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darin
06-01-2016, 08:09 AM
Why would God have been visible, interacting with, and otherwise available in a physical form thousands of years ago and not, well, now? If God is outside and thus unaffected by time as we know it, there's no advantage to presenting Christ so long ago vs today. Could it be God simply gave himself as God because the people really needed a God to follow? Does it mean People today do not need a God, nor king? Even within the church people sing about god/jesus being their King. Yet today nobody I know really knows what it means to serve a King. We don't know what it means to Love God - we simply obey what we find in the bible and call that Love. Might Christ have been more-effective if he showed up, I dunno, maybe 1954? 1987? 2001?

fj1200
06-01-2016, 08:49 AM
Might Christ have been more-effective if he showed up, I dunno, maybe 1954? 1987? 2001?

I think the obvious answer is no. Would Christianity spread further now than it did back then? Premise being that we have the information we need to be Christians.

darin
06-01-2016, 08:52 AM
I think the obvious answer is no. Would Christianity spread further now than it did back then? Premise being that we have the information we need to be Christians.

Right. But since God can "save" folks long-dead, there'd be no need to get an early start to establish 'his church' and all that.

I wonder what the spiritual advantage is - except that people back then sorta needed a God or King. Maybe? Not feeling particularly articulate today though....just trying to sort through what I think I think. I think. :)

fj1200
06-01-2016, 09:05 AM
Right. But since God can "save" folks long-dead, there'd be no need to get an early start to establish 'his church' and all that.

I wonder what the spiritual advantage is - except that people back then sorta needed a God or King. Maybe? Not feeling particularly articulate today though....just trying to sort through what I think I think. I think. :)

The preaching of the Kingdom of God on earth.

http://www.colsoncenter.org/the-center/columns/indepth/15062-jesus-christ-and-the-kingdom-of-god

darin
06-01-2016, 09:28 AM
The preaching of the Kingdom of God on earth.

http://www.colsoncenter.org/the-center/columns/indepth/15062-jesus-christ-and-the-kingdom-of-god

But could have happened ANY time. Why back before Youtube and all that?

fj1200
06-01-2016, 09:30 AM
But could have happened ANY time. Why back before Youtube and all that?

Asked and answered.


I think the obvious answer is no. Would Christianity spread further now than it did back then? Premise being that we have the information we need to be Christians.

You presume today would be a superior environment to yesterday.

EDIT:

There was also no Christianity before Christ. Would an offshoot of Judaism be relevant in today's world?

Atticus Finch
06-01-2016, 09:38 AM
Judaism laid the foundation of Christianity.

fj1200
06-01-2016, 09:40 AM
Judaism laid the foundation of Christianity.

That's a stretch IMO.

Atticus Finch
06-01-2016, 11:00 AM
That's a stretch IMO.abolutely accurate ...if you understand the the relationship between of the OT Law and God's plan of salvation,which of course is an operation of faith.Something secular man struggles with.

fj1200
06-01-2016, 11:12 AM
abolutely accurate ...if you understand the the relationship between of the OT Law and God's plan of salvation,which of course is an operation of faith.Something secular man struggles with.

That would depend on your context. Judaism was in no way accepting of Jesus and Jesus, Peter, and Paul specifically moved away from OT Law as it pertains to gentiles especially. Was Jesus Jewish and a teacher? No question but I think the growth of Christianity was not dependent on Judaism. I'm happy to be wrong though. :)

Atticus Finch
06-01-2016, 11:40 AM
That would depend on your context. Judaism was in no way accepting of Jesus and Jesus, Peter, and Paul specifically moved away from OT Law as it pertains to gentiles especially. Was Jesus Jewish and a teacher? No question but I think the growth of Christianity was not dependent on Judaism. I'm happy to be wrong though. :)The Bible says that the old law was a school master to bring us to Christ....Christ himself said that he did not come to destroy the law but to fulfill it..in other words the Old Law always spoke of a Messiah coming,Jesus was that Messiah.His rejection by the establishment Jews was also foretold in the OL....The first Christians were Jews because the gospel of Christ was to be brought first to the House of Israel and then to the Gentiles.

fj1200
06-01-2016, 11:58 AM
The Bible says that the old law was a school master to bring us to Christ....Christ himself said that he did not come to destroy the law but to fulfill it..in other words the Old Law always spoke of a Messiah coming,Jesus was that Messiah.His rejection by the establishment Jews was also foretold in the OL....The first Christians were Jews because the gospel of Christ was to be brought first to the House of Israel and then to the Gentiles.

Again I think it depends on your context and in your context you're correct. But I think Christianity would not have grown to where it is by remaining a Jewish sect.

Atticus Finch
06-01-2016, 01:23 PM
Again I think it depends on your context and in your context you're correct. But I think Christianity would not have grown to where it is by remaining a Jewish sect.oh,I agree.I may have misunderstand the premise of your question

fj1200
06-01-2016, 05:16 PM
oh,I agree.I may have misunderstand the premise of your question

:cool:

darin
06-02-2016, 01:33 AM
Asked and answered.



You presume today would be a superior environment to yesterday.

EDIT:

There was also no Christianity before Christ. Would an offshoot of Judaism be relevant in today's world?

There's no answer there. Unsure we're not reading the same thing.

From a God who is timeless, there's no urgency nor tardiness to anything. That last bit - you're saying what I suggested in the OP: Back then people actually gave a shit about God and all that. Today, we are our own gods of sorts. What changed in mankind besides knowledge?

Abbey
06-02-2016, 08:41 AM
oh,I agree.I may have misunderstand the premise of your question

I don't see a misunderstanding. You merely said Judaism laid the foundation for Christianity. You didn't say it "remained a Jewish sect". Two very different things.

fj1200
06-02-2016, 08:51 AM
There's no answer there. Unsure we're not reading the same thing.

From a God who is timeless, there's no urgency nor tardiness to anything. That last bit - you're saying what I suggested in the OP: Back then people actually gave a shit about God and all that. Today, we are our own gods of sorts. What changed in mankind besides knowledge?

You asked, I gave an opinion. It wasn't satisfactory to you I guess. :) There are many things different in mankind today; anthropologically, sociologically... To question God's timing is to question God.

darin
06-02-2016, 08:53 AM
You asked, I gave an opinion. It wasn't satisfactory to you I guess. :) There are many things different in mankind today; anthropologically, sociologically... To question God's timing is to question God.

I guess I don't know how what you wrote answers my question. Questioning God is a pretty common. And healthy. :)

gabosaurus
06-02-2016, 05:47 PM
Why would God have been visible, interacting with, and otherwise available in a physical form thousands of years ago and not, well, now? If God is outside and thus unaffected by time as we know it, there's no advantage to presenting Christ so long ago vs today. Could it be God simply gave himself as God because the people really needed a God to follow? Does it mean People today do not need a God, nor king? Even within the church people sing about god/jesus being their King. Yet today nobody I know really knows what it means to serve a King. We don't know what it means to Love God - we simply obey what we find in the bible and call that Love. Might Christ have been more-effective if he showed up, I dunno, maybe 1954? 1987? 2001?

:wtf:
It is amazing the level of inanity the besotted brain can create after spending too much time sitting in a biergarten. :dunno:

DLT
06-02-2016, 07:58 PM
Why would God have been visible, interacting with, and otherwise available in a physical form thousands of years ago and not, well, now? If God is outside and thus unaffected by time as we know it, there's no advantage to presenting Christ so long ago vs today. Could it be God simply gave himself as God because the people really needed a God to follow? Does it mean People today do not need a God, nor king? Even within the church people sing about god/jesus being their King. Yet today nobody I know really knows what it means to serve a King. We don't know what it means to Love God - we simply obey what we find in the bible and call that Love. Might Christ have been more-effective if he showed up, I dunno, maybe 1954? 1987? 2001?

Like any 'startup endeavor'.....it was necessary for a more "hands-on" approach back then. After Jesus died on the cross for us, his disciples were left to carry on and spread the word...as they did. Now, it's more a matter of faith than ever.

darin
06-03-2016, 01:32 AM
Like any 'startup endeavor'.....it was necessary for a more "hands-on" approach back then. After Jesus died on the cross for us, his disciples were left to carry on and spread the word...as they did. Now, it's more a matter of faith than ever.

That's key - but there is no 'before' or 'after' for God. After Christ died he descended into what was essentially hell, and freed those captive therein. That's everyone from the beginning of time to the end - unless time runs liberally within the spirit world, too.