Originally Posted by Gaffer
Really, when was the last time you saw a hospital refuse treatment????? NEVER that's when.
I'll put this in caps since your having trouble today.
HOSPITALS CAN NOT REFUSE TREATMENT BECAUSE OF A PERSONS INABILITY TO PAY.
So......poor citizens are not being made to "suffer without healthcare".
No they make them suffer with their under staffed, over utilized system.. They wait in pain for limited services...
What good is coverage if you cant get in to see your Doctor or get specialized testing done.
Right to healthcare does not mean a right to stand in a VERY long line...
Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want." -Dr. Randy Pausch
Death is lighter than a feather, Duty is heavier than a mountain
Most don't go because they can't afford the outrageous costs. Did you really think I didn't know emergency rooms can't not treat someone in an emergency? That's not the problem. The problem is when people are bankrupted or put into debt for the rest of their lives just because they needed medical care to save their life. Many, many people simply forego medical treatment because they know they can't afford it or because they know they can't afford insurance.
Originally Posted by Gaffer
We also have an under staffed, over utilized system. The difference is that we pay out the wazoo for ours.
What good is coverage when your insurance company refuses to pay-out on your claim???
Have you been to an urban emergency room lately? You have this cartoon image from the Cold War of people standing in line to get bread. Are you really naive or moronic enough to believe that citizens in the UK and France and Canada and every other western country stand in long lines at the hospital and get inadequate care? I swear to god it's frustrating "debating" with someone who has a child's view of the world.
Last edited by Hagbard Celine; 08-17-2007 at 01:54 PM.
Originally Posted by Gaffer
Here I'll answer for him.
I really need to get you on the phone with my sister who lives in Finland, when she is telling me about her 2 month wait for an MRI.
To put this into perspective, today at work we got a call from a Dr's office wanting an MRI, they had to wait 2 hours before they were seen....and they'll have the results tomorrow..................sooner if the doc listens to the dictation line.
“… the greatest detractor from high performance is fear: fear that you are not prepared, fear that you are in over your head, fear that you are not worthy, and ultimately, fear of failure. If you can eliminate that fear—not through arrogance or just wishing difficulties away, but through hard work and preparation—you will put yourself in an incredibly powerful position to take on the challenges you face" - Pete Carroll.
And I'm guessing this doesn't have anything to do with the fact that your sister isn't a Finnish citizen, that Finland has less doctors and nurses per capita than the US or that they have fewer MRI machines but it has everything to do with the public healthcare system? The reason this isn't true in France is because France has more doctors and nurses per capita than the US, the UK and Finland. Wait times are dramatically decreased there because France pays its doctors a little less than they make here and they invest the savings in the public healthcare infrastructure.
You guys do realize that you're arguing in favor of for-profit healthcare right? When you turn medical care into a commodity, it's guaranteed that people at the bottom are going to be left out. It also guarantees that prices are artificially hiked up to increase corporate profiteering. This is our wellbeing--our lives we're talking about. It's sickening to me.
Originally Posted by Gaffer
i don't think a 'literal' line was meant Hag. just the time waiting for something when they feel like doing it. and i didn't say that UK and them didn't have McD's, i said no peanut butter numbnuts. sheesh haggy
they suffer, they just have to wait a few months until they get their free health care with the high taxes. some of them don't even go to the doctor cause they know by the time that they can get in it would make no difference. and theses programs that they can get, they one that don't have it usually lack it becaue they do't feel like leaving their welfare paid for trailer to sign a paper that says i need help. i am all for the system that covers underage kids, don't punish them for the rents lack of trying. but at the same time from the underagers that i have seen, most if the parents incurance don't cover it, medicaid picks it up anyways
Does Monkeybone have to choke a bitch?
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" —Benjamin Franklin, 1759
My family is healthy for the most part. Personally I haven't been to the doctor or dentist--except once in college for a terrible sore throat--in atleast six or seven years. None of us has cancer. None of our men have heart attacks. Nobody gets alzheimers.
But IF we were to, it would cost us a fortune and we'd be left to the whims of insurance adjusters as to whether or not we'd even get reimbursed for our care. What kind of "insurance" is that? Personally I don't like being a commodity for some asshat corporation. Healthcare is a service that I want to be able to utilize when I need it. I'm even willing to pay a reasonable price, but the way things are, I have to pay exorbitant amounts of my paycheck to a middle-man insurance company that may or may not decide to cover me in the event of a health emergency depending on the variables involved. Me no likey.
Originally Posted by Gaffer
Wrong...she is a citizen....married to a citizen....and mother to two little citizens.
One reason they have fewer Dr's is because people aren't thrilled to go to school for 7 yrs and come out making as much as the plumber.
There are many hospitals that are NOT FOR PROFIT. I know, I work for one.
Do you work in healthcare????? Does anyone in your family???????