Hatred for the poor

[darin]

Not sure, but 37..I mean..29 years later, I'm still alive to tell about it. Hell, next I'll be expected to pay for the $5k Viking range I want installed in my kitchen..

Damn the injustice of it all.

Want it free? (never mind it wouldn't be REALLY free because you'd lose part of your soul...) Start MARCHING and DEMONSTRATING against Viking. Say "You have a RIGHT to a well-cooked meal!" Liberals do that ALL the time; they turn their desires into Rights simply by proclamation.

[shattered]

Want it free? (never mind it wouldn't be REALLY free because you'd lose part of your soul...) Start MARCHING and DEMONSTRATING against Viking. Say "You have a RIGHT to a well-cooked meal!" Liberals do that ALL the time; they turn their desires into Rights simply by proclamation.

Alas.. I don't have time.. I have to work... *sigh*

[Hagbard Celine]

Bah - C'mon...you're SO OLD SKEWL! People are GONNA have sex! Instead of telling them information to HELP them - let's coddle their behavior and just hand out condoms at schools and stuff! GOD FORBID a Conservative try to teach the TRUTH of your words to people too self-centered to listen.

Dude, condoms are 99 percent effective at stopping sperm cells from entering the uterus. Save me the "abstinence is 100 percent effective" one-liner. People ARE going to have sex regardless of your freaky insistence to the contrary that if we preach enough about it all unmarried people will suddenly see the light and adopt a monastic lifestyle. You can't keep believing that policy based on ideology alone will work in the real world. In the real world people--unmarried people no less--have sex all the time and they always have and always will. Our bodies are built for it. That's not a "self-centered" comment, it's real life. The way I see it, we've got two options. Either we make birth control available to people, teach our kids about it AND continue to teach that abstinence is the best policy until they're married and we see unwanted birthrates decline, OR we shun birth control based on self-righteous, unrealistic ideology, ignore reality, preach abstinence-only dogma and continue to see unwanted birthrates skyrocket out of control. I've made my choice already.

[darin]

People ARE going to have sex regardless of your freaky insistence to the contrary

Why don't you READ before making-up your mind about what I am or am not insisting upon? Comments like yours above are simply false. Nobody's insisting what you claim.

Here's one for you!

People ARE going to have UNPROTECTED sex regardless of how much "Information" we through at them, OR how convenient we make condoms, regardless of your freaky insistence to the contrary.

You prefer to treat the symptoms - I look to treat the condition. That's the fundamental difference between you and me.

[shattered]

Dude, condoms are 99 percent effective at stopping sperm cells from entering the uterus. Save me the "abstinence is 100 percent effective" one-liner. People ARE going to have sex regardless of your freaky insistence to the contrary that if we preach enough about it all unmarried people will suddenly see the light and adopt a monastic lifestyle. You can't keep believing that policy based on ideology alone will work in the real world. In the real world people--unmarried people no less--have sex all the time and they always have and always will. Our bodies are built for it. That's not a "self-centered" comment, it's real life. The way I see it, we've got two options. Either we make birth control available to people, teach our kids about it AND continue to teach that abstinence is the best policy until they're married and we see unwanted birthrates decline, OR we shun birth control based on self-righteous, unrealistic ideology, ignore reality, preach abstinence-only dogma and continue to see unwanted birthrates skyrocket out of control. I've made my choice already.

Funny.. That was at least 100 words, and I didn't see the words "personal responsibility" anywhere in there.. Now granted, I just skimmed it, because I've heard it all before, but.. were those words in there, and I just missed them?

[darin]

Dude, condoms are 99 percent effective at stopping sperm cells from entering the uterus.

Hrm....This Chart: http://www.contraceptivetechnology.com/table.html

Shows Condoms are only about 1-2% more effective than withdrawal.


Maybe we should simply 'teach' guys to pull-out?

[Abbey Marie]

Bah - C'mon...you're SO OLD SKEWL! People are GONNA have sex! Instead of telling them information to HELP them - let's coddle their behavior and just hand out condoms at schools and stuff! GOD FORBID a Conservative try to teach the TRUTH of your words to people too self-centered to listen.

In the words of a very cool guy I know: That's how I roll.

[Hagbard Celine]

Why don't you READ before making-up your mind about what I am or am not insisting upon? Comments like yours above are simply false. Nobody's insisting what you claim.

Here's one for you!

People ARE going to have UNPROTECTED sex regardless of how much "Information" we through at them, OR how convenient we make condoms, regardless of your freaky insistence to the contrary.

You prefer to treat the symptoms - I look to treat the condition. That's the fundamental difference between you and me.

Sure people would still have unprotected sex, but some who might have gone-in unprotected before might use b.c. if it were readily and easily available. If a girl who didn't know anything about b.c. pills suddenly became educated about them she might choose to go on the pill. That's one-less potential unwanted pregnancy. If a guy who had never been introduced to them before suddenly became educated about condoms or about the female menstrual cycle (something they never taught us guys about here in GA schools) he would have knowledge that he could use to avoid unwanted pregnancy. I never said easily available birth control would completely do away with cases of unwanted pregnancy, but it would certainly lead to a decline in those cases. If we only teach abstinence-only dogma we're completely ignoring another proven line of defense, leaving a problem spot in our society. i.e. If a person were to only have abstinence-only education then that person gets into a situation where they are going to have sex, they could ignore their abstinence-only education. If they had birth control, they could also choose to ignore it, but atleast there were two lines of defense against unprotected sex rather than only one. Shattered is right, it all comes down to personal responsibility. Will you indulge or will you "go monk." Most people will indulge I think, so why not atleast make it easy for them to get condoms?

[darin]

Sure people would still have unprotected sex, but some who might have gone-in unprotected before might use b.c. if it were readily and easily available. If a girl who didn't know anything about b.c. pills suddenly became educated about them she might choose to go on the pill. That's one-less potential unwanted pregnancy. If a guy who had never been introduced to them before suddenly became educated about condoms or about the female menstrual cycle (something they never taught us guys about here in GA schools) he would have knowledge that he could use to avoid unwanted pregnancy. I never said easily available birth control would completely do away with cases of unwanted pregnancy, but it would certainly lead to a decline in those cases. If we only teach abstinence-only dogma we're completely ignoring another proven line of defense, leaving a problem spot in our society. i.e. If a person were to only have abstinence-only education then that person gets into a situation where they are going to have sex, they are ignoring their abstinence-only education. If they had birth control, they could also choose to ignore it, but atleast there were two lines of defense against unprotected sex rather than only one. Shattered is right, it all comes down to personal responsibility. Will you indulge or will you "go monk." Most people will indulge I think, so why not atleast make it easy for them to get condoms?

You are very good at assuming-away the problems with your line of thinking.

[Hagbard Celine]

Hrm....This Chart: http://www.contraceptivetechnology.com/table.html

Shows Condoms are only about 1-2% more effective than withdrawal.


Maybe we should simply 'teach' guys to pull-out?

Funny, I didn't see a statistic for "abstinence-only" effectiveness on that chart. Maybe that's because it's a "faith-based" ideology rather than a realistic form of birth control.

[darin]

Funny, I didn't see a statistic for "abstinence-only" effectiveness on that chart. Maybe that's because it's a "faith-based" ideology rather than a realistic form of birth control.

That's stupid. lol...How would that chart show the 'unexpected Pregnancy' rate of people who abstain from sexual intercourse? lmao

Rule #1 for Libs - When the data doesn't look good for your particular point of view, change the topic; shift people away from YOUR claims and focus the discussion on something ridiculous.

[Hagbard Celine]

You are very good at assuming-away the problems with your line of thinking.

Abstinence-only is based completely on assumption. Assumption that people will listen. Assumption that people will ignore their bodies. Assumption that people will ignore their lovers. Assumption that all people are pious... The list goes on and on. Give me a break with your judgemental little one-line posts based upon nothing more than your own self-righteousness. Pleez

[darin]

Abstinence-only is based completely on assumption. Assumption that people will listen. Assumption that people will ignore their bodies. Assumption that people will ignore their lovers. Assumption that all people are pious... The list goes on and on. Give me a break with your judgemental little one-line posts based upon nothing more than your own self-righteousness. Pleez

Rule #2 for Liberals: When your argument REALLY goes into a downward spiral, ridicule people!

[shattered]

One of those poor people that don't have a job can come clean my house, so I can do other things...

[Hagbard Celine]

That's stupid. lol...How would that chart show the 'unexpected Pregnancy' rate of people who abstain from sexual intercourse? lmao

Rule #1 for Libs - When the data doesn't look good for your particular point of view, change the topic; shift people away from YOUR claims and focus the discussion on something ridiculous.

Rule #1 for Self-Righteous Conservatives - When a liberal makes an excellent point attack their integrity.

For the people who abstain from sex, great for them. I hope they're happy in their frustrated, virginal existence. For everybody else abstinence-only sure doesn't do them a lot of good.

I've got a question for you along the same line of thinking you've presented to me: If abstinence-only works so well and is THE answer, why are there still unwanted pregnancies?