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darin
08-24-2017, 04:17 AM
Compare the two stat lines.

A) 19,078 yards, 132 touchdowns, 68 interceptions, 59.2 completion percentage, 87.3 passer rating. 43-27 record, 3-3 Post season
B) 18,193 yards, 127 touchdowns, 45 interceptions, 64.7 completion percentage, 99.6 passer rating. 56-23-1 record, 8-4 Post season (1SB win, 2 appearances)

A is white - Andrew Luck
B is Black-ish. - Russell Wilson


As ranked by 50 NFL executives, A is a 'better quarterback'.

What gives? Could it be racism? I think it may not be racism so much as the execs are fucking blind to things like "Achievements, stats, and data"

michiganFats
08-24-2017, 04:32 AM
It's hard for me to say because I don't see a lot of the Seahawks except for when they're stomping Detroit's ass in the playoffs but the Colts are a bad all around team and without Luck in the lineup they have no offense at all. I don't think Wilson could have been successful in Indy.

darin
08-24-2017, 04:42 AM
It's hard for me to say because I don't see a lot of the Seahawks except for when they're stomping Detroit's ass in the playoffs but the Colts are a bad all around team and without Luck in the lineup they have no offense at all. I don't think Wilson could have been successful in Indy.

Wilson has thrived without a running game, stat wise. Last year Seattle was the 25th best rushing team. And Wilson had a Solid stat line while playing with significant injuries and again, the worst Oline in football.

And this ranking isn't so much about what each QB did since entering the league as who they are today. The execs double-standard is appalling to me. In the same article they say "...well, we're not sure Russell would be a Good QB without such a great team around him" yet rank David Fucking Carr ahead of him despite Carr playing with one of the better pass-protecting OLines in the league and the number SIX rushing team.

Yet Wilson thrived behind the worst offensive line in the NFL.

And Defensively, a good QB makes the whole team better - defense included because he's consistently putting the Defense in better position through sustained drives and moving the ball to the enemy's side of the field.

And beyond Luck - they ranked Matt Stafford ahead of wilson....a guy who has never won a playoff game.

darin
08-24-2017, 04:50 AM
For good measure - name 9 other QBs who can do some of the things you see here - WHILE having a torn pectoral, and a nearly-broken ankle for more than half the season.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flxPa2gnaXE

michiganFats
08-24-2017, 04:57 AM
From what I saw of the Seahawks last year I don't think that was the worst Offensive line in the NFL. Same thing with Stafford, who I have seen play, Stafford is the Lions MVP, without him they have no chance to win.

darin
08-24-2017, 05:01 AM
From what I saw of the Seahawks last year I don't think that was the worst Offensive line in the NFL. Same thing with Stafford, who I have seen play, Stafford is the Lions MVP, without him they have no chance to win.

From ProFootball Focus - Ranking all 32 Offensive Lines in 2016: (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season)


32. Seattle Seahawks (32)

Top overall grade: C Justin Britt, 80.5 (No. 16)

Top pass-blocking grade: C Justin Britt, 79.1 (No. 21)

Top run-blocking grade: C Justin Britt, 71.9 (No. 18)

Nobody has invested less in their offensive line than the Seattle Seahawks, and it showed in their performance over the 2016 season, with the unit being directly responsible for some of the team’s losses. Even their best performer, Justin Britt, was moved to center in a last-ditch attempt to salvage his career, rather than have to invest more in the position (though he has played far better at center than any other position, surrendering no sacks or hits this season). The other four starters top out at overall grades of 52.3, and the best-ranked among them (LG Mark Glowinski) is the 63rd-ranked player at his position league-wide. The success Seattle has experienced this season is entirely in spite of its offensive line, and requires QB Russell Wilson and the running backs to play stellar football to continue to overcome the unit’s deficiencies.

For what it's worth


19. Detroit Lions (22)

Top overall grade: LT Taylor Decker, 82.8 (No. 23)

Top pass-blocking grade: RG Larry Warford, 82.6 (No. 33)

Top run-blocking grade: RG Larry Warford, 81.8 (No. 16)

The play of rookie LT Taylor Decker was a pleasant surprise for this team. Decker was a player that didn’t overly impress PFF as a draft prospect out of Ohio State, but he was consistently solid all season, performing above-average as both a run blocker and pass protector in his first pro season. Larry Warford was markedly better than a year ago at RG, at least when it comes to run blocking, and Travis Swanson was solid at center. The biggest issue this team had was at LG, where the combination of Graham Glasgow and Laken Tomlinson simply took turns getting abused. As a pair, they surrendered six sacks, 10 penalties, and 49 total pressures, with neither countering that form with dominant run-blocking displays.

michiganFats
08-24-2017, 05:14 AM
You don't make it to the playoffs with the worst offensive line in the league, it doesn't happen. Pundits are wrong a lot.

darin
08-24-2017, 05:16 AM
You don't make it to the playoffs with the worst offensive line in the league, it doesn't happen. Pundits are wrong a lot.

That isnt from Pundits - that ranking is from statistical analysis. That's not subjective rating.

And Russell Wilson proves teams DO make the playoffs with the worst offensive line in the league - that's why the ranking bothers me.

michiganFats
08-24-2017, 05:33 AM
That isnt from Pundits - that ranking is from statistical analysis. That's not subjective rating.

And Russell Wilson proves teams DO make the playoffs with the worst offensive line in the league - that's why the ranking bothers me.

Ratings are subjective, or at least how they are interpreted is subjective. No matter how many stats you crunch all you end up with is some interesting stats but you can't rate a player that way. Stafford has a habit of going on hot streaks when the team needs him to but that isn't reflected in his QB rating. A few seasons ago Lions receivers dropped a lot of perfectly placed passes by Stafford. In one sense you're right, his stats don't lie, they are what they are but on the other hand execs would know that a lot of passes were dropped and that he plays very well when the money is down and judge Stafford by other means. I think stats breakdowns are just clickbait for NFL junkies.

darin
08-24-2017, 05:47 AM
Ratings are subjective, or at least how they are interpreted is subjective. No matter how many stats you crunch all you end up with is some interesting stats but you can't rate a player that way. Stafford has a habit of going on hot streaks when the team needs him to but that isn't reflected in his QB rating. A few seasons ago Lions receivers dropped a lot of perfectly placed passes by Stafford. In one sense you're right, his stats don't lie, they are what they are but on the other hand execs would know that a lot of passes were dropped and that he plays very well when the money is down and judge Stafford by other means. I think stats breakdowns are just clickbait for NFL junkies.

Sounds an awful like like excuses....Non-subjective data such as "rushing yards" - which is not subject to interpretation. When a team doesn't rush well, allows qb pressures and sacks - those things are not subject to interpretation. Fact is - irrefutable fact - seattle had statistically the worst offensive line in Football last year. As measured by data. As interpreted by experts in the field.

Good QBs are not particularly streaky. They are consistent. That consistently is reflected in wins and yards per attempt (which takes drops out of the picture).

Let me ask you, as a fan - are there 9 QBs head of Wilson who YOU would want on your team this coming season?

michiganFats
08-24-2017, 06:36 AM
Sounds an awful like like excuses....Non-subjective data such as "rushing yards" - which is not subject to interpretation. When a team doesn't rush well, allows qb pressures and sacks - those things are not subject to interpretation. Fact is - irrefutable fact - seattle had statistically the worst offensive line in Football last year. As measured by data. As interpreted by experts in the field.

Good QBs are not particularly streaky. They are consistent. That consistently is reflected in wins and yards per attempt (which takes drops out of the picture).

Let me ask you, as a fan - are there 9 QBs head of Wilson who YOU would want on your team this coming season?

I just checked your team stats from last year, the Seahawks were not a bad rushing team, they weren't great but they weren't bad either. The Seahawks were right about in the middle in almost all team stats. I'm surprised there's even a debate on who had the worst offensive line last year, I thought that was a lock for San Fran.

I think there are some good QBs in the league and Wilson is one of them. I haven't seen him play very much but off the top of my head QBs I'd like to have on the Lions are Stafford, Brady, Ryan, Rodgers...Osweiler (just kidding). I'm not saying Wilson is a bad QB but the comparison here was to Andrew Luck and I'd rather have Luck if he's healthy.