Haley calls for removal of Confederate flag

[jimnyc]

Some want it removed from the Capitol by tomorrow, but legally it appears it will be removed sometimes this summer. I've read various stories. Haley gave the announcement this afternoon.

---

South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley called for the removal of the Confederate flag from the grounds of the state Capitol Monday.

"Today we are here in a moment of unity to say it's time to move the flag from the capitol grounds," Haley said during a news conference attended by Republican senators Lindsey Graham and Tim Scott, as well as other state leaders.

Meanwhile, political and religious leaders in the state urged lawmakers to vote to remove the flag as early as Tuesday in tribute to the nine people gunned down at a historic black church in Charleston last week. Authorities have said the shooting was a hate crime, and a white supremacist website that may be linked to shooter Dylann Roof shows images that apparently show him holding the flag.

"This act will do something very personal," Charleston Mayor Joe Riley said on Monday.

"Take away Mr. Roof's symbol of misguided idea of racial superiority and bigotry. Take it away from him and all like him and give the front of our state Capitol equally and fairly to every citizen of South Carolina," he said.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/south-carolina-gov-nikki-haley-calls-removal-confederate-flag-state-n379801

[aboutime]

Some want it removed from the Capitol by tomorrow, but legally it appears it will be removed sometimes this summer. I've read various stories. Haley gave the announcement this afternoon.

---

South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley called for the removal of the Confederate flag from the grounds of the state Capitol Monday.

"Today we are here in a moment of unity to say it's time to move the flag from the capitol grounds," Haley said during a news conference attended by Republican senators Lindsey Graham and Tim Scott, as well as other state leaders.

Meanwhile, political and religious leaders in the state urged lawmakers to vote to remove the flag as early as Tuesday in tribute to the nine people gunned down at a historic black church in Charleston last week. Authorities have said the shooting was a hate crime, and a white supremacist website that may be linked to shooter Dylann Roof shows images that apparently show him holding the flag.

"This act will do something very personal," Charleston Mayor Joe Riley said on Monday.

"Take away Mr. Roof's symbol of misguided idea of racial superiority and bigotry. Take it away from him and all like him and give the front of our state Capitol equally and fairly to every citizen of South Carolina," he said.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/south-carolina-gov-nikki-haley-calls-removal-confederate-flag-state-n379801


Anyone happen to remember what I have been saying about why I DO NOT TRUST Politicians, from either party. They have folded. Given-in, Appeased, just like Obama.
If they are willing to do this. The 1st, and 2nd amendments ARE NEXT.
Just watch.

[NightTrain]

Political posturing by Haley to gain points. The flag didn't make the cowardly idiot shoot those people.

I'm sure he likes swastikas, too. I read where he was ranting about Jews as well as Blacks, so would decreeing that swastikas are not allowed save lives as well?

He was a mentally unbalanced loser, and there's no symbols that drove him to it. The whole idea is ridiculous.

Stupid politicians like this making useless gestures just serve to muddy the waters - the kid had mental issues and that should be the hot topic, not a damn Confederate flag.

[Gunny]

Anyone happen to remember what I have been saying about why I DO NOT TRUST Politicians, from either party. They have folded. Given-in, Appeased, just like Obama.
If they are willing to do this. The 1st, and 2nd amendments ARE NEXT.
Just watch.

I think we should ban the Democratic party. The most un-American thing we have going today.

[Perianne]

And, as we have seen over and over and over, the racemongers win again. It's the adage "the squeaky wheel gets the grease".

[hjmick]

First, I'm not sure why you, Night, would say Nicki Haley is "posturing." She is currently serving her second term as governor and is not eligible to run for the office again until four years after the end of her last term. You might say that she hopes to seek a higher office, but I have not heard any rumblings to that effect. It's not impossible, she's smart, popular in the state, and attractive (let's not pretend that isn't a factor for politicians).

Second, removing the flag only happens with a 2/3 affirmative vote in the state senate. This is the result of the compromise reached in 2000. Unless I am mistaken, the practice of flying the flag over the capitol dome resulted in a tourism boycott, an effective one, spurred on by the NAACP (I can see how they would be offended). The bill was passed in a senate controlled by Democrats, and it was signed in to law by a Democrat governor. Considering the current atmosphere here in the state, it could happen. There is talk of moving behind the state house, but in my mind if that were to happen they might as well stuff it in a drawer somewhere because it would be even more meaningless than it is now (it currently flies at the Confederate Soldiers Memorial which commemorates those killed during the Civil War).

Personally, I'm not sure where I stand...

I understand and respect those who find offense in the flying of the Confederate naval ensign, how could you not? I also understand its significance to the history of this country and believe that history should be embraced, not hidden. The problem is that many racists and bigots have co-opted the stars and bars and in today's America it is synonymous with hatred and racism. Forget the fact that the majority of the men who fought for the Confederate States, the men who fought under the flag, were too poor to own slaves...

The obvious problem is that you can't please all of the people all of the time...

But I will suggest that whatever they do, the do it with a good deal of thought because...

How long will it be after the last Confederate flag comes down that people remember that slavery was an institution under the American flag, the Stars and Stripes, for a much longer period of time than it was under the Flag of the Confederate states?

[NightTrain]

First, I'm not sure why you, Night, would say Nicki Haley is "posturing." She is currently serving her second term as governor and is not eligible to run for the office again until four years after the end of her last term. You might say that she hopes to seek a higher office, but I have not heard any rumblings to that effect. It's not impossible, she's smart, popular in the state, and attractive (let's not pretend that isn't a factor for politicians).

That's exactly what I think, HJ. She's making political hay for whatever position she runs for next, and your average voter isn't smart enough to realize that an inanimate object cannot make a human commit an unspeakable crime.

[Jeff]

She may have been popular in SC but I am afraid this will take all that popularity away, I remember when they took it off the state house roof and people weren't happy about it then. Some truly do look at this flag as their heritage not as hate, in GA ( and I think it is in other southern states ) they have Sons of The Confederate Lisc. plates ( which was actually started by woman ) but these plates go to mostly folks that are very proud to of had family that fought in the war. To take that flag away from a statue that is in memory of those that died isn't going to win her a popularity contest for sure. Many folks where furious when they removed it in the first place, and yes there was a tourist boycott, it came in the form of the college basketball finals, if the flag didn't come down they would boycott. Personally the flag means neither heritage or hate to me, I like it because of the rebel status, but a push now because some racist scum bag shot up a bunch of good folks is ridicules, that flag had nothing to do with his hatred.

And to be honest the only folks that are even worried about that flag now a days are those that are racist themselves, this flag doesn't fly over the state house it is at a monument, the blacks that where so worried about it being over the state house won, now they will push for more, well again I have to ask why is there a African March from Columbia to Charleston, blacks weren't the only ones to build SC so why are they the only ones to be recognized ? This is the kind of stuff that pushed racist to feel the way they do, the flag deal was quiet, it wasn't flying over the State house, but some want the entire bowl of marbles instead of compromise.

[Kathianne]

Personally I've never gotten the wanting to hold onto the Confederate Flag, but I do think it's protected by the first amendment. Now mind you, I'm from the North, so my take is not without bias.

I saw this, and thought it was on mark:

http://www.redstate.com/2015/06/22/the-confederate-battle-flag/


The Confederate Battle Flag

By:Erick Erickson (http://www.redstate.com/users/erick/) (Diary (http://www.redstate.com/diary/erick/)) | June 22nd, 2015 at 12:00 AM

The Bible tells me to love my neighbor. I have a number of black friends and I do not know any of them who would feel comfortable coming into my house if I were flying the Confederate battle flag. So I don’t. In fact, in my life, the people I can think of who proudly fly the Confederate battle flag outside their homes are people in whose yards, let alone houses, I would not feel comfortable.

I think if a Christian is to love his neighbor, he cannot fly a flag that so many of his neighbors associate with the defense of slavery. I agree with my friend Russell Moore in that, but I disagree in that I do think there are places that the Confederate flag is appropriate. I think it is appropriate at Confederate soldiers’ cemeteries. I think it is appropriate at Confederate memorials and museums. Frankly, considering a majority of citizens in Mississippi, both black and white, voted to keep it on their state flag, I think it is appropriate there. Mississippi, unlike many Southern states, put the Confederate battle flag on their state flag shortly after the Civil War, not in protest in the 1950’s and 60’s.

Outside of those locations, I don’t think it is appropriate. You, like many of my friends and family, may think the Confederate battle flag is a symbol of heritage, not hate. But for millions of black Americans, it is a very real symbol of oppression.

I’m afraid, though, that we are about to see a run on Confederate battle flags. Someone is going to make a tidy profit.

The only people I know who grumble and dwell on the flag are busy-body academics and people who don’t live in the South who have a low opinion of the region with or without the flag. The response, in the South, has been a reinforcement that others are bigoted toward the South and that the flag really does represent heritage, not hate — a heritage a bunch of racist1 (http://www.redstate.com/2015/06/22/the-confederate-battle-flag/#fn1), northern white liberals want to stamp out. I have more than one relative, as do most white Southerners, who has a battle flag with “Heritage Not Hate” written in proximity to it. You and I can roll our eyes at this, but it is pervasive.

And now, because a bunch of mostly white yankees are again yelling about the battle flag, we’re not going to see a flag and tradition die out. Instead, we’re going to see a bunch of twenty and thirty-something Southerners go out and buy fresh flags as a middle finger to the Northern white liberals who did not like them without the flag. The Sons of Confederate Veterans are probably getting recruiting material ready as we speak.

...

Once the flag is gone, the left will advance to the next issue then the next issue, etc. They won’t compromise. There is no compromise. There is only conversion or censorship with the left.

But I also think if you proudly fly the Confederate battle flag and call yourself a Christian, you need to ask yourself how you are being a good neighbor to the black family down the street, next door, or on the other side of town whose ancestors were enslaved under that flag and whose parents or grandparents faced down white men in the streets waving that flag as an act of rebellion against voting rights.

None of this really matters though. Because the issue is now politicized, you might as well buy stock in companies that produce the Confederate battle flag. They’re going to get a lot of orders from people who equate raising the stars and bars with raising the middle finger toward liberals up north.

[Jeff]

Personally I've never gotten the wanting to hold onto the Confederate Flag, but I do think it's protected by the first amendment. Now mind you, I'm from the North, so my take is not without bias.

I saw this, and thought it was on mark:

http://www.redstate.com/2015/06/22/the-confederate-battle-flag/

Kat I have it tattooed and have many black friends, it is a piece of cloth, no different than the cloth that the shirts stating it's a black thing or It's our turn now are made on.

Many folks feel very strong about the flag, I have many friends that have a lot of civil war memorials hanging in their homes, from hats to flags. And most of these folks don't have a racist bone in their body. I also have a black friend that rides with us, he has the confederate flag on his helmet ( a sticker ) see he looks at it like I do, neither as heritage or hate just as a sign of doing things his way.

Another way to look at the flag if we must, is for a black person to look at how far they have come, if the flag truly bothers them then they ought to be laughing because they have come so far, take SC for example, they fought to get it off of the top of the state house and now a terrible tragedy happens, so now folks want it off a confederate memorial. In other words some want it all heir way with no compromise.

[Kathianne]

Kat I have it tattooed and have many black friends, it is a piece of cloth, no different than the cloth that the shirts stating it's a black thing or It's our turn now are made on.

Many folks feel very strong about the flag, I have many friends that have a lot of civil war memorials hanging in their homes, from hats to flags. And most of these folks don't have a racist bone in their body. I also have a black friend that rides with us, he has the confederate flag on his helmet ( a sticker ) see he looks at it like I do, neither as heritage or hate just as a sign of doing things his way.

Another way to look at the flag if we must, is for a black person to look at how far they have come, if the flag truly bothers them then they ought to be laughing because they have come so far, take SC for example, they fought to get it off of the top of the state house and now a terrible tragedy happens, so now folks want it off a confederate memorial. In other words some want it all heir way with no compromise.

I can respect that. I came across the following the other day, it was related to some issue in Europe. I think it has some related observations:

http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/42880/


...In fact, of course, the American South knows what it’s like to lose a war, and to be occupied, which may possibly explain why the American South is also far more military-minded than other parts of the United States — or, for that matter, than London. And the American South certainly didn’t like being occupied. Reconstruction was very unpopular, and my grandmother can still tell stories that she heard from her grandmother about Union soldiers passing through and stripping the place bare of everything except what they were able to hide, and of the years (decades, really) of privation that followed the war.

But American southerners know something that apparently a lot of other people seem to have trouble with: how to lose a war and not hold a grudge. (Much of one, anyway). The monument shown above illustrates that; it sits about a block from my office (click the picture for a bigger image; you can see a closeup of the inscription here (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/images/monumentclose.jpg) if that’s too hard to read on your display). As late as the Spanish-American War, there was considerable doubt about whether southerners would turn out to fight for the United States. They did. (My great-grandfather was one of them).

There are a lot of reasons for that, but the American experience of reconciliation after one of the world’s bloodier and more divisive conflicts is one that perhaps ought to get more attention. It may be that, like so many things American, it is exceptional. But maybe not.

Meanwhile, with the Civil War in mind, reader Gregory Birrer points out that Europe never changes:


I have been reading a little book I picked up while in Gettysburg recently, entitled, “Memoranda During The War” by Walt Whitman. It is a compilation of his notes from about 3 years worth of visits to War hospitals in and around Washington D.C. from 1862 – 1865. Toward the end he inserts some interesting political commentary (mixed in with a variety of topics) that sounds as if it could have been written today. Here’s the piece:


Attitude of Foreign Governments toward the U.S. during the War of 1861-’65 -

Looking over my scraps, I find I wrote the following during 1864, or the latter part of ’63: The happening to our America, abroad as well as at home, these years, is indeed most strange. The Democratic Republic has paid her to-day the terrible and resplendent compliment of the united wish of all the nations of the world that her Union should be broken, her future cut off, and that she should be compell’d to descend to the level of kingdoms and empires ordinarily great!There is certainly not one government in Europe but is now watching the war in this country, with the ardent prayer that the united States may be effectually split, crippled, and dismember’d by it. There is not one but would help toward that dismemberment, if it dared. I say such is the ardent wish to-day of England and of France, as governments, and of all the nations of Europe, as governments. I think indeed it is to-day the real, heart-felt wish of all the nations of the world, with the single exception of Mexico–Mexico, the only one to whom we have ever really done wrong, and now the only one who prays for us and for our triumph, with genuine prayer.


Is it not indeed strange? America, made up of all, cheerfully from the beginning opening her arms to all, the result and justifier of all, of Britain, Germany, France, and Spain – all here – the accepter, the friend, hope, last resource and general house of all – she who has harm’d none, but been bounteous to so many, to millions, the mother of strangers and exiles, all nations – should now I say be paid this dread compliment of general governmental fear and hatred?…….Are we indignant? alarm’d? Do we feel wrong’d? jeopardized? No; help’d, braced, concentrated, rather.


We are all too prone to wander from ourselves, to affect Europe, and watch her frowns and smiles. We need this hot lesson of general hatred, and henceforth must never forget it. Never again will we trust the moral sense nor abstract friendliness of a single government of the world.


“Never again?” Apparently, we need to be reminded from time to time. European hopes for our descent were frustrated then by the greatness of the American spirit, which both ended the war and — more importantly — managed to build a great nation without bitterness. May it be so again. And may the Europeans who resent it continue to gnash their teeth.

Which brought another observation from another source: https://web.archive.org/web/20031120093631/http://www.dynamist.com/weblog/archives/000709.html


...Southerners are, and were, extremely proud and prickly, which made the whole losing-and-occupation experience particularly unpleasant. (Taking offense at being dissed is not a black thing. It's a southern thing that blacks have only recently been allowed to express without fear of violent reprisal.) But, as Glenn notes, our ancestors eventually rejoined the Union and even became devoted to it. He doesn't note another effect, which helps explain his views and mine: If war is coming, Southerners know that it's better to fight on the other guy's territory.

Actually, most Americans are descended from refugees (or prisoners) from occupied lands of one sort or another. It's a tribute to the power of American identity that nobody notices.

[Kathianne]

I'd be remiss if not posting the related link to the conversation on Civil War:

http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/172710/


DAVID BERNSTEIN ON why some libertarians sympathize with the Confederacy. (http://www.volokh.com/2013/07/19/why-some-libertarians-sympathize-with-the-confederacy/) This follows up on several other posts on this rather odd fringe, but I’ve said most of what I have to say on the subject here. (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/archive/archives/020873.php) See this, (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/006739/) too. And this. (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/42880/) And, for that matter, this. (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/51243/)

I think, however, that while the following may be an accurate description of why some libertarians might wish the Confederacy had won, it’s also stupid: “If you believe that the United States government has been a massive force for evil in the world, and also object to much of the government’s domestic policy, it’s only natural to wish that the government’s ability to do the damage it wrought had been nipped in the bud. And the most plausible way this could have happened historically would have been for the South to have successfully seceded from the North, leaving a much smaller and weaker central government that would likely have faced further secessionist challenges in the future.”

The most likely outcome of a Confederate victory would have been another war, or wars, down the line: “A generation of madness,” (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345492471?ie=UTF8&tag=insta0c-20&link_code=as3&camp=211189&creative=373489&creativeASIN=0345492471) as described in one Harry Turtledove series about just that. And the likely outcome of such a path wouldn’t have been smaller government or more liberty.

In truth, the single greatest blow the South could have struck for liberty and small government would have been not to secede. Unfortunate that things didn’t work out that way.

As for James Webb’s Confederate enthusiasms, (http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/60553/) well, let’s just put that down to martial romance.

[indago]

Haley calls for removal of Confederate flag

It's beyond time! The flag represents the Confederacy, which no longer exists. To continue to fly the flag is a defiance of the unity of the States.

[Perianne]

If anyone thinks they are bringing America together by removing the flag, they are full of feces.

[indago]

If anyone thinks they are bringing America together by removing the flag, they are full of feces.

Well, I can certainly agree with that. America is a "melting pot" of different cultures that are not "melting", but are certainly active in their ideas and ideals, so there will always be disagreement.

[Jeff]

It's beyond time! The flag represents the Confederacy, which no longer exists. To continue to fly the flag is a defiance of the unity of the States.

Why should folks that are proud of their ancestors that fought in the war have to give it up, the flag flies on a monument in honor of those that lost their lives, what's next take down the monument. :rolleyes:

Will we now be outlawing the shirts that blacks wear, bumper stickers and so on they are written just to offend whites ? Man I am glad I don't live in a pussy section of this country, and that brings me to another point, 90% of those offended by the flag don't live in states that have it. :rolleyes: Gee I wonder where the real racist lay.

[revelarts]

Why should folks that are proud of their ancestors that fought in the war have to give it up, the flag flies on a monument in honor of those that lost their lives, what's next take down the monument. :rolleyes:

Will we now be outlawing the shirts that blacks wear, bumper stickers and so on they are written just to offend whites ? Man I am glad I don't live in a pussy section of this country, and that brings me to another point, 90% of those offended by the flag don't live in states that have it. :rolleyes: Gee I wonder where the real racist lay.

Not sure where you get 90% from jeff?

[revelarts]

Another way to look at the flag if we must, is for a black person to look at how far they have come, if the flag truly bothers them then they ought to be laughing because they have come so far, take SC for example, they fought to get it off of the top of the state house and now a terrible tragedy happens, so now folks want it off a confederate memorial. In other words some want it all heir way with no compromise.


Another way for america to look at islam is to remember how far we've come. Muslims used to rule most of Europe. so there yeah go.
we ought to be laughing because we've have come so far.

[indago]

Why should folks that are proud of their ancestors that fought in the war have to give it up, the flag flies on a monument in honor of those that lost their lives, what's next take down the monument. :rolleyes:

Will we now be outlawing the shirts that blacks wear, bumper stickers and so on they are written just to offend whites ? Man I am glad I don't live in a pussy section of this country, and that brings me to another point, 90% of those offended by the flag don't live in states that have it. :rolleyes: Gee I wonder where the real racist lay.

Nobody is saying — at least I'm not suggesting — that folks "have to give it up". It can be neatly folded, placed into a trunk of historical memorabilia in the attic, and taken out from time to time to reminisce over.

[Jeff]

Another way for america to look at islam is to remember how far we've come. Muslims used to rule most of Europe. so there yeah go.
we ought to be laughing because we've have come so far.

We haven't come no where, they are still cutting heads off and doing the same they always have.

But your right I do Laugh at them, hell I crack up when ever I see them around town, see there BS scare tactics don't worry me at all, and yes we have some kind of training camp just a few miles from here.


Not sure where you get 90% from jeff?

Yes 90% is a number I knew you would jump on, I don't think there is actually a real number of how many came from outside the state, but yes I lived there during the time they made a deal to place the flag on the monument instead of the state house and I wouldn't be surprised if it was more than 90%. See Rev down here people have better things to do than worry about the flag, yes there are those that will, by no means am I saying there isn't racism here, but when all this went down it wasn't
the people from SC pushing it, was more the likes of Sharpton and Jackson and the bus loads of people they bussed in. As for a number your right I have no idea but I will guarantee it is way up there. Folks in SC had bigger worries than the flag Rev, and honestly having lived in SC , NJ and now GA I can tell you racism is by far worst up north. Folks down here get along much better than up north, don't get me wrong yes it's here, but I believe racism is everywhere and you are never going to get rid of it 100 %


Nobody is saying — at least I'm not suggesting — that folks "have to give it up". It can be neatly folded, placed into a trunk of historical memorabilia in the attic, and taken out from time to time to reminisce over.

Why??? A deal was made back around 2000 to take it off of the State House and put it at this Monument, is this how deals are made now, we will get what we want later so play the compromise game now and go for it all later. :rolleyes:

Folks who have family that fought and died in that war have every right to see that flag waving over that monument, they didn't riot or burn the bitch down when they lost the fight in 2000.

But I have to ask, should we go and remove all the American flags from cemeteries as well ??? Or are we just pleasing a few.

[jimnyc]

Nobody is saying — at least I'm not suggesting — that folks "have to give it up". It can be neatly folded, placed into a trunk of historical memorabilia in the attic, and taken out from time to time to reminisce over.

You say 'folks', but I'm assuming that you mean the State? Because this won't do anything to stop citizens from flying this flag, nor should it. Same as no way in hell should any citizen be told to remove a 'don't tread on me' flag.

[Gunny]

Personally I've never gotten the wanting to hold onto the Confederate Flag, but I do think it's protected by the first amendment. Now mind you, I'm from the North, so my take is not without bias.

I saw this, and thought it was on mark:

http://www.redstate.com/2015/06/22/the-confederate-battle-flag/

Yankee. :laugh:

Do you know that if you get rid of Chicago, IL is as redneck as Texas? Y'all let that one city control your entire state. Most everyone else are farmers, bikers and hunters.

[red state]

First, I'm not sure why you, Night, would say Nicki Haley is "posturing." She is currently serving her second term as governor and is not eligible to run for the office again until four years after the end of her last term. You might say that she hopes to seek a higher office, but I have not heard any rumblings to that effect. It's not impossible, she's smart, popular in the state, and attractive (let's not pretend that isn't a factor for politicians).

Second, removing the flag only happens with a 2/3 affirmative vote in the state senate. This is the result of the compromise reached in 2000. Unless I am mistaken, the practice of flying the flag over the capitol dome resulted in a tourism boycott, an effective one, spurred on by the NAACP (I can see how they would be offended). The bill was passed in a senate controlled by Democrats, and it was signed in to law by a Democrat governor. Considering the current atmosphere here in the state, it could happen. There is talk of moving behind the state house, but in my mind if that were to happen they might as well stuff it in a drawer somewhere because it would be even more meaningless than it is now (it currently flies at the Confederate Soldiers Memorial which commemorates those killed during the Civil War).

Personally, I'm not sure where I stand...

I understand and respect those who find offense in the flying of the Confederate naval ensign, how could you not? I also understand its significance to the history of this country and believe that history should be embraced, not hidden. The problem is that many racists and bigots have co-opted the stars and bars and in today's America it is synonymous with hatred and racism. Forget the fact that the majority of the men who fought for the Confederate States, the men who fought under the flag, were too poor to own slaves...

The obvious problem is that you can't please all of the people all of the time...

But I will suggest that whatever they do, the do it with a good deal of thought because...

How long will it be after the last Confederate flag comes down that people remember that slavery was an institution under the American flag, the Stars and Stripes, for a much longer period of time than it was under the Flag of the Confederate states?

Agree.....and when will we forget that MANY of the Union Soldiers were forced into fighting simply because they were poor immigrants from Ireland and were "expendable slaves" for the slaughter of a superior "country boy can survive" army who were just as naturally shooters as they were the type that founded, explored and fought against tyranny. Slavery was wrong when the blacks in Africa sold their "bros" into slavery and slavery is WRONG now under the muSLUMs (who have always been slavers and have it written in their koran). The flag should remain but, already, rumors are developing around Mississippi doing the same thing. Ole Miss Rebels (I mean black bears) have already did this years ago and should have lost their fan base because of it but if Mississippi (as a Sovereign State) allows this BATTLE flag to be stricken, it will be a sad day indeed. Most have already forgotten (and I've raised this point in another thread) but most have forgotten or willfully and ignorantly refuse to acknowledge that the bars and stars are NOT the Confederate flag. It is a BATTLE flag with our Nation's best behind it. Many of these who were our BEST were Scots and Cherokee who were bullied by the so-called Union after being crucial soldiers in several wars. They were also the group who shed blood when the Smoky Mountains were established (forcing families from their farms and traditional hunting lands.....all sacred). Today, we see as much a bully gov. (OR MORE SO) than when Ye Old Merry KING George sat over us. Yet, we do nothing and do not deserve the freedoms THEY fought for.

[Gunny]

Kat I have it tattooed and have many black friends, it is a piece of cloth, no different than the cloth that the shirts stating it's a black thing or It's our turn now are made on.

Many folks feel very strong about the flag, I have many friends that have a lot of civil war memorials hanging in their homes, from hats to flags. And most of these folks don't have a racist bone in their body. I also have a black friend that rides with us, he has the confederate flag on his helmet ( a sticker ) see he looks at it like I do, neither as heritage or hate just as a sign of doing things his way.

Another way to look at the flag if we must, is for a black person to look at how far they have come, if the flag truly bothers them then they ought to be laughing because they have come so far, take SC for example, they fought to get it off of the top of the state house and now a terrible tragedy happens, so now folks want it off a confederate memorial. In other words some want it all heir way with no compromise.

My helmet WAS the rebel battle standard. And guess what ... I got it from a Jew. Go figure.

[Gunny]

It's beyond time! The flag represents the Confederacy, which no longer exists. To continue to fly the flag is a defiance of the unity of the States.

So? Defying the Useless States of America is protected by the First Amendment. So I'd say it's beyond time people quit whining about it.

I'm Southern 'til the day I die. So are my kids. Heritage, not hate.

[red state]

Yankee. :laugh:

Do you know that if you get rid of Chicago, IL is as redneck as Texas? Y'all let that one city control your entire state. Most everyone else are farmers, bikers and hunters.

YEP....it earned at least FIVE (5) of these:

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Like California (specifically San Francisco) Illinois is an absolutely beautiful State with great people. I've had the pleasure of staying in both places and was surprised at how well I adapted and could have actually lived in either location. The liberals are the ones keeping others (including business) from moving in. Just look at Oregon, Colorado and Washington.......three more nice States that I wouldn't mind living if not for the CITIES that run the State (RUiN those States, I should say). I fear Texas will be next but Gunny has already promised that Texas will never fall to liberalism and the CITIES that are gaining in liberal thinking/control.


Before long, I believe B.O. and his minions will ruin (run) all 58 States......

[Gunny]

YEP....it earned at least FIVE (5) of these:

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Like California (specifically San Francisco) Illinois is an absolutely beautiful State with great people. I've had the pleasure of staying in both places and was surprised at how well I adapted and could have actually lived in either location. The liberals are the ones keeping others (including business) from moving in. Just look at Oregon, Colorado and Washington.......three more nice States that I wouldn't mind living if not for the CITIES that run the State (RUiN those States, I should say). I fear Texas will be next but Gunny has already promised that Texas will never fall to liberalism and the CITIES that are gaining in liberal thinking/control.


Before long, I believe B.O. and his minions will ruin (run) all 58 States......

The best thing about Texas is it's too big for any one city to control it. ;)

[red state]

Yeah....that is a good option to have when evil swallows up everything else. What other "REPUBLIC" are we to flee to? Alaska is another HUGE State but it's problem (which is a problem that currently appeals to me) is that it can easily be taken over due to low (VERY LOW) numbers. It is also unsustainable as a large population as it depends on groceries being shipped there to a significant degree.

Thank GOD for Mississippi, Alabama and TEXAS. Unfortunately, Tennessee is falling victim to the same thing Florida fell for (immigrants both YANKEE and other).

[indago]

The only reason it's flown is in defiance of the Union...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6E2oUvvbw0

[indago]

So? Defying the Useless States of America is protected by the First Amendment. So I'd say it's beyond time people quit whining about it.

I'm Southern 'til the day I die. So are my kids. Heritage, not hate.

http://i60.tinypic.com/drcksm.jpg

[Kathianne]

So? Defying the Useless States of America is protected by the First Amendment. So I'd say it's beyond time people quit whining about it.

I'm Southern 'til the day I die. So are my kids. Heritage, not hate.

Oh people are free to whine about it, also protected by the 1st.

[aboutime]

We all are smart enough to know. The removal of that flag is nothing but a contrived, band-aid, and lousy excuse to satisfy the endless whining, insulted, offended Uneducated among us who always need an EXCUSE to hide their real intentions. Which is. Political Correctness, Liberalism, and Socialism being combined to appease the WEAK MINDED Americans who blame their own STUPIDITY, and IGNORANCE on a FLAG???

Really? We have a COWARD, and a WUSS pretending to be a president, and an enemy of his own nation who will happily surrender everything we have as a nation to APPEASE his Ignorance.

[Gunny]

http://i60.tinypic.com/drcksm.jpg

Y'think? Maybe y'all yankees need to look at where the vast majority of the military is located. Hint: it ain't in the North. Then maybe you need to take a look at who is IN that military. Southerners. You yankees got more important shit to do like hide.

Then you can take a look at Texas. The 12th largest economy in the WORLD. We can buy you.

Let me know when some logic reeks into that brain housing group.

You're lucky Robert E. Lee was the man he was or we'd STILL be at war.

[CSM]

Y'think? Maybe y'all yankees need to look at where the vast majority of the military is located. Hint: it ain't in the North. Then maybe you need to take a look at who is IN that military. Southerners. You yankees got more important shit to do like hide.

Then you can take a look at Texas. The 12th largest economy in the WORLD. We can buy you.

Let me know when some logic reeks into that brain housing group.

You're lucky Robert E. Lee was the man he was or we'd STILL be at war.

Easy there Gunny. I'm a granite Yankee and served for 30 years and currently have two sons serving and both of them are Yankees too. Not all Yankees are from Boston... just sayin....

[Gunny]

Easy there Gunny. I'm a granite Yankee and served for 30 years and currently have two sons serving and both of them are Yankees too. Not all Yankees are from Boston... just sayin....

Massachusetts?

I did my 21. I liken it to my relationship with my little brother. I can beat his ass, but don't come around here. You touch my brother and it ain't going to be pretty.

In the meantime, you're a damn yankee.:laugh:

Here's a tidbit for you: I'm a direct descendent of John Adams and John Q Adams. That IS my mother's maiden name. And trust me, when we lived in DC they went and did all the damned research at the National Archives. So ... my family resided in Boston back in the day. :)

[CSM]

Massachusetts?

I did my 21. I liken it to my relationship with my little brother. I can beat his ass, but don't come around here. You touch my brother and it ain't going to be pretty.

In the meantime, you're a damn yankee.:laugh:

Here's a tidbit for you: I'm a direct descendent of John Adams and John Q Adams. That IS my mother's maiden name. And trust me, when we lived in DC they went and did all the damned research at the National Archives. So ... my family resided in Boston back in the day. :)

Definitely not Massachusetts... I'm from and still reside in New Hampshire. Biggest problem we have is keeping the darn refugees from crossing the border. I understand the whole brother analogy...

[Gunny]

Definitely not Massachusetts... I'm from and still reside in New Hampshire. Biggest problem we have is keeping the darn refugees from crossing the border. I understand the whole brother analogy...

I guess I shouldn't ask, but .... did you know the face fell off your mountain? :laugh:

I have actual 60s circa pics of that (The Old Man of the Mountain) somewhere. When my dad was stationed in Key West my Cub Scout den mother and her family were from NH. I played Little League with her boys.

The point is the dad was an F-102 pilot. You know, those birds the left said they didn't have when Bush was in? Must've been my imagination sitting in the cockpit of one.:laugh:

[CSM]

I guess I shouldn't ask, but .... did you know the face fell off your mountain? :laugh:

I have actual 60s circa pics of that (The Old Man of the Mountain) somewhere. When my dad was stationed in Key West my Cub Scout den mother and her family were from NH. I played Little League with her boys.

The point is the dad was an F-102 pilot. You know, those birds the left said they didn't have when Bush was in? Must've been my imagination sitting in the cockpit of one.:laugh:

The face didn't "fall off" ... he left because of all the damn liberals moving in from Mass.....

[Gunny]

The face didn't "fall off" ... he left because of all the damn liberals moving in from Mass.....

:laugh:

That's just wrong. :laugh:

[gabosaurus]

My maternal grandfather was a member of the Wehrmacht in 1945. He didn't like to talk about it, but he wasn't ashamed of it. He had a couple of flags from his military days. Didn't bring any of them with him when he emigrated to the U.S. with my grandmother. He didn't want to show disrespect for his new country.
All past flags of the U.S. belong in museums and history books. The Confederate flag is most prominent in the Deep South, where racism remains most prominent.
I agree that the Confederate flag represents heritage. It stands for a heritage of racial inequality. Of cotton plantations, people being held in lesser esteem than farm animals, of families separated and sold in open markets, of men shot dead for looking the wrong way and children forced to work long hours in fields.
If that is what you believe in, by all means continue to fly the flag.

[Gunny]

My maternal grandfather was a member of the Wehrmacht in 1945. He didn't like to talk about it, but he wasn't ashamed of it. He had a couple of flags from his military days. Didn't bring any of them with him when he emigrated to the U.S. with my grandmother. He didn't want to show disrespect for his new country.
All past flags of the U.S. belong in museums and history books. The Confederate flag is most prominent in the Deep South, where racism remains most prominent.
I agree that the Confederate flag represents heritage. It stands for a heritage of racial inequality. Of cotton plantations, people being held in lesser esteem than farm animals, of families separated and sold in open markets, of men shot dead for looking the wrong way and children forced to work long hours in fields.
If that is what you believe in, by all means continue to fly the flag.

Try again. Racism is most prominent in the upper Midwest.

[Kathianne]

Try again. Racism is most prominent in the upper Midwest.

Racism exists everywhere, the issues in my mind is whether or not folks exercise reasonable control; recognize that other citizens have the same rights, regardless of differences. It's one thing for a person to feel that 'folks should stick with their own,' knowing others hold different feelings. Now if one feels the 'own' type of thing, they are the ones that will have to move to get away if others 'start moving' towards them. They cannot resort to violence or discrimination to keep what isn't theirs.

If their children or friends or other family decide they wish relations with 'others' those wanting their 'own' have to make decisions-whether or not to keep their relations.

[Perianne]

Racism exists everywhere, the issues in my mind is whether or not folks exercise reasonable control; recognize that other citizens have the same rights, regardless of differences. It's one thing for a person to feel that 'folks should stick with their own,' knowing others hold different feelings. Now if one feels the 'own' type of thing, they are the ones that will have to move to get away if others 'start moving' towards them. They cannot resort to violence or discrimination to keep what isn't theirs.

If their children or friends or other family decide they wish relations with 'others' those wanting their 'own' have to make decisions-whether or not to keep their relations.

My mother married an "other". The abuse I received from him has scarred me to this very day. A nine year-old little girl should not have to experience what I did. I left home the day after my 18th birthday and never looked back.

[Kathianne]

My mother married an "other". The abuse I received from him has scarred me to this very day. A nine year-old little girl should not have to experience what I did. I left home the day after my 18th birthday and never looked back.

I'm sorry that happened to you. Would it have been better if he wasn't an 'other?'

[LongTermGuy]

I'm sorry that happened to you. Would it have been better if he wasn't an 'other?'


*Common ...you know it wouldn't have made a difference.....it is what it was.

[Kathianne]

*Common ...you know it wouldn't have made a difference.....it is what it was.

I was responding to Perianne, she brought up the 'other' rather than just sexual abuse. I agree that abuse of a child is unforgivable regardless of the sex or race of the adult.

[Gunny]

Racism exists everywhere, the issues in my mind is whether or not folks exercise reasonable control; recognize that other citizens have the same rights, regardless of differences. It's one thing for a person to feel that 'folks should stick with their own,' knowing others hold different feelings. Now if one feels the 'own' type of thing, they are the ones that will have to move to get away if others 'start moving' towards them. They cannot resort to violence or discrimination to keep what isn't theirs.

If their children or friends or other family decide they wish relations with 'others' those wanting their 'own' have to make decisions-whether or not to keep their relations.

Bigotry exists everywhere. I don't disagree. Grey wolves don't like white wolves. It's an animal thing.

Where you have to draw the argument line is: Where does the First Amendment end and stupidity begins? This clown got on an internet site that preaches hate and he bought off on it. Not unlike a few people we know.:laugh:

The flag is a symbol and the firearm a tool. There are however people who get on the net to do nothing but preach hatred. And what better to preach about than something that is different?

But I don't see a difference between the politicans and media knee-jerking and dumbasses like Roof.

[Perianne]

I'm sorry that happened to you. Would it have been better if he wasn't an 'other?'

No, it would not have made a difference at all. And I have thought of that many times. But, like LTG said, it is what it was. I can't change that he was black and HE was the one doing stuff to my body. It has scarred me in that pictures, video, and print of angry Negroes stir a lot of emotions in me. And face it, we see it every danged day now.

[Olivia]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7380&stc=1

[Perianne]

Olivia!!!! Great to see you!

The place has picked up lately. I hope you stay around and add to the fun.

[Perianne]

For those of you who don't know Olivia, she is Perianne on steroids!!! I love her.

[Gunny]

For those of you who don't know Olivia, she is Perianne on steroids!!! I love her.

Your flag's bigger than mine. Gonna have to fix THAT crap.

[Perianne]

Your flag's bigger than mine. Gonna have to fix THAT crap.

And mine's erect.


Geez, did I say that??? lol

[indago]

Y'think? Maybe y'all yankees need to look at where the vast majority of the military is located. Hint: it ain't in the North. Then maybe you need to take a look at who is IN that military. Southerners. You yankees got more important shit to do like hide.

Then you can take a look at Texas. The 12th largest economy in the WORLD. We can buy you.

Let me know when some logic reeks into that brain housing group.

You're lucky Robert E. Lee was the man he was or we'd STILL be at war.

You ARE still at war, waving that flag in defiance!

[Olivia]

And mine's erect.


Geez, did I say that??? lol




:lmao:

[Gunny]

And mine's erect.


Geez, did I say that??? lol

You are S-O-O-O fired.:laugh:

[Gunny]

You ARE still at war, waving that flag in defiance!

Beats standing for nothing, doesn't it?

[aboutime]

Beats standing for nothing, doesn't it?


Gunny. Indago knows a lot about waving certain flags, like....http://icansayit.com/images/whiteflag.jpg

Like Obama waved it on his apology tour overseas, and every day since.

[Gunny]

Gunny. Indago knows a lot about waving certain flags, like....http://icansayit.com/images/whiteflag.jpg

Like Obama waved it on his apology tour overseas, and every day since.

Maggie's drawers.

[Perianne]

Maggie's drawers.

Who is Maggie?

[Kathianne]

No, it would not have made a difference at all. And I have thought of that many times. But, like LTG said, it is what it was. I can't change that he was black and HE was the one doing stuff to my body. It has scarred me in that pictures, video, and print of angry Negroes stir a lot of emotions in me. And face it, we see it every danged day now.

Perianne, thank you for your honesty. You're right, on both it wouldn't matter and what happened, happened, and you were traumatized. I really do get that, I'll say some prayers that you do have some healing.

I don't know if it helps or not, I know you've seen some of the 'forgiveness words family of the Charleston victims have said, it might help to try and read more about the 'good people,' save condemnation for those that deserve it, including the bastard your mom married.

[Kathianne]

Bigotry exists everywhere. I don't disagree. Grey wolves don't like white wolves. It's an animal thing.

Where you have to draw the argument line is: Where does the First Amendment end and stupidity begins? This clown got on an internet site that preaches hate and he bought off on it. Not unlike a few people we know.:laugh:

The flag is a symbol and the firearm a tool. There are however people who get on the net to do nothing but preach hatred. And what better to preach about than something that is different?

But I don't see a difference between the politicans and media knee-jerking and dumbasses like Roof.

The difference is that Roof murdered 9 people. I don't see a lot of differences between those that preach hate, on websites, messageboards, meetings, or from political or church pulpits. Hate hurts the hater, when they also 'share' their hatred, they may be inspiring someone like Roof. Like I said in another post, it's like the ISIS recruiters, few answer, but when they do we all may be paying the price down the road.

[gabosaurus]

Wal-Mart opens early for closeout sale on Southern Heritage merchandise.

http://runt-of-the-web.com/walmart-confederate-flag?utm_source=pbhfb&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=fborganic

[Gunny]

Who is Maggie?

LMAO. Miss Did not hit. Maggie's Drawers. They wave a white spotter across the target back and forth to indicate a miss. :laugh:

[Gunny]

The difference is that Roof murdered 9 people. I don't see a lot of differences between those that preach hate, on websites, messageboards, meetings, or from political or church pulpits. Hate hurts the hater, when they also 'share' their hatred, they may be inspiring someone like Roof. Like I said in another post, it's like the ISIS recruiters, few answer, but when they do we all may be paying the price down the road.

What's that got to do with anything, kath? One person's evil work indicts an entire segment of society?

So we can almost agree? This idiot acted on his own? Or does the hate speech he envelopes himself in do it?

[Olivia]

Nobody is saying — at least I'm not suggesting — that folks "have to give it up". It can be neatly folded, placed into a trunk of historical memorabilia in the attic, and taken out from time to time to reminisce over.





The tyranny of the minority.

[Gunny]

What's that got to do with anything, kath? One person's evil work indicts an entire segment of society?

So we can almost agree? This idiot acted on his own? Or does the hate speech he envelopes himself in do it?

Gunny, I was responding to your line, [QUOTE]..."But I don't see a difference between the politicans and media knee-jerking and dumbasses like Roof."

:)

[Olivia]

I'm sorry that happened to you. Would it have been better if he wasn't an 'other?'






With all due respect that's disrespectful

[Kathianne]

With all due respect that's disrespectful
With all due respect, she brought it up and we haven't had a problem with the discussion. I'm not disrespectful to Perianne at all, we do have different perspectives on some topics, but we work through them or let it go.

[Kathianne]

What's that got to do with anything, kath? One person's evil work indicts an entire segment of society?

So we can almost agree? This idiot acted on his own? Or does the hate speech he envelopes himself in do it?

Gunny, I was responding to your line, ..."But I don't see a difference between the politicans and media knee-jerking and dumbasses like Roof."

[Jeff]

My maternal grandfather was a member of the Wehrmacht in 1945. He didn't like to talk about it, but he wasn't ashamed of it. He had a couple of flags from his military days. Didn't bring any of them with him when he emigrated to the U.S. with my grandmother. He didn't want to show disrespect for his new country.
All past flags of the U.S. belong in museums and history books. The Confederate flag is most prominent in the Deep South, where racism remains most prominent.
I agree that the Confederate flag represents heritage. It stands for a heritage of racial inequality. Of cotton plantations, people being held in lesser esteem than farm animals, of families separated and sold in open markets, of men shot dead for looking the wrong way and children forced to work long hours in fields.
If that is what you believe in, by all means continue to fly the flag.

Again you speak through a paper ass, I have lived in NJ, SC and now GA. I have been all over this Country and I can tell you without a doubt the racism is 10 times worse in the NE, hell you have blacks hating other blacks because they are dark enough. Neighborhoods that are all white or all black, in the south yes there is racism but it is much more quiet, people live black and white together. Like I sad you will never end racism all together but the south is a place that should be shown to the rest of the world, hell look at Charleston now remember Baltimore, yea I would say it is way worse in the south. :rolleyes:

Places in NJ like Newark for Blacks Short Hills for white are so full of racisit it isn't funny.

[Gunny]

My mother married an "other". The abuse I received from him has scarred me to this very day. A nine year-old little girl should not have to experience what I did. I left home the day after my 18th birthday and never looked back.


I was responding to Perianne, she brought up the 'other' rather than just sexual abuse. I agree that abuse of a child is unforgivable regardless of the sex or race of the adult.


No, it would not have made a difference at all. And I have thought of that many times. But, like LTG said, it is what it was. I can't change that he was black and HE was the one doing stuff to my body. It has scarred me in that pictures, video, and print of angry Negroes stir a lot of emotions in me. And face it, we see it every danged day now.


Gunny, I was responding to your line, ..."But I don't see a difference between the politicans and media knee-jerking and dumbasses like Roof."

Black and Hispanic men treat women like second class citizens.

[hjmick]

Again you speak through a paper ass, I have lived in NJ, SC and now GA. I have been all over this Country and I can tell you without a doubt the racism is 10 times worse in the NE, hell you have blacks hating other blacks because they are dark enough. Neighborhoods that are all white or all black, in the south yes there is racism but it is much more quiet, people live black and white together. Like I sad you will never end racism all together but the south is a place that should be shown to the rest of the world, hell look at Charleston now remember Baltimore, yea I would say it is way worse in the south. :rolleyes:

Places in NJ like Newark for Blacks Short Hills for white are so full of racisit it isn't funny.


The most segregated schools in the U.S. are in New York...

The Nation's Most Segregated Schools Aren't Where You'd Think They'd Be (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/26/new-york-schools-segregated_n_5034455.html)

[indago]

The tyranny of the minority.

What "tyranny"?

[Kathianne]

Black and Hispanic men treat women like second class citizens.

Really, all of them? I know some that are as decent as white guys I know. So you have some links regarding minorities, socio-economic class and dating behaviors?

[Kathianne]

The most segregated schools in the U.S. are in New York...

The Nation's Most Segregated Schools Aren't Where You'd Think They'd Be (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/26/new-york-schools-segregated_n_5034455.html)

Seems to me that Chicago too has had more than a few problems with this.

Here in AZ it's the Native Americans who seem to get the shitty end regarding schools-in a state near the bottom of all 50!

[revelarts]

What's that got to do with anything, kath? One person's evil work indicts an entire segment of society?

So we can almost agree? This idiot acted on his own? Or does the hate speech he envelopes himself in do it?


you know I'm fine with that type of thinking as long as it's consistent.

But over the past several months --few years-- some people have blamed OBAMA!:mad:! and Al Sharpton!:eek:! for the Fergeson rioters, the baltimore idiots, and anything else some idiot criminals in black neighborhoods went overboard with.
But OBAMA!http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/smilies/mad.png! and even Al Sharpton!http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/smilies/eek.png! said NOTHING like what Roof was reading and hearing from these WHITE FEAR sites.

I don't remember if you were in that chorus Gunny.

But i don't remember many saying the individual rioters are SOLEY to blame and are SINGULARLY responsible and it's just the criminal individuals who went off and did wrong. Don't indict an entire segment of society or what Obama or Sharpton or real and imagined black culture and the like.

maybe i missed all the post like that.
I did see a fair amount of it's not white people's or LEOs fault for anything bad that's ever happened to blacks to maybe spark legit protest ever. nothing in the the past 30 years or so. Everything's been just perfectly fine with the LEOs and racially until Obama!:mad:! started outside agitating.
And everything negative in the black community has all 100% completely been brought on themselves because (fill in the blank bad actions/attitude/animals....).

But with Roof we have to be mindful to CAREFULLY separate his SINGULAR action away from those that have the SAME or similar mindset and ideology. And imagine that basically everyone else that waves a rebel flag and goes to White FEAR sites will never really be influenced negatively in the same way on anyone else. That those WHITE FEAR sites and groups , words and culture don't really feed into anyones racist tendencies ---violent or not--- at all... ever.
Roof is just singularly evil,
evil that popped outta nowhere fully formed rootless with a rebel flag in his hand. right?

[Olivia]

With all due respect, she brought it up and we haven't had a problem with the discussion. I'm not disrespectful to Perianne at all, we do have different perspectives on some topics, but we work through them or let it go.




I think think asking her if it would have been better if it wasn't an other was a little out there. Abuse and mostest action ain't good no matter who does it.

[Kathianne]

I think think asking her if it would have been better if it wasn't an other was a little out there. Abuse and mostest action ain't good no matter who does it.
What is 'mostest'?

Perianne is vastly capable of putting me in place if she feels the need. I too haven't a problem addressing her. In fact, we may be a true case of opposites attracting. No, NOT like THAT!

[Perianne]

What is 'mostest'?

Perianne is vastly capable of putting me in place if she feels the need. I too haven't a problem addressing her. In fact, we may be a true case of opposites attracting. No, NOT like THAT!

You are kinda cute!!! lol

[red state]

Again you speak through a paper ass, I have lived in NJ, SC and now GA. I have been all over this Country and I can tell you without a doubt the racism is 10 times worse in the NE, hell you have blacks hating other blacks because they are dark enough. Neighborhoods that are all white or all black, in the south yes there is racism but it is much more quiet, people live black and white together. Like I sad you will never end racism all together but the south is a place that should be shown to the rest of the world, hell look at Charleston now remember Baltimore, yea I would say it is way worse in the south. :rolleyes:

Places in NJ like Newark for Blacks Short Hills for white are so full of racisit it isn't funny.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Jeff again.
So, I'll stay with issuing these :clap:out since Jim can't improve our FREEDOM of

issuing what to whom and when we like for as many times as we like. He's your brother......get him to fix it or call the GEEK squad. U get 10 of them for

that ample serving of TRUTH! I've said much the same thing in another forum and the libs/yanks were shocked to hear it. They watch too much TV.
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:​: clap:

[red state]

you know I'm fine with that type of thinking as long as it's consistent.

But over the past several months --few years--evil that popped outta nowhere fully formed rootless with a rebel flag in his hand. right? POST # 77

Really, as far as my understanding goes, those bashing B.O., Holder and Sharpton were pointing out that they are always one-sided and coming in with bucket so petrol to throw on a fire! Do they matter in what they say? YES. Do they handle things one-sidedly? YES. Should a president stick his warty nose in such things? NO Should a half black S.O.W. say the word N----r? Definitely NO!!! So what is your point Rev......other than put words in most of our mouths here? The obvious to me is that you have mis-interpreted our bashing those scum-bags. You can agree with me that they are scumbags adding fuel to a flame can't you?

[Gunny]

Nathan Bedford Forrest and JEB Stuart kicked the shit out of Sheridan's and Sherman's asses. Why do you think they got sent away? Both of those scumbags used terrorism as a weapon beating up on women and kids because they couldn't stand on a battlefield with real men.

Let's play.

[revelarts]

POST # 77

Really, as far as my understanding goes, those bashing B.O., Holder and Sharpton were pointing out that they are always one-sided and coming in with bucket so petrol to throw on a fire! Do they matter in what they say? YES. Do they handle things one-sidedly? YES. Should a president stick his warty nose in such things? NO Should a half black S.O.W. say the word N----r? Definitely NO!!! So what is your point Rev......other than put words in most of our mouths here? The obvious to me is that you have mis-interpreted our bashing those scum-bags. You can agree with me that they are scumbags adding fuel to a flame can't you?

I can agree that Obama has handled many of these events poorly. And commented prematurely and unwisely on several occasions. And ruined many ops to highlight some real issues by following the media instead of leading it.
But i don't agree that when a some tragedy happens that presidents have to sit back and watch and keep there mouths shut. I agreed with Bush when he commented on the Terry Shivo medical case and when Bush weighed in briefly on school shootings after the Amish shooting incident.
Presidents can address (talk about) whatever issues they like. Bully pulpit and all that. It doesn't mean any of them will say what we want to hear, or they will be helpful.

But i don't agree that he "put fuel on the fire" by EVERYthing he said or did. I think he did poorly attempt to put OUT fires by saying "STAY CLAM" which he said over and over in various venues (now I may be wrong, If so I PRE-apologize,). But i seem to remember at least one person here saying that that wasn't what he or others "REALLY WANTED". That Obama,Sharpton,Holder and or the victims families "REALLY" wanted riots.
In other places Obama is accused of hoping for or fomenting "race war (http://Race War in America – Fomented by Our President?)" "race war (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?49620-Savage-Obama-may-arm-U-S-gangs-for-race-war)" "race wa (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?32456-Black-Panthers-Gear-Up-For-Race-War)r" "race war (http://TWO NYC COPS ASSASSINATED BY BLACK THUG: Sharpton’s, DeBlasio’s And Obama’s Race War)" "race riots (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?41895-How-to-Prepare-for-the-Pending-Race-Riots)" "race wa (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?36614-Police-investigate-racist-rant)r" "race war (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?41877-Lombard-Street-Riot)" and things of that nature.

So IMO It's one thing NOT to agree with their comments, but to say that they WANTED riots after they DIRECTLY called for CALM and PEACE. I don't get that.

But today we see that Roof reads direct passionate admonitions about hating... fearing really... minorities but that influence is played down as not significantly relevant by some. And noone seems concerned that these sites are fomenting a "race wars" even when Roof DIRECTLY says he wants a "race war". But when Obama said, "we should investigate the fergeson police dept. to look into years of complaints by the Black residents their..."
the reaction here is like ---LOOK, OBAMA is RACIST HATES COPS AND WHITE PEOPLE, only BELIEVES BLACKS!!! Why is he INVESTIGATING???! AHHHHH!! Obama's just a RACIST!!! Holders a Racist!! Sharptons a FAT racist for MAKING UP accusations and daring to question the pure and righteous integrity and selfless work of the sainted POLICE anywhere in Americaaaaa!--
:flyflag:.

notice i DID NOT put quotes around ANY of the above. The above is whats called a caricature or hyperbole. but it's not far from the way it sometimes comes across to me. Maybe it's not the way it's MEANT to come across.
But maybe you point me the hardcore racist PURE racist verbal content of Obama that IS equal to the content of the WHITE FEAR sites.

In other places I've believe i've read here (maybe elsewhere) that certain things are not really racist just prejudice. and prejudice which can be considered considered wise. But Obama isn't said to be a wise prejudice person but a hard core RACIST!! One that's RUINED the previously FINE race relations even

It's just odd to me folks.
To me his Unconstitutional acts on other issues are FAR worse than his so called racist actions and comments

[Perianne]

She'll have to remove her belly ring since it's now racist to wear it. Actually, I am going to buy one. You know, being a racist and all.

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--rZF0Y_an--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/17klcl71u0387jpg.jpg

[Perianne]

Also Tuesday, Minority Leader Harry Reid said the mascot and nickname of the University of Nevada, Las Vegas—the Runnin' Rebels—should be reconsidered by the school's Board of Regents. The school is well aware of its branding's ties to the Confederacy.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/politics/mitch-mcconnell-to-kentucky-capitol-lose-the-jefferson-davis-statue-20150623

[Jeff]

you know I'm fine with that type of thinking as long as it's consistent.

But over the past several months --few years-- some people have blamed OBAMA!:mad:! and Al Sharpton!:eek:! for the Fergeson rioters, the baltimore idiots, and anything else some idiot criminals in black neighborhoods went overboard with.
But OBAMA!:mad:! and even Al Sharpton!:eek:! said NOTHING like what Roof was reading and hearing from these WHITE FEAR sites.

I don't remember if you were in that chorus Gunny.

But i don't remember many saying the individual rioters are SOLEY to blame and are SINGULARLY responsible and it's just the criminal individuals who went off and did wrong. Don't indict an entire segment of society or what Obama or Sharpton or real and imagined black culture and the like.

maybe i missed all the post like that.
I did see a fair amount of it's not white people's or LEOs fault for anything bad that's ever happened to blacks to maybe spark legit protest ever. nothing in the the past 30 years or so. Everything's been just perfectly fine with the LEOs and racially until Obama!:mad:! started outside agitating.
And everything negative in the black community has all 100% completely been brought on themselves because (fill in the blank bad actions/attitude/animals....).

But with Roof we have to be mindful to CAREFULLY separate his SINGULAR action away from those that have the SAME or similar mindset and ideology. And imagine that basically everyone else that waves a rebel flag and goes to White FEAR sites will never really be influenced negatively in the same way on anyone else. That those WHITE FEAR sites and groups , words and culture don't really feed into anyones racist tendencies ---violent or not--- at all... ever.
Roof is just singularly evil,
evil that popped outta nowhere fully formed rootless with a rebel flag in his hand. right?

Rev tell me where and when the Klan or any other white supremacy group send in special investigators ??? Declare that Roof could be one of there kids ??? and the list goes on. Obama Sharpton and Jackson didn't cause the riots ( well in a way they had a big hand in it ) but they sure as hell added gas to the fire, Rev you are way to smart for this argument, don't embarrass yourself Bro.

[revelarts]

Rev tell me where and when the Klan or any other white supremacy group send in special investigators ??? Declare that Roof could be one of there kids ??? and the list goes on. Obama Sharpton and Jackson didn't cause the riots ( well in a way they had a big hand in it ) but they sure as hell added gas to the fire, Rev you are way to smart for this argument, don't embarrass yourself Bro.


Special investigators into claims of criminal activity is racist Jeff? Like this (http://articles.latimes.com/2010/nov/06/local/la-me-bart-cop-sentence-20101106). see video of event (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ1mCTQx3UI) . or the report of the long term police issue in Furguson here (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?48856-DOJ-report-on-Furgeson-Police-actions-and-e-mails-show&highlight=report)

Claiming a dead Black boy being dragged through the media could have been your own son is racist?
If he claimed one of the dead woman at the church could have been his mother maybe that'd be racist too? Even though many whites feel the same.
And a list as powerful as that those HORRORS of "racism" above goes on?.
That's what you consider racism when Obama does it?
I wonder that any whites are left alive today in america with such ATTACKS you your dignity, heritage, property and lives like the above!? "...could have been his SON?!" WTH?! RACIST!!! Worse than the N word from teachers, coaches, and media spokes people and any unjust beating with a plunger up your rectum at a NY police station ever was. "...could have been his SON?!" How offensive is THAT! THAT can ONLY mean He HATES WHITE PEOPLE!!!! WHAT ELSE?!? it's so obvious to me now jeff.

c'mon really? Look he jumped to conclusions on that one but he's a racist worse than the white supremacist sites Roof was feeding from? are you kidding me.
jeff really how out of proportion is that?

And here we go again
"Obama Sharpton and Jackson didn't cause the riots ( well in a way they had a big hand in it)":rolleyes:
But the clear WHITE FEAR racist sites and groups are ignored and minimized as not having a BIG or little hand in Roof's actions?

Look I think the white Fear/Supremacist sites are far and AWAY more hatful than anything Obama has said or done racially.

And I'm not embarrassed at all.
But I'm still waiting for that Obama "race war" predicted every year for the past 45 years. as soon as i catch a leprechaun. Or Iran attacks the U.S. with one Nuke (Been waiting since reagan for that one), Or the TSA catches a white handicapped Grandma bringing explosives on a plane in the U.S. for Isis.
fear

But hey maybe we'll just have to agree to disagree again.

[Gunny]

Special investigators into claims of criminal activity is racist Jeff? Like this (http://articles.latimes.com/2010/nov/06/local/la-me-bart-cop-sentence-20101106). see video of event (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ1mCTQx3UI) . or the report of the long term police issue in Furguson here (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?48856-DOJ-report-on-Furgeson-Police-actions-and-e-mails-show&highlight=report)

Claiming a dead Black boy being dragged through the media could have been your own son is racist?
If he claimed one of the dead woman at the church could have been his mother maybe that'd be racist too? Even though many whites feel the same.
And a list as powerful as that those HORRORS of "racism" above goes on?.
That's what you consider racism when Obama does it?
I wonder that any whites are left alive today in america with such ATTACKS you your dignity, heritage, property and lives like the above!? "...could have been his SON?!" WTH?! RACIST!!! Worse than the N word from teachers, coaches, and media spokes people and any unjust beating with a plunger up your rectum at a NY police station ever was. "...could have been his SON?!" How offensive is THAT! THAT can ONLY mean He HATES WHITE PEOPLE!!!! WHAT ELSE?!? it's so obvious to me now jeff.

c'mon really? Look he jumped to conclusions on that one but he's a racist worse than the white supremacist sites Roof was feeding from? are you kidding me.
jeff really how out of proportion is that?

And here we go again
"Obama Sharpton and Jackson didn't cause the riots ( well in a way they had a big hand in it)":rolleyes:
But the clear WHITE FEAR racist sites and groups are ignored and minimized as not having a BIG or little hand in Roof's actions?

Look I think the white Fear/Supremacist sites are far and AWAY more hatful than anything Obama has said or done racially.

And I'm not embarrassed at all.
But I'm still waiting for that Obama "race war" predicted every year for the past 45 years. as soon as i catch a leprechaun. Or Iran attacks the U.S. with one Nuke (Been waiting since reagan for that one), Or the TSA catches a white handicapped Grandma bringing explosives on a plane in the U.S. for Isis.
fear

But hey maybe we'll just have to agree to disagree again.

Can you EVER say anything in 3 sentences or less, Mr Wall of Words?

YOu're full of shit, yankee.

And tell me what battle you fuckwits won in Texas. I'll wait, but I won't hold hold my breath. Y'all got your asses kicked by a bunch of us Southern redneck folk and we even sent your Reconstruction Davis Police packing.

[Jeff]

Special investigators into claims of criminal activity is racist Jeff? Like this (http://articles.latimes.com/2010/nov/06/local/la-me-bart-cop-sentence-20101106). see video of event (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ1mCTQx3UI) . or the report of the long term police issue in Furguson here (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?48856-DOJ-report-on-Furgeson-Police-actions-and-e-mails-show&highlight=report)

Claiming a dead Black boy being dragged through the media could have been your own son is racist?
If he claimed one of the dead woman at the church could have been his mother maybe that'd be racist too? Even though many whites feel the same.
And a list as powerful as that those HORRORS of "racism" above goes on?.
That's what you consider racism when Obama does it?
I wonder that any whites are left alive today in america with such ATTACKS you your dignity, heritage, property and lives like the above!? "...could have been his SON?!" WTH?! RACIST!!! Worse than the N word from teachers, coaches, and media spokes people and any unjust beating with a plunger up your rectum at a NY police station ever was. "...could have been his SON?!" How offensive is THAT! THAT can ONLY mean He HATES WHITE PEOPLE!!!! WHAT ELSE?!? it's so obvious to me now jeff.

c'mon really? Look he jumped to conclusions on that one but he's a racist worse than the white supremacist sites Roof was feeding from? are you kidding me.
jeff really how out of proportion is that?

And here we go again
"Obama Sharpton and Jackson didn't cause the riots ( well in a way they had a big hand in it)":rolleyes:
But the clear WHITE FEAR racist sites and groups are ignored and minimized as not having a BIG or little hand in Roof's actions?

Look I think the white Fear/Supremacist sites are far and AWAY more hatful than anything Obama has said or done racially.

And I'm not embarrassed at all.
But I'm still waiting for that Obama "race war" predicted every year for the past 45 years. as soon as i catch a leprechaun. Or Iran attacks the U.S. with one Nuke (Been waiting since reagan for that one), Or the TSA catches a white handicapped Grandma bringing explosives on a plane in the U.S. for Isis.
fear

But hey maybe we'll just have to agree to disagree again.

Rev no need to go any further buddy, Michael Brown was found to of just committed strong armed robbery, he attacked a cop and the cop was found innocent, maybe just maybe if these hero's of yours waited for the investigation to go on they wouldn't of put their foot in their mouth.

AS for the poor dead boy, you mean the dope head on FB aiming a gun at the camera, again the kid was a thug, he beat up a bus driver just weeks before he got what was coming to him, see Rev sometimes we must look past the color of ones skin.

You consider anything the WHITE DEVIL does as racism , so why shouldn't the president of the United States who swore to with hold the constitition for all Americans white and black alike not be called on his racisit ways.

Yes Rev if he made it personal and said if he had a mother she could of looked like those dead at the church yes it would be racial, Obama was elected to represent all Americans, and I have yet to see him call for special investigation for anything other than some thug getting taken out.

I am waiting for the war as well Rev, see because it wont be black on white, it will be scum bag racist thugs that get blown away by whites, much like opening day of hunting season.

Rev real simple, Black good White bad, personally I think more of you rev, I truly think you are way better than that, open your eyes, Charleston just broke it off in your ass and every other racist's ass in the country, yes white and Black came together to mourn 9 innocnt folks, forget color, forget flags, they where 9 innocent folks, but folks like you turn this into a racist thing, I haven't heard one white person say anything but how terrible that tragedy was, but I hear the likes of you and your kind screaming racism, yes the preacher in SC said they where sending a message to folks like you.

[revelarts]

Rev no need to go any further buddy, Michael Brown was found to of just committed strong armed robbery, he attacked a cop and the cop was found innocent, maybe just maybe if these hero's of yours waited for the investigation to go on they wouldn't of put their foot in their mouth.

AS for the poor dead boy, you mean the dope head on FB aiming a gun at the camera, again the kid was a thug, he beat up a bus driver just weeks before he got what was coming to him, see Rev sometimes we must look past the color of ones skin.

You consider anything the WHITE DEVIL does as racism , so why shouldn't the president of the United States who swore to with hold the constitition for all Americans white and black alike not be called on his racisit ways.

Yes Rev if he made it personal and said if he had a mother she could of looked like those dead at the church yes it would be racial, Obama was elected to represent all Americans, and I have yet to see him call for special investigation for anything other than some thug getting taken out.

I am waiting for the war as well Rev, see because it wont be black on white, it will be scum bag racist thugs that get blown away by whites, much like opening day of hunting season.

Rev real simple, Black good White bad, personally I think more of you rev, I truly think you are way better than that, open your eyes, Charleston just broke it off in your ass and every other racist's ass in the country, yes white and Black came together to mourn 9 innocnt folks, forget color, forget flags, they where 9 innocent folks, but folks like you turn this into a racist thing, I haven't heard one white person say anything but how terrible that tragedy was, but I hear the likes of you and your kind screaming racism, yes the preacher in SC said they where sending a message to folks like you.


ah well yeah, we just disagree.
and it's hard for some to imagine walking in others moccasins.

Look Jeff I'm very happy with the Charleston's response to these murders. And In fact I'd be even MORE please if one day soon Roof became a real christian brother and trusted in Jesus, gave up his hate and i met him in Heaven. (after his execution).
But the Christians families responses and the Charleston community's unity in the face of this has been extremely refreshing a model. If -God Forbid- similar happens elsewhere hope this kind of response becomes TYPICAL, a model for peace. Even if the race roles are reversed.

I wonder if you might find it in your heart to forgive Obama, or others, for their horrific over the top "racism" and all the negative effects it's had your life. BTW couldn't Travon have been your son too? You've had a bit of rowdy past should you have gotten what you had coming... still coming to you i guess right?

[Jeff]

ah well yeah, we just disagree.
and it's hard for some to imagine walking in others moccasins.

Look Jeff I'm very happy with the Charleston's response to these murders. And In fact I'd be even MORE please if one day soon Roof became a real christian brother and trusted in Jesus, gave up his hate and i met him in Heaven. (after his execution).
But the Christians families responses and the Charleston community's unity in the face of this has been extremely refreshing a model. If -God Forbid- similar happens elsewhere hope this kind of response becomes TYPICAL, a model for peace. Even if the race roles are reversed.

I wonder if you might find it in your heart to forgive Obama, or others, for their horrific over the top "racism" and all the negative effects it's had your life. BTW couldn't Travon have been your son too? You've had a bit of rowdy past should you have gotten what you had coming... still coming to you i guess right?

Rev I have forgiven them, see I don't believe it is up to me to judge, we speak on these pages of what we see, and yes I see Obama in sighting a lot of these things, but he must answer to a much higher power than me, as for Roof, I commend you for your thoughts, honestly Rev I have a real problem there, I know the right thing to do is forgive him, but man that is hard for me, I am working on it but he destroyed 9 families, let alone the friends of said families. Like I said I know the right way but I would be lying if I told you yea sure I have forgiven him. And my entire paragraph here is weird, I say I forgive Obama and I have but not Roof and I am not sure if I have, the difference being is I believe Obama pumped things up, Roof did the deed.

OOO and as far as my son, no not possible, yup I had a shady past, but I never prayed on the weak. My kids are tough as nails and take nothing from no body, but they are respectful and honest, today it is going to be over a 100 as it has been and for the last 2 weeks they have been working in chicken houses, my boys take nothing from no one and will probably do things wrong as most kids do, but no they won't be beating up old men that drive a bus , nor will they be on Fb aiming guns at the camera and trying to be a gansta, see my kids have Fb, but I check it at least once a week.

[Gunny]

ah well yeah, we just disagree.
and it's hard for some to imagine walking in others moccasins.

Look Jeff I'm very happy with the Charleston's response to these murders. And In fact I'd be even MORE please if one day soon Roof became a real christian brother and trusted in Jesus, gave up his hate and i met him in Heaven. (after his execution).
But the Christians families responses and the Charleston community's unity in the face of this has been extremely refreshing a model. If -God Forbid- similar happens elsewhere hope this kind of response becomes TYPICAL, a model for peace. Even if the race roles are reversed.

I wonder if you might find it in your heart to forgive Obama, or others, for their horrific over the top "racism" and all the negative effects it's had your life. BTW couldn't Travon have been your son too? You've had a bit of rowdy past should you have gotten what you had coming... still coming to you i guess right?

No, we DON'T "just disagree". You're WRONG. Again and as usual.

See how that works?

[Gunny]

Rev I have forgiven them, see I don't believe it is up to me to judge, we speak on these pages of what we see, and yes I see Obama in sighting a lot of these things, but he must answer to a much higher power than me, as for Roof, I commend you for your thoughts, honestly Rev I have a real problem there, I know the right thing to do is forgive him, but man that is hard for me, I am working on it but he destroyed 9 families, let alone the friends of said families. Like I said I know the right way but I would be lying if I told you yea sure I have forgiven him. And my entire paragraph here is weird, I say I forgive Obama and I have but not Roof and I am not sure if I have, the difference being is I believe Obama pumped things up, Roof did the deed.

The fact is, it is not the President of the United States' business to interfere nor comment on states' matters. Nixon almost blew the Manson trial in 69 by pronouncing him guilty, in living black and white on the tube. If he'd run this NATION half as well as he comments on states' issues he might actually do a half-ass job at it.

[Gunny]

http://www.nationaljournal.com/politics/mitch-mcconnell-to-kentucky-capitol-lose-the-jefferson-davis-statue-20150623

This from the moron that hated tourists in the Capitol because according to him, they stink. He's got about as much credibility as my kitten who is dumb as shit.:laugh:

[Perianne]

http://www.nationaljournal.com/politics/mitch-mcconnell-to-kentucky-capitol-lose-the-jefferson-davis-statue-20150623


This from the moron that hated tourists in the Capitol because according to him, they stink. He's got about as much credibility as my kitten who is dumb as shit.:laugh:

Little kittens are cute!! McConnell is my senator and he is not cute.

Anyway, more piling on from liberals:


Because America's third president owned slaves

The debate over whether to remove Confederate flags from government buildings took a bizarre new twist yesterday when CNN host Ashleigh Banfield suggested that statues of Thomas Jefferson should also be taken down because he owned slaves.

During a segment with co-host Don Lemon, Banfield said, “Jefferson owned slaves….and there’s a monument to him in the capital of the United States, no one ever asks for that to come down – is it equal?”



https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=15&v=oXnEkoBI0zg

[Perianne]

More piling on, now from Arkansas:


FORT SMITH (KFSM)- A Fort Smith School Board committee passed a motion Tuesday (June 23) to ban the “Dixie” song during the 2015-2016 school year and to replace the rebel mascot for the 2016-2017 school year.

http://5newsonline.com/2015/06/23/school-board-votes-to-ban-dixie-song-rebel-mascot-at-southside-high-school/


http://media2.fdncms.com/arktimes/imager/u/blog/3916343/southside-high-school.jpg?cb=1435123513

[aboutime]

Please take a long look at all of the threads today.

Then, hopefully. Everyone will finally, and, at last see. WE ARE LITERALLY SCREWED!

[LongTermGuy]

Please take a long look at all of the threads today.

Then, hopefully. Everyone will finally, and, at last see. WE ARE LITERALLY SCREWED!
​Oh...understand...any suggestions or is it every law-abiding...intelligent hard working American man and women will have to fend for themselves when the time comes?

[Perianne]

Homo-loving Apple has removed a game from its AppStore because it has a Confederate Flag in the game. This censorship is way past out of hand. I will NEVER EVER buy another Apple product.


As you may have been already informed, Apple has removed our game from AppStore because of usage of the Confederate Flag. Ultimate General: Gettysburg could be accepted back if the flag is removed from the game's content.


We accept Apple's decision and understand that this is a sensitive issue for the American Nation. We wanted our game to be the most accurate, historical, playable reference of the Battle of Gettysburg. All historical commanders, unit composition and weaponry, key geographical locations to the smallest streams or farms are recreated in our game's battlefield.


We receive a lot of letters of gratitude from American teachers who use our game in history curriculum to let kids experience one of the most important battles in American history from the Commander's perspective.


Spielberg’s "Schindler's List" did not try to amend his movie to look more comfortable. The historical "Gettysburg" movie (1993) is still on iTunes. We believe that all historical art forms: books, movies, or games such as ours, help to learn and understand history, depicting events as they were. True stories are more important to us than money.


Therefore we are not going to amend the game's content and Ultimate General: Gettysburg will no longer be available on AppStore. We really hope that Apple’s decision will achieve the desired results.

We can’t change history, but we can change the future.

http://www.ultimategeneral.com/blog/our-game-has-been-removed-from-appstore

[LongTermGuy]

Homo-loving Apple has removed a game from its AppStore because it has a Confederate Flag in the game. This censorship is way past out of hand. I will NEVER EVER buy another Apple product.



http://www.ultimategeneral.com/blog/our-game-has-been-removed-from-appstore


Its a trendy "trend".... for the time being...among today's true racists and `their` Plantation owners....
When an American POTUS takes office....and the "changes" and cleaning up start...prepare for Looting and riots...for awhile.....the "PC" hand cuffs will be taken "off" "our" police and Military....the roaches will go back under the rocks the came from...until found .

[Perianne]

Its a trendy "trend".... for the time being...among today's true racists and `their` Plantation owners....
When an American POTUS takes office....and the "changes" and cleaning up start...prepare for Looting and riots...for awhile.....the "PC" hand cuffs will be taken "off" "our" police and Military....the roaches will go back under the rocks the came from...until found .

It can't happen soon enough for me.

[Voted4Reagan]

my question.... How long before THIS FLAG is banned?

http://wamu.org/sites/wamu.org/files/styles/headline_landscape/public/images/attach/07.04.13news-flickr-american-flag.jpg?itok=9S6PImYY

[aboutime]

my question.... How long before THIS FLAG is banned?

http://wamu.org/sites/wamu.org/files/styles/headline_landscape/public/images/attach/07.04.13news-flickr-american-flag.jpg?itok=9S6PImYY


V4R. They are busy right now, planning on ways to do JUST THAT!

The real RACISTS from the White House, to Louis Feverybodyhecan are all taking aim on
the destruction of this nation. Both Obama and the other D-heads who claim to be human beings, all want the Caliphate to succeed, and Obama's bosses in the Muslim Brotherhood are also instructing Liberals in Congress to either....OBEY, or LOSE.

Everybody is laughing when I tell them WE ARE SCREWED in this nation. Because I'm what they call a miserable OLD MAN. They don't want anybody to pay any attention to what I say.

Back in the late 30's, and early 40's. They laughed the same way.
But the young, who KNOW EVERYTHING today...do not want to know about History.
We all know what that means.

[grannyhawkins]

http://i60.tinypic.com/drcksm.jpg

That was quite tasteless!!!

[aboutime]

That was quite tasteless!!!


Granny. Indago only recognizes his own, personal flag; which is an example of his lifestyle.

We know it's tasteless, but then. We need to only consider the source. It answers all questions.

[grannyhawkins]

Group think is what's scarin me more than anything these days. It does seem, that we indeed, are bein run as a corporatocracy. All the major corporations are chompin at the bit, to be the first to align with the newest, progressive hot button issue. It all just seems to happen way too quickly, to seem almost orchestrated. There's a lot more goin on than what meets the eye I'm afeared and much more at stake, than the Stars an Bars!!!

[LongTermGuy]

Group think is what's scarin me more than anything these days. It does seem, that we indeed, are bein run as a corporatocracy. All the major corporations are chompin at the bit, to be the first to align with the newest, progressive hot button issue. It all just seems to happen way too quickly, to seem almost orchestrated. There's a lot more goin on than what meets the eye I'm afeared and much more at stake, than the Stars an Bars!!!



"There's a lot more goin on than what meets the eye"

​Amen Granny.....I smell it...

[Gunny]

Here's a job for you yankee leftwingers ... come down here an get your snowbirds and take them bakc to you yankee-ass states where you have no jobs and keep them? Except Jeff. I like Jeff, so he's adopted.

You come down here, make fun of the way we talk, the way we dress and the way we act while do just what yankees do -- steal our money. We don't need you and never have. You need us but you think your moron asses are so smart you get to tell us what to do.

You people talk stupid. You can'r cook Spagehttio's without screwing it up. And all you care about is taking away what others have earned. These farms and ranches don't get worked by pretending in some inner city rat-hole.

And just declare war and come on down, wimps. The Civil War won't end the way you think. You'll just be a different country with no money.

So rev, why don't you try to bring your ass and take my flag, my rifle, and my swords? Or do you think you can legislate me out of existence? Good luck with the latter, punk.

Southerners believe in the Constitution. Yankees just believe in the bureaucracy you call that POS gov't of yours.

[red state]

Here's a job for you yankee leftwingers ... come down here an get your snowbirds and take them bakc to you yankee-ass states where you have no jobs and keep them? Except Jeff. I like Jeff, so he's adopted.

You come down here, make fun of the way we talk, the way we dress and the way we act while do just what yankees do -- steal our money. We don't need you and never have. You need us but you think your moron asses are so smart you get to tell us what to do.

You people talk stupid. You can'r cook Spagehttio's without screwing it up. And all you care about is taking away what others have earned. These farms and ranches don't get worked by pretending in some inner city rat-hole.

And just declare war and come on down, wimps. The Civil War won't end the way you think. You'll just be a different country with no money.

So rev, why don't you try to bring your ass and take my flag, my rifle, and my swords? Or do you think you can legislate me out of existence? Good luck with the latter, punk.

Southerners believe in the Constitution. Yankees just believe in the bureaucracy you call that POS gov't of yours.

:clap::clap::clap:

[red state]

Group think is what's scarin me more than anything these days. It does seem, that we indeed, are bein run as a corporatocracy. All the major corporations are chompin at the bit, to be the first to align with the newest, progressive hot button issue. It all just seems to happen way too quickly, to seem almost orchestrated. There's a lot more goin on than what meets the eye I'm afeared and much more at stake, than the Stars an Bars!!!

Freak Shows, side lines and dark alleys to take away from the big picture; which is the coming election and ALL those MANY scandals.
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap: You are ALWAYS spot on, Granny!!!!

[Perianne]

Jeb Bush, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, all for removal of the Confederate flag.

Rubio and Cruz have not staked out a position.

Donald Trump said:


Only an idiot opposes the Confederate Flag” read Trump’s tweet. Trump continued to rant stating that the flag is apart of everyone’s heritage and should fly on every government building in the south.


http://newsbuzzdaily.com/donald-trump-only-an-idiot-opposes-the-confederate-flag/

[tailfins]

Jeb Bush, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, all for removal of the Confederate flag.

Rubio and Cruz have not staked out a position.

Donald Trump said:




http://newsbuzzdaily.com/donald-trump-only-an-idiot-opposes-the-confederate-flag/

More ear tickling. Donating a million dollars to the Sons of Confederate Veterans would be more convincing.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Group think is what's scarin me more than anything these days. It does seem, that we indeed, are bein run as a corporatocracy. All the major corporations are chompin at the bit, to be the first to align with the newest, progressive hot button issue. It all just seems to happen way too quickly, to seem almost orchestrated. There's a lot more goin on than what meets the eye I'm afeared and much more at stake, than the Stars an Bars!!!

Sorry but I missed this post granny, as it was made back during the time my wife's mother died suddenly in the Philippines.
You are headed in the right path-- that orchestrated part is done by single foreign entity--the Globalist group.
The same once pursuing an agenda for a One World Government.-Tyr

[grannyhawkins]

Sorry but I missed this post granny, as it was made back during the time my wife's mother died suddenly in the Philippines.
You are headed in the right path-- that orchestrated part is done by single foreign entity--the Globalist group.
The same once pursuing an agenda for a One World Government.-Tyr

Lost my Mom, the original Granny Hawkins, in early November. It wasn't totally unexpected, but when I saw her a few weeks earlier, I thought she had more time, that's what I get fur thinkin. Losin yur, Mom can take the fire outta ya fur a bit an while I'm still recoverin and can definitely relate to the sense of loss, as well as a sense of your own mortality, by Gawd, we got a country ta save for our children!!! Thar tain't no rest fur the weary!!! :salute:

[Perianne]

Lost my Mom, the original Granny Hawkins, in early November. It wasn't totally unexpected, but when I saw her a few weeks earlier, I thought she had more time, that's what I get fur thinkin. Losin yur, Mom can take the fire outta ya fur a bit an while I'm still recoverin and can definitely relate to the sense of loss, as well as a sense of your own mortality, by Gawd, we got a country ta save for our children!!! Thar tain't no rest fur the weary!!! :salute:

I am sorry for your loss, grannyhawkins.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Lost my Mom, the original Granny Hawkins, in early November. It wasn't totally unexpected, but when I saw her a few weeks earlier, I thought she had more time, that's what I get fur thinkin. Losin yur, Mom can take the fire outta ya fur a bit an while I'm still recoverin and can definitely relate to the sense of loss, as well as a sense of your own mortality, by Gawd, we got a country ta save for our children!!! Thar tain't no rest fur the weary!!! :salute:

I am very sorry to hear of your great loss my good friend. In the last two years I've lost my 38 year old niece
(my brother's youngest daughter), mother-in-law, brother-in-law and 3 really close friends..
Yep it knocks ya damn hard...


by Gawd, we got a country ta save for our children!!! Thar tain't no rest fur the weary!!
^^ I couldn't have said it any better my friend...

Mighty glad ta sez ya stil akikin en able to cipher and spel..
Sho's hop'in ya jest don't bez a stranger round des har parts my friend.

Sending you a pm after posting this reply.. ... -Tyr