Chrysler : $1 Billion Investment, 2,000 New American Jobs

[NightTrain]

I imagine this was all in the works long ago too. Right, FJ? :rolleyes:




Fiat Chrysler said Sunday it would spend $1 billion on U.S. manufacturing, including modernizing plants in Michigan and Ohio, in a move that’s set to add 2,000 new jobs, Reuters reported.

According to the company’s plan, the plant in Warren, Michigan will be made capable of producing a pickup truck currently built in Mexico.


The Warren plant will make the new Jeep Wagoneer and Grand Wagoneer large SUVs. A plant in Toledo, Ohio also will get new equipment to make a new Jeep pickup.


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/08/fiat-chrysler-announces-1-billion-investment-in-u-s-manufacturing-2000-new-jobs.html

[fj1200]

I imagine this was all in the works long ago too. Right, FJ? :rolleyes:

I don't know. What I do know is that no matter what the facts are you've already made up your mind.

[NightTrain]

I don't know. What I do know is that no matter what the facts are you've already made up your mind.

Oh, I'm looking at the facts, FJ. Have you noticed that there are an extraordinary amount of very large manufacturing companies suddenly very interested in shutting down Mexican plants and building right here in the USA?

Very coincidental, is it not? What do you suppose is the impetus behind this sudden interest in American manufacturing?

Would a few helpful quotes from company leadership pointing out Trump's arrival on the scene help clear your naysaying?
Or will you continue with :lalala:?

[CSM]

Oh, I'm looking at the facts, FJ. Have you noticed that there are an extraordinary amount of very large manufacturing companies suddenly very interested in shutting down Mexican plants and building right here in the USA?

Very coincidental, is it not? What do you suppose is the impetus behind this sudden interest in American manufacturing?

Would a few helpful quotes from company leadership pointing out Trump's arrival on the scene help clear your naysaying?
Or will you continue with :lalala:?

Hey, Obama is still POTUS so I am quite certain that Trump had nothing to do with any of this and the sudden shift is strictly thanks to Obama. LOLOLOLOL!!!!! I can't even keep a straight face as I type this....

[NightTrain]

Hey, Obama is still POTUS so I am quite certain that Trump had nothing to do with any of this and the sudden shift is strictly thanks to Obama. LOLOLOLOL!!!!! I can't even keep a straight face as I type this....
It appears that the #NeverTrump monkey is hellishly hard to kick for some addicts. :coffee:

[Bilgerat]

It appears that the #NeverTrump monkey is hellishly hard to kick for some addicts. :coffee:



http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9613&stc=1

[Bilgerat]

I don't know. What I do know is that no matter what the facts are you've already made up your mind.



https://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder531/53475531.jpg

[Balu]

Oh, I'm looking at the facts, FJ. Have you noticed that there are an extraordinary amount of very large manufacturing companies suddenly very interested in shutting down Mexican plants and building right here in the USA?

Very coincidental, is it not? What do you suppose is the impetus behind this sudden interest in American manufacturing?

Would a few helpful quotes from company leadership pointing out Trump's arrival on the scene help clear your naysaying?
Or will you continue with :lalala:?

I believe that Trump belongs to industrial/manufacturing elite, occupied in the real sector of the economy, but not to the financial elite, engaged in inflating financial bubbles.

[fj1200]

Oh, I'm looking at the facts, FJ. Have you noticed that there are an extraordinary amount of very large manufacturing companies suddenly very interested in shutting down Mexican plants and building right here in the USA?

Very coincidental, is it not? What do you suppose is the impetus behind this sudden interest in American manufacturing?

Would a few helpful quotes from company leadership pointing out Trump's arrival on the scene help clear your naysaying?
Or will you continue with :lalala:?

You're looking at news stories that show announcements by companies. If anything suggests that the plans were made prior to November 9 then your fingers go straight into your ears. Auto companies make decisions years into the future, did they just decide to do this then great. Did they decide two years ago and are announcing it ahead of the NAIAS that opened yesterday then it would have little to do with trump. But hey, you found a news story. That's cool because anything that shows investment being made in the US with incumbent jobs is OK by me.


Hey, Obama is still POTUS so I am quite certain that Trump had nothing to do with any of this and the sudden shift is strictly thanks to Obama. LOLOLOLOL!!!!! I can't even keep a straight face as I type this....

But that is the actual question. Not just, "hey I found a news story..." They could also be doing it ahead of expected corporate tax cuts and regulatory reform which I've been preaching for years before trump stumbled in.


It appears that the #NeverTrump monkey is hellishly hard to kick for some addicts. :coffee:

Obviously you're confused, it was your trolling not my theoretical nevertrump position why I replied. He is the POTUS, he has an R beside his name, and it's in any Republicans, and conservatives by extension, best interest that he be successful.



https://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder531/53475531.jpg


I'm just wondering if you know you're on a debate site, cartoons have their own thread and network. :poke: Besides sometimes it seems like I'm the only one dealing in fact. ;)

And who's whining about trump? :confused:

[jimnyc]

You're looking at news stories that show announcements by companies. If anything suggests that the plans were made prior to November 9 then your fingers go straight into your ears. Auto companies make decisions years into the future, did they just decide to do this then great. Did they decide two years ago and are announcing it ahead of the NAIAS that opened yesterday then it would have little to do with trump.

IS there anything to show that they planned this previously? JUST asking as I'm walking out door and can't search...

[fj1200]

IS there anything to show that they planned this previously? JUST asking as I'm walking out door and can't search...

Not that I've seen. Hence the "if." However...


General Motors Co (GM.N (http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/overview?symbol=GM.N)) Chief Executive Mary Barra on Sunday said tax reform and "streamlining regulations ... are just two areas that would be extremely beneficial" for Trump to address. Trump has criticized GM for building cars in Mexico while laying off workers in the United States.
Barra, who is on an advisory committee to Trump, told reporters that decisions about where to build specific vehicles are made "two, three four years ago". Overall, she said of Trump, "we have much more in common than we have different".
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-fiatchrysler-usa-idUSKBN14S0WL

[NightTrain]

Nice dance, FJ. You're going to wear out your shoes.

You still didn't answer :

What do you suppose is behind the sudden 180° shift in interest of manufacturing in America? Even at the expense of abandoning millions of dollars of plants under construction right now in Mexico?

You can easily answer with one word.

[fj1200]

Nice dance, FJ. You're going to wear out your shoes.

You still didn't answer :

What do you suppose is behind the sudden 180° shift in interest of manufacturing in America? Even at the expense of abandoning millions of dollars of plants under construction right now in Mexico?

You can easily answer with one word.

You only understand one-word answers even when the answer is so much more; I've already shown you that. Do you know that Ford plant? They're still moving small car production to Mexico last I heard.

[Balu]

Nice dance, FJ. You're going to wear out your shoes.

You still didn't answer :

What do you suppose is behind the sudden 180° shift in interest of manufacturing in America? Even at the expense of abandoning millions of dollars of plants under construction right now in Mexico?

You can easily answer with one word.
I think that it may be a forthcoming foreign trade policy of protectionism - to develop own industries. When exporting money and reverse importing items become detrimental.

[jimnyc]

Not that I've seen. Hence the "if." However...


http://www.reuters.com/article/us-fiatchrysler-usa-idUSKBN14S0WL

Same as why I put IS in caps, wasn't accusing or anything, really wanted to know.

But I have very little doubt that companies are making changes now because of Trump, for various reasons. And I think it all boils down to THEIR best interest of course, and that's on Trump in a few ways - whether making it advantageous for companies to stay and hire here, or to cost more elsewhere.

[NightTrain]

You only understand one-word answers even when the answer is so much more; I've already shown you that. Do you know that Ford plant? They're still moving small car production to Mexico last I heard.

Yeah, I really am a simple fuck, aren't I? You haven't proven shit. Your stubborn schtick isn't nearly as clever as you seem to think it is.

Here's a Fun Fact, FJ : No one cares if a manufacturer produces and sells foreign made cars to foreign countries. Have at it. But you won't produce something in Mexico and expect to benefit from Mexicans earning a couple bucks an hour by selling it here domestically.


Let me help you out, FJ.

FJ's short answer : Trump.

FJ's long answer : Yes, NT, Trump's election and statements have made the economy-killing practice of shipping American manufacturing jobs to Mexico come to a screeching halt. In fact, NT, it appears that the practice is in a full fledged reversal.


There, FJ. Now wasn't that easy?

[sundaydriver]

I imagine this was all in the works long ago too. Right, FJ? :rolleyes:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/01/08/fiat-chrysler-announces-1-billion-investment-in-u-s-manufacturing-2000-new-jobs.html


Yes, in fact it was. Here is an article on the new models and US production from Sept. 1st of last year. Plans and financing were made long before Trumps election.

What this Forum needs is some car guys! Where the hell is dmp?

http://blog.caranddriver.com/holy-toledo-jeep-wrangler-based-pickup-is-happening/

[jimnyc]

Yes, in fact it was. Here is an article on the new models and US production from Sept. 1st of last year. Plans and financing were made long before Trumps election.

What this Forum needs is some car guys! Where the hell is dmp?

I don't see any link, let alone one one that shows a planned billion dollar investment in manufacturing and jobs...

[sundaydriver]

I don't see any link, let alone one one that shows a planned billion dollar investment in manufacturing and jobs...

Added.

[jimnyc]

Yes, in fact it was. Here is an article on the new models and US production from Sept. 1st of last year. Plans and financing were made long before Trumps election.

What this Forum needs is some car guys! Where the hell is dmp?

http://blog.caranddriver.com/holy-toledo-jeep-wrangler-based-pickup-is-happening/


Added.

The plant in Toledo.... and possibly Illinois - is the same $1 billion investment? I don't see anything about Michigan in there.

You guys know a LOT more about cars and the plans and crap than I do, I'm just reading both articles and seeing where the money and jobs go is all. Good for America no matter what. Just don't see the words michigan or billion in that article.

[fj1200]

Same as why I put IS in caps, wasn't accusing or anything, really wanted to know.

But I have very little doubt that companies are making changes now because of Trump, for various reasons. And I think it all boils down to THEIR best interest of course, and that's on Trump in a few ways - whether making it advantageous for companies to stay and hire here, or to cost more elsewhere.

And maybe they are. It doesn't make sense however to claim a decision made two years ago, for example, was made in the last two months.

[fj1200]

Yeah, I really am a simple fuck, aren't I? You haven't proven shit. Your stubborn schtick isn't nearly as clever as you seem to think it is.

You're the one creating the only answer options that you'll accept. :dunno: Besides, you were wrong about IBM jobs and a whole bunch of BO stuff from another thread.

EDIT: All your fanboy posting does remind me of democrats from 8 years ago though.


Yes, in fact it was. Here is an article on the new models and US production from Sept. 1st of last year. Plans and financing were made long before Trumps election.

What this Forum needs is some car guys! Where the hell is dmp?

http://blog.caranddriver.com/holy-toledo-jeep-wrangler-based-pickup-is-happening/

Unpossible.


The plant in Toledo.... and possibly Illinois - is the same $1 billion investment? I don't see anything about Michigan in there.

You guys know a LOT more about cars and the plans and crap than I do, I'm just reading both articles and seeing where the money and jobs go is all. Good for America no matter what. Just don't see the words michigan or billion in that article.

Great for America. They've been teasing that wrangler pickup for years just like Ford with the new Bronco. The plan all along has been to build the new Bronco in the US IIRC while moving Focus production to Mexico, no idea about Chrysler except for the SD's link.

[jimnyc]

And maybe they are. It doesn't make sense however to claim a decision made two years ago, for example, was made in the last two months.

With some perhaps, and maybe other decisions are being made now because of the impending POTUS change. I have NO doubt that companies are paying attention when it comes to staying/leaving, what it would potentially cost their bottom line - and others are looking at what new will come that may just make their business better for them with his new plans.

I still don't see anything that states they planned the plant for Michigan and the investment money 2 years ago. I'm not saying they didn't, I just haven't seen that in this thread.

I have no doubt also, that future companies that may have thought of leaving, or plan on it, may think twice. I think some maybe may even return some jobs here. And I think once Trump is in, I think we'll see more investing as we've been hearing about from folks like Ma and others.

[NightTrain]

You're the one creating the only answer options that you'll accept. :dunno: Besides, you were wrong about IBM jobs and a whole bunch of BO stuff from another thread.

I was? The responsible thing for you to do is to continue that thread or link it instead of nebulously waving your hand 'over there' if you think I was wrong in another thread. Kind of chickenshit to pull this kind of maneuver.


EDIT: All your fanboy posting does remind me of democrats from 8 years ago though.

Emmm... I wouldn't say fanboy.

I would say I've been taking a certain satisfaction in rubbing your nose in your NeverTrump crap I've been listening to for over a year. That would be an accurate statement. :happy0203:

[NightTrain]

Yes, in fact it was. Here is an article on the new models and US production from Sept. 1st of last year. Plans and financing were made long before Trumps election.

What this Forum needs is some car guys! Where the hell is dmp?

http://blog.caranddriver.com/holy-toledo-jeep-wrangler-based-pickup-is-happening/


As Jim pointed out, there was no discussion of pulling production from Mexican plants or a $1 Billion investment - only a shifting of a Jeep pickup for a limited run in existing plants with some shuffling.

[sundaydriver]

As Jim pointed out, there was no discussion of pulling production from Mexican plants or a $1 Billion investment - only a shifting of a Jeep pickup for a limited run in existing plants with some shuffling.

I think that's the difference between a car magazine and financial news. What it does show at a minimum is the timing for the planning stage for production logistics was well along before September 2016 and certainly not a result of Trumps winning in November, regardless of what he claims.

[NightTrain]

I think that's the difference between a car magazine and financial news. What it does show at a minimum is the timing for the planning stage for production logistics was well along before September 2016 and certainly not a result of Trumps winning in November, regardless of what he claims.

I don't doubt that there were alternate plans, especially with the statements Trump was making since the primaries. Successful corporations make contingency plans, especially with something as game-changing as a protectionist-leaning President coming to power.

However, there has been no shift reverting back to American jobs under Obama, in fact, the mass exodus has been alarming. Hillary certainly wasn't going to make a stand - she was all for open trade, remember TPP?

No, the only thing that has changed as far as jobs shifting back to America has been Trump's successful election and his threats to slap them with re-entry taxes on the products made in Mexico. This is just common sense.

[sundaydriver]

I don't doubt that there were alternate plans, especially with the statements Trump was making since the primaries. Successful corporations make contingency plans, especially with something as game-changing as a protectionist-leaning President coming to power.

However, there has been no shift reverting back to American jobs under Obama, in fact, the mass exodus has been alarming. Hillary certainly wasn't going to make a stand - she was all for open trade, remember TPP?

No, the only thing that has changed as far as jobs shifting back to America has been Trump's successful election and his threats to slap them with re-entry taxes on the products made in Mexico. This is just common sense.

I'll take the word of the head of Fiat/Chrysler over Trumps for the timing & decision.

You saw yesterday Fiat Chrysler; big, big factory going to be built in this country as opposed to another country. Ford just announced that they stopped plans for a billion-dollar plant in Mexico and they’re going to be moving into Michigan and expanding, very substantially, an existing plant.”
Trump claims credit for these announcements, but that’s wrong.

Sergio Marchionne, the Fiat Chrysler chief executive, said the plan had been in the works for more than a year and had nothing to do with Trump; he credited instead talks with the United Auto Workers.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2017/01/11/fact-checking-president-elect-trumps-news-conference/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_fact-checker-3pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

[NightTrain]

I'll take the word of the head of Fiat/Chrysler over Trumps for the timing & decision.

You saw yesterday Fiat Chrysler; big, big factory going to be built in this country as opposed to another country. Ford just announced that they stopped plans for a billion-dollar plant in Mexico and they’re going to be moving into Michigan and expanding, very substantially, an existing plant.”
Trump claims credit for these announcements, but that’s wrong.

Sergio Marchionne, the Fiat Chrysler chief executive, said the plan had been in the works for more than a year and had nothing to do with Trump; he credited instead talks with the United Auto Workers.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2017/01/11/fact-checking-president-elect-trumps-news-conference/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_fact-checker-3pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory



And yet, he said this 2 days ago :

The chief executive of auto giant Fiat Chrysler has warned that the company would have to consider closing its Mexican factories if Donald Trump decides to impose his threat of tough new tariffs on imports from Mexico.


Sergio Marchionne, chief executive officer of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, said on Monday that the entire industry was dogged by uncertainty since Trump’s election and added that if the president-elect followed through on threats to tax Mexican car imports, he would have to consider shutting factories.


“It’s possible that if the economic tariffs that are imposed by the US administration on anything that comes into the United States, if they are sufficiently large, it will make the production of anything in Mexico uneconomical and therefore we will have to move on. It is quite possible,” Marchionne said addressing reporters at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit.

Repurposing the Mexican factory would be “costly and uncertain”. Asked if he would consider investments in Mexico if he was offered substantial inducements by the Mexican government, Marchionne said it would be “incredibly imprudent on our side to try and make commitments to that country”.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jan/09/fiat-chrysler-mexico-plants-detroit-auto-show-2017-trump

[fj1200]

With some perhaps, and maybe other decisions are being made now because of the impending POTUS change. I have NO doubt that companies are paying attention when it comes to staying/leaving, what it would potentially cost their bottom line - and others are looking at what new will come that may just make their business better for them with his new plans.

I still don't see anything that states they planned the plant for Michigan and the investment money 2 years ago. I'm not saying they didn't, I just haven't seen that in this thread.

I have no doubt also, that future companies that may have thought of leaving, or plan on it, may think twice. I think some maybe may even return some jobs here. And I think once Trump is in, I think we'll see more investing as we've been hearing about from folks like Ma and others.

I've already allowed for the possibility that the decision was based on trump but the story posted by SD certainly casts doubt on the veracity of the claim similar to IBM and Ford.


I was? The responsible thing for you to do is to continue that thread or link it instead of nebulously waving your hand 'over there' if you think I was wrong in another thread. Kind of chickenshit to pull this kind of maneuver.


Emmm... I wouldn't say fanboy.

I would say I've been taking a certain satisfaction in rubbing your nose in your NeverTrump crap I've been listening to for over a year. That would be an accurate statement. :happy0203:

Yes, you were. That thread fell eerily silent when fact was introduced. :)

Fanboy is a wild understatement. And I have no problem with my position; I didn't vote for him and nothing has changed my opinion but that doesn't mean that I don't want him to be successful for reasons I've already laid out. But I'm happy to be wrong but you will only apparently believe what you want to believe even in the face of evidence to the contrary. Hence, fanboy.

[fj1200]

And yet, he said this 2 days ago :

The chief executive of auto giant Fiat Chrysler has warned that the company would have to consider closing its Mexican factories if Donald Trump decides to impose his threat of tough new tariffs on imports from Mexico.


Sergio Marchionne, chief executive officer of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, said on Monday that the entire industry was dogged by uncertainty since Trump’s election and added that if the president-elect followed through on threats to tax Mexican car imports, he would have to consider shutting factories.


“It’s possible that if the economic tariffs that are imposed by the US administration on anything that comes into the United States, if they are sufficiently large, it will make the production of anything in Mexico uneconomical and therefore we will have to move on. It is quite possible,” Marchionne said addressing reporters at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit.

Repurposing the Mexican factory would be “costly and uncertain”. Asked if he would consider investments in Mexico if he was offered substantial inducements by the Mexican government, Marchionne said it would be “incredibly imprudent on our side to try and make commitments to that country”.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jan/09/fiat-chrysler-mexico-plants-detroit-auto-show-2017-trump

Which raises the question of the failure of protectionism. Free trade is good.

[NightTrain]

Which raises the question of the failure of protectionism. Free trade is good.

No, what it does is put to rest your silly argument and the proves the move is directly due to Trump's election.

Say it with me, FJ : Thanks, President Trump!

[NightTrain]

Yes, you were. That thread fell eerily silent when fact was introduced. :)

Fanboy is a wild understatement. And I have no problem with my position; I didn't vote for him and nothing has changed my opinion but that doesn't mean that I don't want him to be successful for reasons I've already laid out. But I'm happy to be wrong but you will only apparently believe what you want to believe even in the face of evidence to the contrary. Hence, fanboy.

No need to get your panties twisted. Johnson has a nice mellow strain on the market in Colorado.

Where's the link to where you devastated me and all those times I was wrong about Obama? Let's get to the bottom of this mystery.

[fj1200]

No, what it does is put to rest your silly argument and the proves the move is directly due to Trump's election.

Say it with me, FJ : Thanks, President Trump!

I see that you're unable to understand anything beyond what you've already decided. :shrug:


No need to get your panties twisted. Johnson has a nice mellow strain on the market in Colorado.

Where's the link to where you devastated me and all those times I was wrong about Obama? Let's get to the bottom of this mystery.

I see you must be under some sort of delusion that I'm upset over the election. Did my candidate win? Nope and his fate was sealed when he didn't make the debates and then he started shooting himself in the foot. Did my least favorite candidate lose? You bet. At this point my hope is that trump doesn't screw it up but I've stated previously that I'll support what is conservative and oppose what is not; and protectionism is not. Your problem is that your too invested in trump and you won't be able to handle any bad news that might come down the pipe. Admitting that you might be wrong down the line is going to hurt. Me? I'll be happy to admit that I'm wrong but with the clear benefits of free trade it's unlikely to happen.

[sundaydriver]

And yet, he said this 2 days ago :

The chief executive of auto giant Fiat Chrysler has warned that the company would have to consider closing its Mexican factories if Donald Trump decides to impose his threat of tough new tariffs on imports from Mexico.


Sergio Marchionne, chief executive officer of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, said on Monday that the entire industry was dogged by uncertainty since Trump’s election and added that if the president-elect followed through on threats to tax Mexican car imports, he would have to consider shutting factories.


“It’s possible that if the economic tariffs that are imposed by the US administration on anything that comes into the United States, if they are sufficiently large, it will make the production of anything in Mexico uneconomical and therefore we will have to move on. It is quite possible,” Marchionne said addressing reporters at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit.

Repurposing the Mexican factory would be “costly and uncertain”. Asked if he would consider investments in Mexico if he was offered substantial inducements by the Mexican government, Marchionne said it would be “incredibly imprudent on our side to try and make commitments to that country”.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jan/09/fiat-chrysler-mexico-plants-detroit-auto-show-2017-trump

Yes, I'm sure Trump has American companies thinking about the future and that is as it should be to an extent. The kudos he offered himself about Ford, IBM, and Fiat/ Chrysler are factually false as he knows but doesn't care and will double down on it.

[fj1200]

Crazy!

CEOs actually ARE dissing Trump's claims on jobs (https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/ceos-actually-are-dissing-trumps-claims-on-jobs-193331989.html)

At the Detroit auto show in early January, Sergio Marchionne, the CEO of Fiat Chrysler (FCAU (https://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=FCAU)), said he would love to credit Donald Trump for his company’s decision to make a big new investment in US factories. But the planning had been going on since well before Election Day last November. “I wish I could give [Trump] credit for this,” Marchionne told a group of reporters, “but the thinking was in place beforehand.”

[NightTrain]

:laugh:

Still trying to squirm, eh?

Tap out, dude.

[fj1200]

:laugh:

Still trying to squirm, eh?

Tap out, dude.

:confused:


I imagine this was all in the works long ago too. Right, FJ? :rolleyes:


Crazy!

CEOs actually ARE dissing Trump's claims on jobs (https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/ceos-actually-are-dissing-trumps-claims-on-jobs-193331989.html)


“I wish I could give [Trump] credit for this,” Marchionne told a group of reporters, “but the thinking was in place beforehand.”

:shrug:

[NightTrain]

The chief executive of auto giant Fiat Chrysler has warned that the company would have to consider closing its Mexican factories if Donald Trump decides to impose his threat of tough new tariffs on imports from Mexico.

Sergio Marchionne, chief executive officer of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, said on Monday that the entire industry was dogged by uncertainty since Trump’s election and added that if the president-elect followed through on threats to tax Mexican car imports, he would have to consider shutting factories.


“It’s possible that if the economic tariffs that are imposed by the US administration on anything that comes into the United States, if they are sufficiently large, it will make the production of anything in Mexico uneconomical and therefore we will have to move on. It is quite possible,” Marchionne said addressing reporters at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit.

Repurposing the Mexican factory would be “costly and uncertain”. Asked if he would consider investments in Mexico if he was offered substantial inducements by the Mexican government, Marchionne said it would be “incredibly imprudent on our side to try and make commitments to that country”. Tap. Out.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

[B]Tap. Out.

:beer: :clap::clap: :beer:

Leftists/dems/socialists always refuse to give their opponents any credit when it is due.
Its an ideological tactic that they so adamantly adhere too.
Just as they give Trump no credit, you are getting no credit for proving your point/stand..

Fear of economic pains Trump could impose got them to do this, yet being not fools they will not admit that openly and point out how successful it was!
Common-sense and prudent business decision was made but the usual naysayers will deny any of that to be fact/reality, IMHO.

As money talks- bullshit walks... :laugh:-- -Tyr

[fj1200]

[B]Tap. Out.

You apparently are having trouble with past tense and future tense. Sad.

[sundaydriver]

You apparently are having trouble with past tense and future tense. Sad.

Exactly my thought on this thread. What Trump threatens and what will actually be implemented is yet to be seen. The auto manufacturing investments and job locations that Trump has taken credit for have been ongoing planning for years and decisions including the January 2015 bargaining agreement with the UAW, lack of small car sales in the US, and available infrastructure drive these decisions. BMW's reply to threats about their new Mexican plant were: go screw, if the US wants to sell more cars, then make better cars!
All this protectionism reminds me that we 5% of the world selling to 95% of the world and a lot of our new product markets are overseas. I'm all for more living wage growth at home, but also have dealt with the fact that a lot of the production of products will be where the demand is the greatest.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Exactly my thought on this thread. What Trump threatens and what will actually be implemented is yet to be seen. The auto manufacturing investments and job locations that Trump has taken credit for have been ongoing planning for years and decisions including the January 2015 bargaining agreement with the UAW, lack of small car sales in the US, and available infrastructure drive these decisions. BMW's reply to threats about their new Mexican plant were: go screw, if the US wants to sell more cars, then make better cars!
All this protectionism reminds me that we 5% of the world selling to 95% of the world and a lot of our new product markets are overseas. I'm all for more living wage growth at home, but also have dealt with the fact that a lot of the production of products will be where the demand is the greatest.


All this protectionism reminds me that we 5% of the world selling to 95% of the world and a lot of our new product markets are overseas.
BULL. Just how is it in -OUR NATION/CITIZENS-- best interests for far too many of our manufacturing jobs going overseas!!??
That in itself is a huge negative and makes us become a consumer/importer of foreign made products- tips the scale away from us being a booming economy by way of production-more jobs -here!- increasing our wealth and standard of living..
It in fact , lowers our standard of living sending us backwards! Which the dem/libs/leftists just love.
You must live solidly in that ffing lala fantasy land(globalist lying utopia) to spout your bullshit as you just did , IMHO.-TYR

[fj1200]

BULL. Just how is it in -OUR NATION/CITIZENS-- best interests for far too many of our manufacturing jobs going overseas!!??
That in itself is a huge negative and makes us become a consumer/importer of foreign made products- tips the scale away from us being a booming economy by way of production-more jobs -here!- increasing our wealth and standard of living..
It in fact , lowers our standard of living sending us backwards! Which the dem/libs/leftists just love.
You must live solidly in that ffing lala fantasy land(globalist lying utopia) to spout your bullshit as you just did , IMHO.-TYR

Interesting factoids: 1) Manufacturing is our largest sector, and 2) Manufacturing output is as high as it's ever been. Also, comparative advantage (https://mises.org/library/ricardian-law-comparative-advantage) leads to higher living standards. Fact and Truth don't apparently make very good rants. :(

[sundaydriver]

BULL. Just how is it in -OUR NATION/CITIZENS-- best interests for far too many of our manufacturing jobs going overseas!!??
That in itself is a huge negative and makes us become a consumer/importer of foreign made products- tips the scale away from us being a booming economy by way of production-more jobs -here!- increasing our wealth and standard of living..
It in fact , lowers our standard of living sending us backwards! Which the dem/libs/leftists just love.
You must live solidly in that ffing lala fantasy land(globalist lying utopia) to spout your bullshit as you just did , IMHO.-TYR

Nope, talking from the experience of 34 years of process improvement & new product development for three worldwide corporations. I've experienced the needs, wants and the timeframe for such decisions and heard all the corporate reasoning and mantras. Yes, it would be nice if everything was produced here and means should be available to keep what we can here, but business is a business and they need to look out for the companies and employees first and you will find that in most companies Mission Statements. How long is a business going to remain in business if all their decision making is based on what's best for the US?

[sundaydriver]

Interesting factoids: 1) Manufacturing is our largest sector, and 2) Manufacturing output is as high as it's ever been. Also, comparative advantage (https://mises.org/library/ricardian-law-comparative-advantage) leads to higher living standards. Fact and Truth don't apparently make very good rants. :(

Facts don't seem to matter when you want to take the world backwards. The world has become a very small place and only going to get smaller in the future.

[Drummond]

Nope, talking from the experience of 34 years of process improvement & new product development for three worldwide corporations. I've experienced the needs, wants and the timeframe for such decisions and heard all the corporate reasoning and mantras. Yes, it would be nice if everything was produced here and means should be available to keep what we can here, but business is a business and they need to look out for the companies and employees first and you will find that in most companies Mission Statements. How long is a business going to remain in business if all their decision making is based on what's best for the US?

Here I am, a Brit, and I'm struck by what I think and feel about your evident lack of patriotism !!

Trump has spoken strongly on the subject of encouraging businesses to remain in the US, and has at least hinted at measures to be applied if this does not happen. And ... bear in mind that all of this comes from a person whose mindset IS that of a highly experienced businessman !!

I think you are badly in need of a stiff dose of President Trump's (at time of typing .. he's just now been inaugurated) patriotic determination and zeal. If he can do it .. so can any American. Yes ... EVEN Lefties, IF they've a mind to do so.

Do try it.

[sundaydriver]

Here I am, a Brit, and I'm struck by what I think and feel about your evident lack of patriotism !!

Trump has spoken strongly on the subject of encouraging businesses to remain in the US, and has at least hinted at measures to be applied if this does not happen. And ... bear in mind that all of this comes from a person whose mindset IS that of a highly experienced businessman !!

I think you are badly in need of a stiff dose of President Trump's (at time of typing .. he's just now been inaugurated) patriotic determination and zeal. If he can do it .. so can any American. Yes ... EVEN Lefties, IF they've a mind to do so.

Do try it.

Thanks for the condescending platitudes but undeserving of a reply other than this!

[Drummond]

Thanks for the condescending platitudes but undeserving of a reply other than this!

You're welcome.

What's more, I'm right ... and well you know it.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Nope, talking from the experience of 34 years of process improvement & new product development for three worldwide corporations. I've experienced the needs, wants and the timeframe for such decisions and heard all the corporate reasoning and mantras. Yes, it would be nice if everything was produced here and means should be available to keep what we can here, but business is a business and they need to look out for the companies and employees first and you will find that in most companies Mission Statements. How long is a business going to remain in business if all their decision making is based on what's best for the US?


Yes, it would be nice if everything was produced here and means should be available to keep what we can here, but business is a business and they need to look out for the companies and employees first and you will find that in most companies Mission Statements.

They are not looking out for the employees first!!! Are you daft???
How is shipping their jobs overseas, laying them off by the tens of thousands, looking out for them!??-Tyr



but business is a business and they need to look out for the companies

^^^^ Now this part is correct(it totally looks after the business-and only after the business and its owners!) But you tossed in the second part to try to cover the massive negative in this..
Health of maintenance in , welfare and economy of this nation is looking out for their best interests , but they choose instead= globalism!
That is the dirty secret you so adamantly avoid mentioning.
As it most certainly looks out for the company's interests and will always say --- to hell with its employees.

Do explain to the millions that lost really good paying jobs-how the company moving factories overseas and employee foreigners helped them !
As its a damn well known fact it did not and has cost millions their higher standard of living. Millions losing massively(losing homes savings, filing bankruptcy, etc.), and you try to splash that painted over bullshit!
Hoss, I do not care what ffing career you are in, have been in- you do not get to piss down my back and then tell me its raining!
I was smarter than that at age 13..-Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You're welcome.

What's more, I'm right ... and well you know it.
Just wait until he reads my destruction of his ignorance or is it his deliberate deceptions?
Reality reveals the lies he posted in the reply that I commented on..
These type have their career, their money, their in with the globalist system and are fine with this nation failing as they think- so what as long as I am doing well..
What gets me, is how juvenile and silly some of their "thought to be clever defense of globalism and its destruction" is...
As they try to brainwash others into deny reality as they do!!! -Tyr

[Drummond]

Just wait until he reads my destruction of his ignorance or is it his deliberate deceptions?
Reality reveals the lies he posted in the reply that I commented on..
These type have their career, their money, their in with the globalist system and are fine with this nation failing as they think- so what as long as I am doing well..
What gets me, is how juvenile and silly some of their "thought to be clever defense of globalism and its destruction" is...
As they try to brainwash others into deny reality as they do!!! -Tyr

He's wedded to his political allegiances, I think and absolutely refuses to see anything beyond that. Nothing else matters.

The Left only wants to see what it wants to see ! All outside of that, just isn't recognised. Bizarre, but true.

This is why I'm truly inclined to view Left-wing thought as a political manifestation of insanity. Because the truth of that 'thought' mirrors what can be said to be true of so many mental patients, living in institutions !

I have hopes of a cure for them. A stiff, undeniable dose of sheer reality must be a part of that cure.

[fj1200]

Here I am, a Brit, and I'm struck by what I think and feel about your evident lack of patriotism !!

That seems a bit short sighted coming from a "Brit." Their empire was built on trade.

A bit dated but my guess is pretty close to current:

http://www.marktaw.com/culture_and_media/TheUSTradeDeficitImages/GlobalExportsImportsPercentGDP.gif

[fj1200]

He's wedded to his political allegiances, I think and absolutely refuses to see anything beyond that. Nothing else matters.

:laugh:

[sundaydriver]

Just wait until he reads my destruction of his ignorance or is it his deliberate deceptions?
Reality reveals the lies he posted in the reply that I commented on..
These type have their career, their money, their in with the globalist system and are fine with this nation failing as they think- so what as long as I am doing well..
What gets me, is how juvenile and silly some of their "thought to be clever defense of globalism and its destruction" is...
As they try to brainwash others into deny reality as they do!!! -Tyr

You try to make as if I'm a bystander to off shoring jobs and don't realize that it also happened to me in 2002 when I was informed my job was going to China just 15 hours after closing on a new house. Picked myself up and had another job in 7 weeks (marketable skills) and was back taking college courses 4 months later which led me to a better job within a year. What I didn't do was drop out of the workforce. start living off the tax payers for years, while sitting on the internet all day, every day talking about how capable, expert, and smart I was. That to me is just hiding from the real world.

[sundaydriver]

Just wait until he reads my destruction of his ignorance or is it his deliberate deceptions?
..-Tyr

:laugh: Self aggrandizing is it called.

[sundaydriver]

He's wedded to his political allegiances, I think and absolutely refuses to see anything beyond that. Nothing else matters.

The Left only wants to see what it wants to see ! All outside of that, just isn't recognised. Bizarre, but true.

This is why I'm truly inclined to view Left-wing thought as a political manifestation of insanity. Because the truth of that 'thought' mirrors what can be said to be true of so many mental patients, living in institutions !

I have hopes of a cure for them. A stiff, undeniable dose of sheer reality must be a part of that cure.

I believe this is the most prominent example of pot calling kettle black that I've ever seen. :laugh:

You mean living in a hermetically sealed echo chamber like you do in which no facts enter and only dogma is allowed in is bad?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You try to make as if I'm a bystander to off shoring jobs and don't realize that it also happened to me in 2002 when I was informed my job was going to China just 15 hours after closing on a new house. Picked myself up and had another job in 7 weeks (marketable skills) and was back taking college courses 4 months later which led me to a better job within a year. What I didn't do was drop out of the workforce. start living off the tax payers for years, while sitting on the internet all day, every day talking about how capable, expert, and smart I was. That to me is just hiding from the real world.

hmmmmmmmmmmm.
You may or may not be a member of the --"they"-- that I commented on..
And you may have carried forth with great success.
The point made was not about it being a hopeless cause to carry on after being ripped like that.
The point was it was globalism, its allies and its cheerleaders that deliberately destroyed our heavy industry as well as others businesses-linked in a kind of economically depressed servitude as dependent consumers--to China--while they and China profited handsomely---- --NOT US!
That massive destruction of the capitalistic system working on this nation's behalf(and its citizens too) was subverted/ altered in a way that weakened us and enriched/empowered them!

What with all your infinite smarts that enabled you race forth right back into being a great and massive success- how did you miss that?

By the way hoss, I do not hide from anybody or anything..
I only fear one thing in this mad and dark world and that is for the safety of those that I ever so dearly love!
Everything else, I'll fight at the damn drop of a hat when called to do so...
Its a true Southern man thing- do not expect you to know or understand since its family bloodline and heritage driven set of morals/principles... --Tyr
-Tyr

[Russ]

[B]Tap. Out.

I have to agree with NT on this. If any of these companies that have recently announced that they are investing millions or billions in the American economy, or that they will soon be creating thousands of new American jobs, had made the plans long ago, then Obama would have been crowing about it for the last several months (or years). But he hasn't. That's all I need to know.

Another point - America has been losing manufacturing jobs and plants for a long time, and suddenly after the election of Trump we get a series of announcements of manufacturing job and plants getting saved, or even moving back from other countries? The timing is too coincidental. You don't need to think too deeply to see the cause and effect.

Why are some CEO's saying that they are moving jobs back to America, but it's not because of Trump? Easy to explain - they are CEO's and they don't want anyone thinking they're being told what to do or even influenced by Trump. They want it to look like they've made their own financially wise decision. Fine by me, as long as the end result is the added jobs in America. But it still makes sense that Trump influenced them to do it, but they don't want to admit that.

[fj1200]

I have to agree with NT on this. If any of these companies that have recently announced that they are investing millions or billions in the American economy, or that they will soon be creating thousands of new American jobs, had made the plans long ago, then Obama would have been crowing about it for the last several months (or years). But he hasn't. That's all I need to know.

Another point - America has been losing manufacturing jobs and plants for a long time, and suddenly after the election of Trump we get a series of announcements of manufacturing job and plants getting saved, or even moving back from other countries? The timing is too coincidental. You don't need to think too deeply to see the cause and effect.

Why are some CEO's saying that they are moving jobs back to America, but it's not because of Trump? Easy to explain - they are CEO's and they don't want anyone thinking they're being told what to do or even influenced by Trump. They want it to look like they've made their own financially wise decision. Fine by me, as long as the end result is the added jobs in America. But it still makes sense that Trump influenced them to do it, but they don't want to admit that.

:facepalm99: I'm sorry but have you paid attention to any facts I've posted? Almost nothing of what you've said is grounded in reality. But that's the thing that has become apparent here; people will just believe what they want to believe.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I have to agree with NT on this. If any of these companies that have recently announced that they are investing millions or billions in the American economy, or that they will soon be creating thousands of new American jobs, had made the plans long ago, then Obama would have been crowing about it for the last several months (or years). But he hasn't. That's all I need to know.

Another point - America has been losing manufacturing jobs and plants for a long time, and suddenly after the election of Trump we get a series of announcements of manufacturing job and plants getting saved, or even moving back from other countries? The timing is too coincidental. You don't need to think too deeply to see the cause and effect.

Why are some CEO's saying that they are moving jobs back to America, but it's not because of Trump? Easy to explain - they are CEO's and they don't want anyone thinking they're being told what to do or even influenced by Trump. They want it to look like they've made their own financially wise decision. Fine by me, as long as the end result is the added jobs in America. But it still makes sense that Trump influenced them to do it, but they don't want to admit that.



http://www.wbdaily.com/climate-change/liberals-live-fantasy-world-making/


Home » Climate Change » Liberals live in Fantasy World of their own making
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Dec 10, 2014 1 Comment ›› admin

by Lynn Woolley



Within the Progressive Movement, objective truth is some kind of far-fetched, academic concept that has no real meaning. To the confirmed liberal truth is different – it is part of a narrative – part of the plan.
Daily Unconstitutional.com

Daily Unconstitutional.com

Liberals operate with a different set of rules and values than do conservatives – Keynesian with a big dash of Alinsky. If a progressive “end” is determined – then all “facts” must be in alignment to lead to those ends. So there is a “multiplier” that makes higher taxes and spending work. There is a warming pattern that means we should stop using fossil fuels. Harsh interrogation methods simply don’t work. Law enforcement profiling never solves cases. And so on. None of those things are true – but most liberals believe them. They MUST believe them. If a liberal’s heart is bleeding and screaming about “equality” and “social justice,” a new “truth” must be found.

Video: PBS Newshour: Torture doesn’t work — or does it?

This is true in most of the major controversies of the day. Here are some examples:

• Sen. Dianne Feinstein, Chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee believes that enhanced CIA interrogations are “a stain on our values.” Is she right? Not likely. To believe that the techniques did not save American lives, you’d have to think that no information was ever gleaned from waterboarding and other methods now under fire from a report issued exclusively by Democrats. In a high-profile case, the CIA says its interrogation of Abu Zubaydah led to the naming of Khalid Shaikh Mohammed as the “mastermind” of 9/11. The Democrats’ report (heavily redacted) says an informant turned him in for a reward.

• In the immigration wars, President Obama and the Democrats seem to believe that illegals come here to work and to contribute to making American a great country. This “saint-ification” of border-crashers belies reality. Most come here because their home countries are snake pits and they want to get out. Many remain loyal to their home nations, refuse to assimilate into America, and send a lot of the money they earn here back home. Some are criminals and too many get behind the wheel while drunk. To support Obama’s amnesty plan, you have to believe that nearly all of them are akin to Mother Teresa.

• Attorney General Eric Holder has issued new rules on profiling. Holder and his boss, the President, are concerned about unfair racial profiling. Democrats say it doesn’t work. Of course it works. Holder has not stopped airport security from doing what it has to do. And whether you watch “The Mentalist,” “CSI,” or good old Joe Friday on “Dragnet,” you have to understand that profiling is the Number One tool that law enforcement uses to solve crimes. Liberals say it doesn’t work because it doesn’t it into their social justice platform.

• Climate change may be the biggest of all liberal adjustments. We are told by the Associated Press on a near-daily basis that man-made climate change is making the earth uninhabitable? Is it? Certainly not. But liberals need something – anything – to convince you that your use of oil and gas is dangerous. Climate change fits the liberal narrative even though we are now in a “holding pattern” with no warming for nearly two decades. Alex Epstein has a new book, “The Moral Case for Fossil Fuels,” that explains how using such fuels has made it possible for mankind to withstand climate events – and that the benefits of fossil fuels far outweigh any possible downside. This point of view will likely NOT be covered by the AP – nor any of the leftwing networks.

• The current rape epidemic is likely a fraud. Democrats will have you believe that there is a big sexual assault problem on campuses, in the military, and elsewhere. “Rolling Stone” magazine ran an article about a gang rape at a frat house at the University of Virginia. Was it true? Well, no, but it fit the narrative. When Todd Akin, a Republican congressman from Missouri used the term “legitimate rape,” he lost his election. But he was right. Rape is not rape because of accusations. It is rape when facts prove that it is. Liberals need to believe that all accusations are true – and so they do.

And on it goes. You can keep your doctor. Your can keep your health plan. This is what President Obama said, and he may have believed it. He HAD to in order to bolster his core liberal belief that our health care system would be “affordable” if government took over. Government took over and cost has gone up. Professor Jonathan Gruber of MIT called the American people “stupid” for believing the lies.

But Democrats and liberals bought in. They had to. They live in a their own fantasy world with a made-up truth that defies all logic.



And so we see with the libs that post here, regardless of how they try to hide their true colors!--Tyr

[jimnyc]

Just as I couldn't care less if some see an issue with "attendance", I also couldn't care less what some think about who pushed this or that, or when. To me, all that matters is jobs staying, plants staying, any jobs potentially returning.... folks investing and creating jobs... all good for America.

And I believe we'll further see similar things far into his presidency. I don't think some want him to succeed, nor see him get any credit if and whenever something positive should happen.

[fj1200]

And so we see with the libs that post here, regardless of how they try to hide their true colors!--Tyr

You're not really so different than those you listed. You just choose your own lies. :shrug:


Just as I couldn't care less if some see an issue with "attendance", I also couldn't care less what some think about who pushed this or that, or when. To me, all that matters is jobs staying, plants staying, any jobs potentially returning.... folks investing and creating jobs... all good for America.

And I believe we'll further see similar things far into his presidency. I don't think some want him to succeed, nor see him get any credit if and whenever something positive should happen.

Credit is earned, not claimed falsely.

[Drummond]

I believe this is the most prominent example of pot calling kettle black that I've ever seen. :laugh:

You mean living in a hermetically sealed echo chamber like you do in which no facts enter and only dogma is allowed in is bad?

Truly bizarre. Conservatives (I am one, after all) can be distinguished from other politically-minded people by virtue of being realistic in their approach to the world. This is one reason why the Leftie preoccupation with only seeing what propaganda insists upon, is alien to us. We evolve with, adapt to, realities. The Left is too dogma-driven to have that capacity.

This so-called 'hermetically sealed echo chamber' you refer to. WHAT chamber ? What on earth are you talking about ? Do you even know yourself ?

It's more likely that a Leftie would inhabit one. This would explain how Lefties only hear what THEY have to say, and are deaf to the realistic utterances of others !

[jimnyc]

Credit is earned, not claimed falsely.

That's great, but I addressed nothing of the sort in my post, so hey, whatever.

[fj1200]

That's great, but I addressed nothing of the sort in my post, so hey, whatever.

You mentioned giving him credit. :)

[sundaydriver]

Truly bizarre. Conservatives (I am one, after all) can be distinguished from other politically-minded people by virtue of being realistic in their approach to the world. This is one reason why the Leftie preoccupation with only seeing what propaganda insists upon, is alien to us. We evolve with, adapt to, realities. The Left is too dogma-driven to have that capacity.

This so-called 'hermetically sealed echo chamber' you refer to. WHAT chamber ? What on earth are you talking about ? Do you even know yourself ?

It's more likely that a Leftie would inhabit one. This would explain how Lefties only hear what THEY have to say, and are deaf to the realistic utterances of others !

It's pretty telling that you didn't post one comment in this thread until I replied to your buddies post attacking me and then you just tried to place my posts out of context as if I had posted nothing but rhetoric and political points as you mostly do. Notice that none of my posts contain leftie or righty finger pointing or even party? That's because I deal with the real world and consequences and try to base my thinking without all my thoughts starting with a preconceived bias based on ideology. You should give it a try although it appears to be to late for you.

[sundaydriver]

You're not really so different than those you listed. You just choose your own lies. :shrug:.

Not one post on the subject of the thread just diversion and usual hyperbole. :laugh: