A portrait of a Muslim womans life, written by a Muslim woman.

[jafar00]

I post stuff from Islamic websites, from noted Islamic scholars, and you call it lies.

dumb ass.

Is the OP from an Islamic website?

Jafar will say anything to sanitise Islam. He'll take any position lending itself to that effort.

Oh, and Jafar ... so-called 'anti-Islamic' sites (to the extent that any have ever been used as reference-points on this forum) aren't automatically dismissable just on those grounds. Websites can take an 'anti' position because, Jafar, THEY ARE RIGHT AND JUSTIFIED IN DOING SO.

By being dismissive of such sites, what you're really saying is that you oppose their very desire to offer opposition. And THAT, Jafar, is about as biased as it gets. I submit to you that TRUTH is what matters, and when it's presented, it shouldn't be discounted because of how its origin is perceived.

TRUTH is TRUTH.

The bias is on the anti Islam websites.

[jafar00]

Show me in the Quran where it says this. If it's not in the Quran, it's not 'really' Islamic. That's what you've been saying over and over. Now, you change and want us to believe something that is not in the Quran, and instead comes from 'scholarly interpretation'?

Pathetic how you change your tune whenever you're nailed on something. Mohammad would be disgusted by you.



Oh, and I thought you had me on IGNORE, Jahil

Islam is not just the Qur'aan alone but come from the Qur'aan and the Sunnah (the sayings of the Prophet Mohammed (saw) who would most certainly not "nail" me on that).

You are still on ignore, however I couldn't let this latest lie go on without challenge.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Islam is not just the Qur'aan alone but come from the Qur'aan and the Sunnah (the sayings of the Prophet Mohammed (saw) who would most certainly not "nail" me on that).

You are still on ignore, however I couldn't let this latest lie go on without challenge.

this is in direct contradiction to your previous statements on the matter.

Every time you get caught, you move the goal posts.

You're a worthless troll.

[Voted4Reagan]

I will ask JAFAR directly.

Should it be up to the women of all Islamic/Muslim countries through out the world, that they be allowed to choose for themselves if they should wear the Burqa, Niqab or Hijab? Should it be a matter of individual choice and not societal or religious mandate?

[Marcus Aurelius]

Islam is not just the Qur'aan alone but come from the Qur'aan and the Sunnah (the sayings of the Prophet Mohammed (saw) who would most certainly not "nail" me on that).

You are still on ignore, however I couldn't let this latest lie go on without challenge.

really?

What the Qur'aan states IS Islam. If someone does something to the contrary, they can't be doing it in the name of Islam can they? Hence my pork roll example.

If the Quar'aan IS Islam, then what is NOT in the Qur'aan is NOT Islam. Your logic, not mine.

So, still waiting for you to show us where in the Qur'aan that it says when you beat your wife, do it with a toothbrush.

[Voted4Reagan]

really?

If the Quar'aan IS Islam, then what is NOT in the Qur'aan is NOT Islam. Your logic, not mine.

So, still waiting for you to show us where in the Qur'aan that it says when you beat your wife, do it with a toothbrush.

I ask Jafar this....

DO YOU BELIEVE THE FOLLOWING?


"Shall I seek other than God as a judge when He has sent down to you this book sufficiently detailed?" Those to whom We have given the book know it is sent down from your Lord with truth; so do not be of those who have doubt. The word of your Lord has been completed with truth and justice; there is no changing His words. He is the Hearer, the Knower.

[Quran 6:114-115]


a simple yes or no will suffice

anything else means you refuse to answer.

[Marcus Aurelius]

I ask Jafar this....

DO YOU BELIEVE THE FOLLOWING?


"Shall I seek other than God as a judge when He has sent down to you this book sufficiently detailed?" Those to whom We have given the book know it is sent down from your Lord with truth; so do not be of those who have doubt. The word of your Lord has been completed with truth and justice; there is no changing His words. He is the Hearer, the Knower.

[Quran 6:114-115]


a simple yes or no will suffice

anything else means you refuse to answer.

Jahil will now claim you used an improper translation of the passage, and that you got it from an islamic hate site.

Or he'll run away and hide. After all, Jahil knows MUCH more about what is 'really' Islam than the man who wrote the Qur'aan, and all those pesky scholars... right?

[jafar00]

I will ask JAFAR directly.

Should it be up to the women of all Islamic/Muslim countries through out the world, that they be allowed to choose for themselves if they should wear the Burqa, Niqab or Hijab? Should it be a matter of individual choice and not societal or religious mandate?

It should, but depending on local customs, and/or local laws, there are varying degrees of whether women (and men!) follow the decree from Allah to cover themselves modestly of their own free will or not.

really?

If the Quar'aan IS Islam, then what is NOT in the Qur'aan is NOT Islam. Your logic, not mine.

So, still waiting for you to show us where in the Qur'aan that it says when you beat your wife, do it with a toothbrush.

Read what I quoted above and it will explain it. The Sunnah (hadiths) explain it in more detail along with prohibitions from hitting anyone in the face, treating your wives well and never beating them as you would a slave.

I ask Jafar this....

DO YOU BELIEVE THE FOLLOWING?


"Shall I seek other than God as a judge when He has sent down to you this book sufficiently detailed?" Those to whom We have given the book know it is sent down from your Lord with truth; so do not be of those who have doubt. The word of your Lord has been completed with truth and justice; there is no changing His words. He is the Hearer, the Knower.

[Quran 6:114-115]


a simple yes or no will suffice

anything else means you refuse to answer.

Yes I do believe it. As for following the Sunnah...

He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah (4:80)

The Qur'aan is the why, the Sunnah is the howto

[Marcus Aurelius]

Originally Posted by Voted4Reagan
I ask Jafar this....

DO YOU BELIEVE THE FOLLOWING?


"Shall I seek other than God as a judge when He has sent down to you this book sufficiently detailed?" Those to whom We have given the book know it is sent down from your Lord with truth; so do not be of those who have doubt. The word of your Lord has been completed with truth and justice; there is no changing His words. He is the Hearer, the Knower.

[Quran 6:114-115]


a simple yes or no will suffice

anything else means you refuse to answer.

Yes I do believe it. As for following the Sunnah...

He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah (4:80)

The Qur'aan is the why, the Sunnah is the howto

If the book is sufficiently detailed, there is no NEED for the how to's, as that information would be in the book.

You contradict yourself repeatedly, Jahil.

[Drummond]

If the book is sufficiently detailed, there is no NEED for the how to's, as that information would be in the book.

You contradict yourself repeatedly, Jahil.

... and conversely, if there is insufficient detail, then of what worth IS that book, anyway ??

I don't see how Jafar can continue with this without defying the fundamental premise of his 'religion' !

[Drummond]

The bias is on the anti Islam websites.

1. Labelling material as 'biased' doesn't, of itself, necessarily disprove its worth. Laws biased against murder have considerable worth. Websites which, for example, demonstrate a bias against Islamic terrorism, demonstrate the meritorious worth of their bias !!

2. Are you implying that pro-Muslim sites LACK bias ? Or that the only bias worth consideration just 'happens' to be pro-Islamic ?

Silly question.

Jafar, your propagandising is so transparent that I wonder why you bother.

[Voted4Reagan]

It should, but depending on local customs, and/or local laws, there are varying degrees of whether women (and men!) follow the decree from Allah to cover themselves modestly of their own free will or not.



Read what I quoted above and it will explain it. The Sunnah (hadiths) explain it in more detail along with prohibitions from hitting anyone in the face, treating your wives well and never beating them as you would a slave.



Yes I do believe it. As for following the Sunnah...

He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah (4:80)

The Qur'aan is the why, the Sunnah is the howto

and yet you admit to following the Hadiths other then that which the prophet (may peace be upon him) Wrote.

and I quote

"Do not write anything from me except Quran. Anyone who wrote anything other than the Quran shall erase it." [Ahmed, Vol. 1, Page 171, and Sahih Moslim, Zuhd, Book 42, Number 7147]

and

From Ibn Hanbal;






Zayd Ibn Thabit (The Prophet's closest revelation writer) visited the Khalifa Mu'aawiyah (more than 30 years after the Prophet's death), and told him a story about the Prophet. Mu'aawiyah liked the story and ordered someone to write it down. But Zayd said. " the messenger of God ordered us never to write anything of his hadith".

and

The farewell Pilgrimage of the prophet Muhammed is a corner stone in the Muslim history. The Final Sermon given by the Prophet during this pilgrimage was witnessed by thousands of Muslims. There are however three versions of this sermon in the hadiths books. This by itself reflects the degree of corruption of the hadith books as this is the most witnessed speech of the prophet Muhammed.



1- First version, " I left for you what if you hold on to, you will never be misguided, the book of God and my family. Moslim 44/4, Nu2408; Ibn Hanbal 4/366; darimi 23/1, nu 3319.






This is the version made up by the Shi'te Muslims.






2-Second version, "I left for you what if you hold on to, you will never be misguided, the book of God and my sunnah" . Muwatta, 46/3






This is the version made up by the Sunni Muslims.






3- Third version, "I left for you what if you hold on to, you will never be misguided, the book of God." Moslim 15/19, nu 1218; Ibn Majah 25/84, Abu dawud 11/56.


so as you see, the Sunni and Shiite have both chnged the original as laid down in:

Moslim 44/4, Nu2408; Ibn Hanbal 4/366; darimi 23/1, nu 3319.



You cant follow both Quran and the Hadiths Jafar. To do so is hypocrisy and shows how both Sunni and Shiite have twisted the true word of the Prophet (may peace be upon him).

[Marcus Aurelius]

and yet you admit to following the Hadiths other then that which the prophet (may peace be upon him) Wrote.

and I quote

"Do not write anything from me except Quran. Anyone who wrote anything other than the Quran shall erase it." [Ahmed, Vol. 1, Page 171, and Sahih Moslim, Zuhd, Book 42, Number 7147]
.

Jahil will now claim the man who said that wasn't 'really' Islamic.

[Voted4Reagan]

Jahil will now claim the man who said that wasn't 'really' Islamic.

I think he was.... even Jafar will admit that.

Either way.. Jafar can not point to any place in the Quran where Allah or his Prophet(may peace be upon him) says that a woman must be veiled or wear the Burqa, Hijab, Niqab or Khimar.

They simply dont exist in the Quran.

To require a woman to wear any of the above is to follow the hadiths of men and not the writings of the prophet(may peace be upon him).

[tailfins]

I will ask JAFAR directly.

Should it be up to the women of all Islamic/Muslim countries through out the world, that they be allowed to choose for themselves if they should wear the Burqa, Niqab or Hijab? Should it be a matter of individual choice and not societal or religious mandate?

Should the Amish have to ride around in horses and buggies be a matter of societal/community mandate? It's the same principle.