill the kids, he wanted to shoot them in the head. And to add to the pain, he kept shooting them in the head. Those kids died instantly.

But in general, your more typical actual assault weapon would be a bit larger caliber. Bear in mind that the smaller the cartridge is, the slower the bullet moves. I can't think of any standard .22 with the killing power of the M1- or M-14 and they have .30 cal ammo. While 7.62 mm ammo is not the same size as the M-1 ammo at 30.06, it is close enough to not matter. The M-14 uses the 7.62. Compare the cartridge size of the smaller rounds to the larger ammo.

Look, you can kill a cow with a .22 if you shoot the right spot in their head. i saw it done.

But in general, a semi auto is not an assault weapon.

Next they will want to ban not just assault weapons as used by the military, but the rest of the weapons.

This killing is very abnormal in that so many kids got killed and we are all shocked out of our minds.

[aboutime]

Thank you Drummond. You managed to hit the nail, right on the head. As for not underestimating Obama. I put nothing past him. And, as you said. HE already IS managing to carry public opinion. The election on November 6 proved that there are more Uninformed, Dependent, Selfish, Uneducated Americans who want other people's stuff...more than they want, or understand the freedoms they are willing to GIVE AWAY...to be temporarily CONTENT to allow the Govt. to do their thinking for them.

It is on it's way down. And the only way to stop it ISN'T GONNA BE GOOD, or NICE.


By the way. For anyone who thinks, or believes I have given up on our nation. Sounding more like a hypocrite in calling anyone out who has given up. My intentions are to INCITE the attention, and the reality needed from countless millions of Americans who either...have no idea what is taking place around them. Or, they are part of the growing problem, rather than the solution.

If nobody pays attention, or doesn't care. OBAMA, and the Democrats who support him WILL GET WHAT THEY WANT, while the Fools who voted for Obama and those Dems reach that day when they are surprised to learn....They have lost everything.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

(Fixed the stuck Caps-lock key for you.)

Want to hear a real knee-slapper?

In the only case ever to come before the Supreme Court that directly addressed the constitutionality of a Federal gun law - US v. Miller, about the 1934 National Firearms Act - the Supremes ruled that the only guns that WERE protected by the 2nd amendment, were guns that were similar or identical to those in use by the military at the time! Nowadays, that would mean, exactly, Assault Rifles! Especially the ones with a full-auto option, that could fire like machine guns! The Supreme Court has already ruled that the right of the people to own and carry them, cannot be infringed!

So if little gabby's wet dream were to somehow come true, Obama would not only be violating the 2nd amendment, he would also be going against the only Supreme Court case ever brought on that legislation!

Talk about bucking a stacked deck....!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Tis' why I always love reading your posts, you are always a step or two above (at least that)..
You and Drummond never fail to impress me with your rational and ample delivery of logical and informative posts--:beer:--Tyr
A few others here do too but I feel that I've overstepped my limit already on bravo's this week.. Even one of them is always my opposition!!

[DragonStryk72]

Yeah, it was the Bushmaster, an assault rifle, that did all the shooting before Lanza killed himself. It was in the Wall Street Journal this morning, and I trust their fact-checking. He shot the window in with the Bushmaster and killed the principal and psychologist in the hall, then used the same rifle for the many shots killing each child and teacher.

Now here's a big point: he also had on him the Glock and the Sig Sauer and hundreds of rounds of ammo for each of them. Apparently he planned to shoot the Bushmaster dry and then continue with the two handguns killing as many as he could -- there were 600 students in the school.

But as soon as he heard the police pounding down the hall, he shot himself, as they all do: this is a constant, it's what nearly every rampage shooter does.

This is why it's crucial to go in AS SOON AS they hear shots fired! (And they did, brave men! they went straight in as soon as they got there.)

Because that didn't happen at Columbine. That catastrophe of a response kept every police officer, even volunteer EMT people begging to go in, outside while Eric and Dylan leisurely killed until they got tired of it, and then after the gunfire stopped, the police and SWAT teams STILL did not go in for literally hours, while people inside bled out and died. They were afraid of a large team of terrorists, and to be fair, there were small bombs going off frequently that the boys had set, though the big ones never went off.

Okay, live and learn, the police don't wait anymore.

Actually one other cogent fact has come to light: He attempted to buy an assault rifle and was denied. So then. how did he get one? Well, that's easy, he shot someone he knew had one in the head, and took it. What gun control law, precisely, is going to change that in any meaningful way?

[KitchenKitten99]

Anything the President says in regards to anything about any new laws, brings this into my mind:

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/548733_10151291007064061_787301395_n.jpg

That is all.

[Robert A Whit]

A bolt-action 30-06 was a military weapon...the lever-action 30-30 saw military action. The Colt 45 M1911 pistol was a military weapon. A gunman with a double-barrel 12ga shotgun and a back full of shells would have amassed the same body count in that confined classroom. It DIDN'T have to be committed with a pistol-grip rifle.

I had a .45/.70 Winchester that may have seen combat. I had an M-1 Garand that probably saw combat. They don't fool us. They want any gun gotten rid of.

See, you can kill a lot of humans with such weapons.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I had a .45/.70 Winchester that may have seen combat. I had an M-1 Garand that probably saw combat. They don't fool us. They want any gun gotten rid of.

See, you can kill a lot of humans with such weapons.

A man could have went into that room with a hammer and done the same thing. This attack upon the 2nd Amendment by obama and his corrupt crew over this is dirty as hell and ALL that support it should be ashamed!
Every pistol , every rifle and every shotgun has the power to kill if the right ammo is used.. They seek to eliminate battle rifles first and for a reason.They see a future in which the citizens fight back and they want it to be with far inferior and far less deadly weapons. For they plan on eliminating our Constitution eventually. With it gone they can do as they please.-Tyr

[red states rule]

When I saw the video of Obama crying the first thing I thought of was Bill Clinton at the funeral of Ron Brown. It was all for the camera and the liberal media
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr8Y9qguTgc

[Larrymc]

When I saw the video of Obama crying the first thing I thought of was Bill Clinton at the funeral of Ron Brown. It was all for the camera and the liberal media
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr8Y9qguTgcI saw the Speech and he appeared to wipe a way tears but, i saw no evidence of a wet spot on his face

[Robert A Whit]

Tis' why I always love reading your posts, you are always a step or two above (at least that)..
You and Drummond never fail to impress me with your rational and ample delivery of logical and informative posts--:beer:--Tyr
A few others here do too but I feel that I've overstepped my limit already on bravo's this week.. Even one of them is always my opposition!!

Interestingly enough, there is no federal law banning you from owning a fully automatic machine gun. You however do have to have a federal permit. (combined automatic and machine gun for the ladies who may get confused about automatic vs machine gun)

[Robert A Whit]

I saw the Speech and he appeared to wipe a way tears but, i saw no evidence of a wet spot on his face

I have seen the video before where he is walking and cracking jokes and looks up at the camera and suddenly goes into teary Bill mode. It was real showmanship.