Why Do Conservatives Trust Trump?

[jimnyc]

I thought this was an interesting read. Still WAY too early to be really pushing things, but a good read as to why some might be jumping with Trump.

---

Answering Glenn Beck’s Question: Why Do Conservatives Trust Trump?

Beck asks a good question here and then offers a good answer to it. Why, he says, do conservative opinion-makers like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity give Trump a pass on his many, many ideological heresies when normally they’re bulldogs in calling out centrists like Romney for lesser offenses? Beck’s answer: Trump has a swagger that Romney doesn’t. When Trump tells you he’s going to seal the border and destroy the Beltway establishment, you believe him because he doesn’t care who disapproves of him or his objectives. He’s going to do what he sets out to do. After trying for decades and failing to make American government incrementally more conservative, some righties are ready to gamble on a guy who, if, if, if he’s true to his word, will achieve more in that vein than any president since Reagan. Essentially, after six election cycles of making low-risk bets on business-as-usual Republicans, conservatives are willing to make a high-stakes gamble on a guy who won’t be business as usual but, er, might not govern as a Republican either.

…The other take on Trump’s appeal is my own, something I’ve been thinking about since he announced his immigration plan this weekend. Trump and Ted Cruz are frequently lumped in together (including by me) because they’re both overt populists and both seen as essentially right-wing phenomena even though Cruz’s base is more uniformly conservative than Trump’s is. In an important way, though, Cruz and Trump are opposites. The point of Cruz’s trademark rhetoric about “bold colors, not pale pastels” is that he’s a true believer in conservatism’s power to win over the masses if it’s presented unapologetically, in its strong form, by an able messenger like Ronald Reagan (or, of course, Ted Cruz). Give the voters real conservatism and they’ll flock to you, whatever the pollsters or the demographics say. It’s an essentially religious belief in the power of the creed to convert infidels so long as it’s given a fair hearing. Trump fans, on some level, have given up that belief assuming they ever had it to begin with, I think. They wish Cruz was right but they just don’t think conservatism is an electoral winner anymore, either because the character of the country has changed or because changing demographics have made it impossible. At this point, the best deal you’re going to get is a guy like Trump who’s compromised ideologically but seems to have some conservative instincts, most notably on immigration, and who seems like he really might be willing to push the country in that direction (on certain issues) if he’s given power.

If you want to understand why conservatives are willing to at least give Donald Trump a chance, you have to look at what has happened over the last few election cycles.

In 2008, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was John McCain and whom did we get? John McCain — and he lost.

In 2012, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was Mitt Romney and whom did we get? Mitt Romney — and he lost.

In 2010, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then, after the base delivered a victory, Republicans in Congress delivered nothing and said they needed the Senate to accomplish anything.

Then in 2014, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then Republicans in Congress betrayed the people who put them in office to cooperate with Obama.

For six years, Republicans in Congress have promised to fight Obama and stand up for conservatism and have delivered nothing but stupidity, corruption, weakness, betrayal and failure.

So, why not at least hear Trump out?

He’s certainly qualified to be President. He’s not hemmed in by political correctness. He is a tough negotiator. He can’t be bought off. He’s unquestionably a fighter.

In other words, he’s strong in all the areas the Republican Party has been proven to be weak again and again over the last few years.

Sure, ideologically he has been squishy in the past and says he has “evolved,” which is a cause for concern. However, after years of voting for the conservative candidates who don’t even try to accomplish anything once they get in office, there doesn’t seem to be much risk in letting Trump flesh out his positions and giving him a shot if they sound good.

If Trump accomplishes three conservative objectives and doesn’t even make an effort in three others, then we’d still be better off with him than someone who promises to be the most conservative candidate in every area but doesn’t have the guts to fight for anything.

Would someone like Ted Cruz or Scott Walker be better candidates? Maybe, but as we’ve seen in the last couple of elections, the cream doesn’t always rise to the top. Once the primaries begin, Cruz, Walker or even Trump may not be in the game. If Cruz and Trump are both in the game in Iowa, conservatives may abandon Trump for one of those candidates. On the other hand, if the choice in Iowa is Trump or Jeb, Cruz and Walker’s voters may be smarter to go to Trump.

Of course, we have a long way to go and we have no way of knowing how Trump will be doing in February of next year. In the interim, why not enjoy all the extra eyeballs he brings to the debate, thank him for moving the immigration debate to the Right and bringing in new voters and give him a chance to make his case?

http://rightwingnews.com/trump/answering-glenn-becks-question-why-do-conservatives-trust-trump/

[Abbey Marie]

I would add that, unlike Romney, Trump is far from apologetic about his 1%er status. In fact, he arrived at the state fair in his helo, with Trump emblazoned across it. And proceeded to give rides to little kids. Lol!

[jimnyc]

I would add that, unlike Romney, Trump is far from apologetic about his 1%er status. In fact, he arrived at the state fair in his helo, with Trump emblazoned across it. And proceeded to give rides to little kids. Lol!

Yeah, he's not shy about his wealth, never was. In each interview/speech he will generally tell you like 19 times about how much money he has. I just wish he would brag to the liberals about how much he has, and how many planes/copters and vehicles he has, and how much fuel uses and how much he adds to global warming!

[fj1200]

Conservatives don't. ;)


I thought this was an interesting read. Still WAY too early to be really pushing things, but a good read as to why some might be jumping with Trump.

---

Answering Glenn Beck’s Question: Why Do Conservatives Trust Trump?

...

In 2008, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was John McCain and whom did we get? John McCain — and he lost.

In 2012, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was Mitt Romney and whom did we get? Mitt Romney — and he lost.

...

Sure, ideologically he has been squishy in the past and says he has “evolved,” which is a cause for concern. However, after years of voting for the conservative candidates who don’t even try to accomplish anything once they get in office, there doesn’t seem to be much risk in letting Trump flesh out his positions and giving him a shot if they sound good.

http://rightwingnews.com/trump/answering-glenn-becks-question-why-do-conservatives-trust-trump/

The problem with McCain for the righties? He's been squishy and "evolved."
The problem with Romney for the righties? He's been squishy and "evolved."

The problem with Romney for the evangelicals? Mormon? Unlikely they turn out for Trump.

[jimnyc]

Conservatives don't. ;)

And yet they do, whether you do or not, or of others here do or not. I've seen it in the polls. I've seen conservative pundits support him. I've read conservative pundits supporting him. Not all of course, but plenty of them. And no, I don't wish to get into a debate about "what" or "who" a conservative is. :)

[fj1200]

And yet they do...

Thus the winky wink. I was just trying to answer the question. I don't know why conservatives trust him and my guess is that they really don't down deep; I think they like listening to him. Regarding what I've heard from Rush I don't recall him really supporting the man, only supporting the way he's sticking it to the MSM and driving the illegal immigrant discussion.

Nevertheless I was thinking about previous presidents who may share a Trump-like background and came up with Hoover. Unquestionably a private market success but unquestionably a disastrous president.

[jimnyc]

Thus the winky wink. I was just trying to answer the question. I don't know why conservatives trust him and my guess is that they really don't down deep; I think they like listening to him. Regarding what I've heard from Rush I don't recall him really supporting the man, only supporting the way he's sticking it to the MSM and driving the illegal immigrant discussion.

Nevertheless I was thinking about previous presidents who may share a Trump-like background and came up with Hoover. Unquestionably a private market success but unquestionably a disastrous president.

I think people truly are fed up with illegal immigration, for example. If folks feel someone like Trump, or Cruz, will really try to solve such a problem, then I do think they truly like him and are willing to give him a shot.

I honestly don't see where he would be "disastrous" as of yet. There are a few questions I would still like answered, as there are from all the candidates, but he's ok in my book thus far. Out of what, 16 candidates? He's ranking 2 for me out of only 3 I would really vote for thus far. I still think Cruz and Rubio go further, but we'll see. Most thought Trump would be gone by now, and here he is, increasing his lead.

[Abbey Marie]

Here's an interesting anecdote: Last night the guy who sold our daughter her new car told us that he likes Trump (unsolicited political discussion, btw, which in itself I found interesting). Then he proceeded to tell us that he thinks Obama is doing a "pretty good job" (!)

I am trying to understand how a person would like both of these guys.

Btw, he was also a self-avowed conspiracy guy, with a liberal bent. You know, the Koch brothers are evil, (but no mention of Soros), bankers running the world, etc. Yet he likes Trump. Could it be that Trump is the guy to get the swing vote?

[jimnyc]

Here's an interesting anecdote: Last night the guy who sold our daughter her new car told us that he likes Trump (unsolicited political discussion, btw, which in itself I found interesting). Then he proceeded to tell us that he thinks Obama is doing a "pretty good job" (!)

I am trying to understand how a person would like both of these guys.

Btw, he was also a self-avowed conspiracy guy, with a liberal bent. You know, the Koch brothers are evil, (but no mention of Soros), bankers running the world, etc. Yet he likes Trump. Could it be that Trump is the guy to get the swing vote?

I don't think it's as much that, as much as it is that he's reaching some hot button issues right now. And with he himself talking about being politically correct and such, and then others talking about it, I think people like you are seeing are feeling more comfortable speaking up now. I've had a few conversations with folks already, that likely wouldn't have taken place this early, if not for Trump. Not everyone is 'for' Trump, but definitely a lot more talk than usual and a lot earlier than usual. I think the country is sick and tired of the same shit over and over. That doesn't mean Trump wins, but it's good that he's putting a dent in PC, however small, and that others are hopefully following the lead.

[revelarts]

Here's an interesting anecdote: Last night the guy who sold our daughter her new car told us that he likes Trump (unsolicited political discussion, btw, which in itself I found interesting). Then he proceeded to tell us that he thinks Obama is doing a "pretty good job" (!)
I am trying to understand how a person would like both of these guys.
Btw, he was also a self-avowed conspiracy guy, with a liberal bent. You know, the Koch brothers are evil, (but no mention of Soros), bankers running the world, etc. Yet he likes Trump. Could it be that Trump is the guy to get the swing vote?

Speaking as as oddball myself, thats just weird.

I almost feel I'm in sic-fi program where the country has just sorta lost its mind. and reality and media are all mashed together in a dark stew.

even the comments here and from Coluter about immigration being one the MOST VITAL ISSUES of the day.
sheesh WTH? Really?
But no serious heart felt mention about the constitution, not at all. or aborted million dead every week ladeeda, Balanced Budget yeah whatever, trillions in debt um ..what's new. Banks getting more breaks.. to big to fail brother...
But Iran a 3rd rate M.E. country is gonna kill us all if they get 1 bomb!! Putin is surrounded by NATO countries but he's EVIL and HILTER for sending troops into one and trying to take it.... sanction on him!!! and At least we'll be rid of OBAMA, that'll solve all the problems right there I suspect.... etc etc

maybe i'm just getting old. I'll be on the pouch next election cycle shooting cats with bee bee guns and complaining about my butt itching.

the way things are going with this elections season and the comments from the voters left and right I PREDICT that we'll get someone who does nearly the SAME things as Obama and Bush have done ...and a bit worse.
more war, more drone strikes, more wiretapping and spying on you for your safety, more immigrants, more bail outs, more "healthcare", more gov't control via various agencies, more crony capitalism, more abortions, more hysteria over some 3rd rate nation, more terrorism near and far, a president that assumes even a bit more power, a weaker congress, a crazier SCOTUS, more debt, and a slightly if not extremely worse economy.
and more of the R& D leadership string the pot riling up the faithful over soundbites.

it seems the nation is sliding into a soviet like disintegration.

[Perianne]

...
even the comments here and from Coluter about immigration being one the MOST VITAL ISSUES of the day.
sheesh WTH? Really?
But no serious heart felt mention about the constitution, not at all. or aborted million dead every week ladeeda, Balanced Budget yeah whatever, trillions in debt um ..what's new. Banks getting more breaks.. to big to fail brother...
But Iran a 3rd rate M.E. country is gonna kill us all if they get 1 bomb!! Putin is surrounded by NATO countries but he's EVIL and HILTER for sending troops into one and trying to take it.... sanction on him!!! and At least we'll be rid of OBAMA, that'll solve all the problems right there I suspect.... etc etc

maybe i'm just getting old. I'll be on the pouch next election cycle shooting cats with bee bee guns and complaining about my butt itching.

the way things are going with this elections season and the comments from the voters left and right I PREDICT that we'll get someone who does nearly the SAME things as Obama and Bush have done ...and a bit worse.
more war, more drone strikes, more wiretapping and spying on you for your safety, more immigrants, more bail outs, more "healthcare", more gov't control via various agencies, more crony capitalism, more abortions, more hysteria over some 3rd rate nation, more terrorism near and far, a president that assumes even a bit more power, a weaker congress, a crazier SCOTUS, more debt, and a slightly if not extremely worse economy.
and more of the R& D leadership string the pot riling up the faithful over soundbites.

it seems the nation is sliding into a soviet like disintegration.

Illegal immigration is THE most important issue. How do you expect any of your problems to be solved if the country is besieged by millions of additional Democratic voters?

[jimnyc]

Speaking as as oddball myself, that just weird.

I almost feel I'm in sic-fi program where the country has just sorta lost its mind. and reality and media are all mashed together in a dark stew.

even the comments here and from Coluter about immigration being one the MOST VITAL ISSUES of the day.
sheesh WTH? Really?
But no serious heart felt mention about the constitution, not at all. or aborted million dead every week ladeeda, Balanced Budget yeah whatever, trillions in debt um ..what's new. Banks getting more breaks.. to big to fail brother...
But Iran a 3rd rate M.E. country is gonna kill us all if they get 1 bomb!! Putin is surrounded by NATO countries but he's EVIL and HILTER for sending troops into one and trying to take it.... sanction on him!!! and At least we'll be rid of OBAMA, that'll solve all the problems right there I suspect.... etc etc

maybe i'm just getting old. I'll be on the pouch next election cycle shooting cats with bee bee guns and complaining about my butt itching.

the way things are going with this elections season and the comments from the voters left and right I PREDICT that we'll get someone who does nearly the SAME things as Obama and Bush have done ...and a bit worse.
more war, more drone strikes, more wiretapping and spying on you for your safety, more immigrants, more bail outs, more "healthcare", more gov't control via various agencies, more crony capitalism, more abortions, more hysteria over some 3rd rate nation, more terrorism near and far, a president that assumes even a bit more power, a weaker congress, a crazier SCOTUS, more debt, and a slightly if not extremely worse economy.
and more of the R& D leadership string the pot riling up the faithful over soundbites.

it seems the nation is sliding into a soviet like disintegration.

The bold is all that matters! :) j/k

Let's suppose your list above is all of your main concerns. The best we can do is find a candidate that mostly aligns with those, and then hope for the best.

And yes, that sucks. Because even then you have to hope that congress is on your side to get anything done. And then pray that the next administration or session doesn't undo anything good or vice versa.

I don't know if we get exactly the same with Trump, Cruz, Rubio or others. You're probably right though. Still better than Hillary though. And yes, I already know what you'll say about that.

[jimnyc]

Illegal immigration is THE most important issue. How do you expect any of your problems to be solved if the country is besieged by millions of additional Democratic voters?

And that's only the illegals, wanna see what we are going to look like with regular 'ol immigration?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM1YU-Ni_84

[Jeff]

It's simple, Trump is saying out loud what people are thinking. People are sick and tired of the last 8 years, hell 16 for many, Trump talks more like a everyday person than a politician, like when he said he would send troops into the Middle East and take their oil ( like that is ever going to happen ) I think even Trump knows he can't do it, but it lets folks know the issue has pissed him off just like many of them, Trump is just saying out loud what people think.

I read a article today about a era ( I don't remember the exact years ) but people would scream at the top of their lungs about what they would do or what they want, it helped make people feel better, they where getting their frustrations out, Trump understand how Pissed Off folks are and he is letting them know he is to.

[revelarts]

Illegal immigration is THE most important issue. How do you expect any of your problems to be solved if the country is besieged by millions of additional Democratic voters?



http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/07/24/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/

http://www.pewresearch.org/files/2015/07/FT_15.07.23_UnauthImmigrants.png


Here are five facts about the unauthorized immigrant population in the U.S.
<big class="honkin-number" id="number-1" style="margin: 0px 0.4em 0px 0px; padding: 0.2em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-size: 2.5em; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; float: left; color: rgb(236, 159, 46);">1</big>There were 11.3 million unauthorized immigrants in the U.S. in 2014. The population has remained essentially stable for five years (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/07/22/unauthorized-immigrant-population-stable-for-half-a-decade/), and currently makes up 3.5% of the nation’s population. The number of unauthorized immigrants peaked in 2007 at 12.2 million, when this group was 4% of the U.S. population.
http://www.pewresearch.org/files/2014/11/mexican-unauthorized.png (http://www.pewhispanic.org/2014/11/18/unauthorized-immigrant-totals-rise-in-7-states-fall-in-14/#decrease-in-unauthorized-immigrants-from-mexico)<big class="honkin-number" id="number-2" style="margin: 0px 0.4em 0px 0px; padding: 0.2em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-size: 2.5em; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; float: left; color: rgb(236, 159, 46);">2</big>Mexicans make up about half of all unauthorized immigrants (52%), though their numbers have been declining in recent years. There were 5.9 million Mexican unauthorized immigrants living in the U.S. in 2012 (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/07/15/what-we-know-about-illegal-immigration-from-mexico/), down from 6.4 million in 2009, according to Pew Research Center estimates. Over the same time period, the number of unauthorized immigrants from Asia, the Caribbean, Central America and a grouping of countries in the Middle East, Africa and some other areas grew slightly (unauthorized immigrant populations from South America and Europe/Canada did not change significantly).
<big class="honkin-number" id="number-3" style="margin: 0px 0.4em 0px 0px; padding: 0.2em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-size: 2.5em; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; float: left; color: rgb(236, 159, 46);">3</big>Six states alone account for 60% of unauthorized immigrants — California, Texas, Florida, New York, New Jersey and Illinois. But the distribution of the population is changing. From 2009 to 2012, several East Coast states were among those with population increases, whereas several Western states were among those with population decreases. There were seven states overall in which the unauthorized immigrant population increased: Florida, Idaho, Maryland, Nebraska, New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Virginia. Meanwhile, there were 14 states in which the population decreased over the same time period: Alabama, Arizona, California, Colorado, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Massachusetts, Nevada, New Mexico, New York and Oregon. Despite a decline, Nevada has the nation’s largest share (8%) of unauthorized immigrants in its state population.
<big class="honkin-number" id="number-4" style="margin: 0px 0.4em 0px 0px; padding: 0.2em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-size: 2.5em; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; float: left; color: rgb(236, 159, 46);">4</big>Unauthorized immigrants make up 5.1% of the U.S. labor force. In the U.S. labor force, there were 8.1 million unauthorized immigrants either working or looking for work in 2012. Among the states, Nevada (10%), California (9%), Texas (9%) and New Jersey (8%) had the highest shares of unauthorized immigrants in their labor forces.
<big class="honkin-number" id="number-5" style="margin: 0px 0.4em 0px 0px; padding: 0.2em 0px 0px; border: 0px; font-size: 2.5em; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; float: left; color: rgb(236, 159, 46);">5</big>About 7% of K-12 students had at least one unauthorized immigrant parent in 2012. Among these students, about eight-in-ten (79%) were born in the U.S. In Nevada, almost one-in-five students (18%) have at least one unauthorized immigrant parent, the largest share in the nation. Other top states on this measure are California (13%), Texas (13%) and Arizona (11%).
This is an update of a post originally published on Nov. 18, 2014.

Ok so i don't like Obama's policies. but the numbers don't frighten me .sorry.
I ain't a scared of Mexicans that want to work.


Doesn't seem like THE most important issue to me. much less an issue that i'd allow abortions done in the white house to "fix".

[revelarts]

It's simple, Trump is saying out loud what people are thinking. People are sick and tired of the last 8 years, hell 16 for many, Trump talks more like a everyday person than a politician, like when he said he would send troops into the Middle East and take their oil ( like that is ever going to happen ) I think even Trump knows he can't do it, but it lets folks know the issue has pissed him off just like many of them, Trump is just saying out loud what people think.

I read a article today about a era ( I don't remember the exact years ) but people would scream at the top of their lungs about what they would do or what they want, it helped make people feel better, they where getting their frustrations out, Trump understand how Pissed Off folks are and he is letting them know he is to.

Thing is, people seem pissed off over weird stuff.
that's what bugs me.

[Perianne]

Thing is, people seem pissed off over weird stuff.
that what bugs me.

Which weird stuff?

[Abbey Marie]

Thing is, people seem pissed off over weird stuff.
that's what bugs me.

One man's ceiling is another man's floor.

[Gunny]

I thought this was an interesting read. Still WAY too early to be really pushing things, but a good read as to why some might be jumping with Trump.

---

Answering Glenn Beck’s Question: Why Do Conservatives Trust Trump?



Beck asks a good question here and then offers a good answer to it. Why, he says, do conservative opinion-makers like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity give Trump a pass on his many, many ideological heresies when normally they’re bulldogs in calling out centrists like Romney for lesser offenses? Beck’s answer: Trump has a swagger that Romney doesn’t. When Trump tells you he’s going to seal the border and destroy the Beltway establishment, you believe him because he doesn’t care who disapproves of him or his objectives. He’s going to do what he sets out to do. After trying for decades and failing to make American government incrementally more conservative, some righties are ready to gamble on a guy who, if, if, if he’s true to his word, will achieve more in that vein than any president since Reagan. Essentially, after six election cycles of making low-risk bets on business-as-usual Republicans, conservatives are willing to make a high-stakes gamble on a guy who won’t be business as usual but, er, might not govern as a Republican either.

…The other take on Trump’s appeal is my own, something I’ve been thinking about since he announced his immigration plan this weekend. Trump and Ted Cruz are frequently lumped in together (including by me) because they’re both overt populists and both seen as essentially right-wing phenomena even though Cruz’s base is more uniformly conservative than Trump’s is. In an important way, though, Cruz and Trump are opposites. The point of Cruz’s trademark rhetoric about “bold colors, not pale pastels” is that he’s a true believer in conservatism’s power to win over the masses if it’s presented unapologetically, in its strong form, by an able messenger like Ronald Reagan (or, of course, Ted Cruz). Give the voters real conservatism and they’ll flock to you, whatever the pollsters or the demographics say. It’s an essentially religious belief in the power of the creed to convert infidels so long as it’s given a fair hearing. Trump fans, on some level, have given up that belief assuming they ever had it to begin with, I think. They wish Cruz was right but they just don’t think conservatism is an electoral winner anymore, either because the character of the country has changed or because changing demographics have made it impossible. At this point, the best deal you’re going to get is a guy like Trump who’s compromised ideologically but seems to have some conservative instincts, most notably on immigration, and who seems like he really might be willing to push the country in that direction (on certain issues) if he’s given power.

If you want to understand why conservatives are willing to at least give Donald Trump a chance, you have to look at what has happened over the last few election cycles.

In 2008, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was John McCain and whom did we get? John McCain — and he lost.

In 2012, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was Mitt Romney and whom did we get? Mitt Romney — and he lost.

In 2010, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then, after the base delivered a victory, Republicans in Congress delivered nothing and said they needed the Senate to accomplish anything.

Then in 2014, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then Republicans in Congress betrayed the people who put them in office to cooperate with Obama.

For six years, Republicans in Congress have promised to fight Obama and stand up for conservatism and have delivered nothing but stupidity, corruption, weakness, betrayal and failure.

So, why not at least hear Trump out?

He’s certainly qualified to be President. He’s not hemmed in by political correctness. He is a tough negotiator. He can’t be bought off. He’s unquestionably a fighter.

In other words, he’s strong in all the areas the Republican Party has been proven to be weak again and again over the last few years.

Sure, ideologically he has been squishy in the past and says he has “evolved,” which is a cause for concern. However, after years of voting for the conservative candidates who don’t even try to accomplish anything once they get in office, there doesn’t seem to be much risk in letting Trump flesh out his positions and giving him a shot if they sound good.

If Trump accomplishes three conservative objectives and doesn’t even make an effort in three others, then we’d still be better off with him than someone who promises to be the most conservative candidate in every area but doesn’t have the guts to fight for anything.

Would someone like Ted Cruz or Scott Walker be better candidates? Maybe, but as we’ve seen in the last couple of elections, the cream doesn’t always rise to the top. Once the primaries begin, Cruz, Walker or even Trump may not be in the game. If Cruz and Trump are both in the game in Iowa, conservatives may abandon Trump for one of those candidates. On the other hand, if the choice in Iowa is Trump or Jeb, Cruz and Walker’s voters may be smarter to go to Trump.

Of course, we have a long way to go and we have no way of knowing how Trump will be doing in February of next year. In the interim, why not enjoy all the extra eyeballs he brings to the debate, thank him for moving the immigration debate to the Right and bringing in new voters and give him a chance to make his case?

http://rightwingnews.com/trump/answering-glenn-becks-question-why-do-conservatives-trust-trump/

True conservatives don't. I trust him to do exactly what Obama is doing. If we wanted a damned king we could have kept the one we had to start with.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I thought this was an interesting read. Still WAY too early to be really pushing things, but a good read as to why some might be jumping with Trump.

---

Answering Glenn Beck’s Question: Why Do Conservatives Trust Trump?

Beck asks a good question here and then offers a good answer to it. Why, he says, do conservative opinion-makers like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity give Trump a pass on his many, many ideological heresies when normally they’re bulldogs in calling out centrists like Romney for lesser offenses? Beck’s answer: Trump has a swagger that Romney doesn’t. When Trump tells you he’s going to seal the border and destroy the Beltway establishment, you believe him because he doesn’t care who disapproves of him or his objectives. He’s going to do what he sets out to do. After trying for decades and failing to make American government incrementally more conservative, some righties are ready to gamble on a guy who, if, if, if he’s true to his word, will achieve more in that vein than any president since Reagan. Essentially, after six election cycles of making low-risk bets on business-as-usual Republicans, conservatives are willing to make a high-stakes gamble on a guy who won’t be business as usual but, er, might not govern as a Republican either.

…The other take on Trump’s appeal is my own, something I’ve been thinking about since he announced his immigration plan this weekend. Trump and Ted Cruz are frequently lumped in together (including by me) because they’re both overt populists and both seen as essentially right-wing phenomena even though Cruz’s base is more uniformly conservative than Trump’s is. In an important way, though, Cruz and Trump are opposites. The point of Cruz’s trademark rhetoric about “bold colors, not pale pastels” is that he’s a true believer in conservatism’s power to win over the masses if it’s presented unapologetically, in its strong form, by an able messenger like Ronald Reagan (or, of course, Ted Cruz). Give the voters real conservatism and they’ll flock to you, whatever the pollsters or the demographics say. It’s an essentially religious belief in the power of the creed to convert infidels so long as it’s given a fair hearing. Trump fans, on some level, have given up that belief assuming they ever had it to begin with, I think. They wish Cruz was right but they just don’t think conservatism is an electoral winner anymore, either because the character of the country has changed or because changing demographics have made it impossible. At this point, the best deal you’re going to get is a guy like Trump who’s compromised ideologically but seems to have some conservative instincts, most notably on immigration, and who seems like he really might be willing to push the country in that direction (on certain issues) if he’s given power.

If you want to understand why conservatives are willing to at least give Donald Trump a chance, you have to look at what has happened over the last few election cycles.

In 2008, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was John McCain and whom did we get? John McCain — and he lost.

In 2012, the one guy grassroots activists didn’t want as a candidate was Mitt Romney and whom did we get? Mitt Romney — and he lost.

In 2010, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then, after the base delivered a victory, Republicans in Congress delivered nothing and said they needed the Senate to accomplish anything.

Then in 2014, conservatives turned out en masse to elect Republicans who were promising to fight Obama. Then Republicans in Congress betrayed the people who put them in office to cooperate with Obama.

For six years, Republicans in Congress have promised to fight Obama and stand up for conservatism and have delivered nothing but stupidity, corruption, weakness, betrayal and failure.

So, why not at least hear Trump out?

He’s certainly qualified to be President. He’s not hemmed in by political correctness. He is a tough negotiator. He can’t be bought off. He’s unquestionably a fighter.

In other words, he’s strong in all the areas the Republican Party has been proven to be weak again and again over the last few years.

Sure, ideologically he has been squishy in the past and says he has “evolved,” which is a cause for concern. However, after years of voting for the conservative candidates who don’t even try to accomplish anything once they get in office, there doesn’t seem to be much risk in letting Trump flesh out his positions and giving him a shot if they sound good.

If Trump accomplishes three conservative objectives and doesn’t even make an effort in three others, then we’d still be better off with him than someone who promises to be the most conservative candidate in every area but doesn’t have the guts to fight for anything.

Would someone like Ted Cruz or Scott Walker be better candidates? Maybe, but as we’ve seen in the last couple of elections, the cream doesn’t always rise to the top. Once the primaries begin, Cruz, Walker or even Trump may not be in the game. If Cruz and Trump are both in the game in Iowa, conservatives may abandon Trump for one of those candidates. On the other hand, if the choice in Iowa is Trump or Jeb, Cruz and Walker’s voters may be smarter to go to Trump.

Of course, we have a long way to go and we have no way of knowing how Trump will be doing in February of next year. In the interim, why not enjoy all the extra eyeballs he brings to the debate, thank him for moving the immigration debate to the Right and bringing in new voters and give him a chance to make his case?

http://rightwingnews.com/trump/answering-glenn-becks-question-why-do-conservatives-trust-trump/

:beer: :salute: :beer: -Tyr

[Russ]

Donald Trump has not been in my top five, but I have to say that I'm getting really ticked off with CNN and other left-leaning news outlets constantly phrasing their Trump coverage to imply that the only people that could possibly be supporting Trump must be minority-haters and woman-haters. That is crap, and it's making me like Trump more. I'm starting to think that the more the subtly (or not so subtly) they attack Trump, the more support he will get.

[gabosaurus]

The real conservatives likely find Trump an amusing diversion.

Trump's biggest support comes from Democrats. They can't wait to support him in the primaries. :cheers2:

[jimnyc]

True conservatives don't. I trust him to do exactly what Obama is doing. If we wanted a damned king we could have kept the one we had to start with.

I'm pretty confident I'm a true conservative. :) I know some others as well. Just because some disagree on a candidate, that doesn't mean the other person isn't a conservative.

If the suspicion is that we'll get another Obama, I don't see others outside of Trump that will be a huge difference. Trump, Rubio and Cruz have most of what I'm looking for in a candidate, while none of the 3 are hardcore conservatives. I don't see any of them being hugely more conservative than the other. And picking one of these from the lot of 16 also doesn't mean one is not conservative. I think we can say that to someone no matter who they pick. Who's YOUR choice? I can pick ANY choice you make and say "true conservatives" don't support that person.

So, just WHO are these real conservatives pulling for? Jeb Bush? Cruz? Fiorina?

It's simply taking every last thing that means something to me, and lining them up closely with all of the candidates running. Only a few of them go to the top, in my book.

I think a lot of people are against Trump because he's Trump. Where's the outrage at Cruz been about his immigration stances? Folks all want to treat Trump like he spoke of murder for his stance, like it was the most ridiculous thing they ever heard of. I thought it was spot on for the most part.

[jimnyc]

If it's not a serious discussion, please take it to the cage area. I don't care who is wrong or right, who starts it or who adds onto it. Jesus, every other thread I go into. And then I barely even read it, I have to scroll through a few pages to get back to the thread in question. One of you guys seriously needs to place the other on ignore, or take the upper road and move this stuff to the cage.

[Drummond]

Comments removed .. wrong place for them. Plse ignore.

[revelarts]

It's simple, Trump is saying out loud what people are thinking. People are sick and tired of the last 8 years, hell 16 for many, Trump talks more like a everyday person than a politician, like when he said he would send troops into the Middle East and take their oil ( like that is ever going to happen ) I think even Trump knows he can't do it, but it lets folks know the issue has pissed him off just like many of them, Trump is just saying out loud what people think.
I read a article today about a era ( I don't remember the exact years ) but people would scream at the top of their lungs about what they would do or what they want, it helped make people feel better, they where getting their frustrations out, Trump understand how Pissed Off folks are and he is letting them know he is to.

So yeah, basically again this election we see the personality bump in politics.
Not based on real political actions or positions.
the "he's my kinda Fella" "a regular Joe" "doesn't take any guff" political frontrunner.


Donald Trump has not been in my top five, but I have to say that I'm getting really ticked off with CNN and other left-leaning news outlets constantly phrasing their Trump coverage to imply that the only people that could possibly be supporting Trump must be minority-haters and woman-haters. That is crap, and it's making me like Trump more. I'm starting to think that the more the subtly (or not so subtly) they attack Trump, the more support he will get.

And here we have a variant on the personality bump "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" political reasoning. Again less and less care about real political actions or positions. basically "he's SOCKIN' to those SOBs i hate too... so he's my guy".




Which weird stuff?it'd take a while to outline and would rankle some here.
already you disagree with my assessment of immigration as NOT a big issue.
important yes but the top issue no. -Mexicans are gonna get us if we don't do sumthin right noooow!-
to me that's weird.

Iran - hysteria for what -weird.
Russia & Ukraine - Did i spell Ukraine right? can many place it on a map? hysteria sanctions on Russia. weird.
confederate flags -left and rights- explosions of overhype and passion. weird.
Calling women pigs for news traction - weird.
publics back and forth and misplaced and confused concept, fears and passion over terrorism - weird.
there are others minor issues that people get worked up about that politicians "have to " address
but the main thing that's weird to me is at the top of this post.
maybe it's my boarder line autism but the whole --- like his 'personality' therefore it doesn't really matter WHAT he's done or will do.---

that's always been the weirdest thing to me over the years.
i think there's part of humanity that really wants to be ruled by what they perceive as a strong kindred leader king. Even if they really don't agree on much of anything the says or does , he's still "my kinda people".
That's just weird to me but all politicians --good, bad and despotic-- must play the game n some fashion.

[jimnyc]

it'd take a while to outline and would rankle some here.
already you disagree with my assessment of immigration as NOT a big issue.
important yes but the top issue no. -Mexicans are gonna get us if we don't do sumthin right noooow!-
to me that's weird.

Iran - hysteria for what -weird.
Russia & Ukraine - Did i spell Ukraine right? can many place it on a map? hysteria sanctions on Russia. weird.
confederate flags -left and rights- explosions of overhype and passion. weird.
Calling women pigs for news traction - weird.
publics back and forth and misplaced and confused concept, fears and passion over terrorism - weird.
there are others minor issues that people get worked up about that politicians "have to " address
but the main thing that's weird to me is at the top of this post.
maybe it's my boarder line autism but the whole --- like his 'personality' therefore it doesn't really matter WHAT he's done or will do.---

that's always been the weirdest thing to me over the years.
i think there's part of humanity that really wants to be ruled by what they perceive as a strong kindred leader king. Even if they really don't agree on much of anything the says or does , he's still "my kinda people".
That's just weird to me but all politicians --good, bad and despotic-- must play the game n some fashion.

You do realize that some of these things ARE important to others? Both here and abroad? What might be weird to you is important to others. I'm confident that some of the stuff important to you might seem weird to others. I'm not disagreeing with you, as I think there are things out there that raise my eyebrow, and leave me thinking 'who gives a crap'.

I don't want to debate anything at all with you about immigration, I don't mean it that way.... but for example, the illegal immigration issue is HUGE to me and has been in need of fixing for like 30 years now. Yes, the numbers up and down. But it's the strain it causes, to our economy, to our prisons, and certainly enough over the years to where folks say it's now impossible to deport the 'total' as now the numbers are simply too high. But at least we can fix it going forward. It's scary to me, and sad at the same time. But not weird. BUT, I do understand it's not a priority to you.

[revelarts]

You do realize that some of these things ARE important to others? Both here and abroad? What might be weird to you is important to others. I'm confident that some of the stuff important to you might seem weird to others.

agreed.

But i think if we all were able to weigh issues on more objective scales that some things would rise to the top more than others.
and some would never come up past conversation.

when i say more objective scale. i mean like comparing issues based on--
•lives lost. in real numbers
•money loss. in real numbers
•freedoms lost. based on strait reading of the constitution
•open opportunity for all
•equal rendering of justice
•real investigations of corruption gov't and corporate and the amount of property, cash, and harm done.
•measurement of foreign threats by scale of forces and real case histories.

to me banks stealing billions/trillions via fraud and not being stopped and no CEOs sent to prison is far more important than many issues that are more emotional like flags desecration by a very small group of scattered folks.
I mean were talking billions/trillions of dollars retirement funds homes jobs etc..

but i bet R politicians would get far more political traction if they condemned and maybe arrested flag desecrators than if they they condemned, arrested and jailed banisters.

Heck i bet if any R republican had the nerve to fly a confederate flag under the U.S. flag at some of his stops it would probably guarantee a certain number of "conservative" votes no matter what his policies.

more seriously China's potential threat and Russia's threat to us. (not it's neighbors) are real. they have 1000s nukes now and more importantly armies and navies large enough to cause us permanent damage.
I know some people have the idea that the U.S should NEVER suffer a scratch or nosebleed but IMO any HIT from Iran the U.S. could easily recover from and literally DESTROY Iran. We can't say the same for a full out war with Russia or China.
The threats are not comparable AT ALL objectively. So to me the bombast and hysterics over Iran maybe getting a nuke or 2 maybe 5-25 years from now seems weird. Others may sincerely think it's the most important thing in the world. I don't understand why based on the reality of Iranian acts over the years and other nations real capabilities.

I won't debate u over immigration but as you mention it has been a problem for decades. and seems to me those who believe any of these R or D candidates are going to do much more than they've done so far i think they're kidding themselves. many of the candidates are in congress now. Have they proposed any bills to seriously affect immigration or illegals? or have they just been reactionary to Obama's unconstitutional BS? Bush added to the Problem and we voted him in twice. Were Romney or McCain serious about changes. McCain has propose a couple of bills here lately "Criminal Alien Deportation Act (http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c114:S.1752:)" is one. Thanks John. not sure how many times before he's posted that or others like it or stronger if any.

but yeah, be nice if we could all not be so emotional and work off of a similar page.

[fj1200]

I'm pretty confident I'm a true conservative. :) I know some others as well. Just because some disagree on a candidate, that doesn't mean the other person isn't a conservative.

If the suspicion is that we'll get another Obama, I don't see others outside of Trump that will be a huge difference. Trump, Rubio and Cruz have most of what I'm looking for in a candidate, while none of the 3 are hardcore conservatives. I don't see any of them being hugely more conservative than the other. And picking one of these from the lot of 16 also doesn't mean one is not conservative. I think we can say that to someone no matter who they pick. Who's YOUR choice? I can pick ANY choice you make and say "true conservatives" don't support that person.

So, just WHO are these real conservatives pulling for? Jeb Bush? Cruz? Fiorina?

It's simply taking every last thing that means something to me, and lining them up closely with all of the candidates running. Only a few of them go to the top, in my book.

I think a lot of people are against Trump because he's Trump. Where's the outrage at Cruz been about his immigration stances? Folks all want to treat Trump like he spoke of murder for his stance, like it was the most ridiculous thing they ever heard of. I thought it was spot on for the most part.

The Why is still waiting to be answered. Some say he isn't, some say he is, and then others ask say how is he? His immigration plan I'd say is mostly conservative except for a couple of loony tunes issues (Mexico should pay, 14A, etc.), one of his tax proposals is (zero corporate tax) and others are not (14%? one-time wealth tax), abortion (was for it before he was against it), etc.

As far as who the "real" conservatives are pulling for my guess is that they're split or just waiting. But either way almost anyone who comes out of this process would be better than BO or anyone else on the Dem side.


... who starts it...

I care a little seeing as how it's not me. :)