MoD admits campaign in Afghanistan is 'an unwinnable war'

[Drummond]

... as I said a long time ago, is "probably true." No amount of your blathering on about Lefties is going to change that. Now if you could possibly explain how the statement is not true, or how we can set up a workable government that will continually fight our war against Taliban insurgents for us, then a rational discussion could be had. I don't expect it.

So, then, what's Karzai been doing all this time ? Perhaps you weren't aware of his existence ?

I'm sure you will appreciate this following report, coming as it does from the BBC ....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16771301

Afghanistan's President Hamid Karzai has thanked the British people for sacrificing "blood and treasure" for the future of his country.

His comments followed talks with David Cameron at the UK prime minister's Buckinghamshire residence, Chequers.

The leaders signed an agreement detailing how their countries would work together after UK combat troops withdraw from Afghanistan in 2014.

Mr Cameron said the relationship would be based on diplomacy, trade and aid.

Mr Karzai said the agreement was "one more step" in Britain's long-term commitment to Afghanistan.

He said Britain had been Afghanistan's "steadfast friend", particularly over the past 10 years.

Speaking the day after the death of a UK soldier in Helmand province - the 397th military death since 2001 - Mr Karzai said Britain had sacrificed "blood and treasure" in his country.

"The Afghan people recognise that, respect that and remember that".

Mr Karzai said Britain's continued help would move Afghanistan "towards becoming a fundamentally strong democratic state, free of terrorism".

He added: "May I convey to the people of Britain the gratitude of the Afghan people for all that Britain has offered Afghanistan, for having been ready to sacrifice, and for having been ready to share Britain's hard-earned taxpayers' money with Afghanistan for the betterment of the Afghan life, and for a better, more secure vision and - as a consequence - entire world."

OK, how's that ? Being from the BBC, I'm sure that, for you, it must really hit the spot ...

Did you catch that I was referring to the internal struggle within your own ideologies of how you can on one hand complain incessantly about "lefties" while at the same time desiring overwhelming power of the State to advance your own aims? If so, then

'Internal struggle' ?? How bizarre ... 'you wish' ....

Actually, I've no idea what you're talking about.

I have pointed out to you that State power is more the 'norm' over here than I'm sure is true, even now, for America. That's just the way of things here. I have no control over that reality .. it simply IS what it IS.

We could do with a break from the 'hive mind' Leftie approach which devalues the worth of the individual. But, we're not going to get it.

And if you'd claim non-understanding of what I'm talking about, just watch Obama work. Being a Leftie himself, he'll be in favour of State controls, control of people which detracts from their own individual rights.

[Robert A Whit]

President Bush loved learning the plans of General Franks and his staff and not trying to force franks to do it how an ex air force officer might do it. He trusted General Franks for many reasons.

I want to address this one point.

The problem is this:

British soldiers fighting in Afghanistan are part of a campaign that attempted to “impose an ideology foreign to the Afghan people” and was “unwinnable in military terms”, according to a damning report by the Ministry of Defence.

Any such imposition would not be by the Brits or Americans nor the other many forces in Afghanistan over these past years, but it would come from Kabul primarily with the locals standing for their system.

We call the country by one name. But when you see how it is governed, it has many forms of government

Even when the people of Afghanistan worked on their constitution, they spent many days and weeks trying to come up with a document useful to the entire area.

This is my opinion and am entitled to it..

[Drummond]

Damn dude, I gave you a bravo. You just do not know how to take a compliment.

Word count is not as important as is the quality and truthfulness of those words. I've not seen where you disproved any of his !!

Dummond did so very much more than just shout "leftie".. That is just all you chose to concentrate on.

Face it you will never master him or his knowledge about the Brits, the Brit government, the Muslim scum there or the damn lefties.
That you think you will is your arrogance amigo.

Carry on as I am enjoying the schooling -D- is so generously giving you . And I too am learning from his generosity.
See , unlike you, I freely admit that I still have lots to learn .-Tyr

Tyr, many thanks ...

Unfortunately, I can only 'school' Fj if he's prepared to listen. Cherrypicking what he WANTS to consider, isn't helpful to the process. But, unfortunately, that describes the way Lefties think - to see what they want to see ...

[Drummond]

President Bush loved learning the plans of General Franks and his staff and not trying to force franks to do it how an ex air force officer might do it. He trusted General Franks for many reasons.

I want to address this one point.



Any such imposition would not be by the Brits or Americans nor the other many forces in Afghanistan over these past years, but it would come from Kabul primarily with the locals standing for their system.

We call the country by one name. But when you see how it is governed, it has many forms of government

Even when the people of Afghanistan worked on their constitution, they spent many days and weeks trying to come up with a document useful to the entire area.

This is my opinion and am entitled to it..

Points well made, and thanks.

[fj1200]

ok I will but must go after this post ... going to buy another hate stick, bangy bangy stick, lib hated tool--gun...

Drummond wrote....

OK, so HE started talking about lib leftie Brits. I, however, am trying to stay on topic.

[fj1200]

Tyr, many thanks ...

Unfortunately, I can only 'school' Fj if he's prepared to listen. Cherrypicking what he WANTS to consider, isn't helpful to the process. But, unfortunately, that describes the way Lefties think - to see what they want to see ...

When, and if, I get schooled I'm pretty sure it will be by someone who understands what the topic is.

[fj1200]

So, then, what's Karzai been doing all this time ? Perhaps you weren't aware of his existence ?

I'm sure you will appreciate this following report, coming as it does from the BBC ....

OK, how's that ? Being from the BBC, I'm sure that, for you, it must really hit the spot ...

1. Kudos for straying dangerously close to the actual topic.
2. How do you contrast your article with two politicians saying nice things one year before the MoD report that casts doubt on long-term success? Perhaps our own actions are undercutting our expectations of success:

<nyt_headline version="1.0" type=" ">Intractable Afghan Graft Hampering U.S. Strategy</nyt_headline>

As Americans pull back from Afghanistan, Mr. Farnood’s case exemplifies how the United States is leaving behind a problem it underwrote over the past decade with tens of billions of dollars of aid and logistical support: a narrow business and political elite defined by its corruption, and despised by most Afghans for it.

3. Why would I care that it's from the BBC?

Actually, I've no idea what you're talking about.

I'm not surprised, my applause was premature.

I have pointed out to you that State power is more the 'norm' over here than I'm sure is true, even now, for America. That's just the way of things here. I have no control over that reality .. it simply IS what it IS.

We could do with a break from the 'hive mind' Leftie approach which devalues the worth of the individual. But, we're not going to get it.

And if you'd claim non-understanding of what I'm talking about, just watch Obama work. Being a Leftie himself, he'll be in favour of State controls, control of people which detracts from their own individual rights.

When have I suggested that BO was not a "leftie"?

And as far as devaluing the worth of an individual I'd say your support of government being able to classify an individual as "subhuman" certainly qualifies.

[aboutime]

When, and if, I get schooled I'm pretty sure it will be by someone who understands what the topic is.

fj. The very least you could do for the rest of us...in convincing us about being schooled....would be.

Post a copy of your PRE-SCHOOL graduation certificate, dated TODAY.

[fj1200]

fj. The very least you could do for the rest of us...in convincing us about being schooled....would be.

Post a copy of your PRE-SCHOOL graduation certificate, dated TODAY.

Thank you for contributing. I hear a circle calling your name.

[aboutime]

Thank you for contributing. I hear a circle calling your name.

And with you as the Pivot. Oh happy day.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

OK, so HE started talking about lib leftie Brits. I, however, am trying to stay on topic.

I disagree, as that fits in with the topic IMHO.. If it were not so I'd agree with you because truth matters more to me...-Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

1. Kudos for straying dangerously close to the actual topic.

Are you holding that lefty opposition to the Afghan war is not part of the topic at hand? Be they Brit or American lefties? Leftist opposition to the war is huge both here and there.--Tyr



When have I suggested that BO was not a "leftie"?

Congrats, your open admission that BO is a damn leftie deserves high praise and kudos!!!!-- --Tyr


And as far as devaluing the worth of an individual I'd say your support of government being able to classify an individual as "subhuman" certainly qualifies.

Do you hold that there are no subhuman people??
Because I can prove there are...--Tyr

All in all you appear to be coming along fairly well.
Big D gets high marks for teaching you and
YOU GET HIGH MARKS FOR LEARNING!
Praise the Lord......-TYR

[fj1200]

I disagree, as that fits in with the topic IMHO.. If it were not so I'd agree with you because truth matters more to me...-Tyr

I do agree that you love your truth but as far as Socialist Brits in regards to Afghanistan? Not so much.

[fj1200]

Are you holding that lefty opposition to the Afghan war is not part of the topic at hand? Be they Brit or American lefties? Leftist opposition to the war is huge both here and there.--Tyr

Yes, I don't base my entire argument on "lefties" as do you folks.

Congrats, your open admission that BO is a damn leftie deserves high praise and kudos!!!!-- --Tyr

When have I said otherwise? Another creation of your imagination I suppose.

Do you hold that there are no subhuman people??
Because I can prove there are...--Tyr

Have at it.

All in all you appear to be coming along fairly well.
Big D gets high marks for teaching you and
YOU GET HIGH MARKS FOR LEARNING!
Praise the Lord......-TYR

Ranting =/= teaching.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I do agree that you love your truth but as far as Socialist Brits in regards to Afghanistan? Not so much.

How about socialist Americans in regards to opposition on the Afghan war?