Bow season!!!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Sorry for the late reply....just got back from your neck of the woods....had a great burger at Firebirds and then the flourless brownie at BoneFish. Up really too late for going hunting in the morning.....but we'll see. I shot really well at 40 yards today but was pulling to the left with the practice tip. I most ALWAYS shoot a broadhead and almost NEVER a practice tip but It was muddy today and I shoot at a small floating (sometimes rocking) target that is dangled from a sting (which the arrow always penetrates my pond levee whether I'm dead on or not. Just didn't want to get my broadheads all muddy and it was good to see that my practice tip shoots a hair to the left while my broadheads tend to shoot just a bit to the right. I know....I know, I have some adjusting to do but it is so irrelevant as to the "kill zone" that I'll leave it be (for now).

I agree entirely.....I also squirrel hunted with a 22 and refused to do anything but HEAD shots. My dog would tree them (had a very nice, high priced dog that I trained) and I often times didn't even need a gun cuz of how fast that blame dog was. It took quite a lot of breaking to get that dog to settle down. My grandpa had one of the best but he had to get rid of him because he could never break him of going from dead squirrel to the next squirrel in the next hollow. He simply wore my pa out. HA!!! We have a few good dogs now but nothing like the ones we had back when. My dad had some of the BEST beagles in the country (if not the world) and folks as far as Florida to the South East and NJ to the North East. If I'm not mistaken, Idaho was also in the mix to buy dad's bloodline or mix their bloodline to ours. At one time, dad had well over 50 beagles! We never got into squirrel hunting dogs but dad had MANY trophies (over 100) that his dogs won. Dad always had a green thumb, an eye for hunting dogs and a steady trigger finger for long distance shots. The furthest I've ever taken a deer was at 420+ yards and that is a long distance for the SOUTH and for two bucks fighting over ONE doe's attention. I took the bigger buck and he was certainly busy trying to run the other buck off. In the process, he was keeping me extremely busy in getting everything just right before squeezing off a round...or two....or three. HA!!! Yeah, I missed the first two shots but nailed him clean on the third. I even have that long distance bullet. It almost went completely through him and when I rolled him over to see the exit wound.....saw only a tumor-looking protrusion. When I touched it with my knife, the bullet popped put. I mounted the mushroomed lead with the buck's antlers.....as well as some dice. HA!!!

As for the pistols....I wouldn't want to shoot them or the high priced shotguns that some of my friends shoot BUT they shoot those $10,000.oo guns all the time. One friend (from Texas originally) shoots two. One is a composite OLYMPIC looking gun with high-teck everything (including those custom cheek rests that are micro tunable and the other is a gorgeous hunting looking gun with gold trigger and beautiful engravings. My Browning is beautiful but it is only a $700 to $1,000 dollar 12 gauge that I turkey hunt with. It has two loping bucks on one side and two tom turkeys engraved on the other side. the shells come out the bottom (as all shells should). I simply can't see paying 10grand for a gun of any type but I'm sure there are those who think we are KraZy for spending the money we spend on "regular" guns. My rifle is an expensive firearm with a scope that costs as much as some guns do. That glass can be as expensive as diamonds in some cases but a good glass is a good thing to have. HA!!! I've never liked ANY firearm without a scope. Even my turkey gun has a scope. It comes off when skeet shooting and such but for hunting....I always want the best that allows for little mistakes. I believe I and the game I hunt deserve a good clean kill.

Well, time to hit the hay....may even go out in my short pants and flip flops int he morning....supposed to be in the mid to upper 80's and that is too hot to be walking around in camo. HA!!!

I only practice using the broad heads the last two weeks just before season starts. Always shoot a bit different than the field points do. Kinda boring shooting deer with a rifle ,no sport in at all for me. Just far too easy. With a bow its not easy. Makes it a challenge. I was once hunting on the ground and got two shots at a big buck. Shot over the buck both times! Even with my aiming lower the second shot my arrow went right over but seemed to nick his fur the second time. Man that sucker took off like a scalded dog. I was shooting my heavy bow and only found one arrow. The other stayed in the woods unless I hit the buck and didn't see it but I could find no sign of blood , was starting to get dark so cut short my arrow finding mission. I had put a new string on that bow the day before and found I had misjudged setting the nock points on the string. Reset them and the high shooting stopped. Dogs, my brother had some of the best rabbit hunting dogs I've ever seen. All beagles except Queenie the very best dog was a daschound mix, half beagle /half daschound. Queenie never lost the trail. Always listened for her yelp even when the other dogs were coming from another direction, the rabbit would always be just in front of Queenie. I hadnt hunted with my brother for about 5 years and his good friend Rex started rabbit hunting with him . Third hunt out Rex shoot Queenie instead of the rabbit . SEEMS QUEENIE WAS ONLY ABOUT 3 OR 4 FEET BEHIND THE RABBIT EMERGING INTO THE CLEARING AND REX NEVER WAS A GREAT SHOT. My brother dearly loved that dog, took it real, real hard. Sold his other dogs and never rabbit hunted again. That was about 14 years ago. Never hunted with Rex again either. -Tyr

[red state]

Don't mean to be rude or anything but the markings of a really good dog is for one to allow the hunters time to read the situation and prepare for it. A fast dog is so hard to keep up with or anticipate how the rabbit will act or react. Our dogs were usually 3 to 5 minutes "slow" or behind the dog. My son has one now (a mix breed of blue heeler / beagle) that catches many rabbit and squirrel year round. She could definitely make it out in the wild but isn't the best for what one would consider a hunting dog or [trial rabbit dog]. But to each his own cuz my son loves lil' Trixie. He also had a beautiful saddle back Beagle and after I finally broke her and trained her, she turned out to be a very good dog. She was a bit slow (too slow for my taste) but she really showed a bunch of SMART@$$ boys around Wolf River one day. We were all out hunting and they laughed at how she'd still be hunting a rabbit that their dogs had ran, they had shot, cleaned and cooked before ole YellowBelle would come through but that backfired on them cuz each time their dogs lost the trail, good ole Yellowbelle would slow and steadily show them the err of their ways. HA!!!! I didn't like her being so slow but I ate it up with a spoon that day. HA!!!! I accidentally ran over her while backing out of the garage one day going back to work at lunch. I hated it but I had no idea she was there OR that she couldn't/wouldn't have moved in time.

As for practicing with practice tips and my own hunting story (that I caught on video for whenever I'm able to figure all that out), I rarely (if ever) shoot practice tips but most of the time, they shoot just like my broadheads (IF) my rest and everything is set right. If they shoot differently, it usually means the rest needs minor adjustments. Mine needs a micro move to the right on one of my bows because the practice tips shoots a good bit to the right and slightly lower than the broadheads (I shoot those big, wide Walmart specials for $7 or $8 three pack). The best they make is the WASP but they're high and my black Walmart specials do just fine. I also shoot Thunderheads and the traditional broadheads from years ago. I don't like the old, traditional archer broadheads cuz they loose their sharpness here in our humidity. They fly better than almost anything on the market but I truly don't like having to check them and fear using one someday that was not sharp enough to cut an artery. I absolutely HATE my son's retractable heads cuz they are the devil to sharpen and you have to worry with the rubber collars and such.......just not for me but I'm always the one who gets stuck servicing my son's bow and arrows!!!!

Now for the hunting story of the day (since TYR has made the thread interesting). I took my wife's nephew hunting and although it was rifle season, had given up rifle hunting because I enjoyed archery so much and I had actually had a really good year in video taping my hunts. Well, when Jeremy (then a 15 year old.....now a police officer and Iraq Army Vet) asked what he could shoot, I told him that he could shoot anything if he carried his bow but could only shoot a Wall Hanger if he carried his rifle. Since he knew my hunting ground as a good source for Wall Hanger quality deer, he decided to take his rifle......big mistake. He saw over 30 deer in different herds that morning but NONE were worthy of his or my wall so he could shoot. I, on the other hand, saw only 15 - 20 deer and one group of 7 had one out-of-place doe so I opted for her. I saw them in plenty of time on this cold and barren morning and switched my head cam on to watch them approach. They came exactly where I knew they would and the camera caught my bow limbs bending until I released. The white 5" fletched 31" arrow with at least 8" of shaft in white was very easy to see fly till it hit the doe square in the back. My shot was perfect from side to side but the heigth of the stand (40'....which is way too high) plus the doe being a tad further than they normally travel goofed my shot up. This kept the other deer from crossing the lane and when they ran off, I knew the loner would probably double back and walk exactly like she had just done so I was more prepared to correct the mistakes I had just made seconds ago. I had immediately pulled another arrow (which is a second nature trait with me in bow fishing and it is a great practice for when or IF one ever hunts dangerous game) but I did it because I KNEW I'd probably get another chance. Sure enough, with camera rollling, she makes her second mistake and I bust her in the front shoulder. I was a bit off because of the adrenaline and such but I was able to swing the camera and follow her as she went only 50 yards in the beautiful timber that had no leaves and was glistening in frost. My wife's nephew walked up on me as I was getting down and I filmed him tracking the deer till he almost stumbled over her. It was funny because I had time to have hid her a bit before he came and before I was through hunting. Back then, I used KOLPIN four bladed twisters (95 gr) and those make HUGE holes and fantastic blood trails.......too bad they stopped making them. When we studied the deer, we noticed that the broadhead was a wreck cuz I had totally destroyed that bone where the shoulder blade and upper leg meet. This also destroyed the arrow along with the broadhead. Speaking of KOLPIN twisters; because they had quite selling them and because I liked them so much, I killed my first deer with a tin can but that'll have to wait for another post and after there has been any interest in hearing about it. I don't wish to hog the thread and GOD forbid I bore anyone.

Thanks for the story TYR, this is EXACTLY why I opened this thread and my invitation still stands on any story (gun or bow) that anyone wishes to share. It just happens to be BOW SEASON right now but that doesn't mean we aren't interested in hearing any hunting story.

[red state]

I only practice using the broad heads the last two weeks just before season starts. Always shoot a bit different than the field points do. -Tyr

TYR, this is the only reason that I like my son's retractable broadheads.....they ARE practice tips till they hit something. Still, I'm extremely happy with my fixed blades. By the way, I may sell David's recurve......he isn't man enough (or dedicated enough) to use it or keep it. He hated to tell me but he said that he probably won't use it cuz he can't shoot it well enough past 20 yards. He can practically strike a match at 70+ yards with his PSE electric blue tournament bow and his ProLine hunting bow but he hasn't the patience or strength to practice enough to get good at longer distances. Heck, I'd love to use it if it wasn't a lefty but with my old crippled left (release hand) there's no way I can smoothly release ANY bow....much less a 60+ pound bow with ZERO let-off. Maybe I can Ebay it and buy one just like it (only right handed).

My son does use fixed blades on his tournament bow cuz it is sited in with 75 gr and we haven't found any 75 gr retractable/expandable broadheads. In fact, I'm going to Ebay right now to see if anyone has any KOLPIN four bladed TWISTERS. I shoot 125 for maximum penatration but those 95 grain TWISTERS would be worth re-setting my bow to. They do a LOT of damage because the four blades are really like eight. The canted/twisted blade placement causes the four blades to twist at a half turn and this action actually persist (to some degree) as it goes through the animal. What a hole! What a blood trail!!! I miss them!

[red state]

OK....found three possibilities for the Kolpin broadheads on EBAY. Not exactly what i was hoping for, however.

Oh yes.....I almost forgot (AGAIN). On my hunting story above....when we were inspecting the deer, there was a distinct cut that was 7 inches long along the top of the deer's back and the hide had stretched open about 3 inches down to clean, un-bloodied meat. I suppose the broadhead was so sharp that it had cut the hide as a doctor would without cutting the meat at all. Amazing! The deer probably thought it had happened upon a swarm of yellow jackets (which is probably the case in most circumstances having to do with the arrow impacting a deer). This is especially true (IF) the arrow has passed cleanly through the deer without touching any of the bones. Very humane way to hunt. A bow kills by cutting and a gun (for the most part) kills by SHOCK of the devastating impact.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

TYR, this is the only reason that I like my son's retractable broadheads.....they ARE practice tips till they hit something. Still, I'm extremely happy with my fixed blades. By the way, I may sell David's recurve......he isn't man enough (or dedicated enough) to use it or keep it. He hated to tell me but he said that he probably won't use it cuz he can't shoot it well enough past 20 yards. He can practically strike a match at 70+ yards with his PSE electric blue tournament bow and his ProLine hunting bow but he hasn't the patience or strength to practice enough to get good at longer distances. Heck, I'd love to use it if it wasn't a lefty but with my old crippled left (release hand) there's no way I can smoothly release ANY bow....much less a 60+ pound bow with ZERO let-off. Maybe I can Ebay it and buy one just like it (only right handed).

My son does use fixed blades on his tournament bow cuz it is sited in with 75 gr and we haven't found any 75 gr retractable/expandable broadheads. In fact, I'm going to Ebay right now to see if anyone has any KOLPIN four bladed TWISTERS. I shoot 125 for maximum penatration but those 95 grain TWISTERS would be worth re-setting my bow to. They do a LOT of damage because the four blades are really like eight. The canted/twisted blade placement causes the four blades to twist at a half turn and this action actually persist (to some degree) as it goes through the animal. What a hole! What a blood trail!!! I miss them!

I have only ever shot two blade on my arrows, nothing fancy and used Howard Hill broad heads except for a couple years that I used Fred Bear broad heads. Bought a huge supply back then and still have a half dozen that have never been used. Two blades all a man needs if he keeps them sharp. Just a simple guy that likes easy simple gear myself. My nephew used to shot all that fancy stuff. I told him go for it its your hunt not mine. The way I look at it if they are into archery more power to them ,which ever way they chose to do it. -Tyr

[logroller]

I only practice using the broad heads the last two weeks just before season starts. Always shoot a bit different than the field points do. Kinda boring shooting deer with a rifle ,no sport in at all for me. Just far too easy. With a bow its not easy. Makes it a challenge. I was once hunting on the ground and got two shots at a big buck. Shot over the buck both times! Even with my aiming lower the second shot my arrow went right over but seemed to nick his fur the second time. Man that sucker took off like a scalded dog. I was shooting my heavy bow and only found one arrow. The other stayed in the woods unless I hit the buck and didn't see it but I could find no sign of blood , was starting to get dark so cut short my arrow finding mission. I had put a new string on that bow the day before and found I had misjudged setting the nock points on the string. Reset them and the high shooting stopped. Dogs, my brother had some of the best rabbit hunting dogs I've ever seen. All beagles except Queenie the very best dog was a daschound mix, half beagle /half daschound. Queenie never lost the trail. Always listened for her yelp even when the other dogs were coming from another direction, the rabbit would always be just in front of Queenie. I hadnt hunted with my brother for about 5 years and his good friend Rex started rabbit hunting with him . Third hunt out Rex shoot Queenie instead of the rabbit . SEEMS QUEENIE WAS ONLY ABOUT 3 OR 4 FEET BEHIND THE RABBIT EMERGING INTO THE CLEARING AND REX NEVER WAS A GREAT SHOT. My brother dearly loved that dog, took it real, real hard. Sold his other dogs and never rabbit hunted again. That was about 14 years ago. Never hunted with Rex again either. -Tyr

That is a tragic story tyr. I'm sad now.

[red state]

I have only ever shot two blade on my arrows, nothing fancy and used Howard Hill broad heads except for a couple years that I used Fred Bear broad heads. Bought a huge supply back then and still have a half dozen that have never been used. Two blades all a man needs if he keeps them sharp. Just a simple guy that likes easy simple gear myself. My nephew used to shot all that fancy stuff. I told him go for it its your hunt not mine. The way I look at it if they are into archery more power to them ,which ever way they chose to do it. -Tyr

Agreed on the simplicity factor but in a way, my son's expendables are having to do with simplicity in the truest form (except for when it comes to resharpinging them.....but, as I've said, I only like my three blade fixed heads when it comes to easy sharpening). The old traditional heads dull quickly and are not as easy to sharpen as mine are. I say this about David's expandable/switch blade heads because he can set his sites for 3D archery tournaments YET also be SPOT ON for when it comes time to screw on hunting heads. Simple....no worries and can swapped out, with confidence, shoot EXACTLY as he does with practice tips (without worry of dulling or losing a hunting head by practicing with it) so this seems to be a win win.

I can shoot either traditional or modern, in any way (whether finger or aid) with any type of broad head (even home made kinds using tin can tops (peach cans seem to do best). HA!!! I believe I've told you that story before but because the KOLPIN twisters were out of business, I had to do something after breaking a few blades so I shot some home made blades and although they would damage after a few rounds of shooting, they did fly extremely well and were easy to sharpen. Heck, even a plain ole tin can can cut ya so it seemed to be fine to try. Well, on one particular evening after work, I tried one. A single old doe came within 15 yards so I let one fly. I was a bit worried that it may not work BUT after hearing her burn through the brush and hearing a LOUD crash, I knew it worked. She had gone 75 yards (the average run that my deer go after being shot) and she was going down hill all the way and had just made it across the creek that came from my bass lake. I've not used a tin can again but it is a cheap alternative to buying more blades when that time comes. If I ever start my traditional career of hunting (with bows I've made) I'll most assuredly make my own broad heads. That, my friend, is going all out in being traditional.

Seriously though, we should either make our own stuff or be happy with those who only wish to be the best they can in providing food and taking an animal down cleanly. I can and do appreciate those who shoot traditional and, in a way, I too am a traditionalist. I have used the very heads you mentioned and still have some Fred Bear specials in their original package. I hate to use them out of sentimental reasons so I opened one pack and saved the other. I have also used (and still have) the following hunting heads: Hill's Hornet (two blade) glue-on with modern glue-in twist-on inserts for carbon arrows. VINTAGE BEAR mentioned above....with two blades and two small razor blade inserts BUT (I just use the two blades as they fly better without the thin, smaller razor insert blades). I even have some single welded BOD~KIN four blades that fire true and are virtually indestructible. BY THE WAY, what do you have against carbon arrows? The wood ones that you use and the cedar ones that my son uses for his Samick Sage break easy and must be kept dry. The feathers go bad quickly whereas carbon arrows are VERY true flying arrows and are extremely tough. I've used aluminum but they also bend and break fairly easily. I've reused ONE carbon arrow for killing many deer cuz they are so tough and although I like turkey feathers, they truly can't compete with the plastic vanes for accuracy and endurance under ALL weather (wind, rain, sleet). I HATE turkey feathers for when it's raining and don't dare let it rain and then go cold quickly cuz that makes them freeze and unshootable. Plastic vanes can simply be thumped to knock the ice off and they dry in seconds. So, to me that is much more SIMPLE to use than the traditional wood ones with glue on nocks, glue on heads and delicate feathers that require much more work to "set" (if) your equipment needs minor adjustments or to keep from damage. I guess I'm being difficult because I wasn't able to go hunting this mornin' and with my daughter having another game tonight will not get to go tonight. HA!!! Still, I do have good argument to bring to the table and am only trying to keep this interesting.

Look forward to your reply.....AND, if you're able, HAPPY HUNTIN'

[red state]

Well, This young lady, one of my daughter's best friend, who goes to the same church as we do and lives just down the road got her a 7pt-r the other day!!! A few years ago, she bagged a really nice 19-20 inch spread 8 pt (I think) I don't have those photos any more but do remember it being a "shooter" in my book and that's a pretty good book. HA! Good job Marissa!!!!

[red state]

3 more months!!!! and I plan to take a deer with my home-made bows this Fall. Time to pluck the feathers from some of the turkey mounts I've taken and ready-up some arrows with Magnus two-bladed broadheads. I've recently lost one Magnus cuz I'm a bit new to the hot-melt glue. I suppose I wasn't liberal enough in distributing the stuff and one of my broadheads is now deep in the ground after finding a root. I once shot 3D but now all I shoot at is a small white coffee cup (suspended from a stick or string). Once upon a time, I had a dog that would fetch my arrows from the pond after shooting at small, floating objects. I did this so as never to dull a blade. The only problem was with the dog grabbing the fletching from time to time.

Tyr, I have that bow for Dustin but it is now dusty and I'm sure he'd be better off with one of my other ones. I have made many but I am partial to Juniper bows cuz I've not had one to blow up on me and they have a great deal of SNAP. I don't have any Boddock around here or else I'd make one from that type wood. I made a very (VERY) short bow for a neighbor a few weeks ago and I've asked him every Sunday if this 56" Juniper has exploded on him yet. He says it hasn't but continually brags about how it spits his carbon arrows. He plans to take several hogs and deer with it. As it is Juniper, it truly is a beautiful bow indeed. I made a 60+" Juniper bow for a friend who is 6'7" and a 32" draw. Now that was one gorgeous bow and I hated to part with it. I test shot it for well over 200+ shots. Had I not cut it down for tournament shooting, I would have loved to have kept it heavier for hunting (and for myself). It was smooth, comfortable and had plenty of riser for bow fishing, quivers and even site pins. I don't shoot all that now (hope you're proud, TYR) but I was really hitting consistently up to 25yds with that bow. I got a bit shakey at 30 & 35 and could randomly hit at 40+ yds but with more practice, the proper arrows and the proper poundage/draw for me......I'm certain I could have gotten really good with that extremely quiet bow.

At any rate, it is almost time to get all the dust off and get out in the heat, ticks and briars. I'm gonna hit the woods with MY bow, my arrows and possibly my broadheads that I've made (if I don't lazy-out and use the very dependable Magnus two-blades). I've killed a deer with my "tin-can" broadhead but it is so much easier to simply glue on the store-bought ones. HA!!!

Tyr, we're gonna have to get together some time and go stompin'.

[red state]

Oh....just to clarify; I'm long bow all the way none of my bows are recure (although a few have reflex tips). My son still has that Korean Samick Sage recurve and is quite good with it up to 30 yds BUT one simply can't beat the simplicity and smoothness of a reliable LONG BOW! So much more fun to shoot than compounds. Ya can't compete with the SPEED & accuracy of compounds but they are so blasted loud.

To Granny or anyone else here who shoots or to all those interested in picking archery up (like JEFF) put in your 2cents and we'll have a great topic.

[red state]

[QUOTE=Jeff;655309]

Jeff, I've always told folks to not make the same mistakes that I've made over the many years of hunting (or, in general, bow hunting). One of these mistakes is to believe that you need some sort of a plantation or THOUSANDS of gov. land to hunt. This simply isn't true and if you have ONE acre in the right spot....you can do FAR better on that one acre than with thousands of mediocre acres. In fact,

As for laws in hunting FROM or around houses or other structures, we can get into legalities if you like. I don't agree with such things (unless you plan to hunt just 20 yards from your street light. HA! I know an ole redneck boy who brags about the deer around his house where they feed under the street light. He says he's killed many of them while they ate the acorns at night. I frown on such things and usually just listen to him. I knew that he'd eventually wear out his welcome.....and he did by killing the 15 to 20 or so deer that he once had coming to his house. Still, I don't agree with stupid laws and one of them is in what you have mentioned. If you have a house in the middle of nowhere and wish to take a deer (without going out in the weather) I'm all for it (if you take the deer honorably). I am also against laws that are unConstitutional (such as the NO LOADED GUN during deer season law). Many folks can't afford a pistol or simply don't like them and may have a rifle for self preservation. This idiotic law was made for "bad apples" and to make it easier for game officials to catch "bad apples". It is also another way to create "revenue" so I have no doubts about the unConstitutionality of this law. Another law that I can't stand is the "primitive weapon" law. In some States, it is highly illegal to take a crossbow during "primitive weapon" season......and even during the RIFLE SEASON. Some States have gotten better but most still "regulate" crossbows unfairly. I suspect this is so it would be easier for a game official to HEAR what one is doing and as we all know, a crossbow is a GREAT mid-range weapon with virtually NO sound. I prefer a bow but I also like a crossbow ever since I got one for my son (who was too young for a 45 or 50 cal muzzle-loader). I HATE muzzle loaders by the way....never could shoot one well enough to have confidence. This brings me to my next point about crossbow regulations. They highly regulate crossbows YET allow single shot, long distance RIFLES during primitive/so-called muzzle loader season and this is plain WRONG and highly STUPID. I know I have ranted on but, Jeff, you brought legality up so I wanted to deal with that. This thread is truly for anything that one would like to ask or share with others.

Jeff, you mentioned that you are a first time bow hunter so I'd suggest you ask yourself a few questions first:
One: How serious am I on this quest?
Two: What type bow would I enjoy more?
Three: What am I willing to invest?

My reply to question #1 would be in a bit of advice. If you do ANYTHING, do it to the best of your ability. This means getting a bow that you are comfortable with and practice, Practice, PRACTICE. Know you're limits in cost, time and ability. You don't have to get "the best" but you need to take it serious enough to avoid JUNK.
As for question #2, I'd suggest you try a few bows out (especially if you have friends who bowhunt already). If not, you can always talk with a dealer. Many will even allow you to shoot a few bows and let you be the judge. As for the types of bows, there are far too many to discuss at this point but you have two main catagories to consider: TRADITIONAL and Modern. Each have sub-catogories but you'll need to know if you want to hold a bow that man held long ago or use an item that may provide more benefits (and I do hate using the word benefits but that is exactly the case). With traditional bows such as recurve, long bow and a few others in between, you'll definitely need to practice more and get in shape more cuz the bow is part of you and relies ONLY on your strength, consintration and natural ability. You can equipt such bows with modern "xtras" but you'll still need to practice pulling it back and holding it steady with a mastery of the same, exact release each time. Otherwise, you need to forget about it. The better choice that renders more benefit with less amount of time or physical ability would be modern bows such as compounds. They can be simplified depending on "let-off" or doing without all the bells and whistles OR you can go all out and bolt just about everything imaginable to them with as high a "LET OFF" as 90%. Let-off is that amount that the bow will assist in holding at full draw and usually kicks in during the drawing process. I can shoot instinctively with ALL forms of archery or use the most advanced systems but I prefer a 60# Darton Excell at 65%-75% let-off for hunting or tournament shooting. I've taken many deer with this particular brand and videoed quite a bit of these hunts (including a nice, unusually beautiful 8pt with 6" brow tines). I've also taken many deer with a 55-60lbs Martin Lynx and a beautiful (but expensive) Martin Maverick at 90# with 80% let-off. I sold both because I prefer the simplicity, speed, smoothness and reliability of the DARTONS (made in Michigan I believe). Anyway, you've got a lot of research to do and little time to apply everything you need before mid-Sept or OCTOBER. As a general rule.....especially with your just now getting into this, I'd suggest a second hand bow on Ebay and practice at TWICE the distance that you're willing to actually make on a deer. You may get VERY good at 30 yds (for example) but a lot comes into play when a deer walks up....especially if that deer is a monster. HA!!! So, at 30yds of practice, I'd try for a 12-15 yard shot at a deer. In fact, most of my deer have been taken at 12 yards. As thick as it gets around here, I don't like those longer, "IFY" shots. Too much can happen and I'd rather play it safe and see or hear one go down (rather than spend all day or all night looking for an animal that was not shot within a perfect kill zone). If you plan to go the TYR route and use a two sticks and a string, I would like to say that I bought my son a Samich sage two Christmas's ago and it is a cheap, brand new bow that shoots surprisingly well....just don't get one with too much muscle because it'll take a great deal of muscle. HA! 45 pounds is PLENTY to kill a deer and if you've never shot before....you'll quickly feel that 45 pounds after practicing. HA!!!!

Anyway, thanks for posting....If I can help in any way, I'll certainly do so.

PS: below is a Samick Sage (South Korean Bow) Of course, Tyr has some OLDIES but GOODIES that cost 10 times what this brand new one costs.

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I truly appreciate the advice because just like ya said ya walk into the sport store and they have a thousand different types of Bows and if ya aren't familiar with them they all look foreign to me, but I have a buddy down here that is into Bow hunting and has offered to let me try his bows like you he has high dollar and older ones and again like you he said ya need to shoot them to feel what is comfortable to me, he says all the time a $500 Bow may work well for one but the other guy may do better with the cheap one ( or a more expensive one ) so I guess I will head up to see him and see how they feel, again thanks for the advice and I will keep ya posted on my success or lack of

Jeff, did you ever find a good comfortable (AND CONSISTENT) bow? The season may have started in your area already and it starts this coming weekend here. I plan to use one of three bows that I've made. I have arrows that I've made but will probably strip my carbons down and put feathers one them from ole toms that I've killed. All three shoot really well and I've even been shooting 5" plastic vanes in them. Tyr can tell you that it is sometimes difficult to get an aluminum arrow (especially without actual feathers) to shoot well but these bows even shoot them off the shelf of the bow with grace and beauty. They are a bit weaker than I had originally planned to make but they are smooth to the draw and don't wear me out shooting them. I may actually place some old traditional heads that I've had for years and hunt the aluminum/plastic vane arrows since they're shooting so well. I put one of the three bladed [welded] broadheads from YESTERYEAR on one of my 2115 XX Eastons after our homecoming at church a while ago and it shot exceptionally well. Too hot to keep shooting so I stopped after 15 or 20 rounds. Inside to stay now. HA! No church tonight and I may grab a long nap after all that preachin', singing and GOOD, Good, good food!

The bow I like the most from the three I've built is the Juniper bow. It has the best snap to it and is just a tad higher in poundage. It isn't as smooth to achieve full draw but I can really hit with it. Gonna try and show my son out this coming weekend. He just bought a $1,000 PSE X-Force that is SUPER fast (one of the fastest bows I've EVER seen) and I got a bit angry with him. You see, I bought him that Samack Sage three Christmas' ago and he can hit very well with it but has yet to kill a deer with it and seems to have no intentions of using it (for now anyway). I may keep one or two of my compounds for old tyme sake but I am determined to kill my very first deer with a bow that MICHAEL made. I told my son that his is probably 50times faster than mine but mine is much smoother, a great deal stealthier and is MUCH easier to make. HA!!! I'd hate to have to try and build a bow like his.....the blame thing is half rifle. He can shoot LITERALLY the same pin at 40 yards!!! It is that flat! Almost seems unfair to the deer when you see him get half inch to an inch groups (consistently) at 70 yds.

Well, if you need any more info on a bow I'm here for ya. I still say that the Samick Sage is your best option. Pound for pound, I feel that they are one of the BEST bows out there. They're fast, quiet and fit within a 14" X 10" carry case which is fantastic for a biker such as yourself. They are a nice looking bow on top of that so spend the $130 - $150 bucks for one (with string, case and other stuff with this great deal/price).

Hope everyone who goes out this weekend with bow and arrow gets them some fine table fare for the family...nuthin' like fresh, home-made deer jerky for Monday Nite Football!!!!

[Elessar]

I have hunted with both bow and rifle - both of which I had to give up due to knee and back problems.

I firmly believe it takes far more skill to be even mildly successful with a bow than a firearm.

When I did hunt, I always 'still-hunted' - not having the patience to sit in a stand or blind for
hours on end.

[red state]

I have hunted with both bow and rifle - both of which I had to give up due to knee and back problems.

I firmly believe it takes far more skill to be even mildly successful with a bow than a firearm.

When I did hunt, I always 'still-hunted' - not having the patience to sit in a stand or blind for
hours on end.

You are correct on all counts.....and WELCOME to Debate Policy. You may be an old member coming back or a new one but since I'm not familiar with you, I wanted to reach out and wish you the best. Anyway, I find it hard to sit or stand for very long but our deer around here are so heavily hunted and "educated" it makes it almost impossible to get a shot off while slipping. I've done it, mind you, but it is a rare thing (and I'm a darn good injun sneak). I now hunt only with bows that I've made and haven't hunted with a rifle in YEARS (possibly 7 or more). There is a joy I get in crafting my own bow and actually hunting with it. Haven't killed a deer with traditional equipment yet but I have killed a few other things (including stumps). HA!! I'm looking for some good Bodock wood (THE BEST) but have found that Dogwood, Juniper, Red Heart Elm and Huckaberry make GREAT bows....and they are less trouble than Bodock (which usually requires a deep cutting down of outside layers). Huckaberry is VERY dense, tough, plyable and rot resistant but they are hard to find for a solid, one-piece bow. They work great if making a takedown. In fact, I found one a few weeks ago that I plan to hunt with next year. it is 14 hands of limb + two hands of riser, very straight and even has natural deflex in addition to both limbs recurving 6 inches at the tips. It should make a great bow but I'll have to be careful while building it. You can eat the fruit off of 'Huckleberry' and I personally find them tasty.

Truthfully, I haven't been hunting much at all this year. I don't know if it is a turning of the page or if I've simply not made as much an effort. I do know that much of it has to do with my son not hunting much.

Well, I hope you can get your back and knee problems sorted out so you can get back out in the woods. At one time of my life, I was fairly big on shooting deer with a video camera while scouting.....this may be something to consider.

Kind regards,

~RED