Voter ID

[Chessplayer]

Some state require voter ID to vote, is this fair?

Absolutely fair.

[Immanuel]

I am uncertain how having a gvt id at the voting polls stops any kind of significant voter fraud.... can you explain what it does to prevent the kind of significant voter fraud that we have had?

Now if you were to say that registering to vote required proof of citizenship, then I think this would be a place where voter fraud could be taking place in a significant manner, by many illegals or even many legal immigrant residents that are not citizens yet.

etc. etc. etc.

See Mtnbiker, once again, I have to tell you guys, "I told you so."

There is always an excuse.

Notice that she is "uncertain". As far as I am concerned if she and all the other liberals are "uncertain", then voter id should be required because they are not certain that the dead vote Democratic.

Who knows if there are a significant number of criminals that enter polling precincts and vote for people that they know are not going to vote? Who knows if it is only Democrats that do this? Somehow I doubt that it is. Who knows if anyone does it, but does that matter? We put cameras at traffic lights to stop people from running red lights. The police have radar detectors that they point at cars that are not speeding all the time in order to prevent speeding. The IRS has certain "red flags" that can initiate an audit in order to catch tax fraud.

We have all kinds of different devices in this country used to catch criminals and reduce crime. Why not take an effort to reduce voter fraud by requiring a voter to present a valid id before voting?

Immie

[MtnBiker]

What could stop a great deal of voter fraud that has occured over the years is for each voting district to update their voter rolls and purge a person from the roll when they die. When the state issues a death certificate, the voter roll needs to purge off the voting roll, the person that died.

If the dead people are left on the voter rolls as legitimate voters, then those that tend the role can make a compilation of the dead people, have fake id's made up for those going in to vote using their names....so an id wouldn't even help....imo.

The only way to stop this kind of fraud is to not leave dead people on the voting list.....not id's.

And something needs to be done when people register to vote, requiring a birth certificate to show they are American citizens....

Those are things that could make an impact on voter fraud imo.

jd

I like all of those ideas, the requirement of having an ID present at voting is also a good idea. It helps prevent check fraud.

[typomaniac]

Don't be too quick to dismiss JD's point.

Too often, attempts to "prevent voter fraud" are nothing more than excuses to intimidate voters whom the fraud-alarmed people consider undesirable.

[JohnDoe]

See Mtnbiker, once again, I have to tell you guys, "I told you so."

There is always an excuse.

Notice that she is "uncertain". As far as I am concerned if she and all the other liberals are "uncertain", then voter id should be required because they are not certain that the dead vote Democratic.

Who knows if there are a significant number of criminals that enter polling precincts and vote for people that they know are not going to vote? Who knows if it is only Democrats that do this? Somehow I doubt that it is. Who knows if anyone does it, but does that matter? We put cameras at traffic lights to stop people from running red lights. The police have radar detectors that they point at cars that are not speeding all the time in order to prevent speeding. The IRS has certain "red flags" that can initiate an audit in order to catch tax fraud.

We have all kinds of different devices in this country used to catch criminals and reduce crime. Why not take an effort to reduce voter fraud by requiring a voter to present a valid id before voting?

Immie

so immie, let's hear it from you, since you are so smart....how does an id at the poll, showing that you are the person on the voter roll stop, any voter fraud from taking place?

please enlighten me....what kind of fraud does it stop? I'm all ears.....

if it doesn't stop any kind of fraud that has been taking place, why waste tax payer's dollars, to pay for the id and why have it?

to make people THINK voting is less fraudulent while the fraud really continues? so no one looks in to the other two methods of fraud that have and do take place in significant numbers?

Or to stop the poor or elderly who are already registered and legal voters for years and decades from voting... by making them get to a driver's licence place to get an id, when it could be miles and miles and miles from where they live, or make them miss a day of work...which is money they need, to go across town to get there?

when the real problem is dead people left on the voting rolls and immigrants without citizenship registering to vote?

and what about absentee voting, how does an id stop that?

jd

[Yurt]

How do you stop from turning it into a poll tax?

it will never be a poll tax. the cost is not prohibitive. who does not have a photo ID? california has a $22 id fee. there is even a reduced fee card that costs only 7 dollars.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/dl/fees/idCard_fees.htm#reg_id

[Yurt]

so immie, let's hear it from you, since you are so smart....how does an id at the poll, showing that you are the person on the voter roll stop, any voter fraud from taking place?

please enlighten me....what kind of fraud does it stop? I'm all ears.....

if it doesn't stop any kind of fraud that has been taking place, why waste tax payer's dollars, to pay for the id and why have it?

to make people THINK voting is less fraudulent while the fraud really continues? so no one looks in to the other two methods of fraud that have and do take place in significant numbers?

Or to stop the poor or elderly who are already registered and legal voters for years and decades from voting... by making them get to a driver's licence place to get an id, when it could be miles and miles and miles from where they live, or make them miss a day of work...which is money they need, to go across town to get there?

when the real problem is dead people left on the voting rolls and immigrants without citizenship registering to vote?

and what about absentee voting, how does an id stop that?

jd

why are you so uptight over asking for ID at the polls? do you also feel that asking for ID to tender a check is wrong? what about using a credit card, has your name on it. what about getting a job?

[jimnyc]

Or to stop the poor or elderly who are already registered and legal voters for years and decades from voting... by making them get to a driver's licence place to get an id, when it could be miles and miles and miles from where they live, or make them miss a day of work...which is money they need, to go across town to get there?

Why can't the "poor elderly" get appropriate ID like the rest of the nation? The only bitching I hear about is from illegals, and from a handful who refuse to learn the English language. It should be a requirement of all US citizens to have some sort of proper identification, and not just for polling reasons. Prove who you are, prove you are legal - get an ID.

[JohnDoe]

Why can't the "poor elderly" get appropriate ID like the rest of the nation? The only bitching I hear about is from illegals, and from a handful who refuse to learn the English language. It should be a requirement of all US citizens to have some sort of proper identification, and not just for polling reasons. Prove who you are, prove you are legal - get an ID.

as immie has mentioned and typo too, it could be considered a poll tax, unless the id's are issued for free.

and there are many in this country who do not believe the federal gvt has the power to demand a national id card...we have the right to privacy....kathianne mentioned this already in this thread....

the fraud takes place when registering to vote, not at the poll and something has to be figured out on how to stop it....legal immigrants can get driver's licences and gvt ids, but it is still illegal for them to vote unless they have gotten their citizenship, so how does an id at the poll stop the fraud? and shoot, every other illegal probably has a fraudulent driver's licence....

we either need to require a birth certificant in the registering to vote process or some sort of citizenship papers of the immigrants when registering, to stop that aspect of voter fraud and when someone dies they must be removed from the voter rolls.

a fake id like a fraudulent driver's licence can be had in this day and age, easily....there has to be a better way.

this doesn't address the seniors that do not drive and only have a SSAN card that registered to vote decades ago, or a poor citizen who does not have an id other than an SSAN card, who registered to vote years ago....who has no means to get to a gvt office to get an id, i realize this....and maybe it is sending buses in to these poorer neighborhoods that can issue some sort of id
??? i just think it needs to be thought through, thoroughly, without disenfranchising any american citizen who has the RIGHT to vote in this country, and without a pole tax to do it. or maybe these people can mail a copy of their birth certificate to the voting district that verifies their citizenship?

[JohnDoe]

why are you so uptight over asking for ID at the polls? do you also feel that asking for ID to tender a check is wrong? what about using a credit card, has your name on it. what about getting a job?

what voting fraud would it stop? tell me that first... why would having an id to prove you are the person on the voting roll stop any fraud?

i don't want the masses to be FOOLED in to thinking voter fraud doesn't take place just because someone has an id that matches their name on the voting list....

cuz it stops no fraud....the fraud takes place when registering to vote...

NO ONE HAS ANSWERED, whaT fraud having an id at the poll stops...?????

[jimnyc]

as immie has mentioned and typo too, it could be considered a poll tax, unless the id's are issued for free.

Bullshit. We all need ID for so many aspects of our life, and we have all paid for them whether they are drivers licenses, social security cards or general ID cards from the government. This has nothing to do with JUST polls, ALL Americans should have an ID in this day and age. You can't drive without one. You can't fly without one. You can't leave the country legally without one. You can't drink without one. You can't buy a firearm without one. You can't get a bank account without one. It's absolutely absurd to not have an ID in this day and age, and even more absurd to come up with excuses for those who refuse to get one. BUT, people still do have that right - but they should also be denied every last damn thing that currently requires an appropriate ID, and we should be working to require ID's for even more things. See how far they get living like outcasts because they refuse.

[JohnDoe]

it will never be a poll tax. the cost is not prohibitive. who does not have a photo ID? california has a $22 id fee. there is even a reduced fee card that costs only 7 dollars.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/dl/fees/idCard_fees.htm#reg_id

any amount of money paid to vote, even 1 dollar, is a poll tax and illegal....imo.

[Yurt]

as immie has mentioned and typo too, it could be considered a poll tax, unless the id's are issued for free.

Absolutely wrong. See my previous posts. Further, the goal of checking IDs does not amount to a poll tax. You should really learn what "poll tax" is. Are you telling me that $7 would actually stop someone from voting?

Btw, does anyone actually know if getting just a plain ID cost money? I put up CA costs. What about other states?

[JohnDoe]

Bullshit. We all need ID for so many aspects of our life, and we have all paid for them whether they are drivers licenses, social security cards or general ID cards from the government. This has nothing to do with JUST polls, ALL Americans should have an ID in this day and age. You can't drive without one. You can't fly without one. You can't leave the country legally without one. You can't drink without one. You can't buy a firearm without one. You can't get a bank account without one. It's absolutely absurd to not have an ID in this day and age, and even more absurd to come up with excuses for those who refuse to get one. BUT, people still do have that right - but they should also be denied every last damn thing that currently requires an appropriate ID, and we should be working to require ID's for even more things. See how far they get living like outcasts because they refuse.

driving and flying are priveledges, they are not mandatory, therefore it is okay to have to pay the gvt for them

[Yurt]

any amount of money paid to vote, even 1 dollar, is a poll tax and illegal....imo.

how do you get to your poll station? walk? ride? drive? bus? what if someone lived a certain distance away and had to drive or take a bus there? using your logic, that is a tax and illegal.

you are wrong about poll tax, read up on it.