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Jeff
07-06-2013, 08:13 AM
This amazes me , they want Gay rights or tolerance of different life styles but yet don't want to hear the truth , the Bible says it is a sin a sin that you can be forgiven for but a sin just the same so if you wish to be gay either ya don't believe in what the bible says or are willing to take the chance that the bible is wrong so why get mad when a preacher simply holds a sign telling you what the truth is . If you want to live a alternative lifestyle you have to realize there will be those opposed to it and a preacher holding a sign most certainly didn't deserve to be attacked , I mean if it bothered this guy that much ( the sign the preacher was holding ) then as far as I am concerned that blows the entire argument of being born that way , nope he is just a pervert that couldn't even afford a hooker


The violence that has been threatened for years by homosexuals who are intolerant of those who espouse an opposing world view turned real at a “gay pride” event recently in Seattle, where authorities arrested two men for attacking a preacher.
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/gay-threats-of-violence-turn-into-attack/#32XVWhzawUXQl6BL.99

hjmick
07-06-2013, 08:18 AM
I saw this yesterday. It is a sad state of affairs when those calling for acceptance and tolerance offer none...


BTW Jeff, does your link have all the information and stats? Some folk seem unable to use a search engine to find more information...

Jeff
07-06-2013, 08:26 AM
I saw this yesterday. It is a sad state of affairs when those calling for acceptance and tolerance offer none...


BTW Jeff, does your link have all the information and stats? Some folk seem unable to use a search engine to find more information...


You Know me Mr. hjmick I post what I see use my head to see the truth and don't worry about facts to prove what is shown to me in black and white :laugh:

Noir
07-06-2013, 09:01 AM
This amazes me , they want Gay rights or tolerance of different life styles but yet don't want to hear the truth , the Bible says it is a sin a sin that you can be forgiven for but a sin just the same so if you wish to be gay either ya don't believe in what the bible says or are willing to take the chance that the bible is wrong so why get mad when a preacher simply holds a sign telling you what the truth is . If you want to live a alternative lifestyle you have to realize there will be those opposed to it and a preacher holding a sign most certainly didn't deserve to be attacked

The old phrase ironically goes 'no tolerance for intolerance. You'd think people like that preacher would be more concerned with spreading his gods love, than his hate, no?


I mean if it bothered this guy that much ( the sign the preacher was holding ) then as far as I am concerned that blows the entire argument of being born that way , nope he is just a pervert
that couldn't even afford a hooker

Using the same logic - if a black guy assaulted a man who was holding some racist signs, would you say 'well that blows the entire argument about being born black, clearly he chose to be that way'


The violence that has been threatened for years by homosexuals who are intolerant of those who espouse an opposing world view turned real at a “gay pride” event recently in Seattle, where authorities arrested two men for attacking a preacher. Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/gay-threats-of-violence-turn-into-attack/#32XVWhzawUXQl6BL.99

No one should be attacking anyone, physically, verbally or mentally, but there is plenty of hate, and thus attacks, from both sides here.

Noir
07-06-2013, 09:08 AM
Also, watching the video, it seems to be mostly one guy who is described as having a significant 'wrap sheet' and when he starts assaulting the preacher the other gays around are shouting "stop" and pull him away.
So in a big crowd there was a looney with previous, go figure.

Jeff
07-06-2013, 09:18 AM
The old phrase ironically goes 'no tolerance for intolerance. You'd think people like that preacher would be more concerned with spreading his gods love, than his hate, no?



Using the same logic - if a black guy assaulted a man who was holding some racist signs, would you say 'well that blows the entire argument about being born black, clearly he chose to be that way'



No one should be attacking anyone, physically, verbally or mentally, but there is plenty of hate, and thus attacks, from both sides here.

1) The preacher was spreading love Noir in his eyes he was letting these people know if they repent for there sins they will be forgiven , he was actually spreading love by trying to help save these people


2) The preacher wasn't holding a racist sign nor a sign filled with hate a true Christian believes if he/she can help turn any sinner away from what they are doing and help steer them to god they have done good , so bad example


3) And number three you may be right but this article showed a one sided attack , but I see you saying it is coming from both sides but you are clearly trying to prove the preachers side wrong , your first two comments show that

Noir I think you are a great guy and a very smart guy but I have to wonder why with all the intelligence you have why you feel the need to hate something you don't believe in , IMO ya cant hate ( or love for that matter ) something you don't believe in , at least not to the extent of arguing about every thread you see that has anything to do with Religion , this article if you watched the video showed clearly a man ( the preacher ) peaceable holding a sign that he truly believes in and not screaming or ranting and raving but was attacked , sorry buddy but there is no excuse for that

Now you go and pick each thing apart I just typed to meet your atheist ( hard to believe you are a atheist with all your hate towards religion ) needs and post a nasty thread but remember this was cut and dry a man hold s a sign and gets attacked period

Jeff
07-06-2013, 09:25 AM
Also, watching the video, it seems to be mostly one guy who is described as having a significant 'wrap sheet' and when he starts assaulting the preacher the other gays around are shouting "stop" and pull him away.
So in a big crowd there was a looney with previous, go figure.
Noir the three lesbians where right in going after the man in your opinion ? No they didn't throw punches but yes he was being attacked just the same and again Noir this thread doesn't say every gay person is a lunatic it showed what happened at one rally

Noir if you are born this way and maybe some are ya don't have to get mad or go to being violent because someone disagrees , I ride one type of motorcycle and there are people that don't like that kind of bike should I attack them , no , it is there right to believe in what they want

cadet
07-06-2013, 09:39 AM
...Using the same logic - if a black guy assaulted a man who was holding some racist signs, would you say 'well that blows the entire argument about being born black, clearly he chose to be that way'...

I have proof that gay's can't be born that way. I've been making gay acquaintances rethink their opinions.

Noir
07-06-2013, 09:39 AM
1) The preacher was spreading love Noir in his eyes he was letting these people know if they repent for there sins they will be forgiven , he was actually spreading love by trying to help save these people

Telling people to 'Repent or go to hell' is not love. You do not spread love by making threats.



2) The preacher wasn't holding a racist sign nor a sign filled with hate a true Christian believes if he/she can help turn any sinner away from what they are doing and help steer them to god they have done good , so bad example

Ignoring the fact that you said this proved to you that being gay was a choice.



3) And number three you may be right but this article showed a one sided attack , but I see you saying it is coming from both ^sides but you are clearly trying to prove the preachers side wrong your first two comments show that

Or rather that both the preachers and the assaulter were in the wrong.



Noir I think you are a great guy

Thanks, I do too ^,^


and a very smart guy

Do go on...


but

Dammit i knew a but was comming


I have to wonder why with all the intelligence you have why you feel the need to hate something you don't believe in , IMO ya cant hate ( or love for that matter ) something you don't believe in , at least not to the extent of arguing about every thread you see that has anything to do with Religion , this article if you watched the video showed clearly a man ( the preacher ) peaceable holding a sign that he truly believes in and not screaming or ranting and raving but was attacked , sorry buddy but there is no excuse for that Now you go and pick each thing apart I just typed to meet your atheist ( hard to believe you are a atheist with all your hate towards religion ) needs and post a nasty thread but remember this was cut and dry a man hold s a sign and gets attacked period

Some man insults a group, that group shout some insults back, and a loony in the group started hitting the guy, and the other people in the group pulled the looney away, from hitting the man that had been insulting them. Nothing special. But just look at the link you posted, read the comments at the bottom of the page, and see the hate and bile being posted about all gays because of this.

cadet
07-06-2013, 09:50 AM
Telling people to 'Repent or go to hell' is not love. You do not spread love by making threats.

http://www.wwnorton.com/college/history/archive/resources/documents/ch03_03.htm

The God that holds you over the pit of hell, much as one holds a spider or some loathsome insect over the fire, abhors you, and is dreadfully provoked. His wrath towards you burns like fire; he looks upon you as worthy of nothing else but to be cast into the fire. He is of purer eyes than to bear you in his sight; you are ten thousand times as abominable in his eyes as the most hateful, venomous serpent is in ours.

You have offended him infinitely more than ever a stubborn rebel did his prince, and yet it is nothing but his hand that holds you from falling into the fire every moment. It is to be ascribed to nothing else that you did not got to hell the last night; that you were suffered to awake again in this world, after you closed your eyes to sleep. And there is no other reason to be given why you have not dropped into hell since you arose in the morning, but that God's hand has held you up. There is no other reason to be given why you have not gone to hell since you have sat here in the house of God provoking his pure eye by your sinful, wicked manner of attending his solemn worship. Yea, there is nothing else that is to be given as a reason why you do not this very moment drop down into hell.

O sinner! consider the fearful danger you are in! It is a great furnace of wrath, a wide and bottomless pit, full of the fire of wrath that you are held over in the hand of that God whose wrath is provoked and incensed as much against you as against many of the damned in hell. You hang by a slender thread, with the flames of Divine wrath flashing about it, and ready every moment to singe it and burn it asunder. . . .

It would be dreadful to suffer this fierceness and wrath of Almighty God one moment; but you must suffer it to all eternity. There will be no end to this exquisite, horrible misery. When you look forward, you shall see along forever a boundless duration before you, which will swallow up your thoughts, and amaze your soul. And you will absolutely despair of ever having any deliverance, any end, any mitigation, any rest at all. You will know certainly that you must wear out long ages, millions of millions of ages in wrestling with this Almighty, merciless vengeance. And then when you have so done, when so many ages have actually been spent by you in this manner, you will know that all is but a point [dot] to what remains. So that your punishment will indeed be infinite.

Oh! who can express what the state of a soul in such circumstances is! All that we can possibly say about it gives but a very feeble, faint representation of it. It is inexpressible and inconceivable: for "who knows the power of God's anger"!

How dreadful is the state of those that are daily and hourly in danger of this great wrath and infinite misery! But this is the dismal case of every soul in this congregation that has not been born again, however moral and strict, sober and religious, they may otherwise be. Oh! that you would consider it, whether you be young or old!

There is reason to think that there are many in this congregation, now hearing this discourse, that will actually be the subjects of this very misery to all eternity. We know not who they are, or in what seats they sit, or what thoughts they now have. It may be they are now at ease, and hear all these things without much disturbance, and are now flattering themselves that they are not the persons, promising themselves that they shall escape.

If we knew that there was one person, and but one, in the whole congregation, that was to be the subject of this misery, what an awful thing it would be to think of! If we knew who it was, what an awful sight would it be to see such a person! How might the rest of the congregation lift up a lamentable and bitter cry over him!

But, alas! instead of one, how many is it likely will remember this discourse in hell! And it would be a wonder, if some that are now present should not be in hell in a very short time, before this year is out. And it would be no wonder if some persons that now sit here in some seats of this meeting-house, in health, and quiet and secure, should be there before tomorrow morning!

& Dante's inferno. God being all lovey dovey is a fairly new thing. Through most of history it's been about god's wrath, hell, etc. But in recent years god has somehow in the public opinion became a pushover who's all rainbows and butterflies.


Ignoring the fact that you said this proved to you that being gay was a choice.




Or rather that both the preachers and the assaulter were in the wrong.




Thanks, I do too ^,^



Do go on...



Dammit i knew a but was comming



Some man insults a group, that group shout some insults back, and a loony in the group started hitting the guy, and the other people in the group pulled the looney away, from hitting the man that had been insulting them. Nothing special. But just look at the link you posted, read the comments at the bottom of the page, and see the hate and bile being posted about all gays because of this.

Insults are fair game. Punches are not. You have the freedom of speech, not the freedom of laying out whoever disagree's with you.

Gaffer
07-06-2013, 10:02 AM
The preacher had as much right to be there and say anything he wanted as the queers did. The queer that assaulted him needs to spend a long time in jail reflecting on his life choices. With his record it seems a bullet in the head would not be a waste of lead.

They are not gays, they are queers. Queer as in unnatural. Religion has nothing to do with it. Saying they are born that way is nothing but an excuse for deviant behavior.

Jeff
07-06-2013, 01:01 PM
Telling people to 'Repent or go to hell' is not love. You do not spread love by making threats.

me ) It is love Noir it says in the bible if ya dont repent you will go to hell , this preacher took time out of his busy day to try and help there people


Ignoring the fact that you said this proved to you that being gay was a choice.

me ) Ignore nothing you compared apples to oranges , but I will try to explain it to you AGAIN these people if born that way are no different than you or I in there beliefs you don't belief in god therefore if someone told you you where going to hell I would imagine you would LOL at them if someone told me that I would be mad because I try my best to live by the bible and if these people where truly born that way they would ( if they believed in God ) know God created them and he would know they where born that way so they would try to explain that or simply ignore it


Or rather that both the preachers and the assaulter were in the wrong.

me) The preacher assaulted no one he defended himself


Thanks, I do too ^,^



Do go on...



Dammit i knew a but was comming


me) Told ya I thought you where smart :laugh:

Some man insults a group, that group shout some insults back, and a loony in the group started hitting the guy, and the other people in the group pulled the looney away, from hitting the man that had been insulting them. Nothing special. But just look at the link you posted, read the comments at the bottom of the page, and see the hate and bile being posted about all gays because of this.

me) No hate at all Noir these people understand the way the preacher believes , he was there to try and help some of Gods children and was attacked for it and yes that makes some very angry

)

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-06-2013, 06:49 PM
This amazes me , they want Gay rights or tolerance of different life styles but yet don't want to hear the truth , the Bible says it is a sin a sin that you can be forgiven for but a sin just the same so if you wish to be gay either ya don't believe in what the bible says or are willing to take the chance that the bible is wrong so why get mad when a preacher simply holds a sign telling you what the truth is . If you want to live a alternative lifestyle you have to realize there will be those opposed to it and a preacher holding a sign most certainly didn't deserve to be attacked , I mean if it bothered this guy that much ( the sign the preacher was holding ) then as far as I am concerned that blows the entire argument of being born that way , nope he is just a pervert that couldn't even afford a hooker


The violence that has been threatened for years by homosexuals who are intolerant of those who espouse an opposing world view turned real at a “gay pride” event recently in Seattle, where authorities arrested two men for attacking a preacher.
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/gay-threats-of-violence-turn-into-attack/#32XVWhzawUXQl6BL.99


According to Jason's FB page and the woman standing next tio him in the wedding dress, he's most definitely not gay.




https://m.facebook.com/jason.queree?id=1834861746&_rdr


It's a Breitbart style set-up. If you listen to the idiot with the camera he says "This is why I'm here".

tailfins
07-07-2013, 08:52 AM
I have proof that gay's can't be born that way. I've been making gay acquaintances rethink their opinions.

It doesn't matter if they were born that way. Irrespective of their desires, they can control their behavior. If someone is born as a kleptomaniac, does that mean it's OK for them to steal?

Noir
07-07-2013, 11:42 AM
It doesn't matter if they were born that way. Irrespective of their desires, they can control their behavior. If someone is born as a kleptomaniac, does that mean it's OK for them to steal?

In exactly the same sense that when two people get married, thats them, for life, bound. Irrespective of any desires that they may have to be happy or at least less miserable (if the marriage doesn't work out), and should they dare to do so, and find companionship with another human, they will burn for their sins as a wrenched adulterer. Right?

As an aside, do people stand outside divorce offices with signs, telling people they will burn in hell for their sinful ways?

Noir
07-07-2013, 12:02 PM
The preacher had as much right to be there and say anything he wanted as the queers did.

Agreed


The queer that assaulted him needs to spend a long time in jail reflecting on his life choices.

Agreed


With his record it seems a bullet in the head would not be a waste of lead.

Disagree


They are not gays, they are queers. Queer as in unnatural.

Disagree


Religion has nothing to do with it.

Agree


Saying they are born that way is nothing but an excuse for deviant behavior.

Disagree.

Quite the roller-coaster of a post, however as a main point while the preachers where within the rights - just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should. See Westbro-Baptists for an extreme example with a similar idea.

cadet
07-07-2013, 12:36 PM
In exactly the same sense that when two people get married, thats them, for life, bound. Irrespective of any desires that they may have to be happy or at least less miserable (if the marriage doesn't work out), and should they dare to do so, and find companionship with another human, they will burn for their sins as a wrenched adulterer. Right?

As an aside, do people stand outside divorce offices with signs, telling people they will burn in hell for their sinful ways?

If they're church goers, they get a whole lot of shit from church members.
So to answer your question, no, they don't. That doesn't mean it's smiled upon, it's just not looked at as much compared to gays. I guess... Churches don't see it as a huge giant issue. (even though they should)

But then again, only dumbass churches like the Westboro baptist church protest anything. The rest of us normal folk know that hate ain't the way to go.
Unfortunately, the good ones don't get air time...

Noir
07-07-2013, 01:37 PM
If they're church goers, they get a whole lot of shit from church members.

Wow, really? That must be great, like, you're going through a hugely stressful and emotional time, and your friends/peers in your social network and spiritual centre feel it's their position to give you a 'whole lot of shit' about it.


So to answer your question, no, they don't. That doesn't mean it's smiled upon, it's just not looked at as much compared to gays. I guess... Churches don't see it as a huge giant issue. (even though they should)

It really is odd, i mean, adultery et all get much more print space in the bible, and even its own number on the slab of commandments...you'd think it'd be taken more seriously. Why is a gay not treated like an adulterer?


But then again, only dumbass churches like the Westboro baptist church protest anything. The rest of us normal folk know that hate ain't the way to go. Unfortunately, the good ones don't get air time...

Well, defining 'the good ones' is where the snag lies. I'm sure a few in this thread would regard these preachers as exactly that kinda 'good guys' that we need more of, to 'tell the truth to the queers faces' and yada yada. And indeed that now showing these 'good guys' (whether assaulted or not) would be denying airtime to the true voice of the american majority - part of a Liberal stunt by silence to marginalise these 'good men'.

red state
07-07-2013, 02:55 PM
Sin is sin and we are ALL born with a sin/fallen/weakened nature that requires someone better than WE to escape the penalty of our sins. The preachers were well within their rights and they homosexuals who demand intolerance YET expressed NONE should have the book thrown at them. The preachers were not preaching hate (only warning the homosexuals of a coming doom if they continue to ignore and mock God's law and the natural order of things. Holding a sigh up for travelers that reads [BRIDGE OUT AHEAD] is not preaching hate and only an ignorant, small/closed minded person of intolerance would see what these preachers did as HATE so I'll have to disagree with one of the posters assessment of another posters intellect.

As to the distinction between homosexuality and heterosexual adultery (or even divorce)....Again, SIN is SIN but the Bible clearly states that homosexuality is an abomination. Still, the only unpardonable sin is that of rejection. To reject Christ is to spend an eternity away from Christ. It is a choice (just as homosexuality is a choice to give in to a particular sin nature).

The homosexuals were WRONG and those who would say that the preachers were at fault in any way are also WRONG. The preachers are better men than I because I would have given in to my weakness/sin by returning the hatred that was being displayed by the homosexuals. Then again, I wouldn't have been there holding a sign.....I say let 'em all go to hell. Anyone ignorant enough to try and screw a bolt into a bolt or a nut into a nut is a flaw that only harms a society. I would say igNOIR them but that is why we are where we are today. Besides, homosexuals will not allow anyone to igNOIR them because they want the rest of us to make THEM feel better about their perversions of nature by accepting THEM or even honoring THEM.

THEY intend to achieve 'acceptance', 'tolerance' and 'honor' by FORCE while we are expected to reject our beliefs, heritage and religion. We are to remain silent and keep our disgust of them to ourselves when THEY display inappropriate acts in public as if we want to see. I generally keep my heterosexuality to myself (in the privacy of my home) and I should expect THEM to do the same. Perhaps we should have a "NORMAL PRIDE DAY" as THEY have their "QUEER PRIDE DAY".

[Hate the sin....love the sinner] but they certainly make it very difficult to do so and I'm sick of "igNOIRing" the problem. We should all be sick of it by now and if anything good can come from homosexual marriage, it will come from there no longer being a need for THEM to put their choice on display or further force their agenda in our schools, churches or homes. But with the election of B.O. (twice now) THEY still preach "equality" for the down trodden minority when their interpretation of equality is to simply continue to punish others through their biased equality.

Is my post full of hate and frustration....you bet it is. I'm so frustrated with the bias and I HATE having to tolerate others who have NO intentions to tolerate my wisdom in defending my family by any unlimited means necessary or their unwillingness to tolerate my standards, religion or right to declare or execute such rights. England is GONE and I refuse to allow the USA to slither into the sewers as England willingly CHOSE to do. Unlike the not-so-great England, we have freedom of speech here and I hate to think that the heroes of yesteryear fought and died for the filth we allow to march or "occupy" in our cities of today.

Noir
07-07-2013, 03:21 PM
The preachers were not preaching hate (only warning the homosexuals of a coming doom if they continue to ignore and mock God's law and the natural order of things. Holding a sigh up for travelers that reads [BRIDGE OUT AHEAD] is not preaching hate and only an ignorant, small/closed minded person of intolerance would see what these preachers did as HATE so I'll have to disagree with one of the posters assessment of another posters intellect.

'Warning' of something that they have belief but not knowledge of. This is in stark contast to warning someone that a bridge is out, becuase you can *know* of a bridge is out, you can not know if someone is going to hell, you can only *think* that they are. The difference is too fundamental not to acknowledge.



As to the distinction between homosexuality and heterosexual adultery (or even divorce)....Again, SIN is SIN but the Bible clearly states that homosexuality is an abomination. Still, the only unpardonable sin is that of rejection.

Am i to infer from that, that you think that someone who lives the lifestyle of a homosexual, or an adulterer, will be forgiven their sins at death if they have accepted Christ?

Jeff
07-07-2013, 04:52 PM
'Warning' of something that they have belief but not knowledge of. This is in stark contast to warning someone that a bridge is out, becuase you can *know* of a bridge is out, you can not know if someone is going to hell, you can only *think* that they are. The difference is too fundamental not to acknowledge.




Am i to infer from that, that you think that someone who lives the lifestyle of a homosexual, or an adulterer, will be forgiven their sins at death if they have accepted Christ?


Noir when I was young I was raised Catholic and as I grew into my teenage years ( the age where Mom and dad couldn't tell ya ya had to go to Church or probably a better way to put it got tired of arguing with me ) I stopped going , I also started partying a lot and well just became young and wild , at the young age of 22 I met a guy working at a scrap yard that taught me to drive TT I really looked up to this guy he was just a great guy and he was a Christian , I mean he would fast for his sins ( if he had uttered a curse he wouldn't allow himself food the next day to punish himself ) Well during this time I went through some real bad times ( I lost my oldest son ) I was just lost and this man would talk to me and it would always turn to Christian talk and he would tell me if I don't want to hear it or if it gets to much to simply tell him and he will stop m, well he told me many stories from the bible one that stuck in my mind was about a woman and her young daughter who went to church everyday but yet on e morning on the way a horse and its cart ran the little girl over and killed her and the woman questioned God why ( which you are not suppose to do ) well I wont go into it all but this very story helped me through my troubles of my son and has stuck with me all these years , another story he told me was of a man he knew in Puerto Rico That his Daughter was murdered by a man the man was sentenced to death on such and such a day and the father prayed the man would turn to god , the man of course was a killer a criminal of the worst kind and would have nothing to do with it , well the father fasted for 40 days and on the 40th day the prisoner asked to speak with the father and on that day he found God and the father forgave him for killing his daughter and yes God forgave him . So yes to the answer to your question those that believe even if they turn to him on there death bed provided it is true in there heart that they believe the only way to go to Heaven is to believe in Jesus Christ and to believe that he died for our sins, so yes Homosexuals , adulteress even murders can still go to Heaven , that is why the preacher was out there not to belittle the people with his sign but to try and truly lead them top the path he believes will give them eternal life .

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-07-2013, 04:55 PM
The attacker was straight and it was a set up. Dumbasses.

Noir
07-07-2013, 05:02 PM
The point I am making Jeff, is not 'if a homosexual finds god on his deathbed' or anything like that, rather, 'if a homosexual lives his whole life as a Christian AND a homosexual.'

Some would seem to say the two are incompatable, others not.

Noir
07-07-2013, 05:05 PM
The attacker was straight and it was a set up. Dumbasses.

That would be amusing if true, though i've seen no evidence to say so.
Regardless of his sexuality he was a loon in a crowd, get a big enough crowd and you'll find loons.

Jeff
07-07-2013, 05:22 PM
The point I am making Jeff, is not 'if a homosexual finds god on his deathbed' or anything like that, rather, 'if a homosexual lives his whole life as a Christian AND a homosexual.'

Some would seem to say the two are incompatable, others not.


Noir a person couldn't actually be a Christian and a homosexual , he/ she may go to church and do everything right but as long as they live that lifestyle they aren't truly living as a Christian , I understand your Question and think it is a great one and I wish I could give you a better answer but IMO it is in your heart and in your soul , we are all sinners but most of us don't go to bed at night saying well I will commit this sin or this one tomorrow but a person living as a homosexual knows when they wake up there partner will be next to them so it is not possible for them to ask for forgiveness and to truly give themselves to God , as I said that was my opinion hopefully someone will be able to explain it better than I can

Noir
07-07-2013, 05:42 PM
Noir a person couldn't actually be a Christian and a homosexual , he/ she may go to church and do everything right but as long as they live that lifestyle they aren't truly living as a Christian , I understand your Question and think it is a great one and I wish I could give you a better answer but IMO it is in your heart and in your soul , we are all sinners but most of us don't go to bed at night saying well I will commit this sin or this one tomorrow but a person living as a homosexual knows when they wake up there partner will be next to them so it is not possible for them to ask for forgiveness and to truly give themselves to God , as I said that was my opinion hopefully someone will be able to explain it better than I can

Just as woman who has divorced and then re-married, she knows she will wake each morn with her *second* husband, is it therefore impossible for her to be a Christian?

This is before we even go into thought crime/sin.

Jeff
07-07-2013, 06:23 PM
Just as woman who has divorced and then re-married, she knows she will wake each morn with her *second* husband, is it therefore impossible for her to be a Christian?

This is before we even go into thought crime/sin.

That woman should have asked forgiveness for her first divorce provided she didn't divorce or stray from her current husband she was forgiven

aboutime
07-07-2013, 06:29 PM
That woman should have asked forgiveness for her first divorce provided she didn't divorce or stray from her current husband she was forgiven


Jeff. Obviously Noir has no understanding of the words Forgiveness, or Judgmental. But then. Expecting that would be far above his capacity to lower himself to such things in life.

Noir
07-07-2013, 06:32 PM
That woman should have asked forgiveness for her first divorce provided she didn't divorce or stray from her current husband she was forgiven

Adultery is defined as a continuous sin, in contrast to a single event like divorce.

To put parallels in place for context.

Having a one night 'experiment' stand with someone of the same sex, and having a divorce are both single events.

Living a gay lifestyle for life, and marrying someone after you've divorced, entail either continuous gay or adulterous sinning.

Again, this is before you contemplate including thoughts as sin.

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-07-2013, 06:34 PM
That would be amusing if true, though i've seen no evidence to say so.
Regardless of his sexuality he was a loon in a crowd, get a big enough crowd and you'll find loons.

I already posted the linkk to his fb page. The one with his wife in her wedding dress. The guy with the camera recording it if you listen says "this is why I'm here".

Noir
07-07-2013, 06:41 PM
I already posted the linkk to his fb page. The one with his wife in her wedding dress. The guy with the camera recording it if you listen says "this is why I'm here".

'This is why i'm hear' is vague at best. It also begs the question why someone would record themselves saying that what they were recording was a hoax.

As for a pic with his wife, is their anything to suggest thats his wife, rather than say a pic of a brother an sister on her wedding day?

Or indeed if it is his wife, is their confirmation that he is not bisexual?

Edit - forgot to mention - Even if he is totally straight, that wouldn't mean definite setup, plenty of straight people attend 'pride' events for/with LGBT friends/family etc.

As i said, it would be amusing if it was a setup, but until there's definite statements and facts you gotta go with what's more likely. Though certainly not amusing for the preachers, being the victim of a 'heat of the moment' assault is one thing, because the victim of a pre-meditated assault, to try and stir up hate on both sides is ughhh

logroller
07-07-2013, 07:16 PM
The attacker was straight and it was a set up. Dumbasses.
Doesn't mean we can't have a discussion on the matter. A rouse is only as effective as the audience allows it to be.

aboutime
07-07-2013, 07:53 PM
I fully suspect "Damn Yankee Twinkie" has another life better known as BillyBob...the idiot.

Jeff
07-07-2013, 08:54 PM
Adultery is defined as a continuous sin, in contrast to a single event like divorce.

To put parallels in place for context.

Having a one night 'experiment' stand with someone of the same sex, and having a divorce are both single events.

Living a gay lifestyle for life, and marrying someone after you've divorced, entail either continuous gay or adulterous sinning.

Again, this is before you contemplate including thoughts as sin.

I hear what your saying Noir and I am trying :laugh: Adultery is a continuous sin if you continue to do so and yes a one night experiment with a member of either sex is a sin as for living your life in a gay relationship and marrying someone after being divorced that is where your wrong , when you left that first marriage and stopped loving that person and you asked for forgiveness you would be forgiven and therefore could remarry , God is a forgiving God Noir and we are all sinners not one among us can say they are without sin but the bible says homosexuality is abomination but yet will forgive a gay person if he/she repents

fj1200
07-08-2013, 06:21 AM
Noir a person couldn't actually be a Christian and a homosexual , he/ she may go to church and do everything right but as long as they live that lifestyle they aren't truly living as a Christian ,

I know several who would disagree with that.

Jeff
07-08-2013, 06:51 AM
I know several who would disagree with that.


I imagine you do I do as well but to wake up every morning knowing you are living in sin ( even though we are all sinners ) is wrong , the average person doeskin go to bed thinking of the sins they will commit the next day but if you are laying down in a gay relationship or are married and lay down with someone other than your spouse ya cant be in good standings with God ,but Homosexuality is said to be a abomination to god even though it is forgivable as are all sins ( except the biggie , denouncing God ) but Homosexuality is a big one and ya don't live in sin with the idea well before I die I will repent for it .

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-08-2013, 11:06 AM
Doesn't mean we can't have a discussion on the matter. A rouse is only as effective as the audience allows it to be.

I think the word is "ruse".

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-08-2013, 11:07 AM
I imagine you do I do as well but to wake up every morning knowing you are living in sin ( even though we are all sinners ) is wrong , the average person doeskin go to bed thinking of the sins they will commit the next day but if you are laying down in a gay relationship or are married and lay down with someone other than your spouse ya cant be in good standings with God ,but Homosexuality is said to be a abomination to god even though it is forgivable as are all sins ( except the biggie , denouncing God ) but Homosexuality is a big one and ya don't live in sin with the idea well before I die I will repent for it .

what kind of sinner are the heteros whose genes blend together to create a homo?

logroller
07-08-2013, 12:22 PM
I think the word is "ruse".
That would explain why autocorrect kept trying to replace it...with rouge, I knew that wasn't right. Nonetheless, you grasp my point.

logroller
07-08-2013, 12:30 PM
what kind of sinner are the heteros whose genes blend together to create a homo?
Free will. One is responsible for their own actions.

fj1200
07-08-2013, 12:54 PM
I imagine you do I do as well but to wake up every morning knowing you are living in sin ( even though we are all sinners ) is wrong , the average person doeskin go to bed thinking of the sins they will commit the next day but if you are laying down in a gay relationship or are married and lay down with someone other than your spouse ya cant be in good standings with God ,but Homosexuality is said to be a abomination to god even though it is forgivable as are all sins ( except the biggie , denouncing God ) but Homosexuality is a big one and ya don't live in sin with the idea well before I die I will repent for it .

That presumes it is a sin.

aboutime
07-08-2013, 02:06 PM
what kind of sinner are the heteros whose genes blend together to create a homo?


You can answer your own question Damn Yankee. Check your family Tree!

Noir
07-08-2013, 03:14 PM
I hear what your saying Noir and I am trying :laugh: Adultery is a continuous sin if you continue to do so and yes a one night experiment with a member of either sex is a sin as for living your life in a gay relationship and marrying someone after being divorced that is where your wrong , when you left that first marriage and stopped loving that person and you asked for forgiveness you would be forgiven and therefore could remarry , God is a forgiving God Noir and we are all sinners not one among us can say they are without sin but the bible says homosexuality is abomination but yet will forgive a gay person if he/she repents

Every time a once married woman, sleeps with has sex with a man who was not her first husband, she is committing adultery.

A second (and wholly more interesting IMO) angle would be the asexual homoromatics. i.e. people who would live a life as a homosexual, with same sex partners etc, however, they do not have sex and limited physical contact. Can they be Christian? Is it just the sex that is the sin, and not the lifestyle?

cadet
07-08-2013, 07:52 PM
That presumes it is a sin.

Let's say there's a guy who classifies himself as a man addicted to pornography. He watches porn every day. Yet he goes to church and says that it's ok. There's nothing wrong with him, and rather then fight his sin, he accepts it.
No, to be a good christian, you have to be asking god for forgiveness for that sin, and the strength to get over it.

ACCEPTING your sin isn't the same as FIGHTING it.

I once heard it a different way. Imagine you had a gay pastor and a pastor who went to the strip club all the time.
Both have accepted their sin.
Both have given up on God helping them get over their sick twisted desires.
And neither should be listened to until they get their shit together.

cadet
07-08-2013, 07:54 PM
Every time a once married woman, sleeps with has sex with a man who was not her first husband, she is committing adultery.

Right. Unless, you know, death did them part. (first hubby died)


A second (and wholly more interesting IMO) angle would be the asexual homoromatics. i.e. people who would live a life as a homosexual, with same sex partners etc, however, they do not have sex and limited physical contact. Can they be Christian? Is it just the sex that is the sin, and not the lifestyle?

Sin starts in the heart. Not the flesh.

Jeff
07-08-2013, 08:24 PM
That presumes it is a sin.

Yes I guess you are right but most Christians believe in the bible and Homosexuality is most definitely a sin in the Bible in fact I think it is called a abomination to god , so you can believe as you wish ( or not you per say anyone can ) myself I try ( and I emphasize the word try ) to live by the bible

aboutime
07-08-2013, 08:27 PM
Every time a once married woman, sleeps with has sex with a man who was not her first husband, she is committing adultery.

A second (and wholly more interesting IMO) angle would be the asexual homoromatics. i.e. people who would live a life as a homosexual, with same sex partners etc, however, they do not have sex and limited physical contact. Can they be Christian? Is it just the sex that is the sin, and not the lifestyle?


Noir. In case you haven't really thought too much about what you have said above. Think about this. How about your parents? Guess you got here by mistake, huh?

avatar4321
07-08-2013, 08:44 PM
The question now is do you use this as a reason to hate those who engage in homosexual behavior? Or do you use it as an opportunity to show forgiveness and love them even more?

Jeff
07-08-2013, 08:51 PM
Every time a once married woman, sleeps with has sex with a man who was not her first husband, she is committing adultery.

A second (and wholly more interesting IMO) angle would be the asexual homoromatics. i.e. people who would live a life as a homosexual, with same sex partners etc, however, they do not have sex and limited physical contact. Can they be Christian? Is it just the sex that is the sin, and not the lifestyle?

As for the once married woman if she asked for forgiveness and repented after divorcing her first husband then no she is not sinning if she is sleeping with her second Husband , another thought here if she is just sleeping with a man than yes she is sinning no not adultery but having sex before you are married is a sin

As for the second one WOW :laugh: that's a tuff one , If two men live as one under the law they are representing themselves as a gay couple and yes that is a abomination to God is my belief

Noir I have always been taught the Bible is open to interpretation , and the bible also says to live by the law of the land so I have told you my beliefs I am not saying I am right or wrong it is just my opinion, the wife and I are also having a debate over this subject :laugh: thanks buddy , she believes Gays can live a Christian lifestyle but unless they ask for forgiveness and repent they will go to hell ( same as I believe kind of ) but her theory would make both you and Fj correct in a Gay man can be a Christian , but then my believe comes in when if they don't repent they will go to hell .

fj1200
07-09-2013, 06:51 AM
Let's say there's a guy who classifies himself as a man addicted to pornography. He watches porn every day. Yet he goes to church and says that it's ok. There's nothing wrong with him, and rather then fight his sin, he accepts it.
No, to be a good christian, you have to be asking god for forgiveness for that sin, and the strength to get over it.

ACCEPTING your sin isn't the same as FIGHTING it.

I once heard it a different way. Imagine you had a gay pastor and a pastor who went to the strip club all the time.
Both have accepted their sin.
Both have given up on God helping them get over their sick twisted desires.
And neither should be listened to until they get their shit together.

That didn't really address the issue of whether it is sin or not.


Yes I guess you are right but most Christians believe in the bible and Homosexuality is most definitely a sin in the Bible in fact I think it is called a abomination to god , so you can believe as you wish ( or not you per say anyone can ) myself I try ( and I emphasize the word try ) to live by the bible

Are you sure about that?


<center style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif; line-height: 16px;">Scripture cannot mean now
what it did not mean then.</center>Since Paul was referencing a particular pagan religious activity, shrine prostitution, in Romans 1, it is dishonest to reinterpret his words as if they suddenly refer to modern gays, lesbians, bisexuals or transgendered people. Paul’s words in Romans 1 are neither generic nor theoretical.
In Romans 1, Paul addressed a real situation faced by Christians in first century Rome. He was not making a sweeping, universal condemnation of any and all same sex activity, divorced from the historical and religious context of his argument against idolatry.
If Paul's words in Romans 1:26-27 were not a universal reference to homosexuality in the first century AD, then Romans 1:26-27 cannot be a universal reference to homosexuality today.
Reading into the text what Paul did not say (a universal prohibition of homosexuality) is called eisogesis. That is an improper way to interpret scripture. That kind of faulty interpretation is unworthy of Christians who love the word of God.
Paul's words to the Christian community in ancient Rome (http://www.gaychristian101.com/Romans-1-And-Homosexuality.html) come from his knowledge of the first century world in which he lived. His carefully tailored argument in Romans 1 is set in the specific context of Gentile and Jewish history, complete with first century illustrations familiar to first century readers.
Paul’s readers were intimately acquainted, as we are not, with Greek, Jewish and Roman culture and the shrine prostitution which permeated those ancient cultures.
http://www.gaychristian101.com/Romans-1.html

I think it unwise to read the bible out of context in which it was written especially when reading an English version without background into the original Greek, for example.

Jeff
07-09-2013, 07:21 AM
That didn't really address the issue of whether it is sin or not.



Are you sure about that?


http://www.gaychristian101.com/Romans-1.html

I think it unwise to read the bible out of context in which it was written especially when reading an English version without background into the original Greek, for example.

Fj there are many books in the bible with much scripture and of course I am sure you are aware many believe what you get from the scripture is what it means

But yes in the bible it clearly states Homosexual sex is a abomination to God , it may not be in this scripture and they may differ but my take on it all is all sex considered pervers falls into the category of a sin

fj1200
07-09-2013, 09:46 AM
Fj there are many books in the bible with much scripture and of course I am sure you are aware many believe what you get from the scripture is what it means

But yes in the bible it clearly states Homosexual sex is a abomination to God , it may not be in this scripture and they may differ but my take on it all is all sex considered pervers falls into the category of a sin

I disagree that it's so clear. Unless of course you limit your view of the Word to Romans 1: 26, 27 KJV irrespective of context.

cadet
07-09-2013, 10:03 AM
That didn't really address the issue of whether it is sin or not.

Sure it did, you just have to be smarter than the average bear to get it :rolleyes:

fj1200
07-09-2013, 01:11 PM
Sure it did, you just have to be smarter than the average bear to get it :rolleyes:

No. You stayed with the "sin" premise and proceeded to equate it with pornography.

cadet
07-09-2013, 03:09 PM
No. You stayed with the "sin" premise and proceeded to equate it with pornography.

Equating a sin with another sin is not stating it as a sin?

fj1200
07-09-2013, 03:13 PM
Equating a sin with another sin is not stating it as a sin?

Umm... :confused:

I'm disputing your premise.

Damn Yankee's Twinkie
07-09-2013, 05:58 PM
Let's say there's a guy who classifies himself as a man addicted to pornography. He watches porn every day. Yet he goes to church and says that it's ok. There's nothing wrong with him, and rather then fight his sin, he accepts it.
No, to be a good christian, you have to be asking god for forgiveness for that sin, and the strength to get over it.

This is what I love about christians. Rather than not sin they have that good old standby of begging forgiveness. How about not sinning to begin with?

fj1200
07-09-2013, 06:02 PM
This is what I love about christians. Rather than not sin they have that good old standby of begging forgiveness. How about not sinning to begin with?

Umm, man is fallen and can't help but sin. Are you sinless in the eyes of your religion?

Jeff
07-09-2013, 07:50 PM
This is what I love about christians. Rather than not sin they have that good old standby of begging forgiveness. How about not sinning to begin with?

There is no man among us without sin

aboutime
07-09-2013, 07:54 PM
There is no man among us without sin


Jeff. Must admit. What I am thinking about how to handle Damn Yankee WOULD be a sin.

Anyone who acts like him/her. Deserve whatever happens to them in the future.

But best of all. The God that Damn Yankee makes fun of. Played the biggest joke on him/her.

Proving how ignorance, stupidity, hatred, and being just plain dumb...are not accidents for Damn Yankee.

Jeff
07-09-2013, 08:25 PM
Jeff. Must admit. What I am thinking about how to handle Damn Yankee WOULD be a sin.

Anyone who acts like him/her. Deserve whatever happens to them in the future.

But best of all. The God that Damn Yankee makes fun of. Played the biggest joke on him/her.

Proving how ignorance, stupidity, hatred, and being just plain dumb...are not accidents for Damn Yankee.

I have to agree with you , if his post wasn't so funny he may of made me mad but I imagine he is just a youngster with some learning to do

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
07-09-2013, 08:41 PM
Fj there are many books in the bible with much scripture and of course I am sure you are aware many believe what you get from the scripture is what it means

But yes in the bible it clearly states Homosexual sex is a abomination to God , it may not be in this scripture and they may differ but my take on it all is all sex considered pervers falls into the category of a sin

http://www.bible.ca/s-homo=sin.htm The Bible's condemnation of homosexuality is as clear and plain as the Bible's condemnation of murder, adultery, premarital sex, kidnapping, lying and idolatry. Further, for me to openly condemn homosexuality theologically makes me no more a "gay basher" than I am an "adultery basher", "premarital sex basher", "kidnapper basher" or a "murderer basher". If you disagree, your argument is with God's Bible.
The homosexual community has two ways of promoting their personal choices of being homosexual through the religious forum. First, some will claim the Bible actually promotes and condones homosexuality. Second, others try to get the Bible banned from public use by categorizing it as hate literature.
For any to use the Bible to condone rather than condemn homosexual activity in the theological arena just proves such a one has absolutely no idea what the Bible actually teaches. For anyone to suggest the Bible says homosexual activity is acceptable to God, is nothing short of willful blindness. So to set the record straight once and for all, here is what the Bible teaches on the subject.
Anyone who has heard of the cities of "Sodom and Gommorah" knows that they were notorious hotbeds of homosexuality. Gen 19:5-8 "and they called to Lot and said to him, 'Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may have relations with them.' But Lot went out to them at the doorway, and shut the door behind him, and said, 'Please, my brothers, do not act wickedly.'" The Greek word in the New Testament for homosexuality is literally "a sodomite". Jock is trying to redefine what the term "sodomite" means. (A term that has unchanged in 5000 years, even today- "sodomy") Apart from the fact the city was clearly destroyed by God because of homosexuality in the narrative of Gen 19, even the New Testament clearly states exactly the same thing in Jude 7 "Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example, in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire." Any sinner should always remember that the God who commands us to love our neighbour is the same God who will cast any and all unrepentant sinners into the "eternal fire". Here are more Bible quotes, Lev 18:22-23 "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." Lev 20:13 "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death." 1 Cor 6:9 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals" 1 Tim 1:9-10 "realizing the fact that (civil) law is not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers" Rom 1:26-27 "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error."
If the homosexual community chooses to practice homosexuality in privacy, that is there free choice. But let such persons know for certain that the Christian Bible condemns all such practices and God will judge them unfit for the kingdom of heaven if the continue to practice and openly promote homosexual sex.

red state
07-10-2013, 12:14 PM
Still, the only unpardonable sin (in my opinion and/or study) is not murder, mass murder, homosexuality or even pedophilia (unfortunately). The only unpardonable sin is the rejection of CHRIST. We need only accept the gift of atonement He made on Golgotha Hill and the victory He accomplished three FULL days later when he arose. He is the pre-existing, virgin born, PERFECT/sinless, ALL powerful personality of GOD. I think of the Trinity as God Past, God Present and God Future (living all at once within the same time placements) who knows all, can do ALL except sin, allows sin but can intervene. In His wisdom, He knows that freedom is very important but He also knows that with choice comes consequences. He didn't create HELL for US but if we reject Him we condemn ourselves to an eternal death without GOD. Without God all is darkness, chaos and torment but this was a state that was initially set aside for Lucifer and his followers.

We are to be as Christ and that means we are to love the sinner yet hate the sin. I must confess that I find this extremely difficult because the rebel in me prevents me from loving those who would intentionally do this Great Nation harm or take the freedoms that have made us GREAT. To slip (as I often do) is one thing but to purposely do what one knows to be wrong is sin....no matter how WE try to sugar coat it. We can only STRIVE to be like Christ and as the old song sings: HE's Still Workin' On Me.

red state
07-10-2013, 12:50 PM
Getting off of the spiritual/religion side of this topic and addressing a political/moral side of things, a society must have standards. This issue of homosexuality or their contradiction of marriage, has subjected all of us to an almost unlimited amount of scenarios when it comes to EQUALITY.

One of the worse things about the homosexual issue, or other perversions from the natural order of things, is the fact that the flood gates are now open. Unfortunately, it seems that these gates have been opened and the cancer of undefined standards is spreading. CA is a perfect "canary" to use as a measuring stick when determining what WE THE PEOPLE may become or WILL become. For a State that has so much history, beauty, natural resources, access and population, they should be one of the greatest States we have. But do to their turning away from common sense of the American Way of PRIDE, Fortitude, Character and STANDARDS, It has become an existence of slavery, poverty, insecurity and corruptness. The taxpayers SERVE an ever growing populous of masters who we know as beneficiaries or border invaders and Christians live under a rule of tyranny that plays second fiddle only to the evils of iSLUM. Equality/Fairness has replaced prosperity and political correctness has replaced common sense.

With lunacy such as [the bathroom bill] CA repetitively produces DANGER, chaos and a state of anarchy and with rulings from judges who overstep their bounds and cancel the will of the voters, we see madness. We know this lack of order is unAmerican yet allow the insanity to continue and we will eventually fall prey to a tyranny that is Far worse than what our founders lived under before DECLARING their independence.

This is what happens when good men do nothing and eventually allow themselves to live under a decree that states; "if it feels good; DO IT."

http://mail.adpost.com/email/scripts/attach.pl/uid=1&pn=2&noInline=0&folder=INBOX/CA%20(the%20screw%20ball%20state%20-%20SMALL).jpg

jimnyc
07-10-2013, 06:08 PM
This is what I love about christians. Rather than not sin they have that good old standby of begging forgiveness. How about not sinning to begin with?

You talking about not sinning? Accusing another of doing things with little boys, obviously without proof, is beyond sinful in my opinion.

Larrymc
07-10-2013, 06:32 PM
This amazes me , they want Gay rights or tolerance of different life styles but yet don't want to hear the truth , the Bible says it is a sin a sin that you can be forgiven for but a sin just the same so if you wish to be gay either ya don't believe in what the bible says or are willing to take the chance that the bible is wrong so why get mad when a preacher simply holds a sign telling you what the truth is . If you want to live a alternative lifestyle you have to realize there will be those opposed to it and a preacher holding a sign most certainly didn't deserve to be attacked , I mean if it bothered this guy that much ( the sign the preacher was holding ) then as far as I am concerned that blows the entire argument of being born that way , nope he is just a pervert that couldn't even afford a hooker


The violence that has been threatened for years by homosexuals who are intolerant of those who espouse an opposing world view turned real at a “gay pride” event recently in Seattle, where authorities arrested two men for attacking a preacher.
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/gay-threats-of-violence-turn-into-attack/#32XVWhzawUXQl6BL.99They plead for tolerance of there views, but well quickly become vulgar and or violent, if anyone has a different view, I've seen it time and time again, they claim they just want to be accepted, but after engaging many of them with an open mind it becomes clear that they really seek to force there agenda.

fj1200
07-11-2013, 05:50 AM
http://www.bible.ca/s-homo=sin.htm

Apart from the fact the city was clearly destroyed by God because of homosexuality in the narrative of Gen 19...

It's a bit disingenuous to say that homosexuality was the only sin of Sodom, nevertheless your author also stated this:


Pro-gay theologians are correct in saying that this passage [Genesis 19] does not provide a strong argument [for] prohibiting all homosexual acts.

Bob Davies, Coming Out Of Homosexuality, 1993.

tailfins
07-11-2013, 06:24 AM
In exactly the same sense that when two people get married, thats them, for life, bound. Irrespective of any desires that they may have to be happy or at least less miserable (if the marriage doesn't work out), and should they dare to do so, and find companionship with another human, they will burn for their sins as a wrenched adulterer. Right?

As an aside, do people stand outside divorce offices with signs, telling people they will burn in hell for their sinful ways?

Once upon a time preachers preached fire and brimstone against divorce. Anything that contributed to divorce was protested, boycotted, shamed into leaving the community that promoted liquor, porn, gambling, etc. A few years ago gambling and lotteries swept the nation. Sadly, too many were asleep at the switch and now it's accepted as "normal".

cadet
07-11-2013, 08:13 AM
It's a bit disingenuous to say that homosexuality was the only sin of Sodom, nevertheless your author also stated this:


Pro-gay theologians are correct in saying that this passage [Genesis 19] does not provide a strong argument [for] prohibiting all homosexual acts.

Bob Davies, Coming Out Of Homosexuality, 1993.

http://carm.org/bible-homosexuality

You don't need JUST Genesis 19.

Larrymc
07-11-2013, 08:47 AM
http://carm.org/bible-homosexuality

You don't need JUST Genesis 19.I agree you don't just need Genesis, we know when we have done wrong its written on our harts. In fact i believe that the reason that most homosexuals become enraged when there view is not accepted is because deep inside they know its wrong, but if they could get people to accept it maybe that natural sense of guilt would ease.

fj1200
07-11-2013, 09:58 AM
http://carm.org/bible-homosexuality

You don't need JUST Genesis 19.

Especially when you ignore context.


Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord.

fj1200
07-11-2013, 10:01 AM
I agree you don't just need Genesis, we know when we have done wrong its written on our harts. In fact i believe that the reason that most homosexuals become enraged when there view is not accepted is because deep inside they know its wrong, but if they could get people to accept it maybe that natural sense of guilt would ease.

Fallacies aside; was that right after you told them that they were going to hell and that they should put themselves back in the closet?