Iraq war, Saddam, Bush Admin ...again

[Black Diamond]

False dichotomy. They could have made a mistake. Or at least Bush could have.

Or they could be in Syria and bush just decided not to bring up that possibility, instead conceding there weren't any. He didn't exactly exude strength.

[revelarts]

False dichotomy. They could have made a mistake. Or at least Bush could have.

Like i said, from what i've seen it went past mistake.

[Gunny]

And the joke from the Army Officer and Dr. who after Gulf W1 went around Iraq for a more than a year labeling and destroying tons of those WMD stashes is that he and many of his unit are sick and dying from doing that job.

again bottom line is by 2001-2002 the intel community and the key officials knew all that former stash of WMD crap was basically nill, the destroyed, the amounts were basically bill and that practically useless. AND that since Gulf W1 he had NOT "reconstituted" any WMD programs.
One of the UK officials RESIGNED and said as much at the begging of the war.
And again to date we still haven't found all these TONS of WMDs folks.
and Now even Bush Chenney and Blair all admit the WMDs weren't their.
either they are lying now or they where lying then, choose what you like but you can't have it both ways.


"Now, look, I didn’t — part of the reason we went into Iraq was — the main reason we went into Iraq at the time was we thought he had weapons of mass destruction. It turns out he didn’t..."
GW Bush

Bottom line is, you don't know what you're talking about. I was in the First Gulf War. We didn't go more than 25 miles into Iraq. SO whoever you think went around destroying WMDs must have been phantoms.

Bush, Blair and Cheney did not admit the WMDs weren't there. They admitted they didn't find them. Completely different scenarios.

In either case, why is it it takes a Pearl Harbor or a 9/11 to wake people like you up? You're all outraged, you cry for the government to do something, then when they do, you spend 15 years bitching about what YOU asked for. Why on Earth do ostriches like you stick your head in the sand and pretend the bad guys aren't bad guys because they aren't in your back yard? I'd much rather take them out in THEIR yard before they get any traction.

Then there're a people like you with the lamest of lame arguments. You can't get around the fact we sold the WMDs to Saddam and he DID use them. End of story.

Besides all that, how about you catch up to speed? Bush isn't running for President. He hasn't been President for over 7 years. Why is it we couldn't dare question Clinton the day Bush was declared winner (before he even took office) and everything became his fault and 7 years later of Obama it's STILL Bush's fault? I suppose ISIS is Bush's fault when it didn't even exist during his administration?

[revelarts]

Besides all that, how about you catch up to speed? Bush isn't running for President. He hasn't been President for over 7 years. Why is it we couldn't dare question Clinton the day Bush was declared winner (before he even took office) and everything became his fault and 7 years later of Obama it's STILL Bush's fault? I suppose ISIS is Bush's fault when it didn't even exist during his administration?

I started the thread after Trump was questioned/rebuked on his comment that Bush lied about the war etc.
and BTW Isis in Iraq is made up of Saddams former Bathist troops that Bush fired all at once leaving them without jobs and nothing to do but be pissed at america.
Clinton could have kiled Bin Laden but dropped the ball. Carter didn't have to support the Afghans and BinLaden against the USSR.
bad foreign policy decisions effect later generations and presidents. that's just the way it is.

In either case, why is it it takes a Pearl Harbor or a 9/11 to wake people like you up? You're all outraged, you cry for the government to do something, then when they do, you spend 15 years bitching about what YOU asked for. Why on Earth do ostriches like you stick your head in the sand and pretend the bad guys aren't bad guys because they aren't in your back yard? I'd much rather take them out in THEIR yard before they get any traction.

I never wanted to attack Iraq. Afghanistan made sense at the time Iraq never did to me.
plus they didn't have any traction, the scuds they had were nearly WW2 era tech. they couldn't hit U.S. flyzone planes for 5+ years.
Saddam was not a threat to the US.
"he could not project power against his neighbors"

Bottom line is, you don't know what you're talking about. I was in the First Gulf War. We didn't go more than 25 miles into Iraq. SO whoever you think went around destroying WMDs must have been phantoms.

http://www.newsweek.com/how-us-nerve...ered-it-317250
During and immediately after the first Gulf War, more than 200,000 of 700,000 U.S. troops sent to Iraq and Kuwait in January 1991 were exposed to nerve gas and other chemical agents. Though aware of this, the Department of Defense and CIA launched a campaign of lies and concocted a cover-up that continues today.
A quarter of a century later, the troops nearest the explosions are dying of brain cancer at two to three times the rate of those who were farther away. Others have lung cancer or debilitating chronic diseases, and pain.
More complications lie ahead.According to Dr. Linda Chao, a neurologist at the University of California Medical School in San Francisco, “Because part of their brains, the hippocampus, has shrunk, they’re at greater risk for Alzheimer’s and other degenerative diseases.”At first, the DOD was adamant: No troops were exposed. “No information…indicates that chemical or biological weapons were used in the Persian Gulf,” wrote Secretary of Defense William Perry and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs John Shalikashvili in a 1994 memo to 20,000 Desert Storm veterans. Strictly speaking, they were right: No weapons were used. The nerve agent sarin was in the fallout from the U.S. bombing or detonating of Iraq’s weapons sites...


...Elledge was on a team setting C-4 plastic explosives at Khamisiyah, one of Iraq’s largest weapons sites. “We used timed fuses, which gave us 10 minutes to get a half mile away,” he said. “But even at that distance, the smoke was terrible. And we were sent back in to make sure we got everything. The officers never told us the old rockets were filled with sarin, so we didn’t wear any protective gear.”
Jim Bunker was a lieutenant with the First Infantry Division who had trained as a demolition expert. He told me that “before the DOD blew up the ammunition, it sent papers to the battalion officers and intelligence people with clear markings to help them identify chemical weapons. Then on March 2 or 3, the DOD sent the ordnance disposal team to verify which chemicals were there. We don’t know what they found, because once the troops started demolishing them and getting sick, the reports disappeared.”...

...Ron Brown, a soldier with the 82nd Division, watched the demolitions from a mile away. “Within 15 minutes, I couldn’t breathe and my head was about to split open,” Brown said. “Soldiers were nauseous, dizzy and had diarrhea and muscle spasms. About 30 of us went to the medic, who gave us Motrin and told us to drink water.”
Later that month, Bunker almost died. As the demolitions continued, his symptoms became more severe. “First, I couldn’t control my muscles,” he said. “But in a couple days, I had convulsions and collapsed. After this, they medevacked me to hospitals in Saudi Arabia and Germany, and then to the U.S.”...

Also I can't put my finger on his testimony about the details but there was also a Major Doug Rokke that also did some chem weapons inspections and clean up but mainly DU clean up if i remember correctly..

Bush, Blair and Cheney did not admit the WMDs weren't there. They admitted they didn't find them. Completely different scenarios.

"I apologise," said Tony Blair in an interview with CNN's Fareed Zakaria, "for the fact that the intelligence we received was wrong because, even though (Saddam) had used chemical weapons extensively against his own people, against others, the program in the form that we thought it was did not exist in the way that we thought."

[Gunny]

I started the thread after Trump was questioned/rebuked on his comment that Bush lied about the war etc.
and BTW Isis in Iraq is made up of Saddams former Bathist troops that Bush fired all at once leaving them without jobs and nothing to do but be pissed at america.
Clinton could have kiled Bin Laden but dropped the ball. Carter didn't have to support the Afghans and BinLaden against the USSR.
bad foreign policy decisions effect later generations and presidents. that's just the way it is.




I never wanted to attack Iraq. Afghanistan made sense at the time Iraq never did to me.
plus they didn't have any traction, the scuds they had were nearly WW2 era tech. they couldn't hit U.S. flyzone planes for 5+ years.
Saddam was not a threat to the US.
"he could not project power against his neighbors"






Also I can't put my finger on his testimony about the details but there was also a Major Doug Rokke that also did some chem weapons inspections and clean up but mainly DU clean up if i remember correctly..



"I apologise," said Tony Blair in an interview with CNN's Fareed Zakaria, "for the fact that the intelligence we received was wrong because, even though (Saddam) had used chemical weapons extensively against his own people, against others, the program in the form that we thought it was did not exist in the way that we thought."

Did you miss the part where you are just another egghead with a bunch of pointless links that doesn't know what he's talking about? The fact is ad nauseum, the WMDs existed and we sold the damned things to Saddam and taught him how to use them. You've got NOTHING on that. Period.

Furthermore, you're whining about something that is OBE. No one cares. Yet you live in your own little let's relive the past fantasy world. So let's. The Confederate States had EVERY right to secede and ZERO law precluded it. Does that change the here and now? On;y insofar as the erosion of the Constitution is concerned.

Bush invaded Iraq and he had a valid reason for doing so and that ends your story before you get started. Why don't you try living in the here and now instead of 15 years ago?