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View Full Version : Again, why even bother getting health insurance?



tailfins
10-17-2014, 11:34 PM
Just visit the hospital and don't pay the bill.


But many are still on the hook for deductibles that can top $5,000 for individuals and $10,000 for families

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/18/us/unable-to-meet-the-deductible-or-the-doctor.html

DLT
10-18-2014, 03:09 PM
Just visit the hospital and don't pay the bill.



http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/18/us/unable-to-meet-the-deductible-or-the-doctor.html

Insurance in America is a racket. You pay and pay and pay out the wazoo, year after year, and even if you've never had a claim.....they still raise (or double) your premiums and deductibles. The regulatory board that is supposed to protect consumers is in on the take, and instead, only protects insurance companies. I could be driving a brand new car for the money I'm having to shell out for my homeowners policy....yet have never had a claim. Premium just went up $20/month for no reason... other than to cover the insurance companies losses with other homeowners that HAVE had claims. It's a rico racket and a rip off.

tailfins
10-18-2014, 04:12 PM
Insurance in America is a racket. You pay and pay and pay out the wazoo, year after year, and even if you've never had a claim.....they still raise (or double) your premiums and deductibles. The regulatory board that is supposed to protect consumers is in on the take, and instead, only protects insurance companies. I could be driving a brand new car for the money I'm having to shell out for my homeowners policy....yet have never had a claim. Premium just went up $20/month for no reason... other than to cover the insurance companies losses with other homeowners that HAVE had claims. It's a rico racket and a rip off.

A policy for our family prices out at over $20,000 per year. If you want to get out of the Obamacare penalty, just join a Health Sharing Ministry. See below links for details.

http://www.libertyhealthshare.org/healthcare-exempt-from-obamacare

http://samaritanministries.org/healthreform/

https://mychristiancare.org/exemption.aspx

fj1200
10-18-2014, 07:18 PM
Just visit the hospital and don't pay the bill.

And then you ultimately have a suit, and eventually a judgement, against you.


Insurance in America is a racket. You pay and pay and pay out the wazoo, year after year, and even if you've never had a claim.....they still raise (or double) your premiums and deductibles. The regulatory board that is supposed to protect consumers is in on the take, and instead, only protects insurance companies. I could be driving a brand new car for the money I'm having to shell out for my homeowners policy....yet have never had a claim. Premium just went up $20/month for no reason... other than to cover the insurance companies losses with other homeowners that HAVE had claims. It's a rico racket and a rip off.

Try not going with insurance then. As for me, I like mitigating my risk.

fj1200
10-18-2014, 07:21 PM
A policy for our family prices out at over $20,000 per year. If you want to get out of the Obamacare penalty, just join a Health Sharing Ministry. See below links for details.

http://www.libertyhealthshare.org/healthcare-exempt-from-obamacare

http://samaritanministries.org/healthreform/

https://mychristiancare.org/exemption.aspx

That's cool but do they have the financial resources, or reinsurance, to cover unexpectedly large claims?

Shadow
10-18-2014, 07:33 PM
Guess how much money the hospitals write off every year for unpaid bills? And then guess who ultimately suffers for that?

tailfins
10-18-2014, 07:34 PM
And then you ultimately have a suit, and eventually a judgement, against you.



Correct. That's why you make yourself judgement proof as you get older. Certain things are essentially untouchable such as kids college saving plans in their name, retirement accounts, pre-paid rent, open credit lines, and much more. If you goofed on making yourself judgement proof, there's always Chapter 7.


Guess how much money the hospitals write off every year for unpaid bills? And then guess who ultimately suffers for that?

If hospitals quit deciding to stop charging the uninsured 5 to 8 times what insurance pays them, maybe people like me might actually try to pay. If you bill my family $5,000 for a $1,000 emergency room bill, I'm going to say "screw you" and pay nothing. Husband and wife need to keep accounts separate and use minor children as "emergency contacts" when you fill out hospital paperwork. Don't fall for the ruse of "applying for charity care" where they even ask for bank balances. The vast majority are rejected and the info on the application goes straight to the collection agency.

fj1200
10-18-2014, 07:41 PM
Correct. That why you make yourself judgement proof as you get older. Certain things are essentially untouchable such as kids college saving plans in their name, retirement accounts, pre-paid rent, open credit lines, and much more. If you goofed on making yourself judgement proof, there's always Chapter 7.

A. Don't expect good healthcare, and 2. Skipping on bills is not exactly the conservative thing to do. I just heard that only liberals are parasites. :) Not to mention the fraud aspect of the bankruptcy code.

tailfins
10-18-2014, 09:08 PM
A. Don't expect good healthcare, and 2. Skipping on bills is not exactly the conservative thing to do. I just heard that only liberals are parasites. :) Not to mention the fraud aspect of the bankruptcy code.

Sometimes a system becomes such a ripoff, that's it better not to participate. Of course you don't commit fraud. What I'm saying is that bankruptcy isn't necessary unless you erred in making yourself judgement proof. I just don't see the sense in forking over $200,000 over ten years. You set up your finances in a judgement proof manner long before life deals you any surprise.

fj1200
10-18-2014, 09:13 PM
Sometimes a system becomes such a ripoff, that's it better not to participate. Of course you don't commit fraud. What I'm saying is that bankruptcy isn't necessary unless you erred in making yourself judgement proof. I just don't see the sense in forking over $200,000 over ten years. You set up your finances in a judgement proof manner long before life deals you any surprise.

Not participating is not defined as participating and then skipping out. I'm not going to disagree that the system is worse now than it was earlier :cough: BO sucks :cough: but there are ways. One of which you pointed out.

tailfins
10-18-2014, 09:39 PM
Not participating is not defined as participating and then skipping out. I'm not going to disagree that the system is worse now than it was earlier :cough: BO sucks :cough: but there are ways. One of which you pointed out.

Just don't nail yourself to a cross trying to be a "good do-be". It's better to short the healthcare system than to short your family $200,000 over ten years. And yes, a health sharing ministry at least gets you some basic healthcare at a non-absurd price. If you're worth $150K, what's the difference of you owe 10% of a $1.5 million hospital bill or all of a $150K hospital bill? The upper limit of health insurance doesn't help you. A lengthy hospital stay will leave you broke whether you have insurance or not.

fj1200
10-18-2014, 09:49 PM
Just don't nail yourself to a cross trying to be a "good do-be". It's better to short the healthcare system than to short your family $200,000 over ten years. And yes, a health sharing ministry at least gets you some basic healthcare at a non-absurd price. If you're worth $150K, what's the difference of you owe 10% of a $1.5 million hospital bill or all of a $150K hospital bill? The upper limit of health insurance doesn't help you. A lengthy hospital stay will leave you broke whether you have insurance or not.

Sounds like you're advocating for single payer. Nevertheless I see two false assumptions; 1. That you would receive no benefit from your insurance over those ten years, and 2. That you completely discount the risk mitigation aspect of having insurance in the first place.

tailfins
10-18-2014, 09:56 PM
Sounds like you're advocating for single payer. Nevertheless I see two false assumptions; 1. That you would receive no benefit from your insurance over those ten years, and 2. That you completely discount the risk mitigation aspect of having insurance in the first place.

The single payer I'm for is the customer paying a reasonable price similar to the dentist. I don't have dental insurance either, but have no trouble getting a price list and being told cash with no insurance gets a 30% discount. You know what you're paying when you walk in the door. I do pay doctors by the way. It only the hospital I tell to go screw themselves. A doctor will usually accept an amount similar to what an insurance company would pay him if you ask. There's no excuse for charging an uninsured patient 5 to 8 times what the insurance would be charged.