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    Default US Navy Ship and Philippine Merchant Ship Collide

    7 US Sailors missing.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1972SW

    At least three injured, seven missing after U.S. Navy destroyer collides with merchant vessel off Japan Sat Jun 17, 2017 | 12:00am EDT

    By Idrees Ali and Tim Kelly | TOKYO/WASHINGTON


    Seven crew members are missing and at least three injured after a U.S. Navy destroyer collided early on Saturday morning with a Philippine-flagged merchant vessel south of Tokyo Bay in Japan, the U.S. Navy said.


    The Japanese Coast Guard said the U.S. ship was experiencing some flooding but was not in danger of sinking, while the merchant vessel was able to sail under its own power.

    ...
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Those big container ships are notorious for not paying attention to other traffic in the way. Many small vessels like sailboats cruising around the Gulf of Mexico have been hit by those ships and they didn't even stop to assist - just kept on hauling ass.

    It will be interesting to see what the investigation uncovers and I hope a few of those philipinos go to jail to set an example. My guess is they had that ship on autopilot with no one watching the radar.

    Given that the container ship was clearly at fault, why on earth didn't our Destroyer take evasive action? With the billions we've spent on radar systems for our Navy, this is inexcusable. They didn't know there was a 700 foot ship bearing down on them in a collision course?
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightTrain View Post
    Those big container ships are notorious for not paying attention to other traffic in the way. Many small vessels like sailboats cruising around the Gulf of Mexico have been hit by those ships and they didn't even stop to assist - just kept on hauling ass.

    It will be interesting to see what the investigation uncovers and I hope a few of those philipinos go to jail to set an example. My guess is they had that ship on autopilot with no one watching the radar.

    Given that the container ship was clearly at fault, why on earth didn't our Destroyer take evasive action? With the billions we've spent on radar systems for our Navy, this is inexcusable. They didn't know there was a 700 foot ship bearing down on them in a collision course?
    I was kind of wondering that, but let's wait for the resident squids (@aboutime) . There's plenty of screwy variable that go on at sea. The weather giving false reports comes to mind first. You can't turn a ship on a dime like in the movie "Battleship" (although that broadside was cool ) .
    Last edited by Gunny; 06-17-2017 at 05:48 PM.
    GET OFF MY LAWN

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I was kind of wondering that, but let's wait for the resident squids (@aboutime) . There's plenty of screwy variable that go on at sea. The weather giving false reports comes to mind first. You can't turn a ship on a dime like in the movie "Battleship" (although that broadside was cool ) .
    There are so very many things that pop into my mind. What were the bridge crews of BOTH vessels doing?
    Just wrapping up an 'operation', was the Fitz steaming at darkened ship?

    Was this a crossing situation?

    Being struck on the starboard (right) side would initially indicate that the merchie had the Right of Way unless:

    ...the Fitz was at anchor - unlikely 56 miles off shore;
    ...the Fitz was 'Restricted in the Ability to Maneuver' displaying Red over White over Red lights;
    ...the Fitz was a 'Vessel Not Under Command' due to propulsion problem(s) and displaying Red over Red over Red lights.

    Was it an overtaking (passing) error?

    If the Fitz was overtaking, then the merchie would be the 'stand-on' vessel maintaining course and speed,
    and the Fitz the 'give-way' vessel...to maneuver to avoid collision.

    Why was the CPA (closest point of approach) so rapidly decreased? Was the Danger Signal
    (5 rapid blasts of the ship's horn) used by either vessel?

    There could be so many more probabilities.

    One thing is certain...the Fitz's C.O. is toast as might be some of the bridge crew to lesser
    degrees.

    The investigation could be interesting.
    Last edited by Elessar; 06-17-2017 at 06:27 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I was kind of wondering that, but let's wait for the resident squids (@aboutime) . There's plenty of screwy variable that go on at sea. The weather giving false reports comes to mind first. You can't turn a ship on a dime like in the movie "Battleship" (although that broadside was cool ) .
    Thanks Gunny. Today, with all of the automation involved, where only one, or two civilians might be paying attention on the bridge. There's a possibility (sounds like it to me) that the Container ship changed course 25 minutes before the collision. That MIGHT have been programmed....(SHIP AUTOPILOT) like on airliners. At specific times, course changes take place...but I suspect, there was no Human intervention at the time.
    On the other side of the coin. THERE IS NO REASON for a U.S. Navy Destroyer of today to NOT see, or know about the CARGO ship's movements.
    As I have seen over many, many years. Despite the fact that the CO was injured, and flown from the ship. HE LOST HIS COMMAND, the second the OOD, and others on the Bridge in the Pilot House....WERE NOT PAYING ATTENTION.
    The COMMANDING OFFICER (CAPTAIN) IS SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERYTHING.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutime View Post
    Thanks Gunny. Today, with all of the automation involved, where only one, or two civilians might be paying attention on the bridge. There's a possibility (sounds like it to me) that the Container ship changed course 25 minutes before the collision. That MIGHT have been programmed....(SHIP AUTOPILOT) like on airliners. At specific times, course changes take place...but I suspect, there was no Human intervention at the time.
    On the other side of the coin. THERE IS NO REASON for a U.S. Navy Destroyer of today to NOT see, or know about the CARGO ship's movements.
    As I have seen over many, many years. Despite the fact that the CO was injured, and flown from the ship. HE LOST HIS COMMAND, the second the OOD, and others on the Bridge in the Pilot House....WERE NOT PAYING ATTENTION.
    The COMMANDING OFFICER (CAPTAIN) IS SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERYTHING.
    That is exactly what I heard, I think. Something to the effect: 'The container ship was heading into port and for an unexplained reason, began to turn around, into the US vessel. The assumption is that the destroyer was on auto-pilot and wasn't able to adjust in time when the 4X larger ship hit.'
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    That is exactly what I heard, I think. Something to the effect: 'The container ship was heading into port and for an unexplained reason, began to turn around, into the US vessel. The assumption is that the destroyer was on auto-pilot and wasn't able to adjust in time when the 4X larger ship hit.'
    Gotta agree, and disagree in a way Kathianne. U.S. Navy ships are FORBIDDEN from any AUTOPILOT use. The safety of the entire crew RESTS with those on watch in the pilot house, watching radar, steering, engineering, and a multitude of other safety factors. Especially at Night when only specified people are on WATCH. Watches normally last Four Hours on the Bridge (pilot house). I believe just the opposite took place, though I am only guessing; if there was any use of an AUTOPILOT, steering the ship, navigating, and engineering...I suspect, as I mentioned...it was on the Civilian ship.

    Unless navigational duties have changed. I AM SURE, there are several people on the bridge during EACH WATCH.
    It appears to me...the Merchant ship collided with the Navy ship, based on the ANGLE OF ATTACK (they call it) Much like two cars...ONE coming from a side street, into the RIGHT SIDE (Starboard) of the Navy ship. IMO

    It also appears, from photos I have seen. The BRIDGE was struck, which would explain the CAPTAIN being injured.
    Last edited by aboutime; 06-17-2017 at 07:23 PM.

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    Whether the container ship wasn't paying attention, or was deviating from its course toward port, or was totally in the right, or ANYTHING....

    ...how could any ship, especially a big one, possibly get close enough to a U.S. warship to collide with it?

    All I can think, is that the container ship wasn't the only one not paying attention.

    Has the U.S. Navy learned nothing from the USS Cole?
    "The social contract exists so that everyone doesn’t have to squat in the dust holding a spear to protect his woman and his meat all day every day. It does not exist so that the government can take your spear, your meat, and your woman because it knows better what to do with them." - Instapundit.com

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    They found the missing 7 US Sailors... they were drowned in the crushed compartments.

    Such a needless tragedy.

    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/06...destroyer.html
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    Very tragic. These young sailors had a lot of life ahead of them. I have to agree with Acorn - I would think our Navy ships are supposed to be able to avoid stealthy, intentional attacks by terrorists and rogue states, so it is indefensible and sad that a destroyer could be a victim of an accidental and non-stealthy collision with a huge cargo ship.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russ View Post
    Very tragic. These young sailors had a lot of life ahead of them. I have to agree with Acorn - I would think our Navy ships are supposed to be able to avoid stealthy, intentional attacks by terrorists and rogue states, so it is indefensible and sad that a destroyer could be a victim of an accidental and non-stealthy collision with a huge cargo ship.
    ThreatCon Level comes to mind. Security is minimal out in the middle of the sea nowhere near a possible threat. Fifty miles out at sea is a LOT of water. Nobody stands at 1 Alpha 100% of the time. You'd have a bunch of nut-cases on your hands.

    It's ALL speculation at this point. If I know one thing about the US Naval Service, somebody will be blamed, and as El and At said, this Captain is cooked, hurt or not barring some miracle mechanical failure beyond human control. The Ship's Captain is God at sea. That axe swings BOTH ways.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
    Whether the container ship wasn't paying attention, or was deviating from its course toward port, or was totally in the right, or ANYTHING....

    ...how could any ship, especially a big one, possibly get close enough to a U.S. warship to collide with it?

    All I can think, is that the container ship wasn't the only one not paying attention.

    Has the U.S. Navy learned nothing from the USS Cole?
    L.A. Agree totally. As for your question about the navy learning anything. I'd be willing to bet...NOBODY on that bridge was paying attention to their duties. There should be a mass COURT MARTIAL of the C.O. the OOD, and everyone on watch at the time.

    EVERY SAILOR who honestly cares about their safety at Sea these days should know. TOO MUCH DEPENDENCE ON ELECTRONICS VS WIDE AWAKE EYES ON THE BRIDGE means the difference between LIFE AND DEATH.
    SOMEBODY HAS TO BURN FOR THEIR LACK OF CONTROL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutime View Post
    L.A. Agree totally. As for your question about the navy learning anything. I'd be willing to bet...NOBODY on that bridge was paying attention to their duties. There should be a mass COURT MARTIAL of the C.O. the OOD, and everyone on watch at the time.

    EVERY SAILOR who honestly cares about their safety at Sea these days should know. TOO MUCH DEPENDENCE ON ELECTRONICS VS WIDE AWAKE EYES ON THE BRIDGE means the difference between LIFE AND DEATH.
    SOMEBODY HAS TO BURN FOR THEIR LACK OF CONTROL.
    I always hate that it comes down to mass punishment in these cases, but bridge crews have got to be aware and on their toes.
    Up there, EVERYONE is a lookout!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elessar View Post
    I always hate that it comes down to mass punishment in these cases, but bridge crews have got to be aware and on their toes.
    Up there, EVERYONE is a lookout!
    Elessar. Agreed. You know, as well as I. It only takes ONE mistake out there to change everything in seconds. Everyone IS a Lookout...until someone falls asleep, or isn't paying attention as they should. On the MID-WATCH, on the bridge...Well...you know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutime View Post
    Elessar. Agreed. You know, as well as I. It only takes ONE mistake out there to change everything in seconds. Everyone IS a Lookout...until someone falls asleep, or isn't paying attention as they should. On the MID-WATCH, on the bridge...Well...you know.
    Absolutely! When I was a BMOW (Boatswain's Mate of the Watch for you non-sailors) I had a few Lookouts
    and Helmsmen relieved for inattentiveness. Sent them down to messcook instead...then the BMC would rip
    into their asses!
    I have lost my mind. If found, please give it a snack and return it?

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    A Deplorable!

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