Help me save my TARDIS from my HOA!!!

[Marcus Aurelius]

I asked jimnyc where I should put this thread (get your minds out of the gutter ), and he suggested here......



About a year ago, I built a shed in the form or a TARDIS, from the BBC series Dr. Who.

However, my homeowners association has decided that since the color is not on the 'approved list' of colors, they are going to fine me periodically until I change the color.

I originally made my formal presentation to the association in Feb of 2012. The presentation was to the architectural committee, and included construction details, a sample of materials and colors to be used, etc. They declined to give me a yes or no answer at the meeting, and instead said they would pass it off to the main board.

I waited over a month, and heard nothing. I then found rule #26 in the association rulebook, which states...

If the ACC does not issue a written decision within fifteen (15) days after it receives a complete application from the Executive Director, then the application will deemed to have been approved, and the proposed improvements may be made; but the proposed improvements must be made exactly in accordance with the application, and all of the plans, specifications, information and documents submitted by the owner must meet all the conditions and required specifications or are similar to the original installation.

Since they had not met the criteria (15 day written notice), I sent them a registered letter stating I would be going ahead as planned.

The committee then claimed that by passing the buck to the main board, they had satisfied rule #26. I saw a lawyer at the time, and he said that they had not met rule 26, as they had never sent anything in writing within the 15 day period. So, I built the shed.

Now the association is threatening to fine me until I remove the shed, or change the color of the shed to one on the approved list. I refuse to do so.

I've contacted the local small claims court to see if I can bring action there, and I am waiting for a reply. I have contacted local Philadelphia tv news stations to see if they can do a story on this.

I even put up a thread asking for help from my fellow prop builders on THERPF.COM., and other sites.

Please...

HELP ME SAVE MY TARDIS!

Below is the contact information for the HOA. Please... write, call or email them, asking them to allow me to keep my TARDIS exactly as-is, and to drop the fines. Any help is sincerely appreciated.


Rhondda Homeowners Association
P.O. BOX 232
525 Carmarthen Drive
Exton, PA 19341
Phone: 610-363-8413
Fax: 610-363-9223
Email: property@rhonddahoa.org

Here is a form letter you can copy/paste to save time...

Dear Rhondda Homeowners Association,

It has been brought to my attention that about a year ago, one of your residents built a shed in their backyard, in the form of the iconic Blue Police Box from the British television series Dr. Who.

The resident submitted a complete application, as required by your association rules. He even met with the architectural committee in person to make a presentation, as the design and colors specified in the application were not considered 'standard' for your development.

When no written response was provided by Rhondda with the 15 day requirement set forth in rule #26 of the association rules...

If the ACC does not issue a written decision within fifteen (15) days after it receives a complete application from the Executive Director, then the application will deemed to have been approved, and the proposed improvements may be made; but the proposed improvements must be made exactly in accordance with the application, and all of the plans, specifications, information and documents submitted by the owner must meet all the conditions and required specifications or are similar to the original installation.

...the resident went ahead and built his shed.

Now, almost a year later, the Rhondda Homeowners Association is trying to fine the resident over the color of the shed! I find this inexcusable, as the resident clearly followed proper procedures, as set forth in the association rules. Essentially, he found and used a loophole in the rules, and you are trying to penalize him for it.

I respectfully urge you to reconsider your position, and refrain from any further attempts to fine or otherwise punish the resident in this matter.

Thank you for your time.

Any help is sincerely appreciated gang. Thanks in advance. I picture of the shed can be found in the link in my sig.

[aboutime]

I asked jimnyc where I should put this thread (get your minds out of the gutter ), and he suggested here......



About a year ago, I built a shed in the form or a TARDIS, from the BBC series Dr. Who.

However, my homeowners association has decided that since the color is not on the 'approved list' of colors, they are going to fine me periodically until I change the color.

I originally made my formal presentation to the association in Feb of 2012. The presentation was to the architectural committee, and included construction details, a sample of materials and colors to be used, etc. They declined to give me a yes or no answer at the meeting, and instead said they would pass it off to the main board.

I waited over a month, and heard nothing. I then found rule #26 in the association rulebook, which states...



Since they had not met the criteria (15 day written notice), I sent them a registered letter stating I would be going ahead as planned.

The committee then claimed that by passing the buck to the main board, they had satisfied rule #26. I saw a lawyer at the time, and he said that they had not met rule 26, as they had never sent anything in writing within the 15 day period. So, I built the shed.

Now the association is threatening to fine me until I remove the shed, or change the color of the shed to one on the approved list. I refuse to do so.

I've contacted the local small claims court to see if I can bring action there, and I am waiting for a reply. I have contacted local Philadelphia tv news stations to see if they can do a story on this.

I even put up a thread asking for help from my fellow prop builders on THERPF.COM., and other sites.

Please...

HELP ME SAVE MY TARDIS!

Below is the contact information for the HOA. Please... write, call or email them, asking them to allow me to keep my TARDIS exactly as-is, and to drop the fines. Any help is sincerely appreciated.


Rhondda Homeowners Association
P.O. BOX 232
525 Carmarthen Drive
Exton, PA 19341
Phone: 610-363-8413
Fax: 610-363-9223
Email: property@rhonddahoa.org

Here is a form letter you can copy/paste to save time...






Any help is sincerely appreciated gang. Thanks in advance. I picture of the shed can be found in the link in my sig.

Marcus. Have you thought about appeasing the idiots of the HOA by changing the name of the TARDIS to something more appealing, and pleasing to their Liberal insanity...such as "OBAMABOX"???
My apologies for the attempt at humor. But it does seem. HOA's across the nation are led by brainless, insulted, offended, idiots who always need to have power over others..no matter what the cost, or no matter how DUMB they look.

I remember visiting Exton many years ago before it began to grow, and dominate what used to be Open Space.
I was born in Norristown. So, I know what you must be experiencing, making me thankful I live in the South, away from HOA's that make demands based on the idiocy of a few, in order to control the many.
Sadly. HOA's have too much power, and as we have seen. Here in this nation. HOA's even dominate over Veterans who merely wish to fly the AMERICAN FLAG.
Unfortunately. It's going to get worse. The HOA has the means, and the backing to make your TARDIS a very, very expensive thing for you to maintain.
I do wish you luck, but I fear writing any kind of letter in your behalf...In my opinion, would be less than helpful to you.

[fj1200]

Are there any dispute resolution procedures in your HOA that you have to go through? And did the main board ever rule?

[Marcus Aurelius]

Are there any dispute resolution procedures in your HOA that you have to go through? And did the main board ever rule?

The day after they recieved my registered letter stating I was using rule #26, they decided to approve, if I stuck witht he approved colors instead of the blue. Both the lawyer I saw (free consultation) and I agreed that they had not met rule #26, so I built it.

problem with a lawyer now is, $1,000 for a retainer. That's why I am meeting with the court clerk to see what forms I need to file for a temp. injunction.

[fj1200]

The day after they recieved my registered letter stating I was using rule #26, they decided to approve, if I stuck witht he approved colors instead of the blue. Both the lawyer I saw (free consultation) and I agreed that they had not met rule #26, so I built it.

problem with a lawyer now is, $1,000 for a retainer. That's why I am meeting with the court clerk to see what forms I need to file for a temp. injunction.

Surprised that they don't have a dispute resolution process listed in the HOA but then again I've never had to deal with one except our city which has similar restrictions. I bet you could put up enough of a challenge to do it without a lawyer.

Good luck with it.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Surprised that they don't have a dispute resolution process listed in the HOA but then again I've never had to deal with one except our city which has similar restrictions. I bet you could put up enough of a challenge to do it without a lawyer.

Good luck with it.

unless I suddenly inherit $1,000, that's the idea. There is a pro bono program in Chester County for people who can't afford a lawyer, but make too much to get help from Legal Aid. I am waiting for a call back.

[Marcus Aurelius]

here is an edited version of the letter template, changing the loophole section.

Dear Rhondda Homeowners Association,

It has been brought to my attention that about a year ago, one of your residents built a shed in their backyard, in the form of the iconic Blue Police Box from the British television series Dr. Who.

The resident submitted a complete application, as required by your association rules. He even met with the architectural committee in person to make a presentation, as the design and colors specified in the application were not considered 'standard' for your development.

When no written response was provided by Rhondda with the 15 day requirement set forth in rule #26 of the association rules...

If the ACC does not issue a written decision within fifteen (15) days after it receives a complete application from the Executive Director, then the application will deemed to have been approved, and the proposed improvements may be made; but the proposed improvements must be made exactly in accordance with the application, and all of the plans, specifications, information and documents submitted by the owner must meet all the conditions and required specifications or are similar to the original installation.

...the resident went ahead and built his shed.

Now, almost a year later, the Rhondda Homeowners Association is trying to levy fines against the resident over the color of the shed, when in fact the RHA has no right to do so. The RHA failed to tender either an approval or disapproval of the project in the allotted 15-day time frame, resulting in the automatic approval of said project for construction (including the color of paint, as it was in the application and presentation) in accordance with the stipulations set forth in Rule #26. To attempt to fine him after this automatic approval is clearly an attempt by the RHA to circumvent their own bylaws and rules and punish the resident for the RHA's failure to exercise their own responsibilities in a timely fashion.

I respectfully urge you to reconsider your position, and refrain from any further attempts to fine or otherwise punish the resident in this matter.

Thank you for your time.

[Robert A Whit]

I know HOA rules in CA very well. But CA law is based not on English Common law as it is in PA, but based on Spanish law and done so by treaty. (Treaty of Gaudalupe Hidalgo)

However contract law is fairly standard.

You saw a lawyer, Unless you are fined, you have no damages. The Assoc. can only follow the rules on it's own rules pages.

I know CA small claims law but not PA small claims law. A visit by you to the local small claims court jurisdiction ought to get you the information they provide as well as their forms.

If you had the HOA rules, as you say you do, you knew the rules about the color. And though you attempted to get this waived, it might be per your state laws, that the waiver procedure was not as easy to waive as simply having them send said waiver to the full committee.

Why? Because of the negative impact on your neighbors who may suffer financial loss if you keep the odd color.

The Architecture committee may have delayed getting it to the full committee. (such as set it on a desk and ignoring it)

I don't really know enough to disagree with the lawyer you talked to. I expect he or she is correct.

Can they fine you? It seems unlikely.

First, those rules are designed to keep your property values high. You and your neighbors may lose value with that shed there.

Small claims filing fees are not large. But you have no case until you are damaged. In CA, no claimant nor defendant can take a lawyer to court to represent him or her.

If they try to break their own rules by fining you, perhaps you can get a larger award than you may suspect. Courts despise the maker of the contract trying to treat the one agreeing with it unfairly and may be up to awarding you more damages than it costs. A neutral 3rd party could hold any fines you pay to prove you had damages and pay to the winning party. I am saying you both defend and also counter-sue them. If you fail to counter-sue, the court may simply give you back any fines. It can be helpful to attend small claims to size up the way it works and the judges as well.

By the way, generally the HOA may place liens on the property and even force the sale if they turn out to be correct.

FWIW, I hope this helps.

[Robert A Whit]

I know HOA rules in CA very well. But CA law is based not on English Common law as it is in PA, but based on Spanish law and done so by treaty. (Treaty of Gaudalupe Hidalgo)

However contract law is fairly standard.

You saw a lawyer, Unless you are fined, you have no damages. The Assoc. can only follow the rules on it's own rules pages.

I know CA small claims law but not PA small claims law. A visit by you to the local small claims court jurisdiction ought to get you the information they provide as well as their forms.

If you had the HOA rules, as you say you do, you knew the rules about the color. And though you attempted to get this waived, it might be per your state laws, that the waiver procedure was not as easy to waive as simply having them send said waiver to the full committee.

Why? Because of the negative impact on your neighbors who may suffer financial loss if you keep the odd color.

The Architecture committee may have delayed getting it to the full committee. (such as set it on a desk and ignoring it)

I don't really know enough to disagree with the lawyer you talked to. I expect he or she is correct.

Can they fine you? It seems unlikely.

First, those rules are designed to keep your property values high. You and your neighbors may lose value with that shed there.

Small claims filing fees are not large. But you have no case until you are damaged. In CA, no claimant nor defendant can take a lawyer to court to represent him or her.

If they try to break their own rules by fining you, perhaps you can get a larger award than you may suspect. Courts despise the maker of the contract trying to treat the one agreeing with it unfairly and may be up to awarding you more damages than it costs. A neutral 3rd party could hold any fines you pay to prove you had damages and pay to the winning party. I am saying you both defend and also counter-sue them. If you fail to counter-sue, the court may simply give you back any fines. It can be helpful to attend small claims to size up the way it works and the judges as well.

By the way, generally the HOA may place liens on the property and even force the sale if they turn out to be correct. (NOTE, The above is not intended to be the practice of law in any state. It is merely information and said party is advised to seek legal counsel and do not rely on said offered information)

FWIW, I hope this helps.

*

[PostmodernProphet]

I've contacted the local small claims court to see if I can bring action there, and I am waiting for a reply.

no, because you have no damages to recover......

that will be $100......

(if you pay it you will have damages to recover.......)

[Marcus Aurelius]

no, because you have no damages to recover......

that will be $100......

(if you pay it you will have damages to recover.......)

the idea behind small claims court would be to get a preliminary injunction to prevent the fines in the first place, until a hearing can be held.

[Robert A Whit]

the idea behind small claims court would be to get a preliminary injunction to prevent the fines in the first place, until a hearing can be held.

I can't say what would happen since law in your state can easily vary a lot from CA but this is what CA says.



Small Claims Court Can Issue Injunctive and Other Equitable Relief

<small>Written by: Melissa Marsh, a California Business Law Attorney on 2-1-2010</small> Prior to the enactment of Assembly Bill 712, California Smalls Claims Courts had jurisdiction over actions seeking certain forms of relief, including money damages up to $7,500 and in such actions the Smalls Claims Court was also permitted to grant equitable relief in the form of rescission, restitution, reformation, and specific performance in lieu of, or in addition to, money damages. Under the new law, the Small Claims Court will be prohibited from issuing injunctive relief (e.g. specific performance) unless a California statute specifically authorizes the Small Claims Court to award injunctive relief. Fortunately, California Code of Civil Procedure §§ 116.210-116.221 provide that in any small claims action seeking money damages, the Small Claims Court may grant equitable relief in the form of recision, restitution, reformation and specific performance, in lieu of, or in addition to, money damages. In effect, this bill does not change existing law but seeks to clarify it.
Several statutes affecting homeowner associations (HOAs) also explicitly provide the Small Claims Court with jurisdiction to grant equitable relief. For example, California Civil Code § 1365.2 authorizes a person to bring an action in Small Claims Court to inspect and copy HOA records, and to ask for a civil penalty of up to $500 for each violation. The action to enforce the right to inspect and copy HOA documents would be an action for injunctive or declaratory relief. Similarly, Civil Code § 1363.09(c) allows a member of a common interest development to seek injunctive relief in any case involving association-related elections to be brought in Small Claims Court if the amount of the demand does not exceed the jurisdiction of the Small Claims Court ($7,500).

[Marcus Aurelius]

I can't say what would happen since law in your state can easily vary a lot from CA but this is what CA says.



Small Claims Court Can Issue Injunctive and Other Equitable Relief

<small>Written by: Melissa Marsh, a California Business Law Attorney on 2-1-2010</small> Prior to the enactment of Assembly Bill 712, California Smalls Claims Courts had jurisdiction over actions seeking certain forms of relief, including money damages up to $7,500 and in such actions the Smalls Claims Court was also permitted to grant equitable relief in the form of rescission, restitution, reformation, and specific performance in lieu of, or in addition to, money damages. Under the new law, the Small Claims Court will be prohibited from issuing injunctive relief (e.g. specific performance) unless a California statute specifically authorizes the Small Claims Court to award injunctive relief. Fortunately, California Code of Civil Procedure §§ 116.210-116.221 provide that in any small claims action seeking money damages, the Small Claims Court may grant equitable relief in the form of recision, restitution, reformation and specific performance, in lieu of, or in addition to, money damages. In effect, this bill does not change existing law but seeks to clarify it.
Several statutes affecting homeowner associations (HOAs) also explicitly provide the Small Claims Court with jurisdiction to grant equitable relief. For example, California Civil Code § 1365.2 authorizes a person to bring an action in Small Claims Court to inspect and copy HOA records, and to ask for a civil penalty of up to $500 for each violation. The action to enforce the right to inspect and copy HOA documents would be an action for injunctive or declaratory relief. Similarly, Civil Code § 1363.09(c) allows a member of a common interest development to seek injunctive relief in any case involving association-related elections to be brought in Small Claims Court if the amount of the demand does not exceed the jurisdiction of the Small Claims Court ($7,500).

who gives a shit about California, dumbass.

[logroller]

A few questions Marcus.
Can you prove the exact date that your request was filed?
(Obviously, this is necessary to determine rule 26 applies. )

regardless of what was said at the meeting, did you receive something in writing stating that it was referred to the main board within the 15 days? Or otherwise was the acc meeting minutes and decisions documented in some written form that is readily made available to the HOA members?
The reason I ask this is to avoid the argument that referring the matter to the board qualifies as a "decision" within the context of rule 26. Because legally, it could.

Are there definitions provided in the HOA agreement?
Otherwise, consider the following generic legal definitions:

Decision: The written determination of a court or administrative tribunal disposing of motions or claims in a case or matter before it.

A convincing argument could be made that the matter was "disposed of" by the ACC. But this leaves open a challenge upon it being written (although a written record of the minutes may suffice as "written") and, more importantly, whether it was "issued."

Issued: circulated, broadcast, televised, made public, announced, disseminated, published, sent out, promulgated, expressed, spread; see also delivered, distributed, published.

If any of the bold and/or underlined actions took place within the 15 days (again, in written form), then you've not got much of a case.

[Marcus Aurelius]

A few questions Marcus.
Can you prove the exact date that your request was filed?
(Obviously, this is necessary to determine rule 26 applies. )
yes.

regardless of what was said at the meeting, did you receive something in writing stating that it was referred to the main board within the 15 days?
no.

Or otherwise was the acc meeting minutes and decisions documented in some written form that is readily made available to the HOA members?
Possibly. However, rule 26 specifically sates 'notified' in writing'... not 'had written notice made available to', so I believe I'm good there.

The reason I ask this is to avoid the argument that referring the matter to the board qualifies as a "decision" within the context of rule 26. Because legally, it could.

Are there definitions provided in the HOA agreement?
Otherwise, consider the following generic legal definitions:

Decision: The written determination of a court or administrative tribunal disposing of motions or claims in a case or matter before it.

A convincing argument could be made that the matter was "disposed of" by the ACC. But this leaves open a challenge upon it being written (although a written record of the minutes may suffice as "written") and, more importantly, whether it was "issued."

Issued: circulated, broadcast, televised, made public, announced, disseminated, published, sent out, promulgated, expressed, spread; see also delivered, distributed, published.

If any of the bold and/or underlined actions took place within the 15 days (again, in written form), then you've not got much of a case.
none of those happend.

my comments in red above