Antonio Brown and Ben Roethlisberger are the best QB/WR tandem of all time

[jimnyc]

I won't go that far yet, too early. But they have earned the right to be in the discussion. Like they say, not that they are - but we might be witnessing the best duo on their way up. Problem is, while Brown has plenty of time to go - Ben is talking retirement the past few years.

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Breakdown of how Antonio Brown and Ben Roethlisberger are the best QB/WR tandem of all time

The Pittsburgh Steelers are blessed to have so many superstars on their roster, but when it comes to Antonio Brown and Ben Roethlisberger, we might just be witnessing the best QB/WR duo of all time.

The Pittsburgh Steelers’ fan base is a spoiled bunch, and on many levels.

If you think about it, they’ve been witness to such riches as six Super Bowl victories and countless names which have now become the stuff of legend in the annals of NFL history.

“Mean” Joe Greene
Jack Lambert
Terry Bradshaw
Lynn Swann
Jerome Bettis
Troy Polamalu

I could go on, but fans of the Black-and-gold have been blessed with so many more good years, compared to the bad ones during the Bubby Brister/Mike Tomczak/Mark Malone eras.

Of all the players in Steelers’ history, two current players very well might top them all when it comes to their level of play and overall execution at their respective positions. I’m talking about Antonio Brown and Ben Roethlisberger.

These two players have set new standards at the quarterback and receiver positions—to the point where people aren’t just asking if they’re the best in Pittsburgh history, but whether they’re the best quarterback/wide receiver duo of all time.

Brett Kollmann of SB Nation did an awesome breakdown of this subject, and also shows what makes Brown and Roethlisberger the nastiest tandem to try and stop in the NFL today.

Check out the breakdown below:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwMXmVKn4DQ

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/nfl-pittsburgh-steelers-news/2017/12/15/16776964/breakdown-of-how-antonio-brown-and-ben-roethlisberger-the-best-qb-wr-tandem-of-all-time-steelers


And then Antonio Brown - on his own as a WR compared to other greats:


Comparing Antonio Brown to the great NFL wide receivers

Following another spectacular performance by Antonio Brown, the superlatives about the Pittsburgh Steelers star receiver have been flowing on social media. Is he be better than Terrell Owen, Randy Moss or even the greatest wide receiver of all-time, Jerry Rice? Adam Rank of NFL Network had an opinion that drew all sorts of reactions on Twitter.

https://i.imgur.com/vxAAuLT.png

Much has been made on social media of the fact Brown has surpassed the best five-year span of Rice’s career. While this is clearly a landmark achievement, he still has a way to go to match the 20-year career of the San Francisco 49ers legend. Although, when it comes to the best five-year span of all-time, that honor does not belong to Rice at all and Brown has not quite matched those totals yet either.

https://i.imgur.com/sS3A68T.png
https://i.imgur.com/FxHoMyq.png

That crown currently belongs to former Indianapolis Colt Marvin Harrison. With six games still to play and only 254 yards needed to surpass Harrison, the title will belong to Brown soon enough. Matching the touchdown numbers of his illustrious peers will prove to be more of a challenge.

Rest - http://steelerswire.usatoday.com/2017/11/18/comparing-antonio-brown-to-the-great-nfl-wide-receivers/

[Gunny]

:rolleyes:

[del]

how many super bowls have they won together?

[Gunny]

how many super bowls have they won together?2? And lost one?

[Black Diamond]

You ignorant ass clowns.


It's Jim McMahon and Willie Gault..

[Black Diamond]

how many super bowls have they won together?
Brady would have six if jabbar Gaffney could catch better than you.

[Gunny]

You ignorant ass clowns.


It's Jim McMahon and Willie Gault..Who? Vince McMahon and Superstar Billy Graham?

[Black Diamond]

Who? Vince McMahon and Superstar Billy Graham?
Bitch I'll smack you. I don't care how hard you hit back.

[Black Diamond]

how many super bowls have they won together?
You're playing into jims hands I think. Using your model, it will be Bradshaw/swann or Bradshaw/stallworth me thinks.

[del]

2? And lost one?

nope, just lost one.

brown wasn't on the team when they won

[del]

You're playing into jims hands I think. Using your model, it will be Bradshaw/swann or Bradshaw/stallworth me thinks.

i don't have a model, but i'd say just looking at the numbers he posted that owens, rice and moss are all better receivers than brown.

[del]

Brady would have six if jabbar Gaffney could catch better than you.

seven if welker could hold on.

[Black Diamond]

i don't have a model, but i'd say just looking at the numbers he posted that owens, rice and moss are all better receivers than brown.
Agreed. I love TO.
Moss is the best. Rice used stick 'em in Chicago so fuck him. But... 22 touchdowns in strike shortened season? Maybe we should still look at him.

[LongTermGuy]

http://cdn3.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/2416876/benface.0.gif


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"....Ben....stop yakking and dreaming about the past...we`ll see this Sunday if you brought your past with you"

https://66.media.tumblr.com/232882149d962df7c4fddebfe2264cf3/tumblr_n9rpwfTPCJ1qhkbk8o1_400.gif

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:laugh2:........



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"....You guys shut-up...quit your bragging and prove your worth this Sunday...Hell..I got to deal with Aron Rogers this Sunday...they say he is back"

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2016/0208/newton020816_576x324.jpg

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`Packers QB Aaron Rodgers is back from injury`

https://newsline.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Aaron-Rodgers-Green-Bay-Packers-QB-announces-he-is-cleared-to-play_f.jpghttps://cbsjimrome.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/gettyimages-504399584.jpg?w=594&h=360&crop=1

:laugh:

[Black Diamond]

http://cdn3.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/2416876/benface.0.gif


************************************************** ***




"....Ben....stop yakking and dreaming about the past...we`ll see this Sunday if you brought your past with you"

https://66.media.tumblr.com/232882149d962df7c4fddebfe2264cf3/tumblr_n9rpwfTPCJ1qhkbk8o1_400.gif

************************************************** **

:laugh2:........



************************************************** ****



"....You guys shut-up...quit your bragging and prove your worth this Sunday...Hell..I got to deal with Aron Rogers this Sunday...they say he is back"

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2016/0208/newton020816_576x324.jpg

************************************************** ********

`Packers QB Aaron Rodgers is back from injury`

https://newsline.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Aaron-Rodgers-Green-Bay-Packers-QB-announces-he-is-cleared-to-play_f.jpghttps://cbsjimrome.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/gettyimages-504399584.jpg?w=594&h=360&crop=1

:laugh:
There is no this Sunday. Football no longer exists.

[LongTermGuy]

There is no this Sunday. Football no longer exists.

​IMO...If they play Football and... stay out of politics (in every shape and manner) it does exist ....

*Thing is the Left (Liberals) are trying to destroy Football...and a few jack-ass (black lies matter Fools playing in some of the teams)...>In their own low-info mind-set (Translation no clue what really is happening)....comply with the Lefts Ignorance...Fans just want to watch Football...and are watching who is who...and what team they play for....I feel slowly but surely the crap is dying down...and even some of the low-info players are starting to figure out what fans only want...which is just Football and No politics...

[jimnyc]

how many super bowls have they won together?

While I would love nothing more than to put out a huge number here to finalize their history together, that number sits at 0 right now, but I'm hoping they move that to one this year!! :)

Quarterback to wide receiver statistics and what not, unfortunately don't always lead to super bowls. Hell, sometimes it doesn't even lead to the playoffs. You can see QB's like Philip Rivers (off top my head), that get great passing yardage numbers every year, but may not even make the playoffs. For the big game, you need a complete team all the way around. Not just the QB/WR, but also running, a great O line, also a great D, D line and everything that comes with a great D (see 70 Steelers).

Proof the other way around would be, for example, Dan Marino and then Mark Clayton and Mark Duper. Man, what a trio!! But just wasn't really enough for that team in the 80's.

Look at Calvin Johnson on that list aka Megatron. Man, he eat up my Steelers sometimes! He had a damn good QB tossing him the balls, and he's obviously a HOF wide receiver. But it stopped there for them, unfortunately.

Randy Moss needed to be put on the right teams. He was fantastic on the Vikings and brought them out of the darkness, and even into the playoffs, IMO, but wasn't enough.

I think the Steelers have had one of the best offensive teams in the past 10 years, but their defensive side of the ball hasn't been super bowl caliber most of the time.

[jimnyc]

i don't have a model, but i'd say just looking at the numbers he posted that owens, rice and moss are all better receivers than brown.

Only due to time in the NFL, and I believe, IMO, surrounded by a better cast in totality.

I think if given the same time with Ben, Brown is better than Owens, and a very close to Randy Moss (one of my favorites of all time!), but I don't think he comes close to Jerry Rice. I would love to see that!! But even the best of players tend to slow down in time, except for Jerry Rice!!

[Black Diamond]

I am still afraid of Marino/Clayton/Duper

[jimnyc]

I am still afraid of Marino/Clayton/Duper

Marino is STILL my favorite of all time. What an arm that man had!! Different league and different era though. But I think if you toss him out there today in his prime, on a pass happy team? He's the best.

[Black Diamond]

Marino is STILL my favorite of all time. What an arm that man had!! Different league and different era though. But I think if you toss him out there today in his prime, on a pass happy team? He's the best.
Hard to tell how modern quarterbacks would respond to getting roughed up the way they did 20 years ago. Manning came in right Before the league started handling QBs with kit gloves. New England would be really physical with him and his receivers and he would start throwing picks.

So I know it ain't manning/Harrison lol.

[Black Diamond]

seven if welker could hold on.
In addition to Gaffney, manning didn't have his favorite wide receiver, Ty Law.

[Gunny]

Marino is STILL my favorite of all time. What an arm that man had!! Different league and different era though. But I think if you toss him out there today in his prime, on a pass happy team? He's the best.Yeah' 'all that arm". I liked Marino, but that arm was his best friend and worst enemy. Too many times I watched him come down to crunch time and forget there were 10 other players on offense and lose the game trying to do too much on his own.

[Black Diamond]

Yeah' 'all that arm". I liked Marino, but that arm was his best friend and worst enemy. Too many times I watched him come down to crunch time and forget there were 10 other players on offense and lose the game trying to do too much on his own.
Probably after Clayton and duper were gone. Miami run defense was consistently ranked 25th or lower.

[Gunny]

Probably after Clayton and duper were gone. Miami run defense was consistently ranked 25th or lower.Even when Clayton and Duper were there. They actually made him more than he them. He was good, no doubt. But it was like crunch time and his mind went blank. He'd try forcing passes. I don't recall them having a good run OFFENSE after Csonka, Morris and Kiick left. Shula tried to do a "Landry" and pop Don Nottingham and Benny Malone in as FB and TB, respectively, but their only success was from what was left of the line. 1975 killed the Dolphins and a few other teams when their stars ran off to the World Football League (lasted 2 years). Had it not been for the WFL, the SB history as well as Pittsburgh's would be a tad different. Thhe Dolphines were coming off an undefeated season and the defense WAS their game.

I lived in Miami at the time :)

[Black Diamond]

Even when Clayton and Duper were there. They actually made him more than he them. He was good, no doubt. But it was like crunch time and his mind went blank. He'd try forcing passes. I don't recall them having a good run OFFENSE after Csonka, Morris and Kiick left. Shula tried to do a "Landry" and pop Don Nottingham and Benny Malone in as FB and TB, respectively, but their only success was from what was left of the line. 1975 killed the Dolphins and a few other teams when their stars ran off to the World Football League (lasted 2 years). Had it not been for the WFL, the SB history as well as Pittsburgh's would be a tad different. Thhe Dolphines were coming off an undefeated season and the defense WAS their game.

I lived in Miami at the time :)
Amazing Marino fell to 28 in the draft. I wonder if he really did coke. Noll certainly thought so.

[Black Diamond]

Even when Clayton and Duper were there. They actually made him more than he them. He was good, no doubt. But it was like crunch time and his mind went blank. He'd try forcing passes. I don't recall them having a good run OFFENSE after Csonka, Morris and Kiick left. Shula tried to do a "Landry" and pop Don Nottingham and Benny Malone in as FB and TB, respectively, but their only success was from what was left of the line. 1975 killed the Dolphins and a few other teams when their stars ran off to the World Football League (lasted 2 years). Had it not been for the WFL, the SB history as well as Pittsburgh's would be a tad different. Thhe Dolphines were coming off an undefeated season and the defense WAS their game.

I lived in Miami at the time :)
The poor run defense is listed as one of the reason you can't blame Marino for never winning a super bowl. It was some program that ESPN ran. Del will know what it was. :)

[Gunny]

The poor run defense is listed as one of the reason you can't blame Marino for never winning a super bowl. It was some program that ESPN ran. Del will know what it was. :)The Dolphins never had a defense after 75 worth a SB win. They had the "Killer B's" at one point, but they were over-achievers. They could have beaten the 49ers in 82 or 83 if they'd had a defense. Montana was not as good a QB as Marino at that point. Marino came out of college from Pittsburgh already playing a pro set. Montana came out of Notre Dame where they played a college set. Marino had the experience. The Dolphin defense didn't stop Marine when it mattered.

Which is surprising since Shula was known for his defense in both Baltimore and Miami. they lost half their defense to the WFL as well. I mean, come on ... they had come off an undefeated season, had the best defense in the NFL -- Bob Griese gets all the credit for that season but he was out more than half of it. Earl Morrall did just enough to not lose and the Miami D won most of those games. They beat the Steelers in the Championship game that season. The Steelers won the next two SBs.

The WFL basically stole most of that undefeated team and left Shula with not much.

Technically speaking, Bob Griese went to 3 straight SBs, winning 2 which would make him the better QB if championships is the qualifier. Griese was basically a Phil Simms. Competent enough to make a few plays and not lose the game. The team makes the game, and Marino would forget he had one. He never outgrew that flaw.

As far as coke? College kid in the late 70s - early 80s? Probably did. Cocaine landed hard and cheap in 80 with the Colombians in Miami. It was no longer the "rich man's drug".

[gabosaurus]

My uber Steelers friend believes you are all wrong. The best QB-WR combo of all time is Terry Bradshaw to Lynn Swann.

I asked what she thought of all the player kneeling protests, she says it has nothing to do with football. What players do before the game is merely an individual statement of opinion. What they do on the field is what counts. Devoted football fans will always watch the games and support their teams. If you stop watching because of what happens before the game, then you were never a real fan to begin with.
Never argue with devout Steelers fans. They will hurt you. :cool:

[Gunny]

My uber Steelers friend believes you are all wrong. The best QB-WR combo of all time is Terry Bradshaw to Lynn Swann.

I asked what she thought of all the player kneeling protests, she says it has nothing to do with football. What players do before the game is merely an individual statement of opinion. What they do on the field is what counts. Devoted football fans will always watch the games and support their teams. If you stop watching because of what happens before the game, then you were never a real fan to begin with.
Never argue with devout Steelers fans. They will hurt you. :cool:Your friend is wrong, and wrong. Rothelisberger is a better QB than Bradshaw could ever dream of being. Swan might be the better receiver because he made Bradshaw look better than he was.

And I got YEARS on any other Steelers fan here. I'm just not as psycho as one in particular :poke:.

The National Anthem is played at NFL games to honor veterans. You disrespect it, you disrespect them. End of story. The game is football. Cry on your own time.

[gabosaurus]

And I got YEARS on any other Steelers fan here. I'm just not as psycho as one in particular :poke:.

The National Anthem is played at NFL games to honor veterans. You disrespect it, you disrespect them. End of story. The game is football. Cry on your own time.

I could care less. But one of my best friends was born in a suburb of Pittsburgh, into a family of diehard Steelers fans that have held tickets for over 70 years. Someone who has been to three Super Bowls and will be spending Christmas Day in Houston, watching the Steelers play.

The National Anthem is played at NFL games to honor EVERYONE in our country, which includes veterans. No one disrespects anyone by refusing to stand. It is not required. The national anthem and the game of football (or any sport, on any level) are entirely different. Nothing connects them. Also, the actions of a few should not taint the actions of the majority. I think you are being oversensitive.

[Abbey Marie]

Prob the best: Montana/Rice

My personal favorite, though: Warner/Fitzgerald

[Abbey Marie]

I could care less. But one of my best friends was born in a suburb of Pittsburgh, into a family of diehard Steelers fans that have held tickets for over 70 years. Someone who has been to three Super Bowls and will be spending Christmas Day in Houston, watching the Steelers play.

The National Anthem is played at NFL games to honor EVERYONE in our country, which includes veterans. No one disrespects anyone by refusing to stand. It is not required. The national anthem and the game of football (or any sport, on any level) are entirely different. Nothing connects them. Also, the actions of a few should not taint the actions of the majority. I think you are being oversensitive.

Gonna disagree. The Anthem is played to honor our country, which our flag represents. The military defend our country, with their lives, so they are given special respect when we honor it. From Washington's troops, to our current service men and women, we lose everything without their sacrifices. Trying to separate the two for political reasons is unnecessarily disrespectful to them.

[Gunny]

Prob the best: Montana/Rice

My personal favorite, though: Warner/FitzgeraldIt's in all actuality a hard choice. I listen to these stats all the time and usually roll my eyes. It's like saying Muhammed Ali would have beat Lennox Lewis. the stats/polls or whatever always come from the perspective of the age of the person pimping them, and their bias for or not for different teams.

Like people thinking Terry Bradshaw was great. Not only was he a horse's ass, but Noll tried his damnedest to get rid of him until Bradshaw pulled his head out of ass. Bradshaw basically sucked as a QB his first few years and did well only after a team was built he couldn't screw up. And that's from a 70s Steelers fan.

A lot is also contingent on the team and the team's gameplan. Rice and Montana were a perfect fit for Walsh. There are countless instances of players whose heads got too big for the team and went to a different system and failed. Duane Thomas always comes to mind. He went from SB winner and NFC leading rusher to sitting on the bench n SD because once he left the Cowboys, he was done. Running backs that don't appreciate the system they are in and their line screw themselves. QBs and receivers as well. Moss hated being in Dallas. He wasn't the show like he was on the Vikings.

Staubach and Pearson were one of the best tandems. Aikman-Irvin. Griese-Warfield. It's all a popularity contest in the end. The people that use stats just try to justify their favorite as being best.

[Russ]

I have to agree with Joe Montana-Jerry Rice, with honorable mention to Steve Young-Jerry Rice, Kurt Warner-Larry Fitzgerald and Kurt Warner-Isaac Bruce.

I can't credit Aikman-Irvin, because Michael Irvin basically made a career out of pushing off the guy covering him, and the refs seemed to allow it because "that's his move". :rolleyes:

[Gunny]

I have to agree with Joe Montana-Jerry Rice, with honorable mention to Steve Young-Jerry Rice, Kurt Warner-Larry Fitzgerald and Kurt Warner-Isaac Bruce.

I can't credit Aikman-Irvin, because Michael Irvin basically made a career out of pushing off the guy covering him, and the refs seemed to allow it because "that's his move". :rolleyes:Irvin didn't get away with it any more than anyone else. You sound suspiciously like you share the little lady's love for the Giants :) Irvin was good because of Harper, and the TE. When Harper left, Irvin wasn't quite so good. Harper disappeared (in Tampa). And Odell Beckham the 23rd ain't exactly a saint.

Again, you're talking 80s-90s QBs. They aren't "the best" because that's what your generation remembers. I say the same about late-60s - 70s. WAY better than anything that followed. And you could tackle the QB then. He wasn't protected.

All perspective. I think the Lakers and Warriors foul the Spurs on EVERY play :D

[Russ]

Irvin didn't get away with it any more than anyone else. You sound suspiciously like you share the little lady's love for the Giants :) Irvin was good because of Harper, and the TE. When Harper left, Irvin wasn't quite so good. Harper disappeared (in Tampa). And Odell Beckham the 23rd ain't exactly a saint.

Again, you're talking 80s-90s QBs. They aren't "the best" because that's what your generation remembers. I say the same about late-60s - 70s. WAY better than anything that followed. And you could tackle the QB then. He wasn't protected.

All perspective. I think the Lakers and Warriors foul the Spurs on EVERY play :D

Ha and Lol! If you think I share the little lady's love for the Giants, then you don't know Russ!

I still think that Irvin was good mostly because he was allowed to push off, but I will give you this - he was absolutely GREAT at pushing off. Granted, almost all receivers push off, but not like Michael. If you were covering Irvin at the 50 yard line and he gave you a pushoff, you suddenly found yourself at the 40 yard line. That alone deserves a few HoF votes. :cool:

[Gunny]

Ha and Lol! If you think I share the little lady's love for the Giants, then you don't know Russ!

I still think that Irvin was good mostly because he was allowed to push off, but I will give you this - he was absolutely GREAT at pushing off. Granted, almost all receivers push off, but not like Michael. If you were covering Irvin at the 50 yard line and he gave you a pushoff, you suddenly found yourself at the 40 yard line. That alone deserves a few HoF votes. :cool:Wow. LOL. He wasn't THAT bad. Unless you're a Giants, Eagles or Deadskins then. THEN it goes without saying ....

They let receivers get away with murder ever since they started making rule changes that favor them back in the 80s. They claimed ti was to speed up the game and allow for more scoring. They've done a LOT to just ruin the game since I started watching pro football.

The STILL say Fred Biletnikoff was one of the best ever receivers and that dude had stick-em hanging from his ears. You could see it all over his socks and hands. They made it against the rules in the late 70s. But at the time, Stabler to Biletnikoff was as good as anyone. Sonny Jurgenson to Taylor (the bastards). Tarkenton to Gilliam. They were ALL good and usually in different ways from each other. Namath to Maynard and Sauer.

[del]

unitas/berry

[Black Diamond]

unitas/berry
Super bowl XX connection.

[Black Diamond]

Cunningham/moss

[Abbey Marie]

Irvin didn't get away with it any more than anyone else. You sound suspiciously like you share the little lady's love for the Giants :) Irvin was good because of Harper, and the TE. When Harper left, Irvin wasn't quite so good. Harper disappeared (in Tampa). And Odell Beckham the 23rd ain't exactly a saint.

Again, you're talking 80s-90s QBs. They aren't "the best" because that's what your generation remembers. I say the same about late-60s - 70s. WAY better than anything that followed. And you could tackle the QB then. He wasn't protected.

All perspective. I think the Lakers and Warriors foul the Spurs on EVERY play :D

Gunny, I've never seen you be more wrong. There were Giants/Eagles arguments in this household where I had to leave the room. You goof!

[jimnyc]

Daunte Culpepper to Randy Moss.

But then the idiot Culpepper went and hurt himself, and that was the end of that duo! But that's where Moss got his start. :)

[Gunny]

Gunny, I've never seen you be more wrong. There were Giants/Eagles arguments in this household where I had to leave the room. You goof!Giants and Eagles? Hope you BOTH lost :)

[Black Diamond]

Giants and Eagles? Hope you BOTH lost :)
It's spoiler time me thinks