What if there's a problem? Say a tubal pregnancy, too early to be detected by a transabdominal ultrasound, just for example.Originally Posted by Missileman
Copacetic
What if there's a problem? Say a tubal pregnancy, too early to be detected by a transabdominal ultrasound, just for example.
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Transplanted Yankee
The ultrasound isn't being done to look for a problem, it's being done to establish stage of development.
I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do, because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. -- Susan B. Anthony
Copacetic
Mm. Take a step back from the politics for just a minute. Abortion is a medical procedure, not a pedicure. Performing an ultrasound to positively diagnose pregnancy, the gestational development and overall reproductive health is a medical standard. This is much ado about nothing.
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Transplanted Yankee
Sure, but if the fetus is too small to be picked up on a obstetric ultrasound, then can there be any doubt the fetus is less than the legal (22 weeks?) stage?
And you have these procedures being dictated by POLITICIANS, not doctors...so quit trying to pass this off as a medical standard.
I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do, because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. -- Susan B. Anthony
Copacetic
It's planned parenthood's standard too.
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Transplanted Yankee
To do a transvaginal before every abortion?
I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do, because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. -- Susan B. Anthony
Copacetic
Under 12 weeks
http://www.debatepolicy.com/newreply...reply&p=546315
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Exile
No, it's not a medical standard. The ultrasound is an optional procedure. The whole point of forced ultrasounds is to humiliate the women. It will not reduce the number of pregnancy terminations.
Copacetic
Wait for it.....
“Vaginal ultrasound was always performed before the early surgical abortion at 59 (83%) sites, under certain conditions at 11 (16%) sites, and never at one (1%) site,” the study noted. “Vaginal ultrasound was always performed after early surgical abortion at 18 (26%) sites, under certain conditions at 46 (66%) sites, and never at 6 (8%) sites.”Similar numbers were seen regarding vaginal ultrasounds before a mifepristone abortion.
“Vaginal ultrasound was very common before the medical abortion, with 37 (92%) sites reporting that they always performed it,” the study continued. “Vaginal ultrasound was always performed after early medical abortion in 35 (87%) sites, performed under certain conditions in 4 (10%) sites, and never performed in 1 (3%) site.”...http://www.lifenews.com/2012/02/22/p...o-ultrasounds/“That’s just the medical standard,” said Adrienne Schreiber, an official at Planned Parenthood’s Washington, D.C., regional office. “To confirm the gestational age of the pregnancy, before any procedure is done, you do an ultrasound.”
According to Schreiber, Planned Parenthood does require women to give signed consent for abortion procedures, including the ultrasound. But if the women won’t consent to the ultrasound, the abortion cannot take place, according to the group’s national standards.
Schreiber said there are several options at that point. If the woman is uncomfortable with a transvaginal ultrasound, which is more invasive, she can wait until the fetus is large enough to opt for a transabdominal ultrasound.
“But if she’s uncomfortable with a transvaginal ultrasound, then she’s not going to be comfortable with an equally invasive abortion procedure,” Schreiber told me.
http://www.lifenews.com/wp-content/u...soundstudy.pdf
I found actual data proving my claim WS. Do you have data disputing what I found?
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Exile
Consider the source of your data. Stop pretending the anti-choice crowd doesn't want this procedure to discourage women from terminating their pregnancies. You know perfectly well the whole thing is an effort to shame women into not terminating their pregnancies.
Copacetic
I certainly did...the data was published in an academic journal: Contraception. Names are quoted from the regional office in Washington DC. Read it and weep...you're wrong!
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Copacetic
I'm not pretending anything; I'm stating the facts. You just don't like it when the facts don't fit your biases. Admit my data is good, and transvaginal ultrasounds are performed with great frequency on women who CHOOSE to have abortions in the first trimester. Interestingly, its notably common on those who wish to receive RU486. Did you even bother to read the journal research, its informative!
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Exile
I'm not weeping.
"Lifenews.com" No bias there.
Copacetic
You don't have to concede; I know I'm right. At least read the data. Maybe you can use it to fine tune your future arguments for women's rights.
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
Copacetic
Don't shoot the messenger. It was published in Contraception 67 (2003) 287–294
Seriously, read the research. Find contradictory evidence. But merely dismissing it because it refutes your belief is ignorant and naive.
He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.AeschylusRead more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...zeMUwcpY1Io.99
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