Anti-Brexit scaremongering ....

[Drummond]

Anything's possible, Noir, theoretically. But considering the extent of potential out there, to trade with many new countries and businesses ... I really doubt we'll suffer, long-term. The likelihood is we'll prosper to a much greater extent than now.

As matters stand, the EU actually forbids us to strike up new, finalised, trade deals outside of the EU !!! When we get free of them, the brakes will be off.

Then, our real journey to prosperity can begin in earnest, Noir.

By the way, in case you've forgotten, the US President has offered us lucrative trade. Of course, until Brexit begins in earnest, we cannot enter into that trade. But the US will be one valuable trading source, once the EU stops interfering in our affairs !

We live in exciting times.

[Noir]

Okay, so since you can just about consider that we could be worse off - how long do you think it is acceptable for us to be “patient” for for things to be better, months, years?

[Drummond]

It's interesting that you are asking me all of these questions. Can I take it that you're accepting I'm a better 'authority' on such things than you are ?

[I suppose it's understandable. The Left's grasp of competent economic management is at best pathetic ... judging by the messes Labour keeps making of the UK economy, every time it's in Government ...]

Well ... even as Mrs May's travels to African nations is proving, she's working even now to create the basis for future new trade opportunities. How soon will those kick in ? How about the deals President Trump is eager to make with us ?

Overall .. it has to be expected that the sudden wrench away from the EU will have short-term detrimental effects, simply because it IS a wrench. Economic effects ... it'd take weeks for the differences in business activity to become apparent, much less quantifiable with any clarity. We're talking months just to get a clear picture on that. Then, there's the effect of new trading partners. Months again to even record its effects ... I understand that official National Account reports are compiled quarterly.

For the full re-jig to be comprehensibly felt on any standalone permanent basis ... one year plus (would other foreign Companies set up factories here ? How long would it take ? How long before the jobs market feels the effect and employment figures improve ?) So ... effects to feed properly through, I'd say another year or 2.

HOWEVER .. there's another factor. UNCERTAINTY, AND MARKET JITTERS. We saw just after the Referendum result just how volatile stocks and shares were, how confidence in UK economies can make shares plummet overnight, with our entire economy affected within days. Yes .. the Left may take delight in instituting a wrecking bout of propaganda.

In fact .. I think we're seeing something of that, even now. All these scare stories are popping up, NOW, because of the crucial stage of negotiations .. and because EU intransigence makes it look likely that there'll be no deal. Enter 'Remoaners' on to the scene, to hype things up, making it look like we're all about to go down the plughole ...

So, you ask me how long it'll take for things to get better. Well, just how much of a wrecking spree will the anti-leaving side indulge in ??

YOU tell ME.

We will need years for the dust to settle and adjustments to our trading capabilities to fully take effect.

The very best scenario is for everyone to stop fighting the democratically arrived-at Brexit result, get behind it, stop the scaremongering, and go from there. This will, of course, shorten our recovery time.

Then, our new Golden Age can and will be properly experienced.

[Noir]

It's interesting that you are asking me all of these questions. Can I take it that you're accepting I'm a better 'authority' on such things than you are ?

I have no idea what you are an authority in. So unless you were to state such authority I take yours as only an opinion.

We will need years for the dust to settle and adjustments to our trading capabilities to fully take effect.

So you’re prepared for years of ‘teething trouble’ any considerations for those who would struggle through those years?

[Drummond]

Well, Noir, you've still worked hard to get my opinions ! You must value them ...

Noir, as for the 'teething troubles' issue, this is surely unavoidable. Any major change of the type we must go through can't help but cause them.

Can I point out that I wasn't the only one who voted in the Referendum ? In excess of seventeen MILLION people voted for Brexit. What they did not vote for, was its opposite .. remaining chained to the EU, having our affairs increasingly run for us by Brussels, and having completely open borders to anyone and everyone who wants to come here from any EU country.

I prefer that we run our own affairs. If that involves teething troubles, then it does.

I also prefer that we have our Golden Age. One we'll be denied if forced to do things the EU way.

'Sorry' ...

[Drummond]

Aha. Today's scare story !!

Courtesy of the ever-Leftie Guardian newspaper:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...P=share_btn_fb

Consumers would face slower and more costly credit card payments when they buy EU products, and British citizens living abroad could lose access to payments from their bank accounts, in the event of a no-deal Brexit, the government has warned.

The Brexit secretary, Dominic Raab, insisted he was “confident that a good deal is in our sights” as he launched 24 “technical notices” in Westminster on Thursday morning, telling businesses and the public how to prepare if no deal was reached.

He said the government’s priority was to ensure continuity but the 24 technical notices – the first batch of more than 80 due over the summer – underline the potential impact on daily life if Britain leaves without a deal in place next March.


With UK banks likely to lose access to EU payments systems, the financial services paper warns: “Customers (including business using these providers to process euro payments) could face increased costs and slower processing times for euro transactions. The cost of card payments between the UK and EU will likely increase.”


Customers of UK banks living in the EU “may lose the ability to access lending and deposit services, and insurance contracts”, the paper says.


Businesses are warned that if the UK leaves without a deal, “the free circulation of goods between the UK and EU would cease”.

... and so it carries on ....

Teething troubles, indeed, IF this is true (a big 'if'). But with all such phenomena, we'd find ways to fix our difficulties. Other non-EU countries manage perfectly well, as, in time, so will we.

[Drummond]

Aha. Today's scare story !!<br><br>Courtesy of the ever-Leftie Guardian newspaper:<br><br>https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/23/britons-in-eu-could-lose-access-to-uk-bank-accounts-under-no-deal-brexit?CMP=share_btn_fb<br><br>

Consumers would face slower and more costly credit card payments when they buy EU products, and British citizens living abroad could lose access to payments from their bank accounts, in the event of a no-deal Brexit, the government has warned.<br><br>The Brexit secretary, Dominic Raab, insisted he was “confident that a good deal is in our sights” as he launched 24 “technical notices” in Westminster on Thursday morning, telling businesses and the public how to prepare if no deal was reached.<br><br><div>He said the government’s priority was to ensure continuity but the 24 technical notices – the first batch of more than 80 due over the summer – underline the potential impact on daily life if Britain leaves without a deal in place next March.</div><div><br></div>With UK banks likely to lose access to EU payments systems, the financial services paper warns: “Customers (including business using these providers to process euro payments) could face increased costs and slower processing times for euro transactions. The cost of card payments between the UK and EU will likely increase.”</div><br></div><div>Customers of UK banks living in the EU “may lose the ability to access lending and deposit services, and insurance contracts”, the paper says.</div><div><br></div>Businesses are warned that if the UK leaves without a deal, “the free circulation of goods between the UK and EU would cease”.

<br><br>... and so it carries on ....<br><br>Teething troubles, indeed, IF this is true (a big 'if'). But with all such phenomena, we'd find ways to fix our difficulties. Other non-EU countries manage perfectly well, as, in time, so will we.</div>

[Drummond]

Aha. Today's scare story !!<br><br>Courtesy of the ever-Leftie Guardian newspaper:<br><br>https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/23/britons-in-eu-could-lose-access-to-uk-bank-accounts-under-no-deal-brexit?CMP=share_btn_fb<br><br><br><br>... and so it carries on ....<br><br>Teething troubles, indeed, IF this is true (a big 'if'). But with all such phenomena, we'd find ways to fix our difficulties. Other non-EU countries manage perfectly well, as, in time, so will we.</div>

Apologies for the above. I've had difficulties with editing and reproducing quoted text.

Try this, instead:

Today's scare story !! Courtesy of the ever-Leftie Guardian newspaper:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...o-deal-brexit?

Consumers would face slower and more costly credit card payments when they buy EU products, and British citizens living abroad could lose access to payments from their bank accounts, in the event of a no-deal Brexit, the government has warned.

The Brexit secretary, Dominic Raab, insisted he was “confident that a good deal is in our sights” as he launched 24 “technical notices” in Westminster on Thursday morning, telling businesses and the public how to prepare if no deal was reached.

He said the government’s priority was to ensure continuity but the 24 technical notices – the first batch of more than 80 due over the summer – underline the potential impact on daily life if Britain leaves without a deal in place next March.

With UK banks likely to lose access to EU payments systems, the financial services paper warns: “Customers (including business using these providers to process euro payments) could face increased costs and slower processing times for euro transactions. The cost of card payments between the UK and EU will likely increase.”

Customers of UK banks living in the EU “may lose the ability to access lending and deposit services, and insurance contracts”, the paper says.

Businesses are warned that if the UK leaves without a deal, “the free circulation of goods between the UK and EU would cease”.

[LongTermGuy]

Polish Lawmaker Dominik Tarczynski Calls For Burqa Ban, No Saudi Mosques in Europe!!!


`Polish Lawmaker Backs Burqa Ban, No Saudi Mosques in Europe Until Poland Can Build Cathedral in Saudi Arabia`

`He suggested the relationship between the West and the Islamic world was currently unbalanced, citing a mosque which Saudi Arabia’s theocratic regime wants to construct in the Polish capital of Warsaw as an example.


“We’re happy to have it once they agree for Poland to build a cathedral in Saudi Arabia,” he said.

“It’s very simple, either we are equal, we are partners, we are the same human beings — or they feel they are better than others,” he declared.`

https://www.breitbart.com/london/201...ld-cathedrals/

[Drummond]

Polish Lawmaker Dominik Tarczynski Calls For Burqa Ban, No Saudi Mosques in Europe!!!


`Polish Lawmaker Backs Burqa Ban, No Saudi Mosques in Europe Until Poland Can Build Cathedral in Saudi Arabia`

`He suggested the relationship between the West and the Islamic world was currently unbalanced, citing a mosque which Saudi Arabia’s theocratic regime wants to construct in the Polish capital of Warsaw as an example.


“We’re happy to have it once they agree for Poland to build a cathedral in Saudi Arabia,” he said.

“It’s very simple, either we are equal, we are partners, we are the same human beings — or they feel they are better than others,” he declared.`

https://www.breitbart.com/london/201...ld-cathedrals/

Good man !!

I could wish that we had politicians of his brand in the UK. We're riddled with mosques these days (and, of course, we've already seen what Boris Johnson has already suffered for criticising burkhas). Apparently, if you want to oppose either, you're likely 'racist' for doing so ....

[Noir]

Well, Noir, you've still worked hard to get my opinions ! You must value them ...

Welcome to the concept of a forum.

In excess of seventeen MILLION people voted for Brexit.

That they did, and without any clear path forward or expectation of what the end result would be. Which is fine as long as you don’t think about it.

[Drummond]

Welcome to the concept of a forum.

Thank you !! I value your welcome enormously !

That they did, and without any clear path forward or expectation of what the end result would be. Which is fine as long as you don’t think about it.

Seventeen million people are fools, is that your point ?

What was voted for, was perfectly clear ... do you want to be in the EU, or to quit it ? The result was equally clear ... TO QUIT IT.

The 'niceties' of the process was up to politicians to work out. But regardless, the mandate exists ... to quit.

Hopefully the EU will suffer a collective brainstorm, and negotiate a good deal. If (of course !) they don't, then we quit, regardless.

All of this is clear. Any residual problems, fudges etc, are of politicians' making.

[Noir]

Seventeen million people are fools, is that your point ?

No more foolish that the 16 million who voted to remain, no doubt.

What was voted for, was perfectly clear ... do you want to be in the EU, or to quit it ? The result was equally clear ... TO QUIT IT.

The 'niceties' of the process was up to politicians to work out. But regardless, the mandate exists ... to quit.

Which is exactly my point, the decision was made without consideration of the path to the destination would be, or the result of that path.

I am more concerned about the path, than the destination.

[Drummond]

No more foolish that the 16 million who voted to remain, no doubt.

Definitely LESS foolish, in my estimation.

Isn't it foolish to increasingly sign away your very autonomy (!!) to a foreign power, in the HOPE that all the laws and strictures they insist upon inflicting will work in your favour ?

Isn't it particularly foolish to have an island nation forced to maintain permanently open borders to the inhabitants of literally dozens of other nations ?? Do we have infinite room, infinite resources ?

No .. Brexit is an act of remedial sanity. What's more, a straight electoral majority voted for it. They had that right, just as they have the right to see the vote respected, heeded, fully acted upon.

Which is exactly my point, the decision was made without consideration of the path to the destination would be, or the result of that path.

I am more concerned about the path, than the destination.

I think what you really mean (.. but probably won't admit ..) is that very few foresaw just how disgustingly uncooperative and bullying the EU side was going to be throughout these so-called 'negotiations'. We've struggled to get any decent agreements from them. We've struggled to such an extent that we may HAVE to walk away, minus a deal.

You really care LESS about the 'destination' ? Really ? I find that rather hard to believe. I put it to you that you want to see actions taken that will delay or wreck completely our transition to full Brexit ... a 'YES/NO' filter to completion in the hands of Parliament, perhaps ? Something done on our side that derails further progress to finalisation, thereby overturning the electorally-expressed Will of the People ?

Thanks to the EU, most of the two years allotted to getting Brexit 'done & dusted' has been wasted. We're now in a rush to finalise things. What a time, then, to want further potentially delaying elements to emerge !!

NO. We must get this DONE, MINUS FURTHER INTERFERENCE.

[CSM]

Learning a lot reading this thread.