Real food - is that too much to ask?

[SassyLady]

My granddaughter is in the 7th grade and my grandson is in the 4th. Neither of them have ever attended a public school (in charter schools) and their schools have no cafeteria. All parents have to provide lunch; no ifs, ands or buts. If they forget to bring it/make it, there are no backup lunches...they do without. One of the first lessons these schools teach is personal responsibility and that they are not there to coddle anyone. I propose that all cafeterias be closed.

PS...my grandson won first place last night at his science fair, so missing a lunch here or there has not affected his ability to learn and excel.

[ConHog]

So you're against the governmentally imposed monopoly on education as well?

There is of course no such monopoly. You're free to send your child to public/private school OR home school them. I guess it's true that the government mandates that you can't simply not educate your children, but that's probably a good thing.

My granddaughter is in the 7th grade and my grandson is in the 4th. Neither of them have ever attended a public school (in charter schools) and their schools have no cafeteria. All parents have to provide lunch; no ifs, ands or buts. If they forget to bring it/make it, there are no backup lunches...they do without. One of the first lessons these schools teach is personal responsibility and that they are not there to coddle anyone. I propose that all cafeterias be closed.

PS...my grandson won first place last night at his science fair, so missing a lunch here or there has not affected his ability to learn and excel.

First of all congrats to your grandson.

Second of all, I think we all know there is a difference between missing an occasional lunch and not having lunch on a regular basis. So your anecdote, while cute, doesn't apply.

[darin]

Nobody's mind knows they didn't eat lunch. "LUNCH" is not the key to anything people. Think about this; stop the logical fallacies.

Some of you are prophesying over kids; proclaiming their 'distractions from a hungry belly' and somehow converting that into guesses on their academic performance. Balderdash!

Our bodies are not regulated by the labels we apply to the meals we eat. You folk are basing your arguments, in large part, attempting to tug at heart strings with no evidence your claims/fears are rational.

As I've shown - and nobody not in agreement has been able to argue-down - school lunch programs are not proven helpful. They are a waste of tax dollars. Further, the practice re-enforces bad parenting.

[Jess]

Nobody's mind knows they didn't eat lunch. "LUNCH" is not the key to anything people. Think about this; stop the logical fallacies.

Some of you are prophesying over kids; proclaiming their 'distractions from a hungry belly' and somehow converting that into guesses on their academic performance. Balderdash!

Our bodies are not regulated by the labels we apply to the meals we eat. You folk are basing your arguments, in large part, attempting to tug at heart strings with no evidence your claims/fears are rational.

As I've shown - and nobody not in agreement has been able to argue-down - school lunch programs are not proven helpful. They are a waste of tax dollars. Further, the practice re-enforces bad parenting.

Since this has been a hot topic, I looked at the cafeteria as I was walking the minions to assembly. The cafeteria was pretty much packed. But a majority of the kids seem to be well-clothed, put-together ... definitely not what one would describe as needy or underfed.

It occurs to me that perhaps as I think has been pointed out, the fact of the program being there encourages parents to be lazy. They may pay for the breakfasts and pay full price, as opposed to those who get a discount or free breakfast/lunch but is it necessary? My kids would definitely qualify for discounted/free breakfast and/or lunch but I find it a point of responsibility that I/we provide for them. Our breakfasts and lunches may not be the fanciest but they are basically healthy (they even take a veggie in their lunch ) and I know what they are eating. Our boys make their own lunches under supervision, of course, so they eat it better and they take on some responsibility for themselves.

Why have kids if you're gonna have somebody else take care of them? Never understood that.

[ConHog]

Since this has been a hot topic, I looked at the cafeteria as I was walking the minions to assembly. The cafeteria was pretty much packed. But a majority of the kids seem to be well-clothed, put-together ... definitely not what one would describe as needy or underfed.

It occurs to me that perhaps as I think has been pointed out, the fact of the program being there encourages parents to be lazy. They may pay for the breakfasts and pay full price, as opposed to those who get a discount or free breakfast/lunch but is it necessary? My kids would definitely qualify for discounted/free breakfast and/or lunch but I find it a point of responsibility that I/we provide for them. Our breakfasts and lunches may not be the fanciest but they are basically healthy (they even take a veggie in their lunch ) and I know what they are eating. Our boys make their own lunches under supervision, of course, so they eat it better and they take on some responsibility for themselves.

Why have kids if you're gonna have somebody else take care of them? Never understood that.

so you actually advocate just doing away with school provided lunches altogether, not just the "welfare meals?"


Not sure how I feel about that to be honest. While it is true that in an ideal world that isn't really a school's responsibility. I think we all can all agree that in today's world most families need the convenience of just giving the kid $10 for school provided lunches or whatever.

I blame feminists, if they wouldn't have made stay at home mom's feel like they weren't worthy, that would have prevented a lot of our social ills from happening.

And no, I'm NOT saying a woman's place is in the kitchen. I'm making a larger point. Some of you perhaps have read my thoughts on that elsewhere, but it's not really the subject of this thread, so I'll stop there. Suffice to say, I would probably be okay with NO school lunches.

[darin]

I blame feminists, if they wouldn't have made stay at home mom's feel like they weren't worthy, that would have prevented a lot of our social ills from happening.

And no, I'm NOT saying a woman's place is in the kitchen.

I agree with you in principle. Couple that with our citizens 'demands' for higher wages; without thinking twice about the then-higher-costs and we have what we have today: Inflation and struggling. Oh - toss on a dallop of revolving credit debt and yeah - two-income families are the norm, sadly.

But. Here's the But. Parents have a choice. Everyone has choices. Despite working schedules and tiredness, parents OWE it to their kids to ensure the kids are fed adquately. That's not to say "every time somebody says it's lunch time a kid MUST eat". It's to say 'hunger' is a systematic problem. "Being hungry" is an instance. For an instance, most kids can miss a meal.

Most people can, for that matter.

Back to choices - My wife's last dance is about midnight; sometimes later. She gets home between midnight and 2am. After she washes off the remaining glitter, she gets to bed - maybe - about 2:30-3am. She Chooses to rise up to her knees, and pushes herself up off the mattress and down onto the floor - as she puts her little toes into fuzzy slippers, promptly at 0630. She does this to ensure our daughter is up and ready for school. My wife then stands there, and watches / attends to our daughter as the kid waits for the school bus. Back in bed, sometimes, for a 30 minute quicky until she repeats for our son. Thus, her bed life is a series of ups and downs. In and outs. Of bed.

Choices. My wife made the choice to work her body all night for extra income, and then wear herself out in bed, what with the crazy sleep patterns.

If WE can do this. If SHE can do what it takes, anybody can. While my wife is a special breed of woman, she's only human. Just like anyone else. No superpowers I can speak of on a family-friendly forum.

[ConHog]

I agree with you in principle. Couple that with our citizens 'demands' for higher wages; without thinking twice about the then-higher-costs and we have what we have today: Inflation and struggling. Oh - toss on a dallop of revolving credit debt and yeah - two-income families are the norm, sadly.

But. Here's the But. Parents have a choice. Everyone has choices. Despite working schedules and tiredness, parents OWE it to their kids to ensure the kids are fed adquately. That's not to say "every time somebody says it's lunch time a kid MUST eat". It's to say 'hunger' is a systematic problem. "Being hungry" is an instance. For an instance, most kids can miss a meal.

Most people can, for that matter.

Back to choices - My wife's last dance is about midnight; sometimes later. She gets home between midnight and 2am. After she washes off the remaining glitter, she gets to bed - maybe - about 2:30-3am. She Chooses to rise up to her knees, and pushes herself up off the mattress and down onto the floor - as she puts her little toes into fuzzy slippers, promptly at 0630. She does this to ensure our daughter is up and ready for school. My wife then stands there, and watches / attends to our daughter as the kid waits for the school bus. Back in bed, sometimes, for a 30 minute quicky until she repeats for our son. Thus, her bed life is a series of ups and downs. In and outs. Of bed.

Choices. My wife made the choice to work her body all night for extra income, and then wear herself out in bed, what with the crazy sleep patterns.

If WE can do this. If SHE can do what it takes, anybody can. While my wife is a special breed of woman, she's only human. Just like anyone else. No superpowers I can speak of on a family-friendly forum.

Look we agree that many CHOOSE not to make sacrifices that they probably SHOULD make. But in the meantime we need to face realities. A sad reality is that many a parent see schools as day cares which by God not only have to take care of their children for 10 hours a day and provide for all their needs, but also ones that can't actually discipline said children. The choices are either tell those people to fuck off or to deal with it the best we can. That's why schools must have police on campus now, nurses on staff, cafeterias, sports teams, after school activities, and a myriad of other things. Back when Laura Engal was a a teacher your ass learned to read , write, and do math and that was ALL the school provided, but those days are long gone my friend. Never to return.

[Intense]

I'm mixed. I've seen from the housing projects around NYC, kids that are not fed at home, if not for School Programs, they would be in trouble, something that would force the hand of Child Services, for better or worse. The Breakfast?Lunch programs are a crutch, that does lead to dependency, true. There is a real problem and it is compound. Another factor to consider in wasted money, is an inventory in how much gets thrown out by the kid's uneaten, untouched. There is allot of waste. One thing is for sure, One size fit's all, centralized planning does not work.

[darin]

Why have kids if you're gonna have somebody else take care of them? Never understood that.

I am blessed to the point of sending my kids with as much or as little food as they want. I'm sure food banks would love more support to provide for the families of those who aren't as blessed/hard-working as me and my wife. Let private charity do their job; remove charity operations from the public sector - in doing so, you'll reduce my tax burden - allowing me to give MORE to charities - both local and across the nation.

Therein lies the problem: Governments tend to crave money. Governments get their feelings hurt if somebody OTHER than them gets money - which government officials tend to equate (for good reason) with power.

I'm mixed. I've seen from the housing projects around NYC, kids that are not fed at home, if not for School Programs, they would be in trouble, something that would force the hand of Child Services, for better or worse. The Breakfast?Lunch programs are a crutch, that does lead to dependency, true. There is a real problem and it is compound. Another factor to consider in wasted money, is an inventory in how much gets thrown out by the kid's uneaten, untouched. There is allot of waste. One thing is for sure, One size fit's all, centralized planning does not work.

Absolutely right. I'm all for helping the needy - too often our tax dollars get wasted on the 'want-y' - those who simply WANT a free ride; as opposed to those who truly NEED a free ride for awhile.

[fj1200]

There is of course no such monopoly. You're free to send your child to public/private school OR home school them. I guess it's true that the government mandates that you can't simply not educate your children, but that's probably a good thing.

Tell that to those who do not have the means to utilize private schools nor the time to home school. My point was irrefutable, even you said that you're own district couldn't support charter schools due to various factors.

[SassyLady]

First of all congrats to your grandson.

Thank you.

Second of all, I think we all know there is a difference between missing an occasional lunch and not having lunch on a regular basis. So your anecdote, while cute, doesn't apply.

My point, which you completely missed in my little anecdote, is that parents and children need to learn personal responsibility. The public school system has turned the masses into dependent, can't think for themselves, individuals who expect society to take care of them.

Darwin's Law has totally been skewed by society's need to coddle. No wonder "advanced civilizations" fail.

Look we agree that many CHOOSE not to make sacrifices that they probably SHOULD make. But in the meantime we need to face realities. A sad reality is that many a parent see schools as day cares which by God not only have to take care of their children for 10 hours a day and provide for all their needs, but also ones that can't actually discipline said children. The choices are either tell those people to fuck off or to deal with it the best we can. That's why schools must have police on campus now, nurses on staff, cafeterias, sports teams, after school activities, and a myriad of other things. Back when Laura Engal was a a teacher your ass learned to read , write, and do math and that was ALL the school provided, but those days are long gone my friend. Never to return.

And how did these parents get to this point? Because, we as a society, have allowed it to happen through insidious things like providing cafeteria lunches so that parents can turn their back on that responsibility.

Here's an opinion on that. There is a direct correlation between 9 lb chicken breasts becoming available at wal mart and almost every 15 y/o girl having huge tits. It can't be healthy to be eating all that shit.

Unfortunately the alternative is usually either very expensive organic food or limited food options.

I ate home grown chickens and had huge boobies that had to be reduced because of genetics, not the food I ate. Big boobies have been around a lot longer than genetically altered food.

[Abbey Marie]

Thank you.
...
And how did these parents get to this point? Because, we as a society, have allowed it to happen through insidious things like providing cafeteria lunches so that parents can turn their back on that responsibility.
...

And let's not not forget the most insidious problem of all- lawsuits- if the schools make one so-called misstep.

[Shadow]

My point, which you completely missed in my little anecdote, is that parents and children need to learn personal responsibility. The public school system has turned the masses into dependent, can't think for themselves, individuals who expect society to take care of them.

Darwin's Law has totally been skewed by society's need to coddle. No wonder "advanced civilizations" fail.



And how did these parents get to this point? Because, we as a society, have allowed it to happen through insidious things like providing cafeteria lunches so that parents can turn their back on that responsibility.

This is why today's children are not taught the tools they need to succeed. Parents rely on the school...school drops the ball the majority of the time...even though they claim to know what's best. As my kids have gotten older...I have found that I fight the schools to enforce their own rules and guidelines every bit as much as I fight my kids to abide by them. The kids with slacker parents just fall through the cracks.