Russian Passenger Plane Crashes Near Moscow; 71 Dead

[Gunny]

February 11, 2018
By Maria Kiselyova and Andrew Osborn

MOSCOW (Reuters) – A Russian passenger plane crashed near Moscow soon after take-off on Sunday, killing all 71 people on board, and investigators said they were looking at all possible causes.
Temperatures were around minus 5 degrees Celsius with periodic snowfall when the short-haul AN-148 operated by Saratov Airlines took off for the city of Orsk in Orenburg region, about 900 miles (1,500 km) southeast of the capital.
President Vladimir Putin offered condolences to those who had lost relatives and ordered a special investigative commission to be set up.
“According to preliminary information, nobody survived,” the Kremlin said in a statement.

cont ... http://www.oann.com/plane-crashes-ne...ople-agencies/

This is exactly why I don't trust those little "buses with wings".

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I never had a problem flying on a military plane, but public air craft... aaaahh, no. I'm not flying anywhere. I'll drive, take a bus, a train, a ship, whatever, but no public planes.

Far as the Russian plane, sounds like it was iced up to me.

[Elessar]

I never had a problem flying on a military plane, but public air craft... aaaahh, no. I'm not flying anywhere. I'll drive, take a bus, a train, a ship, whatever, but no public planes.

Far as the Russian plane, sounds like it was iced up to me.

I know ours are safety checked both on assumption of duty and pre-flight checks.

I cannot be too sure of commercial and/or civilian flights.

But...the crash and lives lost is indeed tragic.

[Gunny]

I never had a problem flying on a military plane, but public air craft... aaaahh, no. I'm not flying anywhere. I'll drive, take a bus, a train, a ship, whatever, but no public planes.

Far as the Russian plane, sounds like it was iced up to me.

Y'know, I never had a problem hopping on a 141 or C5A. So, you get a web seat and box lunch? I didn't get on for some faux luxury. USAF pilots get it in the air and boogie. They're not getting paid by the hour, nor does my leave on the books care whether I get where I'm going in 12 hours or 3 days. Screw that noise. I'll take the web seats and noisy monster machine.

Those little bitty commuter planes are sardine cans that can't handle turbulence. I have no idea who they built them for. Japanese people? I don't consider myself THAT big and I don't fit in the damn thing. I end up sitting with my shoulders at a 45 degree angle.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I know ours are safety checked both on assumption of duty and pre-flight checks.

I cannot be too sure of commercial and/or civilian flights.

But...the crash and lives lost is indeed tragic.

Yup, I worked air craft avionics maintenance, and I know just how strict the military is about keeping their air craft maintained. Civilian planes, hell they land them, fuel them and then fly them again, over and over. That shit doesn't happen like that in the military.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Y'know, I never had a problem hopping on a 141 or C5A. So, you get a web seat and box lunch? I didn't get on for some faux luxury. USAF pilots get it in the air and boogie. They're not getting paid by the hour, nor does my leave on the books care whether I get where I'm going in 12 hours or 3 days. Screw that noise. I'll take the web seats and noisy monster machine.

Those little bitty commuter planes are sardine cans that can't handle turbulence. I have no idea who they built them for. Japanese people? I don't consider myself THAT big and I don't fit in the damn thing. I end up sitting with my shoulders at a 45 degree angle.

Yup, we were always palletizing and loading C-141's for an Operational Rediness Inspection, that was the big one, or Maintenance Evaluation Inspection, something, but we'd load up everything and then fly somewhere overnight, never knew where we were at, they wouldn't tell us, need to know, but it was usually about 13 hours in the air so we figured probably our parent wing somewhere in England. Fly in at night, eat, sleep, get up, dark again, eat, fly back. I liked the 141's, I never felt unsafe in one. Only rode in a C-5 Galaxy once at an air show at Nellis, but rode in quite a few C-130 Hercs. They fly those into hurricanes, so if there was ever a plane you were safe in, it's a Hercules. I even felt real safe in the F-16. The F-4... aaaahh... I had a little anxiety in that plane, but flying around Lake Mead was fun.

Yeah I will NOT get on one of those little "commuter" planes either, no way no how. You are stuffed in like a sardine. I'm not necessarily claustrophobic, but being stuffed in a seat by the window would probably do it.

[pete311]

I never had a problem flying on a military plane, but public air craft... aaaahh, no. I'm not flying anywhere. I'll drive, take a bus, a train, a ship, whatever, but no public planes.

Far as the Russian plane, sounds like it was iced up to me.

I hear about military helicopters crashing all the time.

[Gunny]

I hear about military helicopters crashing all the time.

Rotary and fixed wing aircraft are not the same animals. Since the Army, Navy & Marine Corps still use transport helicopters designed before I was born and used in Vietnam, odds are good one's going to crash every so often. Flip side of that coin is they are awesome birds to STILL be in service.

I'd rather ride in a Frog or a 53 than one of those "Made in China" commuter planes.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I hear about military helicopters crashing all the time.

No you don't, compared to how much time they spend in the air, it's extremely rare.

And the Air Force never had helicopters that I was ever aware of. If they do have them it's probably just for scuttling around big brass. The president's personal helicopters are maintained and flown by the Marines.

[pete311]

Rotary and fixed wing aircraft are not the same animals. Since the Army, Navy & Marine Corps still use transport helicopters designed before I was born and used in Vietnam, odds are good one's going to crash every so often. Flip side of that coin is they are awesome birds to STILL be in service.

I'd rather ride in a Frog or a 53 than one of those "Made in China" commuter planes.

The vast majority of commercial planes in the world are US, EU, Canadian or Brazilian made.

[Gunny]

No you don't, compared to how much time they spend in the air, it's extremely rare.

And the Air Force never had helicopters that I ever saw. If they do have them it's probably just for scuttling around big brass. The president's personal helicopters are maintained and flown by the Marines.

They have them. They're painted black and hover around pete's house ...

Seriously, they DO have some, or did, in SpecOps.

[Balu]

I never had a problem flying on a military plane, but public air craft... aaaahh, no. I'm not flying anywhere. I'll drive, take a bus, a train, a ship, whatever, but no public planes.

Far as the Russian plane, sounds like it was iced up to me.

Most likely.
The craft was air-born for 4 minutes, climbed up to 2,000 meters, descended down to 1,500 miters, climbed again to 1,800 and finally fall.
Weather: snow, clouds 250 - 4,000 meters.
They say that Captain rejected to get the aircraft to be processed by liquids.

[NightTrain]

Most likely.
The craft was air-born fo 4 minutes, climbed up to 2,000 meters, descended down to 1,500 miters, climbed again to 1,800 and finally fall.
Weather: snow, clouds 250 - 4,000 meters.
They say that Captain rejected to get the aircraft to be processed by liquids.

Yeah, sounds like icing. I've been on many, many flights that were delayed out of Anchorage International because the trucks needed to spray the aircraft with de-icing chemicals prior to takeoff. It's well worth it when icing conditions are present.

I didn't know that a Captain had the authority to decline de-icing when the regulations call for it. I don't think they do for commercial traffic here in the USA.

[Balu]

Yeah, sounds like icing. I've been on many, many flights that were delayed out of Anchorage International because the trucks needed to spray the aircraft with de-icing chemicals prior to takeoff. It's well worth it when icing conditions are present.

I didn't know that a Captain had the authority to decline de-icing when the regulations call for it. I don't think they do for commercial traffic here in the USA.

I do not think that there can be strict criteria as the temperature, air pressure and dew point in different layers of clouds may differ. You see, in this very case the thickness of clouds is rather significant and it is hardly possible to predict.

[Elessar]

Yup, I worked air craft avionics maintenance, and I know just how strict the military is about keeping their air craft maintained. Civilian planes, hell they land them, fuel them and then fly them again, over and over. That shit doesn't happen like that in the military.

Exactly!

Civil aviation is not nearly as strict as military.