Wrong or right?

[jimnyc]

As most of you know, my best friend Jerome has passed on. I'm still heartbroken. Against advice, I kinda still hold back the tears and kinda avoid discussing with others. To me, it's personal and he was literally my best friend.

Anyway. So I try not to say "Jerome" for now in front of the Chihuahua. The first few times afterwards, his tail was wagging and he kinda went looking around for him. It broke my heart to see that. He really seemed depressed for awhile. When the wife used his name several times, I very politely and sincerely explained what I just said, and further said "Please just leave it be for awhile. I see him searching and it kills me to see that. In time it will be better". The response?

"I'm not avoiding the subject like Voldemort. He's just a dog."

I believe she was talking about Porter with the "just a dog" comment, but it doesn't matter to me whether Porter or Jerome. If you feel one is just a dog, then I'm sure others as well. I then turned and said "Sure, just like Nero is JUST a cat". She adores him and lets him sleep with her. I don't know if I should have been surprised when she said the same, he's just a cat.

Am I wrong for trying to protect Porter for now? Is it wrong to feel like it hurts him, or makes him search, when he doesn't know for sure what happened? This re-opened a healing wound for me. :(

[revelarts]

i don't know Jim.

but it will get better

[PixieStix]

I had 3 American Eskimo's. They were buddies, First Rikki past, she was only 11. I loved her very much and when she past the other 2 Jeckyl, and Link, looked for her for weeks. I wondered if they thought I kicked her out. I felt bad for them. Then 4 years later Jeckyl became very ill, and he passed a few months later. My last Eskie, (Link) was really odd after than, he never slept in my room again, He made his new bed, right by the door as if he was looking for his dad (Jeckyl), or maybe he knew he was the only one to protect his family.
Link and all my other dogs were not JUST dogs. They were my friends and Link was totally my heart dog. Link lived to be 18 years old. I think he did not want to leave because he was just too happy. I still cry at times. I will always miss him.

I don't think you are wrong. Feelings are never wrong. They are something real to you. It is what you do with those feelings that matter.

Link was my best friend, and nobody should ever say that he was JUST a dog to me. I would then give them a long lecture on what the definition of a friend is.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7480&stc=1

[NightTrain]

Animals understand death. I don't think they mourn nearly like we do, but they do in their own way.

Remember Koko the 'talking' gorilla? They got her a kitten, because she kept signing that she wanted one. They were inseparable and Koko adored it. Then somehow, the kitten got run over by a car, and the researchers were trying to figure out how to tell the 800 pound gorilla about what happened to the kitten, and no one knew how she was going to react to the news.

Finally, the lead researcher went into the cage and told her that the kitten was dead, even though they had never discussed the concept of death before. She asked Koko if she understood, and the gorilla signed back that she did, that it was "the great sleep." As far as anyone knew, the gorilla had never seen anything dead before, and yet she knew and understood the concept, and "the great sleep" were her words to describe it.

I would handle it just like you are, with the avoidance of saying Jerome's name because of course Porter knows who you're referring to and that's going to remind him. Dogs are a lot more intelligent than people give them credit for.

[Gunny]

As most of you know, my best friend Jerome has passed on. I'm still heartbroken. Against advice, I kinda still hold back the tears and kinda avoid discussing with others. To me, it's personal and he was literally my best friend.

Anyway. So I try not to say "Jerome" for now in front of the Chihuahua. The first few times afterwards, his tail was wagging and he kinda went looking around for him. It broke my heart to see that. He really seemed depressed for awhile. When the wife used his name several times, I very politely and sincerely explained what I just said, and further said "Please just leave it be for awhile. I see him searching and it kills me to see that. In time it will be better". The response?

"I'm not avoiding the subject like Voldemort. He's just a dog."

I believe she was talking about Porter with the "just a dog" comment, but it doesn't matter to me whether Porter or Jerome. If you feel one is just a dog, then I'm sure others as well. I then turned and said "Sure, just like Nero is JUST a cat". She adores him and lets him sleep with her. I don't know if I should have been surprised when she said the same, he's just a cat.

Am I wrong for trying to protect Porter for now? Is it wrong to feel like it hurts him, or makes him search, when he doesn't know for sure what happened? This re-opened a healing wound for me. :(


Why hold back the tears? Real men cry. Sociopaths don't.

[jimnyc]

Why hold back the tears? Real men cry. Sociopaths don't.

Not as much holding them back as much as I find it personal. I like to grieve in my room, on my own time and such. I feel very awkward if I cry in front of others, or in public. So it's not as if they aren't there, trust me, they were and are.

And while I'll do so, I'll love Porter as my best friend as well, and protect him. It seemed to get him excited, or depressed, so I figured it would be wise to let him do his own thing as well. It's so recent that I'm not sure that he fully realizes he's not coming back yet. I think some might feel it's weird of me to protect him as such, to avoid routines and names, so as not to make HIM uncomfortable. Maybe it's partially for me too, but I say his name of course when not in front of the little guy.

[Gunny]

Not as much holding them back as much as I find it personal. I like to grieve in my room, on my own time and such. I feel very awkward if I cry in front of others, or in public. So it's not as if they aren't there, trust me, they were and are.

And while I'll do so, I'll love Porter as my best friend as well, and protect him. It seemed to get him excited, or depressed, so I figured it would be wise to let him do his own thing as well. It's so recent that I'm not sure that he fully realizes he's not coming back yet. I think some might feel it's weird of me to protect him as such, to avoid routines and names, so as not to make HIM uncomfortable. Maybe it's partially for me too, but I say his name of course when not in front of the little guy.

And that's your business. I respect that.

Feeling it's your job to be responsible for others can mess up your head. You can't stop death. None of us can.

[Abbey Marie]

Not as much holding them back as much as I find it personal. I like to grieve in my room, on my own time and such. I feel very awkward if I cry in front of others, or in public. So it's not as if they aren't there, trust me, they were and are.

And while I'll do so, I'll love Porter as my best friend as well, and protect him. It seemed to get him excited, or depressed, so I figured it would be wise to let him do his own thing as well. It's so recent that I'm not sure that he fully realizes he's not coming back yet. I think some might feel it's weird of me to protect him as such, to avoid routines and names, so as not to make HIM uncomfortable. Maybe it's partially for me too, but I say his name of course when not in front of the little guy.


Kindness and compassion are never weird. Or wrong.


http://themighty.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/bipolar9-copy.jpg

[Abbey Marie]

Just saw this quote, no attribution.

"If we could live happy and healthy lives without harming others... why wouldn't we?"

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Why hold back the tears? Real men cry. Sociopaths don't.

I cried when my dad died--but it was three years later(age 18). I cried when two of my babies were born dead (21 and 25) ,,,
I cried when my first dog was deliberately ran over (age 10)...
Yet , I've been cut with a knife, hit on the head with a pool cue, iron bar , wooden chair leg and tire tool --never cried a damn tear.. older brother shot me in the ass with an arrow--hurt like hell (age12)-no tears..
Some things are worth crying over--others are not--losing a beloved dog is always worth it IMHO.

LET ANYBODY TRY TO TELL ME I AM NOT A MAN FOR CRYING WHEN I DID.
I'll leave their dumbass down ,either sitting on their ass crying , or knocked the hell out! A solid gold fact..-Tyr

[hjmick]

Jim...


First and most importantly, they're your feelings, they can't be wrong.

Second, and I know this will sound wrong but... Get another dog. I know that right now it doesn't feel like the right thing, but it is. You'll be surprised. In 2012, a few months before the Mrs. and I left Albuquerque, we had to relieve the suffering of out Gordon Setter mix. We'd had him since we got together, about 17 years. I cried more for him that I did my father. And why not? I had spent every day for 17 years with that dog. I miss him still...

The thing is, I wanted to get another dog soon after, the Mrs. nixed that idea, she was too sad. She also thought loving another dog was something of a betrayal of her beloved Gordon (yes, we named him Gordon). Anyway... We also had another dog, Petrie, some sort of terrier mix, doesn't matter... She's getting long in the tooth about this time, she's still with us (she's 17 now), but slowing way down... Well, we move to South Carolina. Petrie seems lost, sad, whatever. The Mrs. still says no to another dog... Enter my mom, breeder and shower of champion Papillons... She has one she just can't sell, but can't keep because she has more than enough and wants to keep her husband... So, to keep the dog in the family, mom makes a trek to Charleston with the dog.

Jim, that dog not only changed my wife, but we're convinced he is the reason Petrie is still alive and kicking. She, the dog not my wife, almost instantly started acting younger and friskier. Dogs are pack animals after all...

My wife is happier. She loves Jake, hasn't forgotten Gordon, and all is right with the world.

Jake made such a difference that we now have another Papillon, Elwood. Got him for my birthday last year...

Trust me, Jim, you have room in your heart to love another dog and you would be doing the Chihuahua a favor...


If it helps, I know a woman who breeds Papillons...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y113/hjmc3rd/IMG_0403_zps2a9dabc0.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/hjmc3rd/media/IMG_0403_zps2a9dabc0.jpg.html)

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y113/hjmc3rd/IMG_0431_zps76db8362.jpg (http://s4.photobucket.com/user/hjmc3rd/media/IMG_0431_zps76db8362.jpg.html)

[Loralei]

This is my mini Dachshund, Gretchen.
She's now 12 years old.
She's been the constant in my life for a very long time since my husband passed away.
When she goes, I know I'll be a mess.
People who aren't animal people don't understand the grief we feel.

I've been a lifelong dog owner and yes, losing each one hurts very differently.

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r124/Loralei_01/loralei_01/2010-12-19%2012-05-47.514_zpsdelkdsou.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/Loralei_01/media/loralei_01/2010-12-19%2012-05-47.514_zpsdelkdsou.jpg.html)

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r124/Loralei_01/loralei_01/g4_zps9d9a6bdn.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/Loralei_01/media/loralei_01/g4_zps9d9a6bdn.jpg.html)

[Jeff]

Jim animals sure enough know death.

I know you remember when you where down here Jack had those all white cows (Charolais) the oldest one named Granny (due to her age and the fact that she had so many calves still on the property)well Granny died one day, we found her right in the middle of the pasture, talk about grown men cry, Jack his brother and Father all cried, this cow not only made them a bunch of money over the years she had become part of the family. Well we had to bury her so we used the backhoe and dug a big hole and then used the tractor to drag her to the grave, as we did every cow in the pasture went crazy, it was the eeriest feeling I think I have ever felt. If you remember all of their cows where friendly, heck if they got a crazy one it would go straight to the sale or the freezer, but these cows all chased the tractor kicking up their heels and screaming, they stood around us as we buried her. There is no doubt in my mind those cows knew exactly what was going on, once we had her buried they slowly walked away, that made me realize just how smart these dumb animals are.

[jimnyc]

Jim...


First and most importantly, they're your feelings, they can't be wrong.

Second, and I know this will sound wrong but... Get another dog. I know that right now it doesn't feel like the right thing, but it is. You'll be surprised. In 2012, a few months before the Mrs. and I left Albuquerque, we had to relieve the suffering of out Gordon Setter mix. We'd had him since we got together, about 17 years. I cried more for him that I did my father. And why not? I had spent every day for 17 years with that dog. I miss him still...

The thing is, I wanted to get another dog soon after, the Mrs. nixed that idea, she was too sad. She also thought loving another dog was something of a betrayal of her beloved Gordon (yes, we named him Gordon). Anyway... We also had another dog, Petrie, some sort of terrier mix, doesn't matter... She's getting long in the tooth about this time, she's still with us (she's 17 now), but slowing way down... Well, we move to South Carolina. Petrie seems lost, sad, whatever. The Mrs. still says no to another dog... Enter my mom, breeder and shower of champion Papillons... She has one she just can't sell, but can't keep because she has more than enough and wants to keep her husband... So, to keep the dog in the family, mom makes a trek to Charleston with the dog.

Jim, that dog not only changed my wife, but we're convinced he is the reason Petrie is still alive and kicking. She, the dog not my wife, almost instantly started acting younger and friskier. Dogs are pack animals after all...

My wife is happier. She loves Jake, hasn't forgotten Gordon, and all is right with the world.

Jake made such a difference that we now have another Papillon, Elwood. Got him for my birthday last year...

Trust me, Jim, you have room in your heart to love another dog and you would be doing the Chihuahua a favor...


If it helps, I know a woman who breeds Papillons...

Thanks, I appreciate EVERYONE'S posts, but this one got me thinking. I read it last night as a guest and then thought about various things the rest of the night. I'm still kind of grieving of course, and I too have various feelings of betrayal about things. I thought of getting rid of certain things, but then I couldn't. His last bed was starting to be used by Porter shortly thereafter, and the cat didn't waste much time hopping in there either. At first it upset me, but I know my buddy would have been more than happy to share with them, and always did. He had a heart of gold.

I too think it would help Porter to have another dog. I can still remember Jerome, honor him and grieve for him. But the other little guys still need to be happy. As do I!!

The only bad part? The woman has been saying for years that the next dog is her choice. :( She always said she wanted a larger dog, perhaps a chocolate lab. That's cool though, as even larger dogs have to start small!!

Thanks to all, and thank for this post HJ, it brought a real smile to my face. It actually made me happy for YOU GUYS when I first read it. But it made so much sense that it left me thinking. I'm waiting for the woman to get up to start nagging her!!

http://i.imgur.com/c3J5i4y.jpg

[Gunny]

Thanks, I appreciate EVERYONE'S posts, but this one got me thinking. I read it last night as a guest and then thought about various things the rest of the night. I'm still kind of grieving of course, and I too have various feelings of betrayal about things. I thought of getting rid of certain things, but then I couldn't. His last bed was starting to be used by Porter shortly thereafter, and the cat didn't waste much time hopping in there either. At first it upset me, but I know my buddy would have been more than happy to share with them, and always did. He had a heart of gold.

I too think it would help Porter to have another dog. I can still remember Jerome, honor him and grieve for him. But the other little guys still need to be happy. As do I!!

The only bad part? The woman has been saying for years that the next dog is her choice. :( She always said she wanted a larger dog, perhaps a chocolate lab. That's cool though, as even larger dogs have to start small!!

Thanks to all, and thank for this post HJ, it brought a real smile to my face. It actually made me happy for YOU GUYS when I first read it. But it made so much sense that it left me thinking. I'm waiting for the woman to get up to start nagging her!!

http://i.imgur.com/c3J5i4y.jpg


Tell me you didn't get a new puppy ...

[jimnyc]

Tell me you didn't get a new puppy ...

No no no! That's just one I found of a cute chocolate lab. I have a feeling we won't get one anytime soon, or at least not until the boss says it's ok. I think "I" am ready, and I agree that it would be good for my little guy, but not my choice this time around.

[Jeff]

Thanks, I appreciate EVERYONE'S posts, but this one got me thinking. I read it last night as a guest and then thought about various things the rest of the night. I'm still kind of grieving of course, and I too have various feelings of betrayal about things. I thought of getting rid of certain things, but then I couldn't. His last bed was starting to be used by Porter shortly thereafter, and the cat didn't waste much time hopping in there either. At first it upset me, but I know my buddy would have been more than happy to share with them, and always did. He had a heart of gold.

I too think it would help Porter to have another dog. I can still remember Jerome, honor him and grieve for him. But the other little guys still need to be happy. As do I!!

The only bad part? The woman has been saying for years that the next dog is her choice. :( She always said she wanted a larger dog, perhaps a chocolate lab. That's cool though, as even larger dogs have to start small!!

Thanks to all, and thank for this post HJ, it brought a real smile to my face. It actually made me happy for YOU GUYS when I first read it. But it made so much sense that it left me thinking. I'm waiting for the woman to get up to start nagging her!!

http://i.imgur.com/c3J5i4y.jpg

Talk to Di and tell her I have just the dog for her. She will love him.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7481&stc=1

Most loyal dog I have ever owned and the one with the best temperament, again it's all how you bring them up, mine is afraid of the dark :eek: No kidding, when she has to go out if you open the door and it is dark hell she runs to the kids bedroom like OK never mind I am ready for bed ( and she will hold it if I let her stay in ) Great dogs Jim.

[jimnyc]

Where is that Jeff? Yours? Male/female? Age? How much?

[Gunny]

Just get the dog, Jim. This ain't a debate.

What you going to name it?

[jimnyc]

Damn, ran to woman with picture instantly, and she shot the idea down before Jeff could even answer my questions. :( :(

[Jeff]

Where is that Jeff? Yours? Male/female? Age? How much?

I just pulled that one off the net Jim, at this point mine wont even be pregnant for another 3 months, but down here a high quality pup ( like that one ) will run anywhere from 800 to say $1400.

Now when mine goes into heat my next door neighbor has a Pitt that is huge, Chopper is his name, and he fits it well, he is all man sure enough. We spoke of breeding my female to him, if you can wait until then the pup is yours, heck you can get the pick of the litter.

[BJ_WA]

LOL, back in the 60's I gave a friend a black Lab for a college graduation present. He was a piss cutter duck dog and his name was Chopper.

I've had Labs and springer spaniels and can't go wrong with either, just enjoy the shedding.

If you are a hunter a high quality pup will cost a bit, if you want a good one; we're talking dogs out of FTC's and the like.

I know a guy that rescues and foster cares for mutts and they get some wonderful dogs that they've placed.

[tailfins]

As most of you know, my best friend Jerome has passed on. I'm still heartbroken. Against advice, I kinda still hold back the tears and kinda avoid discussing with others. To me, it's personal and he was literally my best friend.

Anyway. So I try not to say "Jerome" for now in front of the Chihuahua. The first few times afterwards, his tail was wagging and he kinda went looking around for him. It broke my heart to see that. He really seemed depressed for awhile. When the wife used his name several times, I very politely and sincerely explained what I just said, and further said "Please just leave it be for awhile. I see him searching and it kills me to see that. In time it will be better". The response?

"I'm not avoiding the subject like Voldemort. He's just a dog."

I believe she was talking about Porter with the "just a dog" comment, but it doesn't matter to me whether Porter or Jerome. If you feel one is just a dog, then I'm sure others as well. I then turned and said "Sure, just like Nero is JUST a cat". She adores him and lets him sleep with her. I don't know if I should have been surprised when she said the same, he's just a cat.

Am I wrong for trying to protect Porter for now? Is it wrong to feel like it hurts him, or makes him search, when he doesn't know for sure what happened? This re-opened a healing wound for me. :(

Most things in life prepare you for some "next step". Ask yourself what purpose does the dog's death and your reaction to it serve. When something serves a purpose, it is no longer a total loss. This year I have seen three instances of someone euthanize a pet. I'm starting to wonder if euthanizing a pet results in emotional damage to the owner. Maybe administering pain killers and letting the pet die naturally is a better idea.

[Gunny]

I just pulled that one off the net Jim, at this point mine wont even be pregnant for another 3 months, but down here a high quality pup ( like that one ) will run anywhere from 800 to say $1400.

Now when mine goes into heat my next door neighbor has a Pitt that is huge, Chopper is his name, and he fits it well, he is all man sure enough. We spoke of breeding my female to him, if you can wait until then the pup is yours, heck you can get the pick of the litter.

You're going to actually charge your brother for a pup? What a dick. I'd make my asshole brother pay twice as much. :laugh:

[Abbey Marie]

Jim, before you decide on another dog, please keep in mind that some are better with cats than others.

[WiccanLiberal]

Yes animals grieve and miss their compatriots. When I took Pandora to the vet for the last time, the other cats and Emma looked at the empty carrier and then at me. It took a while for the social order to resettle itself but they are sorted themselves out sooner than I did. And as for the breed, any dog can be a great dog. Pitties are some of the best. Any lab is a usually a great bet.

[Gunny]

Jim, before you decide on another dog, please keep in mind that some are better with cats than others.

I am. Sorry rodents. Always hanging off the curtains n crap. BUT, they aren't loyal. Anyone who has the Friskies is the pied piper. Dogs are. I got 2 of them laying on my feet right now, and I'm a cat person.

[Jeff]

You're going to actually charge your brother for a pup? What a dick. I'd make my asshole brother pay twice as much. :laugh:

Did you not read my post Gunny, your shot out, I think maybe you are still thinking of that little boy being your cellmate. :laugh::laugh::laugh:


http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Jeff http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=748708#post748708)
I just pulled that one off the net Jim, at this point mine wont even be pregnant for another 3 months, but down here a high quality pup ( like that one ) will run anywhere from 800 to say $1400.

Now when mine goes into heat my next door neighbor has a Pitt that is huge, Chopper is his name, and he fits it well, he is all man sure enough. We spoke of breeding my female to him, if you can wait until then the pup is yours, heck you can get the pick of the litter.



If Jim wished to wait that long he can get pick of the litter, maybe I didn't write it clearly ( I do that quite often) but I am sure Jim knew what I meant, it is his for the taking.

[Jeff]

Jim, before you decide on another dog, please keep in mind that some are better with cats than others.

So very true Abbey, I have a Bully now that wants to chase my cats through the house, I am not sure what she will do if she caught them, I haven't let her get that close, but when I got her she was full grown, she doesn't have a mean streak in her body but she wants the cats bad.

But now the other bully I had (that was shot ) we got as a puppy (8 weeks old) she grew up with the cats and loved them, I really think a dog is what you make them, some say Pitts will always kill cats, they love to catch them, well my Bully (Khaos) grew up with them and looked at them as her friends, even when they had kittens she would play with the tiny little ones and never hurt them.

This is a picture of one of the kittens sleeping in Khaos's food bowl.
http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7483&stc=1

Khaos playing with the kitten
http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7484&stc=1

[Rat]

Sorry for loss of dog jimnyc. Some have deep bond with animals. It hard get over when one passes. Good you talk about it instead keep it to self.

You have picture of him you mind sharing?

[Gunny]

Did you not read my post Gunny, your shot out, I think maybe you are still thinking of that little boy being your cellmate. :laugh::laugh::laugh:



If Jim wished to wait that long he can get pick of the litter, maybe I didn't write it clearly ( I do that quite often) but I am sure Jim knew what I meant, it is his for the taking.

Your first mistake is thinking that being a Marine and reading and thinking go together. I was always told we could lift a ton but can't spell it. :laugh:

Unfortunately for whoever (I suspect Jim's significant other), he's more impulsive than I am. That already doesn't sound good. I suspect a new dog is on the way. :poke:

[Gunny]

So very true Abbey, I have a Bully now that wants to chase my cats through the house, I am not sure what she will do if she caught them, I haven't let her get that close, but when I got her she was full grown, she doesn't have a mean streak in her body but she wants the cats bad.

But now the other bully I had (that was shot ) we got as a puppy (8 weeks old) she grew up with the cats and loved them, I really think a dog is what you make them, some say Pitts will always kill cats, they love to catch them, well my Bully (Khaos) grew up with them and looked at them as her friends, even when they had kittens she would play with the tiny little ones and never hurt them.

This is a picture of one of the kittens sleeping in Khaos's food bowl.
http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7483&stc=1

Khaos playing with the kitten
http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7484&stc=1

I need to get off my butt and bust out some pics. I got 5 cats and 3 dogs, and a one week old baby girl that seems to be attached to my right arm. Just in case anyone has been wondering where I've been. I know rev misses me like he misses the plague. :laugh:

Unfortunately for rev, baby girls are high on the list of the one soft spot Gunny's have. He'll have to get his attention from someone else. :)