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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by fj1200 View Post
    That's kind of like fraud and stuff, it's kinda like a, you know, like a crime.
    I don't even think it's that. Not unless there is actually a question as to do you have a MoH? And it's a deciding factor in whether you get the loan or not. Otherwise it would be hard to prove it's anything more than a lie.

  2. #17
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    ^It was fraudulently used as the "ruse."
    "when socialism fails, blame capitalism and demand more socialism." - A friend
    "You know the difference between libs and right-wingers? Libs STFU when evidence refutes their false beliefs." - Another friend
    “Don't waste your time with explanations: people only hear what they want to hear.” - Paulo Coelho


  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by fj1200 View Post
    ^It was fraudulently used as the "ruse."
    Good luck making it stick...

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConHog View Post
    Good luck making it stick...
    Good luck showing it to a jury...
    "when socialism fails, blame capitalism and demand more socialism." - A friend
    "You know the difference between libs and right-wingers? Libs STFU when evidence refutes their false beliefs." - Another friend
    “Don't waste your time with explanations: people only hear what they want to hear.” - Paulo Coelho


  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by fj1200 View Post
    Good luck showing it to a jury...
    You're right, I don't believe any prosecutor would ever touch such a case.

  6. #21
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    ^Considering it's likely a civil case...
    "when socialism fails, blame capitalism and demand more socialism." - A friend
    "You know the difference between libs and right-wingers? Libs STFU when evidence refutes their false beliefs." - Another friend
    “Don't waste your time with explanations: people only hear what they want to hear.” - Paulo Coelho


  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by fj1200 View Post
    ^Considering it's likely a civil case...
    Then why are we talking about making lying ILLEGAL?

  8. #23
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    ^Because the government passed a law criminalizing false speech.
    "when socialism fails, blame capitalism and demand more socialism." - A friend
    "You know the difference between libs and right-wingers? Libs STFU when evidence refutes their false beliefs." - Another friend
    “Don't waste your time with explanations: people only hear what they want to hear.” - Paulo Coelho


  9. #24
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    Well I guess this Alvarez went free on a technicality-- he's full of shit and everything he says is rubbish-- thus, his lies couldn't actually defame anyone. From the Ninth Circuit Ruling, emphasis is mine.
    Apparently, Alvarez makes a hobby of lying about himself to make people think he is "a psycho from the mental ward with Rambo stories." The summer before his election to the water district board, a woman informed the FBI about Alvarez's propensity for making false claims about his military past. Alvarez told her that he won the Medal of Honor for rescuing the American Ambassador during the Iranian hostage crisis, and that he had been shot in the back as he returned to the embassy to save the American flag. Alvarez reportedly told another woman that he was a Vietnam veteran helicopter pilot who had been shot down but then, with the help of his buddies, was able to get the chopper back into the sky.

    In addition to his lies about military service, Alvarez has claimed to have played hockey for the Detroit Red Wings, to have worked as a police officer (who was fired for using excessive force), and to have been secretly married to a Mexican starlet. As the district court observed, Alvarez "live[s] in a world, a make-believe world where [he] just make[s] up stories all the time . . . . [T[here's no credibility in anything [he] say[s]."

    Well OK, I guess I see how this is free speech issue. B/C If all you do is lie, criminalizing lies would effectively silence you. Were it not so, any actor portraying a decorated service member would be guilty as well. As much as I think the movie Green Zone with Matt Damon was crap, its hardly criminal; though I do think I have a civil case demanding my money back.

  10. #25
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    It is my opinion that anyone can pretend to be a hero with as many medals as they can fabricate and tell whatever war stories they want under the protection of the first amendment. That being said, I also feel that those who support the pretender (especially after proof that their claim is a lie) are either just plain stupid or aiding in continuing the lie. It seems to me that once such hero-wannabees are shown to be imposters, most folks would shun them. Criminal? Probably not. Despicable? Most assuredley.
    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
    Thomas Jefferson


  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConHog View Post
    Stolen Valor is an unconstitutional law, no matter how much I agree with it.
    First of all, the 1st amendment doesn't protect someone lying. 2nd, if the writers of that amendment could of had a poster boy for WHY they wrote the law, it would be this case. What a slime ball. They should take a 100 points off of his credit report.
    If ya can't prove it, don't say it.
    Bikes, babes, and beer, it don't get no better than that.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by trobinett View Post
    First of all, the 1st amendment doesn't protect someone lying. 2nd, if the writers of that amendment could of had a poster boy for WHY they wrote the law, it would be this case. What a slime ball. They should take a 100 points off of his credit report.
    Neither does the first amendment protect the truth.. It protects FREE SPEECH. Which is defined as neither truth nor lies.

    I'll tell you who MIGHT have a civil case here. Actual MoH winners might could sue this douche bag for slandering their noble service. I'd find in favor of them in a heart beat.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by fj1200 View Post
    I think they have a high hurdle to meet when implementing a law like this.



    Trademark might be an acceptable standard but there is no standard required for recipients to continue upholding that I'm aware of. If I claim to have won a Pulitzer do they have recourse against me?

    would it include Al Gore and his having created the internet?

    I would totally oppose this, cuz it opens the door, and the govt always goes thru it

    I Think the people whoare exposed should be shamed and made as miserable as possible, like many people refusing to do business with them, a news article with his large pic in it declaring he is a phony claiming to have won the moh.,
    I DONT CLAIM TO KN0OW ANYTHING ABOUT HUMAN NATURE
    N
    OIR DO I KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT CRITICAL THINKING

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuvRPgrl View Post
    would it include Al Gore and his having created the internet?

    I would totally oppose this, cuz it opens the door, and the govt always goes thru it

    I Think the people whoare exposed should be shamed and made as miserable as possible, like many people refusing to do business with them, a news article with his large pic in it declaring he is a phony claiming to have won the moh.,

    Yep.
    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
    Thomas Jefferson


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    It's a crime to threaten people. It's a crime to lie to the police. It's a crime to impersonate law enforcement and doctors.

    The First Amendment may give you the ability to say anything, but when what you say furthers a crime, then you should be arrested.

    The crime here isn't for saying he's a soldier who was given the medal of honor. It's for pretending to be one. What he said is just the evidence of the crime.
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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