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Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
10-10-2013, 03:27 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/slavery--disease--death--the-dark-side-of-the-christopher-columbus-story-141953979.html
Slavery, disease, death: the dark side of the Christopher Columbus story
Jay Busbee 4 hours ago



Christopher Columbus arrives in the New World.


On Monday, the United States will observe Columbus Day, schools and banks closing and parades marching in honor of the man who, as we all learned in school, discovered America in 1492.

And according to The Oatmeal’s Matthew Inman, Columbus Day is a dangerous farce.

Inman contends in his current strip on The Oatmeal, a humor/political commentary website, that the legends we believe about Columbus are not only misleading but grossly unfair. He cites primary sources and journals recounted in Howard Zinn’s “A People’s History of the United States” and James Lowewen’s “Lies My Teacher Told Me” to dispel the traditional narrative of Columbus as brave traveler who connected the Old World and the New.



Here are a few of The Oatmeal’s conclusions about Christopher Columbus:

• In 1492, no one actually thought the earth was flat. “Pretty much anyone with an education knew the earth was round. The Greeks had proved it 2,000 years before Columbus was born.”

• Columbus didn’t actually “discover” the New World. Not only were there natives living in the Americas for 14,000 years, Leif Ericson found the same territory 500 years before Columbus.

• Columbus wanted gold, and lots of it. His initial ideas for a new trade route to Asia fell by the wayside as he realized how much gold was available in the New World.

• The natives would provide little resistance. According to his own journal, Columbus believed the indigenous Lucayans would not be a significant challenge. “I could conquer the whole of them with fifty men,” he wrote, “and govern them as I pleased.”

• For his second visit, Columbus armed for war. When Columbus returned to the New World, he brought 17 ships and 1,500 men.

• Columbus treated the natives brutally. Columbus demanded treasure, food and sex for his men, and when the Lucayans refused, he ordered their noses and ears cut off to serve as a warning.

• Columbus treated his conquered people harshly. When the Lucayans rebelled, Columbus crushed the rebellion and carted off 500 Lucayans to be sold into slavery in Europe.

• Columbus disrupted the entire economy of three continents. Post-Columbian disease and starvation killed three to five million people over the next fifty years. And the influx of gold disrupted the global economy to the point that African slaves became a dominant commodity.


In short, The Oatmeal contends, Columbus “discovered the New World much like a meteorite discovered the dinosaurs,” and yet is still honored with a federal holiday. Making the point impossible to miss: “The father of the transatlantic slave trade is honored on the same level as Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King Jr.” A liberal/leftist rewriting of history. As if the African slave trade hadn't been going on for thousands of years before Columbus! Utter rot...-Tyr

Trigg
10-10-2013, 04:09 PM
In every newly "discovered" land the natives were treated horrifically. The Romans are a great example of this. They ruled the known world, and they didn't earn that title by throwing tea parties whenever they met the natives.


Meanwhile in, what is now Mexico, the Aztec were busily slaughtering anyone who disagreed with them.

The people with the most advanced weapons and strategic military wins.

This story is just another way to slam white people. When anyone with a brain knows atrocities have happened in every country perpetrated by every race.

Thunderknuckles
10-10-2013, 04:24 PM
In every newly "discovered" land the natives were treated horrifically. The Romans are a great example of this. They ruled the known world, and they didn't earn that title by throwing tea parties whenever they met the natives.


Meanwhile in, what is now Mexico, the Aztec were busily slaughtering anyone who disagreed with them.

The people with the most advanced weapons and strategic military wins.

This story is just another way to slam white people. When anyone with a brain knows atrocities have happened in every country perpetrated by every race.
Pretty much the same argument I give when I run into these "whitey is the devil" types.

Arbo
10-10-2013, 05:02 PM
A liberal/leftist rewriting of history.

Can you list what parts are not true and give links to support your claims?

Gaffer
10-11-2013, 11:48 AM
Can you list what parts are not true and give links to support your claims?

I don't see where Tyr said it wasn't true. He said it was a leftist slant on history. They are leaving out facts and other history that tells the whole story. So where is your usual, "they did it too" argument? This is just a white men conquered the world and enslaved everyone because they are evil book.

Most of what I read from the article I already was familiar with, he's not presenting anything new. Just putting a white people are evil spin on the facts.

Arbo
10-11-2013, 11:58 AM
I don't see where Tyr said it wasn't true.

It has to do with the term 'rewriting'. In general that means 'other than the truth'.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
10-11-2013, 12:45 PM
I don't see where Tyr said it wasn't true. He said it was a leftist slant on history. They are leaving out facts and other history that tells the whole story. So where is your usual, "they did it too" argument? This is just a white men conquered the world and enslaved everyone because they are evil book.

Most of what I read from the article I already was familiar with, he's not presenting anything new. Just putting a white people are evil spin on the facts. So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information. We saw a great example of that when the media left out the fact that Zimmerman was asked by the dispatcher to describe the suspect. With that key information gone the entire context was lost. That was done to make Zman look to be racist. I have noted here before that the Vikings discovered America before Columbus. One can leave out important facts and figures to slant anything how they want it to be considered. As in the Zman case just one little question was edited out to make a radical change in how people interpreted Zman's character. The dems/leftists are masters at this type of deceit and bull shat.-Tyr

Arbo
10-11-2013, 01:31 PM
So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information.

You said they were rewriting history. That means they are lying about things. Can you note the lies or not?

fj1200
10-11-2013, 02:58 PM
So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information.

Like how religionofpeace.com could do the same thing?

revelarts
10-11-2013, 02:58 PM
today -or- tomorrow is Columbus Day right.
So they post a story about Columbus. I didn't see "white devil" or 'hate Whitey" in the article.

Personally I'd never heard of some of that stuff.
and the mainstreem take on Columbus Leaves out the above information as well.
I suppose the Good Bad and Ugly should be told now an then as well, especially since it's such a major part of the story.

For the natives not much good could be said for the short run though. that's just a fact.
some "white people" seem to get defensive when a singlular historical figure is shown to be less than a saint we we're told they were when we were children.

As if it's an afront to a whole socalled "race", or a personal attack.

....slavery was in Africa long before Columbus nyaahh....
...the Romans did it tooo nyaah...
...the aztec killed alot of people too...
... leave white peop... I mean Columbus alone...

When people mention that the Aztecs had human, child sacrifices and the like you don't get a chorus of native Americans or Aztec decedents crying that it should never be mentioned , or that you should ONLY and MORE often mention the great things the Aztecs Accomplished.

Or Italians griping when people mention the horrors of the Roman empire. "DIDN"T THE ROMANS UNITE THE WORLD, the ROADS, the CULTURE, THE DEMOCRACY, the ARTS, BLAHH BLAH they are just trying to make Italians LOOK BAD!" The Chinese Did it TOO.."

We Rightly see a problem when the Japanese gov't is upset with the Chinese gov't or it's own when it wants to teach Japanese children the history and horrors of the Japanese invasion of China.
"It's hate the Jap all over again" "Everyone did it..."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21226068

yeah right
there are no sainted peoples, so don't get bent when someone mentions historical horrors. No ones trying to say your anymore of a monster than anyone else.

hmmm maybe
people shouldn't be calling other races and religions monster and inhuman because they've had a bit history that "proves it" huh?
just a thought.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
10-11-2013, 10:41 PM
Like how religionofpeace.com could do the same thing?

An accusation you have yet to prove. Go for it , present examples of where and how they did so, how they lied by omission etc. How about starting with their running tally of the murders the Islamists engage in everyday of the year. That would be a damn good start if you can prove they lie. -Tyr

fj1200
10-12-2013, 08:13 AM
An accusation you have yet to prove. Go for it , present examples of where and how they did so, how they lied by omission etc. How about starting with their running tally of the murders the Islamists engage in everyday of the year. That would be a damn good start if you can prove they lie. -Tyr

It's just a matter of logic and your own is against you.


So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
10-12-2013, 10:24 AM
Quote Originally Posted by Tyr-Ziu Saxnot View Post

An accusation you have yet to prove. Go for it , present examples of where and how they did so, how they lied by omission etc. How about starting with their running tally of the murders the Islamists engage in everyday of the year. That would be a damn good start if you can prove they lie. -Tyr It's just a matter of logic and your own is against you. Hardly against me pedro. The thread you criticized is itself a testament to validate my past posts on the subject. I challenged you to back up your accusation that it was a hate site or that it deliberately attacked Islam by omitting important facts in its articles. Apparently you have found that to be much too daunting of a task to even give it a try. Back when I was challenged to back up my words on Islam that thread was born! Tons of information has been presented there since then by myself and others! Yet you seek to negate that by an accusation of bias and lying being a mainstay of that thread by way of the use of much evidence coming from the linking to the site of, Religion of Peace.com. Either prove your accusation about that source or fail. Doesn't matter to me. Have fun. ;)--Tyr

fj1200
10-12-2013, 01:38 PM
Either prove your accusation about that source or fail.

What's there to prove? I'm sure even you admit that it doesn't include every aspect of Islam.


So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information.

WiccanLiberal
10-12-2013, 05:02 PM
Real history is pretty bloody and says things about humanity in general we would rather not face. The common factor of one group coming into conflict with another results in the more technologically savvy group enforcing their culture on the less so. This is something that we don't like to acknowledge so we create folk tales and heroes to make our own culture seem different and more morally positive. And these are the versions our young people are taught. In a way it is one of the most "true" things about us. We are taught the legends and the heroes as young people. As we grow up, we are exposed to the more cynical truths. In a way it teaches us the truest lesson, that all history is dependent on the point of view of the historian.