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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    As i said, thankfully such views are withering. But there are still groups that are very backward in this respect, and when these people are your social circle it can be very oppressive.
    Sure, some smaller churches will literally forbid you, and cast you out from other parishioners. But in the grand scale of things...

    While other religions will cut your head off if you don't believe, or believe elsewhere, or believe in another religion. Being "forced" to marry elsewhere isn't so bad in comparison. Even being a cast-out and being "forced" to worship elsewhere still leaves one alive and as free as can be.

    Folks have choices. They know their religions, their faith system and what the rules are of the places they CHOOSE to be members of. And like any other place in the world that has a member based system, it has it's rules.

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  3. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightTrain View Post
    I'm not wired that way. The betrayal from my first marriage left me crushed. Devastated. I couldn't even summon my anger to help, which is a damn sorry place to be in.

    But once I finally was able to rouse my anger as a defense mechanism, triggered by concern for my kid's well being, it was a pure, white-hot fury that took several years to cool. But it gave me the edge and I won everything.

    I see what the article is saying, but instincts for 1 man, 1 woman, 1 family is a powerful thing - and I think the notion of free love within the marriage is no marriage at all. It's a sham.
    Hope you don't think this is some exclusive club, bubba. I got your 6 on this one. I couldn't even think. Had my oldest daughter not refused to leave ME (tossed moms to the curb ), I'd probably be insane. I had Marine officers treading lightly around me. Unlike you, I had no problem with the anger thing and I was on a hair trigger.

    And my first concern WAS my kids. I came from a broken home. I did everything in my power to not repeat it. Unfortunately, it takes 2.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  5. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    As i said, thankfully such views are withering. But there are still groups that are very backward in this respect, and when these people are your social circle it can be very oppressive.
    I will posit that for a pastor to not maintain the tenets of his own church/theology is backwards and wrong.

    I've never known a church to ignore or reject someone who is sincerely contrite about their sins, though.
    After the game, the king and the pawn go into the same box - Author unknown

    “Unfortunately, the truth is now whatever the media say it is”
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  6. #64
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    There's a LOT of math to this, and the church is only part of it. We live in a society where abortion and divorce are cheap. I don't like you putting your feet on the coffee table. Time to call the Lawyer. Used to, you just made things work and walked around each others weaknesses/slights. Now it's "screw you, I'm leaving". Leftwingnut laws have created this mess. We have allowed everyone an easy out from responsibility. And it doesn't pertain solely to this topic but in all facets of our society. Everyone's got an excuse.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  8. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Diamond View Post
    What part of "foresaking all others" and "till death do us part" do folks not get?
    For some, "think with dick" rules.

  9. #66
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    Lets see I was raised Catholic and then went to a Methodist (Presbyterian) church and am now in a Baptist church, I have been to Pentecostal churches as well and have never ever seen one person asked to leave a church for any reason even if they have been divorced. Now if you wish to attend a Catholic church that is fine, but if divorced you can not join the church, yea all because of a simple thing called a vow ( ooo by the way the word Vow is defined as, a solemn promise, pledge, or personal commitment: marriage vows; a vow of secrecy.) After reading the definition and Noirs complaint of a Vow forcing people to stay married, well maybe if it bothers ya that much you should make sure of what ya want before ya promise someone forever.

    With that said yes I have been through a divorce and no I couldn't join a catholic church unless I get the marriage annulled, but I have been to Mass many times since my divorce in a Catholic church and have never had a issue or been asked to leave or anything even close. I made a Vow under God, and I did so knowing I was very young as was the EX so divorce was possible, but we did everything we could do to keep our Vows, but in the end it was worse for our kids if we stayed together so we divorced knowing what the deal with the Catholic church was but again I was never asked to leave a church, the EX well I would hope they threw her out of the state let alone the church. When I received my drivers license I knew it was against the law to drink and drive as well, dam law kept me from getting drunk and driving. And just to be clear I was Catholic when the EX and I met but we where married in a Methodist church, the preacher was that good.
    Never look down on someone unless you are helping them up

  10. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abbey View Post
    Darin, you know I think you're a great guy...

    All I know is that on our wedding day, in front of God, our pastor, and everyone we cared about, my husband and I took solemn, intentional vows, where we swore to "forsake all others" until death.
    I realize that for close to half of us, that doesn't stick. But anyone who knows me can attest: I surely am not going to say it's ok, if my husband doesn't keep his end of that particular promise. Let alone be happy for him.

    Love dictates otherwise. I mean Love. Real Agape or otherwise love means selflessness, right? Nobody I know would truly be happy for their mate if their mate left because nobody I know has that level of Love. I am not promoting people leaving on a whim. I'm not promoting anything but folks seeking a deeper, more-pure love. Think of the freedom of 'no heartbreak'. I know I'd really enjoy not having to feel personal anguish at betrayal or disrespect because I'd reached a point with humility and love where disrespect or offense against me cannot happen.

    And you've been saying I'm great for years, honey, and I have yet to have ONE hook-up or e-date with ANY of your hot attorney (female) friends....(sigh).


    <3
    “… the greatest detractor from high performance is fear: fear that you are not prepared, fear that you are in over your head, fear that you are not worthy, and ultimately, fear of failure. If you can eliminate that fear—not through arrogance or just wishing difficulties away, but through hard work and preparation—you will put yourself in an incredibly powerful position to take on the challenges you face" - Pete Carroll.

  11. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff View Post
    Lets see I was raised Catholic and then went to a Methodist (Presbyterian) church and am now in a Baptist church, I have been to Pentecostal churches as well and have never ever seen one person asked to leave a church for any reason even if they have been divorced. Now if you wish to attend a Catholic church that is fine, but if divorced you can not join the church, yea all because of a simple thing called a vow ( ooo by the way the word Vow is defined as, a solemn promise, pledge, or personal commitment: marriage vows; a vow of secrecy.) After reading the definition and Noirs complaint of a Vow forcing people to stay married, well maybe if it bothers ya that much you should make sure of what ya want before ya promise someone forever.

    With that said yes I have been through a divorce and no I couldn't join a catholic church unless I get the marriage annulled, but I have been to Mass many times since my divorce in a Catholic church and have never had a issue or been asked to leave or anything even close. I made a Vow under God, and I did so knowing I was very young as was the EX so divorce was possible, but we did everything we could do to keep our Vows, but in the end it was worse for our kids if we stayed together so we divorced knowing what the deal with the Catholic church was but again I was never asked to leave a church, the EX well I would hope they threw her out of the state let alone the church. When I received my drivers license I knew it was against the law to drink and drive as well, dam law kept me from getting drunk and driving. And just to be clear I was Catholic when the EX and I met but we where married in a Methodist church, the preacher was that good.
    Contrary to popular myth/assumption, I just want to be left alone. I don't like the Baptist church because they want to glad-handle everyone. I don't want to be noticed. Y'all go about your business and leave me teh Hell alone. But no, they want to recognize you, everyone shakes your hand, and you fill out some card. It's like you're on display. I can't stand that crap.

    True story: I went running one day after me the ex and the kids went to church. I come back in time to see the biddy committee show up and have the ex trapped on the porch. She's looking right at me as I just decided to turn that 3 miler into a 5 miler and kept right on going. I was REALLY popular at the dinner table that night.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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