NATO Summit in S Wales, UK

[Drummond]

I don't have a great deal to say of any substance in this thread ... quite yet, anyway ...

... but it happens to be the case that this Summit is going to be located where I currently am !!

If I say that it's happening 'in my backyard', as a literal statement, that wouldn't be true. But it definitely feels like it is. I'm actually just a handful of miles from where the venue will be.

So - as you might imagine, the local population has been all too aware of the security arrangements instituted to defend the venue from attack. They - to say the least - have been extensive. Right now, I'm adding no observations about them .. though I might add comments after the Summit ends, on the impact this event has had on the local area.

For now - I'll say that the venue, located in Newport, South Wales, is well chosen. That is, if consideration for Obama was a chief consideration. Can anyone here guess why ?

You probably can.

But just in case not ... I'll simply explain that, sure enough, it has its own golf course .... :laugh::laugh:

.. and it does. I'm actually not kidding. I've been there, seen it for myself.

The BBC transmitted a brief news piece from a journalist standing on that golf course. Just behind him, parked on the course, was a tank and a military jet.

I have a concern about that.

Won't they threaten Obama's golfing handicap ??

With parts of the world going to hell in a handbasket ... heyy, these things really matter !!!

[aboutime]

Sir Drummond Obama has seemingly rendered NATO to be a useless entity now. Most of the nations in NATO do not trust, or believe anything OBAMA the DUMMY tries to tell them. I will be surprised if Obama is able to convince even One of them to follow his LACK OF LEADERSHIP.

[Drummond]

Sir Drummond Obama has seemingly rendered NATO to be a useless entity now. Most of the nations in NATO do not trust, or believe anything OBAMA the DUMMY tries to tell them. I will be surprised if Obama is able to convince even One of them to follow his LACK OF LEADERSHIP.

This has the ring of truth about it ... time will of course tell, in any case.

And given that you're proven right ... then that makes all of the big security presence in this general area doubly ludicrous. If all the attendees turn up, and achieve remarkably little, courtesy in no small measure to Obama's uselessness .. then all I've witnessed in recent days, here, is reduced to outrageous farce.

I'll be more descriptive once the summit is over, because after all, the security concerns must be substantial ....

[aboutime]

This has the ring of truth about it ... time will of course tell, in any case.

And given that you're proven right ... then that makes all of the big security presence in this general area doubly ludicrous. If all the attendees turn up, and achieve remarkably little, courtesy in no small measure to Obama's uselessness .. then all I've witnessed in recent days, here, is reduced to outrageous farce.

I'll be more descriptive once the summit is over, because after all, the security concerns must be substantial ....


Sir Drummond. Agreed. It normally would be BEST to wait until after the FARCE...I mean Summit ends to be critical of our CIC. But, I fully expect. Based on his predictable past. How all we will hear might be a Repeat of the words he has used previously to dodge, and circumvent exposing his Inability to make a Decision that would make him...in any way, responsible for anything.

We all know. Not even Obama has any idea what is going on...anywhere in the World that he doesn't first...Get from the PRESS reports, and has time to dwell upon for at least...until the November elections.
Normally. We Americans would try to refrain from talking about our President while out of the country. Normally.

But we haven't, honestly got someone we can admire, or refer to as our Leader, or President these days IMO!

[Drummond]

OK, I said I'd add more after some time had passed .. so, here it is ...

I don't think the Summit was a complete waste of time. From it, we got the decision that a 'Rapid Reaction Force' will be created .. to which the UK, by the way, will contribute a quarter of the total troop force it'll comprise of. There was also general agreement that defence spending cuts in member countries had to stop.

Additionally, an agreed ceasefire between Ukraine and Russia apparently emerged. Though whether that'll work, seems doubtful ...

That said, though, much of it came across as hype, with some grandstanding from Obama ....

Obama definitely did himself some good out of it all, over here, anyway. I'm not aware of this part of Wales having ever hosted any event as prestigious as this .. and Obama definitely tried to sell himself to the 'locals', and with some measure of success. His accolade to the host organisers, even one to the people of Wales, was enthusiastically lapped up. And then ... Obama, before clearing off back to where he came from, decided to arrange a car trip to Stonehenge, to ostensibly wander around amongst its stones (he was given a more 'up close' chance to study them than any ordinary tourist would be allowed). This involved meeting a British family visiting it at the same time, and a couple of 'selfies' being taken with them. The family was said to have been thrilled ...

... and the BBC, never missing an excuse to try and sell your Leftie-In-Chief, regurgitated that story, incessantly, on every news broadcast for the following 24 hours ......

On a more amusing note .. so far as I know, Obama didn't get his round of golf, even though the Celtic Manor boasts quite a good golf course. Parked on one of its greens ... throughout the time of the Summit, one of our tanks. Alternating between the Celtic Manor's entrance, and as a partner for the tank, also a RAF fighter jet. So these pieces of military hardware must've cramped Obama's golfing style ....

Locally .. the 'crazies' came to town. Opponents of NATO set up camp in Tredegar Park, and used it as a squatting base for around a week. We had to maintain a police presence throughout to make sure their activities remained within the law (and police forces from throughout the UK sent police into the general area .. security was extremely tight ..).

Tight or not, a protest gathering assembled at Newport Town Centre the previous Saturday. Timed to coincide with it .. the Socialist Workers Party actually set up stalls in the centre of town, distributing leaflets, trying to recruit members for their cause (they're a Far Left Party ... not a major one here, so they're desperate to get what increases in membership they can get). They are Marxists. In the past, they gave wholehearted support to the IRA - these days, their terrorists of choice are Hamas and Hezbollah. Their literature claimed that NATO was waging a war against Islam, and existed to be warmongering ...

No arrests happened that day. And public transport was suspended in Newport for part of the day, which apparently gave the protesters a good laugh ..

The first day of the Summit (Thursday), a further march .. meant to be 20,000 strong, but in the event there were only around 400 militants marching. Five arrests ... sparked off by the police filming the marchers, followed by the marchers filming the police, all of which caused tensions. So, five arrests. No fights broke out, but then, considering how many police were there (to say nothing of the helicopter presence, noticeable throughout the week) .. no such altercation would've achieved anything.

All in all, it passed off peacefully enough. But I resented the great tolerance, most of it even good-natured, shown towards the Marxist troublemakers the area had to put up with.

[Gaffer]

A 4,000 man reaction force is a little more than a brigade. That's the best NATO can do with 28 members? A 4,000 man force is little more than a blocking force that can be over run easily enough by a well equipped Russian force. Kinda like a mobile Alamo. They better have a couple of divisions standing by to beef this force up or there won't be much left if the Russians decide to really press.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

A 4,000 man reaction force is a little more than a brigade. That's the best NATO can do with 28 members? A 4,000 man force is little more than a blocking force that can be over run easily enough by a well equipped Russian force. Kinda like a mobile Alamo. They better have a couple of divisions standing by to beef this force up or there won't be much left if the Russians decide to really press.

So dead on the money Gaffer...

A token gesture unless they field about 1500 men from each of the 28 nations. Which totals about 42,000 men.. Of course USA should field no less that the main contingent of at least 8,000 EXTREMELY WELL EQUIPPED SOLDIERS IMHO.. To pay for that force USA should cancel some of the dem vote buying give away programs-- A definite win /win for us.. :laugh:
A two division minimum is necessary and it had better be damn well trained, armed and maintained! Quick reaction force should be not less that 9/10 thousand men well equipped and backed by the necessary air power. All this because should Russia act it will not be in a stupid manner, it will be full force and damn sure meaning business! With heavy armor to boot..
For those readers here not familiar with the terms here are the numbers


SQUAD = Nine to 10 soldiers

PLATOON = 16 to 44 soldiers

COMPANY = 62 to 190 soldiers

BATTALION = 300 to 1,000 soldiers

BRIGADE = 3,000 to 5,000 soldiers

DIVISION = 10,000 to 15,000 soldiers.

CORPS = 20,000 to 45,000 soldiers

ARMY = 50,000+ soldiers.

Obama , as usual is out of his element and Russia can and will view this token crap as no real deterrent IMHO. Now if the bamfool adds in the necessary airpower, attack choppers/ground armor then its a totally different story IMHO.

[aboutime]

As long as Obama refuses to use the words terrorists, Islamic, or Islamist, or War. Nothing will be done by the very military he CLAIMS to be the CIC for, and of.

Putin, and the ISIS terrorists, with the Muslim Brotherhood who sponsors Terror groups like Hamas, Hezbollah, and ISIS all know.

Obama is afraid to be a real leader with any GONADS when it comes to defending the American people, and our Allies (what's left of them).

Sad to say. There is only ONE WAY we will see OBAMA take any measurable action to defend WE THE PEOPLE...will only hopefully come following the NEXT 9-11 Attacks that Kill, or Maim a large number of Americans.

Today is SEPTEMBER 7TH.

Does anyone out there privately WONDER.....What Might Happen this Coming THURSDAY, September 11th, 2014?

Based on what all of us heard, and remember with BENGHAZI two years ago.

Can anyone of us "WE THE PEOPLE" honestly feel confident that HISTORY WON'T REPEAT ITSELF AGAIN????

[Drummond]

Some great points made in the posts just prior to this one. I think I agree .. just 4,000 troops does seem ludicrously small on the face of it.

That said, though, I'm wondering if we're sure of quite what they'll be ? What if some are Special Forces, not unlike Navy Seals, or our SAS ? If that's true, their worth might be greater than any of us might think.

Curiously, I've seen this, from the Washington Post:-

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/moscow-will-review-military-strategy-in-face-of-nato-plan-for-rapid-reaction-force/2014/09/02/09732e66-2a6f-4d1b-b529-853d9f438ce5_story.html


MOSCOW — Russia said Tuesday that it was reviewing its military strategy in the face of expected NATO plans to establish a rapid-reaction force capable of deploying quickly to Eastern Europe, ratcheting up tensions ahead of a NATO summit this week.

The review of the Kremlin’s military doctrine came as Russian-backed rebels made fresh gains Tuesday on the ground in eastern Ukraine, where they have swiftly recaptured territory after appearing close to defeat just weeks ago. Kiev and its allies have said Russia has sent in its own troops to tip the balance in favor of the rebels, a charge the Kremlin denies.

NATO leaders meeting later this week in Wales are expected to endorse the creation of a military force of about 4,000 troops capable of deploying to Eastern Europe on about eight hours’ notice.

Russia’s intent to improve its plans to counter NATO forces, announced without further detail Tuesday by a top Kremlin official, brings the sides closer to a large-scale armed confrontation than they have been at any other time since the end of the Cold War.

... so, it seems that the announcement has caused some measure of concern in the Kremlin ! OK, so maybe they were expecting a bigger force than was announced. Even so ... this comes across as a reaction of a bully wary of ever being confronted ...

Also interestingly ... though Obama wasn't exactly shy about making the announcement of NATO's intentions, he - on examination, and in a manner consistent with AT's observation, above - is rather more shy about committing to it (which does a lot to explain the size of the force ?). See ...

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/britain-to-lead-spearhead-force-1.559818


Britain is to a head up a new rapid-reaction Nato "spearhead" force designed to deter Russian further aggression against former Soviet bloc states in eastern Europe, David Cameron has said.

On the final day of the alliance summit in South Wales, the Prime Minister said the UK would be the first member state to take charge of the 4,000-strong force when it becomes operational at the end of next year.

The UK will provide the largest contingent with a 1,000-strong battle group and headquarters for the force which will be on standby to deploy troops within two to five days in the event of a new crisis.

The Prime Minister also confirmed that the European Union would press ahead with a new round of sanctions against Russia, despite the agreement of a ceasefire with pro-Moscow rebels announced by Ukraine's President Petro Poroshenko.

Mr Cameron welcomed the truce, but said that Western sanctions would only be removed if "proper milestones" towards a lasting peace were reached.

The Prime Minister hailed a "hard-fought" agreement by all 28 Nato members to reverse the trend of cuts in defence spending and move towards meeting the alliance's target of spending 2% of GDP on defence over the coming decade - with a fifth of spending to go on major new equipment.

He sought to underline Britain's own commitment to alliance collective defence with an announcement that the Royal Navy's second new aircraft carrier - the Prince of Wales, due to be completed in 2017 - will enter service rather than be mothballed or sold off, enabling the UK to have a carrier available at all times.

From this, it's apparent that the UK is the main driving-force behind the plan to create and deploy that 'reaction force'

Also:-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2744716/NATO-outline-force-aimed-deterring-Russia.html


Obama dodges question on whether US will join NATO rapid response force of 4,000 land troops sent to Eastern Europe to warn off Putin.

President Barack Obama dodged a question on Friday about whether American troops will be part of a new NATO rapid response force in Eastern Europe set up to warn Russia that Western nations could quickly mobilize if an allied country in the region were to come under attack.

NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen said the new unit would send a clear message to potential aggressors in a thinly veiled warning to Vladimir Putin.

'Should you even think of attacking one ally, you will be facing the whole alliance,' he declared as a two-day NATO summit in southern Wales drew to a close.

But when Obama was asked point-blank if he will send troops, he talked only of financial assistance.

Obama hasn't been shy about getting on a podium to announce what NATO will do. But, when it comes to actually doing anything really meaningful .....

[aboutime]

Some great points made in the posts just prior to this one. I think I agree .. just 4,000 troops does seem ludicrously small on the face of it.

That said, though, I'm wondering if we're sure of quite what they'll be ? What if some are Special Forces, not unlike Navy Seals, or our SAS ? If that's true, their worth might be greater than any of us might think.

Curiously, I've seen this, from the Washington Post:-

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/moscow-will-review-military-strategy-in-face-of-nato-plan-for-rapid-reaction-force/2014/09/02/09732e66-2a6f-4d1b-b529-853d9f438ce5_story.html



... so, it seems that the announcement has caused some measure of concern in the Kremlin ! OK, so maybe they were expecting a bigger force than was announced. Even so ... this comes across as a reaction of a bully wary of ever being confronted ...

Also interestingly ... though Obama wasn't exactly shy about making the announcement of NATO's intentions, he - on examination, and in a manner consistent with AT's observation, above - is rather more shy about committing to it (which does a lot to explain the size of the force ?). See ...

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/britain-to-lead-spearhead-force-1.559818



From this, it's apparent that the UK is the main driving-force behind the plan to create and deploy that 'reaction force'

Also:-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2744716/NATO-outline-force-aimed-deterring-Russia.html



Obama hasn't been shy about getting on a podium to announce what NATO will do. But, when it comes to actually doing anything really meaningful .....



There's only ONE sentence no American, or ally of the USA will ever hear from Obama.

And that sentence is "Where's my ball(s)?" Due to his advanced proclivity to find a golf course, expecting to demonstrate his LACKING Intestinal Fortitude most of the World recognizes as "GUTS", of which. Obama has None.

His favorite place on Earth is on a PODIUM where he, and his Teleprompter Buddy can repeat the word "I" in record breaking form.

[Drummond]

There's only ONE sentence no American, or ally of the USA will ever hear from Obama.

And that sentence is "Where's my ball(s)?" Due to his advanced proclivity to find a golf course, expecting to demonstrate his LACKING Intestinal Fortitude most of the World recognizes as "GUTS", of which. Obama has None.

His favorite place on Earth is on a PODIUM where he, and his Teleprompter Buddy can repeat the word "I" in record breaking form.:clap::clap::laugh2::laugh2:

Nicely said ...

Besides, I especially enjoyed the fact that, though the Celtic Manor resort offered Obama his expected golf course ... parked on it, throughout the Conference - and very unsportingly - was a British tank !! Sometimes a RAF fighter jet also accompanied it ...

So I believe Obama was robbed of his hoped-for golfing distraction .... :laugh:

[Gaffer]

Did I read that right. The force would be ready at the end of next year? And it can respond anywhere in Europe in two to four days? That's pathetic.

I was in an independent brigade, a bastard brigade is how it was known. We were a rapid response force. We could put three combat battalions anywhere in the world in 18 hours and the entire brigade there in three days. And that was in 1967. In 2014, with all the technology we have they can't beat our time? Hell we were to be pulled out of combat and go into combat somewhere else. And we did have to stand by in June 67 during the first three days of the six day war. And it takes over a year to put this force together? It didn't take that long to put together three divisions for the invasion of Iraq.

[aboutime]

Did I read that right. The force would be ready at the end of next year? And it can respond anywhere in Europe in two to four days? That's pathetic.

I was in an independent brigade, a bastard brigade is how it was known. We were a rapid response force. We could put three combat battalions anywhere in the world in 18 hours and the entire brigade there in three days. And that was in 1967. In 2014, with all the technology we have they can't beat our time? Hell we were to be pulled out of combat and go into combat somewhere else. And we did have to stand by in June 67 during the first three days of the six day war. And it takes over a year to put this force together? It didn't take that long to put together three divisions for the invasion of Iraq.


Gaffer. I was just as surprised as you were until I reminded myself how...the Obama administration has been riding rough herd over the Pentagon, and DOWNSIZING, FIRING, RETIRING large numbers of the experienced Military people who FORMERLY made up those RAPID RESPONSE FORCES we all were confident...still existed.
But today. Having a Pure WUSS and APPEASER to our enemies for a wannabe president. Well, you can instantly see WHY it would now take so long.
When we have a phony leader...afraid of hurting the feelings of our known enemies. What else could anyone expect from Obama?

[Drummond]

Did I read that right. The force would be ready at the end of next year? And it can respond anywhere in Europe in two to four days? That's pathetic.

... well ... Obama seemed proud of it !! .....

http://www.voanews.com/content/nato-summit-russia-sanctions/2439484.html

That's despite not wanting to offer anything to this other than 'financial assistance' ...

Given that this turns out to be a Europe-only initiative, and when you consider the speed of typical European bureaucracy, this is definitely 'speedy' stuff .. :rolleyes:


I was in an independent brigade, a bastard brigade is how it was known. We were a rapid response force. We could put three combat battalions anywhere in the world in 18 hours and the entire brigade there in three days. And that was in 1967. In 2014, with all the technology we have they can't beat our time? Hell we were to be pulled out of combat and go into combat somewhere else. And we did have to stand by in June 67 during the first three days of the six day war. And it takes over a year to put this force together? It didn't take that long to put together three divisions for the invasion of Iraq.

Yes, but that was (a) because America arranged it, and (b) not even fledgling Leftieism had made itself felt in American politics back in those days.

So, today .. what else can you expect ?

No doubt some passing Leftie or other will happen by, hoping to persuade us of the 'humanity' of our adversaries ..

[aboutime]

Normally. I wouldn't want to use the expression "I hate to say it", but, in this case. I feel it must be said.

I personally, as a retired veteran who didn't just peel potatoes for 30 years, or hide in some office. Have a terrible feeling, based on the Inaction, and amateurism of our sitting CIC. That WE...the United States of America, are probably going to feel the full thrust, and hatred of ISIS, ISIL, or IS...right here, on our shores before Obama has time to pick out his next vacation location.

I know he is planning on addressing the AMERICAN PEOPLE during Prime Time on Wednesday. But sadly. Only a small portion of the American public will even know Obama will be speaking.

Tomorrow is the 10th of September. Does anyone see any significance in Obama choosing that DATE to address the Nation?

Personally. I feel he is merely going to REPEAT all of his past words, and literally SELL US ALL DOWN THE RIVER when he speaks.

Americans who will be watching, and listening to him WILL NOT HEAR any NEW LIES.

We are just going to hear Different Wording, Semantics, Rhetoric to impress the Brain-dead, and Great Under-educated who still LOVE HIM because he would never lie, or cheat them while silently EXTORTING all of them for his LOVE, and SUPPORT.

(a quote of aboutime)