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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by PostmodernProphet View Post
    no.....they will be where they chose to go....it isn't a question of "fault", it's a question of choice....
    So tell me, how does a Viking who gave praise to Thor and so forth a thousand years ago, and who never heard of a single snip of Christianity chose were he goes?
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

  2. #17
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    Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." -- John 14:6

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by PostmodernProphet View Post
    actually, no...
    How sad.

    no, we hope you come to your senses before you die.....
    Lol, thats a different point, if i where to die an atheist you would hope i go to hell.
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    Personally, I hope you are wrong because if you are right then my Grandparents are currently burning in hell because they did not worship a god. I'm sure you can imagin why I'd not be so keen on that.

    Also if it so happens that your type of god is the only god then that means that countless Billions will be sent to hell through no fault of their own, but merely because of the country they were born in, or the age in which they lived.

    However, you will hope that your God does exist, so you can spend forever in pleasure and happiness.

    Also, I do hate this whole notion of 'your life is pointless without god' are you thus saying you could not live a happy life without god? Can you not find beauty in nature without attributing it to a god? Can you not love those around you without god? To make a statement as silly as 'your life is pointless without a god' is to deminish the life that we have,

    To flip the point around, when i die, you will hope i go to hell.

    Noir - my grandbaby (3 months old) doesn't know about the bible, religion or gods ........... I don't think he would be condemned to hell, do you? Personally, I don't believe in heaven or hell.

    Ever heard of quantum physics .... everything that exists is made up of nothing but energy?

    My "god" is the universe ....... and a belief that every single particle of energy is just a cell in the total makeup of God/Universe .......as our physical bodies die the energy of our soul regroups and decides what our next lesson will be and then creates the situation from our combined energy and thoughts.
    If the freedom of speech is taken away
    then dumb and silent we may be led,
    like sheep to the slaughter.


    George Washington (1732-1799) First President of the USA.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    Because i do not believe in your god, or any god for that matter. And if your God does exist then he will send me to hell, and ofcourse you must hope that your god does exist.

    So in the same way that you hope that your loved ones who have passed away are in heaven because they believed, you are indirectly hoping that those who do not believe are going to/are in hell.
    No, no, no, you have it backwards. The very reason those Evangelists that people are so annoyed by try to convert you, is so that you will spend eternity with God. I am always perplexed by how much people are hated for just trying to give others what they believe is the biggest reward possible. Aside from the few shysters out there, most do it because Jesus asked it. And for souls.

    So no, I don't wish hell upon you. I can be glad and convinced that God exists, without wishing punishment on you. That is between you and God.

    Anyway, aside from not having to worry about your grandparents, which is nice, what do you personally gain from not believing? What makes your life better for living/dying in a godless universe?
    After the game, the king and the pawn go into the same box - Author unknown

    “Unfortunately, the truth is now whatever the media say it is”
    -Abbey

  6. #21
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    Your grandparents aren't even aware of each other in hell never mind you still on earth. Fahgetaboutem.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrskurtsprincess View Post
    Noir - my grandbaby (3 months old) doesn't know about the bible, religion or gods ........... I don't think he would be condemned to hell, do you? Personally, I don't believe in heaven or hell.
    Well i don't believe they'd go to hell either, cus it doesn't exist IMO, however, there are no doubt religious people who would say that unless they were chirstaned at birth ect then they would. See thats a massive problem i have with religion, no matter what God does it is just, for anything against his will is Sin, thus if he wants to send babies to hell, and forgive deathbed conversions of murderers, then that is 'just' because it is his will.

    Ever heard of quantum physics .... everything that exists is made up of nothing but energy?
    I have, and it fascinates me,

    My "god" is the universe ....... and a belief that every single particle of energy is just a cell in the total makeup of God/Universe .......as our physical bodies die the energy of our soul regroups and decides what our next lesson will be and then creates the situation from our combined energy and thoughts.
    Indeedy, this is a very common form of 'God' and a view that has been shared by many, such as einstein, the problem is that people can manipulate what you say by removing context, for example Einstien is often quoted as saying "God does not play dice" which he did, but he was using the word god to talk about nature, not about any personal god.
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockmail View Post
    Your grandparents aren't even aware of each other in hell never mind you still on earth. Fahgetaboutem.
    Cool.
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abbey View Post
    No, no, no, you have it backwards. The very reason those Evangelists that people are so annoyed by try to convert you, is so that you will spend eternity with God. I am always perplexed by how much people are hated for just trying to give others what they believe is the biggest reward possible. Aside from the few shysters out there, most do it because Jesus asked it. And for souls.

    So no, I don't wish hell upon you. I can be glad and convinced that God exists, without wishing punishment on you. That is between you and God.

    Anyway, aside from not having to worry about your grandparents, which is nice, what do you personally gain from not believing? What makes your life better for living/dying in a godless universe?
    I have no doubt that you and many others do what you do sincerely and out of caring, and i know you do not wish ill on me, or anyone else, however, it is your belief that one must follow God through Christ and have your sins forgiven ect ect, otherwise you go to hell. As such in hoping that your Gods exist, and that you are following the right one, you are hoping that others are worshiping false gods, and by the scripture that you have faith in that means they are damned to hell
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

  10. #25
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    Sorry bout that,


    1. Well we are all in this world together mates.
    2. You like everyone else has to ask yourself, "Do I feel lucky punk?"
    3. No really just joking, we care what happens to you Noir, or whatever your name is.
    4. But the thing is, is God makes the rules, we just listen and follow is all we're saying.
    5. Sure we are mostly screw ups, we make mistakes too, just like you do.
    6. We ain't perfect, but we are forgiven by his grace.
    7. And theres still room for another, its you who desides.
    8. We're pulling for you,.....



    Regards,
    SirJamesofTexas
    "At Times We Cry, At Time We Fly" ~CWN
    "See You Down The Road Man" ~ CWN

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abbey View Post
    Noir said he hoped that I was wrong about God. So, I wanted to ask the question of any atheists on the board.

    Why do you hope we believers are wrong? What do you gain by living (and especially, by dying) in a Godless universe?
    What about us Agnostics?
    POLITICAL ACTIVISTS CREED
    "It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brushfires in people's minds" -Samuel Adams

    "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men
    stand ready to do violence on their behalf."~George Orwell

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abbey View Post
    Noir said he hoped that I was wrong about God. So, I wanted to ask the question of any atheists on the board.

    Why do you hope we believers are wrong? What do you gain by living (and especially, by dying) in a Godless universe?
    Because if God exists, we are not free to recognize, on our own accord, what is meaningful for us. We are not free to recognize beauty where we find it. With God, whatever is beautiful, whatever really matters, is whatever God says. And if that were so, if that's all we're here for, is to be God's cheering section - then what the hell are our individual lives for? If God exists, everything is meaningless - it's all a parlor game God plays in his head.

    True freedom (and true responsibility) are only possible in a Godless universe. Life is valuable, only because it is finite. I can think of no more perfect hell, than to condemn a man to unending life. The people who yearn for it, don't understand the implications. An eternity of insomnia - the ultimate self-aggrandizement of your ego, and with no escape possible! Life is beautiful, and death is hard. And that is as good as it gets. The grand irony of the hereafter, is that the exact same notice is posted above the gates to heaven and hell alike: "Hope Dies Here."

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pericles View Post
    True freedom (and true responsibility) are only possible in a Godless universe.
    Not true.

    If you can let go of what you currently believe about God, perhaps you could realize that YOU are a piece of God and through you the creator of the universe can experience all that is.

    I do not experience God through the belief system of any religion, therefore, I put no limitations on what I believe God to be, therefore I have the ultimate freedom.
    If the freedom of speech is taken away
    then dumb and silent we may be led,
    like sheep to the slaughter.


    George Washington (1732-1799) First President of the USA.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    Cool.
    Hot, actually.

    [YOUTUBE]9HdugdTIS74[/YOUTUBE]

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockmail View Post
    Hot, actually.

    [YOUTUBE]9HdugdTIS74[/YOUTUBE]
    So someone had a bad dream?
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

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