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  1. #1
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    Default Charlottesville A Strategic Mistake By The Alt-Right?

    Makes sense to me. The details might be a tad off, but the idea is rational. They were hoping to find the alternative to the left's, "You're racist":

    http://www.nationalreview.com/articl...-conservatives
    The Fascists Were Using Antifa against Conservatives
    Don’t fall for it.By Michael Brendan Dougherty — August 18, 2017
    ‘You must love Antifa, ya cuck.”


    “Will you also condemn Antifa, BLM, and radical Muslims? I’m disappointed in you.”


    It’s in reading these desperate social-media messages about violent left-wing protesters that I realized the true purpose of the tiki-torch ectomorph rally in Charlottesville. The “Unite the Right” rally had little to do with “defending” Confederate memorials, or any particular reading of southern history, however misguided. The designated speakers weren’t exactly kids who grew up learning how to give a rebel yell from Paw-Paw. Two of the billed speakers were anti-Semitic podcasters from New York; another fancies himself an American version of France’s Nouvelle Droite. The Robert E. Lee statue was a MacGuffin — or, rather, he was Antifa bait, and the college town that it happened to be in was just a place where Antifa could be expected to swim. The organizers don’t want heritage, they wanted footage.


    Really, what they wanted to do was to set a trap for conservatives. The explosive growth of Antifa during the 2016 campaign and since the election of Donald Trump has become a fixture in conservative media. Conservatives had warned that mainstream-media figures were summoning an awful thing into being by cheering on masked left-wingers who punched Nazis. Soon, anyone you wanted to punch would start looking like a Nazi.


    Sure enough. Aggressive left-wing “direct action” started falling on conservative speakers on campus. And Antifa played the main role in shutting down speeches by Milo Yiannopoulos and Ann Coulter. Even if conservatives, of the type that wears loafers and bowties, had become used to holding Yiannopoulos and Coulter at arm’s length, the sight of left-wingers using violence and the threat of worse riots to shut them down caused some rallying effect.


    The organizers of Unite the Right wanted to achieve the same thing for themselves. A spectacle would attract Antifa, who would predictably use violence. Some mainstream-media figures would endorse that violence, and some conservatives, they believed, would feel obliged to defend the ActualFascists because, hey, these left-wing mobs are attacking America’s legal and social norms of free speech. In other words, even if the assorted Jew-haters and fashy dorks can’t persuade conservatives to adopt a “no enemies to the right” posture, perhaps Antifa would.


    And then one of these MAGA-fascists rammed his Dodge muscle car into peaceful protesters, killing a woman.


    That fact scuttled the rally organizers’ talking point that it was Antifa or poor policing that initiated and caused all the violence. And it prevented conservatives from venturing the “both sides” argument that so swiftly blew up in President Trump’s face.


    The murder of Heather Heyer was a revelation, and so too was the way that rally co-organizer Christopher Cantwell, met news of her death — by sneering, “The fact that nobody on our side died, I’d go ahead and call that points for us.” At the exact moment Richard Spencer and his friends successfully recaptured the “alt-right” label from the so-called alt-light Gamergaters and other populists, it became stained in blood.


    Still, the problem Charlottesville presents for the larger “alt-light” is serious. There seemed to be a real upside to cultivating a reputation as the edgiest and most transgressive political movement going. You’re free of the pieties that come from longer-lived movements. You look authentic, even fresh. And your stock goes up. But there’s an iron law at work here: As soon as anyone identifiably on the right gets the reward of attention for being transgressive, the Neo-Nazis swiftly show up, and the value of transgressive right-wing politics returns to its true value in America, near zero.


    It was amusing to see Gavin McInnes the fiasco in Charlottesville. McInnes has cultivated a gang-like aura among his all-male fraternal organization, the Proud Boys. He and his group had dropped out of the rally once he got the vibe that it was going to turn into a “white power” thing. “I remember hearing William F. Buckley had to drum out the Nazis from National Review, and it didn’t sound like a big deal,” McInnes said in his recent video, “But when you do it, you realize how tedious it is.”


    No kidding.


    Most of the debate about Confederate monuments after Charlottesville has been a distraction. The rally organizers came prepared for violence, and they wanted it. They wanted footage of themselves getting punched and maced so that they could use conservative antipathy to Antifa to erode conservative antipathy to Actual Fascists. Don’t fall for it.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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  3. #2
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    I don't think it was a mistake from their point of view. They scored points with their base.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    I don't think it was a mistake from their point of view. They scored points with their base.
    I suppose that would be correct. They stood up to those folks, what's one dead when you do that?


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    major backfire, minor victory.

    Like terrorist attacks,
    some poor souls will see it as "that's group's getting something DONE."
    while most people will be appaled.
    Last edited by revelarts; 08-18-2017 at 10:54 PM.
    It is proper to take alarm at the first experiment on our liberties. The freeman of America did not wait till usurped power had strengthened itself by exercise, and entangled the question in precedents. James Madison
    Live as free people, yet without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but live at all times as servants of God.
    1 Peter 2:16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I suppose that would be correct. They stood up to those folks, what's one dead when you do that?
    That one death probably scored points with them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    That one death probably scored points with them.
    Well good on them then and their supporters. Trump figures there were some good folks there too. Both sides, though I find it difficult to believe there are any good antifa.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Well good on them then and their supporters. Trump figures there were some good folks there too. Both sides, though I find it difficult to believe there are any good antifa.
    And Trump was right. You're not painting everyone there with the same brush are you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    And Trump was right. You're not painting everyone there with the same brush are you?
    I'm pretty much of the mindset if I saw the march on Friday I'd conclude it wasn't about history. For sure if I showed up on Saturday, the writing was on the wall, before the blood was on the street.

    The police though, no matter if the idiots are on the right or left, must be allowed to step in when any violence starts. You have the right to free speech, no matter how idiotic. You don't have the right to beat those you disagree with, at least without consequences.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I'm pretty much of the mindset if I saw the march on Friday I'd conclude it wasn't about history. For sure if I showed up on Saturday, the writing was on the wall, before the blood was on the street.

    The police though, no matter if the idiots are on the right or left, must be allowed to step in when any violence starts. You have the right to free speech, no matter how idiotic. You don't have the right to beat those you disagree with, at least without consequences.
    I think you're speaking from hindsight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    I think you're speaking from hindsight.
    Hardly. You never walked into a party in high school and knew from the get go you needed to get out? Commonsense.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Hardly. You never walked into a party in high school and knew from the get go you needed to get out? Commonsense.
    I'm talking about the coverage of this. Over the last week it has moved from "there is a rally where some racists may attend" to "Nazis!".

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    I'm talking about the coverage of this. Over the last week it has moved from "there is a rally where some racists may attend" to "Nazis!".
    Umm, they call themselves neo-Nazis and supremacists. Not hard to figure out. They hate Jews, they hate blacks, they hate. If they are what they claim to be they also hate Catholics, those with birth defects, those not of their blood and deserving of the country's soil.

    No, not good people.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Umm, they call themselves neo-Nazis and supremacists. Not hard to figure out. They hate Jews, they hate blacks, they hate. If they are what they claim to be they also hate Catholics, those with birth defects, those not of their blood and deserving of the country's soil.

    No, not good people.
    Very true but the coverage went from claiming some of the people at that rally were those types to All of the people at that rally were those types, within one week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganFats View Post
    Very true but the coverage went from claiming some of the people at that rally were those types to All of the people at that rally were those types, within one week.
    I think the reality hit with their Friday march, no? Blood and Soil, Jews must go, are dead giveaways.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I think the reality hit with their Friday march, no? Blood and Soil, Jews must go, are dead giveaways.
    I watched that video. I counted 14 people in it. I stand by what I said.

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