Fake Army Ranger goes to court [Archive] - Debate Policy

aboutime

09-29-2014, 03:49 PM

Really? Is this a serious question? I guess it is...

Answer: Because if anyone questions a persons claims of service, they are generally derided and otherwise shouted down as unpatriotic scum. As a result, most people are wary of questioning the claims of service people make. Everyone is just expected to take their word for it...

hjmick. Just take a look around at the other threads here, now directed my way. And, unfortunately for some. I Don't take their word for it. Which draws some really childish name calling as a result.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 03:53 PM

hjmick. Just take a look around at the other threads here, now directed my way. And, unfortunately for some. I Don't take their word for it. Which draws some really childish name calling as a result.

With all due respect, it's not about not taking someones word, it's about calling someone a fraud and using the term "stolen valor" with no proof to backup such comments. And you're correct, I do think some name calling is childish. But if I did serve my country, I would be more offended by someone marginalizing or calling my service into question.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 03:59 PM

With all due respect, it's not about not taking someones word, it's about calling someone a fraud and using the term "stolen valor" with no proof to backup such comments. And you're correct, I do think some name calling is childish. But if I did serve my country, I would be more offended by someone marginalizing or calling my service into question.

Jim. I agree. And, if you read what I originally said concerning Stolen Valor. I DID NOT call anyone a fraud. I would never do that to another veteran. But, as you may soon learn. Sadly. There are possibly thousands of SELF-PROCLAIMED Veterans out there today who are STEALING the VALOR of others.
I am, and always will be suspicious...as everyone should. Even those who take OFFENSE and try to distract attention away from them.
If they are proud of their service, and have nothing to hide. Most Veterans know....those who feel they must BRAG the most. Generally are later found to be ...SHALL WE SAY..."Less than honorable?"

Nothing more. Nothing less.

In many ways. This topic is much like the RACIST, RACE CARD discussions that are quickly shut-down, and prevented when the offended declare RACISM. Which stops all conversations.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 04:24 PM

Jim. I agree. And, if you read what I originally said concerning Stolen Valor. I DID NOT call anyone a fraud. I would never do that to another veteran. But, as you may soon learn. Sadly. There are possibly thousands of SELF-PROCLAIMED Veterans out there today who are STEALING the VALOR of others.
I am, and always will be suspicious...as everyone should. Even those who take OFFENSE and try to distract attention away from them.
If they are proud of their service, and have nothing to hide. Most Veterans know....those who feel they must BRAG the most. Generally are later found to be ...SHALL WE SAY..."Less than honorable?"

Nothing more. Nothing less.

In many ways. This topic is much like the RACIST, RACE CARD discussions that are quickly shut-down, and prevented when the offended declare RACISM. Which stops all conversations.

Just seemed like some of the stolen valor crap started in the veterans thread, where he made his service claims. And similarly in other threads. I highly doubt that the new member, myself, Gunny and others made the connection incorrectly. And while perhaps you didn't outright say "fraud", alluding to stolen valor when someone makes a military claim is pretty much the same thing. Be suspicious, that's cool. Don't like someone bragging? Don't respond or place them on ignore. And now later found - less than honorable. - these are ALL things calling into question service, or snide comments alluding to the same.

And this topic can go on forever and I would be cool with it - THE TOPIC - not accusations about fellow members with zero proof - BIG difference.

At the VERY least, if you MUST do it, as usual, which is always ignored - PLEASE bring it to the cage.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 04:26 PM

Just seemed like some of the stolen valor crap started in the veterans thread, where he made his service claims. And similarly in other threads. I highly doubt that the new member, myself, Gunny and others made the connection incorrectly. And while perhaps you didn't outright say "fraud", alluding to stolen valor when someone makes a military claim is pretty much the same thing. Be suspicious, that's cool. Don't like someone bragging? Don't respond or place them on ignore. And now later found - less than honorable. - these are ALL things calling into question service, or snide comments alluding to the same.

And this topic can go on forever and I would be cool with it - THE TOPIC - not accusations about fellow members with zero proof - BIG difference.

At the VERY least, if you MUST do it, as usual, which is always ignored - PLEASE bring it to the cage.

Once again. Please excuse me for being honest with you, and other members. If we say, and do nothing. Everybody's happy.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 04:32 PM

Once again. Please excuse me for being honest with you, and other members. If we say, and do nothing. Everybody's happy.

No one said a thing about honesty. This is about calling into question a members military service without proof to back it up. DO YOU have any proof to backup the stolen valor claims, or just hunches?

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 04:48 PM

Really? Is this a serious question? I guess it is...

Answer: Because if anyone questions a persons claims of service, they are generally derided and otherwise shouted down as unpatriotic scum. As a result, most people are wary of questioning the claims of service people make. Everyone is just expected to take their word for it...

Yes, but we're talking about people who made serious investments in time and money. Wouldn't you do a bit of due diligence before investing with someone? It took me literally 2 minutes to find a list of MoH recipients online. Surely someone who flies to Africa to work for someone would invest that minimal amount of time.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 05:07 PM

No one said a thing about honesty. This is about calling into question a members military service without proof to back it up. DO YOU have any proof to backup the stolen valor claims, or just hunches?

Jim. As I said earlier. I did not accuse anyone. As for proof to backup the stolen valor claims. I have no need to prove anything. I expect the PROOF will be pretty evident as time goes on. If nobody is violating the Stolen Honor code. There is nothing to defend, or prove. And that's not a hunch.
Calling a members military service into question has been welcomed by most veterans who despise, and wish they could personally meet, and handle such people. What's wrong with that?
It would almost be like one of the members of DP trying to pretend they are YOU, and impersonating YOU. How would you feel in that case Jim? There's another name for it most people have learned to recognize. Like...IDENTITY THEFT.

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 05:15 PM

Jim. As I said earlier. I did not accuse anyone. As for proof to backup the stolen valor claims. I have no need to prove anything. I expect the PROOF will be pretty evident as time goes on. If nobody is violating the Stolen Honor code. There is nothing to defend, or prove. And that's not a hunch.
Calling a members military service into question has been welcomed by most veterans who despise, and wish they could personally meet, and handle such people. What's wrong with that?
It would almost be like one of the members of DP trying to pretend they are YOU, and impersonating YOU. How would you feel in that case Jim? There's another name for it most people have learned to recognize. Like...IDENTITY THEFT.

You most certainly did , and you did it again today with another member. Please remove the words truth from your avatar henceforth.

AH , here's the link for Jim or anyone to see for themselves.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?46719-Keep-it-Classy-Obama&p=706921#post706921

hjmick

09-29-2014, 05:25 PM

Yes, but we're talking about people who made serious investments in time and money. Wouldn't you do a bit of due diligence before investing with someone? It took me literally 2 minutes to find a list of MoH recipients online. Surely someone who flies to Africa to work for someone would invest that minimal amount of time.

I would, and I'd like to think everyone would. But I imagine that, coupled with my previous answer, there is a certain eagerness for many people and organizations to associate themselves with men and women who have been awarded various honors in an effort to give themselves and their organizations a level of legitimacy and visibility they may otherwise lack. This desire and eagerness impedes their judgment and blinds them to the inconsistencies that others might see.

Maybe? That's just my opinion. I was wrong once...

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 05:37 PM

I would, and I'd like to think everyone would. But I imagine that, coupled with my previous answer, there is a certain eagerness for many people and organizations to associate themselves with men and women who have been awarded various honors in an effort to give themselves and their organizations a level of legitimacy and visibility they may otherwise lack. This desire and eagerness impedes their judgment and blinds them to the inconsistencies that others might see.

Maybe? That's just my opinion. I was wrong once...

Certainly a possibility I guess, but man the two MoHs would have been setting of alarms for nearly anyone I would think. As the real SEAL said, that hasn't happened since WWI.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 06:18 PM

You most certainly did , and you did it again today with another member. Please remove the words truth from your avatar henceforth.

AH , here's the link for Jim or anyone to see for themselves.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?46719-Keep-it-Classy-Obama&p=706921#post706921

Wow. If you actually read those words you are One Mighty good guy with the ability to twist words to your liking.

ACCUSATION, ACCUSE...Really?

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 06:24 PM

Jim. As I said earlier. I did not accuse anyone. As for proof to backup the stolen valor claims. I have no need to prove anything. I expect the PROOF will be pretty evident as time goes on. If nobody is violating the Stolen Honor code. There is nothing to defend, or prove. And that's not a hunch.
Calling a members military service into question has been welcomed by most veterans who despise, and wish they could personally meet, and handle such people. What's wrong with that?
It would almost be like one of the members of DP trying to pretend they are YOU, and impersonating YOU. How would you feel in that case Jim? There's another name for it most people have learned to recognize. Like...IDENTITY THEFT.

Yes, you did actually, and in several different ways. And now you continue with stolen valor talk, and how proof will be evident - proof of WHAT exactly then, if you aren't accusing? Why ANY talk of identify theft? Why even bring that up if you aren't making an accusation?

Wow. If you actually read those words you are One Mighty good guy with the ability to twist words to your liking.

ACCUSATION, ACCUSE...Really?

WHat did you mean when you told the other member "Identified you..for me instantly" and then questioned whether he knew someone?

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 06:25 PM

Wow. If you actually read those words you are One Mighty good guy with the ability to twist words to your liking.

ACCUSATION, ACCUSE...Really?

Okay Mighty10th. So, how bout you share some of your military background with us. You ruined it when you started out with the Teabagging remarks. Identified you..for me instantly. And will probably explain why I didn't take time to Welcome you here.

Do you know Don Shipley? I do..personally.

You accused the guy of not being a vet. Own it. Coward.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 06:28 PM

Okay Mighty10th. So, how bout you share some of your military background with us. You ruined it when you started out with the Teabagging remarks. Identified you..for me instantly. And will probably explain why I didn't take time to Welcome you here.

Do you know Don Shipley? I do..personally.

You accused the guy of not being a vet. Own it. Coward.

Oh, I see. When I told him his comment about the Teabagging ruined it. You twisted my meaning into him not being a vet? Really?

How bout I ask you how you feel about the comment "Teabagging". If I associate that with you. Does that tell you I don't think you are a vet??

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 06:35 PM

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 06:56 PM

Oh, I see. When I told him his comment about the Teabagging ruined it. You twisted my meaning into him not being a vet? Really?

How bout I ask you how you feel about the comment "Teabagging". If I associate that with you. Does that tell you I don't think you are a vet??

I think calling them tea baggers or or using any derogatory variation of that is stupid.

That has ZERO to do with my military service. You seem to be under the impression that the military only has conservative members, and that may have been true when you were aboard the CSS Virginia pops, it certainly isn't true today.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 06:59 PM

Then why ask him about his military background if your gripe was a teabagging comment?

Maybe I should have asked you instead?

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:02 PM

I think calling them tea baggers or or using any derogatory variation of that is stupid.

That has ZERO to do with my military service. You seem to be under the impression that the military only has conservative members, and that may have been true when you were aboard the CSS Virginia pops, it certainly isn't true today.

So, now that you finally admit I didn't accuse you of being a phony. You just had to finish off your childishness with another dumb remark. And no. I am not under that impression at all. In fact. Believe it or not. Many of the people I formerly served with were as Liberal as you seem to be. But, at least they didn't feel any needs to use the name calling. Nor did I. We were civil, and allowed for each of us to have our own opinions about almost everything. But never once..did any of them Pretend they were trying to be someone they were not.

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 07:03 PM

Maybe I should have asked you instead?

Just admit you use stolen valor as a weapon to attack vets that dare to disagree with you, and move on.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:04 PM

Just admit you use stolen valor as a weapon to attack vets that dare to disagree with you, and move on.

NO WAY. That would be Lying. I won't lie for you, or anyone else just because you disagree, or don't like what I have to say.

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 07:06 PM

NO WAY. That would be Lying. I won't lie for you, or anyone else just because you disagree, or don't like what I have to say.

Pshh, your lie train has already left the station sir when you point blank claimed you didn't accuse me or the other poster of "stealing valor" when you certainly did.

I gather this guy is what is known as an internet troll?

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 07:08 PM

Maybe I should have asked you instead?

Asked me why I asked him about his military background at that time? I didn't - YOU did, and you're running from it now.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 07:10 PM

But, at least they didn't feel any needs to use the name calling. Nor did I. We were civil, and allowed for each of us to have our own opinions about almost everything. But never once..did any of them Pretend they were trying to be someone they were not.

You have an issue with name calling, but not with accusations about someone's military service without proof? Why do YOU start shit like this, and then act like a victim when called on it?

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:10 PM

Pshh, your lie train has already left the station sir when you point blank claimed you didn't accuse me or the other poster of "stealing valor" when you certainly did.

I gather this guy is what is known as an internet troll?

Whatever you say. Fine with me. As long as you feel satisfied that your last words were enough to change my mind about you.

Hope you feel better now.

But keep in mind. I have not LIED to you at all. Stew on that.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 07:11 PM

Whatever you say. Fine with me. As long as you feel satisfied that your last words were enough to change my mind about you.

Hope you feel better now.

But keep in mind. I have not LIED to you at all. Stew on that.

I wonder, with the way you act when other military members come here - how much have YOU lied about yourself.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:14 PM

You have an issue with name calling, but not with accusations about someone's military service without proof? Why do YOU start shit like this, and then act like a victim when called on it?

Jim. GO BACK AND CHECK. I did not accuse him about his military service. If you find that accusation...like he claims he has Both of you have a problem.
As I just told him. I did not lie about anything. And, he insists differently.

READ what I said for crying out loud. I'm not acting like any victim. You are defending one.

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 07:17 PM

Jim. GO BACK AND CHECK. I did not accuse him about his military service. If you find that accusation...like he claims he has Both of you have a problem.
As I just told him. I did not lie about anything. And, he insists differently.

READ what I said for crying out loud. I'm not acting like any victim. You are defending one.

I am not an idiot. You started with the stolen valor shit. You beat around the bush and drop your comments. Did you say "this guy is a fraud and is lying" - no, you didn't. But you might as well have with the way you post "BS" stuff, "stolen valor", "phony" and quite a few other little tidbits. Don't think I just fell off a turnip truck or that the board is full of idiots. At the VERY least, if you think he is lying and all that "stolen valor" crap, then be a MAN and fucking say it already, or just drop it.

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 07:19 PM

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 07:20 PM

I am not an idiot. You started with the stolen valor shit. You beat around the bush and drop your comments. Did you say "this guy is a fraud and is lying" - no, you didn't. But you might as well have with the way you post "BS" stuff, "stolen valor", "phony" and quite a few other little tidbits. Don't think I just fell off a turnip truck or that the board is full of idiots. At the VERY least, if you think he is lying and all that "stolen valor" crap, then be a MAN and fucking say it already, or just drop it.

THis post proved you are a liberal to me

but I'm not calling you a liberal...

:laugh:

jimnyc

09-29-2014, 07:21 PM

Aboutime - YOUR words:

I call BS on your statement about "to do things we can't talk about". If you are, who you claim to be. Other than another STOLEN VALOR candidate. It would be easier to prove it.
Perhaps you were a NAVY SEAL, or a RANGER, GREEN BERET as well.
As for the regularly detached BS. What was your C.O.'s last name?

Why do new military members need to give their commanding officers names and such?

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:29 PM

Oh come on man, you absolutely accused me of stolen valor. Then you did the same with Mighty10th.

If you are such a soft touch that you honestly believe I accused you of that. There is nothing I can do to change what you think.

On the other hand. As the Veteran you are. You should be just as angry about those who STEAL veterans VALOR as I am.

So. I will leave it there. For thirty years. I worked with, served, honored, respected, and even defended Fellow Americans in uniform, even when we didn't always agree. And I also got to know many who pretended, or thought they could pretend to be something they were not in uniform.

My experience from the Vietnam years, and on have trained me to beware of those who feel a need to be 'braggadocious' about their time in uniform, or service. Surely. You must have felt the same way at some time?
That was all I was attempting to WARN everyone about. Personally. I'm really tired, and disgusted with the actual number of people who call themselves Veterans, Hero's, or Phony Medal winners who think...Many of us will just buy their crap...because they were in uniform.
It just doesn't work for me.

Born2DecadesLate

09-29-2014, 07:33 PM

If you are such a soft touch that you honestly believe I accused you of that. There is nothing I can do to change what you think.

On the other hand. As the Veteran you are. You should be just as angry about those who STEAL veterans VALOR as I am.

So. I will leave it there. For thirty years. I worked with, served, honored, respected, and even defended Fellow Americans in uniform, even when we didn't always agree. And I also got to know many who pretended, or thought they could pretend to be something they were not in uniform.

My experience from the Vietnam years, and on have trained me to beware of those who feel a need to be 'braggadocious' about their time in uniform, or service. Surely. You must have felt the same way at some time?
That was all I was attempting to WARN everyone about. Personally. I'm really tired, and disgusted with the actual number of people who call themselves Veterans, Hero's, or Phony Medal winners who think...Many of us will just buy their crap...because they were in uniform.
It just doesn't work for me.

so, now your proof against me is that I didn't have an over the top reaction at being accused of lying? You're obviously a douchebag , why would I worry that much about your opinion? I mean seriously your proof against the other poster is that he called someone a teabagger.

Talk about weak grandpa.

aboutime

09-29-2014, 07:43 PM

so, now your proof against me is that I didn't have an over the top reaction at being accused of lying? You're obviously a douchebag , why would I worry that much about your opinion? I mean seriously your proof against the other poster is that he called someone a teabagger.

Talk about weak grandpa.

Are you done? Once again. I gave you the http://icansayit.com/images/lastword.jpg

There's really no other variation of your defending this?

Thanks again for the Name calling.

Take note. Only one of us resorted to the Immature, childishness of name calling.
YOU WON.

darin

09-30-2014, 06:32 AM

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 06:44 AM

Last year sometime, I proposed fact-checking on this site and was largely shouted-down. The only other veteran I KNOW really IS a veteran is CSM. I think people NEED to be challenged on their claims - whether on social media or in real life.

Here's my issue with that: It sounds an awful lot like distrust right out of the gate. And how many veterans would just leave instead of staying and posting? I can see if this were solely a military site where people were sharing nothing but military stories - but this is simply a political site.

The next question is WHO would be in charge? Many might not feel comfortable sharing such personal information with strangers, whether their claims are legit or not. I know the longtime members here might feel a bit more comfortable, but a new member just arriving here, why would they feel the need to immediately divulge personal information?

I'm not against it, I'm not military and I don't presume to speak for our veterans. I would be more than happy to allow, say yourself, CSM, Gunny, Gaffer, AT and others to be in charge of such (and perhaps other vets), but all I see happening from that is scaring off potential members. Maybe give the "verified" logo to those willing? I dunno.

And regardless of whether some would like a verification of sorts - I still don't think that means we accuse people of lying about their service.

darin

09-30-2014, 08:16 AM

Here's my issue with that: It sounds an awful lot like distrust right out of the gate. And how many veterans would just leave instead of staying and posting? I can see if this were solely a military site where people were sharing nothing but military stories - but this is simply a political site.

How many vets would simply show a modicum of proof before using the label in attempts to bolster their point of view? How many anything? Nobody ever knows. Quality vs Quantity.

The next question is WHO would be in charge? Many might not feel comfortable sharing such personal information with strangers, whether their claims are legit or not. I know the longtime members here might feel a bit more comfortable, but a new member just arriving here, why would they feel the need to immediately divulge personal information?

I'll be in charge. Many MAY feel comfortable showing a known veteran one document that supports their claim. Nothing is personal; redact the SSN and everything else is FOIA. If a veteran does not wish to divulge the info they are not awared a Service icon under their name. Nobody forces anything. :)

I'm not against it, I'm not military and I don't presume to speak for our veterans. I would be more than happy to allow, say yourself, CSM, Gunny, Gaffer, AT and others to be in charge of such (and perhaps other vets), but all I see happening from that is scaring off potential members. Maybe give the "verified" logo to those willing? I dunno.

And regardless of whether some would like a verification of sorts - I still don't think that means we accuse people of lying about their service.

And hence the logo you mention; "Verified" veteran logo vs those affiliated with service; DoD, spouses, etc - would fall into the latter.

If we're going to award the presumption of authority on military topics that comes with "Army, etc" logos under our names, we owe at the very least to not corrupt the pool with folks like ConHog and that one guy who claimed to be a pastor and Navy LTC.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 08:33 AM

How many vets would simply show a modicum of proof before using the label in attempts to bolster their point of view? How many anything? Nobody ever knows. Quality vs Quantity.

I'll be in charge. Many MAY feel comfortable showing a known veteran one document that supports their claim. Nothing is personal; redact the SSN and everything else is FIOA. If a veteran does not wish to divulge the info they are not awared a Service icon under their name. Nobody forces anything. :)

And hence the logo you mention; "Verified" veteran logo vs those affiliated with service; DoD, spouses, etc - would fall into the latter.

If we're going to award the presumption of authority on military topics that comes with "Army, etc" logos under our names, we owe at the very least to not corrupt the pool with folks like ConHog and that one guy who claimed to be a pastor and Navy LTC.

I have no doubt CH was military, same with maineman.

But what about accusing people - do we do that if they refuse to divulge personal information?

darin

09-30-2014, 08:39 AM

I have no doubt CH was military, same with maineman.

But what about accusing people - do we do that if they refuse to divulge personal information?

No. Effing. WAY ConHog is prior military. NOBODY calls it a 'PT EXAM'...Nobody is a field grade officer (he claimed to be a MAJ, yes?) and carries on the way he did. Same for maineman. Bafoons.

And again; nobody is asking for personal information. I sent my DD214 to CSM; nothing on there was personal information.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 08:42 AM

Last year sometime, I proposed fact-checking on this site and was largely shouted-down. The only other veteran I KNOW really IS a veteran is CSM. I think people NEED to be challenged on their claims - whether on social media or in real life.

Last year sometime, I proposed fact-checking on this site and was largely shouted-down.

I agree with you 100% ... Ive done some real life challenging over the years and its quite easy to detect the frauds.
This thread topic is now being discussed and is not my thread but best way to truly show appreciation for those that truly died and sacrificed is to not let frauds get by with it. I think every site should do diligent research or simply ask for proof before giving great admiration and respect to those that are actually stealing it.

I myself give that respect and do not want to be doing so to any person that is stealing it.

I can go sign up at a new forum right now, say I was Army Ranger, give my rank and service dates , then go on to say I was Special Ops , sniper and etc-- and once gunned down 9 men with my pistol and another 25 with my M16. Next battle I had to bayonet 7 enemy soldiers after my ammo ran out and killed 15 more with my last grenade.

Yet I have never been in the military and have been asked often and always say nope not me. I have friends and family members that served but I never did.

Were it my choice I'd say this --

TRUST BUT VERIFY, seems like that was a big thing once if I recall. Reagan was big on it.. ;)

Not my call, but I'll not give respect unless I think a claimant is real..
Any badgering members to give respect should be admonished too IMHO..
If need be I'll leave first... Just my 2 cents .....-Tyr
AND ALL OF IT IS ON TOPIC. IMAGINE HOW THAT OCCURED?

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 08:43 AM

No. Effing. WAY ConHog is prior military. NOBODY calls it a 'PT EXAM'...Nobody is a field grade officer (he claimed to be a MAJ, yes?) and carries on the way he did. Same for maineman. Bafoons.

And again; nobody is asking for personal information. I sent my DD214 to CSM; nothing on there was personal information.

I had proof from MM and wasn't about to divulge personal information. He was a schmuck of the highest order, but he DID serve in the navy. And this is what scares me, is some people will be convinced another is lying, EVEN WITH another person stating it's true. Admittedly I have less proof from CH, but I knew a little more about him than others, and I believe what I saw from him (pictures).

If a DD214 doesn't have a soldiers name on it, it's useless. If the name is on there, that IS personal information. We even have members here now that I'll guarantee are not comfy with simply giving out their name, both civilians and military.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 08:44 AM

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 08:45 AM

darin

09-30-2014, 08:50 AM

I had proof from MM and wasn't about to divulge personal information. He was a schmuck of the highest order, but he DID serve in the navy. And this is what scares me, is some people will be convinced another is lying, EVEN WITH another person stating it's true. Admittedly I have less proof from CH, but I knew a little more about him than others, and I believe what I saw from him (pictures).

If a DD214 doesn't have a soldiers name on it, it's useless. If the name is on there, that IS personal information. We even have members here now that I'll guarantee are not comfy with simply giving out their name, both civilians and military.

I doubt you had proof Jim - despite what he claimed to have sent you.

If somebody lies about their service - from Rank, jobs, etc, - to the very fact they served or didn't, they deserve to be called on it. A name is not 'personal information'.

Btw, you still didn't address accusations for those that haven't verified...

I don't have to address potential accusations - they haven't happened. IF somebody wants to be a verified veteran they can. If they choose not to, THEY have to deal with the accusations.

Interesting that this fraud, stolen valor, checking identities.... didn't come up again here until a new member joined the board. I know I'm not a veteran, but I feel embarrassed as board owner that we are treating people like this, short of proof, of which there is none.

Because we're 'treating' two members who were BANNED in this way? Nobody else was mentioned in this thread. Frankly, and because I love you, I'm thinking you may wanna consider being MORE embarassed at people like CH and MM claiming shit they didn't have the chops to back up :)

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 08:54 AM

I doubt you had proof Jim - despite what he claimed to have sent you.

So if we'll doubt proof, what's the point in asking anyone for proof?

If somebody lies about their service - from Rank, jobs, etc, - to the very fact they served or didn't, they deserve to be called on it. A name is not 'personal information'.

Considering the harassment I've seen from some, things going to people's employers and such, I would NEVER give out my last name to anyone here unless I trusted them 100%.

I don't have to address potential accusations - they haven't happened. IF somebody wants to be a verified veteran they can. If they choose not to, THEY have to deal with the accusations.

We had 2 members in the last 24 hours alone having their service called into question.

Because we're 'treating' two members who were BANNED in this way? Nobody else was mentioned in this thread. Frankly, and because I love you, I'm thinking you may wanna consider being MORE embarassed at people like CH and MM claiming shit they didn't have the chops to back up :)

No, because 2 members thought of quitting within a few days of joining, this is about CURRENT issues, not the past.

darin

09-30-2014, 09:04 AM

So if we'll doubt proof, what's the point in asking anyone for proof?

No - I doubt anything MM or CH sent you could be 'proof' because those guys are f'ing lying pieces of crap :)

Considering the harassment I've seen from some, things going to people's employers and such, I would NEVER give out my last name to anyone here unless I trusted them 100%.

Fair point.

We had 2 members in the last 24 hours alone having their service called into question.

Justified?

No, because 2 members thought of quitting within a few days of joining, this is about CURRENT issues, not the past.

That'd mean, to ME, they are pussies. If somebody calls into question MY service I show them. (shrug). If they STILL refuse to believe me, I tell them to go f themselves.

"You don't BELIEVE my wild claims of service?? I'm taking my toys and going home!" - said No Veteran, Ever. (unless he/she was Airforce or Coast Guard) (that last bit is a good-natured jab; not a serious insult).

:)

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 09:10 AM

Justified?

Maybe it's just me then, I personally see NO justification without proof.

But I give up. If the vets here want to go with a system to prove that people are who they claim, or denigrate those they have a hunch about, so be it. But I'm not responsible when new members come to this board, and leave within a week as usual. Then another week follows and the discussion turns to how we pat one another on our backs here with no opposing views and such.

And with the military issue aside... We have someone helping get new members here, and we have another person directing members here. Then we have the money I spent in advertising in the past 1 1/2 months. This is a message board, here for people to discuss/debate things. This place WILL end up in the ground if we find new ways to push away new members. It's always that they are lying frauds, or accused of being former members.

I will leave this issue up to the veterans to decide and handle, and I won't step in anymore with disputes or gripes of my own. Like I said, I'm admittedly not military. I'll bow out.

darin

09-30-2014, 09:18 AM

Maybe it's just me then, I personally see NO justification without proof.

But I give up. If the vets here want to go with a system to prove that people are who they claim, or denigrate those they have a hunch about, so be it. But I'm not responsible when new members come to this board, and leave within a week as usual. Then another week follows and the discussion turns to how we pat one another on our backs here with no opposing views and such.

And with the military issue aside... We have someone helping get new members here, and we have another person directing members here. Then we have the money I spent in advertising in the past 1 1/2 months. This is a message board, here for people to discuss/debate things. This place WILL end up in the ground if we find new ways to push away new members. It's always that they are lying frauds, or accused of being former members.

I will leave this issue up to the veterans to decide and handle, and I won't step in anymore with disputes or gripes of my own. Like I said, I'm admittedly not military. I'll bow out.

But you justify naming somebody a veteran without proof, or even evidence? I like new members here. I love seeing fresh blood. What I hate is people using wild claims to get attention:

"I did a bunch of other things in The Service; but those are classified!" (Classified as what? Confidential? Secret? Other? People who do secret shit don't TALK about the secret shit they do; especially as a way to get props/attention)
"I can hit a target with my M16 2000 yards away - I was an Expert Marksman" (when the farthest M16 qual course target is 300m (Army) On top of that, I'd guess 80% of Soldiers score "Expert" on their weapons quals. Seeing an Expert badge is really no big deal."
"I finished Army Boot Camp in 1998!" (The Army doesn't HAVE Boot Camp. The Army has Basic Combat Training - or Basic, or Basic Training. "boot camp" hasn't been used in decades. Although some folks still use it - and some veterans - it's ONE tell the person may not be who he/she claims..)

etc.

Etc.

Make sense?

Go Seahawks!

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 09:20 AM

But you justify naming somebody a veteran without proof, or even evidence? I like new members here. I love seeing fresh blood. What I hate is people using wild claims to get attention:

"I did a bunch of other things in The Service; but those are classified!" (Classified as what? Confidential? Secret? Other? People who do secret shit don't TALK about the secret shit they do; especially as a way to get props/attention)
"I can hit a target with my M16 2000 yards away - I was an Expert Marksman" (when the farthest M16 qual course target is 300m (Army)"
"I finished Army Boot Camp in 1998!" (The Army doesn't HAVE Boot Camp. The Army has Basic Combat Training - or Basic, or Basic Training. "boot camp" hasn't been used in decades. Although some folks still use it - and some veterans - it's ONE tell the person may not be who he/she claims..)

etc.

Etc.

Make sense?

Go Seahawks!

I took your word for it, same for GopJeff, CSM, Gaffer and SO many others over the years. So YES, I do accept without proof, until I have proof of otherwise - the same as I have treated every veteran that has ever crossed this board and my former board.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 09:21 AM

No, because 2 members thought of quitting within a few days of joining, this is about CURRENT issues, not the past.

Then to me you setting up a verification system as suggested by DMP looks like a good option.
That way your stating verified military service logo stands true.
Just a member's two cents tossed in since this thread topic is being discussed ...

If members had verified military service logos then nobody could with any credibility at all question their designation.
If they did then you could take action with them instead.

Looks like a good idea to me but I make no decisions here.

I was however attacked myself and admonished that I was a loser poster when this recent thing started.
A member comes on here telling me tall tales I have a right to questions those tales or else there is no freedom to post/speak here
as you've always stated my friend.
I did not question anybody's service but did question tall tales and then I was jumped on not by admin or you(to your credit) but by another military member here. One I respected greatly once.
Seems to me it is an issue that DMP has a good very solution to. -Tyr

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 09:23 AM

Then to me you setting up a verification system as suggested by DMP looks like a good option.
That way your stating verified military service logo stands true.
Just a member's two cents tossed in since this thread topic is being discussed ...

If members had verified military service logos then nobody could with any credibility at all question their designation.
If they did then you could take action with them instead.

Looks like a good idea to me but I make no decisions here.

I was however attacked myself and admonished that I was a loser poster when this recent thing started.
A member comes on here telling me tall tales I have a right to questions those tales or else there is no freedom to post/speak here
as you've always stated my friend.
I did not question anybody's service but did question tall tales and then I was jumped on not by admin or you(to your credit) but by another military member here. One I respected greatly once.
Seems to me it is an issue that DMP has a good very solution to. -Tyr

I want NO PART of any such demands/requests of members/veterans, but in no way would stand in the way, nor will I complain again if people want to call out members as frauds or accuse them of stolen valor. I bow out of this as non-military.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 09:24 AM

But you justify naming somebody a veteran without proof, or even evidence? I like new members here. I love seeing fresh blood. What I hate is people using wild claims to get attention:

"I did a bunch of other things in The Service; but those are classified!" (Classified as what? Confidential? Secret? Other? People who do secret shit don't TALK about the secret shit they do; especially as a way to get props/attention)
"I can hit a target with my M16 2000 yards away - I was an Expert Marksman" (when the farthest M16 qual course target is 300m (Army) On top of that, I'd guess 80% of Soldiers score "Expert" on their weapons quals. Seeing an Expert badge is really no big deal."
"I finished Army Boot Camp in 1998!" (The Army doesn't HAVE Boot Camp. The Army has Basic Combat Training - or Basic, or Basic Training. "boot camp" hasn't been used in decades. Although some folks still use it - and some veterans - it's ONE tell the person may not be who he/she claims..)

etc.

Etc.

Make sense?

Go Seahawks!
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to dmp again.-Tyr

darin

09-30-2014, 09:48 AM

I took your word for it, same for GopJeff, CSM, Gaffer and SO many others over the years. So YES, I do accept without proof, until I have proof of otherwise - the same as I have treated every veteran that has ever crossed this board and my former board.

with Me and Jeff - you had us blatantly discuss our service.

And with CSM and Gaffer and OTHERS - you can just kinda TELL. I mean, there are outliers for sure, but the way, say, CSM conducts himself here - he's consistent. And he's reasonable, rational, and intelligent.

Very few fools make it up the ladder on active duty.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 09:49 AM

B"I can hit a target with my M16 2000 yards away - I was an Expert Marksman" (when the farthest M16 qual course target is 300m (Army) On top of that, I'd guess 80% of Soldiers score "Expert" on their weapons quals. Seeing an Expert badge is really no big deal."
"I finished Army Boot Camp in 1998!" (The Army doesn't HAVE Boot Camp. The Army has Basic Combat Training - or Basic, or Basic Training. "boot camp" hasn't been used in decades. Although some folks still use it - and some veterans - it's ONE tell the person may not be who he/she claims..)

I just did searches and can't find it. I'm not debating, just can't find it. But can you show me where this member mentioned an M16? Or the boot camp discussion? The only reference of recent I can find is AT stating that term, but he was Navy, so understood.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 09:51 AM

Shadow

09-30-2014, 09:58 AM

Interesting that this fraud, stolen valor, checking identities.... didn't come up again here until a new member joined the board. I know I'm not a veteran, but I feel embarrassed as board owner that we are treating people like this, short of proof, of which there is none.
I agree with you Jim. These jokers take this " stolen valor" shit on the road. They have done it elsewhere also. It is used as a form of harrasment and nothing more. And as an aside...speaking as someone who had their personal information dug up and given out by assholes on message boards. NO WAY in hell would I agree to give anything out that is of a personal nature to ANYONE on the internet. Period.

red state

09-30-2014, 09:58 AM

Can't say that there's much to add to the great posts before this insignificant one except....I agree. The board should simply drop the insignia thing or VERIFY before handing them out.

I never knew for sure but ALWAYS suspected that CONhog was exactly that........a CON. I suspect this about other blow-hards as well but that doesn't make me right or wrong and it shouldn't upset them that others (such as AT) care enough to seek the truth or challenge one's "statement" (NOT rank or service) as BS. That's just the way I see it and until Jim makes a decision, I'll let those who actually served the military (TRULY SERVED) seek what they rather have. I'm out.....and will stick to topics I KNOW, such as how to shoot a bow, rifle, gun and THE breeze. Ya'll have at it.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 10:05 AM

"I can hit a target with my M16 2000 yards away - I was an Expert Marksman" (when the farthest M16 qual course target is 300m (Army) On top of that, I'd guess 80% of Soldiers score "Expert" on their weapons quals. Seeing an Expert badge is really no big deal."
"I finished Army Boot Camp in 1998!" (The Army doesn't HAVE Boot Camp. The Army has Basic Combat Training - or Basic, or Basic Training. "boot camp" hasn't been used in decades. Although some folks still use it - and some veterans - it's ONE tell the person may not be who he/she claims..)

I honestly didn't read EVERY thread in the past week, nor do I want to, and my searches came up empty. Can those in the know please link me to where these things were discussed?

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 10:14 AM

with Me and Jeff - you had us blatantly discuss our service.

And with CSM and Gaffer and OTHERS - you can just kinda TELL. I mean, there are outliers for sure, but the way, say, CSM conducts himself here - he's consistent. And he's reasonable, rational, and intelligent.

Very few fools make it up the ladder on active duty.

I merely questioned tall tales myself and was jumped on. Nobody can shoot 2 inch groups with a 50 CAL RIFLE AT RANGE OF 3,280 FEET ALL DAY LONG. THE WIND VARIATIONS AND SHIFTS WOULD PREVENT THAT. I KNEW THAT RIGHT OFF. I have friends that competition shoot and 3 of them verified and told me that claim was rubbish.
I've been here three years and have absolutely no doubt about the military service of those you named but when somebody tells fantastic feats I call 'em on it be the military, ex-military or civilian. Especially if its firearms related , primarily shooting.
There are some things this 'ole boy knows from experience. A bull-shitter artist I can spot a mile away.
My two best friends in the world (both deceased now) were honorable , decorated combat veterans. Outside my father and grandfather the two best men I've ever known. Both would have called bullshit on such tall tales. And both would not have taken kindly to being ridiculed for their opinion and doubts. In fact , if face to face either those men would have taken immediate action if insulted like that.

I read Jim's reply to me and its good enough for me. I take him at his word!!
The man has never lied to me and stood on his principles each time I was wrongly blasted.
Even blasted me good once and he was right to!
I admire that greatly whether the guy is military or not. - :beer: -Tyr

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 10:16 AM

I merely questioned tall tales myself and was jumped on. Nobody can shoot 2 inch groups with a 50 CAL RIFLE AT RANGE OF 3,280 FEET ALL DAY LONG.

Darin mentioned an M16, and then used an example to prove his point, but now you say it was a .50 cal. Do we know for sure, as I can't find it? And can you lead me to where this discussion took place about boot camp?

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 10:19 AM

I am done posting in this thread. I read Jim's reply to me and its good enough for me. I take him at his word!!
The man has never lied to me and stood on his principles each time I was wrongly blasted.
Even blasted me good once and he was right to!

Tyr, understand, this isn't about me taking sides, I hope you know that. If you read in the thread about Hitler/Bush comparison, you'll see I had my issues too. I have NO reason to side with anyone at this point. I would rather play "wait an see" and wait on facts, as things like this tend to always show the truth and work themselves out.

But my main point is - equality. I don't want to call you out, or aboutime, Darin - or any new members - unless I have proof. And if circumstantial, it should be GREAT circumstantial evidence. I'm already seeing differing reasons as to why some may not believe him - and as non-military - even I know the distance in shooting a .50 cal and an M16 is a great distance. I just would want to be 100% certain before I make any such accusation towards someone.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 10:23 AM

I agree with you Jim. These jokers take this " stolen valor" shit on the road. They have done it elsewhere also. It is used as a form of harrasment and nothing more. And as an aside...speaking as someone who had their personal information dug up and given out by assholes on message boards. NO WAY in hell would I agree to give anything out that is of a personal nature to ANYONE on the internet. Period.

That's your opinion and you are welcomed to it.
I strongly disagree with it myself.
WE owe it to the real heroes that sacrificed so damn much to not just let any fool claim falsely to gain the admiration and respect for the valor/sacrifice/service that the real guys earned .

Correction --- maybe not -WE- but as for me I hold that as a solid truth myself...
I'll not stand by to just let my friends and the service of my family members be stolen like that.. -Tyr

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 10:30 AM

Tyr, understand, this isn't about me taking sides, I hope you know that. If you read in the thread about Hitler/Bush comparison, you'll see I had my issues too. I have NO reason to side with anyone at this point. I would rather play "wait an see" and wait on facts, as things like this tend to always show the truth and work themselves out.

But my main point is - equality. I don't want to call you out, or aboutime, Darin - or any new members - unless I have proof. And if circumstantial, it should be GREAT circumstantial evidence. I'm already seeing differing reasons as to why some may not believe him - and as non-military - even I know the distance in shooting a .50 cal and an M16 is a great distance. I just would want to be 100% certain before I make any such accusation towards someone.

Ok, Jim.. unless something major occurs here in this thread I've said my piece but will respond if attacked or need be to my other posts responded to here in this thread.

My two best friends are passed on now but Ill not put up with the real valor stealers stealing from both those men (I'll fight any man alive that disrespects either of them) and I'll never respect such ffing vermin that try to steal what they earned no matter who asks nicely or even demands that I do. I just don't play that way.-Tyr

later , man I am busy today.. late now..

Shadow

09-30-2014, 10:32 AM

That's your opinion and you are welcomed to it.
I strongly disagree with it myself.
WE owe it to the real heroes that sacrificed so damn much to not just let any fool claim falsely to gain the admiration and respect for the valor/sacrifice/service that the real guys earned .

Correction --- maybe not -WE- but as for me I hold that as a solid truth myself...
I'll not stand by to just let my friends and the service of my family members be stolen like that.. -Tyr
I'm pretty sure our military men are capable of defending themselves if they see fit and don't need some internet warrior to battle for them under some faux "stolen valor" BS. That crap would carry more weight if you didn't already abuse it by running to other boards chasing down posters to harass them with it.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 10:34 AM

Ok, Jim.. unless something major occurs here in this thread I've said my piece but will respond if attacked or need be to my other posts responded to here in this thread.

My two best friends are passed on now but Ill not put up with the real valor stealers stealing from both those men (I'll fight any man alive that disrespects either of them) and I'll never respect such ffing vermin that try to steal what they earned no matter who asks nicely or even demands that I do. I just don't play that way.-Tyr

later , man I am busy today.. late now..

Alright, I just felt that if accusations were made about M16's and boot camp, I'm looking for the quotes to be posted, so that I can make a more informed opinion. If what Darin posts is true, he should have known these things. But let's make sure these accusations are true first - hence me simply asking for links to where the M16 and boot camp was discussed. I'll keep looking, but so far only found discussion about a water tower and shooting, but I can't find the guns and boot camp stuff yet.

darin

09-30-2014, 10:40 AM

I honestly didn't read EVERY thread in the past week, nor do I want to, and my searches came up empty. Can those in the know please link me to where these things were discussed?

Nobody said those things - those are the kinds of things that send my spidey-sense into a frenzy; those are things that call into question one's claimed military background.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 11:04 AM

Jim. I agree. And, if you read what I originally said concerning Stolen Valor. I DID NOT call anyone a fraud. I would never do that to another veteran. But, as you may soon learn. Sadly. There are possibly thousands of SELF-PROCLAIMED Veterans out there today who are STEALING the VALOR of others.
I am, and always will be suspicious...as everyone should. Even those who take OFFENSE and try to distract attention away from them.
If they are proud of their service, and have nothing to hide. Most Veterans know....those who feel they must BRAG the most. Generally are later found to be ...SHALL WE SAY..."Less than honorable?"

Nothing more. Nothing less.

In many ways. This topic is much like the RACIST, RACE CARD discussions that are quickly shut-down, and prevented when the offended declare RACISM. Which stops all conversations.

Every veteran on this board is a "self-proclaimed" veteran. Correct? That would include YOU.

What I call it is making accusations with nothing but closed-minded suspicion directed at anyone who doesn't parrot the party line.

So let's get something straight: I'm not defending his service. I'm defending people's right to post here every bit as much as you without being questioned or personally attacked about anything. And I would think the most obvious of all ... you'd let those that are in the Army and/or have served in ground combat decide whether or not this guy's full of it. And DON'T start whining. I'm not questioning YOUR service. BUT there ain't a whole lot of ground combat going on a couple of miles out to sea.

darin

09-30-2014, 11:12 AM

I am not a self-proclaimed Veteran. My service has been verified by active and former members.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 11:22 AM

I am not a self-proclaimed Veteran. My service has been verified by active and former members.

There's one active member left that can confirm mine as well.

And I saw this one on TV...

Dance With the Devil

Just because John Wayne supposedly played a character based on your father in the movies - a World War II admiral hero who whipped into shape the Fighting Seabees -it doesn't mean you have to follow in his daunting footsteps.
But John Perry –Admiral John Perry – did just that. A Navy man whose badges of honor earned him an enviable kind of all access backstage pass to life that made doors open, sitting presidents salute and certain women--one in particular--glow to simply be in his company.
Barbara Bentley would be swept away by John's ease and command. But she'd also be swept into the swirling tide of his mysterious and secretive life ... and a world of subterfuge and intrigue it would take her decades to surface from.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/31130493/ns/dateline_nbc-crime_reports/t/dance-devil/#.VCrYihZht8F

This dude had top officials and Navy brass fooled.

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 11:30 AM

It would never occur to me to question that Darin, Gunny, CSM and Gaffer served. I'm not infallible, but I've lived long enough to be a fairly good judge of people, and can sense when people are "protest(ing) too much".

Btw, I remember some long-gone member questioning my being a lawyer. I know, not the same as being military, but still rather annoying. I let it slide, as I know who and what I am.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 12:10 PM

I'm pretty sure our military men are capable of defending themselves if they see fit and don't need some internet warrior to battle for them under some faux "stolen valor" BS. That crap would carry more weight if you didn't already abuse it by running to other boards chasing down posters to harass them with it.

I do believe my reply to you was civil yet you come with this crap..
ok, bring the proof..
And name who exactly I chased down . I can wait..
Ive not chased anybody down ever from one board to another . So you lie right there.

By the way genius, I didnt start this stolen valor thread or conversation nor did I do anything other than question a couple tall tales.
5 knife kills, 2inch groups at 3,280 all day long with 50 cal rifle, and his amazing --"one shot -one kill baby" comment.
and lets just throw in the Mossad claim too, shall we.. Seem to recall something about undercover terrorist crap too -can check that later.

Not a damn one of those called in question his service but rather his bragging.

You defend him like its personal.

Where da meat??? -Tyr

Gaffer

09-30-2014, 12:12 PM

I don't question someones military service. I may question what they claim to have done. I take what they say with a grain or salt. Everyone perceives things differently. Some just have to exaggerate to make themselves look impressive or boost their own ego.

I like hearing from other veterans, my questions would be what unit were you with? Where were you deployed? When? I don't need details of heroism. I also don't want to hear "that's classified" cause if you have been out more than a year it ain't classified any more. Most of what's classified now days is not for national security but for political reasons.

I don't need to see a DD214 as proof of service. Simply discussing things military will tell me all I need to know. Bragging or acting mysterious doesn't impress me. Personally I like hearing about peoples experience in the military whether they were front line combat troops or in the rear with the gear. It all works toward the same end. Those that didn't really serve will always expose themselves eventually. Those that feel they have to embellish their service I just feel sorry for.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 12:18 PM

I do believe my reply to you was civil yet you come with this crap..
ok, bring the proof..
And name who exactly I chased down . I can wait..
Ive not chased anybody down ever from one board to another . So you lie right there.

By the way genius, I didnt start this stolen valor thread or conversation nor did I do anything other than question a couple tall tales.
5 knife kills, 2inch groups at 3,280 all day long with 50 cal rifle, and his amazing --"one shot -one kill baby" comment.
and lets just throw in the Mossad claim too, shall we.. Seem to recall something about undercover terrorist crap too -can check that later.

Not a damn one of those called in question his service but rather his bragging.

You defend him like its personal.

Where da meat??? -Tyr

I'll defend HER like it's personal. That work for you?

You jumped right on AT's gravy train. Why don't you run on down to the steel cage and read how to go about it the right way?

Shadow

09-30-2014, 12:21 PM

I do believe my reply to you was civil yet you come with this crap..
ok, bring the proof..
And name who exactly I chased down . I can wait..
Ive not chased anybody down ever from one board to another . So you lie right there.

By the way genius, I didnt start this stolen valor thread or conversation nor did I do anything other than question a couple tall tales.
5 knife kills, 2inch groups at 3,280 all day long with 50 cal rifle, and his amazing --"one shot -one kill baby" comment.
and lets just throw in the Mossad claim too, shall we.. Seem to recall something about undercover terrorist crap too -can check that later.

Not a damn one of those called in question his service but rather his bragging.

You defend him like its personal.

Where da meat??? -Tyr

Oh...so it's just a coinky dink that someone that posts just like you...with back up that posts exactly like one of your " buddies " comes to another board ranting on and on about "stolen valor" . Not for honorable reasons mind you ...but in the pursuit of pussy. Then just happens to drag said pussy back to this board. Ah...okay....whatever you say. LMBO.

darin

09-30-2014, 12:26 PM

Gawd I need to frequent other boards...ALL this DRAMA! :D

Hi Shadow!

Gunny

09-30-2014, 12:38 PM

Gawd I need to frequent other boards...ALL this DRAMA! :D

Hi Shadow!

Boring day. :)

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 01:12 PM

It would never occur to me to question that Darin, Gunny, and CSM served. I'm not infallible, but I've lived long enough to be a fairly good judge of people, and can sense when people are "protest(ing) too much".

Btw, I remember some long-gone member questioning my being a lawyer. I know, not the same as being military, but still rather annoying. I let it slide, as I know who and what I am.

And your response would be what, if others demanded seeing a copy of your bar exam results, or degree? There are lots of people out on the 'net acting as wannabe lawyers (not you), so I can see that when someone is presenting a debate, and claims to be an attorney, that one might want proof....

Is it the same, no. Would YOU, even if military or lawyer - divulge YOUR private information to a board full of strangers? Or even friends you've known for years?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 01:19 PM

And your response would be what, if others demanded seeing a copy of your bar exam results, or degree? There are lots of people out on the 'net acting as wannabe lawyers (not you), so I can see that when someone is presenting a debate, and claims to be an attorney, that one might want proof....

Is it the same, no. Would YOU, even if military or lawyer - divulge YOUR private information to a board full of strangers? Or even friends you've known for years?

Nope.

Like you, I see no difference. What would it take? Copy of my ID card? DD214? To the mentality of people demanding them, their next accusation would be they were photo shopped.

Witch-hunters are never satisfied when determined to discount and/or vilify.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 01:21 PM

Nope.

Like you, I see no difference. What would it take? Copy of my ID card? DD214? To the mentality of people demanding them, their next accusation would be they were photo shopped.

Witch-hunters are never satisfied when determined to discount and/or vilify.

And IF someone wants a DD214?

https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=A0LEV01F9CpUanoAubNXNyoA?p=my+dd214&fr=yfp-t-901&fr2=piv-web

Not only photoshopped, but real ones out there too. Just as an example, of course depending on specifics. Suppose I show up, solely introduce myself with a screen name, say I don't talk much about my military background, and go to Google....

http://www.dd-692.com/images/memorabilia/wm02.jpg

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 01:23 PM

Gunny

09-30-2014, 01:25 PM

And IF someone wants a DD214?

https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=A0LEV01F9CpUanoAubNXNyoA?p=my+dd214&fr=yfp-t-901&fr2=piv-web

Not only photoshopped, but real ones out there too. Just as an example, of course depending on specifics. Suppose I show up, solely introduce myself with a screen name, say I don't talk much about my military background, and go to Google....

http://www.dd-692.com/images/memorabilia/wm02.jpg

I'd say looking at the 26 Feb 32 DOB you were O-L-D. :laugh:

You're going to have to work a little harder, Jim. The form is even different now. :laugh:

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 01:26 PM

I'd say looking at the 26 Feb 32 DOB you were O-L-D. :laugh:

You're going to have to work a little harder, Jim. The form is even different now. :laugh:

LOL, my point is that a simple search turns up TONS of them, from various times...

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 01:28 PM

And your response would be what, if others demanded seeing a copy of your bar exam results, or degree? There are lots of people out on the 'net acting as wannabe lawyers (not you), so I can see that when someone is presenting a debate, and claims to be an attorney, that one might want proof....

Is it the same, no. Would YOU, even if military or lawyer - divulge YOUR private information to a board full of strangers? Or even friends you've known for years?

Jim, you know me well enough by now to know that I would decline any such request, and carry on. It isn't going to matter much to to me if some anonymous message board person wants to question my accomplishments. I guess the difference is that when you are confident in who and what you are, people who do those things won't chase you away.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 01:28 PM

LOL, my point is that a simple search turns up TONS of them, from various times...

:)

revelarts

09-30-2014, 01:44 PM

http://www.cmohs.org/recipient-archive.php

I mean seriously. How did he get so far?

It would never occur to me to question that Darin, Gunny, and CSM served. I'm not infallible, but I've lived long enough to be a fairly good judge of people, and can sense when people are "protest(ing) too much".

Btw, I remember some long-gone member questioning my being a lawyer. I know, not the same as being military, but still rather annoying. I let it slide, as I know who and what I am.
I'm sure all the people around the fake navy seal that had the training school and went to Africa and loaded up big $$$ for his protection agency, felt they were pretty good judge's of people as well.

but they fell for it while looking the guy in the eye.
How much less info are we working with online just chatting.

Here it's FAR less consequential if someone is lying.
Frankly I give everyone the benny of the doubt until my BS detectors go off, or odd contradictions keep poping into the chat.

But in the "real world" you can't just rely on your gut when your shipping off to Africa , or loading up some funds into a biz deal or in some other serious venture. you've got to show me the documentation of of your credentials, no offense but as Reagan said "trust but verify".

it's one reason why on a political level I really can't stand the "he's the kinda guy/gal i like" so I'll vote for them mentality. I've worked with some very charming and fun at parties SOBs that i would not trust my wife with or loan my car to. that knowledge came from seeing what they did not what they said or how they presented in public. Heck i was in church once where the College professors and highly degreed pastorial search committee picked a guy that turned out to be a con-man who had FORGED his own papers from various universities. They never bothered to check with the schools or inquiry very deeply into his requirement to go home to New York every month.... where he was checking in with his parole officer. Well they didn't start to check until they found the church treasury light a few 1000 every month and a new car leased in the churches name without approval etc..

But the man came across dignified, charming and "inspirational". I didn't vote for the guy because he was to liberal, light with scripture and a bit swarmy. The far less dignified and less lettered but sincere assistant pastor, that we all had known for years, made a WHOLE lot more sense to me and... well.. but i digress.

All that to say the gut check is a great 1st review but we've got to see the proof and docs if were going to be sure.

Things are not always as good or as bad as or guts tell us they 1st appear.

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 01:46 PM

I'm sure all the people around the fake navy seal that had the training school and went to Africa and loaded up big $$$ for his protection agency, felt they were pretty good judge's of people as well.

but they fell for it while looking the guy in the eye.
How much less info are we working with online just chatting.

Here it's FAR less consequential if someone is lying.
Frankly I give everyone the benny of the doubt until my BS detectors go off.

But in the "real world" you can't just rely on your gut when your shipping off to Africa , or loading up some funds into a biz deal or in some other serious venture. you've got to show me the documentation of of your credentials, no offense but as Reagan said "trust but verify".

it's one reason why on a political level I really can't stand the "he's the kinda guy/gal i like" so I'll vote for them mentality. I've worked with some very charming and fun at parties SOBs that i would not trust my wife with or loan my car to. that knowledge came from seeing what they did not what they said or acted in public. Heck i was in church once where the College professors and highly degreed pastorial search committee picked a guy that turned out to be a con-man who had FORGED his own papers from various universities. They never bothered to check with the schools or inquiry very deeply into his requirement to go home to New York every month.... where he was checking in with his parole officer.

But the man came across dignified, charming and "inspirational". I didn't vote for the guy because he was to liberal, light with scripture and a bit swarmy. The far less dignified and less lettered but sincere assistant pastor, that we all had known for years, made a WHOLE lot more sense to me and... well.. but i digress.

All that to say the gut check is a great 1st review but we've got to see the proof and docs if were going to be sure.

Things are not always as good or as bad as or guts tell us they 1st appear.

Why Rev, are you saying we need to check out Darin, Gunny, CSM and Gaffer? :eek:

I am sorry that your gut isn't operating as well as mine. :laugh2:

revelarts

09-30-2014, 01:55 PM

Why Rev, are you saying we need to check out Darin, Gunny, CSM and Gaffer? :eek:

I am sorry that your gut isn't operating as well as mine. :laugh2:

See .. ok Abby, did i say that:rolleyes:
no i didn't

as i said i give people the benny of the doubt online. Unless other wised noted.
Darin, Gunny, CSM and Gaffer give me know cause to question.

BUT if we're going to be absolutely SURE... welllll.
no offense.

if $$$ on the line or they're going to marry a family member, I need more than my trusty gut feeling to go by.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 01:56 PM

I'm sure all the people around the fake navy seal that had the training school and went to Africa and loaded up big $$$ for his protection agency, felt they were pretty good judge's of people as well.

but they fell for it while looking the guy in the eye.
How much less info are we working with online just chatting.

Here it's FAR less consequential if someone is lying.
Frankly I give everyone the benny of the doubt until my BS detectors go off, or odd contradictions keep poping into the chat.

But in the "real world" you can't just rely on your gut when your shipping off to Africa , or loading up some funds into a biz deal or in some other serious venture. you've got to show me the documentation of of your credentials, no offense but as Reagan said "trust but verify".

it's one reason why on a political level I really can't stand the "he's the kinda guy/gal i like" so I'll vote for them mentality. I've worked with some very charming and fun at parties SOBs that i would not trust my wife with or loan my car to. that knowledge came from seeing what they did not what they said or how they presented in public. Heck i was in church once where the College professors and highly degreed pastorial search committee picked a guy that turned out to be a con-man who had FORGED his own papers from various universities. They never bothered to check with the schools or inquiry very deeply into his requirement to go home to New York every month.... where he was checking in with his parole officer.

But the man came across dignified, charming and "inspirational". I didn't vote for the guy because he was to liberal, light with scripture and a bit swarmy. The far less dignified and less lettered but sincere assistant pastor, that we all had known for years, made a WHOLE lot more sense to me and... well.. but i digress.

All that to say the gut check is a great 1st review but we've got to see the proof and docs if were going to be sure.

Things are not always as good or as bad as or guts tell us they 1st appear.

Thanks for making my point, rev. Bullshit. The vets on this board know who is and isn't. You don't need to see crap that wouldn't mean a thing to you anyway. What you DON'T do is go attacking someone claiming they know or are something for some petty personal reason making irrelevant, wild-ass accusations without proof.

But if you're going to question anyone's service, start with gaffer so the rest of us can take the day off. :)

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:01 PM

See .. ok Abby, did i say that:rolleyes:
no i didn't

as i said i give people the benny of the doubt online. Unless other wised noted.
Darin, Gunny, CSM and Gaffer give me know cause to question.

BUT if we're going to be absolutely SURE... welllll.
no offense.

if $$$ on the line or they're going to marry a family member, I need more than my trusty gut feeling to go by.

Wouldn't common sense dictate if they were going to marry a family member you might know a little more about them than what's on a message board? I'd say most of us at least have a set of cammies, and a service uniform left. 782 gear we "acquired". Dog tags. ID cards. We tend to go on and off base which YOU can't. Hell, my truck's still registered on base and I have a base sticker on the center of the windshield.

Might be a few more clues in real life.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 02:06 PM

Wouldn't common sense dictate if they were going to marry a family member you might know a little more about them than what's on a message board? I'd say most of us at least have a set of cammies, and a service uniform left. 782 gear we "acquired". Dog tags. ID cards. We tend to go on and off base which YOU can't. Hell, my truck's still registered on base and I have a base sticker on the center of the windshield.

Might be a few more clues in real life.

Gunny. If the wind is blowing in the right direction at 8 a.m. Each morning during the Summer, window's open months. We can hear COLORS over the NAS public address system. Wonder how many people even know what the rules are...if you hear COLORS?
Speaking of dress uniforms. I managed to OUTGROW all of them after my heart attack, and stopped smoking. Those 13 buttons on the bell-bottom blues WILL NEVER MEET again.:laugh:
A great reminder never sounds bad to me.

revelarts

09-30-2014, 02:07 PM

Thanks for making my point, rev. Bullshit. The vets on this board know who is and isn't. You don't need to see crap that wouldn't mean a thing to you anyway. What you DON'T do is go attacking someone claiming they know or are something for some petty personal reason making irrelevant, wild-ass accusations without proof.

But if you're going to question anyone's service, start with gaffer so the rest of us can take the day off. :)

geez, Gunny, I haven't been a part of the personal beef here AT ALL.
I've said TWICE... and now a 3rd time... i give you & others here the benny of the doubt.

Heck if really wanted to question any of you're services ....have you known me to be shy with questions or digging for facts?

and i think if you reread what i said you'd agree with it.
So stand down soldier.

....
just to clarify WHY i've post the vids i posted and such, (maybe dig my hole deeper with this crowd)
some here seem to imply that its wrong/offensive to ever question anyone about their service or accounts.
My point is simply that there ARE fakes and liars out there. not necessarily here, but people come and go here too.

darin

09-30-2014, 02:16 PM

So stand down soldier.

...point of order. He's a Sailor. :)

revelarts

09-30-2014, 02:26 PM

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:31 PM

geez, Gunny, I haven't been a part of the personal beef here AT ALL.
I've said TWICE... and now a 3rd time... i give you & others here the benny of the doubt.

Heck if really wanted to question any of you're services ....have you known me to be shy with questions or digging for facts?

and i think if you reread what i said you'd agree with it.
So stand down soldier.

....
just to clarify WHY i've post the vids i posted and such, (maybe dig my hole deeper with this crowd)
some here seem to imply that its wrong/offensive to ever question anyone about their service or accounts.
My point is simply that there ARE fakes and liars out there. not necessarily here, but people come and go here too.

You must not read too well, rev .... I'm not a "Soldier". ;)

Here's how you DON'T make a deeper hole .... ask a respectful question instead of making an accusation. You can go look at the questions I posed in the steel cage, and how I posted them. I asked for clarification. I didn't accuse.

Oh, and questioning someone about their service and questioning their service period are two, entirely different things.

darin

09-30-2014, 02:34 PM

Oh, and questioning someone about their service and questioning their service period are two, entirely different things.

...and if their words- their claimed service does not add up, OR they refuse to answer specific or even general but pointed questions about their service...what then?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:34 PM

Absolutely, that's my point, in real life we could know more, THAT'S IT.
I'm not making an accusation just pointing out a fact.

Okay. Here's a fact I'll point out to you:

This IS a message board. Now unless you're saying someone on this board is marrying one of your kin .... I'm not seeing the relevance to your point.

revelarts

09-30-2014, 02:37 PM

.. We tend to go on and off base which YOU can't. ...

Well it depends on what base and when you're talking about.
I've been on and off bases with only a driver license.

Heck I've been into Langley with only a drivers license... been a while though.
Trying to remember if i was on base at Quantico with someone in the military or not.

And I suspect i could climb the fence . like those folks at the whitehouse, at more than a few bases.
Some i wouldn't what to try it though.

I had a flat once in front of some generals house OFF base near Oceana VB Va and got the 3rd degree from some Airforce MP .

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:38 PM

...and if their words- their claimed service does not add up, OR they refuse to answer specific or even general but pointed questions about their service...what then?

Looks pretty simple to me. I asked simple, basic questions pertaining to ground combat based in HIS statements. I gave in a call-out with the mention function in the thread so he can't say he didn't see it.

ANY grunt I know could easily answer all of those questions without deflecting and/or falling back on ComSec.

I predict he will either explain, or find another place to post.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:43 PM

Shadow

09-30-2014, 02:44 PM

Gawd I need to frequent other boards...ALL this DRAMA! :D

Hi Shadow!
Actually you aren't missing much unless you miss grade school that is : )

Hi Darin

revelarts

09-30-2014, 02:49 PM

Okay. Here's a fact I'll point out to you:

This IS a message board. Now unless you're saying someone on this board is marrying one of your kin .... I'm not seeing the relevance to your point.

my point is that there' no way for ME or others to KNOW if anyone is what they say.
And if someone... not me... were to question someone about it, especially after extravagant claims, then it's not an outrageous offense to do so since FACTUALLY we have very little to verify OR DENY the claims either way.

ok?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:50 PM

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 02:51 PM

Well it depends on what base and when you're talking about.
I've been on and off bases with only a driver license.

Heck I've been into Langley with only a drivers license... been a while though.
Trying to remember if i was on base at Quantico with someone in the military or not.

And I suspect i could climb the fence . like those folks at the whitehouse, at more than a few bases.
Some i wouldn't what to try it though.

I had a flat once in front of some generals house OFF base near Oceana VB Va and got the 3rd degree from some Airforce MP .

Rev, I'm sitting here trying to picture YOU at LANGLEY, and it just makes me want to giggle like a school girl.

Abbey Marie

09-30-2014, 02:54 PM

Hey, why wasn't I warned that it's Testy Tuesday? Or is it Touchy Tuesday?
Thin-skinned Tuesday?

:laugh2:

Gunny

09-30-2014, 02:56 PM

Rev, I'm sitting here trying to picture YOU at LANGLEY, and it just makes me want to giggle like a school girl.

It's an Air Force Base. He'll fit right in. :laugh:

revelarts

09-30-2014, 02:56 PM

Got a base sticker on your windshield?

Langley, huh? AFB? on Mercury Blvd in Hampton?
no stickers on my car,
Yes in Hampton but there are a couple entrances to Langley none from Mercury.
I usually went in through the connector road (name? ya got me) when i was going.
My Grandmother worked in one of the cafeterias and I worked at the area newspaper.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 02:58 PM

And he's logged in now. So, let's see what he has to say.

The cage doesn't show up in new posts and searches - I just sent him a link to that thread/post, as I wasn't sure if he would see it or not.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 03:00 PM

no stickers on my car,
Yes in Hampton but there are a couple entrances to Langley none from Mercury.
I usually went in through the connector road (name? ya got me) when i was going.
My Grandmother worked in one of the cafeterias and I worked at the area newspaper.

Then it was off Hampton Blvd. Hey, I was at NWTC Little Creek in the 80s, give me a break. Trips the Peninsula were not exactly on my radar. I usually went as far as Fisherman's Warf on Wiloughby Spit. Nothing on the other side of that tunnel I need to see except King's Dominion.

Born2DecadesLate

09-30-2014, 03:03 PM

Darin mentioned an M16, and then used an example to prove his point, but now you say it was a .50 cal. Do we know for sure, as I can't find it? And can you lead me to where this discussion took place about boot camp?

Yes, I made the comment about the .50, I honestly don't remember the distance mentioned. I didn't think anyone meant I could literally perform the task all day long. Kind of like when you were younger and you told a woman "you could go all night long" no one actually thought you literally meant ALL NIGHT LONG.

Now, I am BRAND NEW to this internet thing. I'm freshly retired and bored while looking for the next big thing. However, I do know enough to know that giving out even the most basic of personal information is stupid.

If members feel that strongly about it, Jim remove my avatar and I will simply not discuss my military experiences. Problem solved.

And DMP for your information, nearly every guy I served with referred to basic training as boot camp. No different than many other short hand terms for things. Your theory that that is a tell of a fake is pretty silly given that if someone was entirely concerned with being seen as legit they would probably spend time online making sure they got terminology exactly right.

Now, it seems to me that most of you know each other, and probably know who you are comfortable showing private information to, and that's fine and dandy, but I don't know you at all. Why would I feel comfortable? DMP for all I know , YOU could be the fake, I mean I've barely seen you post, why would I feel comfortable showing you my private information? And frankly, a DD214 doesn't mean anything. A 12 year old with a decent laser printer and photoshop could create one in a hurry, so...

Anyway, maybe message boards aren't for me. I'm used to trusting people until they give you a reason not to.

You guys have a great evening.

revelarts

09-30-2014, 03:06 PM

Then it was off Hampton Blvd. Hey, I was at NWTC Little Creek in the 80s, give me a break. Trips the Peninsula were not exactly on my radar. I usually went as far as Fisherman's Warf on Wiloughby Spit. Nothing on the other side of that tunnel I need to see except King's Dominion.

I hear ya, most people try not to cross the tunnels if they don't have to.
And sadly Fisherman's Warf was closed and torn down in the 90's sometime after you left.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 03:14 PM

Yes, I made the comment about the .50, I honestly don't remember the distance mentioned. I didn't think anyone meant I could literally perform the task all day long. Kind of like when you were younger and you told a woman "you could go all night long" no one actually thought you literally meant ALL NIGHT LONG.

Now, I am BRAND NEW to this internet thing. I'm freshly retired and bored while looking for the next big thing. However, I do know enough to know that giving out even the most basic of personal information is stupid.

If members feel that strongly about it, Jim remove my avatar and I will simply not discuss my military experiences. Problem solved.

And DMP for your information, nearly every guy I served with referred to basic training as boot camp. No different than many other short hand terms for things. Your theory that that is a tell of a fake is pretty silly given that if someone was entirely concerned with being seen as legit they would probably spend time online making sure they got terminology exactly right.

Now, it seems to me that most of you know each other, and probably know who you are comfortable showing private information to, and that's fine and dandy, but I don't know you at all. Why would I feel comfortable? DMP for all I know , YOU could be the fake, I mean I've barely seen you post, why would I feel comfortable showing you my private information? And frankly, a DD214 doesn't mean anything. A 12 year old with a decent laser printer and photoshop could create one in a hurry, so...

Anyway, maybe message boards aren't for me. I'm used to trusting people until they give you a reason not to.

You guys have a great evening.

Not going to work. Go to the steel cage, off-topic 9-28 posts, page 2. You can answer every question I asked without divulging any personal information, nor violating anything classified.

The ball's in YOUR court. Saying "believe me or delete my account" doesn't exactly work in your favor.

Yes, we all know each other. Quite a few of us for about 10 years as a matter of fact. Half of us are vets. I've offered you the opportunity to shut your detractors up with questions any LCpl could answer.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 03:16 PM

Not going to work. Go to the steel cage, off-topic 9-28 posts, page 2. You can answer every question I asked without divulging any personal information, nor violating anything classified.

The ball's in YOUR court. Saying "believe me or delete my account" doesn't exactly work in your favor.

Yes, we all know each other. Quite a few of us for about 10 years as a matter of fact. Half of us are vets. I've offered you the opportunity to shut your detractors up with questions any LCpl could answer.

Thanks Gunny. That's exactly what I got jumped on about over the last few days. It's now up to him.

The DD-214 being Unimportant? Really?

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 03:18 PM

Thanks Gunny. That's exactly what I got jumped on about over the last few days. It's now up to him.

The DD-214 being Unimportant? Really?

Ok then, please post yours here... Nothing redacted, we need to know that you're on the up and up.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 03:18 PM

Thanks Gunny. That's exactly what I got jumped on about over the last few days. It's now up to him.

The DD-214 being Unimportant? Really?

And NO, Gunny DID NOT accuse him of stolen valor as you did.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 03:43 PM

Thanks Gunny. That's exactly what I got jumped on about over the last few days. It's now up to him.

The DD-214 being Unimportant? Really?

Was it that important to you? That's 3 people you've run off in the last month. You do the same thing to each one ... attack them personally and question who and what they are. This guy could have just been a supply or admin clerk trying to fit in. Or he could be what he says.It's not like he has a monopoly on braggadocio here.

You jumped on him with whatever weapon you could find because he upset your little applecart. You didn't know crap. You made a bunch of accusations with no basis and tyr and Red state piled on. For NO reason.

Let me ask YOU ... what do YOU know about ground combat? I've never seen a radioman get further away from the LFOC than his berthing or mess, several miles offshore. And you got two people that never served a day backing you up. I don't come in your radio shack and tell you how to do your comm.

So you can quit feeling vindicated. You STILL did everything for the wrong reasons.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 05:48 PM

Was it that important to you? That's 3 people you've run off in the last month. You do the same thing to each one ... attack them personally and question who and what they are. This guy could have just been a supply or admin clerk trying to fit in. Or he could be what he says.It's not like he has a monopoly on braggadocio here.

You jumped on him with whatever weapon you could find because he upset your little applecart. You didn't know crap. You made a bunch of accusations with no basis and tyr and Red state piled on. For NO reason.

Let me ask YOU ... what do YOU know about ground combat? I've never seen a radioman get further away from the LFOC than his berthing or mess, several miles offshore. And you got two people that never served a day backing you up. I don't come in your radio shack and tell you how to do your comm.

So you can quit feeling vindicated. You STILL did everything for the wrong reasons.

Not worth responding to you gunny. No matter what I might try to say. You'll still have that chip. And, as for ground combat. Never done any of it since we don't carry a weapon on ships to operate, and get Marines to the beach. Corpsmen from the Navy are what you are looking for to justify how Special you think you are because you are a Marine.
There was a time when I had much, high respect for ALL OF YOU. But, as my son warned me. Not all of you want to be anything other than the BULLY who always has to have the Floor.
If you are convinced I did everything wrong. That's your opinion, Even though I was trying to LOOK OUT, and even DEFEND you by identifying the PHONIES. Yet, you didn't even want that.
Not something I would ever expect from someone I respected, and called Gunny.
So. Stay angry, and keep acting like you are the only person on Earth who ever served.
Everybody else has to shut up and let Gunny run the show.

hjmick

09-30-2014, 05:57 PM

I'm confused... Is this a message board or fucking middle school?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 06:07 PM

Not worth responding to you gunny. No matter what I might try to say. You'll still have that chip. And, as for ground combat. Never done any of it since we don't carry a weapon on ships to operate, and get Marines to the beach. Corpsmen from the Navy are what you are looking for to justify how Special you think you are because you are a Marine.
There was a time when I had much, high respect for ALL OF YOU. But, as my son warned me. Not all of you want to be anything other than the BULLY who always has to have the Floor.
If you are convinced I did everything wrong. That's your opinion, Even though I was trying to LOOK OUT, and even DEFEND you by identifying the PHONIES. Yet, you didn't even want that.
Not something I would ever expect from someone I respected, and called Gunny.
So. Stay angry, and keep acting like you are the only person on Earth who ever served.
Everybody else has to shut up and let Gunny run the show.

At what part do I quit LMAO at your first sentence and a 7 line response? :laugh:

I think that person you mentioned about bullies? I think he was talking about YOU. Food for thought.

Why would you think I need you to look out for me on a message board? I need you when I call in a CAS mission and you're on a carrier.

I GOT to run the show, AT? You can have it. The fact is, you're looking in the mirror while you accuse me. You've got to be the center of attention and ANY threat to that is immediately attacked. People on boards post in patterns and yours is obvious, and a repeat performance. This is Jim's board. Talk to him about running it.

I'm trying to help get members here which is good for Jim, good for the board, and good for healthy debate. You can't stand anything new or different.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 06:08 PM

I'm confused... Is this a message board for fucking middle school?

Yes. Which grade would you prefer? ;)

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 06:16 PM

I'm confused... Is this a message board for fucking middle school?
Thanks hjmick..

Yes, appears it is . Somebody told some tall tales and any damn body that dared question that person was attacked and told they were lousy posters etc. I never asked for verification of military service but it is my damn business what the fkk I believe or not.
I do not need or appreciate any asshat telling me what the hell I can question or choose to believe.
And that word -anybody , means exactly that.
I do not a give a damn what their career is , was or will be.

Any SOB wants to tell me what the ffk to do just come to my home and try to tell me..
I gave JIM ALL THE DAMN INFORMATION AND MY PERMISSION TO GIVE TO ANYBODY THAT CARES TO TRY.
I've about had enough of this shit ..
Hell, don't ask Jim send me a pm and I give again to any damn body that gotten their wimpy ass in a sling because I state my damn opinion here.

This telling regular members here they can not question a new member is ffing bullshit.
Why the hell do new members get such special privilege as to be certified as solid gold?
I keep seeing my name type with instructions not to post . Not to pile on. Not to do this or that..
Well, that person needs to man up and ffing make me..
I'm not hard find since I gave all that info to Jim.
I dont play this crap and Jim stated he is staying out of it...

Nobody has made me shut up in over 45 years and a damn lot have tried..
People hate the damn truth and some try to bully their ffing way thru it
Well, ffk that and ffk them too!!
Ask Jim for the damn info.
I'll not continue to ignore being insulted......--Tyr

Gunny

09-30-2014, 06:17 PM

Thanks hjmick..

Yes, appears it is . Somebody told some tall tales and any damn body that dared question that person was attacked and told they were lousy posters etc. I never asked for verification of military service but it is my damn business what the fkk I believe or not.
I do not need or appreciate any asshat telling me what the hell I can question or choose to believe.
And that word -anybody , means exactly that.
I do not a give a damn what their career is , was or will be.

Any SOB wants to tell me what the ffk to do just come to my home and try to tell me..
I gave JIM ALL THE DAMN INFORMATION AND MY PERMISSION TO GIVE TO ANYBODY THAT CARES TO TRY.
I've about had enough of this shit ..
Hell, don't ask Jim send me a pm and I give again to any damn body that gotten their wimpy ass in a sling because I state my damn opinion here.

This telling regular members here they can not question a new member is ffing bullshit.
Why the hell do new members get such special privilege as to be certified as solid gold?
I keep seeing my name type with instructions not to post . Not to pile on. Not to do this or that..
Well, that person needs to man up and ffing make me..
I'm not hard find since I gave all that info to Jim.
I dont play this crap and Jim stated he is staying out of it...

Nobody has made me shut up in over 45 years and a damn lot have tried..
People hate the damn truth and some try to bully their ffing way thru it
Well, ffk that and ffk them too!!
Ask Jim for the damn info.
I'll not continue to ignore being insulted......--Tyr

And some people are full of themselves and don't know shit.

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 06:20 PM

And some people are full of themselves and don't know shit.

Damn info is there Hoss. You aren't speaking to a damn kid..

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 06:23 PM

And some people are full of themselves and don't know shit.

Damn info is there Hoss. You aren't speaking to a damn kid..

Send me a pm Hoss and I will give it to you direct. --Tyr

aboutime

09-30-2014, 06:24 PM

At what part do I quit LMAO at your first sentence and a 7 line response? :laugh:

I think that person you mentioned about bullies? I think he was talking about YOU. Food for thought.

Why would you think I need you to look out for me on a message board? I need you when I call in a CAS mission and you're on a carrier.

I GOT to run the show, AT? You can have it. The fact is, you're looking in the mirror while you accuse me. You've got to be the center of attention and ANY threat to that is immediately attacked. People on boards post in patterns and yours is obvious, and a repeat performance. This is Jim's board. Talk to him about running it.

I'm trying to help get members here which is good for Jim, good for the board, and good for healthy debate. You can't stand anything new or different.

Right you are Gunny. Right you always are. As I stated earlier. Everybody else needs to just shut up, you are in charge.

And if Jim leaves you in charge of getting new members here, while you forbid others from Telling the Truth. I hope you both have fun convincing everybody they must always listen to GUNNY, and ask permission to give any opinions here.
You got it Gunny.
I never would say Semper Fi to a Bully.

hjmick

09-30-2014, 06:28 PM

Ah hell, I didn't listen to Gunny when he was in charge over at the place that shall not be named...

CSM

09-30-2014, 06:29 PM

Keeeeriiiist! I aint seen this much chest thumping and weeney wagging since PsycoBlues left. Reminds me of a pack of puppies trying to mark their territory by pissing on the same tree stump. Kind of entertaining though.

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 06:33 PM

hjmick

09-30-2014, 06:46 PM

Feel free to ask questions, no one is saying you guys can't. And I'm sure not saying anyone is a lousy poster. My stance has been a wait an see approach and proof. My only issue is calling someone a liar and/or telling them they are stealing valor - without proof. If it's there, I'd be more than happy to remove any insignia and condemn myself. But I'm giving the exact same benefit, respect and such that I extended to all other veterans that have "reported in" while here.

I have no issues with asking questions, but that's much different than accusations. Like I said, things have a way of working themselves out in the end. Concerning a military veteran, I would rather take give the benefit on this one. But in this case, it seems like it's, make the accusations and charges, and then ask questions to see if the hunches are correct.

I'll say this, the denizens of message boards are anonymous, they can be whoever and whatever they choose. For this reason, with very few exceptions, I tend to give claims of military service the same weight I give to those claiming to be members of the 1% on message boards. None. I do my best to treat every member, regardless of political affiliation, with respect until they say something that shows me they are undeserving of that respect. Sometimes it's their first post, sometimes it's their 23,751 post.

Don't misunderstand me, I respect all those who serve and have served. I know many, I have anonymously bought dinners for many more. I have had family members who served, some didn't return. I am just as offended by false claims of service as the next guy. But this is a message board, we're not curing cancer or destroying ISIS.

Just for the record... I am a gazillionaire with Matt Damon like boyish good looks, a large penis, and I can go from dusk 'til dawn...

Tyr-Ziu Saxnot

09-30-2014, 06:47 PM

Feel free to ask questions, no one is saying you guys can't. And I'm sure not saying anyone is a lousy poster. My stance has been a wait an see approach and proof. My only issue is calling someone a liar and/or telling them they are stealing valor - without proof. If it's there, I'd be more than happy to remove any insignia and condemn myself. But I'm giving the exact same benefit, respect and such that I extended to all other veterans that have "reported in" while here.

I have no issues with asking questions, but that's much different than accusations. Like I said, things have a way of working themselves out in the end. Concerning a military veteran, I would rather take give the benefit on this one. But in this case, it seems like it's, make the accusations and charges, and then ask questions to see if the hunches are correct.

I merely asked about the tall tales. And was jumped for it , insulted for asking , told I am lousy poster and if I'm not military then don't reply..
I am 60 years old and no a sob alive has ever stopped me from expressing my opinion and trust me a damn lot have tried.
I gave respect here to somebody based upon the words and stories told here by people I respect but now know that was my mistake not theirs.

This is not about the liar, tall tale braggart between gunny and I.
Its about him giving me orders, well fkk him this isnt the damn military.

He wants to give me any damn orders try it face to face.
I overlooked his damn rudeness far to long because I respect you other guys here.

He can kiss a good man's ass as far as I am concerned that ffing bully shit he tries doesn't work on me--never has-- never will!
A fact..

I openly -publicly give you my permission to give him all the info I gave you..
He'll not be the first person to learn I do not take kindly to be insulted or ordered around..
to be told what I can and can not say.
ffkk him!!!! His ass aint King Kong.. -Tyr

jimnyc

09-30-2014, 07:11 PM

Nobody is going to fight over this. C'mon, let's not let this get any further out of hand than it already is. In the long run, you guys know that all that will really be accomplished is the deterioration of the board. I have a sneaky suspicion we lost a couple of members in the past few days, and not only new members. When tempers eventually calm down - does everyone want this place to still be here? No longer care? Is all of this worth the actual forum itself?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 07:18 PM

Right you are Gunny. Right you always are. As I stated earlier. Everybody else needs to just shut up, you are in charge.

And if Jim leaves you in charge of getting new members here, while you forbid others from Telling the Truth. I hope you both have fun convincing everybody they must always listen to GUNNY, and ask permission to give any opinions here.
You got it Gunny.
I never would say Semper Fi to a Bully.

What "truth" do you tell?

Jim hasn't left me in charge of nothing.

You don't rate to say "semper fidelis". The problem here is YOU are the bully. I'm just the f-cker than backhands bullies into the dust and you don't like the taste of eating dirt. You ARE as I said before, looking in the mirror as you accuse. The fact is, I'm not backing down to you, nor kissing your ass and you're scrambling all over the place not knowing what to do but whine and play victim.

Nobody has to listen to me. But let's play, tough guy. I try to get people to come here and post to build this board up. So do others. You attack, whine and play victim each and every time, and destroy everyone else's efforts to bring more people in. WHO's the bully?

I'm just not taking your shit and you don't know how to act. You've had your way too long.

Now, you can either get along, or I've got a special friend I'm going to invite here and I'm going to call in some favors so he can say what he wants. He's me 30 ago. Goes by Animal Mother. When he's done with YOU, there'll be nothing left but a burnt cinder.

Your call.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 07:25 PM

What "truth" do you tell?

Jim hasn't left me in charge of nothing.

You don't rate to say "semper fidelis". The problem here is YOU are the bully. I'm just the f-cker than backhands bullies into the dust and you don't like the taste of eating dirt. You ARE as I said before, looking in the mirror as you accuse. The fact is, I'm not backing down to you, nor kissing your ass and you're scrambling all over the place not knowing what to do but whine and play victim.

Nobody has to listen to me. But let's play, tough guy. I try to get people to come here and post to build this board up. So do others. You attack, whine and play victim each and every time, and destroy everyone else's efforts to bring more people in. WHO's the bully?

I'm just not taking your shit and you don't know how to act. You've had your way too long.

Now, you can either get along, or I've got a special friend I'm going to invite here and I'm going to call in some favors so he can say what he wants. He's me 30 ago. Goes by Animal Mother. When he's done with YOU, there'll be nothing left but a burnt cinder.

Your call.

Knock yourself out. Making immature threats actually makes me wonder whether YOU are who you really claim to be.
If you are now incapable of holding a civil conversation without all the name calling, and threats. There really is nothing more either of us have to say.
Go get whoever you want. Your call.
Sounds to me like YOU are In Charge. The Gunny's I knew got all of my respect. So, which one are you?

Gunny

09-30-2014, 07:51 PM

Knock yourself out. Making immature threats actually makes me wonder whether YOU are who you really claim to be.
If you are now incapable of holding a civil conversation without all the name calling, and threats. There really is nothing more either of us have to say.
Go get whoever you want. Your call.
Sounds to me like YOU are In Charge. The Gunny's I knew got all of my respect. So, which one are you?

Really? I know 7 Marines that post on one board? Want me to get them to come here and run your ass off? How would you feel about THAT? Now you tell me what the difference is between me doing that and you doing it ... except I can bring more firepower.

You call your attack on born2decades mature and civil? YOU marginalize yourself. And you marginalize this board. Now, when you can come up with a response better than playing victim, feel free. Otherwise, you're wasting my time.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 07:54 PM

Really? I know 7 Marines that post on one board? Want me to get them to come here and run your ass off? How would you feel about THAT? Now you tell me what the difference is between me doing that and you doing it ... except I can bring more firepower.

You call your attack on born2decades mature and civil? YOU marginalize yourself. And you marginalize this board. Now, when you can come up with a response better than playing victim, feel free. Otherwise, you're wasting my time.

Gunny. I'll just let you ramble on. The endless accusations, name calling and threats are BENEATH a Real Gunny. At least the one's I knew, and served with many times.
Whatever trips your trigger is fine with me. Get other people to do your fighting for you? Really? You call it firepower?

Now, tell me when I am expected to be scared while you are wasting BOTH of our time...threatening like the Bully you want to be.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 08:10 PM

Gunny. I'll just let you ramble on. The endless accusations, name calling and threats are BENEATH a Real Gunny. At least the one's I knew, and served with many times.
Whatever trips your trigger is fine with me. Get other people to do your fighting for you? Really? You call it firepower?

Now, tell me when I am expected to be scared while you are wasting BOTH of our time...threatening like the Bully you want to be.

You're the one rambling on bitch. Is THIS how you think you always win? By not shutting up? YOU are a liar and YOU are stupid, self-centered and think this board revolves around YOU. You wouldn't have even attracted my attention if you hadn't called someone else names and questioned their abilities which are far beyond your scope.

Don't need anyone else. I'm kicking your ass all over the place so bad I'm almost ashamed. But not quite. Figures you'd try to twist shit though, loser. I just wondered how you'd like it if I did the same to you that you do to others with your whiny, loser-ass shit ....

You're stupid and you keep the intelligence level of this board down with your biddy-ass knitting circle shit. There IS a biddy board. Need a link?

aboutime

09-30-2014, 08:21 PM

You're the one rambling on bitch. Is THIS how you think you always win? By not shutting up? YOU are a liar and YOU are stupid, self-centered and think this board revolves around YOU. You wouldn't have even attracted my attention if you hadn't called someone else names and questioned their abilities which are far beyond your scope.

Don't need anyone else. I'm kicking your ass all over the place so bad I'm almost ashamed. But not quite. Figures you'd try to twist shit though, loser. I just wondered how you'd like it if I did the same to you that you do to others with your whiny, loser-ass shit ....

You're stupid and you keep the intelligence level of this board down with your biddy-ass knitting circle shit. There IS a biddy board. Need a link?

Wow, Gunny. Hope you feel better now. Go right ahead and do whatever you think you are doing. I'm only answering you because I enjoy allowing you to do what you seem to do best. And, everyone else who reads this is also learning as well.
By the way. You should explain exactly when, and where I have lied about anything here. But the name calling and threats just don't sound like a Mature Gunnery Sgt in the U.S.M.C. Unless...you are imbibing while your courage at the keyboard grows.

I think Jim would prefer we end this back and forth, useless test of whatever you want to call it.
How bout that?
And please remember. Despite all of your name calling, accusations, and threats. I haven't once used those techniques.
If you disagree with me. Oh well.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 09:37 PM

Wow, Gunny. Hope you feel better now. Go right ahead and do whatever you think you are doing. I'm only answering you because I enjoy allowing you to do what you seem to do best. And, everyone else who reads this is also learning as well.
By the way. You should explain exactly when, and where I have lied about anything here. But the name calling and threats just don't sound like a Mature Gunnery Sgt in the U.S.M.C. Unless...you are imbibing while your courage at the keyboard grows.

I think Jim would prefer we end this back and forth, useless test of whatever you want to call it.
How bout that?
And please remember. Despite all of your name calling, accusations, and threats. I haven't once used those techniques.
If you disagree with me. Oh well.

I'll feel better when you shut the fuck up. You only answered me because you have to get the last pissy-ass bitch word in, and you love to hear yourself.

Are you sure you were in the military? You act like a less-than-a-recruit. See how that works?

aboutime

09-30-2014, 09:43 PM

I'll feel better when you shut the fuck up. You only answered me because you have to get the last pissy-ass bitch word in, and you love to hear yourself.

Are you sure you were in the military? You act like a less-than-a-recruit. See how that works?

Sounds good to me. I expected more name calling, accusations, and threats to backup your FORCE you promised earlier.

By the way. Since I doubt you were. You can doubt whatever you want about me. I have no need to BRAG about anything to someone who needs to tell everybody to STFU.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 09:47 PM

Sounds good to me. I expected more name calling, accusations, and threats to backup your FORCE you promised earlier.

By the way. Since I doubt you were. You can doubt whatever you want about me. I have no need to BRAG about anything to someone who needs to tell everybody to STFU.

What do I need a backup force like you do for? I've slapped all 3 of you silly with no back up.

I don't tell everyone to STFU. Just YOU, nancy-boy.

aboutime

09-30-2014, 09:52 PM

What do I need a backup force like you do for? I've slapped all 3 of you silly with no back up.

I don't tell everyone to STFU. Just YOU, nancy-boy.

Let's end it here. Okay. I'm now going to tell you. From now on. I only want to post to a REAL GUNNY.

Until you change your shitty, dirt-bag attitudes, and begin acting like more than a spoiled little boy.
This is the LAST RESPONSE I will entertain to you.

I once respected you for your service, and for who you claimed to be. But...that person is no longer here.

Gunny

09-30-2014, 10:06 PM

Let's end it here. Okay. I'm now going to tell you. From now on. I only want to post to a REAL GUNNY.

Until you change your shitty, dirt-bag attitudes, and begin acting like more than a spoiled little boy.
This is the LAST RESPONSE I will entertain to you.

I once respected you for your service, and for who you claimed to be. But...that person is no longer here.

I've got a totally positive attitude, little bitch. You're a little bitch. I'm positive. Questioning me being a "real" Gunny hasn't worked for you yet, and it doesn't now.

I don't care WHO respects me for my service, much less you.

Why don't you knock off the passive-aggressive whiny ass shit and stand up for yourself or shut the fuck up?

NightTrain

09-30-2014, 11:18 PM

The next time you decide to shit on a new member, I will ban your sorry ass for a week.

You are not the Grand Inquisitor around here, or the bouncer.

We have all observed you doing this same pattern to damn near every new member, and that behavior of yours is now at a full stop. You do not decide who is to be a member and who is not through your baseless attacks.

Our goal is to grow this board; your efforts are in direct opposition to that goal. New Members are NOT for you to shit upon as soon as you can work it into the conversation.

I am fucking tired of you sniping and playing innocent later when your comments are clearly malevolent.

You are old enough to know better. Play nice with the new members or you'll feel my digital boot in your ass.

If you perform your usual innocence routine and play the Martyr, I will ban you for a week.

This is your last chance.

That is all.

Dismissed.

aboutime

10-01-2014, 01:03 PM

Nukeman

10-02-2014, 06:17 PM

Fine with me. If you refuse to accept the reality taking place. So be it.
And, you are not talking to just another teenager, or appeaser.
If you are FUCKING TIRED of what you call my sniping. Good. Bout time somebody pays attention here.
I was trying to help Jim...and yes, even You.
Too bad you can't see the forest for the tree's.WOW.. You think you are helping the board by running off/attacking new members.

Here's the deal why don't you let people have a little time before you attack them!?!?!? If you don't believe what someone says instead of attacking and throwing out accusations that YOU can't back up. Wait for them to mess up, if they truly are a liar they will mess up and you can have your proof. You can not sit here and "ACCUSE" without proof.. That is liable and defamation if you end up being wrong.. The point is "lighten up Francis" and let the new members have a chance to settle in before your a complete dick to them.. Can ya do that??? Or are you that starved for attention that you think a new member may take some away from you!?!?!?!