Calif. schools turn away unvaccinated students

[Kathianne]

Oh is it only children that have to be vaccinated by law? I don't know much about all that medical stuff. If adults are not required to get them can't they infect other adults in work spaces?

Polio, measles, mumps, rubella, diphtheria, tetanus, pertussis, are all diseases that killed and/or maimed thousands, tens and hundreds of thousands in given years. The vaccines prevent these numbers. While not with a 100% rate of absence of side effects, pretty darn close to it. There's no doubt where to hedge one's bets.

[logroller]

I'd say the constitution matters when the Gov't wants to FORCE me to take drugs OR ELSE.
No one's advocating open sewers or against some standards for public health but Injecting me and my kids crosses the line. Quarantine me if I've got something but Forced PREVENTION with medically debatable drugs doesn't smell like freedom to me. Your faith in Vaccines may be strong but mine is not. We are both willing to bear different risk.

SAFETY from a possible-maybe-oneday threat is no cause to usurp the "right to my body" as it were. Just like the cops don't have a right to put a tap on your phone because you MIGHT one day talk to a terrorist, BECAUSE IT SAVES LIVES.

I've been reading outside the box again on the history of Vaccines and I'm still debating the issue myself but at this point I'm not convinced vaccines have done exactly as historically advertised.

first off I must take issue with your characterization of vaccines being drugs. It's quite misleading; as drugs implies ae damage is done, which vaccines don't often do.
Either they have worked or diseases such as small pox just randomly died off. Are there aide-effects vaccine mnufctrs try to conceal? Maybe, but that alone doesn't indicate vaccines as bee

[ConHog]

first off I must take issue with your characterization of vaccines being drugs. It's quite misleading; as drugs implies ae damage is done, which vaccines don't often do.
Either they have worked or diseases such as small pox just randomly died off. Are there aide-effects vaccine mnufctrs try to conceal? Maybe, but that alone doesn't indicate vaccines as bee

LOL Are you serious?

[logroller]

LOL Are you serious?

It's possible, just not likely.. I'm merely discussing the alternatives here. Either vaccines have worked to reduce the spread of such diseases to near zero-or- they died off for some other reason. The former seems more likely IMO. These complaints about vaccines making children sick are moot if those same diseases are at pandemic proportions. People seem to forget how devastating such diseases were in the US, and still are in many parts of the world.

[Kathianne]

It's possible, just not likely.. I'm merely discussing the alternatives here. Either vaccines have worked to reduce the spread of such diseases to near zero-or- they died off for some other reason. The former seems more likely IMO. These complaints about vaccines making children sick are moot if those same diseases are at pandemic proportions. People seem to forget how devastating such diseases were in the US, and still are in many parts of the world.

Given the number of diseases and the inoculations, I don't think the statistical possibility exists they all just 'died out' at the relative same time. The only explanation is the inoculations.

[ConHog]

Given the number of diseases and the inoculations, I don't think the statistical possibility exists they all just 'died out' at the relative same time. The only explanation is the inoculations.

Especially given the timing. Small pox just happened to "die off" in the US within 10 years of the vaccine being introduced? Same with polio? Same with Rubella? Etc etc etc?

[Trinity]

My youngest just got a booster DTP shot, which they changed a few years back to kids entering the 7th grade had to have done. My youngest school nurse sent a letter home last week, that if he did not have it done by this past Friday, he would not be able to come back to school till it was done. I took him to get the shot thinking OK this is the last one and he's done. Since my 15 year old had the same shot right before 7th grade and that was the end of it. Oh no..... now they are recommending that they have a booster done for the Chicken pox, MMR, and 1 other one that I can't remember what it was. I was like seriously!! Why? The nurse told me it is because the vaccinations they got when they were little are wearing off. Both of my boy's had 1 chicken pox vaccinations when they were little, I was told then and I asked would this work for the rest of their lives or would they need to get another one? The Dr. assures me they only need the one shot. This nurse then tells me that a few years back they changed it to any child entering kindergarten had to have 2 chicken pox vaccinations before entering school. Jeez so looks like both of my boy's need booster shots. And here I thought they were done.....

[pete311]

If obamacare goes into effect then I want everyone vaccinated. Like I'm i'm going to pay for some dummies who get diseased because they didn't want their "rights" violated.

[Psychoblues]

If obamacare goes into effect then I want everyone vaccinated. Like I'm i'm going to pay for some dummies who get diseased because they didn't want their "rights" violated.

Much of the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is already working and proving it's complete viability and wisdom in the American healthcare industry. Is it your purpose to slam healthcare or the President?

Psychoblues

[DragonStryk72]

vaccinations only work if everyone, or as near as we can get, get vaccinated. Otherwise , why bother?

That's not correct. The whole point of vaccinations is so that you, the vaccinated person, can be around those who are not vaccinated, either without getting sick, or at least with decreased symptoms, and faster recovery times. This is why you get vaccinated when you go overseas, because people over there may have diseases they are not vaccinated for that can wreak havoc on you. By your estimation, we would have to vaccinate the entire world for vaccines to be effective, and that clearly hasn't happened.

[logroller]

That's not correct. The whole point of vaccinations is so that you, the vaccinated person, can be around those who are not vaccinated, either without getting sick, or at least with decreased symptoms, and faster recovery times. This is why you get vaccinated when you go overseas, because people over there may have diseases they are not vaccinated for that can wreak havoc on you. By your estimation, we would have to vaccinate the entire world for vaccines to be effective, and that clearly hasn't happened.

There is some merit to CH's premise, as wild-borne diseases mutate. Having less prevalence of a disease means there is less need for vaccine research into boosters to counter new strains.

[fj1200]

Much of the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is already working and proving it's complete viability and wisdom in the American healthcare industry.

[DragonStryk72]

There is some merit to CH's premise, as wild-borne diseases mutate. Having less prevalence of a disease means there is less need for vaccine research into boosters to counter new strains.

yeah, but even diseases that we have vaccines for mutate, it's the nature of disease, like with swine flu and bird flu. Even people who were vaccinated could still get it. That's the problem, and now, schools are starting to get more paranoid, as was pointed earlier, where schools want parents to get second chicken pox vacs that are completely unnecessary.Simply because a group gives a reason doesn't make it reasonable.

[logroller]

yeah, but even diseases that we have vaccines for mutate, it's the nature of disease, like with swine flu and bird flu. Even people who were vaccinated could still get it. That's the problem, and now, schools are starting to get more paranoid, as was pointed earlier, where schools want parents to get second chicken pox vacs that are completely unnecessary.Simply because a group gives a reason doesn't make it reasonable.

And fire codes haven't stopped all fires, but they have reduced them. If my house is built to higher standard than my neighbors, the risk of me having fire reduces the risk a fire will be spread to their house. The more people you come in contact with the higher your risk of both contracting and spreading communicable disease. The more times such a disease replicates the higher the likelihood of mutation and, therefore, the less effective vaccinations become. Prevention, though, is almost always preferable.

I completely understand the counter-arguments; there needs to be a balance. Do ALL vaccinations carry the same benefits to ALL people; of course not. But that isn't to imply there is NO benefit.

I think it must be "reasonable" based on risk of contraction and the likelihood of mortal effects. Lots of people get the flu, most are unscathed by the experience, save sting-ring and dropping a few pounds; the same couldn't be said for measles, small pox, polio and the like. I would recommend old, young, health care/ child-care providers ~i.e.high risk people get flu vaccines-- Both for personal safety and the safety of those you come in contact with. I, however, probably only come into contact with 20-30 people a week, so my risks are relatively low, thus the benefit of such a vaccination is less. Therefore, the question which should asked is rather whooping cough carries a significant enough risk to mandate vaccinations?

One critique I have on mandatory vaccination is that they make people think they wont get sick, which as you mentioned, is far from the truth. Hygenic practices, (eg washing hands) is often less practiced among certain groups-- children, the uneducated, the poor, et all~ third world peoples. Washing hands alone can prevent the spread of a great majority of contracted illnesses; I give my wife credit; as a teacher she does a lesson on proper hygiene the first week of every year and reminds them frequently of such. So far as legal requirements, the difference with schools, then say a church sunday school class, is one isn't required to be in church but we are compelled by law to be in school.

[chloe]

I understand the fear society has about it, and I see why they want it to be the law make it mandatory on children, yet as an adult I don't think personally I should be forced by law to take a vaccine if I don't want to.