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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSM View Post
    Yeah, that was debunked years ago. There are many articles out there claiming such but when actually tested, it was proven that the aircraft in question could not only fly at low altitude but were very controllable at speeds over .86 M. I am sure with the resources available to you, you could do a little research on the internet and find that information.
    Who brought this clown commie in? Here's a little info from actually being there (the Pentagon, not 9/11) ... You got a line of sight approach from the Potomac River. Every other angle of approach is blocked by infrastructure. Unfortunately, aside from the cost in lives, hitting the D ring at the River entrance to the Pentagon means you interrupted some low-level meetings. You ain't going to damage anything that counts in that monster with a plane.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    To be enlisted to the training they should have initially correspond to the Entrance requirements. Shouldn't they?
    Then as to the Pentagon case. ANY pilot knows that maximum possible speed of a liner depends on the Flight Level and NO civilian air-jet liner is able to fly at 0.7-0.8 M at ground altitude. The structure of a plane will be destroyed far before. This is physics and nobody could do anything against it.
    This is another discrepancy that makes me doubt.
    Balu ... I'm really not sure I'm following your argument correctly. Because .. if I really AM, then you're defying what we all know to be true of the events of that day.

    Are you saying that the physics of the commercial jet actually mean that the flight path it took .. it could NOT have taken ?

    What on earth leads you to think we will take any of this seriously ?? SURELY, you must know otherwise ... ?

    We all know that the jets flew as they did, and at the altitude they did. Unless you're claiming that all evidence has been faked ... and that everyone in the media since have also been lying about it (or, been massively duped) .. your assertions make not the slightest sense.

    Here's the thing. Conspiracy theories always find the light of day a long time after the event(s) they purport to be addressing. We see this time and again. WHY ? Because, the longer it takes for them to be concocted and surface in the minds of the target audience, the harder it generally is to refute them. Critically .. memories fade. Evidence disappears (or is sidelined) over time, and becomes more easily questionable. There's ever-more 'opportunity' to challenge (should I say ATTACK ?) what's really TRUE.

    I'm fascinated by your contributions here, Balu. Do you seriously hope to propagandise a 'version' of events which we all know can't stand up to what remains as known fact, and this, way more than a decade after the event(s).. ???

    I wonder what you could hope to achieve, Balu. And .. why.
    Last edited by Drummond; 11-30-2016 at 09:44 AM.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    Balu ... I'm really not sure I'm following your argument correctly. Because .. if I really AM, then you're defying what we all know to be true of the events of that day.

    Are you saying that the physics of the commercial jet actually mean that the flight path it took .. it could NOT have taken ?

    What on earth leads you to think we will take any of this seriously ?? SURELY, you must know otherwise ... ?

    We all know that the jets flew as they did, and at the altitude they did. Unless you're claiming that all evidence has been faked ... and that everyone in the media since have also been lying about it (or, been massively duped) .. your assertions make not the slightest sense.

    Here's the thing. Conspiracy theories always find the light of day a long time after the event(s) they purport to be addressing. We see this time and again. WHY ? Because, the longer it takes for them to be concocted and surface in the minds of the target audience, the harder it generally is to refute them. Critically .. memories fade. Evidence disappears (or is sidelined) over time, and becomes more easily questionable. There's ever-more 'opportunity' to challenge (should I say ATTACK ?) what's really TRUE.

    I'm fascinated by your contributions here, Balu. Do you seriously hope to propagandise a 'version' of events which we all know can't stand up to what remains as known fact, and this, way more than a decade after the event(s).. ???

    I wonder what you could hope to achieve, Balu. And .. why.
    The plane that hit the Pentagon was at a downward angle. It hopped the District and Potomac and tried to fly belly up into the building. a 747 does not respond to manual control quick enough to make that maneuver. Thus the nose dive into the turf at the River entrance which is nothing more than a parade deck. River, parade deck, lovely staircase entrance, building. It was a stupid target for the weapon chosen.

    There is nothing of importance in that particular ring of the Pentagon. A bunch of historical crap. Some really nice art.

    People (detractors) love to make fun of the place. As a fortress, it really is no joke and wasn't built by dummies.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  6. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSM View Post
    Yeah, that was debunked years ago. There are many articles out there claiming such but when actually tested, it was proven that the aircraft in question could not only fly at low altitude but were very controllable at speeds over .86 M. I am sure with the resources available to you, you could do a little research on the internet and find that information.
    OK.
    What would you say about all this?

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc.htm
    Indifferent alike to praise or blame
    Give heed, O Muse, but to the voice Divine
    Fearing not injury, nor seeking fame,
    Nor casting pearls to swine.
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  7. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    OK.
    What would you say about all this?

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc.htm
    That it's theater, written by ignorant journalists and/or politicians.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  9. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    OK.
    What would you say about all this?

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc.htm
    Conspiracy theories abound....just one more.... I am sure you will have no difficulty finding very many of them....

    Quite frankly, at this point, I will not even attempt to answer or defend what has already been answered and defended here on this board so many times in the past. I would encourage you to search threads here to that.
    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
    Thomas Jefferson


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  11. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSM View Post
    Conspiracy theories abound....just one more.... I am sure you will have no difficulty finding very many of them....

    Quite frankly, at this point, I will not even attempt to answer or defend what has already been answered and defended here on this board so many times in the past. I would encourage you to search threads here to that.
    It is a pity.
    Curiosity and hesitation are the qualities which are very valuable in our world overfilled with many kinds of propaganda. Or you are a supporter of the approach of Hegel who said: "If facts contradict to my theory, the worse for the facts."?
    Indifferent alike to praise or blame
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    Fearing not injury, nor seeking fame,
    Nor casting pearls to swine.
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  12. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    It is a pity.
    Curiosity and hesitation are the qualities which are very valuable in our world overfilled with many kinds of propaganda. Or you are a supporter of the approach of Hegel who said: "If facts contradict to my theory, the worse for the facts."?
    and therein lies the heart of the matter..... determining what is fact .... all the conspiracy theory sites such as the one you provided a link for base their assertions on half truths rather than complete fact. and yes, propaganda is prevalent across the globe... some propaganda is very well executed (as I am sure you know all too well) and it takes quite a bit of persistent effort to get at the facts.
    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
    Thomas Jefferson


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  14. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    It is a pity.
    Curiosity and hesitation are the qualities which are very valuable in our world overfilled with many kinds of propaganda. Or you are a supporter of the approach of Hegel who said: "If facts contradict to my theory, the worse for the facts."?
    The pity is the person who rather than defend his argument puts people on ignore rather than face the music. Try manning up instead of making excuses.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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  16. #25
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    As far as a plane that large being able to fly at the height it did to strike the Pentagon,
    I've seen many planes, even large ones, that do 'touch and go' landings yet able to maintain velocity
    on approach, powering down to put wheels on the tarmac, then powering up to lift off again.
    I have lost my mind. If found, please give it a snack and return it?

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same of others"...John Wayne in "The Shootist"

    A Deplorable!

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  18. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    OK.
    What would you say about all this?

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc.htm
    What would I say ? Are you being serious ??

    As for what I'd say ... I'd say the obvious. That it was a conspiracy-fueling site. That it contained some anti-American 'material' (the description 'material' is unsupportively generous, I suspect ...).

    I'm already convinced, Balu, that your driving sentiments are anti-American .. and your latest offering helps add to that belief. WHY, otherwise, would you offer as an 'objective' source, a site which also pushed THIS load of rubbish .. ??

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc14.htm

    -- It's called .. 'The American Drive for World Domination'

    In August 2002 George W. Bush (whose public utterances finally demonstrated that he is mentally deranged, unhinged, demented and a lunatic) and his crony Tony Blair were talking up their intention to attack Iraq, going on like a broken record about its "weapons of mass destruction", hypocritically ignoring the facts that (a) it is the U.S. which leads the world in the manufacture and use of such weapons (Germany and Japan 1945, Vietnam and Cambodia 1960s and 70s, Iraq 1991, Kosovo 1999 and Afghanistan 2001) and (b) it is Israel, America's client state in the Middle East, which already possesses over 100 atomic bombs and is entirely willing to use them against its neighbours.

    Iraq's immediate neighbours did not consider Iraq a military threat, so why did the U.S.? Iraq's missiles could reach parts of Europe and Russia but neither Europe nor Russia considered Iraq a threat; indeed, in mid-2002 Russia signed a multi-billion dollar trade deal with Iraq. Only Israel considered Iraq a threat (consistent with the pan-Arab hatred of Israel for its brutality toward the Palestinians), and in the U.S. Congress and in the Bush [and Obama] Administration what Israel wants Israel gets.

    As British elder statesman Tony Benn said, the American desire for a war against Iraq was based not on any concern over what weapons Saddam Hussein might possess but sprang from the desire of the U.S. to grab Iraq's oil.

    Bush's "War on Terrorism" is not about terrorism (except insofar as staged terrorist acts are an important part of the propaganda campaign) — it's about control of all of the Earth's economic resources, not just oil.

    The United States government wants economic control and exploitation of the vast oil and mineral wealth of the Middle east and Central Asia, and if perpetual worldwide war is required to achieve this then so be it .....
    THIS, Balu, as almost all of us will recognise, is an almighty load of c**p. OBVIOUSLY anti-American (I see an anti-Semitic reference too, by the way), penned to make America out to be some sort of belligerent pariah power hell-bent on international domination, evidently those maintaining the site producing this stuff are following an especially belligerent and rather sick agenda of their own.

    By the way, that so-called 'elder statesman' referred to .. TONY BENN .. was, when alive, a British politician of the HARD LEFT (ex-Labour minister, at one time). Typical of this site to speak of him in unearned 'glowing terms' ... eh ?

    So let's drop the pretence, Balu, of any interest of yours in objective reporting. You're pushing propaganda. And it's pernicious stuff at that.
    Last edited by Drummond; 11-30-2016 at 07:15 PM.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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  20. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    No doubt that 9/11 is an awful Tragedy of American Nation and those who were engaged in organizing and executing this crime must be found and punished.
    But there are a lot very strange things over these events which cause questions of those who used to think, analyze, have some knowledge and personal experience.
    In this respect I would ask some questions.
    Is there anybody on the board who is a professional pilot? He could tell us how much time it takes to learn all the instruments and controls as well as teach a pilot with previous experience to control every particular type of a huge jet-liner.
    No need to say that it differs greatly from single engine Cessna and the pilot of Cessna is not able to control and maneuver huge jet liner especially on descend in manual mode when autopilot is useless as the jet-liner is not guided by approach beacons.
    Every pilot knows that descend and landing are the most difficult phases of a flight as it is necessary to keep the course and altitude to aim a plane strictly to a prescribed points - another unsolvable task for yesterday's graduate of a light aircraft flying school.
    There also are some discrepancies with Pentagon, but it is another separate story.
    Balu. I'll bet you knew Oswald, and you probably believe he did not shoot John F. Kennedy in Dallas, Tx. on November 22, 1963.
    And, I suppose you joined the conspiracy nuts who are convinced Americans did not step on the Moon in July, 1969.
    So. Can you tell us all...WHAT DO YOU KNOW about where Jimmy Hoffa is buried?
    I love to make Liberals Cry, and Whine.
    So, this is for them.
    GOD BLESS AMERICA - IN GOD WE TRUST !

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  22. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balu View Post
    OK.
    What would you say about all this?

    http://www.serendipity.li/wtc.htm
    Mr. Balu - I love ya buddy!! If you were to look around the board, mostly in the conspiracies section, you'll find plenty of threads discussing 9/11. Any talk of blaming anyone other than the 19 scumbags involved that day, is a bunch of shit. These things have been debunked over and over, time and time again.

    Sure, there are some out there that will not let go, they will always believe there is some hanky panky in everything that happens.

    But look at it this way. With the amount of the tragedy, the size of the destruction and following operation in Washington, then the massive amount in NYC, and the other buildings, and the amount of folks involved in recovery operations, literally in the thousands and thousands. The the amount of actual officers, whether federal or local, firemen and investigators... there is literally no solid proof of anything other than those 19 men and their terrorist attacks that day.

    With an operation that big (others can save their links to Northwood or other crap)... with an operation that big, whether 10 people involved or 500, there would be SOME proof of some sort - not just circumstantial things that can be tossed around and blamed on the government.

    But if you must, like I said, look in the conspiracies section. Plenty of talk. You may even get some to bite!
    “You know the world is going crazy when the best rapper is a white guy, the best golfer is a black guy, the tallest guy in the NBA is Chinese, the Swiss hold the America's Cup, France is accusing the U.S. of arrogance, Germany doesn't want to go to war, and the three most powerful men in America are named "Bush", "Dick", and "Colin." Need I say more?” - Chris Rock

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  24. #29
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    To put something into perspective, here is a map and list of the nationalities of
    persons killed on 9/11. Not all of them were Americans, so it can be
    considered an international attack:

    http://brilliantmaps.com/9-11-victims/
    Last edited by Elessar; 11-30-2016 at 08:10 PM.
    I have lost my mind. If found, please give it a snack and return it?

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same of others"...John Wayne in "The Shootist"

    A Deplorable!

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  26. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elessar View Post
    As far as a plane that large being able to fly at the height it did to strike the Pentagon,
    I've seen many planes, even large ones, that do 'touch and go' landings yet able to maintain velocity
    on approach, powering down to put wheels on the tarmac, then powering up to lift off again.
    It actually did not strike its target. There isn't enough room to touch n go in a plane that big. Remember, this ain't a combat plane with touch controls. Civilian airliners are busses with wings. They scare the crap out of me.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

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