Tired of your shat dude--fj - prove my racism here!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Hell, You been accusing me of racism so long that I am tired of it invading almost every thread that I dare post on the subject of muslims, current events, the bambastard or the lousy dems and their leeches.
Well, here is a thread where you can post all your proof of my blatant racism and I can answer your false accusations.
Bring it down here because it is just ffing up the threads up there top boards.

Ball is in your court right here - shoot or dribble fj. -Tyr

[fj1200]

Racism charge

Why two threads?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Racism charge

Why two threads?

That thread is there for commenting and still active.
I authored this thread for you to prove my racism you so love to accuse me of.
If you do not offer proof here then why even respond?
This is the cage and I am here to hash this out without ffing up threads on the top boards.
Either you do it here or else abandon it up there because its getting really old to me to be libeled like that.

I will not discuss that thread here since I already answered there.

Man up dude or stop the damn libel..
Play or else continue your spins and run arounds but you declaration of victory when you have proven nothing to any rational unbiased person
isn't going to cut it Hoss.. -Tyr

[fj1200]

There is plenty unanswered here:

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?46355-Racism-charge-A-HANDY-TOOL-FOR-COWARDS-LIBS-AND-ASSHATS-DEMS

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

There is plenty unanswered here:

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?46355-Racism-charge-A-HANDY-TOOL-FOR-COWARDS-LIBS-AND-ASSHATS-DEMS

Told you dude, state your case . I am not going to answer again what I already answered there.
You want me to answer again , then ask again , don't give me a damn link to a thread that is still active..

List the damn proof our else stop wasting my time..
You issue a broad and unfounded accusation then want to use broad and unfounded comments you made attempting to back up the first mistake!

That is not going to cut it here HOSS.

I will not give blanket validation to your comments by agreeing to that crap..

Cite your proof here not your damn broad accusation rehashed ..

PROOF
Look up the definition if need be.. Apparently it is need be..

[fj1200]

Apparently we'll need to start from the beginning because you didn't really answer anything there.

... the statistics showing that blacks more prone to stealing, drug dealing and violence.

racism: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Do you believe that race is the primary determinant of criminal behavior?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

[QUOTE]

Apparently we'll need to start from the beginning because you didn't really answer anything there.



racism: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Do you believe that race is the primary determinant of criminal behavior?[/QUOTE

]

the statistics showing that blacks more prone to stealing, drug dealing and violence.

FBI stats back that up , so either prove it is wrong or give up.
Ok , just prove another race has higher crime stats per population ratio..
If not then you just lost the first volley. -Tyr

Do you believe that race is the primary determinant of criminal behavior?

I never said race was, I did say the black culture was . The two are not the same thing.. Additionally you read whatever intent you wanted into my statement. The black culture glorifies crime. Their rap music glorifies crime and killing cops too.

[fj1200]

FBI stats back that up , so either prove it is wrong or give up.
Ok , just prove another race has higher crime stats per population ratio..
If not then you just lost the first volley. -Tyr


I never said race was, I did say the black culture was . The two are not the same thing.. Additionally you read whatever intent you wanted into my statement. The black culture glorifies crime. Their rap music glorifies crime and killing cops too.

It's good to see that you are finally backing away from your statement, in your original post your references to them as a people outnumbered your references to culture by a 4 to 1 margin though. I do think though that you're using your "culture" reference as cover considering your statement to needing a "couple more centuries to advance." As I posted before I never disputed the crime statistics, they are what they are but they don't show that "being black" is the cause of those statistics. I posted these before but you haven't chosen to show where they are wrong.

The rise of the welfare state in the 1960s contributed greatly to the demise of the black family as a stable institution. The out-of-wedlock birth rate among African Americans today is 73%, three times higher than it was prior to the War on Poverty. Children raised in fatherless homes are far more likely to grow up poor and to eventually engage in criminal behavior, than their peers who are raised in two-parent homes. In 2010, blacks (approximately 13% of the U.S. population) accounted for 48.7% of all arrests for homicide, 31.8% of arrests for forcible rape, 33.5% of arrests for aggravated assault, and 55% of arrests for robbery. Also as of 2010, the black poverty rate was 27.4% (about 3 times higher than the white rate), meaning that 11.5 million blacks in the U.S. were living in poverty.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/v...ry.asp?id=1672

A review of the empirical evidence in the professional literature of the social sciences gives policymakers an insight into the root causes of crime. Consider, for instance:

• Over the past thirty years, the rise in violent crime parallels the rise in families abandoned by fathers.
• High-crime neighborhoods are characterized by high concentrations of families abandoned by fathers.
• State-by-state analysis by Heritage scholars indicates that a 10 percent increase in the percentage of children living in single-parent homes leads typically to a 17 percent increase in juvenile crime.
• The rate of violent teenage crime corresponds with the number of families abandoned by fathers.
• The type of aggression and hostility demonstrated by a future criminal often is foreshadowed in unusual aggressiveness as early as age five or six.
• The future criminal tends to be an individual rejected by other children as early as the first grade who goes on to form his own group of friends, often the future delinquent gang.

On the other hand:

• Neighborhoods with a high degree of religious practice are not high-crime neighborhoods.
• Even in high-crime inner-city neighborhoods, well over 90 percent of children from safe, stable homes do not become delinquents. By contrast only 10 percent of children from unsafe, unstable homes in these neighborhoods avoid crime.
• Criminals capable of sustaining marriage gradually move away from a life of crime after they get married.
• The mother's strong affectionate attachment to her child is the child's best buffer against a life of crime.
• The father's authority and involvement in raising his children are also a great buffer against a life of crime.

The scholarly evidence, in short, suggests that at the heart of the explosion of crime in America is the loss of the capacity of fathers and mothers to be responsible in caring for the children they bring into the world. This loss of love and guidance at the intimate levels of marriage and family has broad social consequences for children and for the wider community. The empirical evidence shows that too many young men and women from broken families tend to have a much weaker sense of connection with their neighborhood and are prone to exploit its members to satisfy their unmet needs or desires. This contributes to a loss of a sense of community and to the disintegration of neighborhoods into social chaos and violent crime. If policymakers are to deal with the root causes of crime, therefore, they must deal with the rapid rise of illegitimacy.

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...-violent-crime

Teenagers tend to be low skilled. They lack the experience, knowledge and maturity of adults. That means they will be the primary victims of a minimum wage law. But why are black teens more heavily impacted than white teens? Black teens are far more likely to come from broken homes and attend some of the worst schools in the nation. Therefore, a law that discriminates against the employment of low-skilled workers will have a greater impact on black workers. Moreover, the minimum wage subsidizes racial discrimination. After all, if you must pay $7.25 an hour to whomever you hire, you might as well hire people you like the most, even if they are of identical skill.

http://www.creators.com/conservative...our-youth.html

So what is the problem; "culture" or government program?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

[QUOTE]

Quote Originally Posted by Tyr-Ziu Saxnot View Post

FBI stats back that up , so either prove it is wrong or give up.
Ok , just prove another race has higher crime stats per population ratio..
If not then you just lost the first volley.


I never said race was, I did say the black culture was . The two are not the same thing.. Additionally you read whatever intent you wanted into my statement. The black culture glorifies crime. Their rap music glorifies crime and killing cops too.
It's good to see that you are finally backing away from your statement, in your original post your references to them as a people outnumbered your references to culture by a 4 to 1 margin though. I do think though that you're using your "culture" reference as cover considering your statement to needing a "couple more centuries to advance." As I posted before I never disputed the crime statistics, they are what they are but they don't show that "being black" is the cause of those statistics. I posted these before but you haven't chosen to show where they are wrong.

The rise of the welfare state in the 1960s contributed greatly to the demise of the black family as a stable institution. The out-of-wedlock birth rate among African Americans today is 73%, three times higher than it was prior to the War on Poverty. Children raised in fatherless homes are far more likely to grow up poor and to eventually engage in criminal behavior, than their peers who are raised in two-parent homes. In 2010, blacks (approximately 13% of the U.S. population) accounted for 48.7% of all arrests for homicide, 31.8% of arrests for forcible rape, 33.5% of arrests for aggravated assault, and 55% of arrests for robbery. Also as of 2010, the black poverty rate was 27.4% (about 3 times higher than the white rate), meaning that 11.5 million blacks in the U.S. were living in poverty. http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/v...ry.asp?id=1672





A review of the empirical evidence in the professional literature of the social sciences gives policymakers an insight into the root causes of crime. Consider, for instance:

•Over the past thirty years, the rise in violent crime parallels the rise in families abandoned by fathers.
•High-crime neighborhoods are characterized by high concentrations of families abandoned by fathers.
•State-by-state analysis by Heritage scholars indicates that a 10 percent increase in the percentage of children living in single-parent homes leads typically to a 17 percent increase in juvenile crime.
•The rate of violent teenage crime corresponds with the number of families abandoned by fathers.
•The type of aggression and hostility demonstrated by a future criminal often is foreshadowed in unusual aggressiveness as early as age five or six.
•The future criminal tends to be an individual rejected by other children as early as the first grade who goes on to form his own group of friends, often the future delinquent gang.


On the other hand:


•Neighborhoods with a high degree of religious practice are not high-crime neighborhoods.
•Even in high-crime inner-city neighborhoods, well over 90 percent of children from safe, stable homes do not become delinquents. By contrast only 10 percent of children from unsafe, unstable homes in these neighborhoods avoid crime.
•Criminals capable of sustaining marriage gradually move away from a life of crime after they get married.
•The mother's strong affectionate attachment to her child is the child's best buffer against a life of crime.
•The father's authority and involvement in raising his children are also a great buffer against a life of crime.


The scholarly evidence, in short, suggests that at the heart of the explosion of crime in America is the loss of the capacity of fathers and mothers to be responsible in caring for the children they bring into the world. This loss of love and guidance at the intimate levels of marriage and family has broad social consequences for children and for the wider community. The empirical evidence shows that too many young men and women from broken families tend to have a much weaker sense of connection with their neighborhood and are prone to exploit its members to satisfy their unmet needs or desires. This contributes to a loss of a sense of community and to the disintegration of neighborhoods into social chaos and violent crime. If policymakers are to deal with the root causes of crime, therefore, they must deal with the rapid rise of illegitimacy. http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...-violent-crime





Teenagers tend to be low skilled. They lack the experience, knowledge and maturity of adults. That means they will be the primary victims of a minimum wage law. But why are black teens more heavily impacted than white teens? Black teens are far more likely to come from broken homes and attend some of the worst schools in the nation. Therefore, a law that discriminates against the employment of low-skilled workers will have a greater impact on black workers. Moreover, the minimum wage subsidizes racial discrimination. After all, if you must pay $7.25 an hour to whomever you hire, you might as well hire people you like the most, even if they are of identical skill. http://www.creators.com/conservative...our-youth.html

So what is the problem; "culture" or government program?


An essential of Thatcherism:

But more importantly, she instinctively knew that complicity with torture was an affront to everything that Britain stands for – above all, our respect for tolerance, decency and the rule of law.

Lets get this orderly shall we ?
I had three important ideas when making that post, none of which were racist.

1. Intent, --my intent was to present factual evidence to back up my statements about blacks and high crime/high violence
2. Give FBI CRIME STATS
3. Adding in the Black culture aspect

Now you just admitted you do not dispute the FBI STATS
+1 FOR ME
Next you seized upon my comment that included black culture and you went on to validate that to.
+1 FOR ME

Now we are left with my intent. Did I intend for my comments to offend blacks?
Answer is no , but my intent was present the truth regardless of whom it would affect either positively or negatively.
For Truth stands on its own IMHO.
So unless you can prove my intent was to degrade and piss off blacks you lose that one as well SO--
+1 FOR ME

Now refute that with evidence or just call me a damn liar too.
Either way you lose Hoss and logic plus evidence shows you
ran with your interpretation without even asking questions to
get to either the truth or my intent..

My stand is I present truth and have no concern who does or does not like it. -Tyr

[DragonStryk72]

[QUOTE=Tyr-Ziu Saxnot;702659]

Lets get this orderly shall we ?
I had three important ideas when making that post, none of which were racist.

1. Intent, --my intent was to present factual evidence to back up my statements about blacks and high crime/high violence
2. Give FBI CRIME STATS
3. Adding in the Black culture aspect

Now you just admitted you do not dispute the FBI STATS
+1 FOR ME
Next you seized upon my comment that included black culture and you went on to validate that to.
+1 FOR ME

Now we are left with my intent. Did I intend for my comments to offend blacks?
Answer is no , but my intent was present the truth regardless of whom it would affect either positively or negatively.
For Truth stands on its own IMHO.
So unless you can prove my intent was to degrade and piss off blacks you lose that one as well SO--
+1 FOR ME

Now refute that with evidence or just call me a damn liar too.
Either way you lose Hoss and logic plus evidence shows you
ran with your interpretation without even asking questions to
get to either the truth or my intent..

My stand is I present truth and have no concern who does or does not like it. -Tyr

Unintentional racism, is still racism. Now let's talk about Arabs, all of whom you've lumped together, as well.

Actually, I don't think you're aware of how racist you really are, Tyr. and you're showing it again in this thread without knowing it. I'm sorry, you may not like, but FJ is correct. Intent doesn't matter for shit. If I burn down your house, how much do you REALLY care about my intent? It certainly doesn't make the go back up, so sorry, no, no point for intent.

He didn't agree with you on the stats, Tyr, as another point, he just didn't argue them, and no, he didn't validate your comment on black culture.

[Gunny]

[QUOTE=DragonStryk72;702790]

Unintentional racism, is still racism. Now let's talk about Arabs, all of whom you've lumped together, as well.

Actually, I don't think you're aware of how racist you really are, Tyr. and you're showing it again in this thread without knowing it. I'm sorry, you may not like, but FJ is correct. Intent doesn't matter for shit. If I burn down your house, how much do you REALLY care about my intent? It certainly doesn't make the go back up, so sorry, no, no point for intent.

He didn't agree with you on the stats, Tyr, as another point, he just didn't argue them, and no, he didn't validate your comment on black culture.

You people make e laugh. So calling a spade a spade is "racist"? Bull. It isn't racist to state that per statistical data, blacks commit more crimes than white. The charge of racism is running away from the truth of the stats instead of addressing them.

When minorities glorify themselves or play victim by race, that's okay. But if they are called on their actions by race, it's "racism". Complete bull.

[jimnyc]

I go back to what I said a few weeks back which got me in trouble - but it's the stone cold truth - go to ANY forum out there, post NOTHING more than simple statistics. 9 out of 10 times you will be labeled a racist. Quite frankly, a lot of these statistics make me pause, but that doesn't make me a racist. Pointing out that 13% of the nation commit over 50% of the crimes is a fact, not racist.

Unless of course, I point out the white percentage and crime percentage, and am also a racist for pointing out those facts.

Fact is, a lot of people don't like to see/hear about such statistics, as it's "taboo" to many, so we hide from it and ignore it. Well, some do, I don't.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

[QUOTE=DragonStryk72;702790]

Unintentional racism, is still racism. Now let's talk about Arabs, all of whom you've lumped together, as well.

Actually, I don't think you're aware of how racist you really are, Tyr. and you're showing it again in this thread without knowing it. I'm sorry, you may not like, but FJ is correct. Intent doesn't matter for shit. If I burn down your house, how much do you REALLY care about my intent? It certainly doesn't make the go back up, so sorry, no, no point for intent.

He didn't agree with you on the stats, Tyr, as another point, he just didn't argue them, and no, he didn't validate your comment on black culture.

First, NO, we will not talk about-Arabs--because we are discussing fj calling me a racist on my comments about blacks. I've made very few comments about Arabs -so perhaps you are confusing my comments about muslim scum , which are a religion not a race or ethnic identity.

Next he did concede the point on FBI STATS so your next shot was a blank too.

That's two for two--no better than he did..
Then he posted affirmation that validated my black culture comment.

And why did you jump in even before he replied?
Just curious ,you can answer or not but Ive seen this happen too many times over these last few years. Each time when I was winning by using the truth. Seems some here ever so dearly hate to read it.

Now if you are just itching to castigate me on my damn muslim comments start another thread here in the cage--I'll answer that aspect in that thread not this one.
I find your comment about --"the Arabs' --to be silly when this is about a racism accusation made against me for comments I made about American blacks and Arabs I've only ever criticized due to their embrace of Islam-which is a religion not a damn race!
Seems too many confuse racism with criticism of religion , last time I checked a religion is not a race...

No, you do not get to come here and try to spin it into another erroneous accusation, if so hell-bent to accusing me again--please start another thread here in the cage. And don't worry, I can handle replying to two false bullshit accusations..

This ain't my first rodeo, Hoss! -Tyr

Lets get this orderly shall we ?
I had three important ideas when making that post, none of which were racist.

1. Intent, --my intent was to present factual evidence to back up my statements about blacks and high crime/high violence
2. Give FBI CRIME STATS
3. Adding in the Black culture aspect

Now you just admitted you do not dispute the FBI STATS
+1 FOR ME
Next you seized upon my comment that included black culture and you went on to validate that to.
+1 FOR ME

^^^^ This is where he and I were when you jumped in, so address this post directly with any refutation you care to present or else you and I are done in this thread. Of course feel free to start that Arab--thread if you like..

[fj1200]

You people make e laugh. So calling a spade a spade is "racist"? Bull. It isn't racist to state that per statistical data, blacks commit more crimes than white. The charge of racism is running away from the truth of the stats instead of addressing them.

When minorities glorify themselves or play victim by race, that's okay. But if they are called on their actions by race, it's "racism". Complete bull.

No. Correct, true. Sometimes, I have no problem addressing the stats but the stats don't address causation.

It shouldn't be OK. True, I think.

Fact is, a lot of people don't like to see/hear about such statistics, as it's "taboo" to many, so we hide from it and ignore it. Well, some do, I don't.

As I've said before citing FBI crime statistics isn't racist but the mistake is in reading race as to be the cause of crime.

Unintentional racism, is still racism.

Interesting thought. I don't necessarily agree with it depending on how you mean it. That is definitely one of the types of discrimination in the Civil Rights Act; disparate impact I think.

[fj1200]

Lets get this orderly shall we ?
I had three important ideas when making that post, none of which were racist.

1. Intent, --my intent was to present factual evidence to back up my statements about blacks and high crime/high violence
2. Give FBI CRIME STATS
3. Adding in the Black culture aspect

Now you just admitted you do not dispute the FBI STATS
+1 FOR ME
Next you seized upon my comment that included black culture and you went on to validate that to.
+1 FOR ME

Now we are left with my intent. Did I intend for my comments to offend blacks?
Answer is no , but my intent was present the truth regardless of whom it would affect either positively or negatively.
For Truth stands on its own IMHO.
So unless you can prove my intent was to degrade and piss off blacks you lose that one as well SO--
+1 FOR ME

Now refute that with evidence or just call me a damn liar too.
Either way you lose Hoss and logic plus evidence shows you
ran with your interpretation without even asking questions to
get to either the truth or my intent..

My stand is I present truth and have no concern who does or does not like it. -Tyr

1. Intent huh? Yeah, we'll go with that. You are not exactly well known for going to FBI crime stats when you get going on one of your posts.
2. See #1. Although I do reject their validity as it relates to the charge as presented in this thread.
3. I see you pointing out that culture was an afterthought to your argument.

Regardless of what you believe your intent to be the words, as you posted them, were racist. But let's go with your culture argument for a moment; Culture, I've heard it said, is learned. Where did blacks learn this culture?

Now, to your claims of "winning" points:

I didn't JUST admit that I don't dispute the FBI stats, I've never disputed them and have specifically stated that they say what they say. I do dispute that the stats speak to the cause of crime.
+0 for you
I went beyond the FBI stats to look at actual causation.
+1 for me
You still haven't addressed my links.
-1 for you
I seized on your culture comment? No, I pointed out that I disagree that it lets the rest of your post off the hook.
-1 for you

Your intent... I don't know how you can read that post and think that a black person wouldn't be offended. You didn't present any truth in that post other than what I think I've shown it to be. Now, I've got a couple of open issues out there that I don't think have been answered.

Do you believe that race is the primary determinant of criminal behavior?

What say you on the links that I've provided that speak to your stats?