Where is the damn proof??

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

http://news.yahoo.com/syrias-assad-did-not-chemical-weapons-064952151.html http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/veMAAqK9t3aKDTkw02fT2g--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTQyMTtweG9mZj01MDtweW 9mZj0wO3E9ODU7dz03NDk-/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/27c364069f04821c3b0f6a706700b3a9.jpg.View gallery



http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/qv9kPpJ3SkvCjB.KFJl9Dg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTgzLjI1O3B5b2ZmPTA7cT 04NTt3PTE0OA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/637ea7b59f03821c3b0f6a70670049a1.jpg
.
http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/1YZ6EPHJaHkrtOi_OYtFLw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTgzLjI1O3B5b2ZmPTA7cT 04NTt3PTE0OA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/84bcc4869dde7d1c3b0f6a70670063e1.jpg
.
http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/1gP4mb5JHRHeNutcEneUCg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTgzLjI1O3B5b2ZmPTE1O3 E9ODU7dz0xNDg-/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/c21b8fcb9f02821c3b0f6a7067005511.jpg
.
http://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/4lOzYz644eGu0CtmbU4drw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTgzLjI1O3B5b2ZmPTE1O3 E9ODU7dz0xNDg-/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/a732ba899ebb811c3b0f6a706700af60.jpg
.

http://l.yimg.com/os/152/2012/04/21/image001-png_162613.png (http://www.ap.org/) <cite class="byline vcard top-line"><abbr>15 hours ago</abbr> </cite>



<center><center>
</center>
</center>

<!-- google_ad_section_start --> MOSCOW (AP) — Syrian President Bashar Assad said his troops did not use chemical weapons in an attack on a rebel-held suburb in a Damascus last week where hundreds of people died.
The United States have said that there is little doubt that Assad's regime was responsible for the attack on Aug. 21 in the capital's eastern suburbs. Anti-government activists and Doctors Without Borders say that more than 300 people were killed in an artillery barrage by regime forces Wednesday that included the use of toxic gas.
Assad told Russia's Izvestia daily that the accusations that his troops were responsible were "politically motivated."
"This is nonsense," Assad was quoted as saying in an interview published Monday. "First they level the accusations, and only then they start collecting evidence."
Assad said that attacking such an area with chemical weapons would not make sense for the government as there was no clear frontline between regime and rebel forces.
View gallery."
http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/Pc.N55Dp5ST6Y59l38krGw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTIwMDtxPTg1O3c9MzAw/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/637ea7b59f03821c3b0f6a70670049a1.jpg
Friends pose for a photograph at coffee shop in Damascus, Syria, Sunday, Aug. 25, 2013. Syria reache …
(http://news.yahoo.com/photos/friends-pose-photograph-coffee-shop-damascus-syria-sunday-photo-064952649.html)
"How can the government use chemical weapons, or any other weapons of mass destruction, in an area where its troops are situated?" he said. "This is not logical. That's why these accusations are politically motivated, and a recent string of victories of the government forces is the reason for it."
Syria said Sunday that a U.N. team could investigate the site but a senior White House official dismissed the deal as "too late to be credible."
With France, Britain, Israel and some U.S. congressmen urging swift military action against Assad's regime if the use of chemical agents is confirmed, the U.N. team's conclusions could have a dramatic impact on the trajectory of the country's civil war.
French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius said no decision had been made on a military intervention but that any response would be "proportionate."
"It will be negotiated in coming days," Fabius told Europe 1 radio on Monday. He said that the lack of a U.N. blessing was problematic, but that all options remain on the table------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Already convicted without a shred of proof and why believe the muslim terrorists rebels? Are they saints are they not GD murdering scum? So Obama says so. when was he ever NOT A GD lying son of a bitch? THIS WAS A FALSE FLAG ATTACK ... SO ASSAD KILLING 300 OR 1300 CIVILIANS WOULD GAIN HIM WHAT? BESIDES A SUPERIOR ENEMY --USA-- WHICH COULD EASILY SECURE HIS DEFEAT. HE' D HAVE TO BE CRAZY TO DO IT! So far he has survived over 30 months by not being crazy! Its a known fact if he is defeated Syria goes to an Islamic government, Sharia law and will be another base for our enemies! So why is Obama so damn keen on making that happen? Think people ,stop believing the American press and Obama . If YOU still refuse to believe then please give me your email address , I got oceanfront property in Kansas for sale real cheap. I'll contact you for an easy sale... How come America is not asking for proof? Proving it happened is not the same as proving who did it. The rebels had a thousand more percent to gain than Assad.... I've never been scammed out of money in my entire life and I've dealt with those people expert in doing so for about 25 years . Don't fall for the damn scam. -Tyr

[aboutime]

Anyone happen to remember back during the IRAQ war, when Bush, Blair, and even the U.N. declared that Saddam had WMD's?

If you do remember that. Do you remember when someone suggested Bush was lying about WMD's, almost every day...If you hated Bush, or were a Democrat, and just agreed that Bush made Colin Powell look like a fool for saying..."The WMD's could have been sent to SYRIA?"

Why isn't anyone talking about that now, since Bush took all the blame?

And, isn't it surprising how Assad, in Syria now denies using Chemical Weapons...formerly called WMD's by the BUSH haters, and nobody wants to now admit. BUSH WASN'T LYING AT ALL????

Hypocrisy, Lies, Hatred, and just plain STUPIDITY still rules for those who Love Obama, and Democrats so much.

[Gaffer]

Hey, he's got a couple of repubs backing him up on this so there's no need of congress. I still haven't heard a word about his taking any of this to congress for approval.

He's going to fight this in clinton style. The stealth bombers and fighters are already on the way to the refueling points. There won't be many boots on the ground. They will just strike all the military points and let the brotherhood forces move in.

I don't think russia will involve in any actual way, but iran will definitely take some kind of action.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Hey, he's got a couple of repubs backing him up on this so there's no need of congress. I still haven't heard a word about his taking any of this to congress for approval.

He's going to fight this in clinton style. The stealth bombers and fighters are already on the way to the refueling points. There won't be many boots on the ground. They will just strike all the military points and let the brotherhood forces move in.

I don't think russia will involve in any actual way, but iran will definitely take some kind of action.
If so he should be impeached. He also should be arrested IMHO. SYRIA HASNT FIRED A DAMN SHOT AT US. He would be doing it only to secure victory for our known enemies the terrorists and there is a federal law against aiding them. He engages in treason by doing so. Yes, I know he has before. --Tyr

[Gaffer]

The big thing is to watch iran. Half of assad's forces are iranians. They will use hezbo to strike Israel when the US hits assad. And unless it has moved there's still an iranian frigate or destroyer in a syrian port.

The US will strike syria in the next 48 hours.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

The big thing is to watch iran. Half of assad's forces are iranians. They will use hezbo to strike Israel when the US hits assad. And unless it has moved there's still an iranian frigate or destroyer in a syrian port.

The US will strike syria in the next 48 hours. Damn Gaffer, appears that you and I are the only ones that have a clue about this false flag attack and who really is behind it. I say let's give them a hint--it wasn't Assad or his forces. -Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Check this article out!! http://ca.news.yahoo.com/syrian-kurdish-leader-says-assad-not-blame-attack-181018014.html Syrian Kurdish leader says Assad not to blame for attackhttp://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/FZN6924R0WZ__x92.x6.GA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9Zml0O2g9Mjc-/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/logo/reuters/d0c3eb8ca18907492a4b337b5cec5193.jpeg (http://www.reuters.com/)<cite class="byline vcard">By Alexandra Hudson | Reuters – <abbr title="2013-08-26T18:10:18Z">7 hours ago By Alexandra Hudson
BERLIN (Reuters) - Syrian President Bashar al-Assad would not be "so stupid" as to use chemical weapons close to Damascus, the leader of the country's largest Kurdish group said.
Saleh Muslim, head of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party (PYD), said he doubted the Syrian president would resort to using such weapons when he felt he had the upper hand in the country's civil war.
He suggested last Wednesday's attack, which the opposition says was carried out by government forces and killed hundreds of people, was aimed at framing Assad and provoking an international reaction. Assad has denied his forces used chemical weapons.
"The regime in Syria ... has chemical weapons, but they wouldn't use them around Damascus, 5 km from the (U.N.) committee which is investigating chemical weapons. Of course they are not so stupid as to do so," Muslim told Reuters.
At the time of the incident, U.N. experts were already in Syria to investigate three previous alleged chemical attacks dating from months ago.
Muslim's PYD, which has well-armed and effective militias, has clashed with Assad's forces as well as rebels, but has allowed both to move through its territories during the war.
Some rebels and rival Kurdish groups accuse it of having been close to the state, a position Muslim disputes. He said Kurdish areas the PYD controlled were under attack from al Qaeda-linked rebels.
Muslim suggested "some other sides who want to blame the Syrian regime, who want to show them as guilty and then see action" lay behind the chemical attack, which has led to speculation that Western countries will order a military response.
He said that if the U.N. inspectors found evidence Assad was not behind the gassing and the rebels were, "everybody would forget it".
"Who is the side who would be punished? Are they are going to punish the Emir of Qatar or the King of Saudi Arabia, or Mr. Erdogan of Turkey?" Qatar, Turkey and Saudi Arabia have all strongly condemned Assad and backed the rebels.
Kurdish militias have sought to consolidate their grip in northern Syria after exploiting the chaos of the civil war over the past year by seizing control of districts as Assad's forces focused elsewhere.
</abbr></cite>

[aboutime]

Check this article out!! http://ca.news.yahoo.com/syrian-kurdish-leader-says-assad-not-blame-attack-181018014.html Syrian Kurdish leader says Assad not to blame for attack

http://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/FZN6924R0WZ__x92.x6.GA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9Zml0O2g9Mjc-/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/logo/reuters/d0c3eb8ca18907492a4b337b5cec5193.jpeg (http://www.reuters.com/)<cite class="byline vcard">By Alexandra Hudson | Reuters – <abbr title="2013-08-26T18:10:18Z">7 hours ago By Alexandra Hudson
BERLIN (Reuters) - Syrian President Bashar al-Assad would not be "so stupid" as to use chemical weapons close to Damascus, the leader of the country's largest Kurdish group said.
Saleh Muslim, head of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party (PYD), said he doubted the Syrian president would resort to using such weapons when he felt he had the upper hand in the country's civil war.
He suggested last Wednesday's attack, which the opposition says was carried out by government forces and killed hundreds of people, was aimed at framing Assad and provoking an international reaction. Assad has denied his forces used chemical weapons.
"The regime in Syria ... has chemical weapons, but they wouldn't use them around Damascus, 5 km from the (U.N.) committee which is investigating chemical weapons. Of course they are not so stupid as to do so," Muslim told Reuters.
At the time of the incident, U.N. experts were already in Syria to investigate three previous alleged chemical attacks dating from months ago.
Muslim's PYD, which has well-armed and effective militias, has clashed with Assad's forces as well as rebels, but has allowed both to move through its territories during the war.
Some rebels and rival Kurdish groups accuse it of having been close to the state, a position Muslim disputes. He said Kurdish areas the PYD controlled were under attack from al Qaeda-linked rebels.
Muslim suggested "some other sides who want to blame the Syrian regime, who want to show them as guilty and then see action" lay behind the chemical attack, which has led to speculation that Western countries will order a military response.
He said that if the U.N. inspectors found evidence Assad was not behind the gassing and the rebels were, "everybody would forget it".
"Who is the side who would be punished? Are they are going to punish the Emir of Qatar or the King of Saudi Arabia, or Mr. Erdogan of Turkey?" Qatar, Turkey and Saudi Arabia have all strongly condemned Assad and backed the rebels.
Kurdish militias have sought to consolidate their grip in northern Syria after exploiting the chaos of the civil war over the past year by seizing control of districts as Assad's forces focused elsewhere.
</abbr></cite>


Tyr. Looks like that REUTERS article was written by 'jafar'. Sounding like Obama, wishing he could think of somebody else to BLAME, is a usual, standard trick even REUTERS would believe.

[Gaffer]

REUTERS is immediately suspect in my book. They have to much history of supporting hezbo for my liking. But the kurdish guy does make sense.

Now the DiC is getting ready to act based on intelligence from the area about WMD's, where have we heard this before? Maybe he can get powell to go sell it to the un. Are these the same intelligence folks that advised Bush? Aren't the liberals worried about all the innocent civilians that will be killed by the air strikes? Where's code pink? For that matter where are all the reporters on the ships and at the air bases counting down to the attack and estimating how horrific our casualties will be?

[CSM]

REUTERS is immediately suspect in my book. They have to much history of supporting hezbo for my liking. But the kurdish guy does make sense.

Now the DiC is getting ready to act based on intelligence from the area about WMD's, where have we heard this before? Maybe he can get powell to go sell it to the un. Are these the same intelligence folks that advised Bush? Aren't the liberals worried about all the innocent civilians that will be killed by the air strikes? Where's code pink? For that matter where are all the reporters on the ships and at the air bases counting down to the attack and estimating how horrific our casualties will be?

Additionally, where the heck are the anti-war folks especially those who want to volunteer to be human shields so the US wont strike major targets in Syria? Where are all the talking heads claiming its all about oil? Where are all the liberals whining about clandestine profiteering by members of the administration?

On a side note, I'm sure Kerry was against military intervention in Syria before he was for it!

[Marcus Aurelius]

Additionally, where the heck are the anti-war folks especially those who want to volunteer to be human shields so the US wont strike major targets in Syria? Where are all the talking heads claiming its all about oil? Where are all the liberals whining about clandestine profiteering by members of the administration?

On a side note, I'm sure Kerry was against military intervention in Syria before he was for it!

Obama could declare war on Canada, and his supporters would claim Canada deserved it and he was only doing what's right.

Remember, to paraphrase Ben Franklin...


'War is always acceptable when it's in the first person, such as 'our war'. It's only in the third person, such as 'their war' that it becomes unacceptable.'

[Jeff]

Anyone happen to remember back during the IRAQ war, when Bush, Blair, and even the U.N. declared that Saddam had WMD's?

If you do remember that. Do you remember when someone suggested Bush was lying about WMD's, almost every day...If you hated Bush, or were a Democrat, and just agreed that Bush made Colin Powell look like a fool for saying..."The WMD's could have been sent to SYRIA?"

Why isn't anyone talking about that now, since Bush took all the blame?

And, isn't it surprising how Assad, in Syria now denies using Chemical Weapons...formerly called WMD's by the BUSH haters, and nobody wants to now admit. BUSH WASN'T LYING AT ALL????

Hypocrisy, Lies, Hatred, and just plain STUPIDITY still rules for those who Love Obama, and Democrats so much.

Bush wasn't lying at all because we gave them WMD back when we wanted them to keep Iran under control so we know they had them and yes it looks like we are know seeing where they went to

[jafar00]

Additionally, where the heck are the anti-war folks especially those who want to volunteer to be human shields so the US wont strike major targets in Syria? Where are all the talking heads claiming its all about oil? Where are all the liberals whining about clandestine profiteering by members of the administration?

On a side note, I'm sure Kerry was against military intervention in Syria before he was for it!

I'm guessing they are all in support of doing something about Assad. He is one of the worst mass murderers in history and must be stopped.

[Marcus Aurelius]

I'm guessing they are all in support of doing something about Assad. He is one of the worst mass murderers in history and must be stopped.

Mohammed was a mass murderer too. Luckily, a Jewish woman poisoned him and he died in agony.

[Spike]

plenty of proof we need to bomb the hell outta them. wipe them off the map, all the smart citizens already got the hell out.

[red state]

I'm guessing they are all in support of doing something about Assad. He is one of the worst mass murderers in history and must be stopped.

muSLUM scum kill christians, jews and just about ANYONE who doesn't fall in line EVERY SINGLE DAY. They make ASSAD look like a saint and I'm sure the muSLUMS would love to see him go because he (like in Egypt) is the only one between them and the Christians. I say that we back ASSAD....better yet, I say we fight anyone who gains support from B.O. because he is also our enemy. Yes, that's right! Anyone who would abuse my rights and cater to those who would take advantage of me or my welfare, are and should be noted as OUR enemy.

[CSM]

I'm guessing they are all in support of doing something about Assad. He is one of the worst mass murderers in history and must be stopped.

It's all a matter of perspective, isn't it? Saddam Hussein was ok in their book but Assad is not. Liberalism is such a fickle bitch!

[jimnyc]

Additionally, where the heck are the anti-war folks especially those who want to volunteer to be human shields so the US wont strike major targets in Syria? Where are all the talking heads claiming its all about oil? Where are all the liberals whining about clandestine profiteering by members of the administration?

On a side note, I'm sure Kerry was against military intervention in Syria before he was for it!

Someone should pull out the THOUSANDS of quotes and videos, from politicians to every day knuckleheads - not to mention the anti-war liberals from the internet boards - and see if we can find out why so many are suddenly silent now that it's McChimpy and Lurch calling the shots.

[jimnyc]

It's all a matter of perspective, isn't it? Saddam Hussein was ok in their book but Assad is not. Liberalism is such a fickle bitch!

Exactly. People should try adding up the deaths that Saddam and his henchmen were guilty of. But that's somehow different. :rolleyes:

[revelarts]

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/terrorist-groups-backed-by-the-US-SH.gif


http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/USA-sometimes-we-back-al-Qaeda.gif

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/i-feel-much-safer_2.gif

[jafar00]

muSLUM scum kill christians, jews and just about ANYONE who doesn't fall in line EVERY SINGLE DAY. They make ASSAD look like a saint and I'm sure the muSLUMS would love to see him go because he (like in Egypt) is the only one between them and the Christians. I say that we back ASSAD....better yet, I say we fight anyone who gains support from B.O. because he is also our enemy. Yes, that's right! Anyone who would abuse my rights and cater to those who would take advantage of me or my welfare, are and should be noted as OUR enemy.

You're a Hezbollah supporter :D

[jimnyc]

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/terrorist-groups-backed-by-the-US-SH.gif


http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/USA-sometimes-we-back-al-Qaeda.gif

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/i-feel-much-safer_2.gif

I won't go into every last detail of every group, but for example - the USA supported rebels in the Libya incident. If a legit set of rebels turns into a terrorist organization down the road, you can't hold the USA fully accountable for that. That is more or less what happened with Al Qaeda, and as far as I know, it's not like we've supported them since they have turned into a full blown terror organization, or Al Qaeda at all for that fact, but what they were prior.

With that said, regardless of who is in office calling the shots, I disagree with support in any way towards a known terror group. This would include all groups on your list, and a few that aren't. Some are borderline these days, but we more or less know that they have connections to Al Qaeda or similar, and I think we should say 'fuck you' to them as well and let them fight for themselves. ALL of these groups and areas have made it VERY clear over the years that they don't want or need our support, and I think we should honor that. Let the animals kill one another like in Syria. And when people call Assad a mass murderer, and want or expect help, we point them back to their ungrateful rhetoric from the past and watch them die at the hands of one another.

[Trinity]

Anyone happen to remember back during the IRAQ war, when Bush, Blair, and even the U.N. declared that Saddam had WMD's?

If you do remember that. Do you remember when someone suggested Bush was lying about WMD's, almost every day...If you hated Bush, or were a Democrat, and just agreed that Bush made Colin Powell look like a fool for saying..."The WMD's could have been sent to SYRIA?"

Why isn't anyone talking about that now, since Bush took all the blame?

And, isn't it surprising how Assad, in Syria now denies using Chemical Weapons...formerly called WMD's by the BUSH haters, and nobody wants to now admit. BUSH WASN'T LYING AT ALL????

Hypocrisy, Lies, Hatred, and just plain STUPIDITY still rules for those who Love Obama, and Democrats so much.

I was just thinking that today....hmmm maybe I should go back over to the old board and dig up some old posts. :coffee:

[Trinity]

Came across this in my search for older news articles about Syria and Saddam....no idea if this guy is truly who he says he is haven't got that far yet....lol



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7LGeYr1hiQ

[revelarts]

I won't go into every last detail of every group, but for example - the USA supported rebels in the Libya incident. If a legit set of rebels turns into a terrorist organization down the road, you can't hold the USA fully accountable for that. That is more or less what happened with Al Qaeda, and as far as I know, it's not like we've supported them since they have turned into a full blown terror organization, or Al Qaeda at all for that fact, but what they were prior.

Sure honest mistakes could be made, probably have been. But it seems more often than not it hasn't been a mistake.
In Libya we knew most of the rebel fighters fought our own troop in Iraq and that some were members of Alqaeda. . Some will blame that on Obama but all of NATO was on board with the "rebels".

It's great to give the powers that be the benny of the doubt but when the evidence shows it happening over and over, we'd be silly to think that it's a series of accidents by complete idiots R & D.
http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?33130-US-support-quot-good-quot-terrorist
http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?35605-Muslim-Brotherhood-wins-Presidency&p=560102#post560102


Alqaeda always had anti American rhetoric even while getting U.S. training. Very Similar to Skin heads/neo nazis terrorist who join the U.S. military waiting for a chance to strike at the federal gov't. that trains them.




With that said, regardless of who is in office calling the shots, I disagree with support in any way towards a known terror group. This would include all groups on your list, and a few that aren't. Some are borderline these days, but we more or less know that they have connections to Al Qaeda or similar, and I think we should say 'fuck you' to them as well and let them fight for themselves. ALL of these groups and areas have made it VERY clear over the years that they don't want or need our support, and I think we should honor that. Let the animals kill one another like in Syria. And when people call Assad a mass murderer, and want or expect help, we point them back to their ungrateful rhetoric from the past and watch them die at the hands of one another.

except the animal bit, I'd agree with that Jim.

[jimnyc]

Sure honest mistakes could be made, probably have been. But it seems more often than not it hasn't been a mistake.
In Libya we knew most of the rebel fighters fought our own troop in Iraq and that some were members of Alqaeda. . Some will blame that on Obama but all of NATO was on board with the "rebels".

It's great to give the powers that be the benny of the doubt but when the evidence shows it happening over and over, we'd be silly to think that it's a series of accidents by complete idiots R & D.
http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?33130-US-support-quot-good-quot-terrorist
http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?35605-Muslim-Brotherhood-wins-Presidency&p=560102#post560102

Alqaeda always had anti American rhetoric even while getting U.S. training. Very Similar to Skin heads/neo nazis terrorist who join the U.S. military waiting for a chance to strike at the federal gov't. that trains them.

except the animal bit, I'd agree with that Jim.

I used to think in some of these instances, that helping someone fighting your enemy was always a good thing. But I've certainly revisited that belief in the past 20 years and the massive amount of terror attacks that have since followed. It would seem that anyone will do whatever they can for assistance from the USA during their "uprisings", then they condemn us down the line, too many turn to terror as their main MO and they all end up talking smack about their rights and sovereignty. I say let them all take care of their own business. Don't condemn the USA when so many innocents die. As truly sad as it may be, these people will need to manage their own way, and far too many are going to die due to their own people and their way of life.

But I know there's still shit falling into the enemies hands, or our future enemies. Hell, just forking over millions and military assistance to the MB shows it on a grand scale. What will it take before the ties are cut? And Pakistan? I know we have interests here and there, and we need to give a little to get a little, but certain things should just never even be on the table.

The only good news, so far, is that we'll be lobbing the missiles from destroyers, so hopefully no American lives will be at imminent risk. Obama will likely pull another 'war powers resolution' to bypass congress and just wipe his hands of it before the 60-90 days are up.

I know you think I'm referring to EVERYONE in Syria when I refer to animals. I've been referring to so many of them as animals for a bit now. This applies to those we see on the news, those involved in the never ending abuse, abuse of women, violent ways, terrorism, attempted genocide. The people I see in Syria, killing fellow citizens over political shit, over religious crap, are acting like animals. Neither side may have fully gotten what they wanted had this remained peaceful, but it goes without saying that killing untold thousands of the citizens there isn't getting anyone what they want - unless they are looking for death and blood. Which sadly some of them DO want.

[Gaffer]

Came across this in my search for older news articles about Syria and Saddam....no idea if this guy is truly who he says he is haven't got that far yet....lol



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7LGeYr1hiQ

This guy was a great source of info back then and the left said he was just promoting his book. But his claims were backed up by the CIA and the captured documents. The weapons went to syria just as he said. Its something I was saying from the beginning.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Someone should pull out the THOUSANDS of quotes and videos, from politicians to every day knuckleheads - not to mention the anti-war liberals from the internet boards - and see if we can find out why so many are suddenly silent now that it's McChimpy and Lurch calling the shots.
They are silent because they are the hypocritical , lying bastards we've always said they were. They are silent because Obama must be protected at any and all costs. They are silent because such damn scum never stand up for what is right..--Tyr

[revelarts]

...
I know you think I'm referring to EVERYONE in Syria when I refer to animals. I've been referring to so many of them as animals for a bit now. This applies to those we see on the news, those involved in the never ending abuse, abuse of women, violent ways, terrorism, attempted genocide. The people I see in Syria, killing fellow citizens over political shit, over religious crap, are acting like animals. Neither side may have fully gotten what they wanted had this remained peaceful, but it goes without saying that killing untold thousands of the citizens there isn't getting anyone what they want - unless they are looking for death and blood. Which sadly some of them DO want.
Don't take it personal.
I didn't/don't think your referring to everyone or to all muslims. But on the board Muslim terrorist, Black thugs, people who voted for Obama and who knows who else are called animals here. Seems sometimes the only people NEVER considered animals are American white conservatives.
ANd really At least 1 here has made it a point of their argument that Muslim "terrorist" are literally sub human animals. frankly that really shook me. They've made me rethink using the term for anyone.
I don't want to minimize any of the horrific crimes , I'd call them Satanic, or demonic or evil, but God made us all Humans, and I'm not comfortable calling people animals. Dehumanization of a criminal or war enemy doesn't make us more humane it tends to make us less so.

[logroller]

They are silent because they are the hypocritical , lying bastards we've always said they were. They are silent because Obama must be protected at any and all costs. They are silent because such damn scum never stand up for what is right..--Tyr
You're certainly not silent now, by were you as vehemently against the Iraq invasion under the auspices of WMD?
So far as proof goes, there's no proof saddam used chemical warfare since '88. Yet we invaded 15 years later since he didn't fully comply with the 92 cease fire. Some doubted this, while others say that theres documented proof that Syrian took possession of such weapons-- thus proving that saddam violated those resolutions....yet here you claim there's no proof of Syrian violations. Seems to me that, if the illegitimate transfer of chemical weapons took place, then Assad is complicit in the crime, no?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Don't take it personal.
I didn't/don't think your referring to everyone or to all muslims. But on the board Muslim terrorist, Black thugs, people who voted for Obama and who knows who else are called animals here. Seems sometimes the only people NEVER considered animals are American white conservatives.
ANd really At least 1 here has made it a point of their argument that Muslim "terrorist" are literally sub human animals. frankly that really shook me. They've made me rethink using the term for anyone.
I don't want to minimize any of the horrific crimes , I'd call them Satanic, or demonic or evil, but God made us all Humans, and I'm not comfortable calling people animals. Dehumanization of a criminal or war enemy doesn't make us more humane it tends to make us less so.
I disagree Rev. Man has the capacity to renounce and completely abandon his humanity and act just like an animal. Some do that and never return from it. The Nazi's come to mind and so does the Jap soldiers that went into villages in China murdering and raping. Those soldiers used to tear the Chinese infant from its mothers arms and toss that child into the air to catch it on their bayonets. They did this as a sport and millions of Chinese civilians were murdered. Some go down that dark road and never return. Such people are truly sub human. You reject this but its true. Your rejection does not change that truth, that reality. Drummond was correct in his judgment. That you and others fail to see it does not change the fact that it is a truth about man.. --Tyr

[Gaffer]

You're certainly not silent now, by were you as vehemently against the Iraq invasion under the auspices of WMD?
So far as proof goes, there's no proof saddam used chemical warfare since '88. Yet we invaded 15 years later since he didn't fully comply with the 92 cease fire. Some doubted this, while others say that theres documented proof that Syrian took possession of such weapons-- thus proving that saddam violated those resolutions....yet here you claim there's no proof of Syrian violations. Seems to me that, if the illegitimate transfer of chemical weapons took place, then Assad is complicit in the crime, no?

Makes no difference if syria is guilty. This is a war between al qaeda and hezbollah. We don't need to be involved here. And yes assad was complicit in the crime.

[revelarts]

were we go,
Tyr We've done this.

They are human beings.
metaphorically someone can go there but in reality they remain human. Humans.
They are inhumane. Not literal animals. They are "MAN" as you've said.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You're certainly not silent now, by were you as vehemently against the Iraq invasion under the auspices of WMD?
So far as proof goes, there's no proof saddam used chemical warfare since '88. Yet we invaded 15 years later since he didn't fully comply with the 92 cease fire. Some doubted this, while others say that theres documented proof that Syrian took possession of such weapons-- thus proving that saddam violated those resolutions....yet here you claim there's no proof of Syrian violations. Seems to me that, if the illegitimate transfer of chemical weapons took place, then Assad is complicit in the crime, no? I was one that stated the WMDS went to Syria. I do not dispute that Syria has chemical weapons. Assad's FORCES RECENTLY STARTED REGAINING TERRITORY, so why murder civilians now? When it would bring down missiles from American military, best to look to who profits from that. And I have lots of guns so when somebody gets shot in the dead of night here does that mean Im the guilty party!??? THIS IS AS CLEAR A CASE OF A FALSE FLAG ATTACK AS ANYBODY WILL EVER SEE. I CLAIMED THAT THERE HAS BEEN NO PROOF THAT THE GUILTY PARTY WAS ASSAD OR HIS FORCES AND THAT'S TRUE. Logic asks why do it when there is no gain but likely such great harm to come raining down on him? He went over 30 months and didn't and now suddenly when its convenient for Obama he does. I dont buy it!!! Why wasn't the proof splashed all across the world if we had it? And why the sudden rush coming from our GD traitor in chief? I've always been able to spot a scam a mile away. --Tyr

[aboutime]

Thank goodness Nobody on this forum has any power to determine, lead, or take part in the decisions surrounding the Syrian problems.

If so many are convinced, and need unquestionable truth in order to believe what has been reported. Might be time to check-in with Youtube, and all of the 9/11 Conspiracy Junkies too!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

were we go,
Tyr We've done this.

They are human beings.
metaphorically someone can go there but in reality they remain human. Humans.
They are inhumane. Not literal animals. They are "MAN" as you've said. My friend, the word sub-human still retains the word human. It was not sub-animals. Sure they still retain all the genetics that are unique to we humans but they lose their souls and I mean permanently lose them. That is why I agree the term sub-human fits. Now can God perform a miracle and bring them back , I say yes possible. I aint God, so I say just kill the murdering bastards and be done with it.. My Indian side says , just slice 'em and dice 'em a bit first to give 'em a taste of their own medicine.. ;)--Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Makes no difference if syria is guilty. This is a war between al qaeda and hezbollah. We don't need to be involved here. And yes assad was complicit in the crime. -----------------------------------------------------------TRUE, BUT THAT CRIME HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS CIVIL WAR IN SYRIA. This war is muslims TERRORISTS on both sides wasting each other and that's why our GD President WANTS TO HELP END IT!! He wants more of our enemies to stay alive and Syria to fall into their hands. Log bringing in Iraq and where the wmds went from there is irrelevant. As if the rebels couldn't have some chem weapons!! As if it's beyond the Obama admin to give them some to use!!! PLEASE....... --Tyr

[jafar00]

I don't know about you guys, but I will wait for the UN inspectors to say something before screaming about it from the rooftops.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I don't know about you guys, but I will wait for the UN inspectors to say something before screaming about it from the rooftops.

As if the UN inspectors are to be trusted. There is not a single thing about the damn corrupt UN that I trust. The damn UN started sating Assad was guilty before they ever inspected any damn thing. --Tyr

[logroller]

-----------------------------------------------------------TRUE, BUT THAT CRIME HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS CIVIL WAR IN SYRIA. This war is muslims TERRORISTS on both sides wasting each other and that's why our GD President WANTS TO HELP END IT!! He wants more of our enemies to stay alive and Syria to fall into their hands. Log bringing in Iraq and where the wmds went from there is irrelevant. As if the rebels couldn't have some chem weapons!! As if it's beyond the Obama admin to give them some to use!!! PLEASE....... --Tyr
You have any proof of the bold?
I thought not. Yet again you repeat a series of inferred rationales based upon what, your personal opinion? By the way, I didn't bring up iraq and WMD, about time and gaffer did. I merel highlighted that as a glaring example of inconsistency in regards to previous engagements for much the same reasoning--WMD. I mean, you pretty much say, who knows, could be anyone-- they're terrorists anyways. You might as well just say you don't care if they use chem weapons and leave it at that-- that's the truth, the rest is just rhetoric.

seems to me that the fact is you dismissed a valid argument and question from me because it risks exposing your inconsistencies on the righteousness of military engagements surrounding WMD-- namely, iraq --preferring instead to be all indignant over the burden of proof for violations of international law....when you really don't give a rats ass if these two factions bomb each other to kingdom come and just prefer we stay out of it. If I understand gaffer, he's saying that sometimes the enemy of our enemy is still an enemy-- seems reasonable enough a reason as any for not intervening in others disputes.

That's fine, but don't decry another's ignorance for disagreeing and at least acknowledge the possibility that Assad did, in fact, use chem weapons on civilians; just I'm willing to accept they didn't; but its entirely possible that they did--which is foolish for them perhaps, but desperate times....is far more likely than Obama smuggling chem agents to the rebels. Not to say the latter is impossible, we did have fast and furious, (which was underthe umbrella program that began in the previous admin; so I could thus infer that the bush admin allowed the WMD to flow to syria), but its far more likely that those WMD from saddam came with Instructions on dodging UN detection, just saying.

[jimnyc]

I'm curious if this counts as "proof". They should immediately release this information to the UN and all other parties as said proof. Even then, will it be enough? Could it be fake? Will anyone in Syria take credit? Can they narrow it down to WHO said it?

Exclusive: Intercepted Calls Prove Syrian Army Used Nerve Gas, U.S. Spies Say (http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/08/27/exclusive_us_spies_say_intercepted_calls_prove_syr ias_army_used_nerve_gas)Last Wednesday, in the hours after a horrific chemical attack east of Damascus, an official at the Syrian Ministry of Defense exchanged panicked phone calls with a leader of a chemical weapons unit, demanding answers for a nerve agent strike that killed more than 1,000 people. Those conversations were overheard by U.S. intelligence services, The Cable has learned. And that is the major reason why American officials now say they're certain that the attacks were the work of the Bashar al-Assad regime -- and why the U.S. military is likely to attack that regime in a matter of days.

But the intercept raises questions about culpability for the chemical massacre, even as it answers others: Was the attack on Aug. 21 the work of a Syrian officer overstepping his bounds? Or was the strike explicitly directed by senior members of the Assad regime? "It's unclear where control lies," one U.S. intelligence official told The Cable. "Is there just some sort of general blessing to use these things? Or are there explicit orders for each attack?"

Nor are U.S. analysts sure of the Syrian military's rationale for launching the strike -- if it had a rationale at all. Perhaps it was a lone general putting a long-standing battle plan in motion; perhaps it was a miscalculation by the Assad government. Whatever the reason, the attack has triggered worldwide outrage, and put the Obama administration on the brink of launching a strike of its own in Syria. "We don't know exactly why it happened," the intelligence official added. "We just know it was pretty fucking stupid."

American intelligence analysts are certain that chemical weapons were used on Aug. 21 -- the captured phone calls, combined with local doctors' accounts and video documentation of the tragedy -- are considered proof positive. That is why the U.S. government, from the president on down, has been unequivocal in its declarations that the Syrian military gassed thousands of civilians in the East Ghouta region.

However, U.S. spy services still have not acquired the evidence traditionally considered to be the gold standard in chemical weapons cases: soil, blood, and other environmental samples that test positive for reactions with nerve agent. That's the kind of proof that America and its allies processed from earlier, small-scale attacks that the White House described in equivocal tones, and declined to muster a military response to in retaliation.

Rest here - http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/08/27/exclusive_us_spies_say_intercepted_calls_prove_syr ias_army_used_nerve_gas

[glockmail]

The big thing is to watch iran. Half of assad's forces are iranians. They will use hezbo to strike Israel when the US hits assad. And unless it has moved there's still an iranian frigate or destroyer in a syrian port.

The US will strike syria in the next 48 hours.

I think The Obama will just draw another red line.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You have any proof of the bold?
I thought not. Yet again you repeat a series of inferred rationales based upon what, your personal opinion? By the way, I didn't bring up iraq and WMD, about time and gaffer did. I merel highlighted that as a glaring example of inconsistency in regards to previous engagements for much the same reasoning--WMD. I mean, you pretty much say, who knows, could be anyone-- they're terrorists anyways. You might as well just say you don't care if they use chem weapons and leave it at that-- that's the truth, the rest is just rhetoric.

seems to me that the fact is you dismissed a valid argument and question from me because it risks exposing your inconsistencies on the righteousness of military engagements surrounding WMD-- namely, iraq --preferring instead to be all indignant over the burden of proof for violations of international law....when you really don't give a rats ass if these two factions bomb each other to kingdom come and just prefer we stay out of it. If I understand gaffer, he's saying that sometimes the enemy of our enemy is still an enemy-- seems reasonable enough a reason as any for not intervening in others disputes.

That's fine, but don't decry another's ignorance for disagreeing and at least acknowledge the possibility that Assad did, in fact, use chem weapons on civilians; just I'm willing to accept they didn't; but its entirely possible that they did--which is foolish for them perhaps, but desperate times....is far more likely than Obama smuggling chem agents to the rebels. Not to say the latter is impossible, we did have fast and furious, (which was underthe umbrella program that began in the previous admin; so I could thus infer that the bush admin allowed the WMD to flow to syria), but its far more likely that those WMD from saddam came with Instructions on dodging UN detection, just saying. I have proof that Obama armed Mexican drug cartel gangs illegally and so does the authorities that refuse to act on it . Its called Fast and Furious and Obama calls it another phony scandal. Not too much of a leap to think he'd order weapons(chem) to be given to his buddies over there to do a false flag attack. And did you think I said I had proof on that or what? I did imply that it was a legitimate possibility and it damn sure is. A man's past record surely indicates how likely he is to do a thing. Obama's past record shows that he is a corrupt , lying son of a bitch. So yes, its very possible , in fact very likely if the rebels had not captured those weapons in Syria. By the way, I never stated anywhere that it was an impossibility that Assad did it . I did state how unlikely and who stood to really gain from it.. Look at it this way, who is most likely to murder uncle John? The cousin he has never even acknowledge exists or the grandson he has put in his will to inherit his 200 million dollar estate? Logic presents who is far more likely to be the true guilty party. Over 30 months fighting the man never uses them and suddenly he does so right when Obama needs him to. -bullshit. Then he uses them on civilians instead of a large rebel fighting force! - more bullshit. To me the civilians were the target so as to garner far, far more public/world outrage/condemnation and a call for swift action that again points to who most likely did it!--Tyr

[Truth Detector]

Nothing will happen here. The media is already working overtime walking Obamas tough rhetoric back. China and Russia will block any attempts to use force by the UN and Obama will not do anything without the UN and with negative public opinion about going to war higher than any other US engagement.

Like the IRS scandal and Benghazi; nothing to see here folks. Move along. :gives:

[jimnyc]

Nothing will happen here. The media is already working overtime walking Obamas tough rhetoric back. China and Russia will block any attempts to use force by the UN and Obama will not do anything without the UN and with negative public opinion about going to war higher than any other US engagement.

Like the IRS scandal and Benghazi; nothing to see here folks. Move along. :gives:

Welcome to DP. :salute:

Maybe head on over to this thread and introduce yourself - http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?676-Introductions

Oh, and I agree, like all the other bullshit coming from this administration, ultimately this will be investigated by Holder and given 2 thumbs up. My guess, is that IF they send missiles, he'll bypass everyone entirely and cite the war powers resolution, like he did with Libya.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Nothing will happen here. The media is already working overtime walking Obamas tough rhetoric back. China and Russia will block any attempts to use force by the UN and Obama will not do anything without the UN and with negative public opinion about going to war higher than any other US engagement.

Like the IRS scandal and Benghazi; nothing to see here folks. Move along. :gives: A lot of reasons to think that is how it will go down. However if Obama's masters tell him to ignore all and fire those missiles then those missiles will get sent come hell or high water! By the way welcome to the board. Are you American?

[Truth Detector]

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/terrorist-groups-backed-by-the-US-SH.gif


http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/USA-sometimes-we-back-al-Qaeda.gif

http://www.libertystickers.com/static/images/i-feel-much-safer_2.gif


Got facts? Never mind, people who make cartoonish posts from leftist or Libertarian blogs seldom deal in them. :lame2:

[Truth Detector]

A lot of reasons to think that is how it will go down. However if Obama's masters tell him to ignore all and fire those missiles then those missiles will get sent come hell or high water! By the way welcome to the board. Are you American?

I am American; live in Ventura CA surrounded by loony liberals but the weather is great and I'm close to wine country which allows me to put up with all the Liberal buffoonery here. :laugh:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Consider this.... http://news.yahoo.com/syria-says-terrorists-strike-europe-chemical-weapons-125634470.html Syria says 'terrorists' will strike Europe with chemical weapon




Edit content preferences (http://profile.yahoo.com/y/settings/interests/) <button class="done-btn" data-rapid_p="6">Done</button>


http://l.yimg.com/a/p/us/news/editorial/d/0c/d0c3eb8ca18907492a4b337b5cec5193.jpeg (http://www.reuters.com/) <cite class="byline vcard top-line"><abbr>1 hour ago</abbr> </cite>
DAMASCUS (Reuters) - Syria's deputy foreign minister said on Wednesday that the United States, Britain and France helped "terrorists" use chemical weapons in Syria, and that the same groups would soon use them against Europe.
Speaking to reporters outside the Four Seasons hotel in Damascus, Faisal Maqdad said he had presented U.N. chemical weapons inspectors with evidence that "armed terrorist groups" had used sarin gas in all the sites of alleged attacks.
"We repeat that the terrorist groups are the ones that used (chemical weapons) with the help of the United States, the United Kingdom and France, and this has to stop," he said. "This means these chemical weapons will soon be used by the same groups against the people of Europe," he added.
(Reporting by Marwan Makdesi; Writing by Oliver Holmes; Editing by Jon Boyle)

[logroller]

I'm curious if this counts as "proof". They should immediately release this information to the UN and all other parties as said proof. Even then, will it be enough? Could it be fake? Will anyone in Syria take credit? Can they narrow it down to WHO said it?

Exclusive: Intercepted Calls Prove Syrian Army Used Nerve Gas, U.S. Spies Say (http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/08/27/exclusive_us_spies_say_intercepted_calls_prove_syr ias_army_used_nerve_gas)

Last Wednesday, in the hours after a horrific chemical attack east of Damascus, an official at the Syrian Ministry of Defense exchanged panicked phone calls with a leader of a chemical weapons unit, demanding answers for a nerve agent strike that killed more than 1,000 people. Those conversations were overheard by U.S. intelligence services, The Cable has learned. And that is the major reason why American officials now say they're certain that the attacks were the work of the Bashar al-Assad regime -- and why the U.S. military is likely to attack that regime in a matter of days.

But the intercept raises questions about culpability for the chemical massacre, even as it answers others: Was the attack on Aug. 21 the work of a Syrian officer overstepping his bounds? Or was the strike explicitly directed by senior members of the Assad regime? "It's unclear where control lies," one U.S. intelligence official told The Cable. "Is there just some sort of general blessing to use these things? Or are there explicit orders for each attack?"

Nor are U.S. analysts sure of the Syrian military's rationale for launching the strike -- if it had a rationale at all. Perhaps it was a lone general putting a long-standing battle plan in motion; perhaps it was a miscalculation by the Assad government. Whatever the reason, the attack has triggered worldwide outrage, and put the Obama administration on the brink of launching a strike of its own in Syria. "We don't know exactly why it happened," the intelligence official added. "We just know it was pretty fucking stupid."

American intelligence analysts are certain that chemical weapons were used on Aug. 21 -- the captured phone calls, combined with local doctors' accounts and video documentation of the tragedy -- are considered proof positive. That is why the U.S. government, from the president on down, has been unequivocal in its declarations that the Syrian military gassed thousands of civilians in the East Ghouta region.

However, U.S. spy services still have not acquired the evidence traditionally considered to be the gold standard in chemical weapons cases: soil, blood, and other environmental samples that test positive for reactions with nerve agent. That's the kind of proof that America and its allies processed from earlier, small-scale attacks that the White House described in equivocal tones, and declined to muster a military response to in retaliation.

Rest here - http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/08/27/exclusive_us_spies_say_intercepted_calls_prove_syr ias_army_used_nerve_gas
Come on Jim, the NSA just collects metadata.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Come on Jim, the NSA just collects metadata.

5425

[revelarts]

http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a544/jackass345/posting%20pics/noidea_zps1121989c.jpg


<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Dj4axZvzl_s?feature=player_detailpage" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="360" width="640"></iframe>


Who is more deaf to global public opinion - Obama or Assad? Answer: Obama. Sources of photos: AP (http://www.dhakatribune.com/world/2013/aug/23/syrian-chemical-weapons-claim-%E2%80%98-grave-concern%E2%80%99-obama) and Reuters (http://www.aei-ideas.org/2013/01/is-assad-calling-obamas-bluff/).
First, the U.N. official. Her name isCarla del Ponte, the "former Chief Prosecutor of two United Nations international criminal law tribunals" (Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carla_Del_Ponte)). She's an attorney general from Switzerland, so you know she's neutral.

Read the excerpt below from the article, "Syrian rebels used Sarin nerve gas, not Assad’s regime: U.N. official" (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/) by Shaun Waterman, published in The Washington Times on Monday, May 6, 2013:
Testimony from victims strongly suggests it was the rebels, not the Syrian government, that used Sarin nerve gas during a recent incident in the revolution-wracked nation, a senior U.N. diplomat said Monday.

Carla del Ponte, a member of the U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria, told Swiss TV there were “strong, concrete suspicions but not yet incontrovertible proof,” that rebels seeking to oust Syrian strongman Bashar al-Assad had used the nerve agent.

But she said her panel had not yet seen any evidence of Syrian government forces using chemical weapons, according to the BBC, but she added that more investigation was needed.

Damascus has recently facing growing Western accusations that its forces used such weapons, which President Obama has described as crossing a red line. But Ms. del Ponte’s remarks may serve to shift the focus of international concern.
The same false allegations against Assad that were flying around back in May were bound to resurface late in the summer. So the date of the article in no way diminishes its value as far as enlightening the world about who actually is willing and has the means to carry out a chemical weapons attack against Syrian civilians.

The Saudi-Turkish-Qatari-French-British-USraeli backed Al-Qaeda terrorists have everything to gain by framing Assad because they are currently losing the war and would see their fortunes reversed at least somewhat if the U.S. attacks Syria.

Saleh Muslim, Syria's main Kurdish leader, says that Assad would be stupid to use chemical weapons against his own people in front of the eyes of the world.

The Al-Qaeda terrorists are the most likely culprits, if in fact there is proof that chemical weapons have been used in Syria.

Read the excerpt below from the article, "Syrian Kurdish leader says Assad not to blame for attack" (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/26/us-syria-crisis-kurds-idUSBRE97P0Q520130826)by Alexandra Hudson, published by Reuters on Monday, August 26, 2013:
Syrian President Bashar al-Assad would not be "so stupid" as to use chemical weapons close to Damascus, the leader of the country's largest Kurdish group said.

Saleh Muslim, head of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party (PYD), said he doubted the Syrian president would resort to using such weapons when he felt he had the upper hand in the country's civil war.

He suggested last Wednesday's attack, which the opposition says was carried out by government forces and killed hundreds of people, was aimed at framing Assad and provoking an international reaction. Assad has denied his forces used chemical weapons.

"The regime in Syria ... has chemical weapons, but they wouldn't use them around Damascus, 5 km from the (U.N.) committee which is investigating chemical weapons. Of course they are not so stupid as to do so," Muslim told Reuters.

At the time of the incident, U.N. experts were already in Syria to investigate three previous alleged chemical attacks dating from months ago.

http://www.blacklistednews.com/U.N._Official_And_Syrian_Kurdish_Leader%3A_Assad_D id_Not_Use_Chemical_Weapons/28432/0/38/38/Y/M.html

................................


http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/18559-how-intelligence-was-twisted-to-support-an-attack-on-syria


Secretary of State John Kerry assured the public that the Obama administration's summary of the intelligence on which it is basing the case for military action to punish the Assad regime for an alleged use of chemical weapons was put together with an acute awareness of the fiasco of the 2002 Iraq WMD intelligence estimate.
Nevertheless, the unclassified summary (http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2013/08/30/government-assessment-syrian-government-s-use-chemical-weapons-august-21) of the intelligence assessment made public August 30, 2013, utilizes misleading language evocative of the infamous Iraq estimate's deceptive phrasing. The summary cites signals, geospatial and human source intelligence that purportedly show that the Syrian government prepared, carried out and "confirmed" a chemical weapons attack on August 21. And it claims visual evidence "consistent with" a nerve gas attack.
But a careful examination of those claims reveals a series of convolutedly worded characterizations of the intelligence that don't really mean what they appear to say at first glance.
The document displays multiple indications that the integrity of the assessment process was seriously compromised by using language that distorted the intelligence in ways that would justify an attack on Syria.
Spinning the Secret Intelligence
.....

listen to EXetremly informative interview here
http://scotthorton.org/2013/09/04/9413-gareth-porter/

[revelarts]

Assad did not order Syria chemical weapons attack, says German press Bild am Sonntag cites high-level German surveillance source suggesting Syrian president was not personally behind attacks




Simon Tisdall (http://www.theguardian.com/profile/simontisdall) and Josie Le Blond in Berlin

The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian), <time itemprop="datePublished" datetime="2013-09-08" pubdate="">Sunday 8 September 2013</time>

President Bashar al-Assad (http://www.theguardian.com/world/bashar-al-assad) did not personally order last month's chemical weapons attack near Damascus that has triggered calls for US military intervention, and blocked numerous requests from his military commanders to use chemical weapons against regime opponents in recent months, a German newspaper has reported , citing unidentified, high-level national security sources.
The intelligence findings were based on phone calls intercepted by a German surveillance ship operated by the BND, the German intelligence service, and deployed off the Syrian coast, Bild am Sonntag said. The intercepted communications suggested Assad, who is accused of war crimes by the west, including foreign secretary William Hague (http://www.theguardian.com/politics/williamhague), was not himself involved (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/08/us-syria-crisis-germany-idUSBRE98707B20130908) in last month's attack or in other instances when government forces have allegedly used chemical weapons.
Assad sought to exonerate himself from the August attack in which hundreds died. "There has been no evidence that I used chemical weapons against my own people," he said in an interview with CBS.
But the intercepts tended to add weight to the claims of the Obama administration and Britain and France that elements of the Assad regime, and not renegade rebel groups, were responsible for the attack in the suburb of Ghouta, Bild said....




with all of the reports and counter reports, it seems NO ONE should jump to conclutions about the the reported chemical attacks.

only an idiot would go to war or support one side over another with the sketchy info that's available over this.

[revelarts]

MEMORANDUM FOR: The President
FROM: Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS)


SUBJECT: Is Syria a Trap?

Precedence: IMMEDIATE
We regret to inform you that some of our former co-workers are telling us, categorically, that contrary to the claims of your administration, the most reliable intelligence shows that Bashar al-Assad was NOT responsible for the chemical incident that killed and injured Syrian civilians on August 21, and that British intelligence officials also know this. In writing this brief report, we choose to assume that you have not been fully informed because your advisers decided to afford you the opportunity for what is commonly known as “plausible denial.”...

Our sources confirm that a chemical incident of some sort did cause fatalities and injuries on August 21 in a suburb of Damascus. They insist, however, that the incident was not the result of an attack by the Syrian Army using military-grade chemical weapons from its arsenal. That is the most salient fact, according to CIA officers working on the Syria issue. ... And that goes, as well, for his titular boss, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, who has admitted he gave “clearly erroneous” sworn testimony to Congress denying NSA eavesdropping on Americans....


Our sources confirm that a chemical incident of some sort did cause fatalities and injuries on August 21 in a suburb of Damascus. They insist, however, that the incident was not the result of an attack by the Syrian Army using military-grade chemical weapons from its arsenal. That is the most salient fact, according to CIA officers working on the Syria issue. They tell us that CIA Director John Brennan is perpetrating a pre-Iraq-War-type fraud on members of Congress, the media, the public – and perhaps even you.

We have observed John Brennan closely over recent years and, sadly, we find what our former colleagues are now telling us easy to believe. Sadder still, this goes in spades for those of us who have worked with him personally; we give him zero credence. And that goes, as well, for his titular boss, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, who has admitted he gave “clearly erroneous” sworn testimony to Congress denying NSA eavesdropping on Americans....

http://consortiumnews.com/2013/09/06/obama-warned-on-syrian-intel/






Former CIA, State Dept Intel Analyst, Dept Director on anti-terrorism ... (R) , says his CIA contacts tell him...


Obama and Kerry Are Lying About Syria (http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/76328/obama-and-kerry-are-lying-about-syria/)
By Larry Johnson on September 5, 2013 at 1:03 PM in Current Affairs (http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/category/current-affairs/)
Barack Obama and John Kerry are lying about what has happened in Syria.


...My friends in the CIA are still around and they are now warning me that both the United States and the United Kingdom know that Bashir Assad is not responsible for the incident on 21 August that killed and maimed Syrian civilians. While it is true that a chemical of some sort caused the fatalities and injuries, it was not the result of an attack by the Syrian Army using military quality chemical weapons from the Syrian arsenal. The CIA knows that this is the case yet, with John Brennan at the head of the Agency, is deliberately lying and misleading members of Congress, the media and the public.

As I noted in an earlier piece, this was a pre-planned effort by the rebels to create an incident that would bring the United States into the war.
It was prepared in collaboration with the Saudis and the Turks. The canisters containing the chemical agent were opened and people in the immediate vicinity were affected. Some died and some suffered physical injuries.

Important to note that no single Syrian military rocket capable of carrying a chemical agent has been recovered from the area. Not a single shred of physical evidence exists to support the claim that this was a result of a strike by a Syrian military unit with expertise in Chemical weapons. And, there still is no medical evidence backing up the specious claim by Kerry and Obama that this was sarin.

I personally call on President Putin and other leaders at the G-20 to hold Obama to account and to demand proof. Obama cannot supply it. He is lying. He is being aided in this deceit by David Cameron, the British Prime Minister. If the United States proceeds to carry out a military strike on Syria it will be committing the same kind of crime committed by Adolf Hitler in launching an unprovoked and unwarranted attack on Poland in 1939. The stakes are this high and the United States must be stopped from committing war crimes against the government and people of Syria.



http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/76328/obama-and-kerry-are-lying-about-syria/

interview with reporter on above and more...
http://scotthorton.org/2013/09/08/9813-gareth-porter/

[revelarts]

Congress Members Who Have Seen Classified Evidence About Syria Say It Fails to Prove Anything

Posted on September 7, 2013 (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/09/classified-intelligence-doesnt-prove-anything.html) by WashingtonsBlog (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/author/washingtonsblog)
Classified Syria Intelligence Fails to Prove Assad Used Chemical Weapons

The administration’s public case for chemical weapons use by the Syrian government is extremely (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/09/exclusive-top-chemical-weapons-expert-says-syrian-deaths-could-have-been-caused-by-industrial-accident.html) weak (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/09/point-by-point-rebuttal-of-u-s-case-for-war-in-syria.html), and former high-level intelligence officers say that publicly-available information proves that the Syrian government likely did not (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/09/high-level-u-s-intelligence-officers-syrian-government-didnt-launch-chemical-weapons.html) carry out the chemical weapons attacks.
The Obama administration claims that classified intelligence proves that it was the Assad government which carried out the attacks.
But numerous congressional members who have seen the classified intelligence information say that it is no better than the public war brief … and doesn’t prove anything.
Congressman Justin Amash said (https://twitter.com/repjustinamash/status/374319778053509120) last week:
What I heard in Obama admn briefing actually makes me more skeptical of certain significant aspects of Pres’s case for attacking

He noted (https://twitter.com/repjustinamash/status/376081868678246400) yesterday, after attending another classified briefing and reviewing more classified materials:
Attended another classified briefing on #Syria & reviewed add’l materials. Now more skeptical than ever. Can’t believe Pres is pushing war.

And today, Amash wrote (https://twitter.com/repjustinamash/status/376405762903646208):
If Americans could read classified docs, they’d be even more against #Syria action. Obama admn’s public statements are misleading at best.

Congressman Tom Harkin said (http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/harkin-classified-syria-briefing-frankly-raised-more-questions-it-answered_751549.html):
I have just attended a classified Congressional briefing on Syria that quite frankly raised more questions than it answered. I found the evidence presented by Administration officials to be circumstantial.

Congressman Michael Burgess said (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/319879-texas-republican-evidence-that-assad-used-chemical-weapons-is-thin#ixzz2dpV1EY9c):
Yes, I saw the classified documents. They were pretty thin.

Yahoo News reports (http://news.yahoo.com/chemical-weapons-argument-isn%E2%80%99t-enough-to-sway-some-lawmakers-on-syria-resolution-213426745.html):
New Hampshire Democratic Rep. Carol Shea-Porter, for instance, left Thursday’s classified hearing and said she was opposed to the effort “now so more than ever.”
“I think there’s a long way to go for the president to make the case,” she said after the briefing. “It does seem there is a high degree of concern and leaning no.”

Senator Joe Manchin announced he was voting “no” for a Syria strike right after (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/09/05/1236606/-Syria-and-2014) hearing a classified intelligence brieifng.
Congressman Alan Grayson points out (http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/07/opinion/on-syria-vote-trust-but-verify.html?hp&_r=0) in the New York Times:
The documentary record regarding an attack on Syria consists of just two papers: a four-page unclassified summary and a 12-page classified summary. The first enumerates only the evidence in favor of an attack. I’m not allowed to tell you what’s in the classified summary, but you can draw your own conclusion. [I.e. it was no more impressive than the 4-page public version.]
On Thursday I asked the House Intelligence Committee staff whether there was any other documentation available, classified or unclassified. Their answer was “no.”
The Syria chemical weapons summaries are based on several hundred underlying elements of intelligence information. The unclassified summary cites intercepted telephone calls, “social media” postings and the like, but not one of these is actually quoted or attached — not even clips from YouTube. (As to whether the classified summary is the same, I couldn’t possibly comment, but again, draw your own conclusion.)
***
And yet we members are supposed to accept, without question, that the proponents of a strike on Syria have accurately depicted the underlying evidence, even though the proponents refuse to show any of it to us or to the American public....
more

[revelarts]

Medical Experts Doubt Syrian Chemical Weapons Claims
Posted on August 24, 2013 (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/08/is-u-s-launching-a-war-in-syria-to-distract-from-spying-and-other-scandals.html) by WashingtonsBlog (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/author/washingtonsblog)
Preliminary Evidence Indicates that the Syrian Government Did NOT Launch a Chemical Weapon Attack Against Its People CBS News reports that the U.S. is finalizing plans (https://twitter.com/CharlieKayeCBS/status/371045553527730176) for war (https://twitter.com/CharlieKayeCBS/status/371073130095079425) against Syria – and positioning ships (https://twitter.com/CharlieKayeCBS/status/371038840649031681) to launch cruise missiles (https://twitter.com/CharlieKayeCBS/status/371038205295861760) against the Syrian government – based on the claim that the Syrian government used chemical weapons against its people.

The last time the U.S. blamed the Syrian government for a chemical weapons attack, that claim was was debunked (http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/05/see-for-yourself-syrian-government-likely-did-not-use-chemical-weapons.html).
But is the claim that the Syrian government used chemical weapons against its people true this time (http://www.rt.com/news/russia-syria-chemical-attack-801/)?
It’s not surprising that Syria’s close ally – Russia – is expressing doubt (http://rt.com/news/russia-syria-chemical-attack-801/). Agence France-Presse (AFP) notes (http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/RestOfAsia/Syria-over-1-300-massacred-in-chemical-attack-by-army/Article1-1110869.aspx):
Russia, which has previously said it has proof of chemical weapons use by the rebels, expressed deep scepticism about the opposition’s claims.
The foreign ministry said the timing of the allegations as UN inspectors began their work “makes us think that we are once again dealing with a premeditated provocation.”

But Russia isn’t the only doubter.
AFP reports (http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/RestOfAsia/Syria-over-1-300-massacred-in-chemical-attack-by-army/Article1-1110869.aspx):
“At the moment, I am not totally convinced because the people that are helping them are without any protective clothing and without any respirators,” said Paula Vanninen, director of Verifin, the Finnish Institute for Verification of the Chemical Weapons Convention.
“In a real case, they would also be contaminated and would also be having symptoms.”
John Hart, head of the Chemical and Biological Security Project at Stockholm International Peace Research Institute said he had not seen the telltale evidence in the eyes of the victims that would be compelling evidence of chemical weapons use.
“Of the videos that I’ve seen for the last few hours, none of them show pinpoint pupils… this would indicate exposure to organophosphorus nerve agents,” he said.
Gwyn Winfield, editor of CBRNe World magazine, which specialises in chemical weapons issues, said the evidence did not suggest that the chemicals used were of the weapons-grade that the Syrian army possesses in its stockpiles.
“We’re not seeing reports that doctors and nurses… are becoming fatalities, so that would suggest that the toxicity of it isn’t what we would consider military sarin. It may well be that it is a lower-grade,” Winfield told AFP.

Haaretz reports (http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.542849):
Western experts on chemical warfare who have examined at least part of the footage are skeptical that weapons-grade chemical substances were used, although they all emphasize that serious conclusions cannot be reached without thorough on-site examination.
Dan Kaszeta, a former officer of the U.S. Army’s Chemical Corps and a leading private consultant, pointed out a number of details absent from the footage so far: “None of the people treating the casualties or photographing them are wearing any sort of chemical-warfare protective gear,” he says, “and despite that, none of them seem to be harmed.” This would seem to rule out most types of military-grade chemical weapons, including the vast majority of nerve gases, since these substances would not evaporate immediately, especially if they were used in sufficient quantities to kill hundreds of people, but rather leave a level of contamination on clothes and bodies which would harm anyone coming in unprotected contact with them in the hours after an attack. In addition, he says that “there are none of the other signs you would expect to see in the aftermath of a chemical attack, such as intermediate levels of casualties, severe visual problems, vomiting and loss of bowel control.”
Steve Johnson, a leading researcher on the effects of hazardous material exposure at England’s Cranfield University who has worked with Britain’s Ministry of Defense on chemical warfare issues, agrees that “from the details we have seen so far, a large number of casualties over a wide area would mean quite a pervasive dispersal. With that level of chemical agent, you would expect to see a lot of contamination on the casualties coming in, and it would affect those treating them who are not properly protected. We are not seeing that here.”
Additional questions also remain unanswered, especially regarding the timing of the attack, being that it occurred on the exact same day that a team of UN inspectors was in Damascus to investigate earlier claims of chemical weapons use. It is also unclear what tactical goal the Syrian army would have been trying to achieve, when over the last few weeks it has managed to push back the rebels who were encroaching on central areas of the capital. But if this was not a chemical weapons attack, what then caused the deaths of so many people without any external signs of trauma?
***
The Syrian rebels (and perhaps other players in the region) have a clear interest in presenting this as the largest chemical attack by the army loyal to Syrian President Bashar Assad to date, even if the cause was otherwise, especially while the UN inspectors are in the country. It is also in their interest to do so whilst U.S. President Barack Obama remains reluctant to commit any military support to the rebels, when only the crossing of a “red line” could convince him to change his policy.
The rebels and the doctors on the scene may indeed believe that chemical weapons were used, since they fear such an attack, but they may not have the necessary knowledge and means to make such a diagnosis. The European Union demanded Wednesday that the UN inspectors be granted access to the new sites of alleged chemical attacks, but since this is not within the team’s mandate, it is unlikely that the Syrian government will do so.

Stephen Johnson, an expert in weapons and chemical explosives at Cranfield Forensic Institute, said that the video footage looked suspect (http://www.euronews.com/2013/08/21/expert-casts-doubt-on-chemical-weapons-footage-from-syria/):

There are, within some of the videos, examples which seem a little hyper-real, and almost as if they’ve been set up. Which is not to say that they are fake but it does cause some concern. Some of the people with foaming, the foam seems to be too white, too pure, and not consistent with the sort of internal injury you might expect to see, which you’d expect to be bloodier or yellower. Chemical and biological weapons researcher Jean Pascal Zanders said that the footage appears to show victims of asphyxiation, which is not consistent with the use of mustard gas or the nerve agents VX or sarin (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/21/syria-poison-gas-attack_n_3789642.html):

I’m deliberately not using the term chemical weapons here,” he said, adding that the use of “industrial toxicants” was a more likely explanation.