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View Full Version : Best quote about bible-smart folks



darin
01-21-2016, 03:48 AM
I am thinking trying so hard to find deeper meaning in every part of the bible pulls people away from its meaning


"Christians have made the Bible their god and they study it to death in terms of academics, or head knowledge, like a school subject. Studying and memorizing the Bible only makes people arrogantly think that they now understand the truth. Although written communication is helpful, God and love cannot be squished into a theology. It must be lived in order to be understood." - Elizabeth Dahl Kingery

revelarts
01-21-2016, 08:31 AM
DMP that's a weird way to think of it IMO.

I never think of squeezing Gods love into anything. God and his love can't fit in our minds.
And the more I understand the scripture the MORE i understand that he doesn't fit into my limited imagined constructs.
He becomes Bigger and more personal. Seeing what he does in scripture and how he speaks shows me His thoughts are not MY thoughts and his ways are Not my ways.
i don't get to make God into how i imagine he should be loving or dealing with me or the rest of HIS creation.
But i do get clear outlines of His person that i get NO WHERE ELSE but from scripture.

But frankly I don't think i read, memorize or understand the scriptures enough!
I suspect that's true for most Christians, not the other way around.

When Jesus was tempted by Satan ALL he did was quote scripture.
he didn't just say "God loves you"
When he spoke to the money changers in the temple he quoted scripture.
When he spoke to the crowds he started with scripture... and his words BECAME scripture.
David in the old testament said he loved his word.

I'm never sure why people get frustrated with people that REALLY respect the scripture as God clearly speaking to us.
Isn't that a good thing?

No wants wants to "worship" the Bible but when your Dad speaks you don't want to HALF listen.
Or pretend that you or others don't really get it if you decide to pay very close attention to his words and really try to make sure you understand him correctly.
But sure, God is not impressed a lot of bible scripture quotin' but missing the main points. He's more concerned about our hearts.
But he's not impressed by ignorance of his word or those that ignore his clear messages it either.
one of Jesus's most repeated lines is “Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”.
David said "I've hidden your word in my heart so that i might not sin against you."
God told Joshua
"Keep this Book of the Law always on your lips; meditate on it day and night, so that you may be careful to do everything written in it. Then you will be prosperous and successful."

Jesus wants our love and said we should love him with all our "hearts souls and MINDS and strength".
seems appropriate to me that taking time to focus our minds on his words to memorize and better understand is a good thing.
And it's at least as important as our reading, understanding and getting emotional over the words of politicians or having a deep knowledge of sports or being immersed and memorizing lines in our favorite TV and films.

But DMP, I always have to ask when someone says something like what you quoted above.
If there were no Bible, how would you know very much about God?
Scientist (not science) often deny him, there are thousands of other religions, And people have millions of odd opinions on what God is like.
So how would we have any real collective clarity on what God is like? Which no matter how you frame it IS theology.

Or maybe i'm misunderstand her, does she mean she has a DIFFERENT theology of God that she gets WITHOUT scripture that she'd prefer others believe instead of what they get from the Bible. Or that she wants them to LIVE more of it out? I'm just not exactly sure what her beef is.

fj1200
01-21-2016, 09:46 AM
I am thinking trying so hard to find deeper meaning in every part of the bible pulls people away from its meaning


"Christians have made the Bible their god and they study it to death in terms of academics, or head knowledge, like a school subject. Studying and memorizing the Bible only makes people arrogantly think that they now understand the truth. Although written communication is helpful, God and love cannot be squished into a theology. It must be lived in order to be understood." - Elizabeth Dahl Kingery

It seems like a fine quote on its own but does she have the best interest of Christians/Christianity in mind? A post she made in response to an article:


Isnít Christianity itself a form of tribalism? Nearly every Christian seems to feel some delusional need to defend this pathetic religion and thereby assume superiority of their belief over the beliefs/actions of other Christians. It will never end because religion assumes superiority over people themselves and over simple common sense. Believe it or not, the world has bigger problems and in fact Christianity is part of the problem.
http://jonathanmerritt.religionnews.com/2013/10/23/controversial-pastor-mark-driscoll-says-christians-stop-infighting/

More of her views here:

https://themysteryofchrist.wordpress.com/2014/11/07/how-to-recover-from-christian-religious-abuse-elizabeth-dahl-kingery/

darin
01-21-2016, 10:26 AM
It seems like a fine quote on its own but does she have the best interest of Christians/Christianity in mind? A post she made in response to an article:


http://jonathanmerritt.religionnews.com/2013/10/23/controversial-pastor-mark-driscoll-says-christians-stop-infighting/

More of her views here:

https://themysteryofchrist.wordpress.com/2014/11/07/how-to-recover-from-christian-religious-abuse-elizabeth-dahl-kingery/

Lots of people say lots of things - when they make a good point it's worth mentioning. It's not tantamount to endorsement of all her views.

That said, for the reason of what Rel replied with I remain convinced people need to think they have special insights into God; to that end, they search and scour and detail every. last. nuance until their point of view is realized. Without judging Rel's motive or character I see people absolutely unwilling to think about God in the terms God laid-out within scripture. THey refuse to shake their need for a punishing asshole egomaniac God; despite self-study which SHOULD show the opposite to be true. One example

I have little confidence in a bible put-together by what amounts to politicians - but even less confidence in people who remove from scripture VITAL aspects such as "intended audience" and "context of the instruction/lesson" and "cultural norms" of the authors.

Gunny
01-21-2016, 11:46 AM
I am thinking trying so hard to find deeper meaning in every part of the bible pulls people away from its meaning

Can't say I agree with that. You could say the same about science, math, or any other topic someone buries themselves into. Most of us that I know read the Bible like we would a school book -- to learn something. The Old Testament is pretty much nothing more than a history book, and the New Testament is the life of Christ and the lessons he taught to others.

revelarts
01-21-2016, 01:53 PM
who's "Rel"?

if that's me just call me revelarts or Art, or you can use my real name "Avery".
but "Rel" where'd that come from?

revelarts
01-21-2016, 02:19 PM
Lots of people say lots of things - when they make a good point it's worth mentioning. It's not tantamount to endorsement of all her views.

That said, for the reason of what Rel replied with I remain convinced people need to think they have special insights into God; to that end, they search and scour and detail every. last. nuance until their point of view is realized. Without judging Rel's motive or character I see people absolutely unwilling to think about God in the terms God laid-out within scripture. THey refuse to shake their need for a punishing asshole egomaniac God; despite self-study which SHOULD show the opposite to be true. One example

I have little confidence in a bible put-together by what amounts to politicians - but even less confidence in people who remove from scripture VITAL aspects such as "intended audience" and "context of the instruction/lesson" and "cultural norms" of the authors.

"I remain convinced people need to think they have special insights into God;"
But it seems you're saying YOU have a better insight than those your upset with, right DMP?

"until their point of view is realized"
But isn't your point of view realized when you search the parts of scripture you accept?

"I see people absolutely unwilling to think about God in the terms God laid-out within scripture."
I'm not clear what you mean here, are you're saying that people should just read the scripture the way you think it's laid out?

"...They refuse to shake their need for a punishing asshole egomaniac God"
How exactly do you know they "need" a god like that?Andwhat scriptures are you using to describe that god?

"...despite self-study which SHOULD show the opposite to be true."
So people should study themselves instead of the Bible to know what God is really like? I just want to be clear. is that what you mean here?


look i've asked a few of question already but if you only reply to one part please reply to the below.
"I have little confidence in a bible put-together by what amounts to politicians - but even less confidence in people who remove from scripture VITAL aspects such as "intended audience" and "context of the instruction/lesson" and "cultural norms" of the authors."

the last bit 1st. you claim others want to remove from scripture VITAL aspects such as "intended audience" and "context of the instruction/lesson" and "cultural norms" of the authors. Well that's not me or most of the teachers or books i read. And many do what you complain about earlier, painstakingly looking into all of that. Even at times pointing out relevant details like the contemporary physical environment, building practices, how clothes were made, local economics and political nuances of the times.
Why do you think no one does that? who exactly do you have in mind do you have some examples?

concerning your 1st part,
You say you don't have confidence in the bible. OK what exactly do you mean by that?
Do you mean that it's has some accurate parts and some inaccurate?
or that it's got some myths and fables but a few nuggets of truth?
or that it's corrupt start to finish?
or That it started OK but was corrupted and generally not much good anymore?
or that it's great but people don't read it the right way like you do?

Or please write your own description of what's so wrong with the bible. And how we SHOULD use it .. if at all.
I just what understand where you're coming from here.

Abbey
01-21-2016, 05:22 PM
I think Rev's point that Jesus himself quoted scripture when he was being tested is an excellent point that I had never considered.

I would add that understanding the Bible, and experiencing and understanding God's love, are in no way mutually exclusive.

We will get out of any endeavor what we put in. People whose relationship with God I trust and value, pray before reading (and teaching!) the Bible, for God's wisdom, and I believe they approach it with humility.

darin
01-22-2016, 01:03 AM
who's "Rel"?

if that's me just call me revelarts or Art, or you can use my real name "Avery".
but "Rel" where'd that come from?

Its supposed to say Rev, but i wasnt paying attention - sorry